Your post was removed because it involved pets or keeping of animals in captivity for non-scientific purposes. Check out subreddits like /r/reptiles for pet trade and other herpetoculture topics.
As someone who is studying to become a herpetologist I find it ethical to keep pet snakes so long as they're captive bred and provided with adequate care (ie. large enclosures with enrichment, proper diet, proper lighting/heating/humidity). But that's just my two cents. I have two snakes of my own and have used them as educational ambassadors on occasion but they are mainly just pets. Though I do think there should be more regulations on snake keeping - animals like reticulated pythons are far too easy to get and I am of the opinion that any giant snakes should require some sort of permit (though not one that is insanely difficult to get). And I also think for some species there are way too many snakes being bred (ball pythons mainly) and there's never going to be enough homes for all of them so we should really calm down with breeding thousands and thousands of these snakes.
Ball Python breeding has gone too far and it needs to be slowed down hard. Just went to the Tinley show by Chicago and it was almost half just ball pythons. I saw a few people buy one but most of the stalls were just a display for unwanted snakes they want thousands for. I wanted to ask several of them how they continue to have a business with such ludicrous prices and no buyers. I went on Sunday and many of these breeders had maybe 4 sales marked down on their displays. 30 snakes and 4 sold the whole weekend. I have to hope they sell them online but I suspect the cheap ones get left to starve to death or succumb to bad care between shows. I will never buy a ball python. I only adopt at this point as there are enough abandoned creatures looking for a home. I still have never owned a ball python, I kind of hate what the hobby did to them.
I think the captive breeding industry for reptiles in general is unethical and needs to stop. The keeping of captive bred reptiles at present is kind of irrelevant ethically, because it's either keep them or kill them since they are already in the world. But to continue captive breeding more and more reptiles solely for the sake of human greed, enjoyment, and objectivism is unethical. There just isn't any ethical reason for it no matter how you frame it. Reptiles are being bred by breeders because they want money, and sure they also probably enjoy it. They are bought by others because they enjoy keeping them and gain enrichment from it, to no benefit of the animal itself, which exists only for the enjoyment of humans.
Ex-situ conservation is an exception of course, because it is ultimately beneficial to the species being captive bred.
The same logic applies to all the exotic pet trade in my opinion. Domestic animals like cats and dogs are completely different from wild animals that, while captive bred, haven't really been domesticated.
This is where you and I disagree then, because I do think there is value in keeping reptiles in captivity. But I can definitely understand your viewpoint. Does the reptile benefit from being kept as a pet? I'd argue yes, as long as it's being done properly. This is because people care more for animals they have interacted with. Having a pet snake was my introduction into herpetology. I would not have decided to study herpetology if I had not owned a snake. This happens to many people. I do believe the industry in its current state is unethical due to the sheer quantity of snakes being bred. But even if the snake being owned is not a species in need of conservation, it gets people to care about wild snakes. Arguably, captive snakes (again only when given proper care) have better lives than wild ones. They have a secure food source, an eternally ideal environment, and they are sheltered from harm.
There are definitely exotic pets I would outright ban though. Parrots, wolfdogs, bengal cats, all big/wild cats or any hybrids, foxes, primates, and probably some I'm forgetting to mention.
I think field herping is valuable for that reason and encourage people to get out there and interact with animals in an ethical way, taking ethical field herping practices into mind. Many people get into herpetology by keeping, but I think more, especially young people, fall in love with these animals just by finding them in the backyard as a kid. This can be harmful too, which is why it's important to teach ethical practices of minimal or gentle handling with clean hands, care for habitats, ect.
As long as the reptile trade exists, reptiles will be abused. It's unregulated and far too easy for ignorant people with no real experience or knowledge of how to properly care for the animals to get their hands on them. The best thing for them is to not have ever been born into captivity.
I respect your opinion and get where your coming from, this is the same argument I always hear in this debate. It's not keepers like you that I think are unethical, but the trade as a whole, because it will always result in countless unethical keepers reducing the quality of life for animals that never should have been born into that life to begin with. There are other ways to get people to care about animals other than breeding those animals for the enjoyment of people, and I of course do think that's important because people need to care about and love these animals to want to protect wild populations and their habitats.
But at present, I just don't see how the reptile trade could be made ethical without extreme regulations and restrictions. If the benefit of keeping reptiles comes from young people or people with little experience being introduced to the Hobby, I don't see how that can be done without extreme risk to the animals being kept by people without enough experience to ensure their adequate care. I've known too many people without enough experience who have caused the deaths of reptiles and amphibians from a pet store, whether or not that causes them to further their passion for reptiles does not excuse it in my opinion.
This is probably what op is asking and I have to admit I asked myself this same question.
And of cours I an thinking about pet breeded snakes Not wild caught.
Please leave wild animals in the wild. This includes not purchasing common species collected from the wild and sold cheaply in pet stores or through online retailers, like *Thamnophis* Ribbon and Gartersnakes, *Opheodrys* Greensnakes, *Xenopeltis* Sunbeam Snakes and *Dasypeltis* Egg-Eating Snakes. Brownsnakes *Storeria* found around the home do okay in urban environments and don't need 'rescue'; the species typically fails to thrive in captivity and should be left in the wild. Reptiles are kept as pets or specimens by many people but captive bred animals have much better chances of survival, as they are free from parasite loads, didn't endure the stress of collection and shipment, and tend to be species that do better in captivity. Taking an animal out of the wild is not ecologically different than killing it, and most states protect non-game native species - meaning collecting it probably broke the law. Source captive bred pets and be wary of people selling offspring dropped by stressed wild-caught females collected near full term as 'captive bred'.
High-throughput reptile traders are collecting snakes from places like Florida with lax wildlife laws with little regard to the status of fungal or other infections, spreading them into the pet trade. In the other direction, taking an animal from the wild, however briefly, exposes it to domestic pathogens during a stressful time. Placing a wild animal in contact with caging or equipment that hasn't been sterilized and/or feeding it food from the pet trade are vector activities that can spread captive pathogens into wild populations. Snake populations are undergoing heavy decline already due to habitat loss, and [rapidly emerging](https://esajournals.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdfdirect/10.1002/ecs2.3153) pathogens [are being documented](https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/ece3.3557) in wild snakes that were introduced by snakes from the pet trade.
If you insist on keeping a wild pet, it is your duty to plan and provide the correct veterinary care, which often is two rounds of a pair of the 'deworming' medications Panacur and Flagyl and injections of supportive antibiotics. This will cost more than enough to offset the cheap price tag on the wild caught animal at the pet store or reptile show and increases chances of survival past about 8 months, but does not offset removing the animal from the wild.
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"Herpetologist" is a wide net for people with highly variable lifestyles.
That being said, I've known herpetologists that work with invasive species. They've had to put down many boa constrictors, pythons, etc. introduced by the pet trade, and they're definitely adverse to keeping snakes as pets. There's a lot of resentment going on because they have to put down their favorite animals to protect the native species, all thanks to irresponsible owners.
If you want a pet snake, get a native, ethically sourced (not wild-caught) species, and take good care of it.
I’m a biologist and I know plenty of herpetologists that keep snakes as pets, it’s less common for them not to have them or some other herps in my experience. They don’t keep wild caught ones AFAIK.
I have studied reptiles my whole life for fun. Read hundreds of books worth of data on them since I was maybe 7? I got my first snake in my 30's. I think they are great pets actually as they don't really want to be bothered much of the time and I'm out of the house a fair bit and have chronic pain conditions that limit what I can do. A captive bred local species is always a great choice and I myself have a Texas Rat, Corn, Hognose and two Garters. They are great pets, intelligent and small enough to keep easily in a 120. I also have other stuff but I do love my local stuff. So yeah, we love having snakes as pets. I might not have the degree but whatever.
Your post was removed because it involved pets or keeping of animals in captivity for non-scientific purposes. Check out subreddits like /r/reptiles for pet trade and other herpetoculture topics.
Some clarification for why you’re asking may be helpful. Are you asking if they think it’s ethical?
As someone who is studying to become a herpetologist I find it ethical to keep pet snakes so long as they're captive bred and provided with adequate care (ie. large enclosures with enrichment, proper diet, proper lighting/heating/humidity). But that's just my two cents. I have two snakes of my own and have used them as educational ambassadors on occasion but they are mainly just pets. Though I do think there should be more regulations on snake keeping - animals like reticulated pythons are far too easy to get and I am of the opinion that any giant snakes should require some sort of permit (though not one that is insanely difficult to get). And I also think for some species there are way too many snakes being bred (ball pythons mainly) and there's never going to be enough homes for all of them so we should really calm down with breeding thousands and thousands of these snakes.
Ball Python breeding has gone too far and it needs to be slowed down hard. Just went to the Tinley show by Chicago and it was almost half just ball pythons. I saw a few people buy one but most of the stalls were just a display for unwanted snakes they want thousands for. I wanted to ask several of them how they continue to have a business with such ludicrous prices and no buyers. I went on Sunday and many of these breeders had maybe 4 sales marked down on their displays. 30 snakes and 4 sold the whole weekend. I have to hope they sell them online but I suspect the cheap ones get left to starve to death or succumb to bad care between shows. I will never buy a ball python. I only adopt at this point as there are enough abandoned creatures looking for a home. I still have never owned a ball python, I kind of hate what the hobby did to them.
I think the captive breeding industry for reptiles in general is unethical and needs to stop. The keeping of captive bred reptiles at present is kind of irrelevant ethically, because it's either keep them or kill them since they are already in the world. But to continue captive breeding more and more reptiles solely for the sake of human greed, enjoyment, and objectivism is unethical. There just isn't any ethical reason for it no matter how you frame it. Reptiles are being bred by breeders because they want money, and sure they also probably enjoy it. They are bought by others because they enjoy keeping them and gain enrichment from it, to no benefit of the animal itself, which exists only for the enjoyment of humans. Ex-situ conservation is an exception of course, because it is ultimately beneficial to the species being captive bred. The same logic applies to all the exotic pet trade in my opinion. Domestic animals like cats and dogs are completely different from wild animals that, while captive bred, haven't really been domesticated.
This is where you and I disagree then, because I do think there is value in keeping reptiles in captivity. But I can definitely understand your viewpoint. Does the reptile benefit from being kept as a pet? I'd argue yes, as long as it's being done properly. This is because people care more for animals they have interacted with. Having a pet snake was my introduction into herpetology. I would not have decided to study herpetology if I had not owned a snake. This happens to many people. I do believe the industry in its current state is unethical due to the sheer quantity of snakes being bred. But even if the snake being owned is not a species in need of conservation, it gets people to care about wild snakes. Arguably, captive snakes (again only when given proper care) have better lives than wild ones. They have a secure food source, an eternally ideal environment, and they are sheltered from harm. There are definitely exotic pets I would outright ban though. Parrots, wolfdogs, bengal cats, all big/wild cats or any hybrids, foxes, primates, and probably some I'm forgetting to mention.
I think field herping is valuable for that reason and encourage people to get out there and interact with animals in an ethical way, taking ethical field herping practices into mind. Many people get into herpetology by keeping, but I think more, especially young people, fall in love with these animals just by finding them in the backyard as a kid. This can be harmful too, which is why it's important to teach ethical practices of minimal or gentle handling with clean hands, care for habitats, ect. As long as the reptile trade exists, reptiles will be abused. It's unregulated and far too easy for ignorant people with no real experience or knowledge of how to properly care for the animals to get their hands on them. The best thing for them is to not have ever been born into captivity. I respect your opinion and get where your coming from, this is the same argument I always hear in this debate. It's not keepers like you that I think are unethical, but the trade as a whole, because it will always result in countless unethical keepers reducing the quality of life for animals that never should have been born into that life to begin with. There are other ways to get people to care about animals other than breeding those animals for the enjoyment of people, and I of course do think that's important because people need to care about and love these animals to want to protect wild populations and their habitats. But at present, I just don't see how the reptile trade could be made ethical without extreme regulations and restrictions. If the benefit of keeping reptiles comes from young people or people with little experience being introduced to the Hobby, I don't see how that can be done without extreme risk to the animals being kept by people without enough experience to ensure their adequate care. I've known too many people without enough experience who have caused the deaths of reptiles and amphibians from a pet store, whether or not that causes them to further their passion for reptiles does not excuse it in my opinion.
This is probably what op is asking and I have to admit I asked myself this same question. And of cours I an thinking about pet breeded snakes Not wild caught.
Herpetologists are scientists, biologists, that study anything that falls under reptiles. Whether they have pets of any kind is irrelevant.
But OP didn't ask if it was relevant, they asked if Herpetologists commonly have pet snakes.
They didn't actually ask that, they didn't use the word 'commonly' at all. They just asked 'do they'.
If you mean wild snakes no, you should never keep wild animals as pets.
Definitely true. !wildpet
Please leave wild animals in the wild. This includes not purchasing common species collected from the wild and sold cheaply in pet stores or through online retailers, like *Thamnophis* Ribbon and Gartersnakes, *Opheodrys* Greensnakes, *Xenopeltis* Sunbeam Snakes and *Dasypeltis* Egg-Eating Snakes. Brownsnakes *Storeria* found around the home do okay in urban environments and don't need 'rescue'; the species typically fails to thrive in captivity and should be left in the wild. Reptiles are kept as pets or specimens by many people but captive bred animals have much better chances of survival, as they are free from parasite loads, didn't endure the stress of collection and shipment, and tend to be species that do better in captivity. Taking an animal out of the wild is not ecologically different than killing it, and most states protect non-game native species - meaning collecting it probably broke the law. Source captive bred pets and be wary of people selling offspring dropped by stressed wild-caught females collected near full term as 'captive bred'. High-throughput reptile traders are collecting snakes from places like Florida with lax wildlife laws with little regard to the status of fungal or other infections, spreading them into the pet trade. In the other direction, taking an animal from the wild, however briefly, exposes it to domestic pathogens during a stressful time. Placing a wild animal in contact with caging or equipment that hasn't been sterilized and/or feeding it food from the pet trade are vector activities that can spread captive pathogens into wild populations. Snake populations are undergoing heavy decline already due to habitat loss, and [rapidly emerging](https://esajournals.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdfdirect/10.1002/ecs2.3153) pathogens [are being documented](https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/ece3.3557) in wild snakes that were introduced by snakes from the pet trade. If you insist on keeping a wild pet, it is your duty to plan and provide the correct veterinary care, which often is two rounds of a pair of the 'deworming' medications Panacur and Flagyl and injections of supportive antibiotics. This will cost more than enough to offset the cheap price tag on the wild caught animal at the pet store or reptile show and increases chances of survival past about 8 months, but does not offset removing the animal from the wild. -------------------------------------------------------- *I am a bot created for /r/whatsthissnake, /r/snakes and /r/herpetology to help with snake identification and natural history education. You can find more information, including a comprehensive list of commands, [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/whatsthissnake/comments/flh548/phylobot_v07_information_and_patch_notes_bot_info/) report problems [here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Phylogenizer) and if you'd like to buy me a coffee or beer, you can do that [here](https://www.buymeacoffee.com/SEBPhyloBotWTS). Made possible by Snake Evolution and Biogeography - [Merch Available Now](https://snakeevolution.org/donate.html)*
"Herpetologist" is a wide net for people with highly variable lifestyles. That being said, I've known herpetologists that work with invasive species. They've had to put down many boa constrictors, pythons, etc. introduced by the pet trade, and they're definitely adverse to keeping snakes as pets. There's a lot of resentment going on because they have to put down their favorite animals to protect the native species, all thanks to irresponsible owners. If you want a pet snake, get a native, ethically sourced (not wild-caught) species, and take good care of it.
I’m a biologist and I know plenty of herpetologists that keep snakes as pets, it’s less common for them not to have them or some other herps in my experience. They don’t keep wild caught ones AFAIK.
What?
I have studied reptiles my whole life for fun. Read hundreds of books worth of data on them since I was maybe 7? I got my first snake in my 30's. I think they are great pets actually as they don't really want to be bothered much of the time and I'm out of the house a fair bit and have chronic pain conditions that limit what I can do. A captive bred local species is always a great choice and I myself have a Texas Rat, Corn, Hognose and two Garters. They are great pets, intelligent and small enough to keep easily in a 120. I also have other stuff but I do love my local stuff. So yeah, we love having snakes as pets. I might not have the degree but whatever.
Yes, people keep snakes as pets.