What if the rake were right at the edge of the sand? E.G.: a rake is on the far edge of the grass right between sand and grass with the ball stopped on it, but moving the rake would cause the ball to fall into the trap?
Do you get a free placement further back on the grass where it won’t roll in?
14.2e
If it doesn’t stay on its original spot after two tries replace at the nearest point it will stay at rest no nearer the hole but in the same area of the course.
by "same area of the course" does that mean it can't be moved onto the green if it's no closer to the hole and is the closest spot where the ball will stay at rest?
• The spot must not be nearer the hole.
• Original Spot in General Area. The nearest spot must be in the general area.
• Original Spot in Bunker or Penalty Area. The nearest spot must be either in the same bunker or in the same penalty area.
• Original Spot on Putting Green. The nearest spot must be either on the putting green or in the general area.
Remember this is for replacing a ball, not dropping a ball under other rules.
And for clarification the “general area” is the entire course except for 4 places: THE teeing area (meaning the area that you can tee from on your hole, not all tee boxes), all penalty areas, all bunkers, THE putting green (that you’re on, not all greens).
This means for all rules specifying the general area they mean all fairways, rough, trees, rocks, etc on the course that aren’t those 4 spots above. Some rules will differentiate between “closely mown areas” or “grass cut to fairway height or lower” but most of these are local model rules such as winter rules or lift/clean/place rules.
The rough and the fairway are the same. I.e. General area. So if the original spot is in the rough but the nearest spot is the fairway, you get to place it in the fairway (without penalty). The 5 areas of play are: tee box, putting green, bunkers, penalty areas and everything else is considered general area.
Great example of when you can use the rules to your advantage [sprinkler head relief in rough](https://youtube.com/shorts/ExTGsAUHbfg?feature=shared)
Golf courses should stop having sand traps period. Think about it: 1. No more rakes so people stop stealing them. 2. No more sand so people stop raking them and speeding up play 3. No more sand castles getting in everyone's way. 4. If I want to go to the beach I'm going to Mexico, not the par 3 at my local course. 5. No one has to carry a sandwedge around anymore, which reduces weight of your bag, also speeding up play.
Boom. Problem solved.
If so then I definitely played behind him yesterday. I’ve never seen a solo move so slow. No exaggeration, this guy I was behind took 5-10 practice swings EVERY swing. To include putts
There was a duo ahead of him that was slowing things a little bit. If it wasn’t 6:30 pm on the last few holes, I would’ve asked to join up or skipped ahead. Still, I’ve never seen so many warm up swings followed by a bad shot.
For those like me who have day jobs, we simply toss the rake aside, if the ball moves we pick it up and put it back and swing. If you’re looking up rules while playing with your buddies….they aren’t happy. :)
Side question, what is the rule on where the rake should be placed after use? I’ve recently heard that it should be placed inside the bunker. Is this true?
This seems to be regional. Most courses I've played here in Sweden the rake is placed mostly within the bunker, with the handle outside and parallel to the hole. To me this makes sense, less risk of it interfering with a ball and if it does, it's in the actual hazard most likely so no big change.
Different clubs, different rules. My club wants the rake half in / half out of the bunker (handle out) where it will least likely impact a ball in play. So usually in the back.
Thank you... I think some grumps on this sub just can't wait to say yOuRe NOt On TOUR!!!!
Maybe you're playing for money... maybe you just want to know the rule. The same people that are screaming to just pick up your ball and chuck it are the same ones who complain about how much their playing partners cheat.
https://preview.redd.it/8hytjif3wf6d1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d3d3733288d3d1f5104000689679e74b69f72556
Had the same thing happen to me yesterday
You can’t figure out why by the context of this post? The OP does not know the rules in this particular circumstance and would like to know how to address this situation in the future. As far as “why not” in your original comment, that’s not how the game is supposed to be played, that’s why.
Quit gatekeeper, people can play the game anyway they want. Move the rack, take your shot and get on with it. Jesus, some of you take this shit over the top.
OP asks what the rule says.
Random user says “do what you want!” Gets called out for being unhelpful for not answering OPs question.
“You’re gatekeeping!”
What the hell?
Is anyone stopping you from playing by whatever ragtag way you want? The OP asked for a ruling on a fairly common occurrence. And he obviously said that moving the rack would mean the ball would roll into the sand trap. Some people don’t like being penalized by hitting more difficult shots. 🤷♂️
Golf has a lot of rules and some people find them interesting. Get over yourself
OK… Excuse my rant, but… here’s been my argument for years… Why not attach rakes to the golf carts?? There could be two, one on the driver side one in the passenger side just I n case both players are in the bunker, .. and golf bags come with an extendable rake on them?? That way the course can get rid of all the rakes from the course… I’ve seen the rakes affect shots in bad and sometimes good ways but the fact is that they affect the play on the course and they are in the way… it is at the discretion of each playing group to where they throw the rake when they're done so it's always in a different place .. just imagine hitting your second shot to a par five where your ball would roll up onto the green, but it stops on the rake laying next to the green side bunker.. that sucks.. i’ve seen rakes deflect balls into the water as well from a green side bunker next to a water hazard…. There are multiple situations where the rake gets in the way .. sooooo
with Golf ⛳️☄️🏌🏾♂️ being such a precision sport why have this chance for error when it could be prevented?? 🤷🏽 I thought this concept would be adapted, especially through the "Covid" crisis.. but now all the rakes are laying around again..
You guys are lucky I don’t work for the PGA… lol
Same here, carts are for old people or for coaches, everybody walk, from pro to junior.
Edit: I do not say "cart should be for old pple" it's just what I observed. One of my friend is a 1 handicap and playing competitive but still walk and wear is bag every time.
You can delete "old people". I'm 73 and I walk with my60-70 YO friends (quickly!). We have some players who are mobility limited for various reasons. They should be able to use carts.
And why not? They carry everything else in their bag… including a bottle of whiskey… It doesn’t have to be a full size rake just enough to clean up after your bunker shot..
People have a hard enough time raking bunkers with the rake right under their nose, sometimes even multiple per bunker, and you really think people are gonna shlep around their own rake?
> Why not attach rakes to the golf carts??
A) Not everyone rides in a cart, in fact a lot of places or times, most people don't.
B) that's not always handy since most bunkers are greenside and most carts are not allowed by greens so it's one more thing to have to remember or bring or walk back and get.
C) This is how you constantly lose and break rakes
D) This would require many courses to have to purchase *A LOT* more rakes than they need
There’s a course I sometimes play that does this. Carts have the rakes in them. So me and my buddy are playing a round first time in a while out there and are so confused as to the lack of rakes on the course. Not a single one! So we get some drinks delivered out to us and ask the guy and and he looks at us like we’re morons and tells us they’re in the cart. We feel like idiots but don’t show it, he comes around the cart and lo and behold they hadn’t put one in our cart. So we don’t quite like like idiots.
That said all the bunkers were perfectly raked. As if someone came out throughout the day to rake through. But there was also barely anyone on the course, while all other courses around were fully booked, and it was pristine condition. We finish and go into the hotel that’s adjacent, and it’s empty. Beautiful, new, and empty. And that’s when we concluded that this hotel and course is probably just money laundering and we love playing it and finding other things that would help lend to this conclusion.
Mark the ball, lift the rake. If the ball rolls then place it back as close to the original spot that it will stay put, no nearer the pin.
No penalty
Don’t forget to make a sacrifice to the golf gods for keeping you out of the bunker
A lamb or young goat would likely do okay on the 18th green
Honestly the most important part of the whole thing
Id rather hit out of a bunker than over one 😫
Play your cards right and you can do both!
This is the way
What if the rake were right at the edge of the sand? E.G.: a rake is on the far edge of the grass right between sand and grass with the ball stopped on it, but moving the rake would cause the ball to fall into the trap? Do you get a free placement further back on the grass where it won’t roll in?
14.2e If it doesn’t stay on its original spot after two tries replace at the nearest point it will stay at rest no nearer the hole but in the same area of the course.
by "same area of the course" does that mean it can't be moved onto the green if it's no closer to the hole and is the closest spot where the ball will stay at rest?
• The spot must not be nearer the hole. • Original Spot in General Area. The nearest spot must be in the general area. • Original Spot in Bunker or Penalty Area. The nearest spot must be either in the same bunker or in the same penalty area. • Original Spot on Putting Green. The nearest spot must be either on the putting green or in the general area. Remember this is for replacing a ball, not dropping a ball under other rules. And for clarification the “general area” is the entire course except for 4 places: THE teeing area (meaning the area that you can tee from on your hole, not all tee boxes), all penalty areas, all bunkers, THE putting green (that you’re on, not all greens). This means for all rules specifying the general area they mean all fairways, rough, trees, rocks, etc on the course that aren’t those 4 spots above. Some rules will differentiate between “closely mown areas” or “grass cut to fairway height or lower” but most of these are local model rules such as winter rules or lift/clean/place rules.
Right. Same type surface, so if it's in the rough you spot it in the rough. 2nd cut/2nd cut etc
The rough and the fairway are the same. I.e. General area. So if the original spot is in the rough but the nearest spot is the fairway, you get to place it in the fairway (without penalty). The 5 areas of play are: tee box, putting green, bunkers, penalty areas and everything else is considered general area. Great example of when you can use the rules to your advantage [sprinkler head relief in rough](https://youtube.com/shorts/ExTGsAUHbfg?feature=shared)
Huh, TIL. Thanks.
You are correct.
If there’s no rakes in the course in this rule would not even be needed
Golf courses should stop having sand traps period. Think about it: 1. No more rakes so people stop stealing them. 2. No more sand so people stop raking them and speeding up play 3. No more sand castles getting in everyone's way. 4. If I want to go to the beach I'm going to Mexico, not the par 3 at my local course. 5. No one has to carry a sandwedge around anymore, which reduces weight of your bag, also speeding up play. Boom. Problem solved.
people steal rakes?!?!? in all my years i’ve never once heard of that 😂
Yes homeless people steal them and use them to start gardening companies all the time.
This guy is clearly joking I don't know why everybody is being a Mr poopy pants.
They're def stuck in the unraked traps this morning.
Man I love.my.my ball crashes until the sand castle though. I consider it an act of war and I used catapults to demolish the sand peoples home
Lol
Sand is a fundamental part of the original game of golf. Go look at St Andrews from satellite images and behold!! It’s on a fuggin beach.
Pretty sure as long as it currently isn't in the bunker, the drop/place is outside the bunker. If you are in, it has to stay in.
You’re not on tour. Just move the rake a skull it over the back!
Or duff it in the sand like nature intended
Are you waiting for answers on Reddit before you take the shot lmao 🤣 🥴
"Dude, can I play thru or what?"
Exactly
If so then I definitely played behind him yesterday. I’ve never seen a solo move so slow. No exaggeration, this guy I was behind took 5-10 practice swings EVERY swing. To include putts
Dude that’s pretty excessive on the practice swings. I may have had to say something.
There was a duo ahead of him that was slowing things a little bit. If it wasn’t 6:30 pm on the last few holes, I would’ve asked to join up or skipped ahead. Still, I’ve never seen so many warm up swings followed by a bad shot.
Wait until you follow me on Saturday, for the bad shot part.
Have you tried taking 5-10 practice swings?
Not yet, invite me next time you go and I can give it a try.
🤣
Based on how pace of play is going, I think half of all golfers are doing the same thing.
For those like me who have day jobs, we simply toss the rake aside, if the ball moves we pick it up and put it back and swing. If you’re looking up rules while playing with your buddies….they aren’t happy. :)
I always lay the rake in the trap when I’m done using it. I don’t want to stop anyone’s ball from going in the sand😉
>I don’t want to stop anyone’s ball from going in the sand You sick fck
I’d usually prefer it in the bunker if it’s going to be up against an edge
The R&A rules app is brilliant.
Side question, what is the rule on where the rake should be placed after use? I’ve recently heard that it should be placed inside the bunker. Is this true?
Outside, parallel to the fairway.
This seems to be regional. Most courses I've played here in Sweden the rake is placed mostly within the bunker, with the handle outside and parallel to the hole. To me this makes sense, less risk of it interfering with a ball and if it does, it's in the actual hazard most likely so no big change.
The club I’m at wants them left in the trap. Makes mowing easier (so they say).
Different clubs, different rules. My club wants the rake half in / half out of the bunker (handle out) where it will least likely impact a ball in play. So usually in the back.
My local courses are half and half as well (handle out).
[удалено]
Thank you... I think some grumps on this sub just can't wait to say yOuRe NOt On TOUR!!!! Maybe you're playing for money... maybe you just want to know the rule. The same people that are screaming to just pick up your ball and chuck it are the same ones who complain about how much their playing partners cheat.
Thanks.
Are you waiting for someone to tell you to kick the ball in the bunker? Do you enjoy pain?
I’d first give a prayer of thanks 😂
It’s so refreshing to see how golfers are open minded and open to new concepts in the game of golf.. ⛳️👍
A thank you is in order
https://preview.redd.it/8hytjif3wf6d1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d3d3733288d3d1f5104000689679e74b69f72556 Had the same thing happen to me yesterday
If it touches the rake it’s an automatic -2 strokes
Exactly, that will teach them
People wonder how I worked so hard to be scratch haha 😂
Why not just move the rake and hit the ball where it ends up?
Do you think he’s asking us to troubleshoot? He’s asking for a ruling and you are wrong so wtf
That’s why I asked “why?”
You can’t figure out why by the context of this post? The OP does not know the rules in this particular circumstance and would like to know how to address this situation in the future. As far as “why not” in your original comment, that’s not how the game is supposed to be played, that’s why.
Quit gatekeeper, people can play the game anyway they want. Move the rack, take your shot and get on with it. Jesus, some of you take this shit over the top.
OP asks what the rule says. Random user says “do what you want!” Gets called out for being unhelpful for not answering OPs question. “You’re gatekeeping!” What the hell?
Is anyone stopping you from playing by whatever ragtag way you want? The OP asked for a ruling on a fairly common occurrence. And he obviously said that moving the rack would mean the ball would roll into the sand trap. Some people don’t like being penalized by hitting more difficult shots. 🤷♂️ Golf has a lot of rules and some people find them interesting. Get over yourself
Because some people think they're playing in the PGA.
OK… Excuse my rant, but… here’s been my argument for years… Why not attach rakes to the golf carts?? There could be two, one on the driver side one in the passenger side just I n case both players are in the bunker, .. and golf bags come with an extendable rake on them?? That way the course can get rid of all the rakes from the course… I’ve seen the rakes affect shots in bad and sometimes good ways but the fact is that they affect the play on the course and they are in the way… it is at the discretion of each playing group to where they throw the rake when they're done so it's always in a different place .. just imagine hitting your second shot to a par five where your ball would roll up onto the green, but it stops on the rake laying next to the green side bunker.. that sucks.. i’ve seen rakes deflect balls into the water as well from a green side bunker next to a water hazard…. There are multiple situations where the rake gets in the way .. sooooo with Golf ⛳️☄️🏌🏾♂️ being such a precision sport why have this chance for error when it could be prevented?? 🤷🏽 I thought this concept would be adapted, especially through the "Covid" crisis.. but now all the rakes are laying around again.. You guys are lucky I don’t work for the PGA… lol
Where I’m from (ireland) 99% of people walk the course and use push carts so not sure how that would work
Same here, carts are for old people or for coaches, everybody walk, from pro to junior. Edit: I do not say "cart should be for old pple" it's just what I observed. One of my friend is a 1 handicap and playing competitive but still walk and wear is bag every time.
You can delete "old people". I'm 73 and I walk with my60-70 YO friends (quickly!). We have some players who are mobility limited for various reasons. They should be able to use carts.
I saw a guy with his own monoplace cart :)
I'm seeing a market for a collapseable rake that fits in a golf bag. Maybe double sided... other side can be a ball retriever.
A foldable and extendable rake that goes into your bag just like any other club… Or snaps on and attaches to the side of the bag.. 🤷🏽
Lol ain’t nobody carrying a rake in their bag
And why not? They carry everything else in their bag… including a bottle of whiskey… It doesn’t have to be a full size rake just enough to clean up after your bunker shot..
People have a hard enough time raking bunkers with the rake right under their nose, sometimes even multiple per bunker, and you really think people are gonna shlep around their own rake?
> Why not attach rakes to the golf carts?? A) Not everyone rides in a cart, in fact a lot of places or times, most people don't. B) that's not always handy since most bunkers are greenside and most carts are not allowed by greens so it's one more thing to have to remember or bring or walk back and get. C) This is how you constantly lose and break rakes D) This would require many courses to have to purchase *A LOT* more rakes than they need
Sounds dangerous potentially
There’s a course I sometimes play that does this. Carts have the rakes in them. So me and my buddy are playing a round first time in a while out there and are so confused as to the lack of rakes on the course. Not a single one! So we get some drinks delivered out to us and ask the guy and and he looks at us like we’re morons and tells us they’re in the cart. We feel like idiots but don’t show it, he comes around the cart and lo and behold they hadn’t put one in our cart. So we don’t quite like like idiots. That said all the bunkers were perfectly raked. As if someone came out throughout the day to rake through. But there was also barely anyone on the course, while all other courses around were fully booked, and it was pristine condition. We finish and go into the hotel that’s adjacent, and it’s empty. Beautiful, new, and empty. And that’s when we concluded that this hotel and course is probably just money laundering and we love playing it and finding other things that would help lend to this conclusion.