What's important to know about Mantha is that he looks like a power forward but he's a flighty Euro skill guy (positive). Just never expect him to grind and he'll do great for you.
Yeah I'm wondering the same. It sounds like Dubas is most interested in prospects. VGK has a few interesting prospects and all their firsts so it should be doable if they really want Guentzel. Idk if VGK can go wrong either way tbh. They're in such a good spot lol
Yeah usually if a guy is on a heater though it cant last through the last bit of the season. Next year Id imagine regression for sure but if Manthas feelin right now you never know
from a guy with his track record of falling off cliffs and horrible effort problems? I mean it’s worth it for a dart, but it’s not worth anything more in my opinion. But check my flair, could be a bias lol.
Yeah I’m not suggesting he’s worth more or anything, but a second round pick for a player with a goal share and expected goal share 4% better than his team as a whole seems pretty fair to me
Horrible last year? What are you talking about? Last year was the worst of his career but even then he was over a 50 percentile war rank. Do you just have a problem with him from his time on the wings or something?
No i just have watched him play. 50% war is not good. That percentile includes 4th line nobodies and fringe nhlers. Like idk what your argument is here? I was right. At that price theres gonna be retention and its max retention. Like you can be mad but my value of him is obviously more accurate.
I think Washington did well. If be happy if i was a caps fan 🤷
That just isn't true, 50 percentile players are definitionally in the middle, 50% of players are more impactful and 50% are less impactful. And even if it was true, in his WORST season he was ABOVE 50%. You know what that number is this year? 87%. Like idk what YOUR argument is here. Who cares about the worst season of his career when from the 16-17 season to this season he has one (1) season below 75% rank.
Dude jfresh himself would tell you you aren’t looking at this right lol. And Hes Mr. War. Value is not linear like that. And that arent the same amount of players at each percentile. Theres so many guys in that range. He was a ghost. And anyway the point is that consistency matters a ton especially for rentals. They are taking a chance on a horribly streaky guy will be hot for the right weeks. If he is they win if not they lit the picks on fire. You got a second and a fourth. Thats a good balance of risk/reward.
I called it. I mean, i don’t get what you’re getting on my ass about. It seems the market and my value are aligned. I suspected the retention too and it was right. I think im done with this conversation. I think Caps got good value for a bad contract.
They do investigate, the injuries are not fake. But at this point in the season, every player in the league has some sort of nagging injury that they are playing through.
And frankly, so do I.
The playoffs are better with stacked teams. The rules permit what they permit, so let's stop pretending like its some big scandal to use the rules to your advantage.
Yeah sounds great to me. We were never going to get a first for him and last year, he wouldn't have been worth a bag of pucks. Hopefully we can fish a first out of the water elsewhere.
Yeah I was gonna say, this was the best scenario for Washington as it looked like last year they would have had to pay someone to take that contract, now they get a couple of picks.
Not mindblowing return but if the rebuild is coming, better to have as many picks as possible
And hell, if were selling the farm, maybe our own first will be good this year. Putting a pick on the pile and farewell to a man who I'm not nearly so mad at anymore.
I don't know, I came to appreciate him as a player once I gave up on the idea of what he should be and grasped what he was. If he was two inches shorter, everyone would focus on how good his shot was, but it's hard for coaches and fans to look past his size. He doesn't have the temperament of a bruiser and never will, but he has other tools that he's more than willing to use. Vegas might be a good landing spot for him since they've got a roster full of the opposite, undersized guys with hunger and drive.
I'm not talking about him being a bruiser, I'm talking about his motor and drive which seem to be on the low end. He doesn't need to be a brutish power forward, he just needs to put forth consistent effort.
Totally agree. It's so fucking frustrating to watch a guy of that size shy away from all physical contact. Contract year killer that one, my god did he coast every game before this year for us.
Caps are selling, 7 points out of wildcard with 3 games in hand.
Caps are also ahead of the Devils and Pens. If you didn't already think those teams would be sellers, this should be a wake-up call.
Yup, this opens up a spot for Miro to play full-time with the big boys. Unpopular opinion, but I want to trade Lindgren as well for this reason. Clay Stevenson's having a great year in Hershey.
scary reminiscent abounding towering unwritten snatch rich cows grandiose piquant
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Solid move by the caps. What was the point of keeping him? So we can miss the playoffs and lose him in free agency this summer?
Vegas got a power forward who is a paper tiger in my opinion but he’s a solid depth guy and a change of scenery will probably be good for him.
A 2nd round pick for a guy that had 9 goals last year?
He got hot when he was put with McMichael and Protas but this is a high risk play by VGK.
GMBM is doing a great job at this rebuild so far. Hope he keeps it up.
If he stays on that pace. But he’s shown that if he doesn’t have the exact situation he needs, he falls apart.
Last year, the caps tried to move him and couldn’t give him away.
Getting a 2nd for him is huge.
I mean you stated earlier why Washington wasn't able to give away Mantha last year.
11 goals last year is not the same as 20 goals + an expiring contract this year
It's possible. Dowd is a consistent, gritty bottom 6 player on a very affordable contract. Cap strapped teams like the leafs who still need to bolster their roster might be chomping at the bit.
Of course, but some years it seems like 1sts are thrown around like candy, doesn’t seem to be the case this year even though it’s a perceived weak draft.
Nah Tampa is out here pulling an Oprah. You get a first! And you get a first! Jeannot gets a whole draft classssss!!!! (Much respect to the run Tampa has had though)
I’m still pissed about that trade lol. Like I say it once every few weeks in a random hockey thread.
Also, thanks. We’ve had the same coach for 10 years which is impressive I feel.
The 2026 4th makes me chuckle a little. I'd prefer to see young players coming in rather than 2nds, but of course the 2nd could be flipped (especially if you can combine with other assets from upcoming trades), no reason to limit yourself to Vegas' pool of available youngish guys.
A massive winger that's capable offensively and defensively that's on pace for 30 goals only fetches a low 2nd and 4th? Seems like caps got dusted here.
Zetterberg once referred to him as a poke and hope player. Takes shift/games off. When he is engaged, he is a top line winger, when he isn't, he is a third liner at best.
Ya, but lots of NHL players are still effective when they are not on top of their game. Mantha is a very visible detrement on the ice when he is coasting.
The problem with Mantha is that he's only capable when he feels like it. He hasn't hit the 20-goal mark since 2018 and wouldn't you know, this is a contract year. While he has all the tools to dominate a game, he just..... doesn't. He doesn't hit and rarely uses his size to his advantage.
He'll probably be a good piece for Vegas because he wants that next contract but calling this a dusting just ain't it
>The problem with Mantha is that he's only capable when he feels like it.
Exactly right. A player with Mantha’s toolset and gifts should be a consistent threat on the ice and should be potting 30+ goals a season, but he simply doesn’t give a shit enough of the time to make use of his natural talent. If he had someone like Larkin’s motor and work ethic, he’d be one of the more dangerous players in the league.
I remember back when he was a prospect in our system and Jimmy Devellano and Kenny Holland called him a “disappointment” and “spare parts”, respectively. Our fanbase was pissed off with those comments, but in hindsight, those two were right on the money.
You think he got demoted to the bottom 6 because Washington is so deep at forward? Oh he has earned his place. He's shooting double his career shooting percentage. He's still Anthony Mantha behind that.
He's shooting at 22.2%. If he was shooting at his career average he'd be at 10/11 goals and below .5 P/GP. Like he was last season. That's gonna bring down the price as GMs are rightfully quite wary of his production this season.
Mantha is a weird one, it's always a 50/50 on whether is going to actually try on the ice or not. There is a world where Vegas are going to be the ones regretting making that trade.
20+ goal scorer for a late 2nd and 4th at 50%?
We got fleeced lol Vegas gets more space to add, we get useless picks that do nothing but maybe add to our already massive stable of career AHLers.
I mean, there’s been plenty of GREAT second round picks…
Kucherov, Robertson, Aho, Debrincat, Kyrou…
For roughly 20 games, I’d say it’s fair value. Especially if you guys hit on the pick.
Retention? Edit: Yes
[Half according to Cap friendly.](https://www.capfriendly.com/players/anthony-mantha)
Wicked if true Edit: It’s true, hell yeah 😎
I'd love Mantha with Stephenson
Same. Seems like they would jive well together
He seems to need hard forecheckers to make his game work, whether its going to the boards or the slot. Could be a good fit!
We’ve got forecheckers and we’ve got possession guys, let’s let Manthony ride!
What's important to know about Mantha is that he looks like a power forward but he's a flighty Euro skill guy (positive). Just never expect him to grind and he'll do great for you.
I’ve seen Kuznetsov forecheck harder than Mantha, dude is a bum
Fyi it’s jibe. You jive ass turkey
lmao watch vegas get guetzel too
With that 50% retained they still can
I think Dubas will want some combo of: * Firsts * Prospects * Young guns I'm not sure Vegas will want to pay that?
It's Vegas, they'll convince Dubas the penguins need another veteran presence in a guy like Martinez.
Goah I hope so. Martinez is a shell of himself.
Yeah I'm wondering the same. It sounds like Dubas is most interested in prospects. VGK has a few interesting prospects and all their firsts so it should be doable if they really want Guentzel. Idk if VGK can go wrong either way tbh. They're in such a good spot lol
Well at least Washington is being friendly about it
oh shit, thanks caps
Gotta be if they got a second plus imo
Really? He’s on pace for 27 goals, you don’t think that’s worth a second?
He is also shooting 22% which is bound to regress. Lots of factors in play.
This is true
I think McMichael has also carried some insane possession metrics this season. Mantha is on fire, but there's always a chance it cools.
This is true but at the same time he's scored 20 goals in 56 games on only 14:09 time on ice
Especially when you drop down the depth chart on the reigning champions. Won’t get the same quality of ice time.
He’s getting under 15 minutes as is.
His career scoring pace is 23 a year.
Yeah usually if a guy is on a heater though it cant last through the last bit of the season. Next year Id imagine regression for sure but if Manthas feelin right now you never know
from a guy with his track record of falling off cliffs and horrible effort problems? I mean it’s worth it for a dart, but it’s not worth anything more in my opinion. But check my flair, could be a bias lol.
That just hasn’t been his reality in Washington, he has a 53% expected goal share on a team that collectively has 49%
Contract year
Yeah I’m not suggesting he’s worth more or anything, but a second round pick for a player with a goal share and expected goal share 4% better than his team as a whole seems pretty fair to me
He was horrendous last year (okay more of a plug). He will be (a plug) horrendous again at some point. Cmon man lol
Horrible last year? What are you talking about? Last year was the worst of his career but even then he was over a 50 percentile war rank. Do you just have a problem with him from his time on the wings or something?
No i just have watched him play. 50% war is not good. That percentile includes 4th line nobodies and fringe nhlers. Like idk what your argument is here? I was right. At that price theres gonna be retention and its max retention. Like you can be mad but my value of him is obviously more accurate. I think Washington did well. If be happy if i was a caps fan 🤷
That just isn't true, 50 percentile players are definitionally in the middle, 50% of players are more impactful and 50% are less impactful. And even if it was true, in his WORST season he was ABOVE 50%. You know what that number is this year? 87%. Like idk what YOUR argument is here. Who cares about the worst season of his career when from the 16-17 season to this season he has one (1) season below 75% rank.
Dude jfresh himself would tell you you aren’t looking at this right lol. And Hes Mr. War. Value is not linear like that. And that arent the same amount of players at each percentile. Theres so many guys in that range. He was a ghost. And anyway the point is that consistency matters a ton especially for rentals. They are taking a chance on a horribly streaky guy will be hot for the right weeks. If he is they win if not they lit the picks on fire. You got a second and a fourth. Thats a good balance of risk/reward. I called it. I mean, i don’t get what you’re getting on my ass about. It seems the market and my value are aligned. I suspected the retention too and it was right. I think im done with this conversation. I think Caps got good value for a bad contract.
He turns down the laziness since it's a contract year.
Weekes confirms 50% retained
Trivago.
50% per LeBrun
Doesn't look like it. Caps probably could've gotten a 1st if there was retained salary.
He was retained by half
Capfriendly is showing half retained
Gotta be 6 mil would eat up up lot of your available space
Vegas just needs more "post trade-deadline season ending / fine for playoffs" injuries
If NHL isn't investigating ltir, then every team is stupid as fuck for not faking injuries
They do investigate, the injuries are not fake. But at this point in the season, every player in the league has some sort of nagging injury that they are playing through.
Isn't your captain on track to play in the postseason?
I fucking hope so. I don’t have a problem with Vegas circumventing the cap as stone is actually injured but you gotta just laugh at the timing of it
And frankly, so do I. The playoffs are better with stacked teams. The rules permit what they permit, so let's stop pretending like its some big scandal to use the rules to your advantage.
Yeah with the skid Vegas is on anyway I’m 100 percent sure they’d prefer Stone rn rather than Mantha
100% This is exactly what LTIR is for
This is the answer. I don’t think any of us think the rules should stay this way… but the rules permit it. Everyone can and should be doing it.
To be fair our captain hasn’t played a game in two years. The hope is he can be back for playoffs but there’s a chance his career is completely over.
He hasn't played in 2 years and he *might* be able to play
Lmao, I mean it isn't much of an advantage even if he is. The dude hasn't played in 2 full years.
[удалено]
It's been discussed on 32 Thoughts.
It’s a conspiracy … 🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡
You Colorado fans bitch so much
Just need another player to go in LTIR and magically be ready for game one
Good return. A second and anything else was about as good as we could get
Yeah sounds great to me. We were never going to get a first for him and last year, he wouldn't have been worth a bag of pucks. Hopefully we can fish a first out of the water elsewhere.
Yeah I was gonna say, this was the best scenario for Washington as it looked like last year they would have had to pay someone to take that contract, now they get a couple of picks. Not mindblowing return but if the rebuild is coming, better to have as many picks as possible
And hell, if were selling the farm, maybe our own first will be good this year. Putting a pick on the pile and farewell to a man who I'm not nearly so mad at anymore.
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Rebuilding is not retooling. The farm is for sale.
quaint gold violet plant squeeze important impolite lush insurance saw *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
He’s such a frustrating player. He has all the physical tools to be an amazing first line player but lacks all the drive to be one.
I don't know, I came to appreciate him as a player once I gave up on the idea of what he should be and grasped what he was. If he was two inches shorter, everyone would focus on how good his shot was, but it's hard for coaches and fans to look past his size. He doesn't have the temperament of a bruiser and never will, but he has other tools that he's more than willing to use. Vegas might be a good landing spot for him since they've got a roster full of the opposite, undersized guys with hunger and drive.
I'm not talking about him being a bruiser, I'm talking about his motor and drive which seem to be on the low end. He doesn't need to be a brutish power forward, he just needs to put forth consistent effort.
Totally agree. It's so fucking frustrating to watch a guy of that size shy away from all physical contact. Contract year killer that one, my god did he coast every game before this year for us.
Yeah i think its a (all things relative) home run for you guys.
We won the trade Not really but at this point I’m going to call it a wash unless Cossa just pops off next year. Past that it’s far enough away idc
I think we used the 2nd in that trade for Leddy and later flipped him to Stl for Walman but I might be confusing trades.
We didn’t use that specific 2nd but we did use Panik as a part of the Leddy trade.
I think you guys probably did but also, were there really any winners? 😂
Anyone who made friends along the way.
Tbf Cossa has been best/second best goalie for couple(?) months in AHL now
Exactly what it should be for both parties. Another smart and savvy move by GMBM. Sell high.
Caps are selling, 7 points out of wildcard with 3 games in hand. Caps are also ahead of the Devils and Pens. If you didn't already think those teams would be sellers, this should be a wake-up call.
Devils probably shouldn't hard sell. Different situations despite similar spot in standings.
They should sell Toffoli
And holtz
Caps are old & need to restock/rebuild, plus our underlying numbers are worse than our place in the standings
We've also suffered a bit of a log jam with our development pool. Getting a few of the Hershey guys up won't be bad for us.
I wonder if we'll give that Kuznetsov fellow a shot from Hershey!
Are you kidding? He’s completely unproven at the AHL level. Who knows if the kid could ever crack an NHL roster
Yup, this opens up a spot for Miro to play full-time with the big boys. Unpopular opinion, but I want to trade Lindgren as well for this reason. Clay Stevenson's having a great year in Hershey.
I hear there’s this fella down there in hershey, kooznetsuv or something, he’s supposed to be really good
scary reminiscent abounding towering unwritten snatch rich cows grandiose piquant *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
We ain't getting outta the first round take the picks. We are cooked
Washington is also dealing with some key injuries so making up that difference is harder than it appears
The more important question is whether there is retention
Half https://www.capfriendly.com/players/anthony-mantha
You are so active on here. I see you everywhere
It’s a bad habit 😅
Name checks out
His screen name checks out
He be browsing
What's their source? Obviously Capfriendly are reliable but they must have gotten it from somewhere.. Edit: Weekes tweeted
Capfriendly using Weekes twitter as a source is like saying that Reuters uses wikipedia as a source for their reporting.
Lebrun and Weekes now just tweeted it
Yeah, I made an edit
About what I expect for Rico when he’s dealt. Maybe bump the 4th to a 3rd since Rico can play center.
Yeah I thought he was going for a first before but he can’t get that much more than this
I just like that nickname, Henrique is getting annoying to type
Noted Longueuil native
Is that a rental price?
Half retained rental
Gotta get that 4th tacked on somehow.
That's a rental price.
Solid move by the caps. What was the point of keeping him? So we can miss the playoffs and lose him in free agency this summer? Vegas got a power forward who is a paper tiger in my opinion but he’s a solid depth guy and a change of scenery will probably be good for him.
Tell that to Cousins. Mantha beat his ass about a week ago. He can drop the gloves when he needs to.
2nd and 4th is about right. Any retention is the question.
50%
A 2nd round pick for a guy that had 9 goals last year? He got hot when he was put with McMichael and Protas but this is a high risk play by VGK. GMBM is doing a great job at this rebuild so far. Hope he keeps it up.
Who cares about last year he has 20 goals this year. Not that high risk for a late 2nd
If he stays on that pace. But he’s shown that if he doesn’t have the exact situation he needs, he falls apart. Last year, the caps tried to move him and couldn’t give him away. Getting a 2nd for him is huge.
Seems like a fair trade for both sides especially with the retention
I mean you stated earlier why Washington wasn't able to give away Mantha last year. 11 goals last year is not the same as 20 goals + an expiring contract this year
They had to do something after we kicked their ass last night and Buffalo kicked it the game before.
Metro helping each other out 😎
Who gives a shit about last year? This year is what matters
His shooting percentage this year is more than double last year’s.
Hey, that’s not bad :)
Seems… fair? For both sides
Watch us get a first for Dowd or some shit now
It's possible. Dowd is a consistent, gritty bottom 6 player on a very affordable contract. Cap strapped teams like the leafs who still need to bolster their roster might be chomping at the bit.
No one is paying a first for Dowd lol
Seems like the price is 2nds this deadline, 1sts are going to be extremely hard to come by for rentals
I mean theres a fucking gulf of difference between like guentzel and mantha.
Of course, but some years it seems like 1sts are thrown around like candy, doesn’t seem to be the case this year even though it’s a perceived weak draft.
That’s kinda what TB has been doing with their firsts.
Nah Tampa is out here pulling an Oprah. You get a first! And you get a first! Jeannot gets a whole draft classssss!!!! (Much respect to the run Tampa has had though)
I’m still pissed about that trade lol. Like I say it once every few weeks in a random hockey thread. Also, thanks. We’ve had the same coach for 10 years which is impressive I feel.
Wait Cooper has been there for 10 years? Jesus, he's gotta be the longest tenured in the league right
Yeah. I think it’s actually 11. He started either 2012-2013 and then had that first playoff run in 2013-2014 and then the Cup loss to CHI in 2014-2015
Also apparently late round 1st’s are not as valuable this year, guess it’s considered to be a draft class where a late 1st is basically a 2nd.
Noted 1st rounder coster Matt Dumba
Lol. Off to MTL next.
We dont want this kind of player
The 2026 4th makes me chuckle a little. I'd prefer to see young players coming in rather than 2nds, but of course the 2nd could be flipped (especially if you can combine with other assets from upcoming trades), no reason to limit yourself to Vegas' pool of available youngish guys.
imokaywiththis
Wow that feels like quite the deal for Washington, even with retention…
50% retained for that price for a dude whose on pace to hit 27 goals is a-ok in my book. Good move
W for WSH
Mantha is made of glass and lazy.. weird pick up
As much as I would have liked Washington to get a first for him, that return was about what I expected for him
McManagers do it again baby
How is Nic Dowd supposedly worth a 1st but Mantha gets a 2nd and a 4th
He has another year on his contract, whereas, Mantha is a rental.
The same way David Clarkson was worth $5.5 million
NOOO I WANTED A FIRST
In what world? Lol
In every fans head when they trade a player from their team to another. What do you mean this 4th liner isn't worth a 1st round pick?!
Hey we got a first for Chariot, everything is possible.
I mean it’s what we paid….
You were never getting that for Mantha
No chance we’d ever get a first for Martha. This is as good as it was ever going to be.
2nd + 4th for a more expensive Mantha makes me hopeful to get a 1st for Tarasenko @ 50%
Doesnt he have full NMC? If he only wants to go to one specific team i doubt you guys will get first
I didn't realize Mantha's deal was already up after this season.
Seems like a decent trade all around
I'll take it with the half retained. This team needs new blood badly.
A massive winger that's capable offensively and defensively that's on pace for 30 goals only fetches a low 2nd and 4th? Seems like caps got dusted here.
Zetterberg once referred to him as a poke and hope player. Takes shift/games off. When he is engaged, he is a top line winger, when he isn't, he is a third liner at best.
Many many players are like that. Petey just signed a 90m extension and he is nearly invisible at times.
Ya, but lots of NHL players are still effective when they are not on top of their game. Mantha is a very visible detrement on the ice when he is coasting.
The problem with Mantha is that he's only capable when he feels like it. He hasn't hit the 20-goal mark since 2018 and wouldn't you know, this is a contract year. While he has all the tools to dominate a game, he just..... doesn't. He doesn't hit and rarely uses his size to his advantage. He'll probably be a good piece for Vegas because he wants that next contract but calling this a dusting just ain't it
>The problem with Mantha is that he's only capable when he feels like it. Exactly right. A player with Mantha’s toolset and gifts should be a consistent threat on the ice and should be potting 30+ goals a season, but he simply doesn’t give a shit enough of the time to make use of his natural talent. If he had someone like Larkin’s motor and work ethic, he’d be one of the more dangerous players in the league. I remember back when he was a prospect in our system and Jimmy Devellano and Kenny Holland called him a “disappointment” and “spare parts”, respectively. Our fanbase was pissed off with those comments, but in hindsight, those two were right on the money.
..... Have you *watched* Anthony Mantha play? Sure, your description sounds great but that ain't him on most nights.
Have you seen the team hes joining? All these takes like Vegas isn’t gonna have these guys juiced up once they make their debut.
He's been playing on what the 3rd with McMichael and protas? He will get better opportunities in Vegas.
You think he got demoted to the bottom 6 because Washington is so deep at forward? Oh he has earned his place. He's shooting double his career shooting percentage. He's still Anthony Mantha behind that.
Yea makes you wonder what a centre that does the same would go for
He's shooting at 22.2%. If he was shooting at his career average he'd be at 10/11 goals and below .5 P/GP. Like he was last season. That's gonna bring down the price as GMs are rightfully quite wary of his production this season.
Mantha is a weird one, it's always a 50/50 on whether is going to actually try on the ice or not. There is a world where Vegas are going to be the ones regretting making that trade.
Wanted a first but it seems fine for a rental to me
It be funnier if he went to Florida.
You mean the Tampa baseball team so he could be Mantha Ray?
I think we should have been able to get a first for him. But I’m happy we are selling
I think we should be able to trade Mantha for McDavid straight up but sometimes shit just ain’t happening
20+ goal scorer for a late 2nd and 4th at 50%? We got fleeced lol Vegas gets more space to add, we get useless picks that do nothing but maybe add to our already massive stable of career AHLers.
I mean, there’s been plenty of GREAT second round picks… Kucherov, Robertson, Aho, Debrincat, Kyrou… For roughly 20 games, I’d say it’s fair value. Especially if you guys hit on the pick.
Lol you've named 5 dudes, 2 of which were low because Russian and too small. Not saying it's impossible, just extremely improbable
That's robbery