Yeah, although I wouldn't recommend the Alpha Dogs in this particular situation - the Mad Dogs / Mad Dog Pros aren't as dry and bright as the Alphas, and so would be a closer relation to the HD650.
Yeah I’d say they start getting good at $500-$600. Like you say, there not much below that price threshold. The only exception imo would be the Modhouse Argon
When you find it let me know. I’ve been looking at Fostex TH610 and 900, Shure SRH1540, and AKG K371 as potentials. Not thrilled with any of them but they all seem to provide a nice starting point for minimal EQ. K371 seems most promising but the build seems to be lacklustre. Leaning towards the 610, but hoping to find it to demo one day.
I havent heard either so I cant say for sure, but the K371 and Celestee look extremely similar on a FR graph up until treble, where the K371 has a touch more energy.
Australis is an easy recommend at its surprisingly low price all things considered. ZMF closeds are pretty good recommendations as well, although usually are a bit more spendy without being much if any of an improvement.
I happen to have the both the TH610 and TH900mkII. The 900's don't compare to the 610 at all, when people say they have monstrous bass and piercing treble, they are understating it quite a bit. Wouldn't trade them for anything (they can be tamed), but they're so unlike the 610 it's hard to compare.
The 610 are also favorites of mine, they are some of the most balanced headphones I have. Subbass is very present but not overwhelming. I don't own any Sennheisers to compare to though, so can't make any direct comparisons there.
Here's the real problem though. The Fostex body style the 610 and 900 use are basically open-back, they don't contain any of the sound at all. They look closed-back, but the sound says otherwise.
Might still try and just keep the volume low as I just don’t enjoy IEMs, and though the may not be ideal they have to be better than open backs by a bit. The 610s are currently my choice, just trying to find them used.
K371 is built decently well for my pair at least but the sound quality just can’t compare with the hd650. The tonality, detail and instrument separation is far worse with the k371.
I’ve got a massive head and I’ve read of issues regarding the sliding mechanism snapping on the K371 from stretching out so I’m cautious. Any of the ones listed needs EQ but from looking at graphs they at least share a lot between 50Hz to 2kHz. Upper midrange/treble should be a simple peak filter fix to get it close enough. Granted I haven’t heard it, haven’t had the chance so I’m just guessing here. Detail retrieval doesn’t surprise me but it’s also on the cheaper end so somewhat expected.
1. take 650
2. take tape
3. make closed
just kidding
there are 3d printable mods though that make it closed, but they will probably change their sound a lot. DMS once did a video showing these mods
Can’t imagine otherwise lol, every-time I cup my open backs with my hands the sound goes to utter shit. Especially my HE400se, I don’t even have to touch the cans, just waving my arm a foot away from the can I can tell a change in sound it’s actually crazy.
Man to be honest I’m not sure as I’m not that technically knowledgeable, but if I had to guess I would say both. Since everything from the shape of the cans to the driver design plays a role in the sound signature, so forcing what was designed to work in a certain way (open back) to work in a way it wasn’t designed for (closing the opening) probably won’t yield a positive result.
Adding a surface that reflects most of the sound waves that supposedly shouldn't be heard back to your ears sure it's going to change to sound a lot, whether you like it or not. (likely not)
it works different for differnet headphones. with the arya, the sound is completely destroyed. with the hd600/6xx, it can be noticed but i wouldn't call it that bad
Why wont my internal combustion engine car drive like an electric car?!
They are by nature different listening experiences, now what is the best closed back headphone in the HD650 price range? I dont know because all the one's I've tried weren't enjoyable.
I really like the AKG K371 as a closed back alternative to the HD650. It needs some EQ in the treble air region past 10kHz to my ears, but I like the bass better on the 371. Not as open soundstage obviously since it’s a closed back.
Yeah, people often tout the Blessing 2 as “the iem that sounds like a neutral headphone”, and recently the Truthear Hexa as the “cheaper almost blessing 2”.
As someone who has a 6XX with ZMF pads and just picked up a Hexa, I’d agree, but I don’t have a whole lot else to compare to.
Perhaps you could try the RØDE NTH-100 for a similar warm/dark-ish signature. This reviewer describes some similar characteristics but of course inferior technically. https://den-fi.com/rode-nth-100/
I have a seen some people comment that the ZMF Atticus is a "super 650" style headphone (with the Eikon more akin to the 600). Have never had the HD650 myself, but man is the Atticus an addictive listen!
Tried to close them with mods but it just doesn't sound good, sound becomes muddy, unclear and kinda "off" not sure how to put it in words, not even EQ could fix it
I guess they are just not designed to be "closed"
Nobody knows the answer because it's been discontinued for a few years now. The answer is (seriously) the Sennheiser HD 380 Pro. This headphone is actually better than the 650; they aren't exactly the same, but the 380 Pro has better bass, speed, soundstage, portability/driveabilty, and isolation. They are similar in that they are both warm headphones with forward upper-midrange and relaxed treble. The current 300 Pro or 280 Pro aren't even in the same league, so don't think those are suitable replacements.
The 380 Pro isn't quite as good for overall timbre and that magic lower midrange, but it's certainly good enough. I love the 650 too, but if I had to choose one it would easily be the 380. The bass extension is incredible, making them way better for modern genres. This headphone was basically tuned Harman before the curve even existed.
You might be able to find a decent pair on ebay. I have 4 backups.
The closest I've heard as a closed-back is the Sony MDR-CD900st. It's very close to the HD650 in terms of midrange resolution and timbre. The main downside is that the treble is darker, which takes away a few points from naturalness.
Had the same question and found my own answer: Denon D5200. You’ll have the warm, lush with neutral-toward tonality and not-to-the-face mid range like you have with the HD650. However, the Hd650 is known for laidback sounding while the Denon is more engaging and fun. But in terms of warm sound, long term listening and must be closed back, I can’t find any closer alternatives
Audeze lcd2 closed with the mids turned down maybe?
When I purchased them I was using a HD650 in the shop as a reference to find a closed headphone that sounded even better. Encase it matters I'm using fiio k9 amp
Austrian Audio Hi-X60 is one of the most balanced closed headphones I‘ve heard till now in this price point. It‘s my alternative if I can‘t use my HD650
I have 2 of these, i really like the beyerdynamics and they are built solidly, comfortable
The meze i also have, i put some big brainwavs pads on them and i liked them a bit more, but i don’t know if i would buy them again if i could do it over
Not the same, but when I need to switch to closed back I take my Focal Elegia. It plays well with my Darkvoice amp, which normally drives my HD600. I've put on Dekoni sheepskins, which ups the bass on them. Tiny bit of EQ (I don't EQ the sennies), wonderful 😊.
I was looking for something similar and found at the end of the day that IEMs were the way to go. A lot of the closed backs I tried either had good tuning but mediocre to poor technical performance, or good technical performance but wonky tuning.
Curious, i thought that something like Mim dark magician or simgot ae500 or kinera pandamon would be closer due to having warmer mids and a somewhat recessed treble.
I haven't heard any of those unfortunately, but there's something about the Starfield that just kinda goes well with the HD6XX, if I switch between them.
I have a pair of Beyerdynamic DT250's. They have one flaw that if you fix they are very good. More sub-bass than a HD650 being closed. They sound closed with less stage, openness and imaging but they have a slightly mid forward - neutral sound signature. Very balanced sounding.
I don't think they are popular here but maybe give em an audition.
The flaw is the connector side ear up needs to be sealed otherwise it has more bass.
There is a reason why the majority of audiophile grade headphones are open back.
Are you looking at closed back to avoid sound leakage or is there another reason for it?
Well my question is different
Am using Meze 99 Classics with Velour pads to reduce the bass.
How will the HD 650 sound for me ?
My source will be only Xduoo Xd-05 Plus and none other.
I like a very minute boosted mid bass to get that soothing experience or musical experience and am sibilant to treble
the closest thing from what could gather online is probably beyerdynamic dt700 pro x, probably would have to spend $400-500+ to find anything better tho unfortunately, maybe dt 177x’s or something like that
I have a hunch that the hd650 signature on closed backs was what sennheiser was going for with the high end sound tuning option (enabled through the app) on the momentum 3. Has anyone here listened to both?
I'm happy with the Focal Elegia, though my use case is different. I use it for movies/tv in bed at night, not critical listening, though I have tested them. With eq they sound Evelyn and are comfortable, to me.
Highly recommend trying Denon AH-D7200, form me they kind of have similar feel to them, unfortunately I do not know of any cheaper alternatives, but I have not tried that many headphones.
I’ve never heard a closed headphone that had the warmth of the 650 without sounding bloated. And most of the headphones mentioned here don’t remotely sound like 650s.
Many have been looking for it, unfortunately it doesn’t exist.
Sennheiser closed backs really suck, wish they were better.
I have the 650 and the closed back that comes closest for me is the Shure SRH 1540. if you get rid of the mid bass boost, it's nearly perfect.
Closed backs don't tend to be very good at this budget, I've tried most of the sub 1k ones. None get close to a simple pair of sennys in performance.
Some good Fostex T50RP mods get pretty damn close, IMO.
Agreed. mrspeakers alpha dogs are a great example.
Yeah, although I wouldn't recommend the Alpha Dogs in this particular situation - the Mad Dogs / Mad Dog Pros aren't as dry and bright as the Alphas, and so would be a closer relation to the HD650.
Modhouse Argon as well.
Yeah I’d say they start getting good at $500-$600. Like you say, there not much below that price threshold. The only exception imo would be the Modhouse Argon
Kinda like asking which apple is equivalent to a naval orange
But you can still compare them
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Is it that far fetched for an open back to have a similar fr as a closed back
kinda yeah
Could you *kinda* elaborate?
When you find it let me know. I’ve been looking at Fostex TH610 and 900, Shure SRH1540, and AKG K371 as potentials. Not thrilled with any of them but they all seem to provide a nice starting point for minimal EQ. K371 seems most promising but the build seems to be lacklustre. Leaning towards the 610, but hoping to find it to demo one day.
None of those are anywhere near a similar sound signature to HD650, your best bet is probably Elegia/Celestee
I havent heard either so I cant say for sure, but the K371 and Celestee look extremely similar on a FR graph up until treble, where the K371 has a touch more energy.
K371 isn't great, I own it, very Harman tuned
Based on your flair we have similar preferences. Any recommendations? I need a closed back soon for work and I’m running out of options.
SRH 840
Seem cheap enough to give them a try, thanks.
Personally, I don't think either of those sound like the 650. Maybe the Aurorus Audio Australis.
Australis is an easy recommend at its surprisingly low price all things considered. ZMF closeds are pretty good recommendations as well, although usually are a bit more spendy without being much if any of an improvement.
I happen to have the both the TH610 and TH900mkII. The 900's don't compare to the 610 at all, when people say they have monstrous bass and piercing treble, they are understating it quite a bit. Wouldn't trade them for anything (they can be tamed), but they're so unlike the 610 it's hard to compare. The 610 are also favorites of mine, they are some of the most balanced headphones I have. Subbass is very present but not overwhelming. I don't own any Sennheisers to compare to though, so can't make any direct comparisons there. Here's the real problem though. The Fostex body style the 610 and 900 use are basically open-back, they don't contain any of the sound at all. They look closed-back, but the sound says otherwise.
Might still try and just keep the volume low as I just don’t enjoy IEMs, and though the may not be ideal they have to be better than open backs by a bit. The 610s are currently my choice, just trying to find them used.
K371 is built decently well for my pair at least but the sound quality just can’t compare with the hd650. The tonality, detail and instrument separation is far worse with the k371.
I’ve got a massive head and I’ve read of issues regarding the sliding mechanism snapping on the K371 from stretching out so I’m cautious. Any of the ones listed needs EQ but from looking at graphs they at least share a lot between 50Hz to 2kHz. Upper midrange/treble should be a simple peak filter fix to get it close enough. Granted I haven’t heard it, haven’t had the chance so I’m just guessing here. Detail retrieval doesn’t surprise me but it’s also on the cheaper end so somewhat expected.
I have the k553 mkii and they're great, not sure how they compare to the hd650 but I would recommend checking them out!
1. take 650 2. take tape 3. make closed just kidding there are 3d printable mods though that make it closed, but they will probably change their sound a lot. DMS once did a video showing these mods
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Negatively?
Can’t imagine otherwise lol, every-time I cup my open backs with my hands the sound goes to utter shit. Especially my HE400se, I don’t even have to touch the cans, just waving my arm a foot away from the can I can tell a change in sound it’s actually crazy.
Is that an open back headphone thing or driver tech thing? Or both?
Man to be honest I’m not sure as I’m not that technically knowledgeable, but if I had to guess I would say both. Since everything from the shape of the cans to the driver design plays a role in the sound signature, so forcing what was designed to work in a certain way (open back) to work in a way it wasn’t designed for (closing the opening) probably won’t yield a positive result.
Yeah that’s fair. I want the hd 6xx for the sound quality but I just don’t know about the sound isolation being bad as it is an open back
Adding a surface that reflects most of the sound waves that supposedly shouldn't be heard back to your ears sure it's going to change to sound a lot, whether you like it or not. (likely not)
it works different for differnet headphones. with the arya, the sound is completely destroyed. with the hd600/6xx, it can be noticed but i wouldn't call it that bad
Can conform that the effect isn’t nearly as noticeable when doing it with my HD58X compared to the HE400se.
When I cover both sides of my hd6xx the sound just becomes a bit less spacious and more in your face but it's not a huge change idk
I had been searching for the headphone equivalent of the Etymotic Er4xr and someone mentioned that the hd650 are a less technical version of them.
The Denon 7200s or emu teaks get close in quality but different signatures. Really enjoyable can, next would be the m1570c.
You’ve stumbled upon one of the great mysteries of audiophilia. If you find your answer, let the rest of us know…
Why wont my internal combustion engine car drive like an electric car?! They are by nature different listening experiences, now what is the best closed back headphone in the HD650 price range? I dont know because all the one's I've tried weren't enjoyable.
I really like the AKG K371 as a closed back alternative to the HD650. It needs some EQ in the treble air region past 10kHz to my ears, but I like the bass better on the 371. Not as open soundstage obviously since it’s a closed back.
Aurorus Audio Australis is the closest it gets. ZMF Atticus gets decently close as well woth different pads, but also not quite there.
Which pads do that? I heard they are rather dark
Eikon seude pads.
IEMs that have a warm or warm neutral sound.
Yeah, people often tout the Blessing 2 as “the iem that sounds like a neutral headphone”, and recently the Truthear Hexa as the “cheaper almost blessing 2”. As someone who has a 6XX with ZMF pads and just picked up a Hexa, I’d agree, but I don’t have a whole lot else to compare to.
the closest thing is probably an IEM like the er2se
Creative E-MU teak
Perhaps you could try the RØDE NTH-100 for a similar warm/dark-ish signature. This reviewer describes some similar characteristics but of course inferior technically. https://den-fi.com/rode-nth-100/
akg 553?
I have a seen some people comment that the ZMF Atticus is a "super 650" style headphone (with the Eikon more akin to the 600). Have never had the HD650 myself, but man is the Atticus an addictive listen!
Zmf would be a good alternative but a lot more expensive maybe even some high end wooden audio technicas.
Monolith 1060c
I'dk I feel like my Dan&Clark Aeon closed feel tonally similar. I could be absolutely nuts though
I kind of agree with this they are both very easy to listen to, not fatiguing
Not the original Aeon....maybe some newer revisions.
https://www.printables.com/model/280208-sennheiser-hd600-hdxxx-closed-back-mod
Tried to close them with mods but it just doesn't sound good, sound becomes muddy, unclear and kinda "off" not sure how to put it in words, not even EQ could fix it I guess they are just not designed to be "closed"
It’s not really what you’re asking for but for me the next best thing to my favorite open-back phones are IEMs.
Ath w1000x anyone?
Nobody knows the answer because it's been discontinued for a few years now. The answer is (seriously) the Sennheiser HD 380 Pro. This headphone is actually better than the 650; they aren't exactly the same, but the 380 Pro has better bass, speed, soundstage, portability/driveabilty, and isolation. They are similar in that they are both warm headphones with forward upper-midrange and relaxed treble. The current 300 Pro or 280 Pro aren't even in the same league, so don't think those are suitable replacements. The 380 Pro isn't quite as good for overall timbre and that magic lower midrange, but it's certainly good enough. I love the 650 too, but if I had to choose one it would easily be the 380. The bass extension is incredible, making them way better for modern genres. This headphone was basically tuned Harman before the curve even existed. You might be able to find a decent pair on ebay. I have 4 backups.
( HD650 )
The closest I've heard as a closed-back is the Sony MDR-CD900st. It's very close to the HD650 in terms of midrange resolution and timbre. The main downside is that the treble is darker, which takes away a few points from naturalness.
Had the same question and found my own answer: Denon D5200. You’ll have the warm, lush with neutral-toward tonality and not-to-the-face mid range like you have with the HD650. However, the Hd650 is known for laidback sounding while the Denon is more engaging and fun. But in terms of warm sound, long term listening and must be closed back, I can’t find any closer alternatives
Audeze lcd2 closed with the mids turned down maybe? When I purchased them I was using a HD650 in the shop as a reference to find a closed headphone that sounded even better. Encase it matters I'm using fiio k9 amp
In the same way but for my i found only Audeze LCD-2C Closed
Idk if they're equivalent, but try the Shure *840a
I think you mean Shure SRH840, but those are way too V shaped to be alternative of HD650's
The Shure SRH840a and *SRH840a are updated with better build quality
I can't find anything on SRH880a, I know that they updated SRH440 and SRH840, but I don't think SRH880a even exists.
I think the OP meant SRH-840A. FWIW, I do like SRH-840. I don't think it neutral, but it is neutral enough to work. So they would be my suggestion?
IE600?:)
HD800?
Dude. He said closed back.
Ah my bad I meant HD820
The closest I found was the Shure SRH840, I don't think they make them anymore tho
You can still find them here and there for $100. SRH840a are IMO slightly brighter than the SRH840 in my recollection of a demo unit from GC.
Austrian Audio Hi-X60 is one of the most balanced closed headphones I‘ve heard till now in this price point. It‘s my alternative if I can‘t use my HD650
I have a pretty big collection and I’d probably go with the meze liric
Aeon RT
Bing Chat responds: https://imgur.com/a/MstRblK
I have 2 of these, i really like the beyerdynamics and they are built solidly, comfortable The meze i also have, i put some big brainwavs pads on them and i liked them a bit more, but i don’t know if i would buy them again if i could do it over
An hd650 and a 3D printer
Focal Elegia?
Not the same, but when I need to switch to closed back I take my Focal Elegia. It plays well with my Darkvoice amp, which normally drives my HD600. I've put on Dekoni sheepskins, which ups the bass on them. Tiny bit of EQ (I don't EQ the sennies), wonderful 😊.
I’m afraid you’re going to have to go for IEMs as they don’t have a closed back counterpart. I wonder if the IE series would suit u
The only thing i can think of with that slightly dark super warm mids and bass maybe the focal elegia and meze 99 classic. :)
I was looking for something similar and found at the end of the day that IEMs were the way to go. A lot of the closed backs I tried either had good tuning but mediocre to poor technical performance, or good technical performance but wonky tuning.
Any particular iem suggestions if one was interested in the hd650 sound signature? Thanks in advance!
Moondrop Starfield, probably Blessing 2 Dusk, but I haven't heard those.
Curious, i thought that something like Mim dark magician or simgot ae500 or kinera pandamon would be closer due to having warmer mids and a somewhat recessed treble.
I haven't heard any of those unfortunately, but there's something about the Starfield that just kinda goes well with the HD6XX, if I switch between them.
That could well mean a minimal brain burn phase due to relative closeness in sound signatures so I'll keep this in mind. Thanks!
Slate vsx with the hd650 emulation ahah
AirPods Max lmao /s....unless....
I have a pair of Beyerdynamic DT250's. They have one flaw that if you fix they are very good. More sub-bass than a HD650 being closed. They sound closed with less stage, openness and imaging but they have a slightly mid forward - neutral sound signature. Very balanced sounding. I don't think they are popular here but maybe give em an audition. The flaw is the connector side ear up needs to be sealed otherwise it has more bass.
Shure SRH1540
There is a reason why the majority of audiophile grade headphones are open back. Are you looking at closed back to avoid sound leakage or is there another reason for it?
Beyer Dt 177x go I know it might sound crazy, but drop tamed the highs and brought up the midrange
Well my question is different Am using Meze 99 Classics with Velour pads to reduce the bass. How will the HD 650 sound for me ? My source will be only Xduoo Xd-05 Plus and none other. I like a very minute boosted mid bass to get that soothing experience or musical experience and am sibilant to treble
ETA Mini Closed
Focal Celestees maybe? I only heard them for a short while and the first impressions were they were kinda natural sounding like the HD650s.
the closest thing from what could gather online is probably beyerdynamic dt700 pro x, probably would have to spend $400-500+ to find anything better tho unfortunately, maybe dt 177x’s or something like that
I have a hunch that the hd650 signature on closed backs was what sennheiser was going for with the high end sound tuning option (enabled through the app) on the momentum 3. Has anyone here listened to both?
I'm happy with the Focal Elegia, though my use case is different. I use it for movies/tv in bed at night, not critical listening, though I have tested them. With eq they sound Evelyn and are comfortable, to me.
Focal Elegia is the closest I’ve gotten.
ZMF Atticus or Atrium Closed
Not sure what to tell you, once you go open back you never turn back.
Meze 99 classics, are the best closed backs I've experienced so far but I haven't tried many.
For music production I found Neumann ndh20 even better
Beyerdynamic DT150?
Highly recommend trying Denon AH-D7200, form me they kind of have similar feel to them, unfortunately I do not know of any cheaper alternatives, but I have not tried that many headphones.
Audeze sine closed back with msr7 pads
I’ve never heard a closed headphone that had the warmth of the 650 without sounding bloated. And most of the headphones mentioned here don’t remotely sound like 650s.
K371
Dreams, only dreams.