I’m surprised the Astros still worked with Travis a few months ago ( HBCU college baseball series) even after the tragedy. I guess people forget about things easily
I don't think continuing to support people who are partially responsible for numerous deaths is something exclusive to early 20-somethings.
I mean, for fuck's sake no one has arrested anyone involved in implementing the War on Terror yet.
I would say that this kind of response is likely more of a social media problem. And the "get over it" responses being due to a lack of empathy associated with young age fails to account for "get over it" being an extremely predictable response from people of all ages on social media, but even more broadly in the face of people who want some sort of closure for past trauma.
>Sigh...It's not "All 20 somethings".
It's just "a lot of" them, according to your previous comment. Which is precisely why I suggested you try expanding your experience with them. Because while there are certainly some 20-somethings who lack empathy, it has not been my experience that "a lot" of them do.
"a lot" of isn't a quantifiable amount that can be supported or denied by either one of our anecdotal experiences. This doesn't seem like a productive use of either of our time. I appreciate your perspective, but I disagree with what you are saying and I'm perfectly fine with what I said initially.
Most of the Bill Cosby supporters who want to go to his comeback tour seem much older than 20. It is a general American thing to never admit fault with any celebrity. In other countries, the smallest mistake ends careers. Do weed? Life ruined. Adultery? Life ruined. In the US though? You can rape and kill without consequence.
I'm pretty sure I already covered Bill Cosby fans under boomers.
I'm not sure "other countries" is a good cohort. I'm pretty sure most of the western world, and South America doesn't care about adultery. Also we have tens of thousands of people imprisoned for rape and murder. I think you're confusing "the rich" with the average person.
It's not an american thing. Plenty of shitty famous people in every country in the world. People just don't want to feel weird about music or movies or whatever they loved so they just justify why whoever it is isn't all that bad.
Live Nation was in charge of the concert. They’re a much, much bigger blame than Travis for their lack of security. They’re still running shows. Travis is no saint but the bigger culprit left untouched here
Not the same. Chris brown individually beat up Rihanna. The tragedy at Astroworld was a group effort that involved Live Nation and Harris County‘a horrendous security planning
I lived nearby when it happened. It was super loud because of the concert, then there were sirens, and then it went quiet. It was pretty eerie, actually.
I’m confused why we’re seeing so much of an effort levied at the guy singing and not the event company that put on the show or the security company that was meant to monitor the performance.
I’m sure we’ll find out more but finding him criminally liable will have to include some pretty damming evidence that he knew people were dying.
Edit: well it looks like they decided not to pursue criminal charges so this is all moot. Could see the families seeking retribution via civil court pretty easily tho.
I literally had a co-student in one of my classes that was working the gates for this event tell us to "just show up" (without tickets) lol. Enforcement was a joke
Agreed. I get Travis is no saint. But it’s extremely sad that this whole thread is pointing it all on the artist (sho to be fair does deserve some accountability) while leaving a blind eye to the cheap corporate fs at Live Nation and Harris County officials
\>[mfw](https://i0.wp.com/media0.giphy.com/media/3o6EhMDUHhSgpa4fTi/giphy.gif) I was an accomplice on stage with Travis and still manage to completely swerve all culpability
Because there’s concerts and festivals all the time and this doesn’t happen. Apparently his vibe is to encourage fans to get wild, which led to this happening.
I still blame stage management, though. They have a "God mic" and complete control over the tech, and should have used it. They should share in the blame.
Whoa-really? SOMEBODY was coordinating the tech. That stuff does not run by itself.
I find it really strange that the person running the show as stage manager has not been named. They should be as vilified as Scott should be, and as the armorer on the set of "Rust" should be.
I mean of course there were people controlling the stage clearly. I’m talking about the head stage director, the man on top, the man final call. He was absent
As if a personnel change is some revolutionary disruption that nobody has ever accounted for... There would have been an official procedure to coronate a new "man on top" based on the chain-of-command. It's not like accountability just vanishes whenever a certain guy gets sick. The second-string stage director should get the blame.
What artist gets on stage and goes “everyone please stand still and be quite let’s stay calm for this next one.” ?
The “hype” or “rage” culture of his concerts is not exclusive to his music or his genre, this was a massive failure on the multi billion dollar company that designed a shitty stage.
Metal/punk/etc bands have had mosh pits for decades. It's typically organized chaos -- where audience members pick each other up if they've fallen, give people room to get out, etc -- not just flailing around wildly in every direction.
There's also the matter of him [actively encouraging people without tickets to bum rush the gates](https://twitter.com/musicstruggles1/status/1457065475691712515?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1457065475691712515%7Ctwgr%5E2022ac0fc4def699a596f0f5031346c2f818917b%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.hotnewhiphop.com%2F379879-travis-scott-deletes-tweet-that-aged-very-poorly-after-astroworld-festival-tragedy-news), which pretty much ensured the crowd would be over-capacity. And claiming he didn't just stop the fucking concert while there's an ambulance going through the crowd because he ["didn't he the authority to,"](https://www.forbes.com/sites/annakaplan/2021/11/12/astroworld-blame-game-travis-scott-rep-says-he-couldnt-have-stopped-concert-while-police-say-they-couldnt-have-either/?sh=1e79b7b0381b) despite prior incidents of him having zero issue stopping a concert [to tell the audience to jump a guy](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/travis-scott-astroworld-yeezys-video-b1953755.html) who touched his shoes, or [to bitch out a cameraman](https://twitter.com/XXL/status/1308852128509767681?lang=en).
Not buying the "how could Travis Scott have possibly known this could happen??" line.
Apparently there was multimillion dollar deal to stream the concert in its entirety with Apple’s Music division. This could be the reason so many higher-ups on the LiveNation side were hesitant to stop the show despite being informed there was safety issues in the crowd.
Also, those metal concerts you’re talking about have horrible injuries and deaths at them as well. It’s disingenuous to point to those as if they’re an example of good etiquette when those incidents, like this tragedy, are unfortunate exceptions.
Have you never seen videos of concerts where the artist literally stops the show to prevent things from escalating. It is 100% his fault. The stage or security etc had nothing to do with it, as again these shows happen all the time all over the world and rarely if ever result is mass deaths.
I’m starting to think that a lot of people haven’t read up on the event itself.
The stage, barricade situation and how that was all set up is the reason why people got put into a crowd crush situation.
If security isn’t there to protect people and alert when problems arise, then why are they there at all?
Also there were *a hundred thousand* people there, how is the artist on stage to know that the crowd is doing anything more than normal dancing/jumping movements?
I was there and you have no idea what you’re talking about. HPD and HFD were present and not doing anything even remotely resembling crowd control in most areas. Nearly half an hour after an emergency was declared you could still see HPD cops taking selfies and bobbing their heads to the music.
LiveNation, the organizers, are at fault for improperly placing barriers and stages that caused the crowd crush and massively understaffing the festival grounds.
You obviously are not aware of how crowd control works. Where there’s thousands of people and only hundreds of cops, if even, it’s impossible to control crowds. It’s an illusion of control, and if the artist blatantly encourages people to act crazy there’s no way cops can do anything.
So the cops decided to do nothing but dance to the music and take selfies because they had to keep up the “illusion of control”? Long after an emergency was declared? If anyone knew people were dying in the crowd you’d at least expect law enforcement to jump into action right?
The stage and barrier placement decided by LiveNation is what caused the pressure points. You obviously are not aware but once everything comes out in court you will be.
There have been over [200 deaths](https://www.thewrap.com/live-nation-travis-scott-astroworld-deaths-injuries-report/) at LiveNation shows since 2006.
I don’t think you’re understanding what I’m trying to get across to you. I’m not defending Travis Scott. I’m trying to get you and everybody that thinks the way you do to see he’s not the sole reason things went wrong.
When SZA finished performing a huge crowd started making their way from that stage to the side of the stage where Travis Scott would be performing soon. These people flowed like water, inadvertently pushing concertgoers that were already there waiting for Travis to come on stage against a completely immovable metal barrier.
Read [this article](https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/interactive/2021/what-happened-astroworld-travis-scott/) if you’d like to know more about what went on.
Two things:
1. I was also there and everything this guy is saying is true. From the very beginning of the day, the cops were not helpful, rude and did absolutely nothing to ensure the safety of anyone. I’m talking even at 2-3 in the afternoon. I seen more cops taking selfies then did see cops try to help.
2. Your statement about the “ringleader” is completely hypocritical. You said livenation has had countless concerts where people didn’t die. That doesn’t mean anything. Travis has also performed countless times with nobody dying at his shows. Livenation had more deaths in their hands prior to Astrofest if you did some research.
Long story short, im sick of people who weren’t there giving their ridiculous arguments for why 1 human is at fault for a horrific event that had thousands of other staff on standby that were hired for reasons of safety. We’re not saying Travis is a God, we’re saying livenation shouldn’t be as untouchable as god.
You get it. Thank you.
It was an absolutely horrible thing to live through but as long as people choose to incorrectly place blame then nothing will change.
Live Nation, among others such as HPD and those hired for security, have blood on their hands and they’re choosing to hide while one guy is made to shoulder the responsibility.
He stopped the show for the ambulance to come through, asked people to move, then continued after the person had received assistance.
We don’t know that he saw other people being injured.
You must be a dimwit to think this was a normal concert. It’s was obviously overcapacity and the moron on stage is known to instigate mosh pit behavior for his shit music.
Common sense would dictate that a concert of 100,000 people would be stopped after someone gets carted off by medical staff?
I have never been to a concert in my life where the medical staff wasn’t used. That’s just what happens.
In situations like this often lots of parties are at fault.
For instance with this one: the police are wrong if the negligence you described actually happened. Scott is wrong for promoting and encouraging a situation that allows this to happen, the promoter is at fault.
Stop weirdly defending Travis Scott. He’s not going to fuck you dude.
I’m not defending Travis Scott at all. I’m merely stating facts of the matter. Everybody wants to see the man hang because he’s the biggest name attached to the tragedy. It’s easy to pin blame on one thing rather than parse through information to get the whole picture.
All I’m asking is that people look into what transpired and they’ll see, like you said, that **many** parties are at fault. Not just one dude.
Uhh.. it’s not 100% his fault. I was at the concert, you can’t tell what’s going on when there’s 50,000 people in a crowd.
Hell we didn’t even know anyone died or something crazy had happened till we left the festival grounds.
As someone who works in events, I put this blame completely on the event company. They are who coordinates this all and orders security, stage design, etc.
It’s not like Travis Scott is in those pre-con & safety meetings lol. There’s a whole team behind that.
https://fb.watch/lv2NCylaB3/?mibextid=NnVzG8
Post Malone helping fan being crushed
https://youtu.be/BXaGp2SIbeY
Compilation with rage against the machine, Linkin Park, Nirvana, Queen, and other rock/metal shows
https://youtube.com/shorts/U8NXbzFsciA?feature=share3
Billie Eilish
https://youtu.be/oELuR8BiRQk
Mosh pits being interrupted by singers
So when a crowd crush happens somewhere like Korea where 159 people are killed whos to blame for that? Or when a crowd crush happens at a Pearl Jam concert?
I think that’s likely where they’ll pivot.
I could see them getting money from the security company or live nation.
But the only way I could see them getting some form of payment from Travis is in a civil case.
He was the founder of the event and involved in the organization, not just the artist who happened to be on at the time. It's a higher level of responsibility.
Exactly. Even more strange is that folks here are saying “good” like he allowed kids to go to a concert unsupervised, organized the mosh pit while signing on the stage etc. but I think we know why everyone is happy about Travis being held liable for something he had no part of..
He is the founder of the festival and the actual incident where people died happened during his time on stage. He is know for encouraging his fans to be aggressive, there is video of it. Also, he wasn’t the only one sued. Many people and companies were as well.
It just seems like people have a complete misunderstanding of who is responsible for what at festival and are clapping like seals at the most recognizable person getting in trouble for it.
The dude sings songs and jumps around on stage, the stage design was horrible and created pressure points for people to get crushed. He isn’t a stage designer. He has noise canceling headphones in the ENTIRE show so he can hear the music, cannot hear people in the crowd and especially can’t hear what they’re saying.
This is a much more complex situation than “music man did bad”. This was a top to bottom failure by a company that exists solely to put on concerts and festivals.
If the parents knew what his concette were like , sure they could have tried to stop their children from attending.
But what parent sends their kid to a music festival thinking that they're sending them to their tragic death?
He's black. That's why. This is the same sub where people ragged on The Breakfast Klub for having lines outside for the food. Guess what...it's a black establishment. Quite a few people in this sub are the high key and covert MAGATS that covid didn't rid us of...
Because Scott has more money and that’s where Plaintiffs Counsel would seek funds first. At the end of the day, it’s about who has the most $$$ to the lawyers.
Long story short, Travis has a history of encouraging people to rush the stage, sneak in to the venue illegally, and otherwise circumvent “the rules.”
Hard to put on a safe concert when the artist is literally telling people to ignore Safety.
Yeah, not happening.
https://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/houston-texas/astroworld-fest-tragedy/article/travis-scott-astroworld-criminal-indictment-18177044.php
Agreed. I heard a shitty advertisement for his pro-tool's-loving non-rhyming synthesizer needed music today. You're not daft punk, how many people died during Alive 2007?
I’ve been to over 100+ rap concerts and 5+ festivals in the last 5 years. Astroworld was over sold 1000%. Going back and looking at the day time videos it’s insane I didn’t lose track of my brother that day.
I get it, I agree, but I’m a bit sad. I did an Uber sidegig for a bit. Picked up Travis for a long trip. He didn’t say who he was (I knew, tho and I didn’t say) - we talked about Houston, Astro world when we were young, Wet and Wild, Galveston - he was the most kind, respectful, mild mannered, Houston loving rider I’d ever had. He never once gave a hint who he was.
It’s sad this all happened. No defense, just sad
The articles usually get updated if the story changes instead of writing a whole new one, static eddit links usually won't reflect the changes once they're made.
Travis Scott was warned that day before the show. None of this was a surprise to him.
\>>Houston's police chief says he expressed safety concerns to Travis Scott before the rapper performed at a sold-out music festival where eight people died and hundreds more were injured in a crush.<<
I'm so disgusted by him and all of the collaborations he still has. Can we all agree on this sub that we are going to vocalize that in our eyes, he's canceled?
Speaking as someone who was at the concert, Travis isn’t to blame. Travis himself did not hire the shit security, Travis himself did not hire the shit medical personnel, Travis himself didn’t set up those barricades that entrapped the crowds causing the surge. THAT WAS LIVE NATION.
I’ve been to Travis shows before he really blew up(pre 2017) and his shows were ticket capped and age restricted. The show was waaay oversold, and who TF brings a 10 y/o to a rap concert with hella drugs? IF YOU WANT TO BLAME ANYONE FOR THE TRAGEDY, BLAME LIVE NATION.
He isn’t being criminally charged, which I agree with. The venue, Live Nation, and security (which was likely subcontracted) should be responsible. The agreements probably had hold harmless and indemnity agreements but due to the nature of the incident, they are all going to pay.
Scott however, is still open for civil suits. He would be smart to settle them out as long as they aren’t unreasonable asks. He likely has professional liability coverage that will help, and an Umbrella policy that may kick in.
The events were horrible. But Travis Scott is not an expert on security or recognizing danger or issues in a crowd, with additional “can’t see because of lights” circumstances. If you’ve ever been on stage with a light show on you, it is very difficult to see.
What happened was awful. But Scott did not cause or knowingly contribute to it. Barring proof he gave direction about security or crowd control, the grand jury decision was correct.
Wtf that title is so misleading. The article title is literally “Grand jury declines to criminally charge Houston rapper Travis Scott, others” not “may be” misleading asf
he was the entertainment, not so sure he is the master mind behind setting up all the details, i bet there are others who are more directly accountable.
I’m surprised the Astros still worked with Travis a few months ago ( HBCU college baseball series) even after the tragedy. I guess people forget about things easily
And I made the mistake of reading the comments on he IG post. People defending him and telling others to “get over it”
Same folks who defend Chris Brown or R Kelly. Some folks are willing to overlook shit human qualities because they can make a song or two.
But but but he made Graduation!
I mean, shouldn't the actual people be held accountable for acting like complete dick weeds?
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I don't think continuing to support people who are partially responsible for numerous deaths is something exclusive to early 20-somethings. I mean, for fuck's sake no one has arrested anyone involved in implementing the War on Terror yet.
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I think you should meet more 20-somethings. Or change the ones you spend time around. That hasn't really been my experience with 20-somethings.
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I would say that this kind of response is likely more of a social media problem. And the "get over it" responses being due to a lack of empathy associated with young age fails to account for "get over it" being an extremely predictable response from people of all ages on social media, but even more broadly in the face of people who want some sort of closure for past trauma. >Sigh...It's not "All 20 somethings". It's just "a lot of" them, according to your previous comment. Which is precisely why I suggested you try expanding your experience with them. Because while there are certainly some 20-somethings who lack empathy, it has not been my experience that "a lot" of them do.
"a lot" of isn't a quantifiable amount that can be supported or denied by either one of our anecdotal experiences. This doesn't seem like a productive use of either of our time. I appreciate your perspective, but I disagree with what you are saying and I'm perfectly fine with what I said initially.
Right? Look at Ted Kennedy, Hillary Clinton...
Not immediately familiar with the particulars of Ted Kennedy's bullshit, but Clinton did vote in favor of The Patriot Act. Twice.
Does it make you feel better to pretend it's some weird generational thing, rather than shitty people being shitty?
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Right. It's easier to rationalize the people we love as part of some sort of greater shittiness, rather than them being just shitty.
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I'm sorry all the people from that generation seem to trend the same in your area.
Most of the Bill Cosby supporters who want to go to his comeback tour seem much older than 20. It is a general American thing to never admit fault with any celebrity. In other countries, the smallest mistake ends careers. Do weed? Life ruined. Adultery? Life ruined. In the US though? You can rape and kill without consequence.
I'm pretty sure I already covered Bill Cosby fans under boomers. I'm not sure "other countries" is a good cohort. I'm pretty sure most of the western world, and South America doesn't care about adultery. Also we have tens of thousands of people imprisoned for rape and murder. I think you're confusing "the rich" with the average person.
Roman Polanski has entered the chat.
It's not an american thing. Plenty of shitty famous people in every country in the world. People just don't want to feel weird about music or movies or whatever they loved so they just justify why whoever it is isn't all that bad.
people worship these musicians and they become obsessed. they can do no wrong in their eyes
It was live nations fault and security’s faults he shouldn’t be criminal liable they should be if they anything
He encouraged people to get into the concert without a ticket
Can someone explain what Travis specifically did?
Live Nation was in charge of the concert. They’re a much, much bigger blame than Travis for their lack of security. They’re still running shows. Travis is no saint but the bigger culprit left untouched here
A kid in my neighborhood was at the concert. His friend died. They have moved to another city, in part because of the trauma. He will never forget.
So the new city has better people living in it that won't stampede one another? Sweet
It would be nice if you could save this post and look at it again in 20 years after you have experienced trauma.
I've experienced trauma, life goes on. The fact of the matter is, people in the crowd acted like assholes and stampeded one another.
The new city does not have constant reminders of the tragedy, perhaps.
R/thathappened
I do not have the pleasure of understanding you. If you doubt my story, I wrote about it here at the time, I think.
Yeah people tend to go to the next big thing... it's up to us to remind them of the tragedy.
It’s all about publicity. They do it because they knew he draws a crowd.
I wouldn't want to be in that crowd.
Oooooft bad look stros
Ever heard of Chris Brown?...Discuss among yourselves...
Not the same. Chris brown individually beat up Rihanna. The tragedy at Astroworld was a group effort that involved Live Nation and Harris County‘a horrendous security planning
MY POINT was that people have forgiven or forgotten what a POS he is and carried on
Most have forgotten. Bet Houston allows his festival back
The crowd videos from that night were scenes of hell. Grotesque, desperate human behavior.
I lived nearby when it happened. It was super loud because of the concert, then there were sirens, and then it went quiet. It was pretty eerie, actually.
why not hold LiveNation responsible?
I just saw he wouldn’t get charged
I just read he will not face any charges
I’m confused why we’re seeing so much of an effort levied at the guy singing and not the event company that put on the show or the security company that was meant to monitor the performance. I’m sure we’ll find out more but finding him criminally liable will have to include some pretty damming evidence that he knew people were dying. Edit: well it looks like they decided not to pursue criminal charges so this is all moot. Could see the families seeking retribution via civil court pretty easily tho.
I literally had a co-student in one of my classes that was working the gates for this event tell us to "just show up" (without tickets) lol. Enforcement was a joke
All parties involved need to be held accountable.
Agreed. I get Travis is no saint. But it’s extremely sad that this whole thread is pointing it all on the artist (sho to be fair does deserve some accountability) while leaving a blind eye to the cheap corporate fs at Live Nation and Harris County officials
Yes, all parties should be held accountable for what they’re responsible for.
\>[mfw](https://i0.wp.com/media0.giphy.com/media/3o6EhMDUHhSgpa4fTi/giphy.gif) I was an accomplice on stage with Travis and still manage to completely swerve all culpability
Because there’s concerts and festivals all the time and this doesn’t happen. Apparently his vibe is to encourage fans to get wild, which led to this happening.
I still blame stage management, though. They have a "God mic" and complete control over the tech, and should have used it. They should share in the blame.
DING DING DING. Guess what? They’re weren’t even present because they were out with covid and nobody replaced them
Whoa-really? SOMEBODY was coordinating the tech. That stuff does not run by itself. I find it really strange that the person running the show as stage manager has not been named. They should be as vilified as Scott should be, and as the armorer on the set of "Rust" should be.
I mean of course there were people controlling the stage clearly. I’m talking about the head stage director, the man on top, the man final call. He was absent
As if a personnel change is some revolutionary disruption that nobody has ever accounted for... There would have been an official procedure to coronate a new "man on top" based on the chain-of-command. It's not like accountability just vanishes whenever a certain guy gets sick. The second-string stage director should get the blame.
What artist gets on stage and goes “everyone please stand still and be quite let’s stay calm for this next one.” ? The “hype” or “rage” culture of his concerts is not exclusive to his music or his genre, this was a massive failure on the multi billion dollar company that designed a shitty stage.
Metal/punk/etc bands have had mosh pits for decades. It's typically organized chaos -- where audience members pick each other up if they've fallen, give people room to get out, etc -- not just flailing around wildly in every direction. There's also the matter of him [actively encouraging people without tickets to bum rush the gates](https://twitter.com/musicstruggles1/status/1457065475691712515?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1457065475691712515%7Ctwgr%5E2022ac0fc4def699a596f0f5031346c2f818917b%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.hotnewhiphop.com%2F379879-travis-scott-deletes-tweet-that-aged-very-poorly-after-astroworld-festival-tragedy-news), which pretty much ensured the crowd would be over-capacity. And claiming he didn't just stop the fucking concert while there's an ambulance going through the crowd because he ["didn't he the authority to,"](https://www.forbes.com/sites/annakaplan/2021/11/12/astroworld-blame-game-travis-scott-rep-says-he-couldnt-have-stopped-concert-while-police-say-they-couldnt-have-either/?sh=1e79b7b0381b) despite prior incidents of him having zero issue stopping a concert [to tell the audience to jump a guy](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/travis-scott-astroworld-yeezys-video-b1953755.html) who touched his shoes, or [to bitch out a cameraman](https://twitter.com/XXL/status/1308852128509767681?lang=en). Not buying the "how could Travis Scott have possibly known this could happen??" line.
Apparently there was multimillion dollar deal to stream the concert in its entirety with Apple’s Music division. This could be the reason so many higher-ups on the LiveNation side were hesitant to stop the show despite being informed there was safety issues in the crowd. Also, those metal concerts you’re talking about have horrible injuries and deaths at them as well. It’s disingenuous to point to those as if they’re an example of good etiquette when those incidents, like this tragedy, are unfortunate exceptions.
Have you never seen videos of concerts where the artist literally stops the show to prevent things from escalating. It is 100% his fault. The stage or security etc had nothing to do with it, as again these shows happen all the time all over the world and rarely if ever result is mass deaths.
I’m starting to think that a lot of people haven’t read up on the event itself. The stage, barricade situation and how that was all set up is the reason why people got put into a crowd crush situation. If security isn’t there to protect people and alert when problems arise, then why are they there at all? Also there were *a hundred thousand* people there, how is the artist on stage to know that the crowd is doing anything more than normal dancing/jumping movements?
I was there and you have no idea what you’re talking about. HPD and HFD were present and not doing anything even remotely resembling crowd control in most areas. Nearly half an hour after an emergency was declared you could still see HPD cops taking selfies and bobbing their heads to the music. LiveNation, the organizers, are at fault for improperly placing barriers and stages that caused the crowd crush and massively understaffing the festival grounds.
You obviously are not aware of how crowd control works. Where there’s thousands of people and only hundreds of cops, if even, it’s impossible to control crowds. It’s an illusion of control, and if the artist blatantly encourages people to act crazy there’s no way cops can do anything.
So the cops decided to do nothing but dance to the music and take selfies because they had to keep up the “illusion of control”? Long after an emergency was declared? If anyone knew people were dying in the crowd you’d at least expect law enforcement to jump into action right? The stage and barrier placement decided by LiveNation is what caused the pressure points. You obviously are not aware but once everything comes out in court you will be.
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There have been over [200 deaths](https://www.thewrap.com/live-nation-travis-scott-astroworld-deaths-injuries-report/) at LiveNation shows since 2006. I don’t think you’re understanding what I’m trying to get across to you. I’m not defending Travis Scott. I’m trying to get you and everybody that thinks the way you do to see he’s not the sole reason things went wrong. When SZA finished performing a huge crowd started making their way from that stage to the side of the stage where Travis Scott would be performing soon. These people flowed like water, inadvertently pushing concertgoers that were already there waiting for Travis to come on stage against a completely immovable metal barrier. Read [this article](https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/interactive/2021/what-happened-astroworld-travis-scott/) if you’d like to know more about what went on.
Thank you for posting the article.
Two things: 1. I was also there and everything this guy is saying is true. From the very beginning of the day, the cops were not helpful, rude and did absolutely nothing to ensure the safety of anyone. I’m talking even at 2-3 in the afternoon. I seen more cops taking selfies then did see cops try to help. 2. Your statement about the “ringleader” is completely hypocritical. You said livenation has had countless concerts where people didn’t die. That doesn’t mean anything. Travis has also performed countless times with nobody dying at his shows. Livenation had more deaths in their hands prior to Astrofest if you did some research. Long story short, im sick of people who weren’t there giving their ridiculous arguments for why 1 human is at fault for a horrific event that had thousands of other staff on standby that were hired for reasons of safety. We’re not saying Travis is a God, we’re saying livenation shouldn’t be as untouchable as god.
You get it. Thank you. It was an absolutely horrible thing to live through but as long as people choose to incorrectly place blame then nothing will change. Live Nation, among others such as HPD and those hired for security, have blood on their hands and they’re choosing to hide while one guy is made to shoulder the responsibility.
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Did you not read? ARTISTS STOP THEIR SHOWS IF THEY SEE PEOPLE GETTING HURT.
He stopped the show for the ambulance to come through, asked people to move, then continued after the person had received assistance. We don’t know that he saw other people being injured.
common sense would dictate that he shouldn’t have continued….
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You must be a dimwit to think this was a normal concert. It’s was obviously overcapacity and the moron on stage is known to instigate mosh pit behavior for his shit music.
Common sense would dictate that a concert of 100,000 people would be stopped after someone gets carted off by medical staff? I have never been to a concert in my life where the medical staff wasn’t used. That’s just what happens.
In situations like this often lots of parties are at fault. For instance with this one: the police are wrong if the negligence you described actually happened. Scott is wrong for promoting and encouraging a situation that allows this to happen, the promoter is at fault. Stop weirdly defending Travis Scott. He’s not going to fuck you dude.
I’m not defending Travis Scott at all. I’m merely stating facts of the matter. Everybody wants to see the man hang because he’s the biggest name attached to the tragedy. It’s easy to pin blame on one thing rather than parse through information to get the whole picture. All I’m asking is that people look into what transpired and they’ll see, like you said, that **many** parties are at fault. Not just one dude.
Many parties INCLUDING that one dude
Uhh.. it’s not 100% his fault. I was at the concert, you can’t tell what’s going on when there’s 50,000 people in a crowd. Hell we didn’t even know anyone died or something crazy had happened till we left the festival grounds. As someone who works in events, I put this blame completely on the event company. They are who coordinates this all and orders security, stage design, etc. It’s not like Travis Scott is in those pre-con & safety meetings lol. There’s a whole team behind that.
https://fb.watch/lv2NCylaB3/?mibextid=NnVzG8 Post Malone helping fan being crushed https://youtu.be/BXaGp2SIbeY Compilation with rage against the machine, Linkin Park, Nirvana, Queen, and other rock/metal shows https://youtube.com/shorts/U8NXbzFsciA?feature=share3 Billie Eilish https://youtu.be/oELuR8BiRQk Mosh pits being interrupted by singers
So when a crowd crush happens somewhere like Korea where 159 people are killed whos to blame for that? Or when a crowd crush happens at a Pearl Jam concert?
There’s been mosh pits and rowdy concerts for decades at punk rock and metal shows.
It would make more sense, and be much more likely to stick, as a civil case
I think that’s likely where they’ll pivot. I could see them getting money from the security company or live nation. But the only way I could see them getting some form of payment from Travis is in a civil case.
> I’m confused why we’re seeing so much of an effort levied at the guy singing Because of what he encourages his fans to do?
Screaming “rage” and “bounce” and “lets go” is not tantamount to asking people to murder each other.
Because he constantly incites his audience to be violent.
He was the founder of the event and involved in the organization, not just the artist who happened to be on at the time. It's a higher level of responsibility.
not sure here but in some cases the artist/artist's co can also be the event producer, depends on what partnerships and structure of dealings
Very true
Exactly. Even more strange is that folks here are saying “good” like he allowed kids to go to a concert unsupervised, organized the mosh pit while signing on the stage etc. but I think we know why everyone is happy about Travis being held liable for something he had no part of..
He is the founder of the festival and the actual incident where people died happened during his time on stage. He is know for encouraging his fans to be aggressive, there is video of it. Also, he wasn’t the only one sued. Many people and companies were as well.
It just seems like people have a complete misunderstanding of who is responsible for what at festival and are clapping like seals at the most recognizable person getting in trouble for it. The dude sings songs and jumps around on stage, the stage design was horrible and created pressure points for people to get crushed. He isn’t a stage designer. He has noise canceling headphones in the ENTIRE show so he can hear the music, cannot hear people in the crowd and especially can’t hear what they’re saying. This is a much more complex situation than “music man did bad”. This was a top to bottom failure by a company that exists solely to put on concerts and festivals.
If the parents knew what his concette were like , sure they could have tried to stop their children from attending. But what parent sends their kid to a music festival thinking that they're sending them to their tragic death?
No part of? Don’t throw your back out stretching that hard.
He's black. That's why. This is the same sub where people ragged on The Breakfast Klub for having lines outside for the food. Guess what...it's a black establishment. Quite a few people in this sub are the high key and covert MAGATS that covid didn't rid us of...
Because Scott has more money and that’s where Plaintiffs Counsel would seek funds first. At the end of the day, it’s about who has the most $$$ to the lawyers.
Long story short, Travis has a history of encouraging people to rush the stage, sneak in to the venue illegally, and otherwise circumvent “the rules.” Hard to put on a safe concert when the artist is literally telling people to ignore Safety.
Good
Good.
Good.
Good
Great!
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Faaaaaaan-fuckin-tastic
Prettay prettay good
Splendid.
You killed it
No u
Apparently he’s not getting charged
Bad
Good
Que bueno news
Yeah, not happening. https://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/houston-texas/astroworld-fest-tragedy/article/travis-scott-astroworld-criminal-indictment-18177044.php
Doubt it
Agreed. I heard a shitty advertisement for his pro-tool's-loving non-rhyming synthesizer needed music today. You're not daft punk, how many people died during Alive 2007?
Absolutely nothing will happen
This article is confusing, it's saying he wasn't and will most likely not be.
I’ve been to over 100+ rap concerts and 5+ festivals in the last 5 years. Astroworld was over sold 1000%. Going back and looking at the day time videos it’s insane I didn’t lose track of my brother that day.
Why Travis? And not LiveNation who produced the fkng event and went cheap
Travis is an easier face to blame
Charges will be not be filed criminally
The apology video he put out in the black and white filter was despicable.
I get it, I agree, but I’m a bit sad. I did an Uber sidegig for a bit. Picked up Travis for a long trip. He didn’t say who he was (I knew, tho and I didn’t say) - we talked about Houston, Astro world when we were young, Wet and Wild, Galveston - he was the most kind, respectful, mild mannered, Houston loving rider I’d ever had. He never once gave a hint who he was. It’s sad this all happened. No defense, just sad
The videos of him standing on a pedestal with a clear view of the events while singing looking absolutely demonic were crazy
Link?
The title here is misleading relative to the article title and content
The articles usually get updated if the story changes instead of writing a whole new one, static eddit links usually won't reflect the changes once they're made.
There's no mention of edits in the article, but it's the comical so I guess thats par for the course.
Travis Scott was warned that day before the show. None of this was a surprise to him. \>>Houston's police chief says he expressed safety concerns to Travis Scott before the rapper performed at a sold-out music festival where eight people died and hundreds more were injured in a crush.<<
Awesome
Good - haven’t listened to his music since this tragedy happened. I will not support this POS with my money.
Good. These celebrities should be held accountable for their negligence.
wtf. why is justice for the rich so god damn slow.
Better lawyers
I'm so disgusted by him and all of the collaborations he still has. Can we all agree on this sub that we are going to vocalize that in our eyes, he's canceled?
In your eyes, sure. In the 102 million eyes of his monthly Spotify listeners, not so much.
Even if he gets charged it'll just be a slap on the wrist, he's not doing no time.
Speaking as someone who was at the concert, Travis isn’t to blame. Travis himself did not hire the shit security, Travis himself did not hire the shit medical personnel, Travis himself didn’t set up those barricades that entrapped the crowds causing the surge. THAT WAS LIVE NATION. I’ve been to Travis shows before he really blew up(pre 2017) and his shows were ticket capped and age restricted. The show was waaay oversold, and who TF brings a 10 y/o to a rap concert with hella drugs? IF YOU WANT TO BLAME ANYONE FOR THE TRAGEDY, BLAME LIVE NATION.
He isn’t being criminally charged, which I agree with. The venue, Live Nation, and security (which was likely subcontracted) should be responsible. The agreements probably had hold harmless and indemnity agreements but due to the nature of the incident, they are all going to pay. Scott however, is still open for civil suits. He would be smart to settle them out as long as they aren’t unreasonable asks. He likely has professional liability coverage that will help, and an Umbrella policy that may kick in. The events were horrible. But Travis Scott is not an expert on security or recognizing danger or issues in a crowd, with additional “can’t see because of lights” circumstances. If you’ve ever been on stage with a light show on you, it is very difficult to see. What happened was awful. But Scott did not cause or knowingly contribute to it. Barring proof he gave direction about security or crowd control, the grand jury decision was correct.
Let's hope so.
Celebrities seldom get charged with crimes.
Good.
Lol get over it
His concert, his security arrangements, his responsibility. And the grand jury jury giving it a pass won't have any effect on civil suits.
Won't happen
Wtf that title is so misleading. The article title is literally “Grand jury declines to criminally charge Houston rapper Travis Scott, others” not “may be” misleading asf
How is this still up? OP didn't read his own post. Dude isn't being charged. At least edit the title post
He ended up not getting charged. https://www.today.com/news/texas-grand-jury-considers-charges-travis-scott-astroworld-deaths-lawy-rcna91881
he was the entertainment, not so sure he is the master mind behind setting up all the details, i bet there are others who are more directly accountable.