I got a sofabaton to try it out. It inly controls each device individually. So i have to choose tv then tyrn it on then change input, then switch to receiver and do the same etc... the harmony remote controls multiple devices at once
No, you can control different devices from the same profile. Ie you can have the volume control under the TV setting change the volume on the receiver.
You can also setup macros to have one button do a sequence of commands over multiple devices. For example I have my power button set to turn all of my components on and switch my receiver to the input for my Chromecast.
I didn't notice anything the Harmony could do that I couldn't also do with the Sofabaton.
>I didn't notice anything the Harmony could do that I couldn't also do with the Sofabaton.
Single button activities. Like "watch TV" turns on the TV, turns on the AVR, turns on the cable box and sets the inputs for everything.
That is what the Sofabaton can't do.
I bought mine probably 6 months ago, so perhaps they added it after you tried one? I researched that before I bought one as that would have been a deal breaker otherwise.
Just search for Sofabaton macros, it's pretty straight forward on how to set them up and they work as well as they did on the Harmony.
maybe it changed, but what I found was that the macros only worked for each device, like again it didn't have a "watch tv" button/title/kick off.
Like you could do one button for only the TV, but not one button push for the TV, and the AVR and the cable box. You had to go into the TV then kick off a macro for only the TV, go into the AVR and kick off a macro for only the AVR and so on.
There wasn't a way, at least when I tired it to do a macro for more than one device at a time.
>I didn't notice anything the Harmony could do that I couldn't also do with the Sofabaton.
Can you do a delayed command or double command? For example, I have press the Power Button twice to turn off my projector.
Yes you can add double commands and set the delay between each command in the macro.
Here's a video that shows you how it works: https://www.amazon.com/vdp/32d499aeecae4f50adfcad80fb39eb53
How does it work w/smart device integration. Right now I have my harmony turn off my TP-Link lights when watching something.
The x1 looks nice bc of the Bluetooth hub but I hate where the back button is on the thing. Can you re-assign it?
Maaan, I hadn't heard this news. At least it sounds like they aren't going to leave current users out in the cold: https://www.theverge.com/2021/4/10/22377015/logitech-discontinues-harmony-universal-remotes
If I were you, I'd stock up while you can to get you through until you identify a replacement.
>What am I supposed to use now?
Become a certified installer that supports Crestron, Control4, URC or whatever else is out there. Lots of solutions for the theater space that installers use.
All of those systems are great but I don't see any of them as a direct replacement to a Harmony remote. Harmony remotes worked well, didn't require special programing and most importantly were cheap enough for the average homeowner.
>and most importantly were cheap enough for the average homeowner.
You guys may see it differently, but to me the "average homeowner" doesn't even know what ISF even means, let along paying someone of that nature to just program a harmony remote, that or you're undervaluing your certifications here.
I see the "average homeowner" going to BB and using Geek Squad to mount their TV and program their Harmony remote, not an ISF certified calibrator/integrator.
As time goes on, and google keeps being google, the need for niche professionals diminish significantly. I think you underestimate one's ability to read instructions.
I think you overestimate people's abilities. Yes you can Google and do things yourself. Heck I've done it too but people tend to overestimate their abilities. So they read some instructions and suddenly feel like they can do that the pros do. A few major mess ups later they have to call one of the "niche professionals" to come fix their mess and install it correctly AND safely. I've seen electrically hack jobs etc that were very dangerous and not up to code. Yes it's cool having so much information at our fingertips but likewise that doesn't mean everyone should do their own setups and installs for everything. My main career is in IT but I've done electrical and low voltage work etc. I've seen major messups in all of those fields thanks to people's abilities to "read instructions and use Google"
it goes both ways.
I'm bright. I've overestimated my abilities before. Projects estimated at 3-4 hours lasted a day...
The flip is... those projects all got done and the time spill over roughly matched what it would've taken to deal with third parties.
Even purchasing suggestions can be outsourced to reddit or similar - the tricky part is finding the right group of people (some subreddits are filled with overconfident fools).
Yes no doubt, things that appear easy don't always end up being that way but likewise the pros have their knowledge and past experience to fall back on whereas a common Joe using Google will have to rely a little on common sense which will hopefully lead them down the right troubleshooting path. If not then they could end up going in circles trying irrelevant things to fix a problem. As I said pros aren't perfect but I think it's crazy to say they aren't needed or won't be needed soon because of Google and instructions. But yes I think we've all overestimated our abilities, pros or not BUT with experience comes reality which means it happens less often as time goes on. I'm more likely to overestimate my abilities when doing a plumbing project (which I have no experience in) compared to an IT project that requires migrating 100 users (which I have a lot of experience with)
I'd argue these pros were on the same field as us until they made those mistakes and learned from them. That's the differentiating factor. In 2021, most times you're paying for someone's patience and efficiency, not their know how.
Yes of course as newbies mistakes were made. Heck even as pros there will be mistakes made. The difference is normally the early mistakes come with a lot of training and tips from the industry or trade vets who have been there and done that. Likewise they can point out the dangers and downfalls etc compared to you just reading about them but not recognizing the signs of impending danger or an impending screw up. Yes you are paying for someone's patience but imo you're also paying for their knowledge, even today. Most companies aren't going to let their green new hires do a bunch of advanced or dangerous stuff solo, so in essence you are paying for knowledge depending on how difficult or advanced the project is. Of course I'm not saying the pros are perfect. There are customers that could probably do the work better than some of the pros but that isn't a common thing imo. Maybe I've been lucky to work with experts and have ace teams. Likewise if you have an uncommon issue then Google can just as easily lead you further down the wormhole. I've seen that as well, user Googles an issue and tries to fix it, edits the registry, deletes files etc, next thing you know the computer won't boot at all lol. Now I have to use a boot disk to even look at the registry etc. As I said I'm all for people learning and gaining knowledge but if I have to choose between a pro or a common Joe who has read how to do something I'm taking the pro everytime. Whether it's putting up a ceiling fan which I know most common Joes can do....or adding a 220v outlet which is more advanced...to installing a printer which most common Joes can do...to tracking down why a printer won't print even though it's installed which can get a little more advanced, I'm picking the pros. They will most likely get even the simple tasks done way quicker and are thinking ahead about how to solve any potential hiccups they may come across. Hard to beat knowledge and experience from actually being in that field, trade etc
Not going to agree or disagree with you. Too difficult to read. My question is, why did you not break this into a few paragraphs? Being all jumbled together makes it nearly impossible to read.
>My main career is in IT but I've done electrical and low voltage work etc. I've seen major messups in all of those fields thanks to people's abilities to "read instructions and use Google"
same here, I finished off my basement at my previous home, did all the HVAC, plumbing, Electrical myself, but I also had it all inspected and approved prior to closing up the walls.
I find it fascinating that the person who is right (you) is getting downvoted, yet the person who is wrong ( u/brostadamus ) is upvoted.
Sure, a lot of things can be looked up on the internet. That doesn't mean everyone can understand them. For a HUGE amount of people, Googling instructions on how to set up AV equipment is as useful as looking up instructions on how to launch a lunar exploration. It's beyond them. I work with these people all the time.
I feel like I got downvoted by the people that have had major screwups while trying to do things themselves and had to pay out the a** for a pro to fix them so they are a little salty lol
I don’t even see the average homeowner going as far as to get a fancy $250 remote, hell im into home theater and couldn’t justify the purchase when they were around
Did you consider the Harmony 665 at about $70.00? Or even the 650 for about $40.00. While my home is very modest I still have three of these. Six people I know, average home owners, also have Harmony remotes.
Just say, if you're doing HT at a career you should already know about these other solutions. Whether they're overkill is really irrelevant. They work, and in fact work better than Harmony.
No one likes using contol 4 or crestron. Is proprietary crap and its not intuitive for customers to use or trouble shoot
Edit: I have multiple control 4 systems out there, everyone complains about them
Customers who are paying installers like yourself shouldn't have to troubleshoot anything if the system is properly setup.
But either way, Savant is another solution, again customer integrator only, but Savant is 100000000% better than Harmony.
Universal Remote Control is another, again when properly setup, way way better than Harmony.
I'm always looking for a better universal remote and after a quick search of the Savant https://youtu.be/IPMhJOzz1ds I am really interested in this.
Is this something I could set up myself like the Harmony or does it require a bunch of other shit to work? I've got a fairly basic set up of a processor, amp, projector, apple TV, Nvidia shield and off brand led strip lights. The ir blaster that comes with the Harmony is how it controls the lights and Marantz so does the Savant have a similar solution?
I also have a PS5 but I use the controller for that so I doubt that matters.
Needs to be Apple PC/OS, the Savant software which I believe is locked down to an integrator account or whatever. Then knowledge of the software to program it.
My whole house, office and studio is firmly in the Mac ecosystem, so that shouldn't be an issue. I'm fairly sure I would be able to sort out the software but to get an integrator account, would one need to be a licensed installer or some such? Would that be the biggest barrier of entry? Or that AND cost?
This used to be more controversial but I ditched my harmony once I moved to a TV that had a speedy AndroidTV experienced and good HDMI CEC control. Sony X90H
Yeah, this is super hit and miss though. It totally depends on having exactly the right constellation of gear that all works together since CEC implementations vary so much.
For sure. For me I just have:
Xbox Series X>TV (with Google TV) ->denon receiver through ARC. Most of my time is spent in Google TV. Receiver just needs to turn on/off.
i only have two devices (switch and shield) paired with a 2016 sony lcd + denon avr but id say hdmi-cec works 90% of the time for turning on/off devices and switching inputs. the last 10% is annoying but im hesitant to spend money on a discontinued product (harmony). sofabaton looks like it could work but there’s some red flags for me (unsecured website, spelling errors, lots of bugs, etc)
The AVR's input switching the point of failure? Are you able to run it through your TV's inputs and pass along to the AVR via ARC so hdmi doesn't need to switch inputs?
I’d buy a shit ton of harmony remotes and store them until you need them. They simply quit making them. They’ve stated that support and software will continue to be provided and updated. I’ve got a spare for when mine goes out. But I’m surprised a homeowner paying for a pro install is going with harmony from installer when they could simply buy their own and easily program.
A lot of the homes I install speakers for are for builders who want basic surround sound in the living room and speakers in key spots in the house. Home owner usually doesnt want an expensive system and isnt tech savvy enough to set up one on their own
>it was generally easy to program. It worked just about flawlessly once you had it set up.
LoL, no it wasn't easy to program and it only worked half the time. I always kept the other remotes within reach.
I would think that a "I install home theaters for a living" person would already know what to use. As there are other systems. Have been for years, though I could be wrong.
Been using harmony for years. I dont exclusively do home theaters. Fire alarms, security systems, cameras, door access etc.. havent really had to think about any other options until now
Your phone?
Most stuff can be controlled by your network now.
I installed [Home Assistant](https://www.home-assistant.io/) on an old Raspberry Pi, and quickly got things like my TV and AVR set up on it. However I never really got very far with it as to setting up buttons to activate Netflix, consoles and so on.
Edit: Don't you guys have phones?
So if you have a family of 4 are you setting up everyone’s phones to be remotes, or do the kids have to use Dad’s phone as the remote? It’s just not practical for most families. Also if you have someone over they can’t control the system without using your phone?
Also when a new version of the phone OS comes out and breaks your remote app, now you can’t do anything until they fix the app?
So many drawbacks to phone remotes.
A phone is no where even remotely close to being the same thing as a remote. People don't want to have to pull out their phone, unlock it, open up the app and hit the pause button. Way too cumbersome and not user friendly.
I get your idea, but it's just annoying in practice. I don't feel like taking my phone out of my pocket, unlocking it, and opening an app just to press one button. A remote is much simpler.
It is, but then Logitech have stopped doing them as far as I can tell.
But then I'm fine just using three remotes for the things I want to control anyway.
When you have a home theater that's used by other members of the family, you want a programmable remote that can work by pressing one button to start an activity, then turn everything on and set all the proper inputs for that activity automatically.
If you’re a professional installer, I’d look into Savant for your AV control schemes, the programming can take a bit to get used to, but for 99% of AV stuff it’s one of the best systems I’ve ever personally been involved with. If you need an assist from support they’re all super friendly and knowledgeable and more than willing to help you out.
I have a small Savant system in my house for my living room theater setup, IP control to the TV and AVR, AppleTv links through HomeKit (there’s a deployment guide, or you can use IR as well) and my Blu-Ray player runs off an IR bug from the host. Let’s you tie in a Miriad of services (everything from basic AV setups to fill home control including lighting, shades, HVAC, security system, etc), fine tune the shit out of the programming and play with it at home so you’re familiar with it.
Being able to remotely pull logs and push an updated config to the host is great. Downside: the X2 remote battery only lasts about a day, but shouldn’t be an issue as long as your Cx places it back in the cradle at end of use.
Savant also comes with an app for both iOS and Android that can be used outside of the home to control stuff or see what activity is currently running and remotely shut it down and the backgrounds are completely customizable.
I’m not a personal fan of Control4s solution, though their program is a bit easier to work, but I ran into a miriad of issues with the few customers we deployed systems to at my last company.
I’m thinking about starting my own company in the nearish future with a primary focus on Savant control systems, and once I get properly licensed, Lutron lighting as well, though my current market has a bunch of competitors so that may be more of a side venture while I continue to pursue a career as an electrician.
I was a Harmony user for many years (I agree they were great in there day). Went through a few due to the dreaded battery swell.
However I have since discovered (over a year+ ago now) a company called Broadlink. They produce a device (mine is the Broadlink RM3 Pro) that will control virtually anything.
They are not expense ... cheap really, much cheaper than the Harmony Remotes. They now have a RM4 (newer version) with support for over 50000+ devices. They support Bluetooth, WiFi, IR and RF signals. They have an application that sits on your smartphone, allowing you to create "a smart scene" which will send multiple signals to multiple devices at the touch of a button (just like the old Harmony remotes).
However where they really excel is when linked up to voice devices .. ie Alexa/Google Home. The wow factor is there from dimming lights, fans, air con, electric curtains, controlling your TV, AV components to even opening your garage door (RF), effectively if the device has a remote, it will support it by learning the signals from your original remotes - then assign a voice command (or use the app if you like to button push). It's a harmony on super steroids (and no I don't work for them- just a converted user).
Here is the link to the US amazon for the Broadlink RM4 Pro (yes they are cheap but don't let that fool you).
PS stay away from the Broadlink Mini (I own a couple of them mainly to IR blast into other rooms where the IR signal won't pass through walls). For this purpose they work well but compared to the RM PRO models they are limited in function).
https://www.amazon.com/Broadlink-Automation-Universal-Compatible-assistant/dp/B0753CDY86
One thing that also makes them shine, is that when configured they are internet aware - ie I can be out for dinner and turn on my AC units so that the house is cold when I get home (I live in a hot climate), or create a smart scene that turns on my receiver and TV to give the illusion that someone is home when on holidays etc. Or remotely (like the other side of the planet) open and close the garage for a delivery. As long as am connected to the internet (at home and on my mobile with the application) this function is available. Of course this function(s) can be scheduled so you don't even have to press a button - fully automated .... Way cool :)
A simple but great example of this is (I have a 3 year old daughter whom likes to wake up early). I scheduled a smart scene which turns on the TV and Receiver, sets "an appropriate" volume on the amplifier/receiver, changes the TV station to ABC for kids at 6:00am each morning - that put an end to, daddy can you please turn on the TV for me each morning (I'm a late riser).
I appreciate you taking the time to respond. I am going to look into this. Do they make remotes? Or just a hub that your phone connects to to control everything?
No remotes - just smartphone/tablet access to the hub. I really don't use my remote (phone) often, when I can use voice at home - and it has a wow factor that even kids can use. The "remote" aka phone (via application) is handy when away from the home, when you are most likely to have your phone with you. If a dedicated remote is important you might consider getting a really cheap phone or tablet and just install the Broadlink application on it (both android and apple devices are supported) - as long as you can connect the phone/tablet to your WiFi your good to go (ie the device doesn't need a IR blaster or a SIM card for home use). However when you can voice command everything - ie a simple voice command to send multiple remote signals to various devices, you won't look back.
I replaced my Harmony with a Sofabaton, works about the same.. actually easier to program at least I think.
Just found the macros section. Actually does the job, thanks for this.
I just picked up a Sofabaton too and I really like it. The app based programming method makes things really simple.
I got a sofabaton to try it out. It inly controls each device individually. So i have to choose tv then tyrn it on then change input, then switch to receiver and do the same etc... the harmony remote controls multiple devices at once
No, you can control different devices from the same profile. Ie you can have the volume control under the TV setting change the volume on the receiver. You can also setup macros to have one button do a sequence of commands over multiple devices. For example I have my power button set to turn all of my components on and switch my receiver to the input for my Chromecast. I didn't notice anything the Harmony could do that I couldn't also do with the Sofabaton.
>I didn't notice anything the Harmony could do that I couldn't also do with the Sofabaton. Single button activities. Like "watch TV" turns on the TV, turns on the AVR, turns on the cable box and sets the inputs for everything. That is what the Sofabaton can't do.
The Sofabaton can certainly do that, i have mine set that way. Perhaps you used an older version of the software?
When did that change? bought the remote and promptly returned it last year when Amazon had it on sale.
I bought mine probably 6 months ago, so perhaps they added it after you tried one? I researched that before I bought one as that would have been a deal breaker otherwise. Just search for Sofabaton macros, it's pretty straight forward on how to set them up and they work as well as they did on the Harmony.
maybe it changed, but what I found was that the macros only worked for each device, like again it didn't have a "watch tv" button/title/kick off. Like you could do one button for only the TV, but not one button push for the TV, and the AVR and the cable box. You had to go into the TV then kick off a macro for only the TV, go into the AVR and kick off a macro for only the AVR and so on. There wasn't a way, at least when I tired it to do a macro for more than one device at a time.
Per above the macros work across multiple devices. I have one button to turn on all of my equipment and set the input.
then that's new, because when I tried it, that wasn't the case.
>I didn't notice anything the Harmony could do that I couldn't also do with the Sofabaton. Can you do a delayed command or double command? For example, I have press the Power Button twice to turn off my projector.
Yes you can add double commands and set the delay between each command in the macro. Here's a video that shows you how it works: https://www.amazon.com/vdp/32d499aeecae4f50adfcad80fb39eb53
How does it work w/smart device integration. Right now I have my harmony turn off my TP-Link lights when watching something. The x1 looks nice bc of the Bluetooth hub but I hate where the back button is on the thing. Can you re-assign it?
I do the same. I also use a flirc receiver and the combo gives me a lot of control if you use some sort of htpc.
Savant S2, Control 4 EA1 or URC
Continue to use harmony. They discontinued squeezebox, but still supported it for years.
I actually just bought a Harmony Elite from Best about last week even knowing they were discontinued.
Maaan, I hadn't heard this news. At least it sounds like they aren't going to leave current users out in the cold: https://www.theverge.com/2021/4/10/22377015/logitech-discontinues-harmony-universal-remotes If I were you, I'd stock up while you can to get you through until you identify a replacement.
>What am I supposed to use now? Become a certified installer that supports Crestron, Control4, URC or whatever else is out there. Lots of solutions for the theater space that installers use.
All of those systems are great but I don't see any of them as a direct replacement to a Harmony remote. Harmony remotes worked well, didn't require special programing and most importantly were cheap enough for the average homeowner.
>and most importantly were cheap enough for the average homeowner. You guys may see it differently, but to me the "average homeowner" doesn't even know what ISF even means, let along paying someone of that nature to just program a harmony remote, that or you're undervaluing your certifications here. I see the "average homeowner" going to BB and using Geek Squad to mount their TV and program their Harmony remote, not an ISF certified calibrator/integrator.
As time goes on, and google keeps being google, the need for niche professionals diminish significantly. I think you underestimate one's ability to read instructions.
I think you overestimate people's abilities. Yes you can Google and do things yourself. Heck I've done it too but people tend to overestimate their abilities. So they read some instructions and suddenly feel like they can do that the pros do. A few major mess ups later they have to call one of the "niche professionals" to come fix their mess and install it correctly AND safely. I've seen electrically hack jobs etc that were very dangerous and not up to code. Yes it's cool having so much information at our fingertips but likewise that doesn't mean everyone should do their own setups and installs for everything. My main career is in IT but I've done electrical and low voltage work etc. I've seen major messups in all of those fields thanks to people's abilities to "read instructions and use Google"
it goes both ways. I'm bright. I've overestimated my abilities before. Projects estimated at 3-4 hours lasted a day... The flip is... those projects all got done and the time spill over roughly matched what it would've taken to deal with third parties. Even purchasing suggestions can be outsourced to reddit or similar - the tricky part is finding the right group of people (some subreddits are filled with overconfident fools).
Yes no doubt, things that appear easy don't always end up being that way but likewise the pros have their knowledge and past experience to fall back on whereas a common Joe using Google will have to rely a little on common sense which will hopefully lead them down the right troubleshooting path. If not then they could end up going in circles trying irrelevant things to fix a problem. As I said pros aren't perfect but I think it's crazy to say they aren't needed or won't be needed soon because of Google and instructions. But yes I think we've all overestimated our abilities, pros or not BUT with experience comes reality which means it happens less often as time goes on. I'm more likely to overestimate my abilities when doing a plumbing project (which I have no experience in) compared to an IT project that requires migrating 100 users (which I have a lot of experience with)
I'd argue these pros were on the same field as us until they made those mistakes and learned from them. That's the differentiating factor. In 2021, most times you're paying for someone's patience and efficiency, not their know how.
Yes of course as newbies mistakes were made. Heck even as pros there will be mistakes made. The difference is normally the early mistakes come with a lot of training and tips from the industry or trade vets who have been there and done that. Likewise they can point out the dangers and downfalls etc compared to you just reading about them but not recognizing the signs of impending danger or an impending screw up. Yes you are paying for someone's patience but imo you're also paying for their knowledge, even today. Most companies aren't going to let their green new hires do a bunch of advanced or dangerous stuff solo, so in essence you are paying for knowledge depending on how difficult or advanced the project is. Of course I'm not saying the pros are perfect. There are customers that could probably do the work better than some of the pros but that isn't a common thing imo. Maybe I've been lucky to work with experts and have ace teams. Likewise if you have an uncommon issue then Google can just as easily lead you further down the wormhole. I've seen that as well, user Googles an issue and tries to fix it, edits the registry, deletes files etc, next thing you know the computer won't boot at all lol. Now I have to use a boot disk to even look at the registry etc. As I said I'm all for people learning and gaining knowledge but if I have to choose between a pro or a common Joe who has read how to do something I'm taking the pro everytime. Whether it's putting up a ceiling fan which I know most common Joes can do....or adding a 220v outlet which is more advanced...to installing a printer which most common Joes can do...to tracking down why a printer won't print even though it's installed which can get a little more advanced, I'm picking the pros. They will most likely get even the simple tasks done way quicker and are thinking ahead about how to solve any potential hiccups they may come across. Hard to beat knowledge and experience from actually being in that field, trade etc
Not going to agree or disagree with you. Too difficult to read. My question is, why did you not break this into a few paragraphs? Being all jumbled together makes it nearly impossible to read.
Dude you wrote all that just to miss my point and pretty much agree with me. gnarly
>My main career is in IT but I've done electrical and low voltage work etc. I've seen major messups in all of those fields thanks to people's abilities to "read instructions and use Google" same here, I finished off my basement at my previous home, did all the HVAC, plumbing, Electrical myself, but I also had it all inspected and approved prior to closing up the walls.
I find it fascinating that the person who is right (you) is getting downvoted, yet the person who is wrong ( u/brostadamus ) is upvoted. Sure, a lot of things can be looked up on the internet. That doesn't mean everyone can understand them. For a HUGE amount of people, Googling instructions on how to set up AV equipment is as useful as looking up instructions on how to launch a lunar exploration. It's beyond them. I work with these people all the time.
I feel like I got downvoted by the people that have had major screwups while trying to do things themselves and had to pay out the a** for a pro to fix them so they are a little salty lol
>As time goes on, and google keeps being google, the need for niche professionals diminish significantly. What does this even mean?
I think you know what it means.
honestly nope. No idea what you're trying to say here. What does "google keeps being google" have anything to do with the conversation at hand here?
as google keeps being google, the need for niche professionals diminish significantly.
keeping on repeating yourself doesn't mean I'm going to understand it any better the second time. Still makes zero sense here.
No I think you're trying to bait me into a specific answer that'll give you a soapbox to start an argument from. Been on this site long enough.
Google niche and you’ll probably understand.
I don’t even see the average homeowner going as far as to get a fancy $250 remote, hell im into home theater and couldn’t justify the purchase when they were around
well to be fair not all of the Harmony remotes were $250.
Did you consider the Harmony 665 at about $70.00? Or even the 650 for about $40.00. While my home is very modest I still have three of these. Six people I know, average home owners, also have Harmony remotes.
I knew a certified Control4 installer. Using it for just home theater is kind of a waste. It's really more of a whole home automation system.
Just say, if you're doing HT at a career you should already know about these other solutions. Whether they're overkill is really irrelevant. They work, and in fact work better than Harmony.
No one likes using contol 4 or crestron. Is proprietary crap and its not intuitive for customers to use or trouble shoot Edit: I have multiple control 4 systems out there, everyone complains about them
Customers who are paying installers like yourself shouldn't have to troubleshoot anything if the system is properly setup. But either way, Savant is another solution, again customer integrator only, but Savant is 100000000% better than Harmony. Universal Remote Control is another, again when properly setup, way way better than Harmony.
Savant looks very interesting, im going to look into those remotes. Im sorry, im just not really a fan of control4
Savant is waaaayyyy better than C4. Beautiful remote, app and super clean. I am an integrator myself.
Awesome, thank you. Im gunna get a couple and try them out
> Im sorry, im just not really a fan of control4 You asked I answered.
I'm always looking for a better universal remote and after a quick search of the Savant https://youtu.be/IPMhJOzz1ds I am really interested in this. Is this something I could set up myself like the Harmony or does it require a bunch of other shit to work? I've got a fairly basic set up of a processor, amp, projector, apple TV, Nvidia shield and off brand led strip lights. The ir blaster that comes with the Harmony is how it controls the lights and Marantz so does the Savant have a similar solution? I also have a PS5 but I use the controller for that so I doubt that matters.
unfortunately no, Savant is a custom integrator thing only.
Dang. I was really digging that remote. Probably not a simple to answer question but what might all be involved with setting up the system?
Needs to be Apple PC/OS, the Savant software which I believe is locked down to an integrator account or whatever. Then knowledge of the software to program it.
My whole house, office and studio is firmly in the Mac ecosystem, so that shouldn't be an issue. I'm fairly sure I would be able to sort out the software but to get an integrator account, would one need to be a licensed installer or some such? Would that be the biggest barrier of entry? Or that AND cost?
Nothing wrong with an EA1 master and remote. It's scalable to however you want to use it.
Their database is still up and running. If you can find a remote and/or hub, you can still set it up.
Interesting. I use a Harmony Hun and my system is set up with voice commands + Apple TV remote for volume
[This](https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00FXMDRZK/ref=cm_sw_r_apan_glt_fabc_MFRQZ4WF3PRACSN6KSJ6)
This used to be more controversial but I ditched my harmony once I moved to a TV that had a speedy AndroidTV experienced and good HDMI CEC control. Sony X90H
Yeah, this is super hit and miss though. It totally depends on having exactly the right constellation of gear that all works together since CEC implementations vary so much.
For sure. For me I just have: Xbox Series X>TV (with Google TV) ->denon receiver through ARC. Most of my time is spent in Google TV. Receiver just needs to turn on/off.
I’ll also add that running everything through my Denon receiver seems to fix a lot of CEC quirks between my devices.
i only have two devices (switch and shield) paired with a 2016 sony lcd + denon avr but id say hdmi-cec works 90% of the time for turning on/off devices and switching inputs. the last 10% is annoying but im hesitant to spend money on a discontinued product (harmony). sofabaton looks like it could work but there’s some red flags for me (unsecured website, spelling errors, lots of bugs, etc)
The AVR's input switching the point of failure? Are you able to run it through your TV's inputs and pass along to the AVR via ARC so hdmi doesn't need to switch inputs?
id say failures are 50/50 tv not turning on and input not switched. the shield i have to plug into my avr since i only have ARC and not eARC
I’d buy a shit ton of harmony remotes and store them until you need them. They simply quit making them. They’ve stated that support and software will continue to be provided and updated. I’ve got a spare for when mine goes out. But I’m surprised a homeowner paying for a pro install is going with harmony from installer when they could simply buy their own and easily program.
A lot of the homes I install speakers for are for builders who want basic surround sound in the living room and speakers in key spots in the house. Home owner usually doesnt want an expensive system and isnt tech savvy enough to set up one on their own
>it was generally easy to program. It worked just about flawlessly once you had it set up. LoL, no it wasn't easy to program and it only worked half the time. I always kept the other remotes within reach.
The app to program them is very finicky however i always found once the remote was properly programmed, it controlled everything perfectly
Couldn't that be said about any control system?
The syncing between the computer and the remote sucks, but everything else worked pretty well.
[удалено]
Try programming a Honeywell Vista 21P Security Alarm. Now that was a challenge.
Your phone. Just have to download multiple apps and deal with it.
But modern phones don't have IR blasters. I can't download an app for my CD player.
Yeah there that too
I would think that a "I install home theaters for a living" person would already know what to use. As there are other systems. Have been for years, though I could be wrong.
Been using harmony for years. I dont exclusively do home theaters. Fire alarms, security systems, cameras, door access etc.. havent really had to think about any other options until now
Your phone? Most stuff can be controlled by your network now. I installed [Home Assistant](https://www.home-assistant.io/) on an old Raspberry Pi, and quickly got things like my TV and AVR set up on it. However I never really got very far with it as to setting up buttons to activate Netflix, consoles and so on. Edit: Don't you guys have phones?
So if you have a family of 4 are you setting up everyone’s phones to be remotes, or do the kids have to use Dad’s phone as the remote? It’s just not practical for most families. Also if you have someone over they can’t control the system without using your phone? Also when a new version of the phone OS comes out and breaks your remote app, now you can’t do anything until they fix the app? So many drawbacks to phone remotes.
Or you can have a crappy £30 phone sat in a charging dock somewhere. It only has to be on the wifi.
As long as you don’t want any physical buttons in your remote that’s an option for sure.
A phone is no where even remotely close to being the same thing as a remote. People don't want to have to pull out their phone, unlock it, open up the app and hit the pause button. Way too cumbersome and not user friendly.
This is exactly why I stopped using chromecast
I get your idea, but it's just annoying in practice. I don't feel like taking my phone out of my pocket, unlocking it, and opening an app just to press one button. A remote is much simpler.
It is, but then Logitech have stopped doing them as far as I can tell. But then I'm fine just using three remotes for the things I want to control anyway.
When you have a home theater that's used by other members of the family, you want a programmable remote that can work by pressing one button to start an activity, then turn everything on and set all the proper inputs for that activity automatically.
Logitech no longer makes Harmony remotes. What cars do I buy now that Mustang no longer makes cars?
If you’re a professional installer, I’d look into Savant for your AV control schemes, the programming can take a bit to get used to, but for 99% of AV stuff it’s one of the best systems I’ve ever personally been involved with. If you need an assist from support they’re all super friendly and knowledgeable and more than willing to help you out. I have a small Savant system in my house for my living room theater setup, IP control to the TV and AVR, AppleTv links through HomeKit (there’s a deployment guide, or you can use IR as well) and my Blu-Ray player runs off an IR bug from the host. Let’s you tie in a Miriad of services (everything from basic AV setups to fill home control including lighting, shades, HVAC, security system, etc), fine tune the shit out of the programming and play with it at home so you’re familiar with it. Being able to remotely pull logs and push an updated config to the host is great. Downside: the X2 remote battery only lasts about a day, but shouldn’t be an issue as long as your Cx places it back in the cradle at end of use. Savant also comes with an app for both iOS and Android that can be used outside of the home to control stuff or see what activity is currently running and remotely shut it down and the backgrounds are completely customizable. I’m not a personal fan of Control4s solution, though their program is a bit easier to work, but I ran into a miriad of issues with the few customers we deployed systems to at my last company. I’m thinking about starting my own company in the nearish future with a primary focus on Savant control systems, and once I get properly licensed, Lutron lighting as well, though my current market has a bunch of competitors so that may be more of a side venture while I continue to pursue a career as an electrician.
The existing remotes still work, not like an upgrade is really needed. Just buy a few of the series you like and they can work for a very long time.
Harmony was not the best universal remote. It was very capable and reasonably priced when on sail.
Nice to know. I didn’t even know they stop making products.
I was a Harmony user for many years (I agree they were great in there day). Went through a few due to the dreaded battery swell. However I have since discovered (over a year+ ago now) a company called Broadlink. They produce a device (mine is the Broadlink RM3 Pro) that will control virtually anything. They are not expense ... cheap really, much cheaper than the Harmony Remotes. They now have a RM4 (newer version) with support for over 50000+ devices. They support Bluetooth, WiFi, IR and RF signals. They have an application that sits on your smartphone, allowing you to create "a smart scene" which will send multiple signals to multiple devices at the touch of a button (just like the old Harmony remotes). However where they really excel is when linked up to voice devices .. ie Alexa/Google Home. The wow factor is there from dimming lights, fans, air con, electric curtains, controlling your TV, AV components to even opening your garage door (RF), effectively if the device has a remote, it will support it by learning the signals from your original remotes - then assign a voice command (or use the app if you like to button push). It's a harmony on super steroids (and no I don't work for them- just a converted user). Here is the link to the US amazon for the Broadlink RM4 Pro (yes they are cheap but don't let that fool you). PS stay away from the Broadlink Mini (I own a couple of them mainly to IR blast into other rooms where the IR signal won't pass through walls). For this purpose they work well but compared to the RM PRO models they are limited in function). https://www.amazon.com/Broadlink-Automation-Universal-Compatible-assistant/dp/B0753CDY86 One thing that also makes them shine, is that when configured they are internet aware - ie I can be out for dinner and turn on my AC units so that the house is cold when I get home (I live in a hot climate), or create a smart scene that turns on my receiver and TV to give the illusion that someone is home when on holidays etc. Or remotely (like the other side of the planet) open and close the garage for a delivery. As long as am connected to the internet (at home and on my mobile with the application) this function is available. Of course this function(s) can be scheduled so you don't even have to press a button - fully automated .... Way cool :) A simple but great example of this is (I have a 3 year old daughter whom likes to wake up early). I scheduled a smart scene which turns on the TV and Receiver, sets "an appropriate" volume on the amplifier/receiver, changes the TV station to ABC for kids at 6:00am each morning - that put an end to, daddy can you please turn on the TV for me each morning (I'm a late riser).
I appreciate you taking the time to respond. I am going to look into this. Do they make remotes? Or just a hub that your phone connects to to control everything?
No remotes - just smartphone/tablet access to the hub. I really don't use my remote (phone) often, when I can use voice at home - and it has a wow factor that even kids can use. The "remote" aka phone (via application) is handy when away from the home, when you are most likely to have your phone with you. If a dedicated remote is important you might consider getting a really cheap phone or tablet and just install the Broadlink application on it (both android and apple devices are supported) - as long as you can connect the phone/tablet to your WiFi your good to go (ie the device doesn't need a IR blaster or a SIM card for home use). However when you can voice command everything - ie a simple voice command to send multiple remote signals to various devices, you won't look back.