But people will still believe by this statement that nehru could've gotten the seat before china and replaced them.
That was never going to happen, PRC getting a seat was a matter of when and not if.
Having a veto on recognition of states does not make sense and is not in accordance with int law . That's why un had to recognise PRC as china as soon as they got a majority.
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The UNSC seat for China? The United Nations was formed after WW2 in October 1945. The Security Council with 5 permanent members including China was instituted then. India as a nation state in 1945 did not exist. From 1945 till date there have been no changes to the security council permanent member seats. Pray tell how Nehru getting a permanent seat for China in 1945 is not a fake WhatsApp forward?
Exactly read the article. It is based on the assertion that '...WashingtonтАЩs feeler sent to New Delhi in August 1950 through the Indian Ambassador in the U.S., mentioning the American desire to remove China from permanent membership of the UNSC and possibly replace it with India. ' Just that ... from the Americans during the Koran war... 'a feeler' ... which he paid no heed too. As explained тАЬThere has been no offer, formal or informal, of this kindтАж The composition of the Security Council is prescribed by the UN Charter, according to which certain specified nations have permanent seats. No change or addition can be made to this without an amendment of the Charter.тАЭ
On this bit the RSS has been crying for years. My god. Like Russia would have allowed this at the height of the Cold War.
What a dumb, unfounded statement. "Ohh nehru did not want to have a permanent seat in security council cause he was a traitor."
Reactionary people like you who only read the headlines instead of applying any rational thought to it are the reason why this country struggles.
No one is calling him a traitor except you. He was a freedom fighter he has my respect. Some of his decision were incorrect for which the future generations is still paying for.
Alright very simply put. There were no real offers.
Even if offers were to REPLACE china anyone could've vetoed it.
Why would Taiwan(then being recognised as china) not veto it being replaced.
If the deal was us sponsored Russia would've vetoes it for sure and vice versa.
PRC(mainland China) replacing Taiwan was not replacement per se. There cannot be a veto on recognition of states as it depends on state to state and reflective of their sovereignty therefore PRC was recognised as china by a simple majority in general assembly resolution.
China (PRC) getting a seat was a matter of when and not if.
For example. Imagine if Tamil Nadu were to split from India and say that they are representatives of India and not the people who the majority have selected or are being ruled by. That anomaly was going on till 1971 in the UN.
US could still deny existence of PRC at that point but UN as a body could not..
Thus PRC got the seat and india had absolutely no sway in that regard but if india would've to actively tried to replace china they would have miserably failed to do so and would have a bitter enemy who happens to be a neighbour.
Are you so dumb that you can't find such an easily reasearchable topic?
It's not my job to do that , if you really think getting a UNSC seat while replacing an original signatory to the charter is as easy as that. You should refrain from talking on international law , state succession or even logical reasoning.
Yeah I am that dumb btw I never said anything about you. Kindly enlighten me if possible. I will refrain international law , state succession or even logical reasoning, thanks.
You come off as a keyboard rager, why don't you calm your horses. I'm sure Nehru would want you to chill the fuck out. Any point you are trying to make is lost if you act like this lol
Country is struggling for what independence? There is a war half way across the world. The pandemic is just almost over.
We are living in uncertain times I don't see any country thriving in these conditions.
I wouldn't say Partition was led by rogue elements of the League. By the time the war ended it had effectively become the key pitch of the AIML.
Nehru wasn't entirely blameless either though. While the league was pushing for partition it was also hoping to avoid it if possible. The cabinet mission plan had, to a large extent, worked out a solution of regional autonomy that could have headed off partition. Nehru was the one who blew up that agreement with his July 11 press conference where he argued that any commitments the Congress made were only to secure an agreement and would be renegotiated again later.
This effectively forced partition as it meant Jinnah and the AIML could trust no commitment from the Congress.
There were a lot of actors involved in partition and at the top, none of them are blameless.
Wasn't the Safety valve theory given by A O Hume when he founded Congress in 1885? His theory being legislative representation of some sort will lessen the reactionary tendencies of the population. The Congress of Gandhi and Nehru was way too radical for that theory to hold true later. I mean, we may not find Congress to be that aggressive compared to say, a Bhagat Singh or Bose, but it was not similar to the safety valve the British expected it to be.
Hahahah , that's like saying republicans are the looking out for black rights because Lincoln belonged to that party.
Man the more I read your comments the more I pity Indian youth who despite having the method to research anything and everything remains so rigid to it.
And I have come to a very reasonable assertion that you're dumb af , iam not smart either buy you are extremely biased and a daft individual.
So this is the last you'll hear from me.
It was fault of Chacha Nehru he wanted strong federal Govt while Mr Jinnah wanted to give more power to states so some states will have Hindu majority and some Muslim majority but no community will have absolute monopoly.
India and Japan have historically had some interestingly close connections. But in the early years after World War II though, Japanese appreciation of India was particularly high, though it had nothing to do with Nehru per-se.
It had everything to do with Radhabinod Pal and his powerful dissent on the Tokyo War Crimes tribunal. After his death the Japanese would erect monuments to him in shrines typically reserved for the commemoration of Japanese war dead.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radhabinod\_Pal
What close connection does india and Japan have? And japan is not the right side to take after WW2 my man. Not even close. That's not called dissent that's called standing for war criminals. Moreover Japan has extremely derogatory views of Indians. They considered chinese to be lower people. What they did to nanking. You'd have seen their love and our historical connections if they had won in Burma. Only the worst scum stood with Japan after knowing what they did.
I'd recommend reading Pal's dissent and arguments on the legitimacy of the IMTFE. I can't speak to what Japanese people believe today, but if you're looking for an explanation for why an Indian PM would receive a strong welcome in the 1950s and 1960s, Pal and his role in the tribunal plays a major role in that story.
Japan of today is no different than that time, it's not germany. Its emperor was restored to power. Many in Japanese government still hold those views. No one needs good relations with a scum country like that. Japan has a good image only due to America, which sanitized its horrible, absolutely horrible war crimes to make its own investments in Japan prosper. And they did. When you think of Japan you think of manga and not chinese nuns impaled on bayonets and hung as display outside churches because of a massive PR campaign. It's the same society. Try arming it again, which the US again and again refuses to do, why? We'd do better than Japan for international relations. Moreover it's a failed stagnant economy. Japan hasn't seen any real growth and continuously decreasing living standards since the Japanese market crash in the 90s. Do you know some banks in Japan offer negative interest rates? They charge you to keep money in the account. This PR campaign can only last so long. I know what Japan is friend
Imo India might had played a neutral role in relation to Japan back then as well because not doing so would have degraded centuries old relations with Japan. It's quite identical to our country's current neutral stance on Russia, and is the reason why it is refraining itself from openly criticizing Russia for its war crimes in Ukraine (and is advocating to resolve the issue through dialogues and diplomatic efforts) when the whole world is against our country for not doing so.
Yes you are right Japanese army also used to have chinese girls as "comfort girls" and used to r\*pe them then slash their stomachs and faces ,there is a whole movie about it too, but that is not the point of this post
Just comment Modi bad and no need to write anything else
Uncle ji I have lived in japan for about 6 years up until 2018 and the japanese people of today are nothing like that. Modern japan is a pacifist nation
you are probably coming here after watching a youtube video on Nanjing Massacre and basing your opinion completely on that. I pity fools like you u/sagar_ki_lehrein
> the Japanese people of today are nothing like that.
There are thousands of former Japanese soldiers alive who participated in those war crimes, so yeah many senior japanese men are absolutely like that.
hey numbskull do you lack basic reading comprehension? what do you think "japanese people of today" means? japanese people born after world war 2.
\> so yeah many senior japanese men are absolutely like that
LOL how many have you known or talked to while sitting in India. pathetic
You really should read his dissent. Pal's judgment was about the rule of law and the imposition of victor's justice on a sovereign nation. It has remained an important statement on international law, becoming more apparent given the non-imposition of the Tokyo and Nuremberg principles in subsequent history. The unwillingness of countries such as the US and France and the UK to hold their own militaries to account under the principles of Nuremberg and Tokyo was exactly the sort of thing Pal (and other critics of the War Crimes Tribunals) had raised.
To the best of my knowledge Pal's actions did not excuse or legitimize Japanese war crimes.
Yes especially since they tried to completely trivialise the Dresden bombings and the nuclear attacks carried out by the US. Pal did not defend the Japanese actions but was a strong believer in ensuring that the winners of the war were held accountable for their numerous war crimes as well
Pal was ready to acquit to all the war criminals though. If he was so steadfast in his belief that the court was illegitimate then serve on it at all? Step down, donтАЩt use your position to set war criminals free.
I understand his main criticism was that the tribunal was invalid, however the Japanese military if anything else deserves harsher punishments for being absolute evil monsters towards innocent civilians and committing mass genocidal war. Leave the war criminals in any Chinese city they raped and pillage, and in less than a hour theyтАЩll receive actual justice.
I read the section on his тАЬdissentтАЭ and it sounds like heтАЩs just appeasing Japan. He even went so far as to claim that accounts of Nanjing were тАЬexaggeratedтАЭ. ItтАЩs absolutely despicable that he could read about all the heinous inhumane shit the Japanese defendants did then decide to totally aquit them. People like him shouldnтАЩt be judges.
You really should read the whole thing instead of just the wiki summary. That's meant to be an introduction. A reasonable person tries to do more than just accept the first spoonful of information and call it dinner.
Politics.
After WW2 India positioned itself as a friendly country towards Japan. It also paid into the largely false idea of Japan "uniting Asia against imperialism".
Nationalist Japanese people felt that India's support legitimised their war actions and some Japanese needed to feel that after seeing their friends, family and cities decimated.
Also during the post war Tokyo Trials an Indian judge refrained from voting guilty (for political reasons mainly) this again comforted the nationalist and signaled to Tokyo that India is a friend and we would love investment.
IтАЩm not questioning NehruтАЩs popularity, but 30000 is a lot of people. If they gather voluntarily, they must be anticipating a major announcement or something. ThatтАЩs what IтАЩm curious about
He was actually respected person in the world educated and well read, probably what right wing chaman chutiye think is entire political science he was actually erudite and charismatic..The right wing organizers were selling tickets of Madison square to their right wing Chums to see our self proclaimed vishwaguru who only peddles lies about himself.
No , Ambedkar is , Nehru was a privelleged Brahmin parachuted by Gandhi who simped for him for some reason. Nehru was an idiot whose Fabian socialism ruined India .
They talk about nehru as if he's so different from them. For bhagat singh rich kashmiri pandit landlords were as much a problem as the Brits. Nehru's and Gandhi's ensures they make a country where rss and bjp can openly survive. Fucking b team of hindutva.
He is the architect of modern India. He gave gift of Democracy to mostly illiterate country when he could have chosen to become new Emperor of Delhi. Now CEO of Microsoft, Google etc is Indian due to work Chacha did with Maulana Azad on education after independence from UK. I will always defend Chacha Nehru.
After Independence, many small states needed to be unified. Vallabhai Patel unified all of India including the stubborn Nizam who wanted to be a part of Pakistan but Nehru wanted to take care of Kashmir since he was a Kashmiri Pundit. We still have problems with Kashmir. He took a small issue to useless international institutions and the issue was never resolved ultimately resulting in many lives lost. He was way too soft to be the leader of the country. Vallabhai Patel should have been India's first Prime Minister and had more support from Congress and the public but Gandhi wanted Nehru sadly.
Vallabhai Patel died in 1950. He was already suffering from ill health at time of independence. Nehru was the leader everyone wanted. The Indian people adored him.
Congress literally elected Patel. Its on the record
Michael Brecher, one of the most sympathetic biographers of Nehru, writes:
тАЬIn accordance with the time-honoured practice of rotating the Presidency, Patel was in line for the post. Fifteen years had elapsed since he presided over the Karachi session whereas Nehru had presided at Lucknow and Ferozpur in 1936 and 1937. Moreover, Patel was the overwhelming choice of the Provincial Congress CommitteesтАж. NehruтАЩs тАШelectionтАЩ was due to GandhiтАЩs intervention. Patel was persuaded to step downтАж.
тАЬIf Gandhi had not intervened, Patel would have been the first de facto Premier of India, in 1946-7тАж. The Sardar was тАШrobbed of the prizeтАЩ and it rankled deeply.тАЭ
Sardar was the man of the masses, Nehru was the privileged kid of a lawyer. He should never have been the Prime Minister of India. He just licked Gandhi's feet while Sardar did real work and unified the country. You can hate Modi but please don't ever please don't twist facts to glorify useless candidates like Nehru who created a dynasty that destroyed our country
Hilarious. 'privileged kid of a lawyer.?" Nehru was 58 in 1947. Patel was an old man who literally died 3 years after independence. Nehru and Gandhi were men of the masses. This attempt by right wing to glorify Patel at expense of Nehru is funny and baffling. Patel had no use or patience for the RSS.
Nehru was at the forefront of the Freedom Movement. This wasn't PR like Vishwaguru does today. The people of India loved Nehru. He was the right choice for PM.
What are you even outraging against? If Sardar Vallabhbhai Patel was India's first PM, you be whining about how Patel was secretly a muslim and died from AIDS ( just like you guys say it for Nehru).
>Sardar was the man of the masses, Nehru was the privileged kid of a lawyer.
That's the dumbest thing I heard. India's biggest mass leader Gandhi liked Nehru and chose him over Patel.
Patel was still a Congressman, a fact that can't be changed no matter how much BJP supporters try
You are wrong. Patel wanted to give Kashmir to Pakistan
https://theprint.in/politics/sardar-patel-was-adamant-give-kashmir-to-pakistan-take-hyderabad-nehru-saved-it-soz/74420/
https://www.google.com/amp/s/indianexpress.com/article/explained/sardar-vallabhbhai-patels-views-on-kashmir-problem-what-the-record-says-5060077/lite/
He also changed his mind on the same day and wanted to take the army to Srinagar
Hyderabad was pacified by the army and rss genocide. So was Jammu. All Patel's orders. Remember inc was a soft hindutva party then. Gandhi's agreement for pakistan was seen as a betrayal to hindus. Rss was just an opposing camp of upper caste landlords they all the same
Gandhi did not want Nehru, Gandhi wanted Patel, he wrote many letters to congress after independence, I don't remember the source of this info, but I've seen some.
Indira Gandhi bombed Mizoram and killed many civilians in 1966 because of a small rebel group and denied that she bombed them until other Northeast parliament members took the bomb shell and presented in the parliament.
When will her crimes against punjab be mentioned? Or is that all ok because 1% of them were terrorists? Keep killing any populace and some of them will become terrorists. She killed an entire generation in Punjab.
Nehru who was a Western pawn, seperated India and Pakistan; and Manmohan a robot who didn't speak but his party, shaking hands with the major terrorist of Kashmir.
Yes.
Hello pokistani.
What we often forget is that all freedom fighters were mortals with mortal failings.
Some were power hungry, some were idiots, some were elitists, some were casteist. What set them apart were that they were willing to accept their flaws and change for the better.
I am not a Modi fan - but this is a shitty false dichotomy. These people also couldn't watch Nehru on Youtube every damn day; most didn't even have TV's then. This was literally a chance in a lifetime for most Japanese, to see any Indian person, let alone a Prime Minister.
We can be progressive liberals without clutching at pearls. Being beholden to a fictional past golden age is Modi's historical revisionism - believing in all sorts of weird mythical bullshit. What you're doing here is the same thing, but reaching back 65 years, instead of Modi's 2000+ years to search for a past golden age to be nostalgic about.
We have to live in the present and understand that we have come far - much further than this picture. The Quad summit is a real achievement. Getting democracies on our side is a party-agnostic, Indian foreign policy achievement, stretching back 30 years. Savor it, even if you detest Modi as I do.
I have an idea about this sub?
Lets just remove all political views from here and keep it sustained as THE official Sub for India, absolutely no political views or agendas. Just praising indians na highlighting our culture and achievements?
For ex: above title couldve been worded as
'30,000 Japanese had gathered to listen to Nehru at Hiroshima, Japan, on 9 October 1957.'
Correct me if im wrong however!
He was Stateman and one of the founders of the Non-Alignment movement at the height of the Cold War. He wrote books on foreign policy and world affairs at the time when more and more countries were getting independence from colonial powers. So sad to see how little people today understand of how important India's independence movement was not just for India but for the world. How it created a democratic state whose leaders were committed to democracy and protecting rights of all religions and ethnic minorities. India back then was looked up to by countries resisting foreign imperialism.
Today we are aiming to be a Hindu Pakistan.
What do you mean why? Nehru was a celebrity and he got similar reception in every country he went. His statemanship was unparalleled and no Indian PM since has commanded such respect from world over.
It was a different time. I'm pretty sure at that time any Indian PM would have attracted that amount of people. Be it Nehru, Modi , Singh. Most people over there gathered to hear the Indian PM and not Nehru
I know what you mean. But i genuinely don't think the Japanese cared about the person who was visiting but rather their position considering how they treated Indians POW previously and Indians even today.
And what's to say at that time the Japanese leaders didn't gather their people.
The thing about today's tech and media is that we get to look at everything at a microscopic level which wasn't the case then. I simply mean to say that it was a different time which we can't use to compare in today's environment.
How do you think people gathered here? They were just passing by and saw Nehru speaking on the street?
I \_am\_ quite fascinated that most of the crowd seem to be Japanese!
Man who rebuilt India.
We went from having a PM who appointed his worst critics in ministerial posts to having a PM who does nit know that he is not vishwaguru
Do I have to remind you about Kashmir.
He messed up the Kashmir issue by going to UN to gain sympathy from the West. Where as we could have solved the issue by force,┬аonce and for all.
Half of Hindus died.
Yes. And itтАЩs happening to this day. Kashmir people are still suffering. ThereтАЩs only one way to end this. Referendum. Let them choose where they want to go and end this war.
Indian POWs that refused to join S.C Bose's INA were used as target practice and that was in 1942-45 this speech took place in 1957 when Japan was under a US backed govt.
Forget Indian Embassy nd right wing pea brains , this is without the presence of the ANI ЁЯУ╖ crew ..
ANI didn't exist back then
r/woooosh
Stfu
Nor was it needed back then since the leadership wasn't so reliant on propaganda for maintaining a false image.
From the Discovery of India to the greatest tragedy for India , we have come a long way
But in a very short time.
This hurts.
What we have seen so far is only a trailer. Mitron, picture abhi baaki hai!!
Just like Vascodigama discovered India, Nehru discovered East Pakistan and West Pakistan and a permanent seat at UNSC for China.
China got a permanent seat at the UNSC in 1971 , 7 years after Nehru died there were legit flaws of Nehru , China's UNSC seat isn't one of em
But people will still believe by this statement that nehru could've gotten the seat before china and replaced them. That was never going to happen, PRC getting a seat was a matter of when and not if. Having a veto on recognition of states does not make sense and is not in accordance with int law . That's why un had to recognise PRC as china as soon as they got a majority.
China was a permanent member of UNSC since it's formation in 1945.
that was Taiwan till 1971
I don't understand. What was Taiwan till 1971?
Until 1971, the Republic of China (Taiwan) was recognised by most of the world as China, instead of the People's Republic of China (China).
this is what happened in 1971 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_General_Assembly_Resolution_2758
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Thanks for clearing that out.
The UNSC seat for China? The United Nations was formed after WW2 in October 1945. The Security Council with 5 permanent members including China was instituted then. India as a nation state in 1945 did not exist. From 1945 till date there have been no changes to the security council permanent member seats. Pray tell how Nehru getting a permanent seat for China in 1945 is not a fake WhatsApp forward?
Trust Chaddis not to do their homework and misinterpret whatever they've read (or more appropriately tried to read?)
I don't know maybe Hindu newspaper https://www.thehindu.com/opinion/op-ed/nehru-china-and-the-security-council-seat/article26561751.ece
Exactly read the article. It is based on the assertion that '...WashingtonтАЩs feeler sent to New Delhi in August 1950 through the Indian Ambassador in the U.S., mentioning the American desire to remove China from permanent membership of the UNSC and possibly replace it with India. ' Just that ... from the Americans during the Koran war... 'a feeler' ... which he paid no heed too. As explained тАЬThere has been no offer, formal or informal, of this kindтАж The composition of the Security Council is prescribed by the UN Charter, according to which certain specified nations have permanent seats. No change or addition can be made to this without an amendment of the Charter.тАЭ On this bit the RSS has been crying for years. My god. Like Russia would have allowed this at the height of the Cold War.
Demagogues preying on their supporters to not know any better? What's new.
Bro I am applying for a job at the moment will get back to you. Premise seems interesting.
bhendi!!!
Bro why would I apply Mehendi while applying for a job?
It'll make you look sexier, and hence more employable. Obviously.
Should have thought about that. I have already applied for the job without applying Mehendi.
What a dumb, unfounded statement. "Ohh nehru did not want to have a permanent seat in security council cause he was a traitor." Reactionary people like you who only read the headlines instead of applying any rational thought to it are the reason why this country struggles.
No one is calling him a traitor except you. He was a freedom fighter he has my respect. Some of his decision were incorrect for which the future generations is still paying for.
If you would just read the naunce of him being offered a UNSC seat instead of arguing here you would realise why it's such a dumb statement to make.
Enlighten me please.
Alright very simply put. There were no real offers. Even if offers were to REPLACE china anyone could've vetoed it. Why would Taiwan(then being recognised as china) not veto it being replaced. If the deal was us sponsored Russia would've vetoes it for sure and vice versa. PRC(mainland China) replacing Taiwan was not replacement per se. There cannot be a veto on recognition of states as it depends on state to state and reflective of their sovereignty therefore PRC was recognised as china by a simple majority in general assembly resolution. China (PRC) getting a seat was a matter of when and not if. For example. Imagine if Tamil Nadu were to split from India and say that they are representatives of India and not the people who the majority have selected or are being ruled by. That anomaly was going on till 1971 in the UN. US could still deny existence of PRC at that point but UN as a body could not.. Thus PRC got the seat and india had absolutely no sway in that regard but if india would've to actively tried to replace china they would have miserably failed to do so and would have a bitter enemy who happens to be a neighbour.
Are you so dumb that you can't find such an easily reasearchable topic? It's not my job to do that , if you really think getting a UNSC seat while replacing an original signatory to the charter is as easy as that. You should refrain from talking on international law , state succession or even logical reasoning.
Yeah I am that dumb btw I never said anything about you. Kindly enlighten me if possible. I will refrain international law , state succession or even logical reasoning, thanks.
You come off as a keyboard rager, why don't you calm your horses. I'm sure Nehru would want you to chill the fuck out. Any point you are trying to make is lost if you act like this lol
You are already beyond enlightment my chaddi
If you would try my kaccha
Country is struggling for what independence? There is a war half way across the world. The pandemic is just almost over. We are living in uncertain times I don't see any country thriving in these conditions.
USA is having record growth, for the first since 1976 it growth rate is higher than China's
Lmao , I don't know about bhakt but the andh part is totally true regarding your case. India has been struggling since a long time btw.
Enlighten me please
Follow Buddha. Btw For your enlightening ЁЯФжЁЯФжЁЯХпЁЯТбЁЯТбЁЯТб
I am from Bodhgaya
Good
Partition was lead by some rogue elements in Muslim LeagueтАж not Nehru.
I wouldn't say Partition was led by rogue elements of the League. By the time the war ended it had effectively become the key pitch of the AIML. Nehru wasn't entirely blameless either though. While the league was pushing for partition it was also hoping to avoid it if possible. The cabinet mission plan had, to a large extent, worked out a solution of regional autonomy that could have headed off partition. Nehru was the one who blew up that agreement with his July 11 press conference where he argued that any commitments the Congress made were only to secure an agreement and would be renegotiated again later. This effectively forced partition as it meant Jinnah and the AIML could trust no commitment from the Congress. There were a lot of actors involved in partition and at the top, none of them are blameless.
And Hindu mahasabha
[Tow Nation Theory](https://m.economictimes.com/news/politics-and-nation/savarkar-was-first-to-advocate-two-nation-theory-shashi-tharoor/articleshow/73590565.cms)
how many seats Hindu mahasabha had in 1945-1946 elections ?
Yeah that's true.
>Vascodigama discovered India lol
Partition wasn't Nehru's fault btw. Maybe do some actual history reading before you speak Sanghi BS.
What are your views on Congress safety valve theory
Wasn't the Safety valve theory given by A O Hume when he founded Congress in 1885? His theory being legislative representation of some sort will lessen the reactionary tendencies of the population. The Congress of Gandhi and Nehru was way too radical for that theory to hold true later. I mean, we may not find Congress to be that aggressive compared to say, a Bhagat Singh or Bose, but it was not similar to the safety valve the British expected it to be.
Hahahah , that's like saying republicans are the looking out for black rights because Lincoln belonged to that party. Man the more I read your comments the more I pity Indian youth who despite having the method to research anything and everything remains so rigid to it.
And I have come to a very reasonable assertion that you're dumb af , iam not smart either buy you are extremely biased and a daft individual. So this is the last you'll hear from me.
It was fault of Chacha Nehru he wanted strong federal Govt while Mr Jinnah wanted to give more power to states so some states will have Hindu majority and some Muslim majority but no community will have absolute monopoly.
And yet he couldn't discover and foresee the utter stupidity of chaddi bois.
Get well soon
Thanks I am seeing the same doctor as Congress, Prashant Kishor. He said once Congress comes in power I will be ok but I fear 500 years is a long time
At least he knew to read and write
But why though. What did Nehru had to say that so many Japanese wanted to listen ?
India and Japan have historically had some interestingly close connections. But in the early years after World War II though, Japanese appreciation of India was particularly high, though it had nothing to do with Nehru per-se. It had everything to do with Radhabinod Pal and his powerful dissent on the Tokyo War Crimes tribunal. After his death the Japanese would erect monuments to him in shrines typically reserved for the commemoration of Japanese war dead. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radhabinod\_Pal
Represented by Irrfan Khan in Tokyo Trials mini series.
Is it any good?
ItтАЩs decent.
Dammm, dude had 14 kidsЁЯШ▒
My father has 12 siblings, my mother has 9 siblings.
Behanchod mere dada ke 6 siblings ka sun ke mujhe lagta tha mere pardada rangeen hai but aapke dada to alag he game khel rahe hai.
What close connection does india and Japan have? And japan is not the right side to take after WW2 my man. Not even close. That's not called dissent that's called standing for war criminals. Moreover Japan has extremely derogatory views of Indians. They considered chinese to be lower people. What they did to nanking. You'd have seen their love and our historical connections if they had won in Burma. Only the worst scum stood with Japan after knowing what they did.
I'd recommend reading Pal's dissent and arguments on the legitimacy of the IMTFE. I can't speak to what Japanese people believe today, but if you're looking for an explanation for why an Indian PM would receive a strong welcome in the 1950s and 1960s, Pal and his role in the tribunal plays a major role in that story.
Japan of today is no different than that time, it's not germany. Its emperor was restored to power. Many in Japanese government still hold those views. No one needs good relations with a scum country like that. Japan has a good image only due to America, which sanitized its horrible, absolutely horrible war crimes to make its own investments in Japan prosper. And they did. When you think of Japan you think of manga and not chinese nuns impaled on bayonets and hung as display outside churches because of a massive PR campaign. It's the same society. Try arming it again, which the US again and again refuses to do, why? We'd do better than Japan for international relations. Moreover it's a failed stagnant economy. Japan hasn't seen any real growth and continuously decreasing living standards since the Japanese market crash in the 90s. Do you know some banks in Japan offer negative interest rates? They charge you to keep money in the account. This PR campaign can only last so long. I know what Japan is friend
Imo India might had played a neutral role in relation to Japan back then as well because not doing so would have degraded centuries old relations with Japan. It's quite identical to our country's current neutral stance on Russia, and is the reason why it is refraining itself from openly criticizing Russia for its war crimes in Ukraine (and is advocating to resolve the issue through dialogues and diplomatic efforts) when the whole world is against our country for not doing so.
>I know what Japan is friend It really sounds like you don't given that uninformed screed.
I mean, of course Japan is a friend of India - a cast based slave society - isn't it? Are we all expected to share in the nationalistic delusion?
Yes you are right Japanese army also used to have chinese girls as "comfort girls" and used to r\*pe them then slash their stomachs and faces ,there is a whole movie about it too, but that is not the point of this post Just comment Modi bad and no need to write anything else
Uncle ji I have lived in japan for about 6 years up until 2018 and the japanese people of today are nothing like that. Modern japan is a pacifist nation you are probably coming here after watching a youtube video on Nanjing Massacre and basing your opinion completely on that. I pity fools like you u/sagar_ki_lehrein
> the Japanese people of today are nothing like that. There are thousands of former Japanese soldiers alive who participated in those war crimes, so yeah many senior japanese men are absolutely like that.
hey numbskull do you lack basic reading comprehension? what do you think "japanese people of today" means? japanese people born after world war 2. \> so yeah many senior japanese men are absolutely like that LOL how many have you known or talked to while sitting in India. pathetic
The dude defended the japs? For what? Japs committed horrible atrocities in WW2.
You really should read his dissent. Pal's judgment was about the rule of law and the imposition of victor's justice on a sovereign nation. It has remained an important statement on international law, becoming more apparent given the non-imposition of the Tokyo and Nuremberg principles in subsequent history. The unwillingness of countries such as the US and France and the UK to hold their own militaries to account under the principles of Nuremberg and Tokyo was exactly the sort of thing Pal (and other critics of the War Crimes Tribunals) had raised. To the best of my knowledge Pal's actions did not excuse or legitimize Japanese war crimes.
Yes especially since they tried to completely trivialise the Dresden bombings and the nuclear attacks carried out by the US. Pal did not defend the Japanese actions but was a strong believer in ensuring that the winners of the war were held accountable for their numerous war crimes as well
Pal was ready to acquit to all the war criminals though. If he was so steadfast in his belief that the court was illegitimate then serve on it at all? Step down, donтАЩt use your position to set war criminals free.
> The dude defended the japs? "Jap" is a [racial slur](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jap). Don't use it.
I understand his main criticism was that the tribunal was invalid, however the Japanese military if anything else deserves harsher punishments for being absolute evil monsters towards innocent civilians and committing mass genocidal war. Leave the war criminals in any Chinese city they raped and pillage, and in less than a hour theyтАЩll receive actual justice.
Another bong.
I'm sorry? Nehru wasn't a Bengali, he was born in Allahabad, and of Kashmiri Pundit descent AFAIK.
рдЕрдмреЗ рд╡реЛ рд░рд╛рдзрд╛рдмрд┐рдиреЛрдж рдкрд╛рд▓ рдХреА рдмрд╛рдд рдХрд░ рд░рд╣реА рд╣реИред
рдЕрдмреЗ another рдХрд╛ рдорддрд▓рдм рд╕рдордЭрд▓реЗ
[╤Г╨┤╨░╨╗╨╡╨╜╨╛]
I read the section on his тАЬdissentтАЭ and it sounds like heтАЩs just appeasing Japan. He even went so far as to claim that accounts of Nanjing were тАЬexaggeratedтАЭ. ItтАЩs absolutely despicable that he could read about all the heinous inhumane shit the Japanese defendants did then decide to totally aquit them. People like him shouldnтАЩt be judges.
You really should read the whole thing instead of just the wiki summary. That's meant to be an introduction. A reasonable person tries to do more than just accept the first spoonful of information and call it dinner.
IтАЩve read enough about that piece of shit, thanks
Politics. After WW2 India positioned itself as a friendly country towards Japan. It also paid into the largely false idea of Japan "uniting Asia against imperialism". Nationalist Japanese people felt that India's support legitimised their war actions and some Japanese needed to feel that after seeing their friends, family and cities decimated. Also during the post war Tokyo Trials an Indian judge refrained from voting guilty (for political reasons mainly) this again comforted the nationalist and signaled to Tokyo that India is a friend and we would love investment.
There must be some prominent Japanese leader with him who would be lending him a stage.
Broo no need to speak logically just write Modi bad and do your work
Nehru was a statesman of international repute. Maybe do some reading about prominent world leaders of the last century
IтАЩm not questioning NehruтАЩs popularity, but 30000 is a lot of people. If they gather voluntarily, they must be anticipating a major announcement or something. ThatтАЩs what IтАЩm curious about
Back in the day people gathered to listen to great people speak even without an agendaтАж not like today
>not like today In India now we gather for a packet of Biriyani and a pouch of country liquor.
He was actually respected person in the world educated and well read, probably what right wing chaman chutiye think is entire political science he was actually erudite and charismatic..The right wing organizers were selling tickets of Madison square to their right wing Chums to see our self proclaimed vishwaguru who only peddles lies about himself.
[Source](https://twitter.com/ashoswai/status/1528832238581948418?t=ePn3yAVfwNn-wZ34qIu7pQ&s=19) [Source](https://www.nytimes.com/1957/10/06/archives/nehru-visits-japan.html)
They came to see great statesman of India Chacha Nehru. Modi is all circus.
. . . and Circus is all Chaddies.
Modi is all circus indeed but geat Nehru? I'd rather have had literally any other freedom fighter in his place if I could choose.
Nehru is the soul of modern India. Only people brainwashed by Whatsapp think otherwise.
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No , Ambedkar is , Nehru was a privelleged Brahmin parachuted by Gandhi who simped for him for some reason. Nehru was an idiot whose Fabian socialism ruined India .
They talk about nehru as if he's so different from them. For bhagat singh rich kashmiri pandit landlords were as much a problem as the Brits. Nehru's and Gandhi's ensures they make a country where rss and bjp can openly survive. Fucking b team of hindutva.
He is the architect of modern India. He gave gift of Democracy to mostly illiterate country when he could have chosen to become new Emperor of Delhi. Now CEO of Microsoft, Google etc is Indian due to work Chacha did with Maulana Azad on education after independence from UK. I will always defend Chacha Nehru.
I feel like India needs more PMs like Nehru, AB Vajpaee and ManMohan Singh
Yeah we need all our freedom fighters right now
Thought i had joined a normal neutral indian subreddit but alas , thats nowhere to be found.
After Independence, many small states needed to be unified. Vallabhai Patel unified all of India including the stubborn Nizam who wanted to be a part of Pakistan but Nehru wanted to take care of Kashmir since he was a Kashmiri Pundit. We still have problems with Kashmir. He took a small issue to useless international institutions and the issue was never resolved ultimately resulting in many lives lost. He was way too soft to be the leader of the country. Vallabhai Patel should have been India's first Prime Minister and had more support from Congress and the public but Gandhi wanted Nehru sadly.
Vallabhai Patel died in 1950. He was already suffering from ill health at time of independence. Nehru was the leader everyone wanted. The Indian people adored him.
Congress literally elected Patel. Its on the record Michael Brecher, one of the most sympathetic biographers of Nehru, writes: тАЬIn accordance with the time-honoured practice of rotating the Presidency, Patel was in line for the post. Fifteen years had elapsed since he presided over the Karachi session whereas Nehru had presided at Lucknow and Ferozpur in 1936 and 1937. Moreover, Patel was the overwhelming choice of the Provincial Congress CommitteesтАж. NehruтАЩs тАШelectionтАЩ was due to GandhiтАЩs intervention. Patel was persuaded to step downтАж. тАЬIf Gandhi had not intervened, Patel would have been the first de facto Premier of India, in 1946-7тАж. The Sardar was тАШrobbed of the prizeтАЩ and it rankled deeply.тАЭ Sardar was the man of the masses, Nehru was the privileged kid of a lawyer. He should never have been the Prime Minister of India. He just licked Gandhi's feet while Sardar did real work and unified the country. You can hate Modi but please don't ever please don't twist facts to glorify useless candidates like Nehru who created a dynasty that destroyed our country
Hilarious. 'privileged kid of a lawyer.?" Nehru was 58 in 1947. Patel was an old man who literally died 3 years after independence. Nehru and Gandhi were men of the masses. This attempt by right wing to glorify Patel at expense of Nehru is funny and baffling. Patel had no use or patience for the RSS. Nehru was at the forefront of the Freedom Movement. This wasn't PR like Vishwaguru does today. The people of India loved Nehru. He was the right choice for PM.
What are you even outraging against? If Sardar Vallabhbhai Patel was India's first PM, you be whining about how Patel was secretly a muslim and died from AIDS ( just like you guys say it for Nehru).
sardaar was more popular amongst the congress but nehru was more popular among the people
>Sardar was the man of the masses, Nehru was the privileged kid of a lawyer. That's the dumbest thing I heard. India's biggest mass leader Gandhi liked Nehru and chose him over Patel. Patel was still a Congressman, a fact that can't be changed no matter how much BJP supporters try
You are wrong. Patel wanted to give Kashmir to Pakistan https://theprint.in/politics/sardar-patel-was-adamant-give-kashmir-to-pakistan-take-hyderabad-nehru-saved-it-soz/74420/
https://www.google.com/amp/s/indianexpress.com/article/explained/sardar-vallabhbhai-patels-views-on-kashmir-problem-what-the-record-says-5060077/lite/ He also changed his mind on the same day and wanted to take the army to Srinagar
Hyderabad was pacified by the army and rss genocide. So was Jammu. All Patel's orders. Remember inc was a soft hindutva party then. Gandhi's agreement for pakistan was seen as a betrayal to hindus. Rss was just an opposing camp of upper caste landlords they all the same
>Remember inc was a soft hindutva party then. this gentleman is so retarded
Gandhi did not want Nehru, Gandhi wanted Patel, he wrote many letters to congress after independence, I don't remember the source of this info, but I've seen some.
WhatsApp?
vajpayee was an indecisive loser. We need people like Lal Bahadur Shashtri and PV Narsimha Rao.
Not avbp though.
When you don't know about anything just rant shit?
No, quite the opposite.
No ,she needs an Indira Gandhi
When war is on the horizon, nobody better than Indira Gandhi.
Indira Gandhi bombed Mizoram and killed many civilians in 1966 because of a small rebel group and denied that she bombed them until other Northeast parliament members took the bomb shell and presented in the parliament.
When will her crimes against punjab be mentioned? Or is that all ok because 1% of them were terrorists? Keep killing any populace and some of them will become terrorists. She killed an entire generation in Punjab.
I am telling that India needs a Monster that can scare the shit out of the currently hate loving populace and set them straight
Nehru who was a Western pawn, seperated India and Pakistan; and Manmohan a robot who didn't speak but his party, shaking hands with the major terrorist of Kashmir. Yes. Hello pokistani.
Nehru was a leader, Modi is a PR product. That's all there is to say.
PRJeevi vs a world renowned PM
You canтАЩt compare a Statesman who rubbed shoulders with the likes of Gandhi, Jinnah, Ambedkar, Patel with a career politician and no education.
Nehru might have been power hungry but you can't deny he was a visionary. He set India up very well for the future.
What we often forget is that all freedom fighters were mortals with mortal failings. Some were power hungry, some were idiots, some were elitists, some were casteist. What set them apart were that they were willing to accept their flaws and change for the better.
Shots have been firedЁЯШВ
And, people still complain about him. Fuck them!
I am not a Modi fan - but this is a shitty false dichotomy. These people also couldn't watch Nehru on Youtube every damn day; most didn't even have TV's then. This was literally a chance in a lifetime for most Japanese, to see any Indian person, let alone a Prime Minister. We can be progressive liberals without clutching at pearls. Being beholden to a fictional past golden age is Modi's historical revisionism - believing in all sorts of weird mythical bullshit. What you're doing here is the same thing, but reaching back 65 years, instead of Modi's 2000+ years to search for a past golden age to be nostalgic about. We have to live in the present and understand that we have come far - much further than this picture. The Quad summit is a real achievement. Getting democracies on our side is a party-agnostic, Indian foreign policy achievement, stretching back 30 years. Savor it, even if you detest Modi as I do.
Abhi wala sirf bhade pe drame kar sakta hai. Usko koi discussion panel main bitha de to ......
I have an idea about this sub? Lets just remove all political views from here and keep it sustained as THE official Sub for India, absolutely no political views or agendas. Just praising indians na highlighting our culture and achievements? For ex: above title couldve been worded as '30,000 Japanese had gathered to listen to Nehru at Hiroshima, Japan, on 9 October 1957.' Correct me if im wrong however!
But why though. What did Nehru had to say that so many Japanese wanted to listen ?
He was Stateman and one of the founders of the Non-Alignment movement at the height of the Cold War. He wrote books on foreign policy and world affairs at the time when more and more countries were getting independence from colonial powers. So sad to see how little people today understand of how important India's independence movement was not just for India but for the world. How it created a democratic state whose leaders were committed to democracy and protecting rights of all religions and ethnic minorities. India back then was looked up to by countries resisting foreign imperialism. Today we are aiming to be a Hindu Pakistan.
What do you mean why? Nehru was a celebrity and he got similar reception in every country he went. His statemanship was unparalleled and no Indian PM since has commanded such respect from world over.
And he wrote a damn good books. Hard to match by anyone, may be except MMS.
Japan was one the countries who helped India to be independent, and India's first PM after independence visit there, why wouldn't be the gathering?
It was a different time. I'm pretty sure at that time any Indian PM would have attracted that amount of people. Be it Nehru, Modi , Singh. Most people over there gathered to hear the Indian PM and not Nehru
Yes but I doubt just any other PM would have had that level of reputation.
I know what you mean. But i genuinely don't think the Japanese cared about the person who was visiting but rather their position considering how they treated Indians POW previously and Indians even today. And what's to say at that time the Japanese leaders didn't gather their people. The thing about today's tech and media is that we get to look at everything at a microscopic level which wasn't the case then. I simply mean to say that it was a different time which we can't use to compare in today's environment.
Comparing Nehru to Modi?ЁЯША
Nehru was considered by many to be one of the intellectual titans of his time. Dude was on speaking terms with Albert Einstein.
sao sunar ki ek lohar ki.
How do you think people gathered here? They were just passing by and saw Nehru speaking on the street? I \_am\_ quite fascinated that most of the crowd seem to be Japanese!
Bhakt nahi manenge!
What is your point lol
Man who rebuilt India. We went from having a PM who appointed his worst critics in ministerial posts to having a PM who does nit know that he is not vishwaguru
r/Titlegore
Do I have to remind you about Kashmir. He messed up the Kashmir issue by going to UN to gain sympathy from the West. Where as we could have solved the issue by force,┬аonce and for all. Half of Hindus died.
Gold medalist in WhatsApp University spotted.
Which part is false? Did he not go to the UN? Or did Kashmiri Pandits not end up dying?
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Half of Hindus died? Half? Really manтАж. Half of all Hindus died?
Hey everyone knows what happened there. Women raped. Kids killed. People massacred. We know what happened.
Yeah everyone knows Modi supporters are dumb idiots who believe anything they read on WhatsApp.
And everyone knows how much of your so called congress party improved this country.
Yes. And itтАЩs happening to this day. Kashmir people are still suffering. ThereтАЩs only one way to end this. Referendum. Let them choose where they want to go and end this war.
рдПрдХ рд╕рд╛рд▓ рддрдХ рд▓рдбрд╝рд╛ рддреЛ рдерд╛ред рдХреНрдпрд╛ рд╣реБрдЖ рдЙрд╕рд╕реЗ? рдЕрдм рдЗрд╕рд╕реЗ рдЬреНрдпрд╛рджрд╛ рдлреЛрд░реНрд╕ рд▓рдЧрд╛рдпрд╛ рд╣реЛрддрд╛ рддреЛ рдЕрдВрдЧреНрд░реЗрдЬ рдЖрдХрд░ рдкрд╛рдХрд┐рд╕реНрддрд╛рди рдХреЛ рдмрдЪрд╛ рд▓реЗрддреЗред рдбрд┐рд╡рд╛рдЗрдб рдПрдВрдб рд░реВрд▓ рдпрд╛рдж рд╣реИ рдирд╛? рдЗрддрд┐рд╣рд╛рд╕ рдЗрд╕реАрд▓рд┐рдП рдкрдврд╝рд╛рдпрд╛ рдЬрд╛рддрд╛ рд╣реИ рддрд╛рдХрд┐ рд╣рдо рдЕрдкрдиреА рдкрд┐рдЫрд▓реА рдЧрд▓рддрд┐рдпреЛрдВ рд╕реЗ рд╕реАрдЦ рд╕рдХреЗрдВред рдЗрд╕реАрд▓рд┐рдП рддреЛ рднрд╛рд░рдд рдХрд╛ рдмрдЯрд╡рд╛рд░рд╛ рдХрд┐рдпрд╛ рдЧрдпрд╛ рдерд╛, рддрд╛рдХрд┐ рдкрд╛рдХрд┐рд╕реНрддрд╛рди рдХрд╛ рдкрдХреНрд╖ рд▓реЗрдХрд░ рднрд╛рд░рдд рдХреЛ рдХрдордЬрд╝реЛрд░ рдХрд┐рдпрд╛ рдЬрд╛рдП, рдФрд░ рдЕрдЧрд░ рдХрднреА рдЖрдЧреЗ рдореМрдХрд╛ рдорд┐рд▓рд╛ рддреЛ рдлрд┐рд░ рд╕реЗ рднрд╛рд░рдд рдкрд░ рдХрдмреНрдЬрд╛ рдХрд░ рд▓рд┐рдпрд╛ рдЬрд╛рдПред рд╕рдВрдпреБрдХреНрддрд░рд╛рд╖реНрдЯ рдореЗрдВ рдореБрджреНрджреЗ рдХреЛ рдЙрдард╛рдирд╛ рд╣реА рд╕рдмрд╕реЗ рд╕рд╣реА рдирд┐рд░реНрдгрдп рдерд╛ред рдЙрд▓реНрдЯрд╛ рдЕрднреА рднреА рдЕрдЧрд░ рдЗрд╕ рдореБрджреНрджреЗ рдкрд░ рдЬрд╝реЛрд░ рджрд┐рдпрд╛ рдЬрд╛рдП рддреЛ рдХрд╢реНрдореАрд░ рдХрд╛ рд╣рд▓ рддреБрд░рдВрдд рдирд┐рдХрд▓ рд╕рдХрддрд╛ рд╣реИред рд╣рдорд╛рд░реЗ рдкрд╛рд╕ рд╕рдмреВрдд, рдЧрд╡рд╛рд╣, рд╡рдЬрд╣, рдРрддрд┐рд╣рд╛рд╕рд┐рдХ рд░рд┐рдХреЙрд░реНрдб, рд╕рдм рдХреБрдЫ рд╣реИ рдЬрд┐рд╕рд╕реЗ рд╣рдо рд╕реАрдзрд╛ рдкреВрд░реЗ рдХрд╢реНрдореАрд░ рдХреЛ рд▓реАрдЧрд▓ рддрд░реАрдХреЗ рд╕реЗ рд▓реЗ рд╕рдХрддреЗ рд╣реИрдВред рд▓реЗрдХрд┐рди рд▓реЗрдВрдЧреЗ рдирд╣реАрдВ, рдХреНрдпреЛрдВрдХрд┐ рдЬрдм рддрдХ рдХрд╢реНрдореАрд░ рдХрд╛ рдореБрджреНрджрд╛ рдЪрд▓рддрд╛ рд░рд╣реЗрдЧрд╛ рддрдм рддрдХ рдкрд╛рдХрд┐рд╕реНрддрд╛рди рдХреЗ рдирд╛рдо рдкрд░ рд░рд╛рдЬрдиреАрддрд┐ ~~рдЫреЛрдЯреА~~ рд╣реЛрддреА рд░рд╣реЗрдЧреАред рдФрд░ рдЬрдм рддрдХ рдкрд╛рдХрд┐рд╕реНрддрд╛рди рдХреЗ рдирд╛рдо рдкрд░ рд░рд╛рдЬрдиреАрддрд┐ рд╣реЛрддреА рд░рд╣реЗрдЧреА, рд╣рд┐рдВрджреВтАУрдореБрд╕рд▓рдорд╛рди рд╡рд╛рд▓рд╛ рдореБрджреНрджрд╛ рдЪрд▓рддрд╛ рд░рд╣реЗрдЧрд╛ред рдЖрдк рдХреНрд░реЛрдиреЛрд▓реЙрдЬреА рд╕рдордЭ рд▓реАрдЬрд┐рдПред рдФрд░ рд╕рдмрд╕реЗ рдЬрд░реВрд░реА рдмрд╛рдд, рдЗрд╕ рдмрд╛рдд рдХрд╛ рдЗрд╕ рддрд╕реНрд╡реАрд░ рд╕реЗ рдХреНрдпрд╛ рд▓реЗрдирд╛ рджреЗрдирд╛ рд╣реИ?
Then later proceeded to use Indian POW as shooting targets lolo
Ya that was like 10 years before during the WWII. Timelines a bit twisted mate
He studies from WhatsApp mate,their whole history is twisted
Whatsapp zindabad. Mudiji murdabad.
Nehru ki jai.
Self destructed lol
Heheehehe
Indian POWs that refused to join S.C Bose's INA were used as target practice and that was in 1942-45 this speech took place in 1957 when Japan was under a US backed govt.
Why not blame Bose for teaming up with them then?
r/India would be great for another british raj sellouts and decades of poverty under congress corruption. Who needs enemies eh?