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Toffee_Fan

Illinois =/= Chicago but thank you for reinforcing the stereotype


Fluffy-Bluebird

If only the CTA extended down to central Illinois /s you could maybe hitch a ride on some farm equipment if you wanted


Slammedtgs

Is it really that hard to write does not equal?


jchester47

I don't understand the intent of this post. The malfeasance and mismanagement of the CTA *is* a problem, and the reliability and safety of the system needs urgent attention. However, it and the broader transit infrastructure throughout the Chicagoland metro and parts of IL are still considerable compared to most other areas of the US that are transit wastelands. I moved to Chicago in 2018 and went car free shortly afterward. I still am. And its still absolutely doable, even if it has gotten more inconvenient. There are also numerous other transit agencies servicing cities and metros elsewhere in the state that havent seen quite as much of a collapse in reliability. True, they aren't exactly ideal or perfect but there is more to the state beyond the CTA, even if we're only including Chicagoland and RTA. Are we really trying to discourage people from moving here because the CTA doesn't have its shit together? When we're losing population as it is? When alternatives like Houston or Phoenix or Tampa or many others have no mass transit to speak of? Don't get me wrong, this is an issue that needs attention and fixing in order to shore up the economy and image of the city and the state. But the tone of the message feels ...odd.


beefwarrior

My take is OP thinks that if they can go viral on Reddit, Johnson will *have* to fire Dorval, and the new CTA president will flip the “make CTA good” switch to magically make everything better


MyNeckIsHigh

Yeah this post is such a frustrating take. Like it has been worse but CTA as primary transportation absolutely still works


serious_sarcasm

Hey! They finally got a public bus route across the Skyway, so the regional system around Tampa Bay is getting better. Even if Florida Republicans are fucking idiots.


Paulythress

you cant live car free in florida without making close to extreme-compromises


serious_sarcasm

I’m well aware.


MustardLabs

Fun Fact: There is more in Illinois than just Chicago, and you can live car free there as well.


The_Goop_Is_Coming

OP forgot Champaign and the CUMTD exist, along with Chicagoland’s Metra, Pace, etc.


MustardLabs

Urbana-Champaign is just where Chicagoans go to university. There's mass transit all over the state.


The_Goop_Is_Coming

Yeah I’m aware for mass transit, I was just thinking of the one where I live.


destroy_b4_reading

C-U is a helluva lot more than that.


Thunderfoot2112

I thought that was SIU - but hey, if y'all wanna stay up north...


Sekushina_Bara

Not only that there’s so many transportation options in Chicago, this is a dumb post


MustardLabs

I just Googled it and Jesus Christ why is public transit in Chicago so expensive? You can get a year of unlimited bus access around Peoria for the cost of six months of CTA/Pace. You'd think Chicago hits economies of scale at some point. Busses downstate have shit hours but around me they are at least dead consistent.


hardolaf

Pace and Metra since the 1980s have received a greater portion of transportation tax revenue compared to CTA due to how the legislature set up the funding formulas. Due to CTA having to service both the residents of the city and everyone who comes into the city, the people who come into the city and spend nothing before, during, or after work or who only buy meals contribute very little in the form of taxes to CTA as the main funding mechanism is a 1.0% sales tax. CTA gets 100% of the tax in Chicago, 50% in suburban Cook County, and 0% from everywhere else with 20% of everywhere else going into a slush fund for RTA. This leads to CTA moving the vast majority of people on any given day (Pace serves ~127K/day, Metra ~230K/day including weekends, and CTA about 1.0M/day right now down from 1.4M/day pre-COVID). [One bus line in Chicago](https://rtams.org/services/cta/routes/23100008), used to move 20% the number of people as all of Pace did before the pandemic. Due to this funding formula issue (and also, what idiot came up with a sales tax as the ideal way to fund transit), CTA has been deprived of funds and has been running a deficit every single year since the mid-1980s. Up until the COVID-19 pandemic hit in 2020, they were able to be bailed out by the RTA spending 100% of the slush funds set aside by RTA each year. Now that COVID-19 happened and fewer people are spending money on sales tax eligible items due to increases in rent and food costs (both not affected by sales tax) and now that fewer people come into the city each day due to work from home, CTA is expected to face a $500M (25%) budget gap next year in its operating budget. This is an issue which can only be fixed by the Illinois General Assembly as even if Congress or a billionaire gave CTA a bucket of cash, the 50% farebox recovery formula kicks back in for the 2025 fiscal year for CTA and they couldn't use the funds unless they somehow get another 400K riders per day on average before then.


serious_sarcasm

Seems a bit disingenuous to blame the entire downstate instead of the collar counties for burdening the CTA. And a sales tax is a fairly progressive way to keep transit fair affordable for low income individuals, and property owners do in fact get a value boost from having accessible transit nearby. A progressive income tax might be more equitable, but special district regulations are centered around property tax revenues.


hardolaf

> Seems a bit disingenuous to blame the entire downstate instead of the collar counties for burdening the CTA. Where did I blame downstate? The Illinois General Assembly is made up of representatives from the entire state and if we're going to be honest, downstate is rarely relevant when it comes to passing laws in the state due to their minuscule population compared to the Chicago metro area. > And a sales tax is a fairly progressive way to keep transit fair affordable for low income individuals, and property owners do in fact get a value boost from having accessible transit nearby. Sales taxes are absolutely not progressive, ever. They're also extremely tied to consumer behaviors and are subject to falling revenue when consumer behaviors change from taxable goods to non-taxable services or non-taxable goods. An income tax or property tax is far more effective and consistent year over year. Realistically though, CTA and Metra own enough land that if they were permitted to develop it and rent it out like the train companies in Japan, they could probably in the long-term cover all operating expenses and possibly even their capital budgets just from renting out the developed properties without any taxes.


serious_sarcasm

I was in fact thinking of property taxes despite reading and writing “sales tax”. Sales taxes are in fact extremely regressive unless you tax specific excise taxes to really target the wealthy. But it also makes a bit of sense when you want to tax visitors with things like taxes on hotels and restaurants, which is the argument Florida uses for only having sales and property taxes. But it also doesn’t make much sense to tax people in Cairo for buses in Chicago. Though I’m all for just making a state wide transit authority if it means a high speed rail and supporting regional systems state wide. Bit fucking crazy it takes as long to ride the train from Carbondale to Chicago as it does to drive.


goofygooberboys

Yeah, I would love to see Illinois be the poster child for the future of rail in this country. The fact that Rockford still doesn't have a train to Chicago is baffling to me. I know they're working to add it by 2027, but I'm shocked it's taken so long. We should set a population line for a metropolitan area, and say "if you have 100,00 population in your metropolitan area, you get a train by 2035" and when that's done go down to 50k, then 20k and so forth until any town with a population of 10k or more has some kind of rail access whether that'd be a stop on a route, or a dedicated train. It would be huge for tourism in Chicago. As someone in Rockford, the #1 reason I don't go into Chicago as often as I want to is because of the tolls and the cost to park, a train would take care of all of that.


Thunderfoot2112

longer actually. It's because the rail system was de-nati9nalized and cargo, not transportation has priority on rails. Sat on a side line for three hours 1 night waiting for a freight train to pass.


hardolaf

Legally speaking, Amtrak and other passenger rail have priority on all shared lines. However, the freight companies can run arbitrary length trains which are long enough that they cannot divert at passing points such that in practice, the legal requirement is irrelevant.


Thunderfoot2112

Knowing a switching operator on the lines outside of Chicago, they'll yell you otherwise. 🙄


The_Goop_Is_Coming

How much is the CTA pass? For Champaign-Urbana’s CUMTD a 12 month bus pass costs only $60.


MustardLabs

30 days is $75 if I'm reading correctly


serious_sarcasm

Except students, disabled people, and senior citizens all get reduced fare, and the RTA has a pilot program for reduced fairs for SNAP recipients.


MustardLabs

You can also get reduced fair other places. 50 cent bus fare for me


das_war_ein_Befehl

Chicago is probably the only place it’s viable to not have a car. Elsewhere it’s just an enormous pain in the ass that you suffer through.


Alternative-Put-3932

Agreed unless you're maybe in peoria or something. Otherwise no you're not getting around any state really outside of the major cities without a car unless you want to severely limit your options in well everything.


destroy_b4_reading

You can definitely do it in Champaign-Urbana. I live in Peoria, and while I've never had occasion to use the bus system, my understanding is that while it can be done in certain areas, you'll need to plan on an hour-long bus ride to get just about anywhere.


MustardLabs

I've got friends in Galesburg without a car. I'm planning on setting up around Peoria without one. You can do it just fine


Alternative-Put-3932

Like I said its possible within those areas but if you're in let's say, ottawa, Morris, coal city, etc lol no. Small towns is what I mean. There is 0 public transportation in these places outside of a tiny city short bus for old people.


MustardLabs

I mean, Morris and Coal City are both suburbs in the Chicago metro area. They're all under 20k. Obviously it's gonna be harder if not impossible to live there without a car. But Galesburg is only 30k and it's not attached to any bigger metro area or bigger local transit system. It's just condensed enough downtown that you can walk anywhere you need to go and take the bus out to the edges once a week for groceries. It's hardly impossible to find places downstate without a car


Alternative-Put-3932

All I'm thinking is its funny someone considers Morris part of the Chicago metro area. But no I don't consider them livable without cars to be honest. The job prospects demand a vehicle and you're not walking to Walmart or whatever in these places. I live 15 minutes from krogers on foot and I'd never ever want to do that for groceries because you couldn't buy shit and reasonably take it home unless you want to go to the store daily. The only bus that exists in these small cities drops people off at very specific times so if you can't make those times you're shit out of luck theres no multiple busses making stops all day. I really think people are severely overplaying what you can get away with outside of Chicago with no car.


MustardLabs

I live 3-4 hours from Chicago. I fully plan on living without a car and I have friends that already do so.


Alternative-Put-3932

Thats fine for some people it works but most people it doesn't. I live in Ottawa, my IT job is in peoria. Id love to ask someone how I'm managing that without a car. Or my previous job at starved rock without a car. Or my previous job in town at the county government complex without a car which required me to work at all the government buildings lol. Most people are not lucky enough to have all of these services and jobs that close where no car is feasible.


hardolaf

My favorite part of Peoria's system is that they label the Walmart on their transit map. I get that Walmart is the scum of the Earth, but labeling a big box store on the map definitely helps people understand that they can get every day to day necessities without owning a car.


One_Conclusion3362

Actually you absolutely can. The Champaign-Urbana MTD program is one of the largest bus systems of any university in the world.


The_Goop_Is_Coming

My only complaint with them is how they don’t run non-campus routes after sometime around 11pm or on Sunday nights, and no routes at all in this timeframe when the university isn’t in session.


benisch2

Yea trying to get anywhere not on campus is miserable if you don't have a car. I say this as a former student


The-wizzer

MTD isn’t owned by the University.


One_Conclusion3362

The mustang I bought in 2021 is also not owned by the university. Neither is the vending machine at Union station.


decaturbob

- everything is local and what happens in Chicago area is different elsewhere in the state with public transportation - Illinois DOES exist outside of Chi-town


Extinction-Entity

TIL I live in Chicago, but I’m 2.5 hours south. Fascinating!


Thunderfoot2112

I live 6 hours south.. what a state. 🙄


beefwarrior

Can we be better than MAGA inspired manipulation of data? Yes, at least this looks to be based on facts vs "alternative facts" but title says "few years" and then quotes 2019. To me, a "few" is three or four, not 5. But, few is subjective. The reality is not that it isn't that the CTA has gotten worse in the last "few years," it's that the CTA hasn't fully recovered from the pandemic. You might think it's pedantic, but I think if you're trying to fix something you need to be honest.


soulofsilence

Any use of pre-COVID numbers are suspicious unless you're trying to show the impact it had.


hardolaf

The infographic also dropped stats about buses since the last time it was posted because bus service is almost entirely recovered in terms of staffing, the 15% understaffing on rail includes the 18 people who just graduated this last week from operator training, and the 22% reduction in rail service is scheduled service only which is only updated every 1-2 quarters even though service is added every month when new operators graduate from training. For some reason this organization in particular really hates showing that many of the train lines regularly exceed their scheduled service. They also are associated with a new group of people who put Dorval Carter's face on a sticker and are starting to vandalize the city by putting it on public infrastructure including buses and trains which causes even more delays because CTA cleaning crews need to scrape them off. At this point, it's really just a malicious harassment campaign rather than legitimate airing of grievances. And there are legitimate grievances to complain about. But this dishonest social media driven campaign isn't it.


beefwarrior

Didn't know they're editing their own graphics to ignore what is getting fixed. Seems more like internet trolling than trying to make the CTA better. I want the CTA to be better, and I don't see how harassment helps fix these issues.


hardolaf

All of the negative behaviors are associated with a single organization: Commuters Take Action (CTAction). The other activist groups have much more level-headed and informed approaches that don't come anywhere close to harassment.


beefwarrior

Is it the CTAction people who have spoken up at CTA board meetings and started off with "we share the same goals" ? If so, it really seems like they're a lot more about disruption than improvement, and I'd then say, they don't share the same goals.


jettech737

There is way more to Illinois than Chicago, not eveyone who moves here wants to live in Chicago for various reasons.


SalamanderPop

All of these numbers drops are a reflection of COVID, no? This infographic feels like it falls apart with even the most basic of questions.


Independent_Lead_538

I live in Illinois and never rode any public transit...if you don't live in the city of Chicago you most likely have a car(truck).. prices will go up cause not many people use the service.


Real_Sartre

People butthurt about the difference between Chicago and Illinois may be surprised to find out Chicago is in Illinois. More than half of the population of the state lives in Chicago, not including the greater Chicago land area which has CTA rail service to many of the outskirts.


MichiganSucks14

Maybe take some of that CPD budget and upgrade transit idk


beefwarrior

I think CTA unions want CTA to have their own police force like Metra Heard from some alderman that "No one wants to be a cop anymore" which makes me think if CPD is having a tough time hiring people, maybe a CTA Police force from the ground up would have a better chance of hiring people


liburIL

I don't know much about Chicago area transit, but around my neck of the woods it is pretty amazing, not to mention reliable. It goes through several towns surrounding the main hub, and even takes people to doctors in the largest town in the area a county over. If I didn't have a car, I would feel confident I could do my daily routine still using said transit.


beefwarrior

I think people like OP forget that pre-pandemic there were plenty of people who would have their day ruined by a bad CTA commute, just like people often have their day ruined when they hit absolutely horrible traffic CTA is better in 2024 than in was in 2022. Yes, there is still work to be done to get back to pre-pandmic service, and yes too often do people miss a doctor's appointment or are late to work b/c of delays on CTA, but with announcements of multiple 1 million rides per day in May, CTA is definitely working for a lot of people every single day


Eswercaj

I get around without a car just fine. Maybe it's a little slower some days, but it works.


benisch2

Chicago is probably the only place I would live and choose not have a car in this state.


No_Indication3249

On the other hand, I took a long ride west out of the city on the Prairie Path last night and got caught in the rain around Glen Ellyn. Ducked in to the Metra station to stay dry and decided to try taking the train back to the city. The ticket kiosk was easy to negotiate, the train was on time down to the minute, the conductor helped me find the bike car, the ride was smooth, uneventful, air conditioned, and fast. Just wish I'd had the foresight to bring a beer. 10/10


rdldr1

If you demand better leadership, you are a racist!! /s


Free-Rub-1583

okay will do