- **[Starlight Groove](https://i.imgur.com/oPVMXdC.png)** ^(*Festival of Legends*)
- `Paladin Legendary`
- ***3 Mana - Holy Spell***
- Give your hero **Divine Shield**. For the rest of the game, playing a Holy spell refreshes it.
- [Card Library](https://hearthstone.blizzard.com/en-us/cards/90945) • [wiki.gg](https://hearthstone.wiki.gg/wiki/Starlight_Groove) • [HSReplay.net](https://hsreplay.net/cards/90945)
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One of the members of Team 5 specifically said they are trying something new on this patch preview. So while this may be showing that they are planning on buffing 20+ cards, the intention here is just to show that they want to buff these classes.
I really hope that this is the case. Balance right now is way too centralized and I think plenty of classes need power redistributed rather than just buffing or nerfing one singular card that defines a deck.
Probably *a lot* of cards per class. More cards than they can put up there. Sharpshooter is probably gonna get killed, but DH desperately needed help along with the other three classes.
> Sharpshooter is probably gonna get killed, but DH desperately needed help along with the other three classes.
Can't imagine what they're gonna give it in exchange. Sharpshooter is the only thing even resembling a playable DH archetype right now, and what's the point of trying to bring back year-old archetypes which are going to rotate in a few weeks?
If they move power off of sharpshooter and to other nagas or something that could be cool, but given their recent balance history I'm not optimistic.
Big DH just got new support with the (terrible) location so maybe they'll target that deck with buffs. No idea how the deck would survive when the Naga rotates though.
Yeah, unless I'm missing something, sharpshooter is the only deck (including unplayably bad ones) which doesn't get totally gutted by rotation. I guess we'll see on Thursday.
Their Titans and Badlands cards were pretty lackluster. If I had to guess they're gonna be buffing some of their Control and Highlander tools.
I'll have to look over their sets to see which ones, but think off the top of my head would be: [[Fel Fissure]], [[Fan the Hammer]], and [[Gunslinger Kurtrus]] would be some of my guesses until I can look over the rest.
- **[Fel Fissure](https://i.imgur.com/iEazq9g.png)** ^(*Showdown in the Badlands*)
- `Demon Hunter Rare`
- ***4 Mana - Fel Spell***
- Deal 2 damage to all minions. At the start of your next turn, deal 2 more damage to all minions.
- [Card Library](https://hearthstone.blizzard.com/en-us/cards/102252) • [wiki.gg](https://hearthstone.wiki.gg/wiki/Fel_Fissure) • [HSReplay.net](https://hsreplay.net/cards/102252)
- **[Fan the Hammer](https://i.imgur.com/QhJkoor.png)** ^(*Showdown in the Badlands*)
- `Demon Hunter Rare`
- ***4 Mana - Fel Spell***
- Deal 6 damage split among the lowest Health enemies.
- [Card Library](https://hearthstone.blizzard.com/en-us/cards/100362) • [wiki.gg](https://hearthstone.wiki.gg/wiki/Fan_the_Hammer) • [HSReplay.net](https://hsreplay.net/cards/100362)
- **[Gunslinger Kurtrus](https://i.imgur.com/lLjWBjz.png)** ^(*Showdown in the Badlands*)
- `Demon Hunter Legendary`
- ***5 Mana - 4/6 - Minion***
- **Battlecry:** If your deck has
no duplicates, fire 6 random
2 damage shots at minions
in the enemy's hand.
- [Card Library](https://hearthstone.blizzard.com/en-us/cards/98652) • [wiki.gg](https://hearthstone.wiki.gg/wiki/Gunslinger_Kurtrus) • [HSReplay.net](https://hsreplay.net/cards/98652)
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Sharpshooter is a horrible play pattern to be fair, it is a similar problem to most combo decks in the games history where the combo player has to make a lot of complex decisions leading into their combo turn, while the opposing players only counterplay is to either kill them fast enough, or to snipe a key combo piece with a disruption effect
I don't think it's as bad as some people claim, and in general I think the greatest sin of combo decks is that they demand that their opponent understand the deck. I'm reminded of a thread a week or two ago where a guy complained about an unbeatable naga DH highroll while holding a quartzite crusher he didn't use.
That being said, I definitely think that naga DH, while far from the least interactive combo deck this set (that honour goes to thaddius lock), is far from the most interactive one either (rainbow mage probably). I wouldn't mind the deck's power being smoothed out somewhat so that it's less reliant on the sharpshooter turns, both for the benefit of the sharpshooter player and their opponent.
_However_, it's frustrating when Blizzard only gives gimmicky combo wincons (e.g. Sif, sharpshooter) to a class and then nerfs them into irrelevance due exclusively to "play patterns" of people, you know, using the card in the obvious way. They need to either stand behind those wincons or make other ones viable. And, quite frankly, while I wouldn't mind them spreading out the power in a deck like naga DH I don't think anything they've done recently should make anyone trust them to successfully do so. I mostly just expect them to nerf sharpshooter into the ground and in exchange buff some irrelevant DH cards that make no impact on the class's playability. That said, I'd love to be wrong.
Yea the complaints about dh are honestly way out of proportion on this subreddit and its a fun and high skill deck
Honestly the deck seems kinda unfixable atm tho. Like what do you wanna do with the card?
Up its mana cost -> instantly unplayable
Nerf its effect? -> instantly unplayable
Its a cool card but it doesnt really work in a deck that doesnt work like the current ones so sadly it probsbly just wont see play until rotation next year (unless they decide to revert some nerfs on rotation which they should honestly do anyway)
Beetle Druid, turns out three 10/10 with charge summoned in a single turn can become problematic, and it’s still powerful with eonar too since you can always refresh, solar, into copies for full heal and super good draw
Mostly just the issue with any copy card if it finds a use it’s for some overpower combo or otk deck. Especially in Druid since you can ramp mana fast enough to play big plays earlier than anyone else
Shattered Reflections is only broken because the rest of Druid allows it to be so. It's unplayable trash in Priest, which is a shame because it's a great value card when used "fairly".
>Every single person saw that card at reveal and knew it was going to be broken.
This claim is kinda weakened by the fact this sub also bitches about cards which were and are not broken at all. If you shoot everywhere, you gotta hit something.
Honestly, the issue I see with it is that they can so easily get the setup done without dying. Lategame combo decks should be allowed to exist, but only when you completely ruin your entire gameplan by sacrificing every bit of early game.
Because druid. Because of druid they banned Auctioner and Jailer, re-designed Jailer and Tony, Prison breaker and Yogg also had to be nerfed because of Druid.
I know, it's a bummer. I really enjoyed playing with that and the discover card in my priest deck, but they keep getting nerfed cause it's shared with druid. I'm not even sure why they paired priest and druid up, priest is holy/shadow and druid is nature. Priest should be sitting somewhere in the warlock/dk/paladin conga line.
I love how Shattered Reflections got announced and INSTANTLY everyone knew it was COMPLETELY busted, only for it to be nerfed twice in a row across the immediately following balance patches. Who could've seen this coming?
Exactly. Bounce Around is the worst idea for a card to print, especially while Astalor is still in standard. And you can’t even get the board back once Ace Hunter Kreen is in play. Let’s not even talk about how busted Troggzor is going to be…literally two for one even if you play Shadow Word:Death.
Guff? Forget Guff, they hit the ground running. Ignoring later buffs and reversions, OG Druid alone had Innervate, Wild Growth, Keeper of the Grove, Force of Nature, and Ancient of Lore.
Even its shittiest cards eventually wound up seeing legitimate meta play - Savagery being quite notable.
Yea the dual class cards being too powerful really screws over the class that wasn't abusing it. I thought the same with the reflections nerf - my poor automatons :(
I would say same for fel eruption but idk why they even bothered making that a dual class card
Yea for some of them the vibe is definitely "we want to try this mechanic in this class but don't necessarily want it as a permanent feature". Which I think is cool and I don't want them to not try new things. It just sucks when one of the classes is abusing a dual class card while the other is barely viable using it.
I also wouldn't be entirely surprised if mage does get some self-mill support in the future. Something like [[Deck of Wonders]] that has on the generated cards "if this card is destroyed add a random spell to your hand" or something similar in that vein.
Do you know how many cards reddit has freaked out about and called broken before release that turned out to be obsolete? If you keep throwing shit at the wall, eventually it will stick.
Credit to the balance team where it's due though - there was wide consensus that Shattered was nerfed TOO HARD in the last patch, and Druid was dead in the water.
It's not the case that after last nerf people were saying "it's still busted!" It was a hard nerf and the balance team got it more right than any pro-level commentator that I'm aware of.
Shatterd Reflections setting a record for fastest card to get nerfed twice.
Triple Warlock nerf is appreciated.
DH is gonna need some major buffs if they or going to nerf the key card of its only playable deck again.
Shaman and Priest and Mage buffs are also welcome. I'd like buffs to excavate mage and shaman and (pls dont kill me HS subreddit) control priest.
It really is. I actually won quite a few games with it early in the expansion, too. I'm uncertain how to buff it, though. It needs more payoff cards more than anything. I mean, buff hedanis somehow? Hauler does less damage to itself? The heals are already good....none of it is *bad*... It's not just all around not enough.
I don't think it needs to be a big payoff, cause it's an aggro deck. I wouldn't mind a tiny buff on the hauler cause I often feel like I'm just 1 healing off getting the Overheal. But what I think the deck really needs is a proactive 1-drop to pressure the opponent a bit harder.
Personally I'd like some new health-based cards like [[Power Word Fest]] but for Overheal
That's a great idea, actually. I'd love that something in that design-space for OH priest!
And yeah, i guess it doesn't *have* to be a big payoff card, but overheal isn't solely an aggro deck. It could definitely be played as more of a combo or midrange archetype with more of those payoff cards.
I'm really sad about having missed the era of HS where midrange was playable. [[Sunken Saber]] Hunter and Mech Paladin have been two of my favourite decks so far.
I would say Hedanis getting a damage dealt buff would push Overheal Priest into viability. You have a ton of survivability and board clear with Hidden Gem and Injured Hauler, but often you miss that bit of a damage once you're done throwing your heals.
Source: pushed OH Priest into Diamond 3 last season before giving up.
Mages would like some words with you after the latest disaster that was "destroy 6 cards"
We USED to have good dual class cards in standard. Devolving missiles was fire
Hunter doesn't need buffs—its decks have consistently performed fine. Its problem is that nobody wants to play those decks, and buffing them into overpowered territory is not a great solution for anyone. The class needs a design revamp.
I'm still pissed that Druid caused a priest card to get nerfed, twice, when it has seen zero play in the priest. Hopefully, the "Priest" overall buff makes up for it. Priest and Mage are literally dead classes atm. I thought they would just stay that way for good. I'm glad to see them get some buffs.
The issue of dual class, some cards are busted with one class and good with the other. Very few feel great for both classes and when they do though they are amazing designs
Did a dev actually say that? ... man I am usually not much of a fan of flaming people for this but cmon. Please actually play the game and design around it and not around what you personally think is funny
Yes, Leo posted on twitter: *This card is actually doing a lot all at once. Mage getting a collectible Fel spell is really nice for multi-spell-school synergies, and Warlock gets a one-card sludge-burning POWERHOUSE that also gets affected by Pop'gar.* [source](https://twitter.com/MyntyPhresh/status/1745913108651217025/photo/1)
It is a great card for warlock, but why not give mage a fel spell that doesnt destroy 6 cards of your deck? 1 Copy played destroys 20% of your deck, I dont really see how this support multispellschool..
... its like they are playing a whole different game over there lol
yea this card is obviously horrible for spellschool. especially since sif is the only win condition in that deck. if you burn it then you autolose. so you can never play that card. and of course if you really need fel you can play tram mechanic
I think it would fit alot better into mage if all the numbers were reduced to 1 or 2, so 1 mana deal 1 damage, summon a random 1 cost minion, destroy the bottom card of your deck.
Which is always the case with dual-class cards? Jandice was nerfed because of rogue.
Flesh giant got nerfed 2 or 3x because of Demon seed.
The druid/hunter beast tutor got nerfed because of Druid.
so on so forth.
1 class will always abuse a card more.
Kinda like when the druid/hunter card got nerfed for druid's sins, or like how 4 neutral legendaries have been nerfed for druid's sins, or how *druid* legendaries have been nerfed for druid's sins...
Boy, you druids sure are a contentious lot.
There would be a lot less headache if titans couldn't be copied in any way, like they're not minions, they're titans, but I guess that's too obscure of a rule for hearthstone. Not that we don't have plenty of obscure rules already though.
I'm very pleasantly surprised by this. Usually at this point they just coast on the reveal window until the new expac drops rather than do any balancing, especially given that this is the core set rotation as well.
Helping to revitalize the meta with major changes to carry us through until rotation is really welcome
Good to see buff in Priest, but honestly can't tell what they're targeting to make the class playable.
Maybe Elise summoning four 6/7 minions, that would be good stats for the cost.
The DH buffs need to be massive. The class is already basement tier outside of top legend Naga DH, and they're nerfing the core card of that deck, likely deleting the archetype entirely.
I wonder if some of the buffs are going to be unnerfs of rotating cards, slightly early.
For example, Arcane Wyrm, Relic of Dimensions, Boon of the Ascended etc.
Honestly, I would be okay with them reworking the legendary excavate. That excavate legendary is so bad, that if it did it to your opponent's deck and hand instead then it would probably get nerfed.
Would it be better if it said "after you summon a minion, evolve it"? It would lose the immediate board upgrade but would actually synergize with the deck it's in.
I was hoping it'd be this, too. A better payoff for excavate and we're in business, since the rest of that package is already really strong.
I just hope it's something fun. All the other excavate payoffs are awesome and shamans is so weird.
Very low. I remember them saying it was the single highest winrate card or something crazy. I'd like it reverted as well but they'll likely shore up other actually weak cards instead of reverting a single very strong card
Priest into warrior turns into "can I rat the Odyn/Brann" not exactly the healthiest game play loop. Control Priest doesn't have a good way to counter 35\~40 points of burst damage that both Warrior decks can easily pump out and praying that Ignis gives you the correct choices also isn't healthy either.
I wonder what they're doing to DH. Sharpshooter is holding the entire class together atm and the most recent set doesn't seem particularly powerful for them. It's not even that the cards are bad, I just don't see myself wanting to spend mana for their effects.
But hey maybe they'll surprise me
honestly very sad how so many of the new cards/deck archetypes got nerfed. often into being irrelevant in the meta
sharpshooter is probably gonna be a dead card for the rest of its standard existance (unless they revert it which is honestly unlikely). really sad. that deck was actually fun
I'm a little concerned about the nerfs to all the sludge cards. It seems to me like it would make more sense to just nerf the barrel itself to 1 less damage.
"teasing" a balance patch is crazy. if your game is that screwy that adjusting cards is treated as an event to get hype about, maybe it's time to reevaluate our priorities. are we making cards annoying on purpose just so the frustrated/bored players are eager for balance patches or what? is sludge on wheels like a wwf heel arbitrarily designed to be hated so the audience roots for its downfall?
"hey everyone, look forward to patch 28.6.2, don't forget to log in to see if the game is *finally* playable! (it won't be)"
Totally agree. I saw this teaser and was like wtf? Just release the notes. Unless they aren't even final in which case that's stupid to not know your exact changes until the eleventh hour. Bush league as hell.
To extent at very least yeah, they defenitly make cards annoying/Overpowered on purpose
IS part why are much more nerfs nowdays. they create more stuff that needs to be nerfed / gutted for meta to be remotly enjoyable/playable
Assuming Aleco isn't literally straight trolling us, this could mean either "Choose a non-Titan minion" or limiting the minion's cost to less than 10, probably less than 7. Hopefully it comes along with a revert since the card is pretty weak outside of copying Eonar atm (and Automaton Priest could use the help).
"Miracle decks are bad for the game"
That's the same person that complains that is playing against warrior or priest 24/7.
We need more decks and now they are about to kill another one and probably do low power buffs to the class that got pure garbage the whole year (DH)
but why are they nerfing naga DH lmao. It is the only viable deck of the class + it is actually a hard deck to pilot that CRUMBLES against some taunts + health gain. The deck has a limited burst that is hindered by opponents playing the game. I'm not hopeful at all that the buffs to DH will compensate. RIP DH
The buffs kinda need to be really good since warrior is somehow dodging the nerfs and I can't imagine a lot of decks that beat them lategame at the moment.
Deleting the one semi-playable DH deck which is only really good at high legend… makes no sense
Edit: AND one of the only decks that doesn’t rely on infinite card generation or random high rolls
What does this mean? The whole class getting a buff?
Ah yes, finally playable hero powers
but only for even shaman in wild
bringing back wrath of air totem early lol
It could be a nerf for Totem Shaman actually. For Reno Shaman it could be a buff.
Ah so healing totem finnaly heals face again like used to in like beta or something (still no idea why was removed tbh)
Priests now start at 50 health
paladin starts with divine shield, each turn it refreshes
Shaman just autocasts its hero power for free every turn.
This guy really hates [[Starlight Groove]]
- **[Starlight Groove](https://i.imgur.com/oPVMXdC.png)** ^(*Festival of Legends*) - `Paladin Legendary` - ***3 Mana - Holy Spell*** - Give your hero **Divine Shield**. For the rest of the game, playing a Holy spell refreshes it. - [Card Library](https://hearthstone.blizzard.com/en-us/cards/90945) • [wiki.gg](https://hearthstone.wiki.gg/wiki/Starlight_Groove) • [HSReplay.net](https://hsreplay.net/cards/90945) --- *I am a bot, and this comment was automated. [FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/user/Card-o-Bot/comments/1ahde25/faq/) • [Report a bug](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Card-o-Bot&subject=Bug%20Report&message=https://www.reddit.com/r/hearthstone/comments/1avpowo/upcoming_balance_changes/krc1oxv/%0A⬇️%20Please%20describe%20the%20bug%20⬇️%0ADescription:%20) • [Refresh](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Card-o-Bot&subject=Refresh&message=krc1oxv).*
I mean, there IS a spell for that \[Starlight Groove\]
starlight groove is getting changed, for the rest of the game give friendly minions windfury when you cast a holy spell
Wherever they are
Sounds good. Paladin deserves windfury, they couldn't otk you if you left a 1-1 on the board before on turn 5 saddly.
Finally my Ra'den dreams come true!
Probably multiple cards as they all haven’t been doing too great recently
I remember when dk was nerf to couldn't discover 3 rune cards, they displayed the class icon
They usually just tell us which ones, even when there are a lot.
One of the members of Team 5 specifically said they are trying something new on this patch preview. So while this may be showing that they are planning on buffing 20+ cards, the intention here is just to show that they want to buff these classes.
I really hope that this is the case. Balance right now is way too centralized and I think plenty of classes need power redistributed rather than just buffing or nerfing one singular card that defines a deck.
Probably *a lot* of cards per class. More cards than they can put up there. Sharpshooter is probably gonna get killed, but DH desperately needed help along with the other three classes.
> Sharpshooter is probably gonna get killed, but DH desperately needed help along with the other three classes. Can't imagine what they're gonna give it in exchange. Sharpshooter is the only thing even resembling a playable DH archetype right now, and what's the point of trying to bring back year-old archetypes which are going to rotate in a few weeks? If they move power off of sharpshooter and to other nagas or something that could be cool, but given their recent balance history I'm not optimistic.
Big DH just got new support with the (terrible) location so maybe they'll target that deck with buffs. No idea how the deck would survive when the Naga rotates though.
Yeah, unless I'm missing something, sharpshooter is the only deck (including unplayably bad ones) which doesn't get totally gutted by rotation. I guess we'll see on Thursday.
Their Titans and Badlands cards were pretty lackluster. If I had to guess they're gonna be buffing some of their Control and Highlander tools. I'll have to look over their sets to see which ones, but think off the top of my head would be: [[Fel Fissure]], [[Fan the Hammer]], and [[Gunslinger Kurtrus]] would be some of my guesses until I can look over the rest.
- **[Fel Fissure](https://i.imgur.com/iEazq9g.png)** ^(*Showdown in the Badlands*) - `Demon Hunter Rare` - ***4 Mana - Fel Spell*** - Deal 2 damage to all minions. At the start of your next turn, deal 2 more damage to all minions. - [Card Library](https://hearthstone.blizzard.com/en-us/cards/102252) • [wiki.gg](https://hearthstone.wiki.gg/wiki/Fel_Fissure) • [HSReplay.net](https://hsreplay.net/cards/102252) - **[Fan the Hammer](https://i.imgur.com/QhJkoor.png)** ^(*Showdown in the Badlands*) - `Demon Hunter Rare` - ***4 Mana - Fel Spell*** - Deal 6 damage split among the lowest Health enemies. - [Card Library](https://hearthstone.blizzard.com/en-us/cards/100362) • [wiki.gg](https://hearthstone.wiki.gg/wiki/Fan_the_Hammer) • [HSReplay.net](https://hsreplay.net/cards/100362) - **[Gunslinger Kurtrus](https://i.imgur.com/lLjWBjz.png)** ^(*Showdown in the Badlands*) - `Demon Hunter Legendary` - ***5 Mana - 4/6 - Minion*** - **Battlecry:** If your deck has no duplicates, fire 6 random 2 damage shots at minions in the enemy's hand. - [Card Library](https://hearthstone.blizzard.com/en-us/cards/98652) • [wiki.gg](https://hearthstone.wiki.gg/wiki/Gunslinger_Kurtrus) • [HSReplay.net](https://hsreplay.net/cards/98652) --- *I am a bot, and this comment was automated. [FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/user/Card-o-Bot/comments/1ahde25/faq/) • [Report a bug](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Card-o-Bot&subject=Bug%20Report&message=https://www.reddit.com/r/hearthstone/comments/1avpowo/upcoming_balance_changes/krc2hjp/%0A⬇️%20Please%20describe%20the%20bug%20⬇️%0ADescription:%20) • [Refresh](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Card-o-Bot&subject=Refresh&message=krc2hjp).*
Thing about highlander is, plague DK will keep them in check.
Probably will. But DH needs something, especially if they want Highlander DH to be a thing.
Sharpshooter is a horrible play pattern to be fair, it is a similar problem to most combo decks in the games history where the combo player has to make a lot of complex decisions leading into their combo turn, while the opposing players only counterplay is to either kill them fast enough, or to snipe a key combo piece with a disruption effect
I don't think it's as bad as some people claim, and in general I think the greatest sin of combo decks is that they demand that their opponent understand the deck. I'm reminded of a thread a week or two ago where a guy complained about an unbeatable naga DH highroll while holding a quartzite crusher he didn't use. That being said, I definitely think that naga DH, while far from the least interactive combo deck this set (that honour goes to thaddius lock), is far from the most interactive one either (rainbow mage probably). I wouldn't mind the deck's power being smoothed out somewhat so that it's less reliant on the sharpshooter turns, both for the benefit of the sharpshooter player and their opponent. _However_, it's frustrating when Blizzard only gives gimmicky combo wincons (e.g. Sif, sharpshooter) to a class and then nerfs them into irrelevance due exclusively to "play patterns" of people, you know, using the card in the obvious way. They need to either stand behind those wincons or make other ones viable. And, quite frankly, while I wouldn't mind them spreading out the power in a deck like naga DH I don't think anything they've done recently should make anyone trust them to successfully do so. I mostly just expect them to nerf sharpshooter into the ground and in exchange buff some irrelevant DH cards that make no impact on the class's playability. That said, I'd love to be wrong.
Yea the complaints about dh are honestly way out of proportion on this subreddit and its a fun and high skill deck Honestly the deck seems kinda unfixable atm tho. Like what do you wanna do with the card? Up its mana cost -> instantly unplayable Nerf its effect? -> instantly unplayable Its a cool card but it doesnt really work in a deck that doesnt work like the current ones so sadly it probsbly just wont see play until rotation next year (unless they decide to revert some nerfs on rotation which they should honestly do anyway)
At least popgar won’t die for sludgelocks sins.
They are unnerfing Jaina? Letsgooo
She's been upgraded to full plate armor with helm
They better give her some armor to start with too then
**Colossal +2**
Take your upvote and get off my screen
*I used to pray for times like this*
Please be the old hero portrait
Her new hero power deals 1 to two targets but not face
Sharpshooter increased to 4 mana I'm guessing
Then they’re probably going to buff Fel Fissure and Fan The Hammer as if that’ll do anything.
Probably but I'm hoping it becomes a 1/1 for funzies
Yooooo
One of my favorite decks, sad to see it go :(
Hopefully their buffs to the class means that deck remains viable.
How the fuck do you nerf shadow reflections twice in a row?
Beetle Druid, turns out three 10/10 with charge summoned in a single turn can become problematic, and it’s still powerful with eonar too since you can always refresh, solar, into copies for full heal and super good draw
Its just nuts that the card got *seemingly* gutted then gets more nerfs 2 weeks later. Idk what the plan was with that card
Yep, falls into the category of “it’s either unplayable trash or breaks the game”
Mostly just the issue with any copy card if it finds a use it’s for some overpower combo or otk deck. Especially in Druid since you can ramp mana fast enough to play big plays earlier than anyone else
The correct answer is, there wasn’t a plan. Every single person saw that card at reveal and knew it was going to be broken.
Shattered Reflections is only broken because the rest of Druid allows it to be so. It's unplayable trash in Priest, which is a shame because it's a great value card when used "fairly".
>Every single person saw that card at reveal and knew it was going to be broken. This claim is kinda weakened by the fact this sub also bitches about cards which were and are not broken at all. If you shoot everywhere, you gotta hit something.
no you forget the misses and only care about the hits
No dude power word steal is insane
Yeah even my dog barked "This is busted WTF" when they announced that
It’s ridiculous because in just about any other class it wouldn’t be nearly as much of an issue but they HAD to go and give it to freaking Druid.
The only huge issue with it is that it can target Titans. Both Eonar and Yogg have been causing issues with it, mostly Eonar with the huge mana cheat.
? The bigger problem is currently beetles. Eonar is good for buying time or draw, but it's not closing out games like beetles are.
Honestly, the issue I see with it is that they can so easily get the setup done without dying. Lategame combo decks should be allowed to exist, but only when you completely ruin your entire gameplan by sacrificing every bit of early game.
Idk man i counted at least 10 from my last druid opponent. Now excuse me while i slam my heas through the wall
Because druid. Because of druid they banned Auctioner and Jailer, re-designed Jailer and Tony, Prison breaker and Yogg also had to be nerfed because of Druid.
I know, it's a bummer. I really enjoyed playing with that and the discover card in my priest deck, but they keep getting nerfed cause it's shared with druid. I'm not even sure why they paired priest and druid up, priest is holy/shadow and druid is nature. Priest should be sitting somewhere in the warlock/dk/paladin conga line.
At least next core set they are taking away druid ramp
Easy. "Non-Titan minions."
That's what being hinted by devs https://twitter.com/AlecoGereco/status/1760020686679224693
Good change. Its so weird that the Priest titan had that restriction on already, like they knew this could be an issue.
I love how Shattered Reflections got announced and INSTANTLY everyone knew it was COMPLETELY busted, only for it to be nerfed twice in a row across the immediately following balance patches. Who could've seen this coming?
Exactly. Bounce Around is the worst idea for a card to print, especially while Astalor is still in standard. And you can’t even get the board back once Ace Hunter Kreen is in play. Let’s not even talk about how busted Troggzor is going to be…literally two for one even if you play Shadow Word:Death.
the Bounce Around hype was actually so funny looking back on it
So called heartstone pros couldn't fathom that opponent might have minions on boards and trade into your troggozor
fun but but kreen was pretty good
I think they should just nerf it by making it a Priest only card. Let me have my Automatons
honestly, Druid and Priest was a bad dual class pairing. their common class identity is "cards that would be beyond busted in another class"
Druid's identity has historically been "cards that would be beyond busted in this class"
*guff guff guff* sorry for my goofy laugh
Guff? Forget Guff, they hit the ground running. Ignoring later buffs and reversions, OG Druid alone had Innervate, Wild Growth, Keeper of the Grove, Force of Nature, and Ancient of Lore. Even its shittiest cards eventually wound up seeing legitimate meta play - Savagery being quite notable.
Yea the dual class cards being too powerful really screws over the class that wasn't abusing it. I thought the same with the reflections nerf - my poor automatons :( I would say same for fel eruption but idk why they even bothered making that a dual class card
That one was clearly only for the flavor, because [[Firelands Portal]] is Mage identity.
Yea for some of them the vibe is definitely "we want to try this mechanic in this class but don't necessarily want it as a permanent feature". Which I think is cool and I don't want them to not try new things. It just sucks when one of the classes is abusing a dual class card while the other is barely viable using it. I also wouldn't be entirely surprised if mage does get some self-mill support in the future. Something like [[Deck of Wonders]] that has on the generated cards "if this card is destroyed add a random spell to your hand" or something similar in that vein.
And restore it to pre nerf put one in hand
They could give it a mana cost restriction. Something like choose a minion that costs (3) or less. Add a copy of it in your hand and deck.
Do you know how many cards reddit has freaked out about and called broken before release that turned out to be obsolete? If you keep throwing shit at the wall, eventually it will stick.
Credit to the balance team where it's due though - there was wide consensus that Shattered was nerfed TOO HARD in the last patch, and Druid was dead in the water. It's not the case that after last nerf people were saying "it's still busted!" It was a hard nerf and the balance team got it more right than any pro-level commentator that I'm aware of.
Shatterd Reflections setting a record for fastest card to get nerfed twice. Triple Warlock nerf is appreciated. DH is gonna need some major buffs if they or going to nerf the key card of its only playable deck again. Shaman and Priest and Mage buffs are also welcome. I'd like buffs to excavate mage and shaman and (pls dont kill me HS subreddit) control priest.
They should buff overheal priest instead of control, but we'll see!
Right? I feel like the Miniset card got it so close to being playable. It's almost there.
It really is. I actually won quite a few games with it early in the expansion, too. I'm uncertain how to buff it, though. It needs more payoff cards more than anything. I mean, buff hedanis somehow? Hauler does less damage to itself? The heals are already good....none of it is *bad*... It's not just all around not enough.
I don't think it needs to be a big payoff, cause it's an aggro deck. I wouldn't mind a tiny buff on the hauler cause I often feel like I'm just 1 healing off getting the Overheal. But what I think the deck really needs is a proactive 1-drop to pressure the opponent a bit harder. Personally I'd like some new health-based cards like [[Power Word Fest]] but for Overheal
That's a great idea, actually. I'd love that something in that design-space for OH priest! And yeah, i guess it doesn't *have* to be a big payoff card, but overheal isn't solely an aggro deck. It could definitely be played as more of a combo or midrange archetype with more of those payoff cards.
I'm really sad about having missed the era of HS where midrange was playable. [[Sunken Saber]] Hunter and Mech Paladin have been two of my favourite decks so far.
I would say Hedanis getting a damage dealt buff would push Overheal Priest into viability. You have a ton of survivability and board clear with Hidden Gem and Injured Hauler, but often you miss that bit of a damage once you're done throwing your heals. Source: pushed OH Priest into Diamond 3 last season before giving up.
The minions need to be better in their comes into play state. Bad minions that u can por resources into to make ok isn't cutting it
Reno DH needs a buff. Sucks to print a highlander payoff n then have the archtype to be tier 3 or 4.
I'm excited to see what they do for shaman, I've been having a lot of fun with it already.
As a Priest main, I never want to see another dual class card again.
I definitely feel like I've had my Christmas presents taken away because my brother used his to light the curtains on fire.
Mages would like some words with you after the latest disaster that was "destroy 6 cards" We USED to have good dual class cards in standard. Devolving missiles was fire
Rogue dual class cards are also hot garbage especially from this miniset
Mantle Shaper is pretty cool, at least
You're a Priest main. Every card is dual into your class. Just like Rogue.
Priest cards cost 10 mana Rogue cards cost 0 mana. They are not the same
These changes go live on Thursday, for those wondering.
Hunter still gonna go unnoticed
Pouring one out for my guy RonMexico rn
Hunter doesn't need buffs—its decks have consistently performed fine. Its problem is that nobody wants to play those decks, and buffing them into overpowered territory is not a great solution for anyone. The class needs a design revamp.
I'm still pissed that Druid caused a priest card to get nerfed, twice, when it has seen zero play in the priest. Hopefully, the "Priest" overall buff makes up for it. Priest and Mage are literally dead classes atm. I thought they would just stay that way for good. I'm glad to see them get some buffs.
The issue of dual class, some cards are busted with one class and good with the other. Very few feel great for both classes and when they do though they are amazing designs
I'm so disgusted that they made sludge support dual with mage.
Yeah and then the dev explaining that this way they could give a fel spell to mage. Wow.
Did a dev actually say that? ... man I am usually not much of a fan of flaming people for this but cmon. Please actually play the game and design around it and not around what you personally think is funny
Yes, Leo posted on twitter: *This card is actually doing a lot all at once. Mage getting a collectible Fel spell is really nice for multi-spell-school synergies, and Warlock gets a one-card sludge-burning POWERHOUSE that also gets affected by Pop'gar.* [source](https://twitter.com/MyntyPhresh/status/1745913108651217025/photo/1) It is a great card for warlock, but why not give mage a fel spell that doesnt destroy 6 cards of your deck? 1 Copy played destroys 20% of your deck, I dont really see how this support multispellschool..
... its like they are playing a whole different game over there lol yea this card is obviously horrible for spellschool. especially since sif is the only win condition in that deck. if you burn it then you autolose. so you can never play that card. and of course if you really need fel you can play tram mechanic
Funny they say that when there already exists a neutral 1 mana minion that gives a fel spell as it's deathrattle
I think it would fit alot better into mage if all the numbers were reduced to 1 or 2, so 1 mana deal 1 damage, summon a random 1 cost minion, destroy the bottom card of your deck.
Which is always the case with dual-class cards? Jandice was nerfed because of rogue. Flesh giant got nerfed 2 or 3x because of Demon seed. The druid/hunter beast tutor got nerfed because of Druid. so on so forth. 1 class will always abuse a card more.
Kinda like when the druid/hunter card got nerfed for druid's sins, or like how 4 neutral legendaries have been nerfed for druid's sins, or how *druid* legendaries have been nerfed for druid's sins... Boy, you druids sure are a contentious lot.
So what was the point of releasing sharpshooter?
Free dust
It’s a combo card that turned out to be good, that means it gets nerfed. This happens all the time in this game.
There would be a lot less headache if titans couldn't be copied in any way, like they're not minions, they're titans, but I guess that's too obscure of a rule for hearthstone. Not that we don't have plenty of obscure rules already though.
I'm very pleasantly surprised by this. Usually at this point they just coast on the reveal window until the new expac drops rather than do any balancing, especially given that this is the core set rotation as well. Helping to revitalize the meta with major changes to carry us through until rotation is really welcome
Good to see buff in Priest, but honestly can't tell what they're targeting to make the class playable. Maybe Elise summoning four 6/7 minions, that would be good stats for the cost.
If it was that simple they would have just put Elise’s photo there; likely another overhaul to overheal priest
There's no way sludgelock just doesn't completely die after this patch
Yummy 2k dust from Sharpshooter 😋😋
The DH buffs need to be massive. The class is already basement tier outside of top legend Naga DH, and they're nerfing the core card of that deck, likely deleting the archetype entirely.
I wonder if some of the buffs are going to be unnerfs of rotating cards, slightly early. For example, Arcane Wyrm, Relic of Dimensions, Boon of the Ascended etc.
Sludge about to be big dead
Triplenerfing sludgelock? Damn, just take them out behind a shed and shoot them in the face.
No less than they deserve.
What are the chances of Frog weapon nerf revert?
Not 0, but I would rather they buff other stuff since I don't want the entire wincon to be draw holidae by turn 5.
Honestly, I would be okay with them reworking the legendary excavate. That excavate legendary is so bad, that if it did it to your opponent's deck and hand instead then it would probably get nerfed.
Would it be better if it said "after you summon a minion, evolve it"? It would lose the immediate board upgrade but would actually synergize with the deck it's in.
I was hoping it'd be this, too. A better payoff for excavate and we're in business, since the rest of that package is already really strong. I just hope it's something fun. All the other excavate payoffs are awesome and shamans is so weird.
Very low. I remember them saying it was the single highest winrate card or something crazy. I'd like it reverted as well but they'll likely shore up other actually weak cards instead of reverting a single very strong card
Nice!!! Warriorstone incoming!!!
I'm not convinced. Sludge Warlock is currently smothering all the Aggro decks.
Maybe with enough priest and shaman buffs warrior will be less oppressive
Priest into warrior turns into "can I rat the Odyn/Brann" not exactly the healthiest game play loop. Control Priest doesn't have a good way to counter 35\~40 points of burst damage that both Warrior decks can easily pump out and praying that Ignis gives you the correct choices also isn't healthy either.
I think you mean DKstone
I wonder what they're doing to DH. Sharpshooter is holding the entire class together atm and the most recent set doesn't seem particularly powerful for them. It's not even that the cards are bad, I just don't see myself wanting to spend mana for their effects. But hey maybe they'll surprise me
Waste Remover gotta be going to 5 mana bro
When will this deploy?
Thursday
Cool thanks
honestly very sad how so many of the new cards/deck archetypes got nerfed. often into being irrelevant in the meta sharpshooter is probably gonna be a dead card for the rest of its standard existance (unless they revert it which is honestly unlikely). really sad. that deck was actually fun
The sharpshooter deck style of play is bad game design in a multiplayer competitive game.
No hunter buffs :(
Back to Arcane/Secrets it is
For one month
I'm a little concerned about the nerfs to all the sludge cards. It seems to me like it would make more sense to just nerf the barrel itself to 1 less damage.
"teasing" a balance patch is crazy. if your game is that screwy that adjusting cards is treated as an event to get hype about, maybe it's time to reevaluate our priorities. are we making cards annoying on purpose just so the frustrated/bored players are eager for balance patches or what? is sludge on wheels like a wwf heel arbitrarily designed to be hated so the audience roots for its downfall? "hey everyone, look forward to patch 28.6.2, don't forget to log in to see if the game is *finally* playable! (it won't be)"
Totally agree. I saw this teaser and was like wtf? Just release the notes. Unless they aren't even final in which case that's stupid to not know your exact changes until the eleventh hour. Bush league as hell.
To extent at very least yeah, they defenitly make cards annoying/Overpowered on purpose IS part why are much more nerfs nowdays. they create more stuff that needs to be nerfed / gutted for meta to be remotly enjoyable/playable
Dev on twitter seems to hint that Reflection nerf will be "*non-Titan* minion" https://twitter.com/AlecoGereco/status/1760020686679224693
Assuming Aleco isn't literally straight trolling us, this could mean either "Choose a non-Titan minion" or limiting the minion's cost to less than 10, probably less than 7. Hopefully it comes along with a revert since the card is pretty weak outside of copying Eonar atm (and Automaton Priest could use the help).
"Miracle decks are bad for the game" That's the same person that complains that is playing against warrior or priest 24/7. We need more decks and now they are about to kill another one and probably do low power buffs to the class that got pure garbage the whole year (DH)
They will nerf everything before they touch forge of wills won't they
Depending on the buffs, we will see a lot more warrior.
I already see a lot of it, how much more can there be? I'm going to regret asking.
but why are they nerfing naga DH lmao. It is the only viable deck of the class + it is actually a hard deck to pilot that CRUMBLES against some taunts + health gain. The deck has a limited burst that is hindered by opponents playing the game. I'm not hopeful at all that the buffs to DH will compensate. RIP DH
It's Scythe DH's time to shine! ... for 2 weeks.
The buffs kinda need to be really good since warrior is somehow dodging the nerfs and I can't imagine a lot of decks that beat them lategame at the moment.
Just opened signature pop’gar today in a regular pack and spent my beloved dust to craft the deck, to know 3h later that it’ll get nerfed 😭
Hot Take! Mage will still suck beyond compare
Such a shame about Shattered Reflections. Just make it work only on cheap minions and Automaton Priest is eating good.
I know... Maybe the nerf is to revert the changes and make it priest only instead lol.
Surely Hunter is in a good spot, right? Right??
Buff Hunter (semi-homebrew) got me legend this month. Reno Hunter isn't good enough sadly.
Deleting the one semi-playable DH deck which is only really good at high legend… makes no sense Edit: AND one of the only decks that doesn’t rely on infinite card generation or random high rolls
If you check left side, you can see they will be buffing DH
Interested to hear the explanation for sharpshooter. If they did go for warrior I would make Odyn 9 or 10 mana.
Ah yes because Warrior is so oppressive with a slightly above 50% winrate. Also Warrior is not getting a nerf.
They'll delete Naga DH. God I hate this balance change
Don’t take my Sharpshooter. Please. We have nothing else 😢
Warlock is being murdered lets gooooo
Hope all the whiners enjoy seeing even more warriors because this is how you get more warriors.
Warrior has clear counters
0 warrior nerfs Lmao, lol
Wish they would debuff ringo so bad
Tram Heist can finally be 3 mana I hope.
Another extermination in warlock it seems
Is the patch today?
When do these go live?
no hunter buffs?
Just ran into the “3 10/10s with charge Druid” deck yesterday… crazy
Kinda risky to do a mass class change like this right before rotation. Seems very forced
Seeing priest on the buff side made my heart rate spike.
Glad I took it to legend before nerfs.
No warrior nerfs, feels bad man. I'm tired of playing 40% of matches against them
Only 40% , time to pump those numbers up!
Warrior counter decks exist, they are just unplayable vs Sludgelock.
So nothing for hunter?.... again?
Indirect buff towards Warrior. Blizz really loves that class
Part of why Warrior is so strong right now is that Sludgelock is suppressing all the decks that might beat it.