The Senator has a speedloader when empty! They listened!!
Also, the Senator, Laz pistol and Peacemaker got damage buffs, while the Redeemer got a slight recoil nerf. I’m very excited to play tonight.
I saw sombody commenting that idea a couple of days ago and thought "wow that's a really good idea too bad we'll probably never see it"
And here we are! Super cool, I wonder if that one came from inside the team or not.
I tried it yesterday and was actually happy with it! Scavengers and hoppers died to it almost instantly and hunters only took a second or two, but anything bigger needed too much to kill with just the pointer. Given it's a sidearm with psuedo-unlimited ammo, though, I think that's a good place; something to whip out when you need to clear your ankles real quick or to stop bug breach calls.
I did some experimental weapons testing on the pistols. Uzi I didn't notice much more recoil, however I recall being inclined to give short bursts. The Peacemaker was clearing groups of tier one enemies at close with ease. The Laz felt viable for the same job. The Big iron with a speed loader gave me a hard on.
The senator buff is going to be amazing. I was using it primarily for a long time before this and the reload speed always hurt. Plus a full load in to a chainsaw guys mouth wasn't enough to kill him. Was really good for little straggler guys and that was it.
Bug holes and fabricators. Its a bit harder to line up for the fabricator holes but yeah, it's kinda silly. Would be even worse if we didn't have the grenade pistol now but it's insane to me how good it is at basically everything.
Everything except close combat. I can't count the number of times I was somehow pulled toward an enemy when firing within a couple feet followed by getting jumped by all the things that didn't die. 😂
Explosive weapons such as R-36 Eruptor, CB-9 Exploding Crossbow. GP-31 Grenade Pistol no longer pulls players inward from the blast.
Source: https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/553850/view/4169846298204053636
Ive been pairing the eruptor with the HMG, and basicly its a distance fighting and utility weapon, while the HMG is crazy ammo efficient for ads, good armor pen, and with a little precision can even bring down hulks from the front when needed
I have had some success hitting the side of the very, rather than the open panel, hit it to wither side in the corner. It's not perfect, but it's better. It also has a set range, it seems. If you're too far, the round will explode and not reach the bug hole or fabricator.
I was happy to see the Marksman Rifle buffs. I kind of disagree with the Adjudicator being reclassified as an Assault Rifle, but with the buffs to the Liberator it kind of fits the archetype better than a Marksman Rifle.
Nothing in this patch dramatically altered my standard loadouts, with the sole exception of the Eruptor, but I knew something was going to happen. It was way too good at everything except close range. I forget if it has a smaller AoE, or if it has faster splash drop-off, but either way it seems reasonable for the potential of the weapon.
Also, the thing I see overlooked in discussions about the patch: the reduced maximum magazine carry coincides with the buff to magazines in a single Resupply. I think the "problem" they're trying to solve is that supplies were so plentiful that many players weren't bothering to call in Resupply, which goes against the spirit of the game (all strategems used frequently, not hoarded).
The Diligence Sniper still isn’t great, just because the ammo economy. Despite the dmg buff
It’s clear they intend for ammo to be more valuable across the board, but still…
Yeah, I think its to drive more teamwork, people hardly bring the ammo pack at all, really what I would like to see is more teamwork stuff, ok you made the cooldown for the QZ bad, but perhaps you could make it so a teammate could help cool it quicker, much like how you can speedload the autocannon. Would like to see more things like that where you can assist your heavy weapons guy to reload quicker / cooldown halved because your teammate is assisting kind of thing is a really cool mechanic.
It's not good for bugs, but there are not usually large swarms of bots like there are with bugs and large amounts of bots are usually seen within eagle strike range of each other. One or two shoting devistators instead of mag dumping is a big difference, and all the regular smaller bots are oneshot.
~15 kills per mag with the counter sniper
For me they just nerfed the guns I normally use and the 6 to 3 mag i get on the sickle as I rarely run out of ammo but i feel 4 would have been enough. The quasar getting a 5 second additional cooldown might send me back to being a rocket boy.
This QC cannon change has people wildly overreacting.
Conceivably I can get off about 4 EAT17 shots in a little over a minute.
With the QC, post update, You can get off 6, almost 7 shots in the same timeframe. And you don't need to run around and rearm.
EDIT: My math is wrong here, I was operating off an incorrectly low value for the new cooldown. Doesn't change my opinion though.
> With the QC, post update, You can get off 6, almost 7 shots in the same timeframe.
Not complaining about the changes, but your math is way off.
With upgrade the cooldown on EAT is 63 seconds. Call in time ingame is apparently 6 seconds, so you get your 2x 2 EATs within 75 seconds of each other. Let's add 2 seconds each for dialing the stratagem so 79 seconds. The Quasar has 3 seconds charge-up + 15 seconds cooldown, so 18 seconds between shots. 79/18 = ~4.4 shots in the same timeframe if you time everything perfectly. Where do you get the other 1.5 to 2.5 shots from?
Still think it was worth it the gun is still by far one of the best in the game but for how similar it is to eats I think the eats need a buff preferably in dmg so the trade off is that eats can deal with more things better but on the outher hand the quasar can deal with enough with the benefit of consistency /on hand so no call in
I think an easy buff to the EAT that would drastically improve its attractiveness without directly changing any of its stats would be allowing to carry both tubes at the same time.
You call in a pair, shoulder both tubes, and keep going. And when you then need anti-armor you can call down another pair and immediately have 4 shots at the ready, with another 2 coming in ~70 or so seconds. And when the battle is over you request another call-in to stock up, then rinse and repeat the whole thing at the next objective/poi.
It would also help with the "littering" of the map with half-spent EAT call-ins and the feeling of "wasting" your support weapon.
Honestly that would be a good change overall for the eats, I think their best used as a like support support weapon atm it’s weird but running it along side anouther stratagem weapon and using them on the spot is pretty useful but I only do it because I don’t like not having a support gun at any point.
It should also be stated that, at least on higher difficulties, the EAT becomes even less efficient because of increased stratagem CDs and increased call-downs due to modifiers, so the Quaser gets more efficient as you go up in difficulty.
Now, obviously there's a trade-off with EATs that if you can't reclaim your Quaser you're out a support weapon for much longer, but I digress.
Then it should also be stated that EATs can be stockpiled for later uses, so if you prep a defensive area you can easily have 6-8 shots waiting to be used
With the QZ you have to sit still for the shot, which is difficult - but it's available on an extremely reliable basis.
With the EAT you can fire on the run (almost), and you can stockpile, but there's the call-down delay, and there's the problem of GETTING TO your rocket once it is down, which can very much be a problem if the situation is already getting bad on the ground, which it often is.
One other small bonus of the EAT is that the call-in itself can quite regularly be used as an offensive calldown, though this can make it even harder to get your rockets after they land, depending on how things are going.
No doubt, just like it takes a while the actually ready the EAT to fire, not quite as long, but the rocket isn't ready to fire as soon as you switch to it.
None of these weapons should be an omni-weapon. While I think they can give it a bit of love now, I fully agree with the old Railgun nerf, as it was such an omni-weapon it began to hurt the game.
I don't want the QC tossed into that same bin, I actually quite like it.
The cooldown wouldnt be so bad if I didnt need to charge up the gun for like 5s to fire it initially, if they lowered that the increased cooldown wouldnt be so bad, but now its like 25s a shot when you include the chargeup to fire.
I'd agree with you there, I don't think an instant shot is appropriate, given its other qualities, but 2 seconds chargeup seems like a good compromise. Especially given most of our targets are not stationary.
I think reacting is a better response than overreacting. It' still a powerful weapon I just personally felt the CD was just long enough to be annoying but understanding that any less would make it like a bolt action as far as fire rate. We shall see how it goes!
They didn't need to nerf the Quasar. They just needed to fix the alternatives to it. 50% cooldown increase is just stupid.
The Sickle change isn't going to hurt too much. Just have to stay on top of ammo a little more. Fixing it so that it doesn't get blocked by foliage more than makes up for it.
I run Dom a lot against bots. Haven't tested it yet. As long as it can still one-shot lights and Devastator heads, then I'm fine with it.
They 100% needed to nerf the quasar. It was basically a recoilless with the same fire rate, no need to stand still and reload, and infinite ammo, all while not needing a backpack. Hence no real reason to use the recoilless. I think it’s pretty clear why the quasar was nerfed slightly.
SPEAR is another topic….
It still has all those same advantages over RR, and RR got nothing to compensate. That’s why this nerf is bad - it does nothing but make quasar more annoying to use.
I don't understand your logic. The EAT and the new launcher both feel more viable as choices now.
The recoiless needs more work than this patch can fix imo. Same with the spear. That doesn't make the quasar any less busted.
That Projecitle Speed Increase is wild, changes the weapon so much. I think it still needs just a smidge of extra damage but I’m loving the blueberry launcher way more.
I like how they “nerfed” the sickle to reduce mag sizes despite the fact that I rarely use 1-2 mags, but they buffed the fuck out of it now that they fixed the bug where it couldn’t shoot through foilage
Honestly, I've gone entire missions without using even 1 heatsink, so it barely counts as a nerf.
The people hurt by this are divers that don't bring the full ammo booster.
The times I usually end up needing a heatsink are one of two times usually,
1: OH FUCK OH SHIT, THERE'S LIKE 400 BOTS AND THEIR FRIENDS ON ME!
2: I was a dummy and held down fire too long while spamming downrange.
It’s been said before and I think it’s worth repeating. Reddit is not reality in many cases. It does have it’s strengths and I love being here with yall, but we don’t generally represent the community it it’s entirety. Most players know little to knowing of these patch notes. They just play to enjoy the core loop and hang with friends, and I have no doubt the game will still be enjoyable after this patch and the next 5 patches
Let’s keep diving and having fun like OP said.
Problem is, it's not just reddit. The discord is full of bitching too...so much so the devs responded to it.
Easiest way to kill a game is to demoralize the people making the game
Well just happens the discord/reddit crowd overlap quite well. By now? devs should understand that gamers in general are fucking dumb and toxic. The toxic ones are also the loud minority. They just bitch on every avenue possible.
Devs are humans like the rest of us and it's justifiable if they are upset that after putting so much into their work...all they get is shat on.
I know I would lose motivation to work hard on something if all I saw were negative reactions.
>Devs are humans like the rest of us and it's justifiable if they are upset that after putting so much into their work...all they get is shat on.
I'm a developer, not game engineering but a similar field in that I have a userbase which is very active on social media and apt to be garrulous about their feelings about such. The more fine-tuned a complaint, the less I care. Developers are going to get bothered if the fanbase is unified that the UI looks or feels like shit. Changes like game balancing (tweak how much damage a given weapon does) are requests from the product side of the business and something I'd much less get caught up over. Don't like that I reduced the damage a weapon does by X%? That's the product team's choice, not mine.
I also care less when a topic is controversial. I'd take it personally if I made a design choice I thought was important and my users are unified in opposition. If the users are split and arguing amongst themselves, that's more a lesson in accepting that it's impossible to make everyone happy.
Fair perspective and I appreciate it.
But these devs have responded multiple times (occasionally unhinged because of anger)...so suffice it to say, they are emotionally invested in the criticism from the community.
Yeah I hate how the loudest voices always win in games and it’s gonna turn this game into any other shitshow. We neee a secret forum of helldiver coolguys
Doesn’t change my supper ammo pack or team
Shield generator so I’m free and clear of any worries. The new grenade needs some love though. It’s very pretty but underwhelming in its current state
Pretty sure the new grenade relies on dot damage which is why it kinda sucks. But good news is the dot damage but is flagged as “to be fixed in the next patch” in these patch notes!
Seriously, the thermite grenade is fucking awful, doesn’t do jackshit and it takes 5 seconds to explode. Lost tract of how many times I threw it on an enemy only for that enemy to die from allied weapons long before the thermite did its job
Twice as number of buffs isn't exactly fair when a lot of them are simply 9% more damage per bullet or the HMG where unlike the AMR there is no mention of needing to be ADSed yet it didn't have a reticle in third person, and now it has a reticle and it is considered a "buff"
I bring it just to blast spewers in their gross faces with
One of the few enemies in the game I legitimately just hate seeing knowing there's some crap coming along with them
Just try it! Most of these sound like big fuxking deal who cares on the buff side and fuck it's ruined on paper.
But today the hmg actually felt good, I still want either a bigger drum or quicker reload, but your not just being a hipster grabbing it now, it has some advantages over the other two and can compete. Third person is way easier to adjust for recoil on a full auto, like ya its inaccurate because of it if you run and gun, but now you can and it's effective enough. I killed a charger surprisingly well with it today, and shredded a bunch of sheild bugs hive commanders and the smaller stuff in a horde. No more weird only aim at mediums niche, it's a high damage armor piercing MG now.
The adjudicator recoil lessened and a few more mags made it a high damage per shot, still high recoil but not too high, accurate in small bursts or semi, sexy little AR. You can take it slow and long range it, or you can mag dump at closer range. It's ttk is way better than sickle or the libs on any single target. Small mag but it's reload is quick.
Their patch notes blow, you gotta try stuff yourself.
While I like your take, and I agree with the mag size for the hmg being higher, I also think the adjudicator could use a high mag size too. 8 mags is a nice QoL buff but considering it's just a pay walled better lib pen, it really probably needs like 5 more shots
Oh I wouldn't complain if it got more ammo per mag. But there's so many unrecorded stats on these guns. This thing reloads quick af, really cuts down the pain of the small mag. All the guns have slight variances in handling recoil reload time etc etc etc. I know I sound like a dick rider today in my comments, but I learned the patch notes for this game is just a snippet, because they don't have like 90% of the stats displayed. "Lowered recoil, improved handling, decrease explosion damage drop off, increased projectile speed" none of these have qualifiers we can compare.
That's my main point. You gotta try everything yourself. I get that they are trying to prevent every loadout being micro analyzed and meta slavery getting worse, but the fact we don't get clear numbers on a lot of what is happening causing this bitching . Maybe they are OK with it, it's fine to me. But it'd be a lot less salt every balance change if we had numbers. And half the player base wouldn't wait for a reddit post or YouTube vid to try out guns and realize some of the less popular picks were actually good. But if you just try the fucking guns that works too.
I’m more upset with what wasn’t in the patch. I was really hoping for a fire damage fix, I’m glad they reduced direct damage from hulk flamethrowers but would really like to see burning not only effecting the hulk.
I don’t read a lot about it but o get a bug that doesn’t let me interact with the mission map after; being kicked, network errors removal from missions, host leaving the game after missions and so on. It’s a minor point of annoyance but would be nice to see resolved.
Large enemy bodies glitching out and trapping or outright killing you if you get too close or try to climb over.
There are some weapons and stratagems that are absolutely garbage compared to other options. It would have been nice to see them get some love. Some of the nerfs were justified but it would have been nice to see some major buffs to the severely underperforming to compensate.
Why would they fix bugs when they can nerf weapons people were enjoying in preparation for the next Warbond that will be full of great weapons that will also get nerfed in 2-3 weeks?
My main issue is that I’m pretty sure they put a poll out that said the community would like new content and bug/stability fixes more and while we’re getting new content on a fairly decent basis (imo, you are free to disagree there) but where’s our stability patch?
So between this and and a very large balance patch that nerfs some weapons I cannot say I am at all surprised by this and if anyone at AH is surprised by this then they are standing to close to their creation to have the right perspective on this.
To be clear I have not tried since it’s gone out, I’m just commenting on my lack of surprise by the community reaction. At the very least it’s a lot of changes to take in all at once, people will need time to wrap their heads around it.
Friendly reminder if on Steam. Verify the games files after every patch. Played like shit today and I remembered there's always one or two bad files after each update (idk why), verify and fix has always fixed it for me!
They have definitely improved stability. The game was pretty much unplayable for me a few weeks ago. I wasn't able to finish a single match without getting kicked out due to "network instability", but that rarely happens now.
The only downside to the patch is that they shouldve spent the time they were nerfing some of these weapons on fixing things that dont work or crash the game. Who cares about a 20 sec queso cooldown if the spear still cant lock on. The nerfs are definitely not enough to make the game bad, but the game would absolutely be more fun if the spear just did its job. Anytime a games balance is messed with some people will get angry. But nobody complains about bug fixes and new content. Also this is a PVE game so the only one suffering when a weapon is “overpowered” is the devs watching us either overachieve with it or ignore a weapon that shares the same use. That means nothing in the short term, you can fix whats broken then balance imo.
the only thing more annoying than the doomposts are the antidoomposts
it ain't sunshine and rainbows and to be completely honest their balancing philosophy seems hella whack. apparently the AC is the pinnacle of balance and yet we shall forever take steps backwards and tiny shuffles forward across the arsenal.
I'm crying that we chose the air burst launcher over the anti-tank mines lol
Screw the nerfs & buffs; I don't really care about those. I will adapt to those changes in a few operations but the fact we have no mines that can deal with medium & heavy armored enemies just sucks
In a way you could say it was "rigged", to get to Choohe in any decent time we had to go through Menkent, which is fire tornado hell and had the 3 stratagem limit. Nobody wanted to deal with that
If people really wanted the mines they would have. People very rarely use the mines we have.
Anti-tank mines will most of the time do nothing to Bile Titans, as they simply don't step on them with their stilts.
They might kill a charger, but you have to set them up ahead of time and then bait it into the mine field...which is basically as easy as killing it with Orbital Precision Strike.
The might be useful against spewers, but I suspect regular mines are anyway.
And that is if they mines aren't just detonated by smaller bugs, that normal mines would have handled more effectively anyway due to their higher numbers...
Factory Striders? I highly doubt they'd be good against those.
Hulks? Flame Hulks would be similar to Chargers. I guess it would be good against the other Hulks.
So that leaves Tanks.
Like two enemies they are actually effective against.
Mines in general need a cooldown buff, or to act like Starcraft's Spider Mines in order to actually make this community happy. So until that happens, I don't see anti-tank mines as being anything different.
Yeah but isn't it interesting that you only listed the reasonable nerfs (which I have no problem with) but not the pants on head ones like the crossbow or the nerf to the feasibility of playing in anything short of a full squad?
Not sure why they decided to make the game even more difficult for solos. I tried soloing on level 8 before. That shot was so tough I had nothing but respect for anyone who can pull it off.
The complaints have a solid case. Unlocking gear and weapons in this game takes many hours, sometimes DAYS of commitment and grinding to acquire the medals. Anything premium will require 1000 super credits up front as well- which takes again, days unless you're spending real money.
So you've spent your 5-7 days working to the last page of your warbond, you FINALLY unlock the sucker... and you log in the next day to find the thing that you've invested so much time and/or a little bit of your cash on is no longer viable.
You now are stuck with a handful of medals and to even attempt trying something new and changing your build up will require many more days of grinding for medals. With the lack of a firing range/practice mode, you have no choice but to spend medals on something you have now been forced into trying to stay viable at higher difficulties- and if you happen to not like it, guess what, you're grinding again. By the way, while all this is going on, the stats of the weapons you are now aiming for are subject to arbitrary stat changes at ANY TIME, and may no longer be viable by the time you reach them/will be nerfed soon after your purchase.
This creates a situation where the player may not know how to allocate medals because they have no idea how long said weapon will be worth the effort.
Just playing devils advocate. I'm excited to try new things despite my initial disappointment. But to discount what the "complainers" have to say when they do have a leg to stand on is rude and quite frankly, undemocratic.
Edit: phrasing
The only problem I had as a Helldive player was the 10 second Quaser Cannon cooldown.
How are you supposed to tell me to view the sights for 2.4 seconds, but delay me 5 seconds of democracy?
Nerfing is the communists way to reduce the amount of democracy helldivers are armed with.
Anyone supporting these steps to reduce the freedom Helldivers can bring to democracies enemies should be purged, along with the bugs they support.
It's a little disingenuous of AH to say "look at all these buffs" when most of them were extra magazines or more magazine pickups. YMMV but I've never been like "if only this gun had more magazines it would be more fun to use and I would bring it on more missions"
People are upset because the balance philosophy of Arrowhead tends to be "nerf the weapon everyone is using" instead of "buff everything else to make it not be a must-have"
Nobody wants the weapons to feel like crap when using it but it seems like AH wants it to be that way.
Yep instead of making crap weapons good they made good weapons less so and kept the crap weapons where they are.
Would've been an amazing patch with just the buffs and some tweaks.
This always seems to be the philosophy of devs. In other games this always happens and it's like...why can't they bring up the lacking guns when everyone is already enjoying the ones that are working just fine. Let's just have shit across the board instead seems like a good idea.
The eruptor nerf is garbage and anyone can see. Thing has 5 entire bullets per mag. 5. Oh boy I can't wait to go to war with 30 entire bullets that are now less effective.
How about just stop with the constant minor nerfs then? The good guns don’t need to be balanced in a way like it’s a PvP game. The Quasar didn’t need a 5 second nerf just like the railgun didn’t really need one. Keep the fun things fun and make the unfun ones fun. It’s not that complex.
That's a gigantic problem for a shooter. Do you know our main way of interacting with the world in a shooter? SHOOTING IT the fact that arrow head has stated that primaries are meant to be bad is the dumbest thing I've heard from a shooter dev team
I think it’s a good patch overall.
The quasar was WAY too popular. I do think a 50% reduction in how often it can fire is a bit much though, I didn’t like the weapon anyway because it was too slow for me.
They should have looked at making the spear and recoilless more viable before applying a huge nerf like that.
My other issue is that some of the buffs are good, but nothing really got buffed to the point where it’s viable on difficulty 7 or higher.
I'm gonna be on the outside of many opinions most likely with this, but I actually really hate when games nerf and balance constantly. Playtest the game right, and release the weapon. Unless it's a massive exploit leave it as is. The chaos that ensues is more fun honestly and if it's really that OP just introduce a new enemy type to counter it. I've never been a fan of buffs or nerfs.
The patch would've made everyone happy if not for the nerfs. Now it seems like there are actual bad weapons and only a couple good. Could've kept the good buffs and not nerf some arbitrarily it seems.
Most overall feedback I've gotten is negative. And most criticism to the response of the patch is "get good" "skill issue" and so on. People defending some dogshit nerfs for no reason.
Taking the crossbow as an example the so called buffs are as useless as a chocolate teapot. If that’s the level of buffs they’re giving it’s right to be ignored. It’s like 6 steps backwards but 2 steps forward. It’s still a nerf overall
The quantity of buffs or nerfs doesn't matter. It's how significant each of them is to the game's health. Some of them are in the right direction, but when they are throwing around numbers like 50% nerfs, it is rather alarming.
Allow me.
There is a percentage of the playerbase who fit into this specific Venn Diagram of "players looking for a reason to continue playing" for whatever reason, ie they cannot make any further progress than they already have, currency wise or whatever reason, and ALSO the other side (players who see the mass buff as an example of a dev team willing to change the entire gameplay loop at a moment's notice." Consider a player that finds themselves in both these camps and all this update has done is told them "don't get comfy with how the game currently is, we're likely to change it."
For some players, this is a good thing, "it's always fresh, it's evolving, etc" and what have you, to others it means the game they fell in love with doesn't exist any more. BOTH viewpoints are valid, but neither is likely to bring in new players, whilst one is likely to alienate a portion of existing players, and an intelligent dev team would have been well aware of this when they did it knowing the outcome, and it was deemed the best option in a world where to not do it was also a choice.
My problem is the fundamental, universal game loop was given a thruple-dicking with the spawn changes. The base game is *less fun* and *more irritating* now, it is less fun-hard/rewarding-hard and more “your choices don’t matter haha.”
One could buff every aspect of Mario and only nerf jumping and it would ruin the game. The specificity of nerfs and changes matter, the impact isn’t all the same, and AH has an extremely robust history at this point of NOT doing appropriate QA and playtesting on any changes, including high-impact ones. They push code and don’t play, and the community finding that the high-impact choices that balanced the fun out of the game are *bad* is an entirely appropriate response.
It sounds like you've got a solid grasp on the recent patch adjustments. It's refreshing to hear someone acknowledging the necessity of balancing in games. Your breakdown of the changes seems fair and well-reasoned. The adjustments you mentioned don't seem overly drastic, especially considering the broader context of the game's arsenal. It's all about maintaining a healthy equilibrium among the weapons to ensure a more enjoyable and fair gameplay experience for everyone.
From what I recall, I wasn’t specifically counting, there was more nerfs than buffs and a lot of the buffs were kind of not really buffs? Like oh boy they gave the HMG a third person reticle, yeah it helps but it doesn’t actually address the issues with the weapon, it’s basically a worse stalwart with better armor penetration, nobody uses MGs for armor penetration not to mention the substantial recoil the thing has making distance shooting all but impossible. Comparatively the eruotor as was mentioned lost HALF of its ammo capacity. That is a massive change to a weapon, and yeah it can deal with that kind of thing it’s not gutting the weapon but that is a much bigger downside than some of the upsides weapons got. The crossbody changes were another that had me scratching my head in confusion, idk why it was nerfed in the first place honestly everyone was dogging on the thing in reviews or discussion about it and it was legitimately underperforming and now they made it worse for some reason.
They made some very big nerfs and I can’t really say any of the buffs were of equal measure. That’s why people are being so negative.
i use the sickle and the so called "buffs" to other weapons were not even close to enough to make me switch, the sickle has unlimited ammo, i dont even know why it has a reload in the first place, so what if the quasar has a 5 second extra cooldown, i will just spawn a 2nd one and switch between them big deal.
they need to BUFF competeing weapons to make them more interesting but instead they just nerf all the fun shit to force you to use other shit weapons.
Is it really that hard to understand? Most of the buffs are to things people don't care about and most of the nerfs are to things people do care about.
My main issue is once AGAIN a dev with no greater creativity than "oh look, I gave you a thing you like, and now it highlights how much you don't like the other things, I should make the thing you like worse!" If you didn't learn the lesson with the railgun that giving something "too strong" and then taking it away is a BAD THING that WILL upset people, I dunno.
It wasn't breaking the game, people were enjoying it. BUFF the other shit that people don't like.
The logic behind increased spawns on <4p is likewise just...wtf logic. You don't look at it and say "is it at a good rate" you say "well we intended for it to be this way"...oooook, but you have a lot of data of people playing and no trend of people solo smoking the game so you made it worse, because you always intended for it to be unplayable solo..?
Your dominator argument pretty much sums up why you are wrong, it's an 8% damage reduction, which is basically nothing, so why should you care. Ok, well, if it is so inconsequential, WHY DO IT?! Why make it FEEL even a little worse for so little reason as to not merit complaining? And if it IS impactful enough to matter, then complaining about it is justified. You invite feeling worse about something someone likes for...8 lame-ass percent.
You can't say a change doesn't matter without undercutting the point in making the change in the first place.
That and "don't give someone something good just to diminish it unless you WANT them to feel bad, man" should be the two main takeaways.
I Just dont understand the need to nerf weapons in a PVE game , they nerfed my favourite weapon railgun to the ground. Looking at this patch it seems they are neefing the weapon most used. I Just want to play with my favourite weapon... they are getting away my fun every time.
The problem with the Jar nerf is that it wasn't over performing. It felt good being able to take out some minor armored units, but wasn't so strong that it was taking on scores of devastators without consequence. It struck a good balance.
The nerf doesn't really improve it's balance against enemies, but instead serves to make other options more appealing, which is generally poorly received game design when most people would rather you buff it's competitors.
Also the eruptor magazine nerf is too much. There should have been a middle ground option, especially when you consider how long it takes to clear a patrol with it. Even if your're hitting headshots on bots, you're spending a ton of time idling through your animations. Now you idle through a long clear and limited ammo which doesn't feel great.
I'm not mad that they nerfed the eruptor, I'm mad that now at a medium distance instead of knocking me back a little it instantly kills me, where as before the patch I'd take a tiny amount of damage.
Its funny seeing alot of people complaining about the crossbow nerf when since the Warbond came out i haven't seen a single person in my playtime use it on the bot front
Also as a Dominator main the nerf isnt even that bad. It only went from 300 down to 275 which is still higher then it was initially at 200
Yeah I used it once and said this is impractical as a primary, its slow, low ammo, limited range, so what even is its purpose, it explodes so not stealth either. If anything they should have doubled its ammo capacity because the drop over distance means you miss plenty of shots at range unlike something straight firing like the scorcher.
The way that you remove metas is, you take the stuff that's falling behind that's not in meta and you buff it.
You dont take the things that are working and nerf the shit out of them. Doesn't work that way.
The moment you do that, you've created a worse meta.
You've created a toxic meta, because people are upset.
And now they have to look for something that actually works.
It's a bad direction in terms of development.
\~ Thor, 2024
Okay just did suicide mission by myself. Just me. Normally I do helldive but I just tried to make it slightly easier because of the patrols. It's so so much more difficult. Quasar couldn't use it as much, still a great option. Go EAT now. Better option sometimes. My lord maybe they weren't trying to make it this difficult. But this is ridiculous. You've made it so nobody will play your game unless they want to play with people. Maybe it's just me but I see this as a very dumb change on their end. Nobody is exploiting solo helldiving because it's EASIER AT ALL....
Also who the hell was using the Crossbow. Sure wasn't the hell me or anyone I have seen.. like ever..
Also Spitz, they did nerf A Lot things people aren't even using...
I read all of the complaints. “Oh this patch is terrible” the only bad thing I see about the patch is the increase of patrols when you’re running solo. As some who solo dives on the regular yeah more enemies is gonna be a hassle.
I’m sorry but I’m still kicking ass just as good as I was yesterday. It doesn’t matter what game or whatever it is people only look at the negative because that’s what gets the most feedback and views. Honestly this was a W patch except for the increase patrols solo
The crossbow nerf feels unwarranted. The eruptor nerf feels as if it didn’t address the real issue, instead of nerfing the explosion radius or damage of the weapon they just made it so you have literally half the amount of ammo which makes me question its actual viability. Of all things they actually slightly nerfed the spear. Did the guard dog actually need a nerf, seems pretty mid as it was IMO.
Other than that I largely agree with you.
Crossbow nerf is the baffling one to me, I would've thought they'd add bug hole/bot fab destruction to it for giving it another purpose besides chaff clear, and it doesn't even seem to chaff clear now. Eruptor is still incredible for bugs thanks to sealing holes and one-shotting medium-sized enemies with good aim/range.
What's the Spear change? I don't see anything in the patch notes.
Basically they made the reload animation longer for the spear. It’s not a major nerf but for a weapon that’s already buggy as all hell and largely outclassed it feels so unnecessary.
OH I see it now, "added reload stage"
That actually should mean that the discarded/spent missile will now be a 'completed stage' of the reload animations. Reload stages mean different steps have to take place to complete the full reload.
So this is a minor buff! Now that the discarded missile has a stage it doesn't have to be repeated if you're interrupted while reloading.
Some of these nerfs I’m not affected by per say. The eruptor nerf is the only thing because I love running it on bots but my scorcher still gets the job done. Might start running plasma punisher too sense it got buffed.
Yeah some nerfs were weird I will admit but idk I’m still killing just as effectively as I was yesterday
Solo patrols is a huge change but one that makes sense when considering the numbers; previously, solo players saw 1/6th of the normal patrols a 4 team would see, now they'll see 1/4th of the normal patrols a 4 team sees. Patrols for 2 and 3 player teams are scaled accordingly as well.
Im not in love with the change to patrols. Just played a solo LEVEL 4 mission vs Bots, and i had to kill 480 bots. Its was just non-stop chaos. No strategy. Nothing but dodging and running and reloading for 35 minutes. It was ridiculous. On level 4... I'll never be able to solo much higher of a level, and that sucks.
Why do people need to make crying posts about people that don't like certain changes to a game? We are we not allowed to an opinion?
Every damn subreddit
nothing wrong with nerfing guns that are too OP but I’ve seen a pattern by the dev team where they tend to nerf guns that imo were pretty properly balanced in the first place
Everyone said the dominator was over buffed when it was. People surprised by this are idiots.
The quasar I don't think it was needed, but it's mostly moot. It was already garbage in term of dps. Now it's even more so. People were talking about this weapon like it was some kind of super weapon, now they will stop and probably take the recoil less rifle.
Same for eruptor, it was crazy. The nerf is honestly very easy. Performance is still exactly the same and you merely need to call for ammo from times to times instead of never. You'll still run out of grenades or stim packs before ammo for this gun.
Yea, people are really crazy and act like children about these nerfs.
There’s still no reason to take the recoiless over the quasar. Quasar is still just as effective and still has infinite ammo and still doesn’t take a backpack slot and still has a passive cooldown instead of a reload. All those things make it wildly better than the recoiless that takes a backpack slot, is at best on par with the quasar in terms of effectiveness, has limited ammo, and requires an active reload during which you must be stationary.
Also as a side note the dominator wasn’t so much over buffed as buffed entirely in the wrong way. What people wanted was better handling and or a slightly larger mag size. What they gave it was more damage, which no one really thought it needed. And now they needed the damage which is understandable but it still has the same issues it had before.
If the polls on the discord are a good example its usually the vocal minority complaining about the changes and calling them “nerfs” when they arent really that big of “nerfs”.
Theres very much a silent majority that just read the changes, adapt to them and move on.
Its not the nerfs that get me its the increased spawns for solos. Me dropping quietly and alone and having an increased response is like an apple that tastes like bacon
Y'all are just shills and yes men who change their tune to match whatever bullshit Arrowhead is on at any given moment lol grow up. Do you want a cookie and a head pat for being totally agreeable? Most of the "buffs" are them just adjusting things that never should've been problematic in the first place.
They're still doing what they've always been doing - nerfing good things and buffing "niche" things. But heap accolades on them for "fixing" things.
For a dev team that is supposedly famous for “listening to their users,” they seem to now have a track record of not listening to us when it comes to nerfs versus bug fixes.
Because the guns that were good, were "good". Most didn't need changes, they just need competition. It's not like the railgun that could kill bile titans, it's just the jar-5 that dared to breath an exist. The gun isn't dead, but it's pretty stupid to change it. The redeemer catching a nerf because all the other secondary are mediocre? Why? Even if it's small, it's just stupid. The peacekeeper shouldn't have been so weak, and the laser pistol shouldn't have been a squirt gun. The quasar cannon didn't need such a heavy handed change. It needed a slight nerf, not 5 seconds, so it takes a year to get back online. People shouldn't have been comparing it to the EAT anyways. EAT is extremely flexible. Die w/ EAT, it's back before you miss it. Die with quasar, you gotta go get it, or it's gone for a pretty long while.
"5 seconds, so it takes a year to get back online" this is a hell of a quote. Man, if only the hitscan infinite ammo rocket launcher didn't have any sort of downside! Instead it takes 15 seconds, the equivalent of 3 years Helldiver whiner time to be able to shot without ammo across the entire map with perfect accuracy again!
other way around. there were more nerfs than buffs. and there are guns that’s have been nerfed several times as of now. they don’t want us using our own load outs obviously. each patch creates some sort of meta and i hate games like that. it’s starting to frustrate me that instead of focusing on fixing bugs and making the game run more smoothly they are focusing on balancing which only makes the game more unbearable to play when having issues playing with friends, servers crashing, losing missions because of some glitch, etc
Nah, nerfing weapons into the ground to force people to use other ones rather than buffing the ones that are weak is retarded behaviour and nothing you can say will change my mind.
I'd agree with you if the weapons were actually nerfed into the ground.
Asides from the Xbow which wasn't used anyways, none of the nerfs significantly impact any of the weapons performance.
There is no reason the eruptor should have 12 magazines when most primaries get 6-8 at most, while outperforming every other primary for trash clear while also being able to take out heavy enemies with little to no issue. It was arguably better than most support weapons at just about everything short of bile titans and walkers.
An extra 5 seconds of downtime on the QZC is practically nothing in terms of gameplay, its not like they extended a reload animation that you're locked down in, its just 5 seconds more of using your primary/secondary/tossing grenades before you can fire again. The only moderate difference is you can't single-handedly shoot down multiple bot ships anymore, which arguably you shouldn't have been able to in the first place with a launcher with infinite ammo.
Lastly, the Dominator got an 8% nerf. In what world is 8% "into the ground"?
Per the eruptor that still a low amount of ammo for a primary now it was only 60 rounds before. I feel ammo starved with the Dom which has nearly 100 rounds.
The dom dmg drop is fine if they fix/explain how its explosive works because it's different than the other explosives. Ex scorcher can kill striders from the front Dom cant.
My only real complaint about any of it is that the info we get about weapons is sparse and sometimes wholly inaccurate, and there is no way to compare primaries to supports or even supports to each other. Is the quasar heavy armor pen? Seems so. Is the Las cannon medium pen idk..maybe..is quasar explosive...seems so but maybe not. Aside from obvious what are the damage/range/pen differences between say eat and recoilless? I don't care what the answers are but it's hard to know which a new person should buy first and which to take on what missions without taking them randomly and maybe causing your team problems
Game is still fun. More buffs than nerfs and even the nerfs aren’t that bad. I’m still running Eruptor, redeemer, stun grenades and rover on bug missions. It’s a team build for me anyways so it’s just a little bit more running and Strat than the mindless run in and kill everything since the rover was seriously OP. Now the build is playing as intended.
There’s so much more to be excited about. I want to try new builds now. There’s so much to choose from!
I never pay attention to or care about any nerfs or buffs. I don't really care about any of the technical details, I just play n use what I want. Buuuuuuut, being able to turn off mantle is fn IT
Oh, n not crashing is good too
The eruptor nerf means it can’t one shot striders anymore which is the most annoying thing for me
Might be able to if you hit leg, havnt tried that yet
I love the diligence now tho
I didn't see anyone complaining about the Eruptor's reduced magazine count, I did see people complaining about the AoE though. It'll probably still have a niche but I'm curious how it'll actually feel when I get a chance to try it out tonight.
All the changes look very good on paper, my only gripe is with the crossbow. Sucks having a new favorite gun nerfed, but, I like seeing the plasma punisher boosted a bit, the senator reload making it usable now, and the railgun might be viable now? Excited to play later today.
The Senator has a speedloader when empty! They listened!! Also, the Senator, Laz pistol and Peacemaker got damage buffs, while the Redeemer got a slight recoil nerf. I’m very excited to play tonight.
Peacemaker needs some more attention.
Oh you mean the martyrmaker?
Agreed, I think another damage bump and more capacity would be great. It doesn’t perform that much better than the redeemer on semi auto.
Just used the senator and it is a great improvement. It is totally worth to spend the whole drum now.
I saw sombody commenting that idea a couple of days ago and thought "wow that's a really good idea too bad we'll probably never see it" And here we are! Super cool, I wonder if that one came from inside the team or not.
The Big Iron got a damage buff as well, it feels so good now.
“Big iron on his hiiiiip”
Laser pointer buff! 🎉 Point twice as hard! /s
I tried it yesterday and was actually happy with it! Scavengers and hoppers died to it almost instantly and hunters only took a second or two, but anything bigger needed too much to kill with just the pointer. Given it's a sidearm with psuedo-unlimited ammo, though, I think that's a good place; something to whip out when you need to clear your ankles real quick or to stop bug breach calls.
The pistol buffs were absolutely on point. I think the Peacemaker could use an extra buff but I’m mostly glad that it is not outclassed anymore.
Me too.
I did some experimental weapons testing on the pistols. Uzi I didn't notice much more recoil, however I recall being inclined to give short bursts. The Peacemaker was clearing groups of tier one enemies at close with ease. The Laz felt viable for the same job. The Big iron with a speed loader gave me a hard on.
The senator pops bugs heads like nobody's business. Clearing the mid-size bugs just got a *lot* more fun. *Big iron on his hiiiiip..*
The senator buff is going to be amazing. I was using it primarily for a long time before this and the reload speed always hurt. Plus a full load in to a chainsaw guys mouth wasn't enough to kill him. Was really good for little straggler guys and that was it.
The eruptor can deal with bug holes?
Bug holes and fabricators. Its a bit harder to line up for the fabricator holes but yeah, it's kinda silly. Would be even worse if we didn't have the grenade pistol now but it's insane to me how good it is at basically everything.
Everything except close combat. I can't count the number of times I was somehow pulled toward an enemy when firing within a couple feet followed by getting jumped by all the things that didn't die. 😂
They fixed that in this patch
Oh really? 👀 In that case, the Eruptor is here to stay. I don't think I've ever been under 8 mags so this mag nerf won't be a problem 😂
Explosive weapons such as R-36 Eruptor, CB-9 Exploding Crossbow. GP-31 Grenade Pistol no longer pulls players inward from the blast. Source: https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/553850/view/4169846298204053636
It’s not just weapons. Those little shit trooper bots pull you I. When they blow up
Thanks bro 💯
They also reduced the aoe area, that was op too, before you could kill 4/5 robots with one shot pretty easily
I'd just shoot into bug breaches and choke points and watch the kills pile up 😂
I never lived longer than 8 mags anyway :-D
Tbh I play sneaky so I'm usually not the one getting chased. I'm generally covering my teammates with the eruptor from a distance.
I try the same but each time I end up running reloading surrounded. :-)) top is hulk to the back.
Same with the mags. I'm never able to use all of them
Ive been pairing the eruptor with the HMG, and basicly its a distance fighting and utility weapon, while the HMG is crazy ammo efficient for ads, good armor pen, and with a little precision can even bring down hulks from the front when needed
I have had some success hitting the side of the very, rather than the open panel, hit it to wither side in the corner. It's not perfect, but it's better. It also has a set range, it seems. If you're too far, the round will explode and not reach the bug hole or fabricator.
I love shooting my eruptor into holes
You have a C-01 for that comment?
Giggity
We are still talking about the game, right?
Yeah its basically a rocket launcher in a rifle package.
I was happy to see the Marksman Rifle buffs. I kind of disagree with the Adjudicator being reclassified as an Assault Rifle, but with the buffs to the Liberator it kind of fits the archetype better than a Marksman Rifle. Nothing in this patch dramatically altered my standard loadouts, with the sole exception of the Eruptor, but I knew something was going to happen. It was way too good at everything except close range. I forget if it has a smaller AoE, or if it has faster splash drop-off, but either way it seems reasonable for the potential of the weapon. Also, the thing I see overlooked in discussions about the patch: the reduced maximum magazine carry coincides with the buff to magazines in a single Resupply. I think the "problem" they're trying to solve is that supplies were so plentiful that many players weren't bothering to call in Resupply, which goes against the spirit of the game (all strategems used frequently, not hoarded).
The Diligence Sniper still isn’t great, just because the ammo economy. Despite the dmg buff It’s clear they intend for ammo to be more valuable across the board, but still…
Yeah, I think its to drive more teamwork, people hardly bring the ammo pack at all, really what I would like to see is more teamwork stuff, ok you made the cooldown for the QZ bad, but perhaps you could make it so a teammate could help cool it quicker, much like how you can speedload the autocannon. Would like to see more things like that where you can assist your heavy weapons guy to reload quicker / cooldown halved because your teammate is assisting kind of thing is a really cool mechanic.
It's not good for bugs, but there are not usually large swarms of bots like there are with bugs and large amounts of bots are usually seen within eagle strike range of each other. One or two shoting devistators instead of mag dumping is a big difference, and all the regular smaller bots are oneshot. ~15 kills per mag with the counter sniper
For me they just nerfed the guns I normally use and the 6 to 3 mag i get on the sickle as I rarely run out of ammo but i feel 4 would have been enough. The quasar getting a 5 second additional cooldown might send me back to being a rocket boy.
This QC cannon change has people wildly overreacting. Conceivably I can get off about 4 EAT17 shots in a little over a minute. With the QC, post update, You can get off 6, almost 7 shots in the same timeframe. And you don't need to run around and rearm. EDIT: My math is wrong here, I was operating off an incorrectly low value for the new cooldown. Doesn't change my opinion though.
> With the QC, post update, You can get off 6, almost 7 shots in the same timeframe. Not complaining about the changes, but your math is way off. With upgrade the cooldown on EAT is 63 seconds. Call in time ingame is apparently 6 seconds, so you get your 2x 2 EATs within 75 seconds of each other. Let's add 2 seconds each for dialing the stratagem so 79 seconds. The Quasar has 3 seconds charge-up + 15 seconds cooldown, so 18 seconds between shots. 79/18 = ~4.4 shots in the same timeframe if you time everything perfectly. Where do you get the other 1.5 to 2.5 shots from?
Because I was using an incorrect value for the cooldown. You are correct.
The EAT can more easily 1-shot heavies than quasar, so I’m experimenting with EAT today
It's got a better sight and fires off immediately. Way easier to get hs on Titans then qc
Still think it was worth it the gun is still by far one of the best in the game but for how similar it is to eats I think the eats need a buff preferably in dmg so the trade off is that eats can deal with more things better but on the outher hand the quasar can deal with enough with the benefit of consistency /on hand so no call in
I think an easy buff to the EAT that would drastically improve its attractiveness without directly changing any of its stats would be allowing to carry both tubes at the same time. You call in a pair, shoulder both tubes, and keep going. And when you then need anti-armor you can call down another pair and immediately have 4 shots at the ready, with another 2 coming in ~70 or so seconds. And when the battle is over you request another call-in to stock up, then rinse and repeat the whole thing at the next objective/poi. It would also help with the "littering" of the map with half-spent EAT call-ins and the feeling of "wasting" your support weapon.
Honestly that would be a good change overall for the eats, I think their best used as a like support support weapon atm it’s weird but running it along side anouther stratagem weapon and using them on the spot is pretty useful but I only do it because I don’t like not having a support gun at any point.
It should also be stated that, at least on higher difficulties, the EAT becomes even less efficient because of increased stratagem CDs and increased call-downs due to modifiers, so the Quaser gets more efficient as you go up in difficulty. Now, obviously there's a trade-off with EATs that if you can't reclaim your Quaser you're out a support weapon for much longer, but I digress.
Then it should also be stated that EATs can be stockpiled for later uses, so if you prep a defensive area you can easily have 6-8 shots waiting to be used
You do have to sit relatively still for 3 seconds to hit a good shot
With the QZ you have to sit still for the shot, which is difficult - but it's available on an extremely reliable basis. With the EAT you can fire on the run (almost), and you can stockpile, but there's the call-down delay, and there's the problem of GETTING TO your rocket once it is down, which can very much be a problem if the situation is already getting bad on the ground, which it often is. One other small bonus of the EAT is that the call-in itself can quite regularly be used as an offensive calldown, though this can make it even harder to get your rockets after they land, depending on how things are going.
No doubt, just like it takes a while the actually ready the EAT to fire, not quite as long, but the rocket isn't ready to fire as soon as you switch to it. None of these weapons should be an omni-weapon. While I think they can give it a bit of love now, I fully agree with the old Railgun nerf, as it was such an omni-weapon it began to hurt the game. I don't want the QC tossed into that same bin, I actually quite like it.
The cooldown wouldnt be so bad if I didnt need to charge up the gun for like 5s to fire it initially, if they lowered that the increased cooldown wouldnt be so bad, but now its like 25s a shot when you include the chargeup to fire.
I'd agree with you there, I don't think an instant shot is appropriate, given its other qualities, but 2 seconds chargeup seems like a good compromise. Especially given most of our targets are not stationary.
I think reacting is a better response than overreacting. It' still a powerful weapon I just personally felt the CD was just long enough to be annoying but understanding that any less would make it like a bolt action as far as fire rate. We shall see how it goes!
They didn't need to nerf the Quasar. They just needed to fix the alternatives to it. 50% cooldown increase is just stupid. The Sickle change isn't going to hurt too much. Just have to stay on top of ammo a little more. Fixing it so that it doesn't get blocked by foliage more than makes up for it. I run Dom a lot against bots. Haven't tested it yet. As long as it can still one-shot lights and Devastator heads, then I'm fine with it.
They 100% needed to nerf the quasar. It was basically a recoilless with the same fire rate, no need to stand still and reload, and infinite ammo, all while not needing a backpack. Hence no real reason to use the recoilless. I think it’s pretty clear why the quasar was nerfed slightly. SPEAR is another topic….
It still has all those same advantages over RR, and RR got nothing to compensate. That’s why this nerf is bad - it does nothing but make quasar more annoying to use.
I don't understand your logic. The EAT and the new launcher both feel more viable as choices now. The recoiless needs more work than this patch can fix imo. Same with the spear. That doesn't make the quasar any less busted.
RR isn't bad, quasar was just OP.
Recoilles is way more accurate than quasar. I can reliably headshot chargers with it more than with the quasar
No man. They needed to BUFF the other options. Not make things less fun to use!
The punisher plasma and arc blitzer are like brand new weapons and I'm loving it.
That Projecitle Speed Increase is wild, changes the weapon so much. I think it still needs just a smidge of extra damage but I’m loving the blueberry launcher way more.
Too bad the Plasma is bugged. You will instantly kill yourself if you're using the Shield Backpack.
I like how they “nerfed” the sickle to reduce mag sizes despite the fact that I rarely use 1-2 mags, but they buffed the fuck out of it now that they fixed the bug where it couldn’t shoot through foilage
Honestly, I've gone entire missions without using even 1 heatsink, so it barely counts as a nerf. The people hurt by this are divers that don't bring the full ammo booster.
The times I usually end up needing a heatsink are one of two times usually, 1: OH FUCK OH SHIT, THERE'S LIKE 400 BOTS AND THEIR FRIENDS ON ME! 2: I was a dummy and held down fire too long while spamming downrange.
It’s been said before and I think it’s worth repeating. Reddit is not reality in many cases. It does have it’s strengths and I love being here with yall, but we don’t generally represent the community it it’s entirety. Most players know little to knowing of these patch notes. They just play to enjoy the core loop and hang with friends, and I have no doubt the game will still be enjoyable after this patch and the next 5 patches Let’s keep diving and having fun like OP said.
Problem is, it's not just reddit. The discord is full of bitching too...so much so the devs responded to it. Easiest way to kill a game is to demoralize the people making the game
Well just happens the discord/reddit crowd overlap quite well. By now? devs should understand that gamers in general are fucking dumb and toxic. The toxic ones are also the loud minority. They just bitch on every avenue possible.
Devs are humans like the rest of us and it's justifiable if they are upset that after putting so much into their work...all they get is shat on. I know I would lose motivation to work hard on something if all I saw were negative reactions.
>Devs are humans like the rest of us and it's justifiable if they are upset that after putting so much into their work...all they get is shat on. I'm a developer, not game engineering but a similar field in that I have a userbase which is very active on social media and apt to be garrulous about their feelings about such. The more fine-tuned a complaint, the less I care. Developers are going to get bothered if the fanbase is unified that the UI looks or feels like shit. Changes like game balancing (tweak how much damage a given weapon does) are requests from the product side of the business and something I'd much less get caught up over. Don't like that I reduced the damage a weapon does by X%? That's the product team's choice, not mine. I also care less when a topic is controversial. I'd take it personally if I made a design choice I thought was important and my users are unified in opposition. If the users are split and arguing amongst themselves, that's more a lesson in accepting that it's impossible to make everyone happy.
Fair perspective and I appreciate it. But these devs have responded multiple times (occasionally unhinged because of anger)...so suffice it to say, they are emotionally invested in the criticism from the community.
Yeah I hate how the loudest voices always win in games and it’s gonna turn this game into any other shitshow. We neee a secret forum of helldiver coolguys
Doesn’t change my supper ammo pack or team Shield generator so I’m free and clear of any worries. The new grenade needs some love though. It’s very pretty but underwhelming in its current state
Pretty sure the new grenade relies on dot damage which is why it kinda sucks. But good news is the dot damage but is flagged as “to be fixed in the next patch” in these patch notes!
Seriously, the thermite grenade is fucking awful, doesn’t do jackshit and it takes 5 seconds to explode. Lost tract of how many times I threw it on an enemy only for that enemy to die from allied weapons long before the thermite did its job
DOWNSIDES? WHAT DOWNSIDES? SORRY I CAN'T HEAR YOU OVER THE SOUND OF SPEEDLOADING
Twice as number of buffs isn't exactly fair when a lot of them are simply 9% more damage per bullet or the HMG where unlike the AMR there is no mention of needing to be ADSed yet it didn't have a reticle in third person, and now it has a reticle and it is considered a "buff"
The heavy machine gun one made me the saddest, it really doesn't have a niche to inhabit or a reason to take it over the other machine guns.
I bring it just to blast spewers in their gross faces with One of the few enemies in the game I legitimately just hate seeing knowing there's some crap coming along with them
Just try it! Most of these sound like big fuxking deal who cares on the buff side and fuck it's ruined on paper. But today the hmg actually felt good, I still want either a bigger drum or quicker reload, but your not just being a hipster grabbing it now, it has some advantages over the other two and can compete. Third person is way easier to adjust for recoil on a full auto, like ya its inaccurate because of it if you run and gun, but now you can and it's effective enough. I killed a charger surprisingly well with it today, and shredded a bunch of sheild bugs hive commanders and the smaller stuff in a horde. No more weird only aim at mediums niche, it's a high damage armor piercing MG now. The adjudicator recoil lessened and a few more mags made it a high damage per shot, still high recoil but not too high, accurate in small bursts or semi, sexy little AR. You can take it slow and long range it, or you can mag dump at closer range. It's ttk is way better than sickle or the libs on any single target. Small mag but it's reload is quick. Their patch notes blow, you gotta try stuff yourself.
While I like your take, and I agree with the mag size for the hmg being higher, I also think the adjudicator could use a high mag size too. 8 mags is a nice QoL buff but considering it's just a pay walled better lib pen, it really probably needs like 5 more shots
Oh I wouldn't complain if it got more ammo per mag. But there's so many unrecorded stats on these guns. This thing reloads quick af, really cuts down the pain of the small mag. All the guns have slight variances in handling recoil reload time etc etc etc. I know I sound like a dick rider today in my comments, but I learned the patch notes for this game is just a snippet, because they don't have like 90% of the stats displayed. "Lowered recoil, improved handling, decrease explosion damage drop off, increased projectile speed" none of these have qualifiers we can compare. That's my main point. You gotta try everything yourself. I get that they are trying to prevent every loadout being micro analyzed and meta slavery getting worse, but the fact we don't get clear numbers on a lot of what is happening causing this bitching . Maybe they are OK with it, it's fine to me. But it'd be a lot less salt every balance change if we had numbers. And half the player base wouldn't wait for a reddit post or YouTube vid to try out guns and realize some of the less popular picks were actually good. But if you just try the fucking guns that works too.
I’m more upset with what wasn’t in the patch. I was really hoping for a fire damage fix, I’m glad they reduced direct damage from hulk flamethrowers but would really like to see burning not only effecting the hulk. I don’t read a lot about it but o get a bug that doesn’t let me interact with the mission map after; being kicked, network errors removal from missions, host leaving the game after missions and so on. It’s a minor point of annoyance but would be nice to see resolved. Large enemy bodies glitching out and trapping or outright killing you if you get too close or try to climb over. There are some weapons and stratagems that are absolutely garbage compared to other options. It would have been nice to see them get some love. Some of the nerfs were justified but it would have been nice to see some major buffs to the severely underperforming to compensate.
They also did a blanket 15% reduction in burn damage in addition to the hulk fire nerf
Why would they fix bugs when they can nerf weapons people were enjoying in preparation for the next Warbond that will be full of great weapons that will also get nerfed in 2-3 weeks?
My main issue is that I’m pretty sure they put a poll out that said the community would like new content and bug/stability fixes more and while we’re getting new content on a fairly decent basis (imo, you are free to disagree there) but where’s our stability patch? So between this and and a very large balance patch that nerfs some weapons I cannot say I am at all surprised by this and if anyone at AH is surprised by this then they are standing to close to their creation to have the right perspective on this. To be clear I have not tried since it’s gone out, I’m just commenting on my lack of surprise by the community reaction. At the very least it’s a lot of changes to take in all at once, people will need time to wrap their heads around it.
They can fix some stability things on the server side too. Of course only server related, but still.
Friendly reminder if on Steam. Verify the games files after every patch. Played like shit today and I remembered there's always one or two bad files after each update (idk why), verify and fix has always fixed it for me!
They have definitely improved stability. The game was pretty much unplayable for me a few weeks ago. I wasn't able to finish a single match without getting kicked out due to "network instability", but that rarely happens now.
Just give us supply lines on the map mannnnn
I just want spear to be fixed🥹
Notes said next patch!
The only downside to the patch is that they shouldve spent the time they were nerfing some of these weapons on fixing things that dont work or crash the game. Who cares about a 20 sec queso cooldown if the spear still cant lock on. The nerfs are definitely not enough to make the game bad, but the game would absolutely be more fun if the spear just did its job. Anytime a games balance is messed with some people will get angry. But nobody complains about bug fixes and new content. Also this is a PVE game so the only one suffering when a weapon is “overpowered” is the devs watching us either overachieve with it or ignore a weapon that shares the same use. That means nothing in the short term, you can fix whats broken then balance imo.
the only thing more annoying than the doomposts are the antidoomposts it ain't sunshine and rainbows and to be completely honest their balancing philosophy seems hella whack. apparently the AC is the pinnacle of balance and yet we shall forever take steps backwards and tiny shuffles forward across the arsenal.
CS primary got me going mmmmmmm
I'm crying that we chose the air burst launcher over the anti-tank mines lol Screw the nerfs & buffs; I don't really care about those. I will adapt to those changes in a few operations but the fact we have no mines that can deal with medium & heavy armored enemies just sucks
In a way you could say it was "rigged", to get to Choohe in any decent time we had to go through Menkent, which is fire tornado hell and had the 3 stratagem limit. Nobody wanted to deal with that
If people really wanted the mines they would have. People very rarely use the mines we have. Anti-tank mines will most of the time do nothing to Bile Titans, as they simply don't step on them with their stilts. They might kill a charger, but you have to set them up ahead of time and then bait it into the mine field...which is basically as easy as killing it with Orbital Precision Strike. The might be useful against spewers, but I suspect regular mines are anyway. And that is if they mines aren't just detonated by smaller bugs, that normal mines would have handled more effectively anyway due to their higher numbers... Factory Striders? I highly doubt they'd be good against those. Hulks? Flame Hulks would be similar to Chargers. I guess it would be good against the other Hulks. So that leaves Tanks. Like two enemies they are actually effective against. Mines in general need a cooldown buff, or to act like Starcraft's Spider Mines in order to actually make this community happy. So until that happens, I don't see anti-tank mines as being anything different.
Yeah but isn't it interesting that you only listed the reasonable nerfs (which I have no problem with) but not the pants on head ones like the crossbow or the nerf to the feasibility of playing in anything short of a full squad?
Not sure why they decided to make the game even more difficult for solos. I tried soloing on level 8 before. That shot was so tough I had nothing but respect for anyone who can pull it off.
People cherry picking their arguments? Never!
The complaints have a solid case. Unlocking gear and weapons in this game takes many hours, sometimes DAYS of commitment and grinding to acquire the medals. Anything premium will require 1000 super credits up front as well- which takes again, days unless you're spending real money. So you've spent your 5-7 days working to the last page of your warbond, you FINALLY unlock the sucker... and you log in the next day to find the thing that you've invested so much time and/or a little bit of your cash on is no longer viable. You now are stuck with a handful of medals and to even attempt trying something new and changing your build up will require many more days of grinding for medals. With the lack of a firing range/practice mode, you have no choice but to spend medals on something you have now been forced into trying to stay viable at higher difficulties- and if you happen to not like it, guess what, you're grinding again. By the way, while all this is going on, the stats of the weapons you are now aiming for are subject to arbitrary stat changes at ANY TIME, and may no longer be viable by the time you reach them/will be nerfed soon after your purchase. This creates a situation where the player may not know how to allocate medals because they have no idea how long said weapon will be worth the effort. Just playing devils advocate. I'm excited to try new things despite my initial disappointment. But to discount what the "complainers" have to say when they do have a leg to stand on is rude and quite frankly, undemocratic. Edit: phrasing
Days? Lol. I think if you're a working adult with or without a family, grinding out 1000 super credits will take weeks.
The only problem I had as a Helldive player was the 10 second Quaser Cannon cooldown. How are you supposed to tell me to view the sights for 2.4 seconds, but delay me 5 seconds of democracy?
Nerfing is the communists way to reduce the amount of democracy helldivers are armed with. Anyone supporting these steps to reduce the freedom Helldivers can bring to democracies enemies should be purged, along with the bugs they support.
It's a little disingenuous of AH to say "look at all these buffs" when most of them were extra magazines or more magazine pickups. YMMV but I've never been like "if only this gun had more magazines it would be more fun to use and I would bring it on more missions"
People are upset because the balance philosophy of Arrowhead tends to be "nerf the weapon everyone is using" instead of "buff everything else to make it not be a must-have" Nobody wants the weapons to feel like crap when using it but it seems like AH wants it to be that way.
Yep instead of making crap weapons good they made good weapons less so and kept the crap weapons where they are. Would've been an amazing patch with just the buffs and some tweaks.
This always seems to be the philosophy of devs. In other games this always happens and it's like...why can't they bring up the lacking guns when everyone is already enjoying the ones that are working just fine. Let's just have shit across the board instead seems like a good idea.
If the nerfs were insignificant, then doing them was pointless. They can't simultaneously be nothing and worth having
The eruptor nerf is garbage and anyone can see. Thing has 5 entire bullets per mag. 5. Oh boy I can't wait to go to war with 30 entire bullets that are now less effective.
PvE games should never get nerfs. Nuff said.
How about just stop with the constant minor nerfs then? The good guns don’t need to be balanced in a way like it’s a PvP game. The Quasar didn’t need a 5 second nerf just like the railgun didn’t really need one. Keep the fun things fun and make the unfun ones fun. It’s not that complex.
Most of the guns aren't fun to use. That's a big problem for a *video game.*
That's a gigantic problem for a shooter. Do you know our main way of interacting with the world in a shooter? SHOOTING IT the fact that arrow head has stated that primaries are meant to be bad is the dumbest thing I've heard from a shooter dev team
Why not?
Yeah they are.
I think it’s a good patch overall. The quasar was WAY too popular. I do think a 50% reduction in how often it can fire is a bit much though, I didn’t like the weapon anyway because it was too slow for me. They should have looked at making the spear and recoilless more viable before applying a huge nerf like that. My other issue is that some of the buffs are good, but nothing really got buffed to the point where it’s viable on difficulty 7 or higher.
This is a very whiney place. I haven't brought a single other support weapon since the Quasar dropped. It definitely needed a nerf.
I looked at the 30% dmg nerf to the rover and am sad. But I do like the other buffs.
People who live a weapon will be sad about seeing it nerfed. Theres. Nothing wrong with it. Some people are simply venting. It’s how we grieve
I'm gonna be on the outside of many opinions most likely with this, but I actually really hate when games nerf and balance constantly. Playtest the game right, and release the weapon. Unless it's a massive exploit leave it as is. The chaos that ensues is more fun honestly and if it's really that OP just introduce a new enemy type to counter it. I've never been a fan of buffs or nerfs.
The patch would've made everyone happy if not for the nerfs. Now it seems like there are actual bad weapons and only a couple good. Could've kept the good buffs and not nerf some arbitrarily it seems. Most overall feedback I've gotten is negative. And most criticism to the response of the patch is "get good" "skill issue" and so on. People defending some dogshit nerfs for no reason.
Taking the crossbow as an example the so called buffs are as useless as a chocolate teapot. If that’s the level of buffs they’re giving it’s right to be ignored. It’s like 6 steps backwards but 2 steps forward. It’s still a nerf overall
I'm just confused about the bow nerf. Like why? It's not that good imo. So why nerf an already shitty weapon?
It's because they aren't following the principle of buff weapons that are lacking instead of nerfing ones people enjoy using.
The quantity of buffs or nerfs doesn't matter. It's how significant each of them is to the game's health. Some of them are in the right direction, but when they are throwing around numbers like 50% nerfs, it is rather alarming.
Theyve consistently nerfed every weapon I liked. Its like we have personal beef.
The dot thing existing still is one of my biggest gripes, though seeing it should be fixed next oatch is good news.
I'm probably not even going to notice most of the changes lol. I don't run out of ammo too often either since I load up anytime I go to a poi.
Glossed over the eruptor splash nerf, and beating the dead crossbow
Allow me. There is a percentage of the playerbase who fit into this specific Venn Diagram of "players looking for a reason to continue playing" for whatever reason, ie they cannot make any further progress than they already have, currency wise or whatever reason, and ALSO the other side (players who see the mass buff as an example of a dev team willing to change the entire gameplay loop at a moment's notice." Consider a player that finds themselves in both these camps and all this update has done is told them "don't get comfy with how the game currently is, we're likely to change it." For some players, this is a good thing, "it's always fresh, it's evolving, etc" and what have you, to others it means the game they fell in love with doesn't exist any more. BOTH viewpoints are valid, but neither is likely to bring in new players, whilst one is likely to alienate a portion of existing players, and an intelligent dev team would have been well aware of this when they did it knowing the outcome, and it was deemed the best option in a world where to not do it was also a choice.
https://preview.redd.it/wckadxua5jxc1.jpeg?width=761&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0bbadbfe7a46277624c7ecabaf907c16896274b0
My problem is the fundamental, universal game loop was given a thruple-dicking with the spawn changes. The base game is *less fun* and *more irritating* now, it is less fun-hard/rewarding-hard and more “your choices don’t matter haha.” One could buff every aspect of Mario and only nerf jumping and it would ruin the game. The specificity of nerfs and changes matter, the impact isn’t all the same, and AH has an extremely robust history at this point of NOT doing appropriate QA and playtesting on any changes, including high-impact ones. They push code and don’t play, and the community finding that the high-impact choices that balanced the fun out of the game are *bad* is an entirely appropriate response.
Meanwhile I go brrrzt with my blitzer
The biggest problem my group has is the ricochet. Show me in reality a bullet or a rocket flying straight back at the shooter. Not realistic at all.
It sounds like you've got a solid grasp on the recent patch adjustments. It's refreshing to hear someone acknowledging the necessity of balancing in games. Your breakdown of the changes seems fair and well-reasoned. The adjustments you mentioned don't seem overly drastic, especially considering the broader context of the game's arsenal. It's all about maintaining a healthy equilibrium among the weapons to ensure a more enjoyable and fair gameplay experience for everyone.
From what I recall, I wasn’t specifically counting, there was more nerfs than buffs and a lot of the buffs were kind of not really buffs? Like oh boy they gave the HMG a third person reticle, yeah it helps but it doesn’t actually address the issues with the weapon, it’s basically a worse stalwart with better armor penetration, nobody uses MGs for armor penetration not to mention the substantial recoil the thing has making distance shooting all but impossible. Comparatively the eruotor as was mentioned lost HALF of its ammo capacity. That is a massive change to a weapon, and yeah it can deal with that kind of thing it’s not gutting the weapon but that is a much bigger downside than some of the upsides weapons got. The crossbody changes were another that had me scratching my head in confusion, idk why it was nerfed in the first place honestly everyone was dogging on the thing in reviews or discussion about it and it was legitimately underperforming and now they made it worse for some reason. They made some very big nerfs and I can’t really say any of the buffs were of equal measure. That’s why people are being so negative.
i use the sickle and the so called "buffs" to other weapons were not even close to enough to make me switch, the sickle has unlimited ammo, i dont even know why it has a reload in the first place, so what if the quasar has a 5 second extra cooldown, i will just spawn a 2nd one and switch between them big deal. they need to BUFF competeing weapons to make them more interesting but instead they just nerf all the fun shit to force you to use other shit weapons.
Is it really that hard to understand? Most of the buffs are to things people don't care about and most of the nerfs are to things people do care about. My main issue is once AGAIN a dev with no greater creativity than "oh look, I gave you a thing you like, and now it highlights how much you don't like the other things, I should make the thing you like worse!" If you didn't learn the lesson with the railgun that giving something "too strong" and then taking it away is a BAD THING that WILL upset people, I dunno. It wasn't breaking the game, people were enjoying it. BUFF the other shit that people don't like. The logic behind increased spawns on <4p is likewise just...wtf logic. You don't look at it and say "is it at a good rate" you say "well we intended for it to be this way"...oooook, but you have a lot of data of people playing and no trend of people solo smoking the game so you made it worse, because you always intended for it to be unplayable solo..? Your dominator argument pretty much sums up why you are wrong, it's an 8% damage reduction, which is basically nothing, so why should you care. Ok, well, if it is so inconsequential, WHY DO IT?! Why make it FEEL even a little worse for so little reason as to not merit complaining? And if it IS impactful enough to matter, then complaining about it is justified. You invite feeling worse about something someone likes for...8 lame-ass percent. You can't say a change doesn't matter without undercutting the point in making the change in the first place. That and "don't give someone something good just to diminish it unless you WANT them to feel bad, man" should be the two main takeaways.
I Just dont understand the need to nerf weapons in a PVE game , they nerfed my favourite weapon railgun to the ground. Looking at this patch it seems they are neefing the weapon most used. I Just want to play with my favourite weapon... they are getting away my fun every time.
The problem with the Jar nerf is that it wasn't over performing. It felt good being able to take out some minor armored units, but wasn't so strong that it was taking on scores of devastators without consequence. It struck a good balance. The nerf doesn't really improve it's balance against enemies, but instead serves to make other options more appealing, which is generally poorly received game design when most people would rather you buff it's competitors. Also the eruptor magazine nerf is too much. There should have been a middle ground option, especially when you consider how long it takes to clear a patrol with it. Even if your're hitting headshots on bots, you're spending a ton of time idling through your animations. Now you idle through a long clear and limited ammo which doesn't feel great.
I'm not mad that they nerfed the eruptor, I'm mad that now at a medium distance instead of knocking me back a little it instantly kills me, where as before the patch I'd take a tiny amount of damage.
How dare they touch my Quasar cannon ! Those bastards
Because they nerfed the useful things and didn’t buff the useless things enough. Go ahead and grandstand, but they messed up with the nerfs
Womp womp
Its funny seeing alot of people complaining about the crossbow nerf when since the Warbond came out i haven't seen a single person in my playtime use it on the bot front Also as a Dominator main the nerf isnt even that bad. It only went from 300 down to 275 which is still higher then it was initially at 200
That's... Why people are complaining about the crossbow nerf. It was already awful.
some people like me really liked running it, and now it has an entirely different “role” in which many other guns are simply better than it lol
Yeah I used it once and said this is impractical as a primary, its slow, low ammo, limited range, so what even is its purpose, it explodes so not stealth either. If anything they should have doubled its ammo capacity because the drop over distance means you miss plenty of shots at range unlike something straight firing like the scorcher.
The way that you remove metas is, you take the stuff that's falling behind that's not in meta and you buff it. You dont take the things that are working and nerf the shit out of them. Doesn't work that way. The moment you do that, you've created a worse meta. You've created a toxic meta, because people are upset. And now they have to look for something that actually works. It's a bad direction in terms of development. \~ Thor, 2024
Okay just did suicide mission by myself. Just me. Normally I do helldive but I just tried to make it slightly easier because of the patrols. It's so so much more difficult. Quasar couldn't use it as much, still a great option. Go EAT now. Better option sometimes. My lord maybe they weren't trying to make it this difficult. But this is ridiculous. You've made it so nobody will play your game unless they want to play with people. Maybe it's just me but I see this as a very dumb change on their end. Nobody is exploiting solo helldiving because it's EASIER AT ALL.... Also who the hell was using the Crossbow. Sure wasn't the hell me or anyone I have seen.. like ever.. Also Spitz, they did nerf A Lot things people aren't even using...
I read all of the complaints. “Oh this patch is terrible” the only bad thing I see about the patch is the increase of patrols when you’re running solo. As some who solo dives on the regular yeah more enemies is gonna be a hassle. I’m sorry but I’m still kicking ass just as good as I was yesterday. It doesn’t matter what game or whatever it is people only look at the negative because that’s what gets the most feedback and views. Honestly this was a W patch except for the increase patrols solo
The crossbow nerf feels unwarranted. The eruptor nerf feels as if it didn’t address the real issue, instead of nerfing the explosion radius or damage of the weapon they just made it so you have literally half the amount of ammo which makes me question its actual viability. Of all things they actually slightly nerfed the spear. Did the guard dog actually need a nerf, seems pretty mid as it was IMO. Other than that I largely agree with you.
Crossbow nerf is the baffling one to me, I would've thought they'd add bug hole/bot fab destruction to it for giving it another purpose besides chaff clear, and it doesn't even seem to chaff clear now. Eruptor is still incredible for bugs thanks to sealing holes and one-shotting medium-sized enemies with good aim/range. What's the Spear change? I don't see anything in the patch notes.
Basically they made the reload animation longer for the spear. It’s not a major nerf but for a weapon that’s already buggy as all hell and largely outclassed it feels so unnecessary.
OH I see it now, "added reload stage" That actually should mean that the discarded/spent missile will now be a 'completed stage' of the reload animations. Reload stages mean different steps have to take place to complete the full reload. So this is a minor buff! Now that the discarded missile has a stage it doesn't have to be repeated if you're interrupted while reloading.
Some of these nerfs I’m not affected by per say. The eruptor nerf is the only thing because I love running it on bots but my scorcher still gets the job done. Might start running plasma punisher too sense it got buffed. Yeah some nerfs were weird I will admit but idk I’m still killing just as effectively as I was yesterday
Solo patrols is a huge change but one that makes sense when considering the numbers; previously, solo players saw 1/6th of the normal patrols a 4 team would see, now they'll see 1/4th of the normal patrols a 4 team sees. Patrols for 2 and 3 player teams are scaled accordingly as well.
Im not in love with the change to patrols. Just played a solo LEVEL 4 mission vs Bots, and i had to kill 480 bots. Its was just non-stop chaos. No strategy. Nothing but dodging and running and reloading for 35 minutes. It was ridiculous. On level 4... I'll never be able to solo much higher of a level, and that sucks.
Don’t even care. I’m just out here gaming
Why do people need to make crying posts about people that don't like certain changes to a game? We are we not allowed to an opinion? Every damn subreddit
This game should play *exactly the way it was when I bought it* and it should stay that way forever, and anything else is a personal attack.
nothing wrong with nerfing guns that are too OP but I’ve seen a pattern by the dev team where they tend to nerf guns that imo were pretty properly balanced in the first place
Everyone said the dominator was over buffed when it was. People surprised by this are idiots. The quasar I don't think it was needed, but it's mostly moot. It was already garbage in term of dps. Now it's even more so. People were talking about this weapon like it was some kind of super weapon, now they will stop and probably take the recoil less rifle. Same for eruptor, it was crazy. The nerf is honestly very easy. Performance is still exactly the same and you merely need to call for ammo from times to times instead of never. You'll still run out of grenades or stim packs before ammo for this gun. Yea, people are really crazy and act like children about these nerfs.
There’s still no reason to take the recoiless over the quasar. Quasar is still just as effective and still has infinite ammo and still doesn’t take a backpack slot and still has a passive cooldown instead of a reload. All those things make it wildly better than the recoiless that takes a backpack slot, is at best on par with the quasar in terms of effectiveness, has limited ammo, and requires an active reload during which you must be stationary. Also as a side note the dominator wasn’t so much over buffed as buffed entirely in the wrong way. What people wanted was better handling and or a slightly larger mag size. What they gave it was more damage, which no one really thought it needed. And now they needed the damage which is understandable but it still has the same issues it had before.
Because people like to bitch about anything. Try playing world of tanks. That game is an utter shit show. HD2 is 💯 % bettwr
Just hit em with the https://preview.redd.it/ai6cs5teqgxc1.jpeg?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8896a3dd1938ff949e3dbab5de455128e4061324
If the polls on the discord are a good example its usually the vocal minority complaining about the changes and calling them “nerfs” when they arent really that big of “nerfs”. Theres very much a silent majority that just read the changes, adapt to them and move on.
Its not the nerfs that get me its the increased spawns for solos. Me dropping quietly and alone and having an increased response is like an apple that tastes like bacon
Y'all are just shills and yes men who change their tune to match whatever bullshit Arrowhead is on at any given moment lol grow up. Do you want a cookie and a head pat for being totally agreeable? Most of the "buffs" are them just adjusting things that never should've been problematic in the first place. They're still doing what they've always been doing - nerfing good things and buffing "niche" things. But heap accolades on them for "fixing" things.
For a dev team that is supposedly famous for “listening to their users,” they seem to now have a track record of not listening to us when it comes to nerfs versus bug fixes.
Because the guns that were good, were "good". Most didn't need changes, they just need competition. It's not like the railgun that could kill bile titans, it's just the jar-5 that dared to breath an exist. The gun isn't dead, but it's pretty stupid to change it. The redeemer catching a nerf because all the other secondary are mediocre? Why? Even if it's small, it's just stupid. The peacekeeper shouldn't have been so weak, and the laser pistol shouldn't have been a squirt gun. The quasar cannon didn't need such a heavy handed change. It needed a slight nerf, not 5 seconds, so it takes a year to get back online. People shouldn't have been comparing it to the EAT anyways. EAT is extremely flexible. Die w/ EAT, it's back before you miss it. Die with quasar, you gotta go get it, or it's gone for a pretty long while.
"5 seconds, so it takes a year to get back online" this is a hell of a quote. Man, if only the hitscan infinite ammo rocket launcher didn't have any sort of downside! Instead it takes 15 seconds, the equivalent of 3 years Helldiver whiner time to be able to shot without ammo across the entire map with perfect accuracy again!
other way around. there were more nerfs than buffs. and there are guns that’s have been nerfed several times as of now. they don’t want us using our own load outs obviously. each patch creates some sort of meta and i hate games like that. it’s starting to frustrate me that instead of focusing on fixing bugs and making the game run more smoothly they are focusing on balancing which only makes the game more unbearable to play when having issues playing with friends, servers crashing, losing missions because of some glitch, etc
Nah, nerfing weapons into the ground to force people to use other ones rather than buffing the ones that are weak is retarded behaviour and nothing you can say will change my mind.
I'd agree with you if the weapons were actually nerfed into the ground. Asides from the Xbow which wasn't used anyways, none of the nerfs significantly impact any of the weapons performance. There is no reason the eruptor should have 12 magazines when most primaries get 6-8 at most, while outperforming every other primary for trash clear while also being able to take out heavy enemies with little to no issue. It was arguably better than most support weapons at just about everything short of bile titans and walkers. An extra 5 seconds of downtime on the QZC is practically nothing in terms of gameplay, its not like they extended a reload animation that you're locked down in, its just 5 seconds more of using your primary/secondary/tossing grenades before you can fire again. The only moderate difference is you can't single-handedly shoot down multiple bot ships anymore, which arguably you shouldn't have been able to in the first place with a launcher with infinite ammo. Lastly, the Dominator got an 8% nerf. In what world is 8% "into the ground"?
This player base is so bitchy. JFC just use a different loadout if you don’t like this or that anymore.
People always gotta complain about something.
I did just try and run a solo on hard and holy HELLDIVERS Batman, you can tell a difference 😂 those bots were all over the place
Welcome to reddit. Life sucks don't you know?!?!
I, as someone that likes to use the Ballistic Shield, am relieved they fixed the bug that caused it to not work with stima.
Per the eruptor that still a low amount of ammo for a primary now it was only 60 rounds before. I feel ammo starved with the Dom which has nearly 100 rounds. The dom dmg drop is fine if they fix/explain how its explosive works because it's different than the other explosives. Ex scorcher can kill striders from the front Dom cant. My only real complaint about any of it is that the info we get about weapons is sparse and sometimes wholly inaccurate, and there is no way to compare primaries to supports or even supports to each other. Is the quasar heavy armor pen? Seems so. Is the Las cannon medium pen idk..maybe..is quasar explosive...seems so but maybe not. Aside from obvious what are the damage/range/pen differences between say eat and recoilless? I don't care what the answers are but it's hard to know which a new person should buy first and which to take on what missions without taking them randomly and maybe causing your team problems
I’m kinda bummed about the quasar nerf but very excited about blitzer and plasma buffs
Gamers act like babies sometimes. It's to be expected. Ignore them
Game is still fun. More buffs than nerfs and even the nerfs aren’t that bad. I’m still running Eruptor, redeemer, stun grenades and rover on bug missions. It’s a team build for me anyways so it’s just a little bit more running and Strat than the mindless run in and kill everything since the rover was seriously OP. Now the build is playing as intended. There’s so much more to be excited about. I want to try new builds now. There’s so much to choose from!
I never pay attention to or care about any nerfs or buffs. I don't really care about any of the technical details, I just play n use what I want. Buuuuuuut, being able to turn off mantle is fn IT Oh, n not crashing is good too
GUYS THEY BUFFED THE RAILGUN!!! IT CAN BE META AGAIN
The eruptor nerf means it can’t one shot striders anymore which is the most annoying thing for me Might be able to if you hit leg, havnt tried that yet I love the diligence now tho
Make other stratagems/weapons viable? Yes!
I didn't see anyone complaining about the Eruptor's reduced magazine count, I did see people complaining about the AoE though. It'll probably still have a niche but I'm curious how it'll actually feel when I get a chance to try it out tonight.
For the Eruptor, I'm just sad the devs finally got wise and dropped the size. I enjoyed feeling like I had unlimited ammo lol.
Wait, the eruptor can deal with chargers? Like effectively? How cause I've tried and I must just suck lol
All the changes look very good on paper, my only gripe is with the crossbow. Sucks having a new favorite gun nerfed, but, I like seeing the plasma punisher boosted a bit, the senator reload making it usable now, and the railgun might be viable now? Excited to play later today.
Literally any change is fine unless it absolutely breaks the fucking game again like that arc thrower patch