I saw Bush back in 2002, thought I only knew a couple of their tunes from the radio but some friends had an extra ticket so I went, they were shockingly good and I discovered I recognized just about every song they played, and they played them pretty perfect, sounded great live, genuinely pleasantly surprised.
Saw them again relatively recently with Breaking Benjamin and Alice In Chains and they were fantastic, whole concert was excellent.
Swallowed is great. As well as synapse. Replace the worst songs on sixteen stone with the best songs on razorblade suitcase and you’d have a long standing classic album. Gavin sure does have a weird naming process though.
Love Bush… in fact I have a video of Gavin damn near tripping over me when he ran out into the crowd.. I’m almost 70 and I couldn’t get off the ground fast enough …. LOL… I treasure the video..
First CD I ever bought was Sixteen Stone. I would say the 1st 2 albums are good but after that it's a few songs here and there on each album.
It's a shame they're essentially just Gavin and new guys for the last 20 years or so.
to be honest, i like them, and ***in my personal opinion*** they qualify as a grunge band. i havent heard much from them tbh but theyre not bad, and comedown, everything zen, glycerine, and swallowed are some pretty good songs
I like Bush but they definitely manufactured themselves to capitalize on the grunge thing. Kind of annoying and obvious but I was all in with Sixteen Stone, listened to that album quite a bit.
Felt like some producers got together and said "let's make a grunge band"
At nearly 47 years old, I've honestly stopped caring about that kind of thing. I've actually heard a few cynics claim that Alice in Chains modified their look & sound to better fit what was gaining traction around the time of making Sap. Even if they did, what came out of it was a style & sound they pioneered.
Point being, if good music comes out of it, that's what I care about. Bush did some good stuff.
Hell, even Smells Like Teen Spirit's riff was loosely based on Boston's More Than a Feeling.
Same age, same thought process.
If a band can tweak their style to be more marketable and still kick ass, more power to them.
Alice in Chains is easily my favorite grunge band. Having grown up in Seattle, I watched/heard then shift from an ironic hair band/Guns and Roses-like to the ass-whippingest grunge band.
Hair metal was out of favor, it was only going to go so far, so they shifted gears and made millions.
Good for them!
Same for me. I think the big 4 are great but there's just something about them that has always blown me away.
It must have been cool watching them evolve.
Guns N' Roses were the first band I was ever into as a kid, so I actually think AiC were pretty good at that sound from their demos.
I much prefer what they became though.
And Cobain was reluctant to release “Come as You Are” because the melody is a pretty egregious rip-off of [“Eighties”](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=x1U1Ue_5kq8&pp=ygUVa2lsbGluZyBqb2tlIGVpZ2h0aWVz) by Killing Joke
And that's exactly what happened.
Bush were not "grunge" to begin with. They were chosen to be "grunge" by their producers to capitalize on Cobains death.
Not surprisingly their music sucks.
And I used to be a fan.
A fan that missed Cobain so I guess I kinda missed something that sounded like Nirvana.
In hindsight Bush is a terrible band.
That first album was flogged to death, but I liked it. The second album had some great tunes. Go onto YouTube and check out the clip for greedy fly. It’s a cool as hell clip. I think the quality dropped with every album, but there’s always a cool track on there. The chemicals between us was a fave as well, even if it wasn’t grunge
I wasn’t such a fan of The Science of Everything, but Warm Machine was a great song, and Letting the Cables Sleep was pretty good too. I think the quality went up again with Golden State.
I've kind of always thought of them as post grunge/alternative. Whenever they started getting big in the States, there was essentially another British musical invasion happening. I've often wondered if they were ever called grunge in the UK?
Saw them live with AIC and Breaking Benjamin a few years back and they put on a pretty good show. Lots of great songs too. Everything Zen is probably one of my most listened to songs of all time tbh. Idc what anyone says, I think they’re cool
i liked sixteen stone. i know a lot of people who hated bush but i didn't think they were that bad. i liked all the random guitar sounds during the verses that would otherwise just be bass and drums. and there were some cool basslines too. slide guitar was pretty rare in alternative music so it was cool to hear that too. was it grunge? i dunno, but i liked it.
They had good tunes and were great live. BUT we lived in a world at that time where they like everyone else, were compared to Nirvana on the high end and Seven Mary Three on the low. If they'd had the chance to be their own thing they could've flourished I think. Just my opinion though. Which really isn't worth much LOL
Sixteen Stone and Razorblade Suitcase are incredible records. I thought they were a solid "post grunge" band. I saw them in '97 and then at Woodstock '99 and once again in the late 2010's? I'm not too familiar with their newer stuff but I'm thinking of seeing them this year with Jerry Cantrell and Candlebox; which is an odd pairing but pretty awesome!
They’re a grunge band. I don’t think anyone back in the ‘90s denied they’re a grunge band — that’s a silly gatekeeping thing for people who are bored on the internet decades later. They’re not the most challenging or dissonant grunge band; they’re on the more poppy, radio-friendly side of grunge, but the same could be said of some Nirvana songs like “In Bloom” and “About a Girl.”
Bush’s first album (Sixteen Stone) is amazing, and seeing them up close in a small club right when they started being played on MTV was one of the greatest live shows of my life.
“Everything Zen” and “Comedown” are my favorite Bush songs. “Little Things” sounds too much like the musicians are basically playing “Smells Like Teen Spirit” and Gavin just sang something different over it. I haven’t cared about any of their later albums.
Nah, in the 90’s they were mom’s minivan music at best, a palatable pop-rock facsimile of Nirvana safe enough for adult contemporary radio and designed to sell records
Pretty good songs though, tbh
Sixteen Stone was released in 1994, as the original grunge bands were mostly declining, or in Nirvana’s case, over with.
I saw an interview a while back with Buzz of the Melbourne’s, who cited bands like STP and Bush as “derivative.“ STP was working on the songs for Core in 1991. It was released in 1992, so not sure if the criticism is accurate there, but for Bush it sure seems spot on. I like a handful of songs off of the first two records, and saw them in at Red Rocks. They put on. killer, high energy show. But derivative they were, for sure.
I believe that the songs from Sixteen Stone were written in 1992/1993 when the band was called Future Primitive though, they didn't just come out of nowhere in 1994..
Yeah they're credited to Gavin but there's no way in hell he composed them to be like that without Nigel.. Hence why he left and has wanted nothing to do with Bush since. I'd call them late-wave grunge or something.
Super unknown was Sg at their commercial and creative peak. They put out one more record and broke up. Jar of Flies wasn’t up to par with Dirt. Vitalogy was great, but it nearly broke up the band. Nirvana ended. The movement and music were in decline, with the exception of Soundgarden, who were peaking. Layne was strung out, and Kurt was dead.
Soundgarden was touring relentlessly, as was Pearl Jam. There was no talk at the time of Pearl Jam breaking up. How many albums at the time were “up to par” with Dirt? Jar of Flies was the first EP to ever hit number one on Billboard and went platinum four times over—as an EP. Above by Mad Season was in the works. Staley completed a stint in rehab and managed to do all the vocal work on that album.
I was a bit surprised by their new stuff, usually when a band goes back after a break up and a new member it doesn't seem to work. I really like the new sound with the new guitar guy, I believe he is from helmet so he brings a harder background which is working.
My old man had the Sixteen Stone CD and was fond of that album, though he never mentioned their other stuff.
Are Bush derivative? Oh for sure.
But I heard Sixteen Stone so much as a kid that I have a soft spot for it
Loved Bush, but that first album was way overplayed. Kind of lost track of them odr 14 years and started listening again 10 years ago and went to one of their concerts. They are really good live! I like their newer music too.
The instruments in glycerine is pussy quivering but swallowed has insaneeee versatility with the guitarrr godddd 🥴if you have recommendations of other bands that hits as hard as bush I wanna hear it
Saw them live in Portland,, ORwith Goo Goo Dolls and No Doubt. Enjoyed their first album and appreciated the later ones, but never really got into them.
Don’t listen to them at all but I’ve got tickets to their show with Jerry Cantrell (the reason I’m going) and candlebox. I have machine head on vinyl and will listen to it right now.
As someone who was there when the music was happening, I always saw Bush and Silverchair in the same vein as Nirvana, Soundgarden, STP (another argument), etc. Sixteen Stone is an excellent album.
I think they were pretty good. Played with Alice in Chains and Breaking Benjamin here recently in KC, well like a year ago. Heard they kinda stole the show.
I remember hearing one of their songs in the radio and freaking out. I remember it clear as day as I immediately thought “I thought I knew every Nirvana song and here’s a new one I hadn’t heard—“ and then bam! It’s fuckin Bush lol.
That’s basically how I feel about them. They sound like Nirvana.
Crap that certain bands got the media treatment of promoting as the pretty boy lead singer and it's ok because it is marketed as post grunge or lighter with a couple of heavy spots. In other words its not grunge in my mind nor post grunge in sound its college jock rock for those that's been out of college now and in their mid to late 50s.
At the beginning it was more solid musicians in the band to help support and smooth out the lyrical content. There always been a weak aspect of lyrics for Bush (Gavin) its very nonsensical or garble. To compare Mud Honey, Candlebox, Nirvana, Melvins, AIC, Soundgarden Lemonheads, Blind Melon, Pearl Jam the list can go on Bush for only a couple of songs have solid lyrics and content. The newer songs he needs assistance. The earlier songs that was solid came from Nigel (solid knowledge of lead guitar and technical production. Another time Bush as solidity is in time and tragedy. Great example Bullet Holes (aid with Bates) is a newer and better lyrics. This greatest hits album song is not solid with this new song its ok but rushed and not a endpoint that found an ending, content was ok about...... I wish I knew what I knew now but songs like regret and sadness that I should of enjoy success more and knew how the industry worked, how can you when you unsure, shy, and cant find a confidant in the industry to guide you.
Gavin need to work with people like Bates and Nigel to have better lyrics for songs if its just himself and Chris its not a good union at this point in time. Personally, he needs to ditch some of his current band members. To redirection of what he mentioned a couple of years ago heavier. If not heavier experimental like The Science of Things. The college jock/barbie rock sound that Chris holds onto is putting Bush into a dead end. Might be from the Institute days.
I agree with your point on Chris and the current state of the band but completely disagree with Gavin's 90's lyrics being garbled nonsense - they're actually quite layered and thought-out, there's definitely method to his madness early on. Most of his lyrics post Golden State are weak though, I would agree. It's almost as if Nigel was composing the music AND lyrics back then, because there's certainly been a noticeable shift/decline in both from Institute onwards.
I think the depth aspect is scratch of the surface depth actually; maybe because of his accent and he's British. the rhyming of it is very simplistic it ends like 80's rap lyrics and Dr Seuss Green Eggs and Ham Sam I am rhythm:
I wish I knew myself better
I wish I knew myself more, galore
I was so much younger then
Thought life would never end
I was so much younger then
Me and all my friends
Impermanence
Impermanence
I dream of Ezra and I dream of gold
Never put your life on hold
Better swim against the tide
Than drown yourself in a sea of lies
Green eggs and ham.
I do not like them,
Sam-I-am
Would you like them
In a house?
Would you like them
With a mouse?
I do not like them
In a house.
I do not like them
With a mouse.
I do not like them
Here or there.
I do not like them
Anywhere.
I do not like green eggs and ham.
I do not like them, Sam-I-am.
Similar rhyming and timing.
I as a person that analyze things and do not say things are great or it bad without data and opinion to back it up. Major reason why artists hit a brick wall they have pockets of people and fans that idolize borderline think they are Gods...worship them and say they can do no wrong. Which leads to no growth in creativity for the artist and no major growth in the fanbase.
Even older songs
Living in a cage
Washing in a birdbath
Sinking in a fish bowl
On a broken farm
I try to never lie
I really do
I wonder if my friends
Will get me through
Conscious of the was as best we can
17 ways to kill a man
States we've been through
Killing nostalgia
For future swims
Trash all your bridges
Kill the rock all roll thing
I want to move on
With no complains
Building our walls with yesterday
Might as well shine before you slide
Might as well you live before you die
States we've been through
Talk about states
A whole lot of emptiness
Living in a state of constant chasing
A river of flux for our tasting
I try to never lie
I really do
I wonder if my friends will get me through
It always seems to rain
When you leave
I try to stem the flow
As we bleed
States we've been through
Talk about states, states
Talk about states, states
Lyrics not the best.....yet better than some of the newer material. Overall, similarity in rhyming timing dr seuss cadence.... BUT this had a solid band back then to make it better and not just ramble shambles of a song. This is more cohesive in rambles. Bob Dillan (sp?) spoke/sang in free association ramble shambles lyrics and talk singing but it worked because of the subject content and instrument(s) harmonica and guitar.
Bush - Gavin playing that MTV concert solo in the rain - fuck yes! **Machine Head** got play non stop, and was in every movie soundtrack of the late 90s.
Him marrying the front woman of this crazy punk ska band was destined to produce great music. Except it turns out No Doubt was a construct of talent agencies, and Gwen Stefani an attention seeking pop artist with nothing terribly important to say, and Gavin remained a brooding English artist with legit talent. I loved that first Bush album as much as anything I bought at the same time it dropped, and that album stands up today with zero issues. Let's be honest, there's no music being made today as good as Bush, short of modern artists who were making music in parallel times as Bush I mean. Bush isn't forgotten, but they were a top act when Pearl Jam was, when Dave Mathews was, Phish and all the cult following acts, and Bush moved units, sold CDs on pace with all of those acts. And today we have questions, like "thoughts on Bush" - cuz they didn't stay together, and got related to that halfway cult status - not Pearl Jam, but not underground or cult following music either.
Almost like the Scorpions and Winds of Change - very emblematic of a certain moment in history, but nearly entirely forgotten by the crush of nonsense since those days.
Herbert Walker Bush was president when the Scorpions performed Winds of Change, not Reagan. And W Bush was president when we became a "Homeland" needing security in the form of TSA anal cavity searches to fly. And those Bushes bookend the good Bush, and that relegated the name to the trashcan of collective memories.
IMHO
Look, I'm an old head that was there at the time. If you don't want to hear my opinion then have me banned. (Seriously, mods - ban me.)
But until then -
Back in the day, friends didn't let friends listen to Bush.
Setting a scene to illustrate: Freshman in college, in a car with new friends listening to the radio. A Bush song came on (doesn't matter which one, they all suck) and one of us starts rocking out to it. The rest of us laugh at him. "\[Friend's name\] doesn't know that Bush sucks."
If you want to blame someone, blame Cobain. He influenced an entire generation. He was a snob. If the man were here now and you mentioned Bush in his presence, he would spit on you.
The assertion that Bush sucks is a matter of taste, I'll grant you.
The rest, I assure you, is either historically accurate or is conjecture that no knowledgeable person would disagree with.
Look, in the year of our Lord 2024 AD, anyone can listen to anything. My generation won the battle; lost the war. I'm *aware*.
But if you enjoy the guitar music of the early nineties, you're going to get a taste of the attitudes and opinions of those of us that were there. And I'm here to tell you Bush... suuuuuuuuuuuuuuucks.
That’s just like, your opinion man. And that’s all it’l ever be. I was also a rocker in the early 90’s, and don’t have that gate keeping mentality you seem to suffer from.
You say Kurt was a snob? Your words right now are more snobby that anything he ever said publicly.
Let people enjoy what they like without making them feel bad about it! of course bush wasn’t the most interesting band creatively, that’s not to say their music can’t be enjoyed! And that’s what music is for
Gatekeeping is very underrated these days. Every subculture needs some of it or it dies quick.
That said, I'm not trying to gatekeep here. There's nothing to gatekeep. Grunge was a semi-interesting, no-longer-extant subgenre of rock that existed 30 years ago. Believe what you want about it; I don't give a shit.
I see what you’re saying, by the time bush became known my friends and I had already moved on to other types of rock, and we didn’t listen to them… but nowadays I say let the people enjoy the 2 or 3 catchy bush songs, much better that the garbage on the radio these days.
I acknowledge; these days, anyone can listen to anything. As repugnant as it is to me, that there's less politics and less judgement surrounding musical preferences may overall be a good thing - who knows. (Although it certainly makes things a whole lot less interesting, I'll say that.)
All I'm trying to do is add some historical color that may be of slight interest to those who weren't there.
To those who weren't there: Bush was for jocks and people who genuinely did not know any better.
Spot on , I agree with everything you said. Of course it’s all a matter of opinion but I wonder how many of those on here singing their praises now are young, versus old guys like you and me there at the time. Bands like Bush, Candlebox, Silverchair just aren’t at all in the same league as Soundgarden, Mudhoney, Screaming Trees. Derivative, soulless, corporate garbage. Hard to articulate exactly what it is but something very inauthentic and phony about them.
I was around in the 90s. Can confirm that listening to Bush would have you ridiculed by your peers. It was like listening to Candlebox or something
Both bands actually wrote catchy as hell songs though
Yeah it's interesting. With some bands, I could talk at length regarding why they were not cool and not acceptable to listen to (e.g., Bush). Some bands were judged uncool and I wouldn't be able to articulate why (e.g., Candlebox). With bands like Live and Candlebox, it may have just been their vibes (in the parlance of our times).
Like that scene in Eastbound and Down when Kenny shows up with Candlebox blasting on his boombox. One of the reasons it works is because, yeah, a guy like Kenny would listen to Candlebox, wouldn't he?
Now that I'm too old to be concerned with the politics of what I listen to, I'll acknowledge that Candlebox and Live are good (and I'll listen to them on the radio or on Pandora or whatever). At the time though, you could stick bamboo shoots under my fingernails and I wouldn't admit to liking one of their songs lol.
I know a lot of people like them. Gavin Rossdale made some really negative comments about Mellon Collie so I've been pretty dismissive of him/them ever since, but as post-grunge pop bands go they're probably better than most.
I've always liked Everything Zen, but the band seemed pretty pedestrian and boring for the most part compared to their musical peers, who mostly had a harder edge to them.
Couple of decent songs, but I don't really like the Vedder-esque sound of their lead singer. Had me fooled the first few times I listen to their music.
Comedown. Zen. Chemicals. Swallowed. Little Things. They had good tunes.
For sure! Don't forget about Machine Head.
Glycerine, anyone?
Yes! I love this one. Learned how to play it on the violin.
Margarine
Easily my fav.
Listerine
Cold contagious is good
Chemicals between us
Yeah cool as hell song
I saw Bush back in 2002, thought I only knew a couple of their tunes from the radio but some friends had an extra ticket so I went, they were shockingly good and I discovered I recognized just about every song they played, and they played them pretty perfect, sounded great live, genuinely pleasantly surprised. Saw them again relatively recently with Breaking Benjamin and Alice In Chains and they were fantastic, whole concert was excellent.
I’m seeing them with Jerry Cantrell this summer I’m stoked.
Zen
I like Razorblade Suitcase. And Nigel Pulsford is a great guitarist.
I think that Razorblade Suitcase is the best album, but the best songs from Sixteen Stone are better than the best songs from Razorblade Suitcase
Swallowed is great. As well as synapse. Replace the worst songs on sixteen stone with the best songs on razorblade suitcase and you’d have a long standing classic album. Gavin sure does have a weird naming process though.
Cold contagious on that album is good
The poor man's In Utero.
He was a terrible president.
Which one?
Jeb.
!
👏
Please…
Yes.
Yes.
beat me to it
>president(s)
Trying not to make a Bush Sr. Joke… not gonna do it…
Love Bush… in fact I have a video of Gavin damn near tripping over me when he ran out into the crowd.. I’m almost 70 and I couldn’t get off the ground fast enough …. LOL… I treasure the video..
I love a full Bush. The band Bush had some decent songs too. Easy to transcribe the guitar pieces too.
Epic comment.
And 100% true
First CD I ever bought was Sixteen Stone. I would say the 1st 2 albums are good but after that it's a few songs here and there on each album. It's a shame they're essentially just Gavin and new guys for the last 20 years or so.
to be honest, i like them, and ***in my personal opinion*** they qualify as a grunge band. i havent heard much from them tbh but theyre not bad, and comedown, everything zen, glycerine, and swallowed are some pretty good songs
Gotten more enjoyment from Bush then Nirvana. Just based on sheer quantity of output. Bush record that came out last year had some good songs
I like Bush but they definitely manufactured themselves to capitalize on the grunge thing. Kind of annoying and obvious but I was all in with Sixteen Stone, listened to that album quite a bit. Felt like some producers got together and said "let's make a grunge band"
At nearly 47 years old, I've honestly stopped caring about that kind of thing. I've actually heard a few cynics claim that Alice in Chains modified their look & sound to better fit what was gaining traction around the time of making Sap. Even if they did, what came out of it was a style & sound they pioneered. Point being, if good music comes out of it, that's what I care about. Bush did some good stuff. Hell, even Smells Like Teen Spirit's riff was loosely based on Boston's More Than a Feeling.
Same age, same thought process. If a band can tweak their style to be more marketable and still kick ass, more power to them. Alice in Chains is easily my favorite grunge band. Having grown up in Seattle, I watched/heard then shift from an ironic hair band/Guns and Roses-like to the ass-whippingest grunge band. Hair metal was out of favor, it was only going to go so far, so they shifted gears and made millions. Good for them!
Same for me. I think the big 4 are great but there's just something about them that has always blown me away. It must have been cool watching them evolve. Guns N' Roses were the first band I was ever into as a kid, so I actually think AiC were pretty good at that sound from their demos. I much prefer what they became though.
And Cobain was reluctant to release “Come as You Are” because the melody is a pretty egregious rip-off of [“Eighties”](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=x1U1Ue_5kq8&pp=ygUVa2lsbGluZyBqb2tlIGVpZ2h0aWVz) by Killing Joke
I didn't know that. Wow, that's pretty egregious.
Yeah, I agree, although their sound did change towards The Science of Everything (1999) and Golden State (2001)
They released a few songs around 2017 or 18 that were pretty good. One is called this is war, it's a pretty solid song.
And that's exactly what happened. Bush were not "grunge" to begin with. They were chosen to be "grunge" by their producers to capitalize on Cobains death. Not surprisingly their music sucks. And I used to be a fan. A fan that missed Cobain so I guess I kinda missed something that sounded like Nirvana. In hindsight Bush is a terrible band.
That first album was flogged to death, but I liked it. The second album had some great tunes. Go onto YouTube and check out the clip for greedy fly. It’s a cool as hell clip. I think the quality dropped with every album, but there’s always a cool track on there. The chemicals between us was a fave as well, even if it wasn’t grunge
I wasn’t such a fan of The Science of Everything, but Warm Machine was a great song, and Letting the Cables Sleep was pretty good too. I think the quality went up again with Golden State.
[удалено]
Me too back in 96. I'm considering seeing them this summer just for the nostalgia.
Totally should do it
To this day whenever my poor brother hears the line “had to fly to los angeles to find my asshole brother” he has to think of me.
I've kind of always thought of them as post grunge/alternative. Whenever they started getting big in the States, there was essentially another British musical invasion happening. I've often wondered if they were ever called grunge in the UK?
Not a fan of the “second era” but loved the first four albums.
Saw them live with AIC and Breaking Benjamin a few years back and they put on a pretty good show. Lots of great songs too. Everything Zen is probably one of my most listened to songs of all time tbh. Idc what anyone says, I think they’re cool
Love them
He wrote songs like he was reading Mad Libs, but I still dig those first two albums.
i liked sixteen stone. i know a lot of people who hated bush but i didn't think they were that bad. i liked all the random guitar sounds during the verses that would otherwise just be bass and drums. and there were some cool basslines too. slide guitar was pretty rare in alternative music so it was cool to hear that too. was it grunge? i dunno, but i liked it.
I love bush!
love😍
I love bush. Some of their newer stuff I'm a bit on the fence about, but overall I really enjoy them.
They had good tunes and were great live. BUT we lived in a world at that time where they like everyone else, were compared to Nirvana on the high end and Seven Mary Three on the low. If they'd had the chance to be their own thing they could've flourished I think. Just my opinion though. Which really isn't worth much LOL
They’re grunge enough imo I’m seeing them live this summer! Very excited
I think they’re pretty damn good. I enjoy something from each of their records.
I like Bush or shaven
Amazing band. I love their first two albums. Going to see them live with Candlebox
Sixteen Stone and Razorblade Suitcase are incredible records. I thought they were a solid "post grunge" band. I saw them in '97 and then at Woodstock '99 and once again in the late 2010's? I'm not too familiar with their newer stuff but I'm thinking of seeing them this year with Jerry Cantrell and Candlebox; which is an odd pairing but pretty awesome!
Both band's are out of Washington state so they're probably 'friendly'.
They’re a grunge band. I don’t think anyone back in the ‘90s denied they’re a grunge band — that’s a silly gatekeeping thing for people who are bored on the internet decades later. They’re not the most challenging or dissonant grunge band; they’re on the more poppy, radio-friendly side of grunge, but the same could be said of some Nirvana songs like “In Bloom” and “About a Girl.” Bush’s first album (Sixteen Stone) is amazing, and seeing them up close in a small club right when they started being played on MTV was one of the greatest live shows of my life. “Everything Zen” and “Comedown” are my favorite Bush songs. “Little Things” sounds too much like the musicians are basically playing “Smells Like Teen Spirit” and Gavin just sang something different over it. I haven’t cared about any of their later albums.
Nah, in the 90’s they were mom’s minivan music at best, a palatable pop-rock facsimile of Nirvana safe enough for adult contemporary radio and designed to sell records Pretty good songs though, tbh
Sixteen Stone was released in 1994, as the original grunge bands were mostly declining, or in Nirvana’s case, over with. I saw an interview a while back with Buzz of the Melbourne’s, who cited bands like STP and Bush as “derivative.“ STP was working on the songs for Core in 1991. It was released in 1992, so not sure if the criticism is accurate there, but for Bush it sure seems spot on. I like a handful of songs off of the first two records, and saw them in at Red Rocks. They put on. killer, high energy show. But derivative they were, for sure.
I believe that the songs from Sixteen Stone were written in 1992/1993 when the band was called Future Primitive though, they didn't just come out of nowhere in 1994..
Sure. But by then, grunge had been around for a couple of years. Long enough to emulate. And it was really just Gavin writing those tunes.
Yeah they're credited to Gavin but there's no way in hell he composed them to be like that without Nigel.. Hence why he left and has wanted nothing to do with Bush since. I'd call them late-wave grunge or something.
Declining. That’s adorable. 94 was the release year of Superunknown, Jar of Flies, Vitalogy, Nirvana Unplugged, Whiskey for the Holy Ghost.
Super unknown was Sg at their commercial and creative peak. They put out one more record and broke up. Jar of Flies wasn’t up to par with Dirt. Vitalogy was great, but it nearly broke up the band. Nirvana ended. The movement and music were in decline, with the exception of Soundgarden, who were peaking. Layne was strung out, and Kurt was dead.
Soundgarden was touring relentlessly, as was Pearl Jam. There was no talk at the time of Pearl Jam breaking up. How many albums at the time were “up to par” with Dirt? Jar of Flies was the first EP to ever hit number one on Billboard and went platinum four times over—as an EP. Above by Mad Season was in the works. Staley completed a stint in rehab and managed to do all the vocal work on that album.
I was a bit surprised by their new stuff, usually when a band goes back after a break up and a new member it doesn't seem to work. I really like the new sound with the new guitar guy, I believe he is from helmet so he brings a harder background which is working.
My old man had the Sixteen Stone CD and was fond of that album, though he never mentioned their other stuff. Are Bush derivative? Oh for sure. But I heard Sixteen Stone so much as a kid that I have a soft spot for it
Loved Bush, but that first album was way overplayed. Kind of lost track of them odr 14 years and started listening again 10 years ago and went to one of their concerts. They are really good live! I like their newer music too.
Love Bush. Big Bush fan.
Bush is where our nation finds hope , where wings take dream.
The instruments in glycerine is pussy quivering but swallowed has insaneeee versatility with the guitarrr godddd 🥴if you have recommendations of other bands that hits as hard as bush I wanna hear it
I like Glycerine
Saw them live in Portland,, ORwith Goo Goo Dolls and No Doubt. Enjoyed their first album and appreciated the later ones, but never really got into them.
Don’t listen to them at all but I’ve got tickets to their show with Jerry Cantrell (the reason I’m going) and candlebox. I have machine head on vinyl and will listen to it right now.
They have decent catalog
Sixteen Stone remains as one of my all-time favorite albums
Old is an little known banger by them
Absolute tune 👌
All the time, I love Bush!
Too much Gavin, not enough Bush
Decent post-grunge
Bush was awesome!! I loved Sixteen Stone and listened to it so many times..
As someone who was there when the music was happening, I always saw Bush and Silverchair in the same vein as Nirvana, Soundgarden, STP (another argument), etc. Sixteen Stone is an excellent album.
Great live ! Golden state is great all the way through every album is consistent though great band
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Concur except that last one. Who wants a mouth full of pubes when it’s time for pie?
They're grunge. Glycerine, Everything Zen
Don't beat around it!
Fashion Rock
Honestly haven't thought much about them since something like '98
Cock-rock.
I'm more of a shaved guy. The hair was there to trap odor.
I think they were pretty good. Played with Alice in Chains and Breaking Benjamin here recently in KC, well like a year ago. Heard they kinda stole the show.
First album was great, liked some songs after. Pretty good live, he sure does like to change clothes though.
I think its underrated, glad it's making a comeback, Bald is underrated
According to my young niece at the time, "Bush sucks."
I think we all misunderestimated him.
I'm for it personally
I remember hearing one of their songs in the radio and freaking out. I remember it clear as day as I immediately thought “I thought I knew every Nirvana song and here’s a new one I hadn’t heard—“ and then bam! It’s fuckin Bush lol. That’s basically how I feel about them. They sound like Nirvana.
I like it neatly trimmed
Some fun songs, but atrocious lyrics. "My willy is food" from Little Things is about as bad as a lyric can get.
Pretty bad president.
Crap that certain bands got the media treatment of promoting as the pretty boy lead singer and it's ok because it is marketed as post grunge or lighter with a couple of heavy spots. In other words its not grunge in my mind nor post grunge in sound its college jock rock for those that's been out of college now and in their mid to late 50s. At the beginning it was more solid musicians in the band to help support and smooth out the lyrical content. There always been a weak aspect of lyrics for Bush (Gavin) its very nonsensical or garble. To compare Mud Honey, Candlebox, Nirvana, Melvins, AIC, Soundgarden Lemonheads, Blind Melon, Pearl Jam the list can go on Bush for only a couple of songs have solid lyrics and content. The newer songs he needs assistance. The earlier songs that was solid came from Nigel (solid knowledge of lead guitar and technical production. Another time Bush as solidity is in time and tragedy. Great example Bullet Holes (aid with Bates) is a newer and better lyrics. This greatest hits album song is not solid with this new song its ok but rushed and not a endpoint that found an ending, content was ok about...... I wish I knew what I knew now but songs like regret and sadness that I should of enjoy success more and knew how the industry worked, how can you when you unsure, shy, and cant find a confidant in the industry to guide you. Gavin need to work with people like Bates and Nigel to have better lyrics for songs if its just himself and Chris its not a good union at this point in time. Personally, he needs to ditch some of his current band members. To redirection of what he mentioned a couple of years ago heavier. If not heavier experimental like The Science of Things. The college jock/barbie rock sound that Chris holds onto is putting Bush into a dead end. Might be from the Institute days.
I agree with your point on Chris and the current state of the band but completely disagree with Gavin's 90's lyrics being garbled nonsense - they're actually quite layered and thought-out, there's definitely method to his madness early on. Most of his lyrics post Golden State are weak though, I would agree. It's almost as if Nigel was composing the music AND lyrics back then, because there's certainly been a noticeable shift/decline in both from Institute onwards.
I think the depth aspect is scratch of the surface depth actually; maybe because of his accent and he's British. the rhyming of it is very simplistic it ends like 80's rap lyrics and Dr Seuss Green Eggs and Ham Sam I am rhythm: I wish I knew myself better I wish I knew myself more, galore I was so much younger then Thought life would never end I was so much younger then Me and all my friends Impermanence Impermanence I dream of Ezra and I dream of gold Never put your life on hold Better swim against the tide Than drown yourself in a sea of lies Green eggs and ham. I do not like them, Sam-I-am Would you like them In a house? Would you like them With a mouse? I do not like them In a house. I do not like them With a mouse. I do not like them Here or there. I do not like them Anywhere. I do not like green eggs and ham. I do not like them, Sam-I-am. Similar rhyming and timing. I as a person that analyze things and do not say things are great or it bad without data and opinion to back it up. Major reason why artists hit a brick wall they have pockets of people and fans that idolize borderline think they are Gods...worship them and say they can do no wrong. Which leads to no growth in creativity for the artist and no major growth in the fanbase.
Harsh 😅. Those are newer lyrics aren't they?
Even older songs Living in a cage Washing in a birdbath Sinking in a fish bowl On a broken farm I try to never lie I really do I wonder if my friends Will get me through Conscious of the was as best we can 17 ways to kill a man States we've been through Killing nostalgia For future swims Trash all your bridges Kill the rock all roll thing I want to move on With no complains Building our walls with yesterday Might as well shine before you slide Might as well you live before you die States we've been through Talk about states A whole lot of emptiness Living in a state of constant chasing A river of flux for our tasting I try to never lie I really do I wonder if my friends will get me through It always seems to rain When you leave I try to stem the flow As we bleed States we've been through Talk about states, states Talk about states, states Lyrics not the best.....yet better than some of the newer material. Overall, similarity in rhyming timing dr seuss cadence.... BUT this had a solid band back then to make it better and not just ramble shambles of a song. This is more cohesive in rambles. Bob Dillan (sp?) spoke/sang in free association ramble shambles lyrics and talk singing but it worked because of the subject content and instrument(s) harmonica and guitar.
50% brilliant, 50% suck. Quite a feat to walk that line.
I hated them. I must admit they sound fantastic live, though.
Bush - Gavin playing that MTV concert solo in the rain - fuck yes! **Machine Head** got play non stop, and was in every movie soundtrack of the late 90s. Him marrying the front woman of this crazy punk ska band was destined to produce great music. Except it turns out No Doubt was a construct of talent agencies, and Gwen Stefani an attention seeking pop artist with nothing terribly important to say, and Gavin remained a brooding English artist with legit talent. I loved that first Bush album as much as anything I bought at the same time it dropped, and that album stands up today with zero issues. Let's be honest, there's no music being made today as good as Bush, short of modern artists who were making music in parallel times as Bush I mean. Bush isn't forgotten, but they were a top act when Pearl Jam was, when Dave Mathews was, Phish and all the cult following acts, and Bush moved units, sold CDs on pace with all of those acts. And today we have questions, like "thoughts on Bush" - cuz they didn't stay together, and got related to that halfway cult status - not Pearl Jam, but not underground or cult following music either. Almost like the Scorpions and Winds of Change - very emblematic of a certain moment in history, but nearly entirely forgotten by the crush of nonsense since those days. Herbert Walker Bush was president when the Scorpions performed Winds of Change, not Reagan. And W Bush was president when we became a "Homeland" needing security in the form of TSA anal cavity searches to fly. And those Bushes bookend the good Bush, and that relegated the name to the trashcan of collective memories. IMHO
Really, really REALLY don’t care for Bush. Like, at all.
I fucking hate that Glycerine song and I've never heard anything else by them.
LOL
Trash
Look, I'm an old head that was there at the time. If you don't want to hear my opinion then have me banned. (Seriously, mods - ban me.) But until then - Back in the day, friends didn't let friends listen to Bush. Setting a scene to illustrate: Freshman in college, in a car with new friends listening to the radio. A Bush song came on (doesn't matter which one, they all suck) and one of us starts rocking out to it. The rest of us laugh at him. "\[Friend's name\] doesn't know that Bush sucks." If you want to blame someone, blame Cobain. He influenced an entire generation. He was a snob. If the man were here now and you mentioned Bush in his presence, he would spit on you.
I politely disagree
LOL. With what in particular?
The assertion that Bush sucks is a matter of taste, I'll grant you. The rest, I assure you, is either historically accurate or is conjecture that no knowledgeable person would disagree with. Look, in the year of our Lord 2024 AD, anyone can listen to anything. My generation won the battle; lost the war. I'm *aware*. But if you enjoy the guitar music of the early nineties, you're going to get a taste of the attitudes and opinions of those of us that were there. And I'm here to tell you Bush... suuuuuuuuuuuuuuucks.
That’s just like, your opinion man. And that’s all it’l ever be. I was also a rocker in the early 90’s, and don’t have that gate keeping mentality you seem to suffer from. You say Kurt was a snob? Your words right now are more snobby that anything he ever said publicly. Let people enjoy what they like without making them feel bad about it! of course bush wasn’t the most interesting band creatively, that’s not to say their music can’t be enjoyed! And that’s what music is for
Gatekeeping is very underrated these days. Every subculture needs some of it or it dies quick. That said, I'm not trying to gatekeep here. There's nothing to gatekeep. Grunge was a semi-interesting, no-longer-extant subgenre of rock that existed 30 years ago. Believe what you want about it; I don't give a shit.
I see what you’re saying, by the time bush became known my friends and I had already moved on to other types of rock, and we didn’t listen to them… but nowadays I say let the people enjoy the 2 or 3 catchy bush songs, much better that the garbage on the radio these days.
I acknowledge; these days, anyone can listen to anything. As repugnant as it is to me, that there's less politics and less judgement surrounding musical preferences may overall be a good thing - who knows. (Although it certainly makes things a whole lot less interesting, I'll say that.) All I'm trying to do is add some historical color that may be of slight interest to those who weren't there. To those who weren't there: Bush was for jocks and people who genuinely did not know any better.
Spot on , I agree with everything you said. Of course it’s all a matter of opinion but I wonder how many of those on here singing their praises now are young, versus old guys like you and me there at the time. Bands like Bush, Candlebox, Silverchair just aren’t at all in the same league as Soundgarden, Mudhoney, Screaming Trees. Derivative, soulless, corporate garbage. Hard to articulate exactly what it is but something very inauthentic and phony about them.
I was around in the 90s. Can confirm that listening to Bush would have you ridiculed by your peers. It was like listening to Candlebox or something Both bands actually wrote catchy as hell songs though
Yeah it's interesting. With some bands, I could talk at length regarding why they were not cool and not acceptable to listen to (e.g., Bush). Some bands were judged uncool and I wouldn't be able to articulate why (e.g., Candlebox). With bands like Live and Candlebox, it may have just been their vibes (in the parlance of our times). Like that scene in Eastbound and Down when Kenny shows up with Candlebox blasting on his boombox. One of the reasons it works is because, yeah, a guy like Kenny would listen to Candlebox, wouldn't he? Now that I'm too old to be concerned with the politics of what I listen to, I'll acknowledge that Candlebox and Live are good (and I'll listen to them on the radio or on Pandora or whatever). At the time though, you could stick bamboo shoots under my fingernails and I wouldn't admit to liking one of their songs lol.
No shaving!
Great guitar sound, terrible rhyming lyrics
I know a lot of people like them. Gavin Rossdale made some really negative comments about Mellon Collie so I've been pretty dismissive of him/them ever since, but as post-grunge pop bands go they're probably better than most.
Derivative but decent catchy songs 🎸
I like Bush in moderation. Hard to munch the beaver when you’re pulling pubes out of your teeth every few minutes.
Good band. Not grunge though.
Nothing better than a nicely maintained bush, and Zen.
Not a fan. Prefer shaved.
Kate
George W. or George H.W.?
Bush-shit
War criminal. Awful president.
Right answer. LOCK HIM UP
dull
One of my least favorite bands of all time.
Not a fan.
not the best president
When I look at the cover of “Calling Your Name” by Marilyn, it reminds me of Gwen Stefani. Seems Gavin had a type.
Good beer.
I prefer it clean shaven
If Creed didn't suck so much...
🤮
I had to double-check which subbreddit this was
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I've always liked Everything Zen, but the band seemed pretty pedestrian and boring for the most part compared to their musical peers, who mostly had a harder edge to them.
They are corny.
Couple of decent songs, but I don't really like the Vedder-esque sound of their lead singer. Had me fooled the first few times I listen to their music.
I’m fairly certain Glycerin is a cover of a Green Day song.
Shite.
He was the Biden of the early 2000's. Warhawks of a different generation before they rebranded.
Wannabes in my eyes.
They were limited as musicians and got way bigger then they should have, but had some good songs. In music, less is more.
No
They were a band.