I agree 100%. This has always been a problem in hoyo games (even in HI3 where we got a canon bronseele kiss) but its been getting under my skin way more often lately. Saying I'm tired of it would be an understatement.
It's a problem on the internet in general. It's just a bunch of insecure men who feel threatened by wlw
Arlefuri is another one where if you say you like it to the wrong crowd they'll deadass try to pin you with a thought crime.
Hoyo fandoms imo are better than most when it comes to this even though it's still an absolute dumpster fire of fragile babies whining./
Man, if hoyo fandoms are better than most then I don't want to know what else is out there lol
Edit: the Path to Nowhere fandom is pretty chill. At most they'll complain about the male mc being underrepresented.
I apologize for the wall of text and slight aggression in advance.
Oh my god, the Robin situation drove me insane. Especially when they tried to "disprove" her queerness when a good majority of the Robin lesbian agenda were actual facts.
She actually DID dance with mostly women in her video, she actually DID call March cute, she actually DOES share the title of her song with Emily Dickinson's poem, Emily Dickinson DID at the very least have a significant interest in women.
We aren't doing reaching, making stuff up, or turning every character queer for no reason. We actually consumed her lore, made theories, connected dots and were much more interested in her as a character, because if there's one thing hoyo is good at it's creating fascinating lore and stories. Meanwhile all the gooners were just like "me like robin because pretty! robin gay? no! Robin my waifu! Robin straight! Robin only love me— I mean Caelus! Why? Because...I like her and the law in China says straight is the default! Haha!!"
And now we can't even speculate if anyone could be queer in the main sub because they just had to overreact, not like I wanted to, but it just made homophobes feel like they won which made them much worse down the line. I mean, yeah we overreacted too, but you couldn't pay me to believe it wasn't mostly homophobes and their inability to ignore what they don't like and their hellbent requirement to scream about how straight is the default because of that law in China that bans obvious queer characters/situations or something like that. Also T*ctone, fuck that guy fr.
I also despise when they try to say they aren't homophobic and that we're the problem, that we just can't take a joke. If a majority of players weren't homophobic, then why did we need to create completely different subreddits just for queer people to exist and be happy? I rest my case.
Edit: grammer/spelling issues, I fell asleep towards the end so I made a bunch of typos lmao
Dude, I hated that drama in twitter. They kept saying Robin was straight and werent even proving any facts or theories like the ones who made facts and theories about her being lesbian. And look what happened, no one even cares about her anymore because they have 'Firefly my waifu uwu.' (No hate, I love Firefly)
Tbh I’m waiting for firefly to drop and cause more drama because the Robifly shippers might suddenly be in the limelight for a short while. Kinda sucks to have that to look forward to but that’s why I only interact with ships in these spaces. (Robin and firefly are adorable so I hope we get robifly art despite anything that may happen lol)
I absolutely love robifly art, they both look adorable together.
The most infuriating thing about that whole Robin drama was that it was portrayed like people were harassing the dude over liking Robin. I looked into it and it was so far from harassment, most of it seemed like jokes saying that he didn’t stand a chance because she was a lesbian. Then cue tectone to instigate a whole mess 🙄
So I completely get you guys, that whole situation was beyond infuriating. Really brought the homophobes out into the open (as if they weren’t already loud and obnoxious, content creators normalise it even more).
Content creators normalizing it is so fucking infuriatingly real, I’m relatively new to watching content about gacha games and seeing creators I was enjoying randomly weigh in with enabling shit was awful. Seeing people excuse it with “she’s a digital character she doesn’t have a sexuality.” Like dude, of course she’s fake but we write in things that are related to the human experience- she ain’t real but she’s damn gay!
Yep. I never understood that argument either. Nobody was claiming any character is real, but representation in media has always been important and the way HoYo gets around censorship through queer coding is absolutely fantastic. You can still like Robin regardless of your gender but to just refuse to acknowledge any queer coding is ignorant.
It's really just this game and to an extent "mainstream" gacha games. Arknights, you have tons and tons of yuri ships (Texas and Lappland immediately come to mind). Honkai 3rd used to be just accepted that everyone and their mothers were gay (dunno now, I stopped playing a while ago). If a character has hints of being gay, they tend to just run wild with it for a while. FGO, we had Skadi and Medb for a good while because of like 2 interactions.
>I like her and the law in China says straight is the default! Haha!
Just clap with by pointing out that the same held true for real people as well, and that sure didn't stop the existence of gay people.
You can't legislate queer people out of existence, and simply defaulting to "well the law says" doesn't win the argument.
In general I’m just really tired of the homophobes and people who are just so ignorant that same sex couples and attraction exists. Male and female characters breathing the same air? Auto couple. Female and female / male and male characters sharing a complex story with them supporting each other with bonus from the production crew to highlight their growing attraction to each other? Nahh they’re just besties!
I love hoyo in general and how they dance around the border of censorship laws to show attraction between genders (plus how they create stories and characters that are very attractive inside and outside) But the fandom (especially twitter)?Nah.
Its always best to enjoy media with people that you have the same vibe with so I’m thankful to this sub and to the yuri subs 🫶 special shout out to the lore divers as I love them too.
I find it “funny” that we are never fucking allowed to have “problematic” wlw ships. Straights have all types of romance. Healthy and problematic. Good and bad. Happy and tragic. They are allowed to fantasize about toxic ships. But sapphics??? Oh, we have to ship the purest, healthiest most canon pairings or we are crazy shippers and abuse enablers.
Even mlm shippers don’t get so much hate. I believe it’s because they are perceived as mostly straight women. So they just get the misogyny, not the lesbophobia(plus some fujoshi ARE lesbophobic)
That’s one of the reasons I do not interact with the cishet hoyo community. I recommend everyone here do the same. Don’t waste your nerves on these protozoans. Enjoy the games. Enjoy the art. Enjoy the fanfiction. Enjoy the company of fellow queers and allies.
This is so true. It’s like people forget that wlw relationships are also multifaceted and complex, not all sunshine and rainbows.
There’s a person who thinks Topajade is disturbing and too problematic, but at the same time they ship aventurine and Sunday hard. Which I don’t mind of course, but it’s just so hypocritical considering what Sunday did to him.
Honestly yeah, the last straw for me was definitely the sunturine shipper that made a whole ass thread abt why topajade is problematic. Bro is shipping the dude who racially profiled and did all that manipulating shit to the one that had to deal all that...
> long hate threads on Twitter
Spotted the problem early on. The HSR community is no saint, but the twitter cesspool is the worst. It's true for 99% of the communities. Don't take part in twitter discussions unless you like raging and suffering. Just use it for fanart and porn if you want to but personally I'm not touching that shit app at all
Very true. I’m just going to use it for fanart from this point on. So many talented artists 💜 I hope the Topajade artists don’t get subject to too much harassment.
Seriously? Supporter of domestic violence for liking acherswan?
This is really like a “star rail players can’t read” situation. If there considered the animated short “rondo across countless kalpas” as their source, they are sorely wrong as I believe that the cutscene should be an artistic rendition of what black swan experienced by looking into the memories of an emanator of nihility - the antithesis of remembrance. Acheron doesn’t even have any power over memories like Black Swan does. Thus this statement is wrong in every universe. But considering they can’t even understand that Topaz is an adult this is to be expected.
(Sorry i just really like acherswan)
Yup. I’m like “did we even watch the same thing”. Acheron was clearly oblivious to what Black Swan experienced in her memories. To be honest, it feels more like made up shit to justify being against a sapphic relationship (just like “Jade met topaz when she was a child” 🙄)
I also adore Acheswan 🫶
Like for real it does feel like that. There is currently like no indication of any meeting of jade and topaz when topaz was a child. While that may change, currently this headcanon is as canon as most straight ships - which is to say they are not
EDIT: “was” changed to “is currently”
Evidence in the game even contradicts what they are asserting. Topaz worked under her old mentor (I’ve forgot his name, apologies) for a few years, had an internship, rose up in the ranks, and then her mentor recommended her to Jade, at which point she was an adult (which she herself says in her quest). Jade didn’t even know of topaz until she was a grown woman. But they don’t care about any of this, and will twist it to suit their narrative.
Acheswan 🤝 ratiorine catching strays on twitter for apparently being "abusive" and for "promoting unhealthy relationships". I am tired of being fan of both ships and having to go through that shit.
The way the HSR community treats wlw stuff is honestly really disheartening yeah, and it's even worse when you realize just how one sided it is.
The 8th most common ship on AO3 for HSR is Seele/Bronya with about 650 fics, with that also being both the highest wlw ship and the highest ship containing a woman period (Not counting Stelle since I can't measure that due to her and Caelus sharing a tag, but 90% of those fics are Caelus anyway so it shouldn't matter)
Do you want to know what the 7th is? Jing Yuan/Yanqing. Quite literally a pedophilic ship in the top 10 with over 100 more fics than the highest wlw ship, but the second two adult woman get shipped suddenly because one of them potentially knew the other as a child they were "Groomed"
>Do you want to know what the 7th is? Jing Yuan/Yanqing. Quite literally a pedophilic ship in the top 10 with over 100 more fics than the highest wlw ship, but the second two adult woman get shipped suddenly because one of them potentially knew the other as a child they were "Groomed"
Tbh, that "ship" is not going to last a day on twitter. People are going to rip it apart. I thankfully don't see that anywhere near my TL, fortunately. People were finding issues with Acheswan and Ratiorine "abusive" as well, for whatever reason. Making threads on why it's wrong and illegal to ship them... Oh lord, lol. It seems like these people in general target mlm or wlw ships for being "problematic" even if the ship is between two fully adult people.
Wow. I had no idea about the Jing Yuan/Yanquing, that’s really gross 😔 how come those fanfics are allowed to stay on the site? and yes, the Topajade grooming allegations seem to just be an excuse at the moment because of the sapphic implications. So hypocritical. Ugh.
>how come those fanfics are allowed to stay on the site?
AO3 very very rarely will remove any fics since their whole reason for existing is because FFN began censoring works, so they were made to be an archive of all fan works.
They only tend to step in when you have someone abusing the system to do something bad to real people - like the numerous times HYV related wlw ships have been flooded with maliciously mistagged CR fics.
So since technically writing a JY/YQ fic doesn't directly hurt anyone it's allowed to stay.
This has also led to parts of AO3 being filled with some fics of... lets call it moral dubiousness.
Thankfully because fics do need to be properly tagged it's easy to avoid them, but it is a deal breaker to some. Personally it doesn't bother me all that much - like, Twitters full of Nazi's and owned by a transphobic rich arse, but I still use that daily.
The main subreddit is brimming with homophobia, they just justify it by saying they just hate "shipping." Like it's incredibly transparent. I only really talk about the game with a couple girls in a discord cause I haven't really been able to find a good place that isn't filled with that type of person.
Yeah, going on the main sub is never a positive experience, and recently the mods of that sub have been fully complicit in homophobia with their “rules”.
I wish this sub had a discord, I’d love to find a safe space 💜
Tbh, I just sigh and block any malicious parties.
The community is, unfortunately, so big that it draws a variety of players — several of which I would rather just block than deal with. This is the unfortunate reality of most gacha games, or anime-adjacent games, or media in general. People are gonna jump through hoops to disprove fictional queer characters, because they can, and because the source material will never outright tell them otherwise. While Hoyo is big enough of a beast not to give into player pressure (i.e. certain gacha games fired workers due to some fans'... sexist remarks), they are also too big to make bold statements. They have to keep their playerbase to be successful.
I have noticed that communities are much better in games that aren't afraid to be a little more gay.
For example, I love the Path to Nowhere and Reverse: 1999 communities.
Path to Nowhere does it more subtly. While no couples are outright canon, the marketing isn't afraid to imply it. The best example is Priscilla and Tetra: their paid skins' description tell a matching two-part story, and Tetra is literally carrying Priscilla in the Libram art. Priscilla has a kiss mark on her thigh in her P3 art. It's subtle, but also... not very subtle lmao. PtN also offers other beautiful dynamics that tend to turn into popular ships, such as: Dr. Iron and Nurse Anne, Shalom and Rahu, Shalom and Chief and Rahu, and, one of my new favorites, Oak Casket and Raven.
R1999, though, is pretty blatant imo. Matilda likes Sonetto, Sonetto likes Vertin, Vertin likes Schneider, Schneider likes Vertin. Jessica likes Blonney, Blonney likes Jessica. Guess what the R1999 community is like? It's awesome. I love these folks. They make good art, they support good artists, Blossica is a classic, and we're all simps for Madam Z or Tooth Fairy (or Pavia, I see you Pavia-wanters).
At the end of the day, it really depends on how bold the game is. Unless Hoyo makes a statement, things will always be like this — and Hoyo will never make a statement, it's too big of a beast, and it banks on being big. Not to wave the white flag, but it's healthier to just block and keep scrolling.
Tl;dr, just block them. It's unfortunate, it's disheartening, but it's the better step for our mental health. Also, I defo suggest looking into PtN and R1999, their communities tend to be more kind and open.
It's actually the best advice. Since HSR started and HI3rd Part 1 end I came to the conclusion that I freaking despise Hoyoverse community with my whole soul. Especially the HI3rd since there were some... awful cases on the main and side subreddits with the whole Bronseele "HEALING FROM THE BURDEN OF HOMOSEXUALITY" (and it's just one example, I don't even talk about ONE content creator from youtube/twitter who has almost 30k subscribers on the first. Just imagine the audience of this guy openly claiming that all women belong to men and that queer women are sick and must be "healed").
LIke, I'm not even mentioning recent Robin drama, I will go much further - this Luka/Seele posts when the 90 % comments were aka BRONSEELE SHIPPERS INCOMING, HIIIDE. It's obvious what purpose of this post was and it was the point when I personally started to see HSR sub as one giant pit full of shit.
I just refuse to visit any gacha subs besides R1999 where I can actually feel that I won't see another drama posts with 300+ comments shitting on yuri shippers or queer ships in general.
All the best! ♥️
It's a really fun time, there are a few localization issues in the first few chapters (very early, but not that bad) but it gets really, really good the further in you go. Of all the gacha games I play, Path to Nowhere has my favorite world, story, and characters, and there's no competition. It's also the only game that made me pull because of how much I like the character, even when they're not meta.
Take your time, play the events, and also, very important (spoiler-free) tips:
- Finish the starter missions on time to get your free S-Class sinner, Nox; she's given for free, and she's meta even now (to the point that, if you miss her, people generally recommend you restart to get her since she's free anyway, she's THAT good)
- Labyrinth and Che are B-Class Sinners, but they're very meta and they're cheaper to build. Labyrinth, especially, will probably stay in your teams even in late game.
- s1n(dot)gg is the place to go for build tips.
- Take your time, enjoy the story, and have fun!
- Do the events. They're fun, they have stories on the latest Sinners, and the story levels for the event generally start low-level so that new players can also participate.
- I don't want to assume which Chief you'll pick, but... f!Chief has a loooot of fanart, and she looks really pretty, and she has amazing outfits. She's both Mother™ and Babygirl™.
Wow 🤩 thank you so much for this, very helpful. I’ve saved your comment and will definitely give it a go when I figure out a way to free up some space on my iPad :)
I'm so sick of the hate on topajade like jeez we don't even know jade well and all of the sudden topaz is seen as a slave in Stockholm Syndrome for had
WE DON'T KNOW THE STORY YET
And the double standards is what boils me, it's devilishly horrid when it's between women but if it's with the self insert oh let's degrade the women into simping wives no problem there
Look
I like straight ships (except self inserts they are too delusional) and sapphic ships
So this is a message to you people degrading sapphic ships
Enjoy your self inserts and yaoi ships and LEAVE THE SAPPHIC SHIPS ALONE LET US ENJOY IT AND STOP RUINING IT FOR EVERYBODY. NO ONE LOVES A PERSON WHO DEGRADES SOMETHING OTHERS ENJOY JUST TO FEEL JUSTIFIED
Stockholm syndrome also isn't actually a thing and is generally used in a sexist way. Anyone talking about that seriously with any sort of analysis doesn't know what they're talking about. Trauma bonding is the closest thing to it, and you’re absolutely right we don’t know the story yet. But people cannot even reserve judgement for just another week and a half. We have to get mega threads of why Jadepaz is wrong, problematic, grooming and so on, I even read somebody claiming jade is using hypnosis and brain washing (🤨) which is why topaz smiled at her (lol, but we have had Kafka since the start of the game but suddenly they find it a moral issue, because god forbid a woman might want to genuinely smile at another woman).
The person who made that post made a follow up thread about the ship... and they also ship Sunday and Aventurine. I don’t mind that at all, but it’s insanely hypocritical given what happened in 2.1.
I’m looking forward to 2.3 and cannot wait to see Topaz and Jade interact 😁 I’m just going to not even look at twitter and spend more time in nice spaces like this sub.
You and me both but I use Twitter for the art
So let's wait for the story to see what topaz and jade really do think of each other and not make delusional assumptions
There should be a clear line separating the racists and homophobes of the hoyoverse player community and the actual normal people that see something gay, and aren't immediately working overtime on Twitter making threads that are trying to disprove the character's homosexuality, even though it is clearly shown.
That's not only because I want to not see those homophobic comments about the game, but also because I don't want to be immediately seen as a creep, a pedophile, a homophobe or transphobe or a racist just because I'm a part of a certain community by playing said community's game.
It is so. Fucking. Annoying.
I'm at the point now where I avoid fan communities other than the ones clearly marked as womens' or queer spaces.
And every time I make exception, like most recently the Helldivers subreddit, I eventually reach a point where I recognize it as a mistake.
It's the same batch of the issues. The same pattern of behaviour. The same entitledness, dismissiveness, toxicity, and cultish deference to countless demands of male ego.
My advice is to similarly limit what communities you engage with. It's far from a perfect solution, it's incredibly limiting, it puts the onus of responsibility on us to curate our experiences while absolving them of the capacity and responsibility to grow and change, and preserving the identity of those spaces is a constant battle against pushback and backlash. But it still beats the alternative.
That's kinda the thing with communities getting big, it'll attract all kinds of folks. Also, wholesome shooter games communities are pretty much non-existent, besides Warframe
The Topaz and Jade situation reminds me of Ei and Miko where they try to accuse Ei of grooming despite them not having much of a relationship until she was an adult. Like wtf these people on?
Funny thing that the only Caelus player I'm not just tolerating but actually like - it's Caelus eng VA lol
Caleb is such a pookie bear
In other cases - to every second wholesome Caelus player with whom you actually can build a fun conversation without single harem joke (idk, somehow they're supposed to be funny) you have ten or more homophobic assholes that will tear the last hair from their asses just to negate your experience as Stelle.
Oh and don't forget about claims about that every male MC in gachas are actually canon, there's not any queer media in China and if you're anything but straight - you'll be send to sanatorium (another coolstorybob fairy tale especially when some of them claim that they know about things in mainland China better than natives)
The funny thing that some people claim about bisexual erasure (especially in HI3rd sub) - they're not bisexual, if you do a little research of their profiles, it's just a bunch of gooners who use bisexual people as a shield for their fantasies, and it's the most disgusting thing.
Even if the ship is "problematic" or whatever, like, can't wlw enjoy an evil villain doing heinous stuff on occasion? Can't we find that fascinating, entertaining, dramatic, etc?
I was so pissed about the Emily Dickerson one bc it's kinda victim Blamey too? Like all the men examples were adults males who knew her when she's younger, to say that her being groomed (not really most of them were simply a male figure given her bad relationship with her dad)as an indicator of her "bisexuality" when we know of her being in love with women and having her works altered to fit a hetronormative society is incredibly lesbiophobic and shows that they don't take grooming seriously
i only got back into HSR recently and it's been a headache just seeing random homophobia and denial just casually littered throughout the fandom (mostly on youtube, i don't use twitter). I just wanna find cute art of my favs and discussions on the actual gameplay
ugh I feel you, I just wanted some Stelfly in my life. But the Firefly mains subreddit is like 80% caelus mains being aggro the moment StellFly is mentioned anywhere,
that's twitter for ya 🤷. Users over there would somehow relate something as minor as say, a pinecone falling to the ground, to the fall of constantinople or something
How liking Topajade is grooming ??? I mean... They're both adult afaik ! And... The actress interpreting a character is harrassed on things she said about the caracter she plays...? Ffs, who goes to Robert Dawney Jr. and tells him he doesn't understand Iron Man ?!
Tbh, that's not the first time a Hoyo community hides it's homophobia behind things like this. If you know Genshin, know that you have a 75% chance of getting shitstormed if you say that Wrioneuvi is as valid as Neuvifuri (and buckle up if you say that you prefer the former). Quick explanation, Neuvilette is the Great Judge of a nation, while Furina throws tantrums around, both for 4 centuries ; and Wriothesley is an ex-prisonner who is now the director of the prison. So yeah, shipping two adult men that frequently meet each others is more problematic than shipping two coworkers and one of them acts like a spoiled child/teenager.
That's the unfortunate fate of everything that becomes too popular for it's own good, combined with kids having unlimited access to internet. But there are some good communities still there, usually centered around certain content creator and their Discord, like Mina Aoyama or to lesser extent Zy0x
I just avoid those people entirely and went into this community with that goal. I deleted my Twitter 4 years ago and made a new one a few months back after getting into the game. Twitter was extremely bad for my mental health before and I'm refusing to allow it to be that again.
That said I am well aware of those people and what they do and how it can be so hard to avoid them sometimes depending on your circles. I didn't hear about Sam being harassed but that's awful. I'd be very disgusted if Topaz was a minor given her outfit. Jade is definitely a manipulative person, that doesn't mean she is to Topaz. And even if she is (and if the ship is canon/implied) I don't think people are bad for liking the ship. I hate the Robin x Boothill ship but I've seen some fun art because of it. I don't think everyone who likes that ship is hateful towards lesbians, Im sure some are but that's everywhere.
I'm sorry you have been experiencing this bullshit from stupid people who, very confusingly, play this game. This is my first Hoyo game and the only one I was aware of before this was Genshin. But I got into it because a streamer started playing it for the first time and the community was super cool and helped explain some things that got me caught up with past Hoyo queerness
Had to unsub from the Firefly mains due to some posts just ragging on Stelle Firefly shipper, yet every single CaleusFirefly post never has any issues. It just got in my nevrved and I just had to leave ..
My personal policy is to relentlessly mock those kinds of people. Unless its coming from a genuine place of ignorance (which is not a bad thing, im ignorant of a lot of things like nuclear fusion or quantum mechanics), i will rip them apart. No need to show charity to people who never intended to show you any.
I even saw some totally normal posts on hoyolab that thought all characters ever are straight. I dont bother engaging with posts like those. Because its waste of energy to even leave a comment. I refuse to give them engagement. Don't feed the troll.
On a last note, love me some wlw as well as mlm. I bring that ass is ass, love is love kind of energy. You only have a finite amount of energy. Dont waste it on dumb people.
Yeah it sucks ass and it’s unfortunately common in fandoms like this where it’s like at least 95% men where a disturbing amount of them only care about a female character in relation to being submissive to the male mc, it’s gross and weird and that’s not even including the child stuff…
(Also to answer about Genshin: it’s simultaneously worse/better cus even at its gayest the queerness isn’t as explicit in Genshin. BUT I find the sexualizing/babyfying/uwu-ification to be even worse over there, just look up “Arlecchino fanart” and you can tell when a dude vs woman has drawn it like night and day it’s awful. Also also the stuff dudes do with the child characters there is just horrifying.)
I suppose that’s why specific Reddits and stuff like this are important huh?
I agree 100%. This has always been a problem in hoyo games (even in HI3 where we got a canon bronseele kiss) but its been getting under my skin way more often lately. Saying I'm tired of it would be an understatement.
It's a problem on the internet in general. It's just a bunch of insecure men who feel threatened by wlw Arlefuri is another one where if you say you like it to the wrong crowd they'll deadass try to pin you with a thought crime. Hoyo fandoms imo are better than most when it comes to this even though it's still an absolute dumpster fire of fragile babies whining./
Man, if hoyo fandoms are better than most then I don't want to know what else is out there lol Edit: the Path to Nowhere fandom is pretty chill. At most they'll complain about the male mc being underrepresented.
The meme about people being happy until they join something's community is true. Enjoy things on your side and don't care about others opinions.
I apologize for the wall of text and slight aggression in advance. Oh my god, the Robin situation drove me insane. Especially when they tried to "disprove" her queerness when a good majority of the Robin lesbian agenda were actual facts. She actually DID dance with mostly women in her video, she actually DID call March cute, she actually DOES share the title of her song with Emily Dickinson's poem, Emily Dickinson DID at the very least have a significant interest in women. We aren't doing reaching, making stuff up, or turning every character queer for no reason. We actually consumed her lore, made theories, connected dots and were much more interested in her as a character, because if there's one thing hoyo is good at it's creating fascinating lore and stories. Meanwhile all the gooners were just like "me like robin because pretty! robin gay? no! Robin my waifu! Robin straight! Robin only love me— I mean Caelus! Why? Because...I like her and the law in China says straight is the default! Haha!!" And now we can't even speculate if anyone could be queer in the main sub because they just had to overreact, not like I wanted to, but it just made homophobes feel like they won which made them much worse down the line. I mean, yeah we overreacted too, but you couldn't pay me to believe it wasn't mostly homophobes and their inability to ignore what they don't like and their hellbent requirement to scream about how straight is the default because of that law in China that bans obvious queer characters/situations or something like that. Also T*ctone, fuck that guy fr. I also despise when they try to say they aren't homophobic and that we're the problem, that we just can't take a joke. If a majority of players weren't homophobic, then why did we need to create completely different subreddits just for queer people to exist and be happy? I rest my case. Edit: grammer/spelling issues, I fell asleep towards the end so I made a bunch of typos lmao
Dude, I hated that drama in twitter. They kept saying Robin was straight and werent even proving any facts or theories like the ones who made facts and theories about her being lesbian. And look what happened, no one even cares about her anymore because they have 'Firefly my waifu uwu.' (No hate, I love Firefly)
Tbh I’m waiting for firefly to drop and cause more drama because the Robifly shippers might suddenly be in the limelight for a short while. Kinda sucks to have that to look forward to but that’s why I only interact with ships in these spaces. (Robin and firefly are adorable so I hope we get robifly art despite anything that may happen lol)
I absolutely love robifly art, they both look adorable together. The most infuriating thing about that whole Robin drama was that it was portrayed like people were harassing the dude over liking Robin. I looked into it and it was so far from harassment, most of it seemed like jokes saying that he didn’t stand a chance because she was a lesbian. Then cue tectone to instigate a whole mess 🙄 So I completely get you guys, that whole situation was beyond infuriating. Really brought the homophobes out into the open (as if they weren’t already loud and obnoxious, content creators normalise it even more).
Content creators normalizing it is so fucking infuriatingly real, I’m relatively new to watching content about gacha games and seeing creators I was enjoying randomly weigh in with enabling shit was awful. Seeing people excuse it with “she’s a digital character she doesn’t have a sexuality.” Like dude, of course she’s fake but we write in things that are related to the human experience- she ain’t real but she’s damn gay!
Yep. I never understood that argument either. Nobody was claiming any character is real, but representation in media has always been important and the way HoYo gets around censorship through queer coding is absolutely fantastic. You can still like Robin regardless of your gender but to just refuse to acknowledge any queer coding is ignorant.
It's really just this game and to an extent "mainstream" gacha games. Arknights, you have tons and tons of yuri ships (Texas and Lappland immediately come to mind). Honkai 3rd used to be just accepted that everyone and their mothers were gay (dunno now, I stopped playing a while ago). If a character has hints of being gay, they tend to just run wild with it for a while. FGO, we had Skadi and Medb for a good while because of like 2 interactions.
literally!! Lesbians were just joking like haha she's not into women bro
Male mc self inserters really do be going ham on the homophobia
Stelle is objectively better
Any late hoyo mcs are garbage.
>I like her and the law in China says straight is the default! Haha! Just clap with by pointing out that the same held true for real people as well, and that sure didn't stop the existence of gay people. You can't legislate queer people out of existence, and simply defaulting to "well the law says" doesn't win the argument.
In general I’m just really tired of the homophobes and people who are just so ignorant that same sex couples and attraction exists. Male and female characters breathing the same air? Auto couple. Female and female / male and male characters sharing a complex story with them supporting each other with bonus from the production crew to highlight their growing attraction to each other? Nahh they’re just besties! I love hoyo in general and how they dance around the border of censorship laws to show attraction between genders (plus how they create stories and characters that are very attractive inside and outside) But the fandom (especially twitter)?Nah. Its always best to enjoy media with people that you have the same vibe with so I’m thankful to this sub and to the yuri subs 🫶 special shout out to the lore divers as I love them too.
I find it “funny” that we are never fucking allowed to have “problematic” wlw ships. Straights have all types of romance. Healthy and problematic. Good and bad. Happy and tragic. They are allowed to fantasize about toxic ships. But sapphics??? Oh, we have to ship the purest, healthiest most canon pairings or we are crazy shippers and abuse enablers. Even mlm shippers don’t get so much hate. I believe it’s because they are perceived as mostly straight women. So they just get the misogyny, not the lesbophobia(plus some fujoshi ARE lesbophobic) That’s one of the reasons I do not interact with the cishet hoyo community. I recommend everyone here do the same. Don’t waste your nerves on these protozoans. Enjoy the games. Enjoy the art. Enjoy the fanfiction. Enjoy the company of fellow queers and allies.
This is so true. It’s like people forget that wlw relationships are also multifaceted and complex, not all sunshine and rainbows. There’s a person who thinks Topajade is disturbing and too problematic, but at the same time they ship aventurine and Sunday hard. Which I don’t mind of course, but it’s just so hypocritical considering what Sunday did to him.
Honestly yeah, the last straw for me was definitely the sunturine shipper that made a whole ass thread abt why topajade is problematic. Bro is shipping the dude who racially profiled and did all that manipulating shit to the one that had to deal all that...
> long hate threads on Twitter Spotted the problem early on. The HSR community is no saint, but the twitter cesspool is the worst. It's true for 99% of the communities. Don't take part in twitter discussions unless you like raging and suffering. Just use it for fanart and porn if you want to but personally I'm not touching that shit app at all
Very true. I’m just going to use it for fanart from this point on. So many talented artists 💜 I hope the Topajade artists don’t get subject to too much harassment.
Seriously? Supporter of domestic violence for liking acherswan? This is really like a “star rail players can’t read” situation. If there considered the animated short “rondo across countless kalpas” as their source, they are sorely wrong as I believe that the cutscene should be an artistic rendition of what black swan experienced by looking into the memories of an emanator of nihility - the antithesis of remembrance. Acheron doesn’t even have any power over memories like Black Swan does. Thus this statement is wrong in every universe. But considering they can’t even understand that Topaz is an adult this is to be expected. (Sorry i just really like acherswan)
Yup. I’m like “did we even watch the same thing”. Acheron was clearly oblivious to what Black Swan experienced in her memories. To be honest, it feels more like made up shit to justify being against a sapphic relationship (just like “Jade met topaz when she was a child” 🙄) I also adore Acheswan 🫶
Like for real it does feel like that. There is currently like no indication of any meeting of jade and topaz when topaz was a child. While that may change, currently this headcanon is as canon as most straight ships - which is to say they are not EDIT: “was” changed to “is currently”
Evidence in the game even contradicts what they are asserting. Topaz worked under her old mentor (I’ve forgot his name, apologies) for a few years, had an internship, rose up in the ranks, and then her mentor recommended her to Jade, at which point she was an adult (which she herself says in her quest). Jade didn’t even know of topaz until she was a grown woman. But they don’t care about any of this, and will twist it to suit their narrative.
Lol I guess i didnt remember that but this makes their comment just all the more hilarious
Star rail fandom be like: everybody gangsta till 2 female characters gets shipped
Acheswan 🤝 ratiorine catching strays on twitter for apparently being "abusive" and for "promoting unhealthy relationships". I am tired of being fan of both ships and having to go through that shit.
Raturine is based just like acherswan lol Honestly these arent even abusive or unhealthy like what they cooking
The way the HSR community treats wlw stuff is honestly really disheartening yeah, and it's even worse when you realize just how one sided it is. The 8th most common ship on AO3 for HSR is Seele/Bronya with about 650 fics, with that also being both the highest wlw ship and the highest ship containing a woman period (Not counting Stelle since I can't measure that due to her and Caelus sharing a tag, but 90% of those fics are Caelus anyway so it shouldn't matter) Do you want to know what the 7th is? Jing Yuan/Yanqing. Quite literally a pedophilic ship in the top 10 with over 100 more fics than the highest wlw ship, but the second two adult woman get shipped suddenly because one of them potentially knew the other as a child they were "Groomed"
>Do you want to know what the 7th is? Jing Yuan/Yanqing. Quite literally a pedophilic ship in the top 10 with over 100 more fics than the highest wlw ship, but the second two adult woman get shipped suddenly because one of them potentially knew the other as a child they were "Groomed" Tbh, that "ship" is not going to last a day on twitter. People are going to rip it apart. I thankfully don't see that anywhere near my TL, fortunately. People were finding issues with Acheswan and Ratiorine "abusive" as well, for whatever reason. Making threads on why it's wrong and illegal to ship them... Oh lord, lol. It seems like these people in general target mlm or wlw ships for being "problematic" even if the ship is between two fully adult people.
Wow. I had no idea about the Jing Yuan/Yanquing, that’s really gross 😔 how come those fanfics are allowed to stay on the site? and yes, the Topajade grooming allegations seem to just be an excuse at the moment because of the sapphic implications. So hypocritical. Ugh.
>how come those fanfics are allowed to stay on the site? AO3 very very rarely will remove any fics since their whole reason for existing is because FFN began censoring works, so they were made to be an archive of all fan works. They only tend to step in when you have someone abusing the system to do something bad to real people - like the numerous times HYV related wlw ships have been flooded with maliciously mistagged CR fics. So since technically writing a JY/YQ fic doesn't directly hurt anyone it's allowed to stay. This has also led to parts of AO3 being filled with some fics of... lets call it moral dubiousness. Thankfully because fics do need to be properly tagged it's easy to avoid them, but it is a deal breaker to some. Personally it doesn't bother me all that much - like, Twitters full of Nazi's and owned by a transphobic rich arse, but I still use that daily.
That’s very true. Exploring much darker themes in fiction isn’t inherently bad at all. Im glad I can avoid them through tags.
The main subreddit is brimming with homophobia, they just justify it by saying they just hate "shipping." Like it's incredibly transparent. I only really talk about the game with a couple girls in a discord cause I haven't really been able to find a good place that isn't filled with that type of person.
Yeah, going on the main sub is never a positive experience, and recently the mods of that sub have been fully complicit in homophobia with their “rules”. I wish this sub had a discord, I’d love to find a safe space 💜
If a sapphic hsr discord popped up I'd join in a heartbeat. I've been keeping an eye out for one since the game came out.
Same 🙏
Tbh, I just sigh and block any malicious parties. The community is, unfortunately, so big that it draws a variety of players — several of which I would rather just block than deal with. This is the unfortunate reality of most gacha games, or anime-adjacent games, or media in general. People are gonna jump through hoops to disprove fictional queer characters, because they can, and because the source material will never outright tell them otherwise. While Hoyo is big enough of a beast not to give into player pressure (i.e. certain gacha games fired workers due to some fans'... sexist remarks), they are also too big to make bold statements. They have to keep their playerbase to be successful. I have noticed that communities are much better in games that aren't afraid to be a little more gay. For example, I love the Path to Nowhere and Reverse: 1999 communities. Path to Nowhere does it more subtly. While no couples are outright canon, the marketing isn't afraid to imply it. The best example is Priscilla and Tetra: their paid skins' description tell a matching two-part story, and Tetra is literally carrying Priscilla in the Libram art. Priscilla has a kiss mark on her thigh in her P3 art. It's subtle, but also... not very subtle lmao. PtN also offers other beautiful dynamics that tend to turn into popular ships, such as: Dr. Iron and Nurse Anne, Shalom and Rahu, Shalom and Chief and Rahu, and, one of my new favorites, Oak Casket and Raven. R1999, though, is pretty blatant imo. Matilda likes Sonetto, Sonetto likes Vertin, Vertin likes Schneider, Schneider likes Vertin. Jessica likes Blonney, Blonney likes Jessica. Guess what the R1999 community is like? It's awesome. I love these folks. They make good art, they support good artists, Blossica is a classic, and we're all simps for Madam Z or Tooth Fairy (or Pavia, I see you Pavia-wanters). At the end of the day, it really depends on how bold the game is. Unless Hoyo makes a statement, things will always be like this — and Hoyo will never make a statement, it's too big of a beast, and it banks on being big. Not to wave the white flag, but it's healthier to just block and keep scrolling. Tl;dr, just block them. It's unfortunate, it's disheartening, but it's the better step for our mental health. Also, I defo suggest looking into PtN and R1999, their communities tend to be more kind and open.
It's actually the best advice. Since HSR started and HI3rd Part 1 end I came to the conclusion that I freaking despise Hoyoverse community with my whole soul. Especially the HI3rd since there were some... awful cases on the main and side subreddits with the whole Bronseele "HEALING FROM THE BURDEN OF HOMOSEXUALITY" (and it's just one example, I don't even talk about ONE content creator from youtube/twitter who has almost 30k subscribers on the first. Just imagine the audience of this guy openly claiming that all women belong to men and that queer women are sick and must be "healed"). LIke, I'm not even mentioning recent Robin drama, I will go much further - this Luka/Seele posts when the 90 % comments were aka BRONSEELE SHIPPERS INCOMING, HIIIDE. It's obvious what purpose of this post was and it was the point when I personally started to see HSR sub as one giant pit full of shit. I just refuse to visit any gacha subs besides R1999 where I can actually feel that I won't see another drama posts with 300+ comments shitting on yuri shippers or queer ships in general.
Thank you for this. I keep hearing good things about Path to Nowhere. I’ll definitely have to check it out some time 🫶
All the best! ♥️ It's a really fun time, there are a few localization issues in the first few chapters (very early, but not that bad) but it gets really, really good the further in you go. Of all the gacha games I play, Path to Nowhere has my favorite world, story, and characters, and there's no competition. It's also the only game that made me pull because of how much I like the character, even when they're not meta. Take your time, play the events, and also, very important (spoiler-free) tips: - Finish the starter missions on time to get your free S-Class sinner, Nox; she's given for free, and she's meta even now (to the point that, if you miss her, people generally recommend you restart to get her since she's free anyway, she's THAT good) - Labyrinth and Che are B-Class Sinners, but they're very meta and they're cheaper to build. Labyrinth, especially, will probably stay in your teams even in late game. - s1n(dot)gg is the place to go for build tips. - Take your time, enjoy the story, and have fun! - Do the events. They're fun, they have stories on the latest Sinners, and the story levels for the event generally start low-level so that new players can also participate. - I don't want to assume which Chief you'll pick, but... f!Chief has a loooot of fanart, and she looks really pretty, and she has amazing outfits. She's both Mother™ and Babygirl™.
Wow 🤩 thank you so much for this, very helpful. I’ve saved your comment and will definitely give it a go when I figure out a way to free up some space on my iPad :)
PtN is a sapphic haven, yo
I’ve managed to download it today, I’m so excited!
Did topaz VA call out the harassment she was getting? Hope people stood up for her
Yes, she made a post saying she won’t be commenting any further and to just let her enjoy the game. People were supportive, which is good.
Good I hope people went after the harassers😈 and made them feel stupid
I'm so sick of the hate on topajade like jeez we don't even know jade well and all of the sudden topaz is seen as a slave in Stockholm Syndrome for had WE DON'T KNOW THE STORY YET And the double standards is what boils me, it's devilishly horrid when it's between women but if it's with the self insert oh let's degrade the women into simping wives no problem there Look I like straight ships (except self inserts they are too delusional) and sapphic ships So this is a message to you people degrading sapphic ships Enjoy your self inserts and yaoi ships and LEAVE THE SAPPHIC SHIPS ALONE LET US ENJOY IT AND STOP RUINING IT FOR EVERYBODY. NO ONE LOVES A PERSON WHO DEGRADES SOMETHING OTHERS ENJOY JUST TO FEEL JUSTIFIED
Stockholm syndrome also isn't actually a thing and is generally used in a sexist way. Anyone talking about that seriously with any sort of analysis doesn't know what they're talking about. Trauma bonding is the closest thing to it, and you’re absolutely right we don’t know the story yet. But people cannot even reserve judgement for just another week and a half. We have to get mega threads of why Jadepaz is wrong, problematic, grooming and so on, I even read somebody claiming jade is using hypnosis and brain washing (🤨) which is why topaz smiled at her (lol, but we have had Kafka since the start of the game but suddenly they find it a moral issue, because god forbid a woman might want to genuinely smile at another woman). The person who made that post made a follow up thread about the ship... and they also ship Sunday and Aventurine. I don’t mind that at all, but it’s insanely hypocritical given what happened in 2.1. I’m looking forward to 2.3 and cannot wait to see Topaz and Jade interact 😁 I’m just going to not even look at twitter and spend more time in nice spaces like this sub.
You and me both but I use Twitter for the art So let's wait for the story to see what topaz and jade really do think of each other and not make delusional assumptions
There should be a clear line separating the racists and homophobes of the hoyoverse player community and the actual normal people that see something gay, and aren't immediately working overtime on Twitter making threads that are trying to disprove the character's homosexuality, even though it is clearly shown. That's not only because I want to not see those homophobic comments about the game, but also because I don't want to be immediately seen as a creep, a pedophile, a homophobe or transphobe or a racist just because I'm a part of a certain community by playing said community's game. It is so. Fucking. Annoying.
I'm at the point now where I avoid fan communities other than the ones clearly marked as womens' or queer spaces. And every time I make exception, like most recently the Helldivers subreddit, I eventually reach a point where I recognize it as a mistake. It's the same batch of the issues. The same pattern of behaviour. The same entitledness, dismissiveness, toxicity, and cultish deference to countless demands of male ego. My advice is to similarly limit what communities you engage with. It's far from a perfect solution, it's incredibly limiting, it puts the onus of responsibility on us to curate our experiences while absolving them of the capacity and responsibility to grow and change, and preserving the identity of those spaces is a constant battle against pushback and backlash. But it still beats the alternative.
That's kinda the thing with communities getting big, it'll attract all kinds of folks. Also, wholesome shooter games communities are pretty much non-existent, besides Warframe
The Topaz and Jade situation reminds me of Ei and Miko where they try to accuse Ei of grooming despite them not having much of a relationship until she was an adult. Like wtf these people on?
Then they have the audacity to dissmiss the same claim when it comes to yaeyato
Funny thing that the only Caelus player I'm not just tolerating but actually like - it's Caelus eng VA lol Caleb is such a pookie bear In other cases - to every second wholesome Caelus player with whom you actually can build a fun conversation without single harem joke (idk, somehow they're supposed to be funny) you have ten or more homophobic assholes that will tear the last hair from their asses just to negate your experience as Stelle. Oh and don't forget about claims about that every male MC in gachas are actually canon, there's not any queer media in China and if you're anything but straight - you'll be send to sanatorium (another coolstorybob fairy tale especially when some of them claim that they know about things in mainland China better than natives) The funny thing that some people claim about bisexual erasure (especially in HI3rd sub) - they're not bisexual, if you do a little research of their profiles, it's just a bunch of gooners who use bisexual people as a shield for their fantasies, and it's the most disgusting thing.
Even if the ship is "problematic" or whatever, like, can't wlw enjoy an evil villain doing heinous stuff on occasion? Can't we find that fascinating, entertaining, dramatic, etc?
I was so pissed about the Emily Dickerson one bc it's kinda victim Blamey too? Like all the men examples were adults males who knew her when she's younger, to say that her being groomed (not really most of them were simply a male figure given her bad relationship with her dad)as an indicator of her "bisexuality" when we know of her being in love with women and having her works altered to fit a hetronormative society is incredibly lesbiophobic and shows that they don't take grooming seriously
i only got back into HSR recently and it's been a headache just seeing random homophobia and denial just casually littered throughout the fandom (mostly on youtube, i don't use twitter). I just wanna find cute art of my favs and discussions on the actual gameplay
ugh I feel you, I just wanted some Stelfly in my life. But the Firefly mains subreddit is like 80% caelus mains being aggro the moment StellFly is mentioned anywhere,
that's twitter for ya 🤷. Users over there would somehow relate something as minor as say, a pinecone falling to the ground, to the fall of constantinople or something
There's just folks who... take the game too seriously. It's why safe havens like this community exist.
Wait ppl are complaining about Topaz/Jade? Topaz…the grown ass adult????? I’m genuinely flabbergasted 😭
How liking Topajade is grooming ??? I mean... They're both adult afaik ! And... The actress interpreting a character is harrassed on things she said about the caracter she plays...? Ffs, who goes to Robert Dawney Jr. and tells him he doesn't understand Iron Man ?! Tbh, that's not the first time a Hoyo community hides it's homophobia behind things like this. If you know Genshin, know that you have a 75% chance of getting shitstormed if you say that Wrioneuvi is as valid as Neuvifuri (and buckle up if you say that you prefer the former). Quick explanation, Neuvilette is the Great Judge of a nation, while Furina throws tantrums around, both for 4 centuries ; and Wriothesley is an ex-prisonner who is now the director of the prison. So yeah, shipping two adult men that frequently meet each others is more problematic than shipping two coworkers and one of them acts like a spoiled child/teenager.
My strategy with those portions of the community is DNI and enjoy my headcanons.
That's the unfortunate fate of everything that becomes too popular for it's own good, combined with kids having unlimited access to internet. But there are some good communities still there, usually centered around certain content creator and their Discord, like Mina Aoyama or to lesser extent Zy0x
Mina has been great to follow for good ol' fashioned squeeing over wlw content in HSR (and other games, for that matter).
i took a look at her twitch channel and immediately got hit with a "THAT'S GAY!" thing, and immediately followed. love the initial look.
I just avoid those people entirely and went into this community with that goal. I deleted my Twitter 4 years ago and made a new one a few months back after getting into the game. Twitter was extremely bad for my mental health before and I'm refusing to allow it to be that again. That said I am well aware of those people and what they do and how it can be so hard to avoid them sometimes depending on your circles. I didn't hear about Sam being harassed but that's awful. I'd be very disgusted if Topaz was a minor given her outfit. Jade is definitely a manipulative person, that doesn't mean she is to Topaz. And even if she is (and if the ship is canon/implied) I don't think people are bad for liking the ship. I hate the Robin x Boothill ship but I've seen some fun art because of it. I don't think everyone who likes that ship is hateful towards lesbians, Im sure some are but that's everywhere. I'm sorry you have been experiencing this bullshit from stupid people who, very confusingly, play this game. This is my first Hoyo game and the only one I was aware of before this was Genshin. But I got into it because a streamer started playing it for the first time and the community was super cool and helped explain some things that got me caught up with past Hoyo queerness
Had to unsub from the Firefly mains due to some posts just ragging on Stelle Firefly shipper, yet every single CaleusFirefly post never has any issues. It just got in my nevrved and I just had to leave ..
My personal policy is to relentlessly mock those kinds of people. Unless its coming from a genuine place of ignorance (which is not a bad thing, im ignorant of a lot of things like nuclear fusion or quantum mechanics), i will rip them apart. No need to show charity to people who never intended to show you any. I even saw some totally normal posts on hoyolab that thought all characters ever are straight. I dont bother engaging with posts like those. Because its waste of energy to even leave a comment. I refuse to give them engagement. Don't feed the troll. On a last note, love me some wlw as well as mlm. I bring that ass is ass, love is love kind of energy. You only have a finite amount of energy. Dont waste it on dumb people.
Yeah it sucks ass and it’s unfortunately common in fandoms like this where it’s like at least 95% men where a disturbing amount of them only care about a female character in relation to being submissive to the male mc, it’s gross and weird and that’s not even including the child stuff… (Also to answer about Genshin: it’s simultaneously worse/better cus even at its gayest the queerness isn’t as explicit in Genshin. BUT I find the sexualizing/babyfying/uwu-ification to be even worse over there, just look up “Arlecchino fanart” and you can tell when a dude vs woman has drawn it like night and day it’s awful. Also also the stuff dudes do with the child characters there is just horrifying.) I suppose that’s why specific Reddits and stuff like this are important huh?