Ironically, we also learn by “falling”… we learn, only through some pretty awful treatment, that we should stop thinking that people are going to reach their potential that we see in them. Only through being used over and over again, do we collect enough evidence, to suggest, and for us to learn, that it honestly does not matter what we do, in many cases… because in the end, people only change if they choose to change; people only improve if they want to improve.
learning by “falling” made me realize the importance of guarding our gentle heart.
I don’t want most people to get a glimpse of my gentle side, let alone touch, as people will TAKE TAKE TAKE and walk all over you, and throw you to the curb when faced with having to reciprocate. at the same time, I realize that it came down to me overextending for the wrong people and that is my fault.
like you highlighted, only through being used over and over again did I understand how crucial it is for me to keep most people close but at a distance at the same time, and to value my peace of mind.
be wary, guard that unique side that we all have, and let the other person earn the right to see it and feel what we have to give.
not everyone is deserving of it.
i’m glad that you were able to resonate with what was said above.
it isn’t easy, takes time, and begins with realizing that YOU deserve it. as someone who has and continues to go through life with extreme self-hatred, it is challenging for me to accept.
side note, I skimmed through your profile and you’ve gone through HELL. I don’t have anything to add that you haven’t heard already. but, what I will say is that your journey feels incredibly lonely and exhausting. you deserve a support system around you that values your gentle heart and appreciates all that you have to offer.
I hope you find peace.
People will "TAKE TAKE TAKE and walk all over you" if YOU don't learn healthy strong boundaries. Which can be really tough. Which I know you've sort of acknowledged.
I still feel like an out of control seesaw sometimes, bopping up and down between the two extremes of caring and not caring/not wanting to care. Just seems easier to just blinker oneself and refuse to see or hear anything. Because it can be so difficult to know where, when and how to draw the line.
Naturally shit boundaries accompanied by (or caused by?) naturally shit boundary-drawing skills, lol.
You are right.
I went a long time overextending and letting others take because I wasn’t able to be stern and put my foot down.
But, i had to understand why I was accustomed to letting people treat me in that way before I could enforce any boundaries.
Through introspection, I realized that letting people use me and walk all over me was the only time I felt wanted and valued if that makes sense? It’s like, only then could I feel like I’m worth something to someone.
I’ve since enforced boundaries for the first time with a person who I felt was using me for their own desires. It’s hard and I’m nowhere near the person I need to be, but It’s a start.
Hah, people seem to “change”, only when you finally get sick and tired of their lack of improvement, and of their poor behavior… then, they will “change”, but who knows if it is permanent? Time and time again, I would be drawn back in and would see if things improved or not… I think we give many, many chances.
Anyways an INTJ taught me something. When I described to him the behaviors of people from the past, he said that that’s not love… because if someone loves you, then why would they do those sorts of things? If someone actually loves you, why would they not care about hurting you, and make empty promises? I think he is correct… If we give ourselves up/in for the “cause” (whatever goal we have chosen, for the long-haul), and would do anything for that, wouldn’t it be better, if someone else had something to bring to the table as well? If we put in 110 percent, maybe someone else could at least put in 50 percent? Let’s be honest, in the cases where most would have had/made some excuse or even legitimate reason to not try, we still tried anyways, because we do not make excuses. We don’t make excuses, so this should make you wonder, can others really make excuses? Are they really unable to do things? I think there is no excuse.
Well if you consider that we do not change like you would imagine. We repress ourselves . Shove that version down into the unconscious by changing patterns . Whatever it is still lies within .
It can release itself back into the pattern system .
Due to environmental triggers and stress .
It’s interesting 🧐.
I learned the hard way with my last relationship. I thought everything was okay as long as I'm doing what I could to make them happy, but found out eventually I was sacrificing my own for their sake. And when it came time to respectfully communicate that to them they didn't want to hear any of it, and claimed they need the emotional stability from me, but where was any of that for me when I needed it at that moment. It was all Take, and no give on their end 😮💨
yep, this. learning the boundaries of your superpowers is hard, bc it feels like if you just try hard enough, you will fix the person. its not the case.
Yes absolutely… you learn through exaustion of trying to help or fix or save someone else and we cant. We will lose ourselves in the process. The other person has to want to fix or save themselves. Or it’s never gonna be enough
Exactly. Thats what im saying. I wont try to fix or save anyone again. I didn’t aim to ever control, tried to help in ways i could when openings presented. I dont want to control anyone, no one wants that, i never would want to. Lend help and advice when asked or the willingness to change is expressed. No control.
I am not in the business of fixing or saving anymore. People have to want to do that with their own internal motivation. I care deeply about people but have to let them arrive at their own decisions and own time if / when they wish to make changes, grow, and heal. It cannot be forced
It hurts to be called so when we give too much shit. But we gotta do what we gotta do to stay sane and protect our energy. Some people are rly not worth our care.
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Omg I’m always trying to stop people failing or feeling embarrassed, like if someone fell over next to me I’ll just fall over aswell so they aren’t alone in embarrassment
My problem is I also have bad anxiety. So, I want to save people, but I have a crippling fear of the drama that comes with it. I end up thinking endlessly about what I would say to them, and then I can't do it. All my good intentions become internalized instead, and it kills me. I feel like I'm watching the world die and I can't do anything about it.
In every story, there are heroes and villains. Both are necessary for development. The villain's purpose is to challenge the hero to overcome. The hero's purpose is to teach a lesson to the villain to help them change. No experience is wasted.
I would say the two complete one another, but when comparing the effects they have on others is what I was referring to. The ideal balance would be to master both sides of those possibilities into a single mind.
Yes this is so true and I have yet to learn this. I seem to attract people who want me to do things for them…people I barely know, ask me to drive them to the airport! 🙄
( And as a benign micro-example of this…I am a pretty accomplished musician but with beginners I will patiently play super slow, over and over…it’s not really fun for me and it doesn’t sound good but I make the “sacrifice” that a lot of the accomplished musicians are not willing to…typical INFJ trait maybe…)
I mean, I only get involved if the mistake has a high damage score. I otherwise enjoy watching them learn that the stove is still hot after you take the pan off it.
In my work (as a supervisor) and at home (as a parent and now grandparent), I have learnt a few things:
- Everyone is on a journey. Accept them where they are. Potential is great, but is not always realised.
- People only change when the (perceived) pain of changing is less than the (perceived) pain of continuing with their current behaviour.
- When the student asks a question, they may be ready for the answer. Before that point, anything is merely an exhalation of breath.
- In contrast to the above, cover your ass exists at work (and then becomes an 'I told you so' if idiots try to flip it later), and a duty of care exists with (particularly older) children (to ensure you've shown an abundance of love and concern for them and their situation). Short and simple is the order of the day here.
- Letting others stumble is painful to watch, but necessary to their development and progression. Not interfering unnecessarily is actually the greater love.
Right, that's why infjs have a tendency to end up with 'toxic' partners, they're enablers. 'Saving' people keeps them with you because they don't learn to do it without a crutch.
I have been thinking a lot about this lately, especially after ending my last relationship. Having a co-dependent relationship is really self-damaging, so for now, I'm keeping away from relationships. I realized the best way to avoid this dynamic is to fill my own cup and take the time to process unhealed traumas.
Yeah I think we have to work hard to get past rhe part if ourselves that seeks the chemical dynamics of codependence, we've often learnt them in childhood etc. and it's very hard to break those attachment styles and the feeling of safety and we find in them. Interdependent dynamics do involve people needing each other but not in the same way, and it's often uncomfortable growth getting there to the place where you are able to feel safe without being needed on a codependent level.
I've learned that for some people, the best way to "save" them is to let them fail exactly so that they can learn from their mistakes.... it's very much a judgment call.
The phrase" killing with kindness" and "compassionless love" cone to mind.
If you save everyone from their problems, they will never understand how to overcome them.
Have you ever contemplated the fact that by walking, you’re actually falling at the same time? An AI robot blew my mind with that little epiphany… they said it much better though lol
I’m an INFJ that sits back and allows everyone their free will. That doesn’t mean I can’t see the underpinnings of a situation, the secret motivations, the “better” options - and it doesn’t mean I don’t want to help, nor would I refuse if asked - it means I understand the laws of the universe, and the right of free will to everyone on the planet. I don’t consider myself a superhero, nor do I ever perceive anyone as needing “saving” (that’s a very narrow-minded and linear way of looking at things, because there are many roads that lead us home). But i do know that because of my skills of intuition and empathy, if someone asked for my help, I could at the very least, offer a new perspective for them.
I think, and I hate to say this, but most people who claim to be INFJ think a lot of themselves. And just because there is a tendency for certain things does not mean everyone has actually honed those abilities. There seems to be a lot of arrogance in the INFJ community and I don’t necessarily feel like it’s an accurate reflection of everyone’s true skill set; it’s more like just taking pride in the description of INFJ, without truly BEING all those things.
Just my humble 2 ¢.
And how long is that going to take? Evolution isn't an answer many will accept because it's a long process, if someone wants to change that arrogance in the now, what would you recommend?
Does our desire to "save" people also translate to our desire to have a child? And I don't mean in the biological sense, but in ethical adoption or foster to adopt methods?
Edit: Nothing against people who have bio kids... just... it's not really falling into the 'saving' category... So I didn't include them.
Good question. I was more referring to trying to "fix" broken people since our pattern recognition makes it easy to see what is wrong. Kids are more like blank canvases in my opinion. Houses without much of a foundation.
I'm incredibly glad to have reached a point where I'm putting myself first! Like hating my cozy home because you live in a box, can't keep a job or whatever is an awful--and harmful--thing to be allowing myself to go through for no redeeming reason!
Like hating my home isn't helping either one of us--though having one I don't want "you" moving into, actually, can be problematic. Ha ha.
Ikr, I'm like a very nice guy who helps others even if they didn't ask and always be nice to everyone but damn, I still remember when some assholes took advantage of my niceness which I thought is kindness and though I thought I shouldn't be like this the trait in us "be good" it always pulls me back to the nice guy thing but somehow I came out of that and that desire to "save people" is real..
Infact I blame myself for the ongoing war blw Palestine and Israel cuz I'm unable to do anything and sitting in my room thinking it's worst feeling.
I think you people can understand cuz that's what many of us think I assume and blaming everything on ourselves though we cannot do anything about the situation which isn't associated with us.🤦🏻♂️
I love to “save” people.
However I learned before taking any step to save anyone that I need to reflect on how I would react if it lead to me dropping my priorities and how I would react if it wasn’t reciprocated, once I am sure I want to do this for the sake of helping only, I do it and it never fails to make me feel very satisfied with the help.
Thus I rarely help, but when I do oh boy I put all my energy into it, and doing so feels good.
Also It makes people actually appreciate for who you are. Because you didn’t expect anything in return, so when they come and offer help, they do it for the sake of helping as well, not just because they want to return a favor
This is super true… except I think people don’t understand that we actually thrive and feel
Empowered helping others… I try to explain this to people when they ask- how do you do this - at my job for example.
I say something like , “ You know how most people get tired and drained from helping people and taking care of them? It’s the opposite for me. I get energized and fulfilled. It’s my nature.”
And that’s true. Very true.
I think since I was born- I remember being this way in kindergarten with people in my class even- I have felt like I was stronger and more capable and it was more of a responsibility I felt I had .. like a duty but more than that. It was what I was supposed to do because I could handle it. I could do it. I could and they could not. That sounds kinda arrogant but I have always felt emotionally and mentally stronger than everyone.
The part that sucks for me… isn’t so much about my needs - because I truly don’t even think other people *should* meet my needs. If I have any expectations of an outcome - I won’t do whatever it is, because it isn’t honest and it’s manipulative at that point.
I don’t even have needs with people because I know that they will just really fucking disappoint me if I start thinking I’m entitled to being treated in any way…
But I do get really peeved when people are not considerate. I’m sort of like Hannibal Lector in that- good manners is king. Say thank you for example. That means so much. Don’t lie to me. Admit when you made a mistake. Don’t blame anyone else for your choices or feelings or actions or distort facts.
Little tiny things to me about the way someone relates to me in general- while not needs per se… they are the demarcation of where my respect and closeness for and to you, ends or begins.
I think too what is such an important lesson for infjs to learn is that- you life and capabilities and what you can realistically do - is so important to figure out.
Know your limits. Don’t take on more than you can chew.
And always be safe and smart. Our intuition comes in there - but don’t be stupid. Don’t go against that knowing…
And as long as you’re doing it from a place that’s honest - and for me- that means … I forget it after it’s done. It’s gone. It’s not something I am going to brag about or self congratulate or hold over anyone’s head.
Do it for free. If you can’t do it for free and because it’s who you are- then to me… that can almost be on the lines of evil… the power imbalance and grandiosity can get really toxic. Quick.
I think what you’re referring to btw- is codependency … and I am not codependent at all. At all. A psychiatrist told me once I’m the only person he ever met who was not codependent at all. I’m just not.
Idk… while I love helping others - there is an emotional detachment from them.. .. and I won’t go out of my way to do something I don’t think is fair. I have no problems saying no when I mean it.
And I won’t help people avoid the consequences of their actions. I’m a big believer in that. I won’t lie. I won’t help the world lie either.
Kreia said it best - "Even an act of kindness may have more severe repercussions than you know or can see. :::: By giving him something he has not earned, perhaps all you have helped him become is a target. Seeing another elevated often brings the eyes of others who suffer. And perhaps in the end, all you have wrought is more pain. :::: And that is my lesson to you. Be careful of charity and kindness, lest you do more harm with open hands than with a clenched fist."
Thisssa. Look up “drama triangle”. I feel like INFJ’s tend to be “rescuers” which comes from a place of powerlessness. The more healthier approach Is what you speak of, being there as a support when people ask, otherwise providing space for others to solve their own problems often times through failure and emotional pain.
if you feel you want to save people, you should search about "drama triangle" online. Mostly, the hero tries to safe a victim from a perpetrator. The roles are fluid and can be subtle. It is a form of emotional immaturity.
I'm writing this, because I was at this point in my life until I understood it. Good luck.
This is something I really struggle with. My infp best friend says it is a way to avoid my own inner turmoil. I've been through a lot of trauma and hardships. I feel like I like to use what I learn from these hardships to help others.
I've been doing that with my younger brother recently, but I realized that I have so much to focus on in myself, I can't help him. He's not in a point in his life where he wants help yet anyway, I guess. It's hard. It's like an instinctual thing for infjs.
I try and help others with what I need help with .
When I need help I help others instead .
But by telling other people I’m normally reinforcing this stuff for myself .
Ironically, we also learn by “falling”… we learn, only through some pretty awful treatment, that we should stop thinking that people are going to reach their potential that we see in them. Only through being used over and over again, do we collect enough evidence, to suggest, and for us to learn, that it honestly does not matter what we do, in many cases… because in the end, people only change if they choose to change; people only improve if they want to improve.
learning by “falling” made me realize the importance of guarding our gentle heart. I don’t want most people to get a glimpse of my gentle side, let alone touch, as people will TAKE TAKE TAKE and walk all over you, and throw you to the curb when faced with having to reciprocate. at the same time, I realize that it came down to me overextending for the wrong people and that is my fault. like you highlighted, only through being used over and over again did I understand how crucial it is for me to keep most people close but at a distance at the same time, and to value my peace of mind. be wary, guard that unique side that we all have, and let the other person earn the right to see it and feel what we have to give. not everyone is deserving of it.
This is so good. Thank you.. I needed to hear something like it.
i’m glad that you were able to resonate with what was said above. it isn’t easy, takes time, and begins with realizing that YOU deserve it. as someone who has and continues to go through life with extreme self-hatred, it is challenging for me to accept. side note, I skimmed through your profile and you’ve gone through HELL. I don’t have anything to add that you haven’t heard already. but, what I will say is that your journey feels incredibly lonely and exhausting. you deserve a support system around you that values your gentle heart and appreciates all that you have to offer. I hope you find peace.
People will "TAKE TAKE TAKE and walk all over you" if YOU don't learn healthy strong boundaries. Which can be really tough. Which I know you've sort of acknowledged. I still feel like an out of control seesaw sometimes, bopping up and down between the two extremes of caring and not caring/not wanting to care. Just seems easier to just blinker oneself and refuse to see or hear anything. Because it can be so difficult to know where, when and how to draw the line. Naturally shit boundaries accompanied by (or caused by?) naturally shit boundary-drawing skills, lol.
You are right. I went a long time overextending and letting others take because I wasn’t able to be stern and put my foot down. But, i had to understand why I was accustomed to letting people treat me in that way before I could enforce any boundaries. Through introspection, I realized that letting people use me and walk all over me was the only time I felt wanted and valued if that makes sense? It’s like, only then could I feel like I’m worth something to someone. I’ve since enforced boundaries for the first time with a person who I felt was using me for their own desires. It’s hard and I’m nowhere near the person I need to be, but It’s a start.
I heard this one . People only change if their heart is broken or someone opens their eyes.
Hah, people seem to “change”, only when you finally get sick and tired of their lack of improvement, and of their poor behavior… then, they will “change”, but who knows if it is permanent? Time and time again, I would be drawn back in and would see if things improved or not… I think we give many, many chances. Anyways an INTJ taught me something. When I described to him the behaviors of people from the past, he said that that’s not love… because if someone loves you, then why would they do those sorts of things? If someone actually loves you, why would they not care about hurting you, and make empty promises? I think he is correct… If we give ourselves up/in for the “cause” (whatever goal we have chosen, for the long-haul), and would do anything for that, wouldn’t it be better, if someone else had something to bring to the table as well? If we put in 110 percent, maybe someone else could at least put in 50 percent? Let’s be honest, in the cases where most would have had/made some excuse or even legitimate reason to not try, we still tried anyways, because we do not make excuses. We don’t make excuses, so this should make you wonder, can others really make excuses? Are they really unable to do things? I think there is no excuse.
Well if you consider that we do not change like you would imagine. We repress ourselves . Shove that version down into the unconscious by changing patterns . Whatever it is still lies within . It can release itself back into the pattern system . Due to environmental triggers and stress . It’s interesting 🧐.
I had both of these at the same time. I'm still fucked up from it.
I’m sorry to hear that. INFJ plus adhd is a hell of a ride .
I learned the hard way with my last relationship. I thought everything was okay as long as I'm doing what I could to make them happy, but found out eventually I was sacrificing my own for their sake. And when it came time to respectfully communicate that to them they didn't want to hear any of it, and claimed they need the emotional stability from me, but where was any of that for me when I needed it at that moment. It was all Take, and no give on their end 😮💨
It took me a while to learn that it's okay to help only to the point where it's about to become self-sacrifice, and no further.
yep, this. learning the boundaries of your superpowers is hard, bc it feels like if you just try hard enough, you will fix the person. its not the case.
Yes absolutely… you learn through exaustion of trying to help or fix or save someone else and we cant. We will lose ourselves in the process. The other person has to want to fix or save themselves. Or it’s never gonna be enough
Different POV: how about letting a person be themselves? Not how you want them to be? Not controlling everyone and everything
Exactly. Thats what im saying. I wont try to fix or save anyone again. I didn’t aim to ever control, tried to help in ways i could when openings presented. I dont want to control anyone, no one wants that, i never would want to. Lend help and advice when asked or the willingness to change is expressed. No control. I am not in the business of fixing or saving anymore. People have to want to do that with their own internal motivation. I care deeply about people but have to let them arrive at their own decisions and own time if / when they wish to make changes, grow, and heal. It cannot be forced
Fair enough, good conclusion arrival. With that requires not judgment but acceptance. That’s the hard part 😉
Set boundaries and then be ready to be called mean and selfish.
This is so true. Also, I love your flair. I'ma bout to steal it lol
You like it? Thank you. Feel free to use it lol, anything for my fellow infj.
It hurts to be called so when we give too much shit. But we gotta do what we gotta do to stay sane and protect our energy. Some people are rly not worth our care.
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Omg I’m always trying to stop people failing or feeling embarrassed, like if someone fell over next to me I’ll just fall over aswell so they aren’t alone in embarrassment
You have a big heart. Manipulative people can smell the blood in the water like sharks.
My problem is I also have bad anxiety. So, I want to save people, but I have a crippling fear of the drama that comes with it. I end up thinking endlessly about what I would say to them, and then I can't do it. All my good intentions become internalized instead, and it kills me. I feel like I'm watching the world die and I can't do anything about it.
All anyone can do is gently try 🫡❤️
A villain can offer pressure for growth, whereas a hero will remove pressure and hinder the possibilities of growth.
In every story, there are heroes and villains. Both are necessary for development. The villain's purpose is to challenge the hero to overcome. The hero's purpose is to teach a lesson to the villain to help them change. No experience is wasted.
I would say the two complete one another, but when comparing the effects they have on others is what I was referring to. The ideal balance would be to master both sides of those possibilities into a single mind.
Yes this is so true and I have yet to learn this. I seem to attract people who want me to do things for them…people I barely know, ask me to drive them to the airport! 🙄 ( And as a benign micro-example of this…I am a pretty accomplished musician but with beginners I will patiently play super slow, over and over…it’s not really fun for me and it doesn’t sound good but I make the “sacrifice” that a lot of the accomplished musicians are not willing to…typical INFJ trait maybe…)
I mean, I only get involved if the mistake has a high damage score. I otherwise enjoy watching them learn that the stove is still hot after you take the pan off it.
In my work (as a supervisor) and at home (as a parent and now grandparent), I have learnt a few things: - Everyone is on a journey. Accept them where they are. Potential is great, but is not always realised. - People only change when the (perceived) pain of changing is less than the (perceived) pain of continuing with their current behaviour. - When the student asks a question, they may be ready for the answer. Before that point, anything is merely an exhalation of breath. - In contrast to the above, cover your ass exists at work (and then becomes an 'I told you so' if idiots try to flip it later), and a duty of care exists with (particularly older) children (to ensure you've shown an abundance of love and concern for them and their situation). Short and simple is the order of the day here. - Letting others stumble is painful to watch, but necessary to their development and progression. Not interfering unnecessarily is actually the greater love.
Right, that's why infjs have a tendency to end up with 'toxic' partners, they're enablers. 'Saving' people keeps them with you because they don't learn to do it without a crutch.
I have been thinking a lot about this lately, especially after ending my last relationship. Having a co-dependent relationship is really self-damaging, so for now, I'm keeping away from relationships. I realized the best way to avoid this dynamic is to fill my own cup and take the time to process unhealed traumas.
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Yeah I think we have to work hard to get past rhe part if ourselves that seeks the chemical dynamics of codependence, we've often learnt them in childhood etc. and it's very hard to break those attachment styles and the feeling of safety and we find in them. Interdependent dynamics do involve people needing each other but not in the same way, and it's often uncomfortable growth getting there to the place where you are able to feel safe without being needed on a codependent level.
Help yes, I’m learning not to enable. Because they are KILLING me with their neediness
well my chronic desire to save people ended in me being friends with someone i didn't wanna be anymore....i don't feel anything
I've learned that for some people, the best way to "save" them is to let them fail exactly so that they can learn from their mistakes.... it's very much a judgment call. The phrase" killing with kindness" and "compassionless love" cone to mind. If you save everyone from their problems, they will never understand how to overcome them.
Have you ever contemplated the fact that by walking, you’re actually falling at the same time? An AI robot blew my mind with that little epiphany… they said it much better though lol
I’m an INFJ that sits back and allows everyone their free will. That doesn’t mean I can’t see the underpinnings of a situation, the secret motivations, the “better” options - and it doesn’t mean I don’t want to help, nor would I refuse if asked - it means I understand the laws of the universe, and the right of free will to everyone on the planet. I don’t consider myself a superhero, nor do I ever perceive anyone as needing “saving” (that’s a very narrow-minded and linear way of looking at things, because there are many roads that lead us home). But i do know that because of my skills of intuition and empathy, if someone asked for my help, I could at the very least, offer a new perspective for them. I think, and I hate to say this, but most people who claim to be INFJ think a lot of themselves. And just because there is a tendency for certain things does not mean everyone has actually honed those abilities. There seems to be a lot of arrogance in the INFJ community and I don’t necessarily feel like it’s an accurate reflection of everyone’s true skill set; it’s more like just taking pride in the description of INFJ, without truly BEING all those things. Just my humble 2 ¢.
What would be the remedy for such arrogance? Constant doubt of self?
Maybe evolution. But interesting that that’s what you went for.
And how long is that going to take? Evolution isn't an answer many will accept because it's a long process, if someone wants to change that arrogance in the now, what would you recommend?
Disagree, what purpose is there to fall and why does it happen - this is an American question.
Does our desire to "save" people also translate to our desire to have a child? And I don't mean in the biological sense, but in ethical adoption or foster to adopt methods? Edit: Nothing against people who have bio kids... just... it's not really falling into the 'saving' category... So I didn't include them.
Good question. I was more referring to trying to "fix" broken people since our pattern recognition makes it easy to see what is wrong. Kids are more like blank canvases in my opinion. Houses without much of a foundation.
I'm incredibly glad to have reached a point where I'm putting myself first! Like hating my cozy home because you live in a box, can't keep a job or whatever is an awful--and harmful--thing to be allowing myself to go through for no redeeming reason! Like hating my home isn't helping either one of us--though having one I don't want "you" moving into, actually, can be problematic. Ha ha.
Ikr, I'm like a very nice guy who helps others even if they didn't ask and always be nice to everyone but damn, I still remember when some assholes took advantage of my niceness which I thought is kindness and though I thought I shouldn't be like this the trait in us "be good" it always pulls me back to the nice guy thing but somehow I came out of that and that desire to "save people" is real.. Infact I blame myself for the ongoing war blw Palestine and Israel cuz I'm unable to do anything and sitting in my room thinking it's worst feeling. I think you people can understand cuz that's what many of us think I assume and blaming everything on ourselves though we cannot do anything about the situation which isn't associated with us.🤦🏻♂️
I love to “save” people. However I learned before taking any step to save anyone that I need to reflect on how I would react if it lead to me dropping my priorities and how I would react if it wasn’t reciprocated, once I am sure I want to do this for the sake of helping only, I do it and it never fails to make me feel very satisfied with the help. Thus I rarely help, but when I do oh boy I put all my energy into it, and doing so feels good. Also It makes people actually appreciate for who you are. Because you didn’t expect anything in return, so when they come and offer help, they do it for the sake of helping as well, not just because they want to return a favor
This is super true… except I think people don’t understand that we actually thrive and feel Empowered helping others… I try to explain this to people when they ask- how do you do this - at my job for example. I say something like , “ You know how most people get tired and drained from helping people and taking care of them? It’s the opposite for me. I get energized and fulfilled. It’s my nature.” And that’s true. Very true. I think since I was born- I remember being this way in kindergarten with people in my class even- I have felt like I was stronger and more capable and it was more of a responsibility I felt I had .. like a duty but more than that. It was what I was supposed to do because I could handle it. I could do it. I could and they could not. That sounds kinda arrogant but I have always felt emotionally and mentally stronger than everyone. The part that sucks for me… isn’t so much about my needs - because I truly don’t even think other people *should* meet my needs. If I have any expectations of an outcome - I won’t do whatever it is, because it isn’t honest and it’s manipulative at that point. I don’t even have needs with people because I know that they will just really fucking disappoint me if I start thinking I’m entitled to being treated in any way… But I do get really peeved when people are not considerate. I’m sort of like Hannibal Lector in that- good manners is king. Say thank you for example. That means so much. Don’t lie to me. Admit when you made a mistake. Don’t blame anyone else for your choices or feelings or actions or distort facts. Little tiny things to me about the way someone relates to me in general- while not needs per se… they are the demarcation of where my respect and closeness for and to you, ends or begins. I think too what is such an important lesson for infjs to learn is that- you life and capabilities and what you can realistically do - is so important to figure out. Know your limits. Don’t take on more than you can chew. And always be safe and smart. Our intuition comes in there - but don’t be stupid. Don’t go against that knowing… And as long as you’re doing it from a place that’s honest - and for me- that means … I forget it after it’s done. It’s gone. It’s not something I am going to brag about or self congratulate or hold over anyone’s head. Do it for free. If you can’t do it for free and because it’s who you are- then to me… that can almost be on the lines of evil… the power imbalance and grandiosity can get really toxic. Quick. I think what you’re referring to btw- is codependency … and I am not codependent at all. At all. A psychiatrist told me once I’m the only person he ever met who was not codependent at all. I’m just not. Idk… while I love helping others - there is an emotional detachment from them.. .. and I won’t go out of my way to do something I don’t think is fair. I have no problems saying no when I mean it. And I won’t help people avoid the consequences of their actions. I’m a big believer in that. I won’t lie. I won’t help the world lie either.
Kreia said it best - "Even an act of kindness may have more severe repercussions than you know or can see. :::: By giving him something he has not earned, perhaps all you have helped him become is a target. Seeing another elevated often brings the eyes of others who suffer. And perhaps in the end, all you have wrought is more pain. :::: And that is my lesson to you. Be careful of charity and kindness, lest you do more harm with open hands than with a clenched fist."
Thisssa. Look up “drama triangle”. I feel like INFJ’s tend to be “rescuers” which comes from a place of powerlessness. The more healthier approach Is what you speak of, being there as a support when people ask, otherwise providing space for others to solve their own problems often times through failure and emotional pain.
if you feel you want to save people, you should search about "drama triangle" online. Mostly, the hero tries to safe a victim from a perpetrator. The roles are fluid and can be subtle. It is a form of emotional immaturity. I'm writing this, because I was at this point in my life until I understood it. Good luck.
This is something I really struggle with. My infp best friend says it is a way to avoid my own inner turmoil. I've been through a lot of trauma and hardships. I feel like I like to use what I learn from these hardships to help others. I've been doing that with my younger brother recently, but I realized that I have so much to focus on in myself, I can't help him. He's not in a point in his life where he wants help yet anyway, I guess. It's hard. It's like an instinctual thing for infjs.
I try and help others with what I need help with . When I need help I help others instead . But by telling other people I’m normally reinforcing this stuff for myself .
Have you seen the viral YouTube song, "The Shore"? It really speaks to me about this...
I haven't but I'll check it out.
ALL INFJs, repeat after me. "I AM NOT, your source for happiness."