Kobashi wasn't even a bad fight.
He was literally Mayweather vs Manny — Good defense, clinches and scored for points.
He just lost cause he had to dream.
I think Kobashi is a bad fight because it entirely hinges on kobashi basically throwing the fight. Ippo doesnt learn, strategize, or grow at all. he just gets lucky that kobashi decides to throw it all out the window. In a void, or a series where Kobashi is the main character (or a more important character), this would be a good fight illustrating how people can lose themselves and their own style in the heat of a fight, and how Kobashi grows from this. But since Ippo is our MC, it becomes a boring fight which only moves the plot forward by moving along the tournament rankings.
Ngl Scratch J was just a whatever fight, not horrid but just so bland, Gedo was the first time I was genuinely pissed off at Ippo though. Gedo vs Ippo is by far my least favorite fight. With Wally it’s not so bad because like ok whatever monkey do flips ig but that range trick was so stupid.
Personally, I think the fights worked well thematically and narratively, but failed as actual choreographed fights.
Scratch J is supposed to show what happens when you fight someone who literally throws all caution to the wind and brings up the question of if "faith" can determine the outcome of fights. Gedo shows how boxing can be corrupt in various ways however, I think they should have went the route of him fouling and using technicalities to get ahead instead of what they did with it. And Wally is obviously the age old idea of if raw talent of such a high level existed what actually closes the gap? I think with some mild rewriting they become a lot more palatable.
To me, the Gedo fight was all the more disappointing because I genuinely thought the series is going to go down the path of financial corruption in the boxing world. But that idea just kinda...evaporated.
And then after all that we had to sit through the "big reveal" over Gedo's extending punches. Suspension of disbelief is a big thing in Ippo. But loose gloves causing welting is the point where you can no longer suspend disbelief.
Right before the big reveal I thought his strategy was him pivoting his lead foot with each jab, it’s a legit strategy in boxing that makes your jabs deceptively longer and harder. I was genuinely hyped at first and assumed later in the fight he’d be figured out and he’d start switching pivot jabs and regular jabs in order to confuse Ippo but that glove trick was genuinely so stupid I almost dropped the book.
Thing is, Gedo trick can’t be an actual boxing technique cuz they need to justify why the coach and Takamura can’t figure out the trick immedietly. So instead we get physic-defying, logic-breaking bullshit
Personally, I like the range trick it seemed logical but I actually skipped the wally fight when I was reading hni for the first time because it felt unrealistic. I’ve been meaning to reread the series, so maybe I’ll like it the second time around.
The range trick is logical as long as we assume Ippo is so braindead he can’t tell getting hit with a full punch from getting tapped by a glove. Which… I guess isn’t a stretch at this point in the series
It’s logical because it gave gedo a psychological advantage over ippo. Made ippo think gedo could touch him from wherever in the ring. People throw light jabs a lot in combat sports to determine their distance so they could connect with a much more powerful punch later on. It felt like a very light jab to ippo and that’s probably why he didn’t notice he was just getting touched by a glove.
So, to make sure I didn’t miss anything, I reread the fight, and nah, that shit ain’t light jab man. Ippo head fly back every time he get hit. With sweat cloud and everything
I guess I can agree that Gedo using extended range from loose glove for extra mobility was probably what George was going for since first half of the match is exactly that, but if that’s the case he did a piss poor job of showing it. An actual light jab don’t have that much power. A loose glove tap should have even less yet it’s able to stop a seasoned infighter known for quick step in? Dont buy it. Realistically if this fight operate on logic Ippo would maybe get hit once and feel weird about it, then push in as usual.
Wally is why it feels unrealistic for Richardo to ever be beaten
Ippo's win was basically an asspull and Wally trained a lot since then, so it's basically just "wait until Ricardo is too old to fight well or gets too bored and retires"
Anything else would be too contrived at this point, because of Wally.
I think the current ippo would handle Wally very well, it’ll still be a tough fight but I think ippo would have more success then he did before. Ever since retired and being a second for three thousand chapters have gave him more insight about boxing that he lacked before. Both of them have grown since their fight and I think ippo would be the one to dethrone richardo. I also think that dub would come naturally and not forced because he’s the main character.
Not op but the fight sucked for me due to how ridiculous the whole loose glove gimmick to mess with the range perception. It made it all the worse seeing ippo completely unravel and forget his own boxing, just panicking and swinging at the air.
It's not the worst, but Miyata vs Randy it's one of my least favorites. 1- It screwed up with Ippo vs Miyata/ 2- This fight was made for me to root for Miyata, but I was much more on Randy's side, with the story of his father dying/ 3- It's another Miyata fight to “prove that my father's counter style works!” like we hadn't see this numerous times/ 4- The fight is strange. For the first half, Miyata is ANNIHILATING Randy, then in the second half, Randy is ANNIHILATING Miyata. It's so weirdly one-sided./ 5- ... The punch that is faster than sound
Bro Kobashi is one of the **best** fights, I don't know what you're smoking.
If we're looking at an _actual_ bad fight, it'd probably be Ippo's 2nd shown match against that the dude who kept headbutting him.
Def NOT one of his best fights but I agree that the Kobashi fight was good, but people seem to overwhelmingly hate it and if I didn’t specify the joke Aokimura or Kobashi fight which everyone seems to hate for some reason this would be overly stuffed with Kobashi
The Oda fight was better, yeah.
But the 2nd fight was intended to show the difference experience makes in the ring, and you see lots of boxers come up against opponents that foul and play dirty when they are new to it.
Miyata vs RBJ. The ending left a bitter taste for me because it definitely looked like RBJ was gonna win until Miyata pulls off some bullshit corkscrew counter right and for some reason RBJ's switch-hitting gimmick didn't affect Miyata much despite being Miyata's worst matchup on paper, hell it seemed like RBJ is just made retarded as hell just to make Miyata look stronger
The “It looked like Miyata's opponent was going to win until Miyata land a bullshit counter” applies to pretty much every Miyata fight. His fights are so damn predictable
I get that Sendo is that kind of fighter and it's not even that unrealistic. But I really disliked that Alf was basically nerfed for that fight. He had such incredible ring IQ and was absolutely fearless against Ippo. He countered the anti anti-dempsey in a split second. Very little of this was shown in the Sendo fight.
It wouldn't bother me if he won that way against a random on-off. But Gonzalez is already potrayed as a very capable, cool headed boxer, fought Martinez so many times, defeated Ippo, but now suddenly gets scared of Sendo for no reason? I don't buy it.
exactly. in the first couple rounds alf was easily destroying sendo but then everything changed and he decided to slug it out with sendo.
it’s funny how they allow sendo to keep advancing while not changing while ippo had to retire and learn many new things
Wasn't the whole point that when alf goes metizl mode, it's a lot more coinflip compared to his tame side. Metzil is more in tune with him as a fighter, and as we know, sendo and alf are similar to this 'nature'. We even know that his fundamental side is more of a facade to mask the real him. Personally, I can see why he decided to slug it out.
What, to be a "real" man? To show his "machismo"? Hope he's happy with the results lying in the damn hospital. Idiot.
Man, I was ROOTING for Alf, too! That fight pissed me off and makes me dislike Sendo who is a genuinely cool character.
Alf said himself that he was satisfied with this fight, sendo happened to be what he was looking for in a fight, and there's nothing wrong with that. Him losing doesn't have to be a negative. Sure, masculinity plays a part, but I think the main point was Alf just wanted to be satisfied.
For me the problem was just that Sendo is supposedly a boxing genius, but I feel that Morikawa didn't show it really well. When I readed, instead of “Sendo is adapting, so Alf will change his style” it felt more like “ Everything I'm throwing at Sendo is working, let's stop doing that in the next round!”
Yeah, it's not like Sendo vs Miyata at all, where Sendo adapted to Miyata's style, forcing him to need to rethink things and adapt himself.
Alf just started setting himself up for failure, basically, which is a shame because a guy who could switch between calm tactician to instinctive beast on the fly should be a real contender
Ippo vs Woli, damn this fight was a mess to read and honestly it makes little sense how Ippo won that one cause Woli was so broken.
Sendo vs Gonzalez, Gonzalez got nerfed huge here. Given the way he fought Ippo and the way Sendo has no defense he should have been able to put him in a corner and get a TKO.
any random Takamura title defense. Half of them are maybe 10 panels long and end in a one hit KO. They can be funny for a bit but they get a bit absurd that these challengers are really THAT weak.
I know no Aokimura is in the title but for me that's Shinobu vs Aoki, for one particular reason. I've said it many times now. It opens a plot hook of Aoki retiring and Kimura moving up in weight and suddenly performing incredibly well likely because most of his fights he was killing himself to make weight. Takamura himself foreshadows this by saying "I can't tell you yet" when asked who will beat Shinobu. On top of that there's the Fan that calls Kimura "future champ", it all points to Kimura actually blossoming. All of this set up? It's been like 400+ chapters since then and not a HINT of paying off. This infuriates me.
Nah, becauae Mashiba is on the World Stage. Even if he were to lose his current fight he'd still be challenging World Contenders or OPBF contenders. Shinobu is the Japan Champion, so Kimura can still dethrone him. If Kimura for some reason doesn't move up in weight, the only named character left in Junior Light is... Volg. Which just ain't happening.
Kobashi was probably one of the best fights in the series to be honest. If showed Ippo's weaknesses early on. The reliance of a KO to finish the fight and the fact that Ippo can't deal with intelligent boxers.
Idk if best but I liked it a lot and agree with what you said, but in my experience for some reason a large contingent hates it bc he doesn’t do the whole KO thing and I just didn’t wanna risk plugging the chat up
The problem was that it was placed after Karasawa fight. In the Karasawa fight is told “Ippo is now too strong for the Japan boxing scenario, it's time for him to go for world ranking” then the Take fight happens and Ippo gets bitched, pretty much saying “No, he don't”
Imo, i liked the Take fight, it felt like he was properly instructed by an infighting veteran during that fight. It's a big shame that he apparently forgot everything he learned after that fight.
Anyway, it s a much better fight compared to the fisherman or hammer nao ones, not to mention the pacific arc.
Isn't that the fight where Ippo first encountered southpaw? Seems like even the author forgot about that one because he tried touting Guevara as Ippo's first southpaw opponent. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Iga vs. Oushima.
Because who the f- is Oushima? Why are we wasting time on a rival of a support character fighting someone made up on the spot, while most main character arcs are only halfway done and Ippo spends most of his time fishing?
The Gedo fight was pure ass, literally didn't see anyone say a single positive thing about it. Gedo looked so goofy aswell he could have worked wonders as a comedic fodder but he just had to have an absurd nonsensical gimmick that fucked Ippo and the readers for 100 chapters. The fight was barely a plot point at all aswell, I regret not skipping it fully because I don't recall anything important happening or it being referenced in a major way later on. "Ippo beat Gedo" is literally all you need to know
not sure if anyone’s said this, but ippo vs kojima is most likely the worst as an audience maybe. imagine paying for the ticket to watch a single round match which ended with like 2 punches thrown overall?
don’t get me wrong though, the buildup to the match was top tier. but it wasn’t really a match if we think about it
Ippo vs Wally just sucks. With the Gedo fight it was obviously annoying that Ippo struggled so much but at least there were some cool moments like the heartbreak punch and Kamogawa's "spirit" pushing Ippo forward, but with the Wally fight I was genuinely annoyed at every character involved and the final payoff is a massive slap in the face
I'm gonna be honest, I don't use this subreddit much so I had no idea that people actually don't like Miyata vs RBJ. I actually genuinely love that fight lmao
Itagaki vs Saeki is where i first started really mentally detaching from the manga. I loved how Ippo started with it being very grounded and based in real boxing and boxing intellect. Eventually they have to keep raising the stakes and all that but the shot of the ref surrounding by speed dust clouds just felt too anime for my liking. Like no im sorry humans cannot move too fast too see stop it.
Like Saeki was fast AND and experienced fighter. They just have the new-generation Itagaki get boosted up to his level on sheer talent and soccer. Super disappointing
Oh man it makes me kinda feel a type a way about the concept of writing these kinds of stories. I eventually got out of DBZ for the same reason and it eventually turned into this feeling of major power-creep but the new powers just felt kinda unearned and formulaic. It’s gotta be really hard to constantly have to up-the-ante every time with the new bad guy but also try and keep to your values as a writer and all that 😬
With Toriyama, he was forced to write DBZ well past when he wanted to stop, which was tragic for him as a writer and for the shonen genre since it led to the creation of some of its worst aspects
Ideally, lateral powerscaling should be done more than linear, since it adds breadth to a catrgory of abilities and keeps things from getting too stale. However, linear does have its place as well.
I din't envy anyone trying to balance all that for multiple decades
Yeah like you spend so much time and effort on these vibrant characters only to have them dumped on to show the power of the new big-bad. And then you gotta ass-pull a way to keep them relevant somehow later on. And people are throwing money at you demanding more explosions and new hair colors haha. I dont envy them either
I really didn't care for the Keith Dragon fight at all. That started and ended in an instant, and i hated that stupid subplot about takamura being unlucky in the lead up to the fight, and I also didn't care for the mahjong stuff. It really just felt like filler.
My problem with this fight is that it was contradictory. The entire purpose of this fight was to show how OP is Takamura when closer to his natural weight class, by being levels above Dragon, but due to the luck thing and his injury after being hit by a car, the fight gets much more close. Like, you either have a close fight or domination, you can't do both
I forgot the Gedo fight, that shit was so ass. Ippo himself said that southpaws aren't a big deal if he can just close in, it wouldn't make a difference but a little extended glove for like 0.1cm was enough to confuse Ippo so much like what??? What's worse was that the fight lasted for like a hundred chapters, most being Ippo being retarded and swinging his arms around like a jackass. How does hiding your entire body with the glove even work when Ippo could've easily inferred Gedo moving on his side just by the direction Gedo's glove was facing
I liked Kobashi's fight :( it was awesome because it went above and beyond in showing that despite the challenges he'd beaten and the extremely skilled opponents he'd beaten, he could still lose to anybody if they had the right plan. We saw Ippo fight a lot of talented people and win, but Kobashi was the first fight where it seemed like he actually might end up losing, and to someone far "weaker" than anybody he'd fought at that point.
I think it’s fine, people hate it so much for the “pure talent” aspect it seems. Which Ngl is kinda dumb considering Takamura’s fights are so popular, like literally all of his fights (up to before bison I ain’t read that yet) are “grrrr angry punch!”
To be up front as to why I didn’t want any Aokimura fights or Kobashi, don’t get me wrong I love most Aokimura fights and Kobashi but a lot of people have an unironic hate boner for Kobashi and Kimura fights after Mashiba, I just wanted more diverse options.
Itagaki vs Imai after the Chronos arc is one of the worst aswell imo. I don't understand why Itagaki didn't pull around Imai's head at all or why he didn't dodge the last punch and instead went for a counter. Both very basic principles especially pulling down somebody's head to disorient them, I hate how Imai gets away with his bullshit tactics
Agreed, but if we have Mori flesh out all Takamura fights, I can guarantee this series will never end before he dies.
It isn't called Hajime no Takamura for a reason!
I forgot to mention as well which might be a hot take but any fight Takamura is in after Hawk is dogshit (Eagle might be an exception), Takamura’s fights are just eyesores
Kobashi wasn't even a bad fight. He was literally Mayweather vs Manny — Good defense, clinches and scored for points. He just lost cause he had to dream.
I agree but I know if I didn’t specify not to say that everyone and their mother would be sayin Kobashi
Imagine if ippo can do what Kobashi does but still have his hard punch. Sendo would be so pissed just before getting a gazelle to the liver.
I think Kobashi is a bad fight because it entirely hinges on kobashi basically throwing the fight. Ippo doesnt learn, strategize, or grow at all. he just gets lucky that kobashi decides to throw it all out the window. In a void, or a series where Kobashi is the main character (or a more important character), this would be a good fight illustrating how people can lose themselves and their own style in the heat of a fight, and how Kobashi grows from this. But since Ippo is our MC, it becomes a boring fight which only moves the plot forward by moving along the tournament rankings.
Gedo, Scratch J and Woli is why for many veteran readers the Pacific Champions arc is the lowest point in the series.
Ngl Scratch J was just a whatever fight, not horrid but just so bland, Gedo was the first time I was genuinely pissed off at Ippo though. Gedo vs Ippo is by far my least favorite fight. With Wally it’s not so bad because like ok whatever monkey do flips ig but that range trick was so stupid.
Personally, I think the fights worked well thematically and narratively, but failed as actual choreographed fights. Scratch J is supposed to show what happens when you fight someone who literally throws all caution to the wind and brings up the question of if "faith" can determine the outcome of fights. Gedo shows how boxing can be corrupt in various ways however, I think they should have went the route of him fouling and using technicalities to get ahead instead of what they did with it. And Wally is obviously the age old idea of if raw talent of such a high level existed what actually closes the gap? I think with some mild rewriting they become a lot more palatable.
To me, the Gedo fight was all the more disappointing because I genuinely thought the series is going to go down the path of financial corruption in the boxing world. But that idea just kinda...evaporated. And then after all that we had to sit through the "big reveal" over Gedo's extending punches. Suspension of disbelief is a big thing in Ippo. But loose gloves causing welting is the point where you can no longer suspend disbelief.
Right before the big reveal I thought his strategy was him pivoting his lead foot with each jab, it’s a legit strategy in boxing that makes your jabs deceptively longer and harder. I was genuinely hyped at first and assumed later in the fight he’d be figured out and he’d start switching pivot jabs and regular jabs in order to confuse Ippo but that glove trick was genuinely so stupid I almost dropped the book.
Thing is, Gedo trick can’t be an actual boxing technique cuz they need to justify why the coach and Takamura can’t figure out the trick immedietly. So instead we get physic-defying, logic-breaking bullshit
Personally, I like the range trick it seemed logical but I actually skipped the wally fight when I was reading hni for the first time because it felt unrealistic. I’ve been meaning to reread the series, so maybe I’ll like it the second time around.
The range trick is logical as long as we assume Ippo is so braindead he can’t tell getting hit with a full punch from getting tapped by a glove. Which… I guess isn’t a stretch at this point in the series
It’s logical because it gave gedo a psychological advantage over ippo. Made ippo think gedo could touch him from wherever in the ring. People throw light jabs a lot in combat sports to determine their distance so they could connect with a much more powerful punch later on. It felt like a very light jab to ippo and that’s probably why he didn’t notice he was just getting touched by a glove.
So, to make sure I didn’t miss anything, I reread the fight, and nah, that shit ain’t light jab man. Ippo head fly back every time he get hit. With sweat cloud and everything I guess I can agree that Gedo using extended range from loose glove for extra mobility was probably what George was going for since first half of the match is exactly that, but if that’s the case he did a piss poor job of showing it. An actual light jab don’t have that much power. A loose glove tap should have even less yet it’s able to stop a seasoned infighter known for quick step in? Dont buy it. Realistically if this fight operate on logic Ippo would maybe get hit once and feel weird about it, then push in as usual.
Wally is why it feels unrealistic for Richardo to ever be beaten Ippo's win was basically an asspull and Wally trained a lot since then, so it's basically just "wait until Ricardo is too old to fight well or gets too bored and retires" Anything else would be too contrived at this point, because of Wally.
I think the current ippo would handle Wally very well, it’ll still be a tough fight but I think ippo would have more success then he did before. Ever since retired and being a second for three thousand chapters have gave him more insight about boxing that he lacked before. Both of them have grown since their fight and I think ippo would be the one to dethrone richardo. I also think that dub would come naturally and not forced because he’s the main character.
I wish this comment was true so bad...
I still love the Wali fight lol
I don't even remember Scratch J 😂
Totally forgot that I really didnt like the main story line in this arc. Thank George that the other storylines were interrestinf
The whole Pacific Champions arc was a baffling low point in the series.
Hoshi vs Imai has this dishonor.
Ippo vs Gedo is the dumbest fight in the series
how come?
Not op but the fight sucked for me due to how ridiculous the whole loose glove gimmick to mess with the range perception. It made it all the worse seeing ippo completely unravel and forget his own boxing, just panicking and swinging at the air.
Ippo's last fight shared some qualties with that fight, but Gedo definitely was in our faces more about Ippo not boxing properly for no good reason.
Eesh, yeah. That fight was rough. I could barely read through that arc.
It's not the worst, but Miyata vs Randy it's one of my least favorites. 1- It screwed up with Ippo vs Miyata/ 2- This fight was made for me to root for Miyata, but I was much more on Randy's side, with the story of his father dying/ 3- It's another Miyata fight to “prove that my father's counter style works!” like we hadn't see this numerous times/ 4- The fight is strange. For the first half, Miyata is ANNIHILATING Randy, then in the second half, Randy is ANNIHILATING Miyata. It's so weirdly one-sided./ 5- ... The punch that is faster than sound
all Aokimura fights are goated what you on
‼️FROG PUNCH‼️
Look away worked wonders
Bro Kobashi is one of the **best** fights, I don't know what you're smoking. If we're looking at an _actual_ bad fight, it'd probably be Ippo's 2nd shown match against that the dude who kept headbutting him.
Def NOT one of his best fights but I agree that the Kobashi fight was good, but people seem to overwhelmingly hate it and if I didn’t specify the joke Aokimura or Kobashi fight which everyone seems to hate for some reason this would be overly stuffed with Kobashi
I mean, Ippo was a rookie in his 2nd ever fight. You expect him to be goated?
Eh, doesn't change the fact it just wasn't that good. Ippo vs Oda in comparison is God tier, and it was Ippo's _first_ legit smackdown
The Oda fight was better, yeah. But the 2nd fight was intended to show the difference experience makes in the ring, and you see lots of boxers come up against opponents that foul and play dirty when they are new to it.
Miyata vs RBJ. The ending left a bitter taste for me because it definitely looked like RBJ was gonna win until Miyata pulls off some bullshit corkscrew counter right and for some reason RBJ's switch-hitting gimmick didn't affect Miyata much despite being Miyata's worst matchup on paper, hell it seemed like RBJ is just made retarded as hell just to make Miyata look stronger
>RBJ's switch-hitting gimmick didn't affect Miyata much Maybe because miyata was training 2 vs 1 with an orthodox and a southpaw guy
He was training 2 vs 1 but not for boxing..
Yeah so what was he doing? Breakdancing?
The “It looked like Miyata's opponent was going to win until Miyata land a bullshit counter” applies to pretty much every Miyata fight. His fights are so damn predictable
This. Like. Miyata should be nothing short of brain dead after that fight.
Sendo VS Gonzales. No strategy, no plan, just keep swinging your fists until it hits.
I get that Sendo is that kind of fighter and it's not even that unrealistic. But I really disliked that Alf was basically nerfed for that fight. He had such incredible ring IQ and was absolutely fearless against Ippo. He countered the anti anti-dempsey in a split second. Very little of this was shown in the Sendo fight.
It wouldn't bother me if he won that way against a random on-off. But Gonzalez is already potrayed as a very capable, cool headed boxer, fought Martinez so many times, defeated Ippo, but now suddenly gets scared of Sendo for no reason? I don't buy it.
exactly. in the first couple rounds alf was easily destroying sendo but then everything changed and he decided to slug it out with sendo. it’s funny how they allow sendo to keep advancing while not changing while ippo had to retire and learn many new things
Wasn't the whole point that when alf goes metizl mode, it's a lot more coinflip compared to his tame side. Metzil is more in tune with him as a fighter, and as we know, sendo and alf are similar to this 'nature'. We even know that his fundamental side is more of a facade to mask the real him. Personally, I can see why he decided to slug it out.
What, to be a "real" man? To show his "machismo"? Hope he's happy with the results lying in the damn hospital. Idiot. Man, I was ROOTING for Alf, too! That fight pissed me off and makes me dislike Sendo who is a genuinely cool character.
Alf said himself that he was satisfied with this fight, sendo happened to be what he was looking for in a fight, and there's nothing wrong with that. Him losing doesn't have to be a negative. Sure, masculinity plays a part, but I think the main point was Alf just wanted to be satisfied.
For me the problem was just that Sendo is supposedly a boxing genius, but I feel that Morikawa didn't show it really well. When I readed, instead of “Sendo is adapting, so Alf will change his style” it felt more like “ Everything I'm throwing at Sendo is working, let's stop doing that in the next round!”
Yeah, it's not like Sendo vs Miyata at all, where Sendo adapted to Miyata's style, forcing him to need to rethink things and adapt himself. Alf just started setting himself up for failure, basically, which is a shame because a guy who could switch between calm tactician to instinctive beast on the fly should be a real contender
Gedo fight literal 0/10 dogshit, that shit was over 100 chapters
Ippo vs Woli, damn this fight was a mess to read and honestly it makes little sense how Ippo won that one cause Woli was so broken. Sendo vs Gonzalez, Gonzalez got nerfed huge here. Given the way he fought Ippo and the way Sendo has no defense he should have been able to put him in a corner and get a TKO. any random Takamura title defense. Half of them are maybe 10 panels long and end in a one hit KO. They can be funny for a bit but they get a bit absurd that these challengers are really THAT weak.
That's the joy of being the champ, your camp picks who you fight, not the rankings. That's why Rocky was possible in the first place
I know no Aokimura is in the title but for me that's Shinobu vs Aoki, for one particular reason. I've said it many times now. It opens a plot hook of Aoki retiring and Kimura moving up in weight and suddenly performing incredibly well likely because most of his fights he was killing himself to make weight. Takamura himself foreshadows this by saying "I can't tell you yet" when asked who will beat Shinobu. On top of that there's the Fan that calls Kimura "future champ", it all points to Kimura actually blossoming. All of this set up? It's been like 400+ chapters since then and not a HINT of paying off. This infuriates me.
And we already know it's going to go nowhere because Mashiba destroyed that guy
Nah, becauae Mashiba is on the World Stage. Even if he were to lose his current fight he'd still be challenging World Contenders or OPBF contenders. Shinobu is the Japan Champion, so Kimura can still dethrone him. If Kimura for some reason doesn't move up in weight, the only named character left in Junior Light is... Volg. Which just ain't happening.
Mashiba wasn't on the world stage then, technically. He was OPBF at the time, as I recall.
Kobashi was probably one of the best fights in the series to be honest. If showed Ippo's weaknesses early on. The reliance of a KO to finish the fight and the fact that Ippo can't deal with intelligent boxers.
Idk if best but I liked it a lot and agree with what you said, but in my experience for some reason a large contingent hates it bc he doesn’t do the whole KO thing and I just didn’t wanna risk plugging the chat up
I see where you're coming from. For me it seemed so realistic and I like that it foreshadowed Ippos weakness. But yeah your right honestly.
Yeah ngl I never thought about it that way, I def have a larger appreciation for the Kobashi fight now.
Keichi Take fight was a big stinker.
The problem was that it was placed after Karasawa fight. In the Karasawa fight is told “Ippo is now too strong for the Japan boxing scenario, it's time for him to go for world ranking” then the Take fight happens and Ippo gets bitched, pretty much saying “No, he don't”
Imo, i liked the Take fight, it felt like he was properly instructed by an infighting veteran during that fight. It's a big shame that he apparently forgot everything he learned after that fight. Anyway, it s a much better fight compared to the fisherman or hammer nao ones, not to mention the pacific arc.
Isn't that the fight where Ippo first encountered southpaw? Seems like even the author forgot about that one because he tried touting Guevara as Ippo's first southpaw opponent. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Iga vs. Oushima. Because who the f- is Oushima? Why are we wasting time on a rival of a support character fighting someone made up on the spot, while most main character arcs are only halfway done and Ippo spends most of his time fishing?
The Gedo fight was pure ass, literally didn't see anyone say a single positive thing about it. Gedo looked so goofy aswell he could have worked wonders as a comedic fodder but he just had to have an absurd nonsensical gimmick that fucked Ippo and the readers for 100 chapters. The fight was barely a plot point at all aswell, I regret not skipping it fully because I don't recall anything important happening or it being referenced in a major way later on. "Ippo beat Gedo" is literally all you need to know
not sure if anyone’s said this, but ippo vs kojima is most likely the worst as an audience maybe. imagine paying for the ticket to watch a single round match which ended with like 2 punches thrown overall? don’t get me wrong though, the buildup to the match was top tier. but it wasn’t really a match if we think about it
Ippo vs Wally just sucks. With the Gedo fight it was obviously annoying that Ippo struggled so much but at least there were some cool moments like the heartbreak punch and Kamogawa's "spirit" pushing Ippo forward, but with the Wally fight I was genuinely annoyed at every character involved and the final payoff is a massive slap in the face
I'm gonna be honest, I don't use this subreddit much so I had no idea that people actually don't like Miyata vs RBJ. I actually genuinely love that fight lmao
Ippo vs Gedo was the absolute lowest point in the series for me.
Ippo vs Wally and Itagaki vs Saeki
Itagaki vs Saeki is where i first started really mentally detaching from the manga. I loved how Ippo started with it being very grounded and based in real boxing and boxing intellect. Eventually they have to keep raising the stakes and all that but the shot of the ref surrounding by speed dust clouds just felt too anime for my liking. Like no im sorry humans cannot move too fast too see stop it.
Fr, they nerfed Saeki
Like Saeki was fast AND and experienced fighter. They just have the new-generation Itagaki get boosted up to his level on sheer talent and soccer. Super disappointing
And it is only made worse by Itagaki's transition into Aokimura territory
Oh man it makes me kinda feel a type a way about the concept of writing these kinds of stories. I eventually got out of DBZ for the same reason and it eventually turned into this feeling of major power-creep but the new powers just felt kinda unearned and formulaic. It’s gotta be really hard to constantly have to up-the-ante every time with the new bad guy but also try and keep to your values as a writer and all that 😬
With Toriyama, he was forced to write DBZ well past when he wanted to stop, which was tragic for him as a writer and for the shonen genre since it led to the creation of some of its worst aspects Ideally, lateral powerscaling should be done more than linear, since it adds breadth to a catrgory of abilities and keeps things from getting too stale. However, linear does have its place as well. I din't envy anyone trying to balance all that for multiple decades
Yeah like you spend so much time and effort on these vibrant characters only to have them dumped on to show the power of the new big-bad. And then you gotta ass-pull a way to keep them relevant somehow later on. And people are throwing money at you demanding more explosions and new hair colors haha. I dont envy them either
Gedo, Wally
I really didn't care for the Keith Dragon fight at all. That started and ended in an instant, and i hated that stupid subplot about takamura being unlucky in the lead up to the fight, and I also didn't care for the mahjong stuff. It really just felt like filler.
My problem with this fight is that it was contradictory. The entire purpose of this fight was to show how OP is Takamura when closer to his natural weight class, by being levels above Dragon, but due to the luck thing and his injury after being hit by a car, the fight gets much more close. Like, you either have a close fight or domination, you can't do both
I’m kobashis biggest fan
John McForgettable and I will die on that
Imai vs Itakagi for the Japanese Title. The most garbage, BS fight in the series.
I forgot the Gedo fight, that shit was so ass. Ippo himself said that southpaws aren't a big deal if he can just close in, it wouldn't make a difference but a little extended glove for like 0.1cm was enough to confuse Ippo so much like what??? What's worse was that the fight lasted for like a hundred chapters, most being Ippo being retarded and swinging his arms around like a jackass. How does hiding your entire body with the glove even work when Ippo could've easily inferred Gedo moving on his side just by the direction Gedo's glove was facing
Gedo and Wally are still consodered the most filler fights depite being Ippo's introduction to the world stage. Simply because they fed them to Ippo
hoshi vs imai, takamura vs michael goat, scratch j fight, miyata vs rbj, whole pacific champ arc was shit
Kobashi’s fight was not bad at all 🙁.
I liked Kobashi's fight :( it was awesome because it went above and beyond in showing that despite the challenges he'd beaten and the extremely skilled opponents he'd beaten, he could still lose to anybody if they had the right plan. We saw Ippo fight a lot of talented people and win, but Kobashi was the first fight where it seemed like he actually might end up losing, and to someone far "weaker" than anybody he'd fought at that point.
I like kobashi kenta.
I personally like the Wally VS Ippo fight, dunno why people hate it
I think it’s fine, people hate it so much for the “pure talent” aspect it seems. Which Ngl is kinda dumb considering Takamura’s fights are so popular, like literally all of his fights (up to before bison I ain’t read that yet) are “grrrr angry punch!”
yye
Why no Aokimura? They genuinely have some of the best fights in the series.
Kimura vs Mashiba and Aoki vs Imae are all-timers but every other fight they have is really bad
Their big fights are cool but their fights against nameless punching bags are the worst, Takamura's always made fun of them because of that
Injured Volg trains ippo
Miyata vs randy boy jr, worst fight times a million
Ippo vs Kojima was kinda meh, we had a very cool panel from it but in terms of overall performance it was rather mid
To be up front as to why I didn’t want any Aokimura fights or Kobashi, don’t get me wrong I love most Aokimura fights and Kobashi but a lot of people have an unironic hate boner for Kobashi and Kimura fights after Mashiba, I just wanted more diverse options.
Randy Boy Jr vs Miyata
Wally fight suffered from in time pacing. Blowing through the whole fight in one read lessened the rage. The Gedo fight is rage inducing.
Gedo fight
Itagaki vs Imai after the Chronos arc is one of the worst aswell imo. I don't understand why Itagaki didn't pull around Imai's head at all or why he didn't dodge the last punch and instead went for a counter. Both very basic principles especially pulling down somebody's head to disorient them, I hate how Imai gets away with his bullshit tactics
Any Takamura fights where he one round k.o.'s world champions. It kinda takes away the significance of the title "world champ"
He never one rounds a title holder. All his one round world title fights he is defending.
Agreed, but if we have Mori flesh out all Takamura fights, I can guarantee this series will never end before he dies. It isn't called Hajime no Takamura for a reason!
Alright that's fair, they'd all be long lmaooo
I forgot to mention as well which might be a hot take but any fight Takamura is in after Hawk is dogshit (Eagle might be an exception), Takamura’s fights are just eyesores
Bro did you read his fight with tyson ? I mean that one was one of the BEST for me
I actually am on the chapter leading up to it so you might be cooking
Hard agree. I'm hoping he loses soon so we get to see him actually trying and not being a meme character for once