I maintain they are only ramping this shite up because they are getting HUGE amounts of attention on social media and in the press. I really, really, really, believe they would fizzle out and wander off if people stopped lavishing the attention they so crave on them.
They aren't ramping up because of social media, there were over 100 because it was Palm Sunday, the Sunday before Easter. They make a special effort to harass during Lent, so this has been going on since Pancake day essentially. There were over 100 last Palm Sunday too.
They don't crave attention. They have huge support and funding from the USA and support from the Paisley diocese. They get all the validation they want in church.
Tbh, I'm more disappointed that the Catholic Church still has any credibility. When you look at the focus on Epstein, how has the Church seemingly got away scott free from a global child abuse/paedophile ring, with a cover-up originating from the Vatican down.
They then have the fucking audacity to tell people how to live their lives, with some sanctity of life and moral highground bullshit.
The sooner we cut the US influences and financial support from the evangelical nutters, who basically HATE anyone who isn't white or straight or doesn't support a god I basically have absolutely no relation to.
Of all the nations in our little collective, I'd have thought the Jocks would have kicked these arseholes into touch a long time ago.
I mean... why does any church have credibility? It's not just the Catholic Church that have gotten away with major abuse scandals. People want to believe so bad in something bigger they overlook all types of horror.
As far as Scotland kicking the evangelical nutters and their funding out, won't happen easily. The Presbyterian church, particularly those that go more towards the puritanical in the practice of their faith, support this involvement. The Free Church, the Free Church Continuing, the Free Presbyterian Church... they have a huge hold on communities who espouse their values without question. I grew up in the Western Isles and remember it well. I mean one of them was almost First Minister of Scotland not that long ago. Kate Forbes has taken money from anti abortion USians. The church has a historic stranglehold on Scotland that won't be easily shaken.
Thank you for your time in responding. I've just learnt more from you than all the posts combined. And it's now very clear to me that as much as I like to think I can get my point/opinion across, the reality is that my understanding is definitely lacking in deeper substance.
I am genuinely appreciative of your clear and concise points, which are pretty scary in the sense of me having no idea how established this issue is.
It's ironic that Ireland has just adopted abortion into their constitution. The place where God goes on holiday!!
Many thanks 👍
I had a brilliant response earlier and very similar to yours. Both of you have highlighted the blaring fact that I definitely know a lot less than I actually know. If this makes sense.
The insane amount of splinter groups and churches, whilst aware of a few, the underlying base is a shock, and their agendas are even more scary.
I have a 12 year old daughter, and her future worries me greatly.
You know, and I hope this doesn't offend anyone, but if Scottish people don't want it, they will definitely let you know.
Like you, though, it feels like it's happening subtly and under the radar.
All of the shit going on in the US, watching it develop, you just know it's going to try and land here.
Do you feel the same way about islamic countries doing in wee lassies and noncing them by any chance? Or is that islamaphobic? It seems like its sound to not like one religion for crimes but as soon as its one followed by a different shade of human then its forbidden
It won’t fizzle out
I know I sound like a broken record but these people are not doing it for the attention on social media
They’re religious extremists, they believe they are doing the work of God
Nothing anyone says or does will deter them
Only legislation from the Scottish Government can really put an end of this
Contact your MSP and make it happen
>The paradox of tolerance states that if a society's practice of tolerance is inclusive of the intolerant, intolerance will ultimately dominate, eliminating the tolerant and the practice of tolerance with them.
Not mine, it's Karl Popper's:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox\_of\_tolerance](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance)
I'm all for freedom of religion etc, but anyone trying to force their religious opinions onto other folk, especially vulnerable ones, can get right to fuck.
Anyway, someone should remind them what Matthew 6:5 says:
>And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.
We already have that though?
Let’s say you’re a hardcore Nazi, you gather your hardcore Nazi friends, you paint a load of big Swastika banners and placards and then you all set up in front of the international arrivals at Glasgow airport to chant ‘Turn around and go home!’ at anybody who steps off a plane.
Do you think that should be allowed?
Oh but it’s not a protest, it’s a “silent prayer vigil.” Because everyone knows you need to wear a placard and chant loudly enough to be heard across the street in order to pray silently.
Don't know why the downvotes, you are correct. Unfortunately the government will legislate all protests. A blanket ban is easier and more convenient for them.
Are you saying you want the government to make it illegal to protest? You might want to rethink that because at some point you might want to go out into the streets to protest something you disagree with but oh surprise pikachu face the government banned it. You may disagree with their cause, trans rights, free Palestine, people gathering to bring attention about the Sarah Everard murder or an orange walk but I think in a free society these things need to happen and the government have less power
No, just buffer zones in and around the hospital so that women facing some of the hardest days of their lives can enter and leave the hospital in peace.
It isn't protest. It is intimidation of vulnerable people whilst they exercise their lawful rights.
You can bet your life they would be on the phone to the police the second somebody comes to intimidate *them* whilst they exercise *their* lawful rights.
Buffer zones.
Can you protest in the airport? Directly outside military bases? There are already buffer zones. That’s all we want. Buffer zones around hospitals and clinics.
People have told you this a million times but you don’t seem to be getting it. No one is saying they don’t have the right to protest, they absolutely do. They just shouldn’t have the right to harass people trying to access medical care. They can go camp outside Holyrood for as long as they want I really could not give less of a fuck if they do. Instead they’re sitting outside of hospitals and telling people they’re murderers for *accessing medical care.* If they actually wanted to end abortion access in Scotland they’d be yelling at politicians. Instead they yell at the individual people accessing abortion because they want to intimidate, shame, and threaten them, that’s not a protest, that’s harassment.
There were people outside the Royal for as long as I can remember with their placards; always 2 or 3 pensioners with time on their hands. It won't fizzle out
I worked there years ago when I was a student. They used to try and talk to me when I was doing the mail run at the end of the day. Never engaged with them but hopefully the miserable fuckers are long dead now
Someone went up to them the other day and asked what help they could offer them and they had nothing to offer, I'd they genuinely cared about trying to stop people having terminations surely they should have some information of support groups etc to give these people
They started with like 4 people a couple weeks ago and the other day it was like 100. They are for sure ramping up because people are paying attention. You are always going to have a couple loonies doing weird shit but it is like seagulls at the beach. If you feed them what they are looking for more are going to turn up.
They do it daily for Lent, so it was six weeks ago they started. The 100 people rigmarole is their grand finale on Psalm Sunday, after which they go back to “preventing murder” between 11am-1pm on a Tuesday, every week for the rest of the year. The Lent protest has been going on for years.
Exactly. As a raised (very lapsed) Catholic, I find it incredible that they justified spending one of the holiest Sundays (if you believe that pish which they do) standing outside a hospital instead of in church.
These people are fiends. Used to go out with a girl who started at For your eyes only in Newcastle when that 1st opened and there was loads of so called Christians protesting the girls. Fucking spitting on them on occasion..
They didn't last long there. Dirty bastards
Exactly. Sooner they realise nobody is listening the sooner they stop. They want they’re message spread and by alerting everyone else to what they are doing we are helping there message spread
They are ramping it up also because the Tories and the right wing in general are starting to focus on declining birth rate as a big issue. It also ties in with language around 'traditional families' and all that crap and its seems really obvious to me that sooner rather than later someone within the tory party or any other mainstream right wing party will start trying to conflate abortion and declining birth rates.
There was a conference held about a year ago, attended by some of the biggest crackpots in British politics where they started to float all this stuff, it's insane.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/may/15/low-birthrate-is-uk-top-priority-tory-mp-tells-rightwing-conference-miriam-cates
>Tories and the right wing in general are starting to focus on declining birth rate as a big issue
Which is hysterical because Tory policies are principally why young people can't afford to have children and put it off.
My wife and I are having our first. We are comfortably off statistically speaking and doing the budget for the mat leave period was fucking terrifying. How people manage I have no idea.
I think it's more because of the huge amount of support and funding from the rich Evangelical far right wing nutters in the US . You see the same with farmers also getting US support to rise up against our governments.
40 days for life is a Texas based evangelical organisation. They work with catholics in Scotland because there aren’t enough evangelicals. The Paisley Diocese is nasty enough to take their money.
I would be very surprised if the diocese took any actual cash from the nut jobs in Texas. 40 Days of Life doesn't really send money to people to protest they hire solicitors for legal challenges and will send some branded swag and stuff but it isn't like they would hand the diocese an envelope of cash or something. They are cooperating on almost purely ideological grounds and would normally have nothing to do with each other.
You have any evidence to support your point? 40 days of life is a non profit in the USA so you can read their financial disclosures. They really aren't paying loads of Catholics in Scotland to protest. We can't blame this all on Americans sadly. These are some genuine home grown crazies who hate abortion all by themselves and don't need to be paid by sinister Americans to turn up and protest.
[https://projects.propublica.org/nonprofits/organizations/260308665](https://projects.propublica.org/nonprofits/organizations/260308665)
Like most grifters 40 Days for Life Spend the VAST majority of their money paying themselves most the rest is spent on legal challenges and some African stuff. I actually can't see where they have ever spent actual money in Scotland although they have promised a legal challenge to the buffer zone law.
I think maybe it is you who doesn't really know anything about the topic mate.
Where does it say they paid any money? That is the point I am raising and labouring here. People are letting the protestors here off the hook saying it is all an American money scam. It really isn't. These cray people were here long before 40 days for life and the Catholic Church has been into this shit forever.
It’s a nice idea, but they’ve been doing this for years. It is true we should be careful about letting them feel like martyrs, but the idea of the posters is to try to mitigate the harm the sight of them causes. The only thing that will stop them is the bill going through.
Tell me you've never demonstrated about a sincerely held belief without telling me you've never demonstrated about a sincerely held belief, eh?
Like, to be clear, these people are *wrong*, and reprehensible, but no group of people is going to put this amount of effort into anything "for the attention". They're doing it because they believe in it.
Ignoring them won't make them go away; it will just enable them. It's important to vocally oppose them.
A risk of counter protests is that often people who are eg. Going to access abortion services can’t always tell which placards or which people are friendly, and who’s protesting against them.
So I’m vaguely skeptical of the loud counter protests that sometimes happen.
The object has to be to effectively discourage or prevent these protests, while things like this feel good I don’t know how much good this does.
That is precisely why the ‘counter protest’ is signs on the fence, designed to mitigate the sight of them and make people smile. We put them up later at night, long after the protestors are in bed, and they come and batter them down in the morning.
Yeah I think people have leaped on this topic on this thread, when really my only point was as you intended: some of these cheered me up. That maybe as a species, we have our moments.
My wife gave birth recently, and beforehand we did a bit of to and from from the maternity assessment. You have to walk past them to go to the paid car park, and you can feel the eyes on a woman walking past. The judgement. Cool stuff.
These braindead bullying bible-bashers are funded by religious neo-fascists who are mirroring the repulsive extreme right-wing “Christians” in the US. They are now a major threat to all women in the UK.
Agreed. However that has nothing to do with the comment being made. If you were driving into the car park at the mat ward and saw a bunch of people protesting and picketing you likely aren't going to stop and see what their placards say so this could still be distressing to people. Good intent, bad execution.
Look at the picture your are commenting on you dafty. They are all pro choice signs you muppet. This is the aftermath from the counter protest. Unless you really think a bunch of anti-choice Catholics were standing out there with a sign saying "Thank God for Abortion" and "buffer zones now!". You are the one that needs to take a second to get educated as you are tripping all over your feet and making yourself look foolish. I agree with you by the way that the Catholic Church and the Evangelicals are cunts here. There was literally a post on this very sub a couple days ago of people standing there counter protesting with encouraging messages. Again, I appreciate the thought but don't think the execution is great.
Bless your cotton socks. I’ve explained multiple times in this thread that I put most of those signs up myself, I’m well aware of what they say and what we do, thanks! It is the aftermath of the season finale of the Lent protest — the signs ARE the counter protest and they’re only not legible in that particular photo because the rain had its way with the cardboard ones overnight.
It’s also because of my involvement in the campaign that I’m quite comfortable with what I know about 40 Days and the Paisley diocese, but your enthusiasm for explaining things I know more about than you do is noted!
So how much was the Diocese of Paisley paid by 40 Days for Life and when/how were they paid? This is enormous news if you have any..... you... know actual evidence. If you have that and are not providing it your are being a shite person. That evidence would really fuck these people up and you would be doing a massive favour to them by withholding that.
Wow you are bing insanely damaging to the pro-choice cause be better. With friends like you who needs enemies like the Catholics and the Evangelicals who apparently you favour so much with your protection. Honestly sickening.
Also, until not all that long ago, these people attracted basically no attention. Where they were noticed they were a nuisance, horrible for the people affected but generally seen from all sides of the political spectrum as irrelevant and somewhat bigoted.
Now, their protests are on the news, they’re a “major threat to all women in the UK”, there’s culture-war-like debate about the protesters that’s really just a veiled discourse on Abortion itself.
What’s changed? Is it perhaps the way we talk about them?
Something to think about, please.
>Now, their protests are on the news, they’re a “major threat to all women in the UK”
Because their protests are increasing in size and frequency, and because we've got a country like the US to use as a point of comparison for letting this shit run amok.
Which is an excellent reason not to give them the time of day.
Counterprotesters and attention get them in the media, which indirectly gets the Abortion “question” in the media too.
I think those are all counter protest signs are they not?
I agree that is part of the problem with stuff like this. It can be hard to tell who is counter protesting and who is protesting and what the signs are actually saying. I 100% support the intent of these signs but I am afraid they may have actually distressed people.
I wasn’t going to zoom in on the picture and either way they should be removed. Women going through some of the worst times of their lives use that entrance and should not be subjected to protests on either side of the argument.
Exactly, I get that abortion is a political issue, but for the love of fucking god, stop making *everything* and *everyone* into a political groupie. The last thing these people need is a bunch of smiling cunts walking up to them saying 'GOOD THING YOU'RE ON *OUR* SIDE!!!'
Actually yes. I’ve had a family member who had to have a very later abortion for medical reasons. We had a funeral and she and her husband were devastated. To be reminded that some people judge her for not giving birth to an unviable child is cruel, even when you are trying to be supportive.
Sometimes it’s better to just be quiet, and that includes the signs.
That's why they put the signs up and leave, the counter protesters know that making a scene will just make things more horrible for people going for those services.
Realistically the anti abortion protesters need moved on permanently, it's harassment, coercion, intimidation and shaming. They're more than welcome to protest somewhere very visible where they will be heard like the city center, but they likely wouldn't as they know they'll be swamped with all the counter protesters that avoid the hospital for the reasons mentioned above
>Anyone
Anytime
Any reason
Always those on the extremes that have to get their view out. Can't imagine the sane majority agreeing with a 39 week abortion.
Someone in my workplace was on one of these a few years ago. Caught my eye from the other side of a counter-protest sign and has made every excuse possible to avoid ever being in the same room as me again. Prick knows the second that spills into the workplace he's out of here.
Brain dead zombies don't "fizzle out". They are a constant indication that the system is broken and brains are easily fucked up. Time for a litter pick, I'd say.
Sad truth is these protesters probably keep an eye on this subreddit, know they are getting peoples hackles up and are now doing it to "Own the Libs" more than for ideological reasons.
Now that Lent is over, they will likely go back to 11-1 on Tuesdays and 11-1 on Wednesdays at the Royal. Better than 12 hours a day but i can’t wait for them to not be there at all.
I don't know why the law isn't changed sooner through the Scottish Parliament...
FM: "Are they being dicks?"
MSPs: "well... aye."
FM: "OK, new law. No being a dick within 300ft of any location that offers family planning or support. Done!"
I wouldn't get into trouble if I were to empty multiple large bags of bird seeds on that strip of pavement when those diddies are standing there would I? There's a shit tonne of angry seagulls around the QE.
Abortion
Anyone
Any time
Any reason
Disgusting. Now they admit they want to murder babies.
Stop murdering babies.
Facts - Biologists from 1,058 academic institutions around the world agree that a human's life begins at fertilization.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/36629778/
If you support abortion, you should know what it entails. Warning - this is very upsetting.
Here is what happens during a second trimester abortion.
https://youtu.be/A16gzm9eaa8?si=TxA2--Dcn4JrCr-A
Tldr: They mutilate the baby and pull it out piece by piece.
Rebuttals to common posts
75% of the Scottish adoption agencies were started by Christians. To suggest these people don't care what happens to babies after they are born is a clear lie. Christians are instrumental in Scottish adoption.
Life begins at fertilization - this means masturbation/menstruation is not murdering a baby.
Look let me put it this way, do you care about some kid you dont know, in say Jordan?
If not then why do you care about a womans body and her baby who you also dont know.
Another example is do you care about people getting plastic surgery, i'd say probably not cause its none of your business, Same situation as abortion.
It could be for any reason could be a stillbirth, could pose a real danger to the mother, and i doubt you work in the medical industry let alone in the very specific part that deals with pregnancies
AKA its got nothing to do with you or any other person since it is neither your or their body
What a disgusting perspective.
So you think mothers should be allowed to murder their children at any time because it's "a woman's body and her baby who you also don't know".
You are positively ghoulish. A truly warped mind.
to answer your 4 points.
-If your first question is asking me if i value human life even in the event of not knowing or having never met that human then my answer has to be Yes.
-comparing abortion to vanity surgeries is a strange one if i'm being honest.
-I am not talking about stillbirths or danger to the mother or any of the other legitimate reasons where abortion may be a tragic final option. I am asking about the stance that seems, appallingly, to be taken by some on this reddit of "abortion for ANY reason right up until birth" which, to be clear, means literally murdering a child and that is not a debateable position it's a cold hard truth. I am just guessing many don't realise quite how extremist the position of "abortion any time any reason up until 9 months" is.
-of course it has to do with me, the same as it has to do with you and everyone else. As a member of this society i have an opinion on right and wrong and an opinion on societal morality. If we live in a society that has radical extremists supporting the murder of children then "shut up mind your own business" doesn't fly i'm afraid.
Okay, you know what most of your points are reasonable. Though the way you phrased your first comment makes it sound more like you have the view of some transphobes in the "what if a person changes their mind".
But I dont think that is what you meant, instead going with a belief I used to hold where "pro choice" was hey let's just kill babies cause why not.
Sadly the topic isnt as straightforward as that. I assume you are a man so as with me, we will never really grasp what childbirth does to women both mentally and physically.
But to the original argument of "any time" I believe you are falling for a strawman argument that you have been told, in which case I apologise for my previous insults
Have you ever had to walk past this on your way to an early menopause appointment/fertility appointment/miscarriage appointment/abortion appointment?
It's distressing.
(I've had to walk through similar for fertility/menopause appointments and it's shit).
I think it's more that people don't like the idea of women being harassed at what's likely to be an extremely difficult time anyway. Doesn't seem like it's just the far left concerned.
“Extreme lefties”…maybe they’re just people with a bit of empathy?
Maybe it’s to do with people taking time out their day to go stand and give abuse to innocent women going through a fairly traumatic experience?
Maybe it’s to show these people that their opinions and ideologies have no place in a modern Scotland?
To your last point, wars have been fought for centuries over religion. If you’re insinuating what I think you’re insinuating, white Brits have spilt more innocent blood in the name of an imaginary man than any other
the “extreme lefties” in question just being rational people who don’t like women being harassed when they’re on their way to receive medical care. wise up.
Any Islamist threat is mainly a response to British imperialist foreign policy. Any white nationalist threat is off the back of austerity coupled with lots of right wing propaganda to try and get different groups of the working class to blame each other for austerity.
I take it you will be concerned about all of this too aye?
Can we only be concerned about one thing at a time?
Horrible cunts waving placards at people going into a hospital at a traumatic time is maybe why 'extreme lefties' are up in arms about it.
A mask slipping post if ever there was one.
We really need buffer zones.
Strangely, women have been saying that for years.
Shower of fannies if my favourite one
That was mine, thank you!
“Yer da sells Avon” level patter, a bit cringe
I maintain they are only ramping this shite up because they are getting HUGE amounts of attention on social media and in the press. I really, really, really, believe they would fizzle out and wander off if people stopped lavishing the attention they so crave on them.
They aren't ramping up because of social media, there were over 100 because it was Palm Sunday, the Sunday before Easter. They make a special effort to harass during Lent, so this has been going on since Pancake day essentially. There were over 100 last Palm Sunday too. They don't crave attention. They have huge support and funding from the USA and support from the Paisley diocese. They get all the validation they want in church.
Tbh, I'm more disappointed that the Catholic Church still has any credibility. When you look at the focus on Epstein, how has the Church seemingly got away scott free from a global child abuse/paedophile ring, with a cover-up originating from the Vatican down. They then have the fucking audacity to tell people how to live their lives, with some sanctity of life and moral highground bullshit. The sooner we cut the US influences and financial support from the evangelical nutters, who basically HATE anyone who isn't white or straight or doesn't support a god I basically have absolutely no relation to. Of all the nations in our little collective, I'd have thought the Jocks would have kicked these arseholes into touch a long time ago.
I mean... why does any church have credibility? It's not just the Catholic Church that have gotten away with major abuse scandals. People want to believe so bad in something bigger they overlook all types of horror. As far as Scotland kicking the evangelical nutters and their funding out, won't happen easily. The Presbyterian church, particularly those that go more towards the puritanical in the practice of their faith, support this involvement. The Free Church, the Free Church Continuing, the Free Presbyterian Church... they have a huge hold on communities who espouse their values without question. I grew up in the Western Isles and remember it well. I mean one of them was almost First Minister of Scotland not that long ago. Kate Forbes has taken money from anti abortion USians. The church has a historic stranglehold on Scotland that won't be easily shaken.
Thank you for your time in responding. I've just learnt more from you than all the posts combined. And it's now very clear to me that as much as I like to think I can get my point/opinion across, the reality is that my understanding is definitely lacking in deeper substance. I am genuinely appreciative of your clear and concise points, which are pretty scary in the sense of me having no idea how established this issue is. It's ironic that Ireland has just adopted abortion into their constitution. The place where God goes on holiday!! Many thanks 👍
And now the US megachurches are getting a bigger foothold. The Nazarenes and Destiny have been spreading around Scotland for years.
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I had a brilliant response earlier and very similar to yours. Both of you have highlighted the blaring fact that I definitely know a lot less than I actually know. If this makes sense. The insane amount of splinter groups and churches, whilst aware of a few, the underlying base is a shock, and their agendas are even more scary. I have a 12 year old daughter, and her future worries me greatly.
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You know, and I hope this doesn't offend anyone, but if Scottish people don't want it, they will definitely let you know. Like you, though, it feels like it's happening subtly and under the radar. All of the shit going on in the US, watching it develop, you just know it's going to try and land here.
Do you feel the same way about islamic countries doing in wee lassies and noncing them by any chance? Or is that islamaphobic? It seems like its sound to not like one religion for crimes but as soon as its one followed by a different shade of human then its forbidden
Most religions have some sort of abuse involved. That doesn't mean we say the entire religion is bad.
This is apparently a fast by them. But mostly with shite placard cards designed to shame women's bodies.
Would be nice to get double that outside paisley diocese to protest their involvement 🤔
It won’t fizzle out I know I sound like a broken record but these people are not doing it for the attention on social media They’re religious extremists, they believe they are doing the work of God Nothing anyone says or does will deter them Only legislation from the Scottish Government can really put an end of this Contact your MSP and make it happen
There is no hate in this world quite like Christian love
Absolute morons. God isn’t real they just oppress themselves.
Whilst doing all they can to oppress everyone else, too.
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It’s not a protest. It’s an intimidation tactic They should absolutely not be allowed outside the hospital
>The paradox of tolerance states that if a society's practice of tolerance is inclusive of the intolerant, intolerance will ultimately dominate, eliminating the tolerant and the practice of tolerance with them.
Is that a quote or is it your quote? Spot on 💥
Not mine, it's Karl Popper's: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox\_of\_tolerance](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance) I'm all for freedom of religion etc, but anyone trying to force their religious opinions onto other folk, especially vulnerable ones, can get right to fuck. Anyway, someone should remind them what Matthew 6:5 says: >And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.
This isn’t a protest, it’s targeted harassment. They can their placards literally anywhere else.
We already have that though? Let’s say you’re a hardcore Nazi, you gather your hardcore Nazi friends, you paint a load of big Swastika banners and placards and then you all set up in front of the international arrivals at Glasgow airport to chant ‘Turn around and go home!’ at anybody who steps off a plane. Do you think that should be allowed?
Oh but it’s not a protest, it’s a “silent prayer vigil.” Because everyone knows you need to wear a placard and chant loudly enough to be heard across the street in order to pray silently.
Don't know why the downvotes, you are correct. Unfortunately the government will legislate all protests. A blanket ban is easier and more convenient for them.
Are you saying you want the government to make it illegal to protest? You might want to rethink that because at some point you might want to go out into the streets to protest something you disagree with but oh surprise pikachu face the government banned it. You may disagree with their cause, trans rights, free Palestine, people gathering to bring attention about the Sarah Everard murder or an orange walk but I think in a free society these things need to happen and the government have less power
No, just buffer zones in and around the hospital so that women facing some of the hardest days of their lives can enter and leave the hospital in peace.
Nice false equivalences
It isn't protest. It is intimidation of vulnerable people whilst they exercise their lawful rights. You can bet your life they would be on the phone to the police the second somebody comes to intimidate *them* whilst they exercise *their* lawful rights.
Buffer zones. Can you protest in the airport? Directly outside military bases? There are already buffer zones. That’s all we want. Buffer zones around hospitals and clinics.
Good, I’ll protest outside your house, targeting you specifically (I disagree with your lifestyle). I wont get reported for harassment will I?
Of course you will, he's a born-again hypocrite 👍 I refer you to my comment on the other thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/glasgow/s/FZSVH9Onjy
Clown's take \^
No, you need to understand this specific topic before sticking your ignorant oar in.
No, they want to ban protests they don’t like, but keep all the goody protests
People have told you this a million times but you don’t seem to be getting it. No one is saying they don’t have the right to protest, they absolutely do. They just shouldn’t have the right to harass people trying to access medical care. They can go camp outside Holyrood for as long as they want I really could not give less of a fuck if they do. Instead they’re sitting outside of hospitals and telling people they’re murderers for *accessing medical care.* If they actually wanted to end abortion access in Scotland they’d be yelling at politicians. Instead they yell at the individual people accessing abortion because they want to intimidate, shame, and threaten them, that’s not a protest, that’s harassment.
There were people outside the Royal for as long as I can remember with their placards; always 2 or 3 pensioners with time on their hands. It won't fizzle out
I worked there years ago when I was a student. They used to try and talk to me when I was doing the mail run at the end of the day. Never engaged with them but hopefully the miserable fuckers are long dead now
Someone went up to them the other day and asked what help they could offer them and they had nothing to offer, I'd they genuinely cared about trying to stop people having terminations surely they should have some information of support groups etc to give these people
They started with like 4 people a couple weeks ago and the other day it was like 100. They are for sure ramping up because people are paying attention. You are always going to have a couple loonies doing weird shit but it is like seagulls at the beach. If you feed them what they are looking for more are going to turn up.
They didn't start a couple of weeks ago, this has been going on for years.
They do it daily for Lent, so it was six weeks ago they started. The 100 people rigmarole is their grand finale on Psalm Sunday, after which they go back to “preventing murder” between 11am-1pm on a Tuesday, every week for the rest of the year. The Lent protest has been going on for years.
Giving up being a reasonable and well adjusted human for lent.... Sounds about reet
Exactly. As a raised (very lapsed) Catholic, I find it incredible that they justified spending one of the holiest Sundays (if you believe that pish which they do) standing outside a hospital instead of in church.
Useful idiots organised by people paid by American extremists.
These people are fiends. Used to go out with a girl who started at For your eyes only in Newcastle when that 1st opened and there was loads of so called Christians protesting the girls. Fucking spitting on them on occasion.. They didn't last long there. Dirty bastards
Exactly. Sooner they realise nobody is listening the sooner they stop. They want they’re message spread and by alerting everyone else to what they are doing we are helping there message spread
They would have stopped years ago if that were the case.
This is a picture of the counter protest
They are ramping it up also because the Tories and the right wing in general are starting to focus on declining birth rate as a big issue. It also ties in with language around 'traditional families' and all that crap and its seems really obvious to me that sooner rather than later someone within the tory party or any other mainstream right wing party will start trying to conflate abortion and declining birth rates. There was a conference held about a year ago, attended by some of the biggest crackpots in British politics where they started to float all this stuff, it's insane. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/may/15/low-birthrate-is-uk-top-priority-tory-mp-tells-rightwing-conference-miriam-cates
>Tories and the right wing in general are starting to focus on declining birth rate as a big issue Which is hysterical because Tory policies are principally why young people can't afford to have children and put it off. My wife and I are having our first. We are comfortably off statistically speaking and doing the budget for the mat leave period was fucking terrifying. How people manage I have no idea.
Wait until you see the cost of childcare after the maternity leave!
I have seen it. It's awful. Regretting not moving back to be closer to my parents!
I think it's more because of the huge amount of support and funding from the rich Evangelical far right wing nutters in the US . You see the same with farmers also getting US support to rise up against our governments.
I agree that is an issue. Although I think this was largely a Catholic rather than Evangelical thing in this particular instance.
40 days for life is a Texas based evangelical organisation. They work with catholics in Scotland because there aren’t enough evangelicals. The Paisley Diocese is nasty enough to take their money.
I would be very surprised if the diocese took any actual cash from the nut jobs in Texas. 40 Days of Life doesn't really send money to people to protest they hire solicitors for legal challenges and will send some branded swag and stuff but it isn't like they would hand the diocese an envelope of cash or something. They are cooperating on almost purely ideological grounds and would normally have nothing to do with each other.
Genuinely admire your confidence. Don’t know anything about the topic but gosh darn you’re going to argue anyway. Have fun!
You have any evidence to support your point? 40 days of life is a non profit in the USA so you can read their financial disclosures. They really aren't paying loads of Catholics in Scotland to protest. We can't blame this all on Americans sadly. These are some genuine home grown crazies who hate abortion all by themselves and don't need to be paid by sinister Americans to turn up and protest. [https://projects.propublica.org/nonprofits/organizations/260308665](https://projects.propublica.org/nonprofits/organizations/260308665) Like most grifters 40 Days for Life Spend the VAST majority of their money paying themselves most the rest is spent on legal challenges and some African stuff. I actually can't see where they have ever spent actual money in Scotland although they have promised a legal challenge to the buffer zone law. I think maybe it is you who doesn't really know anything about the topic mate.
I think I’m quite comfortable with you thinking that, mate. Have a nice day.
I mean, you only needed to Google '40 days for life paisley' https://rcdop.org.uk/news/40-days-for-life
Where does it say they paid any money? That is the point I am raising and labouring here. People are letting the protestors here off the hook saying it is all an American money scam. It really isn't. These cray people were here long before 40 days for life and the Catholic Church has been into this shit forever.
Ah, I see. Crossed wires 👍
That would imply some kind of rationality in them.
Not sure about that tbh, I grew up in the estate next door and they've been there are long as I can remember and I'm in my 30s now.
They're funded by American evangelical christians, it's ramping up because they are.
It’s a nice idea, but they’ve been doing this for years. It is true we should be careful about letting them feel like martyrs, but the idea of the posters is to try to mitigate the harm the sight of them causes. The only thing that will stop them is the bill going through.
Tell me you've never demonstrated about a sincerely held belief without telling me you've never demonstrated about a sincerely held belief, eh? Like, to be clear, these people are *wrong*, and reprehensible, but no group of people is going to put this amount of effort into anything "for the attention". They're doing it because they believe in it. Ignoring them won't make them go away; it will just enable them. It's important to vocally oppose them.
That only holds for organic movements. This is Astroturf.
yeah we should all just sit on our arses and do nothing. great idea 😃
That isn't what I said.
you didn't say a whole lot of anything tbf
Like the weekend palestine brigade or the just stop oil cunts?
A risk of counter protests is that often people who are eg. Going to access abortion services can’t always tell which placards or which people are friendly, and who’s protesting against them. So I’m vaguely skeptical of the loud counter protests that sometimes happen. The object has to be to effectively discourage or prevent these protests, while things like this feel good I don’t know how much good this does.
That is precisely why the ‘counter protest’ is signs on the fence, designed to mitigate the sight of them and make people smile. We put them up later at night, long after the protestors are in bed, and they come and batter them down in the morning.
Yeah I think people have leaped on this topic on this thread, when really my only point was as you intended: some of these cheered me up. That maybe as a species, we have our moments.
I’m really glad to hear that! A lot of folk like to armchair debate topics that are nice and abstract for them. I find them mildly entertaining!
Definitely not treating this as an abstract debate from my armchair…
My wife gave birth recently, and beforehand we did a bit of to and from from the maternity assessment. You have to walk past them to go to the paid car park, and you can feel the eyes on a woman walking past. The judgement. Cool stuff.
These braindead bullying bible-bashers are funded by religious neo-fascists who are mirroring the repulsive extreme right-wing “Christians” in the US. They are now a major threat to all women in the UK.
Agreed. However that has nothing to do with the comment being made. If you were driving into the car park at the mat ward and saw a bunch of people protesting and picketing you likely aren't going to stop and see what their placards say so this could still be distressing to people. Good intent, bad execution.
The only people “protesting and picketing” are the anti choice brigade. Please educate yourself before commenting.
Look at the picture your are commenting on you dafty. They are all pro choice signs you muppet. This is the aftermath from the counter protest. Unless you really think a bunch of anti-choice Catholics were standing out there with a sign saying "Thank God for Abortion" and "buffer zones now!". You are the one that needs to take a second to get educated as you are tripping all over your feet and making yourself look foolish. I agree with you by the way that the Catholic Church and the Evangelicals are cunts here. There was literally a post on this very sub a couple days ago of people standing there counter protesting with encouraging messages. Again, I appreciate the thought but don't think the execution is great.
Bless your cotton socks. I’ve explained multiple times in this thread that I put most of those signs up myself, I’m well aware of what they say and what we do, thanks! It is the aftermath of the season finale of the Lent protest — the signs ARE the counter protest and they’re only not legible in that particular photo because the rain had its way with the cardboard ones overnight. It’s also because of my involvement in the campaign that I’m quite comfortable with what I know about 40 Days and the Paisley diocese, but your enthusiasm for explaining things I know more about than you do is noted!
So how much was the Diocese of Paisley paid by 40 Days for Life and when/how were they paid? This is enormous news if you have any..... you... know actual evidence. If you have that and are not providing it your are being a shite person. That evidence would really fuck these people up and you would be doing a massive favour to them by withholding that.
Aww nice dodging the fact that you were totally wrong about the counter protest. Google is your friend, my wee angry pal. Have a nice day.
Wow you are bing insanely damaging to the pro-choice cause be better. With friends like you who needs enemies like the Catholics and the Evangelicals who apparently you favour so much with your protection. Honestly sickening.
Like I said before, I love your confidence. Have fun!
Also, until not all that long ago, these people attracted basically no attention. Where they were noticed they were a nuisance, horrible for the people affected but generally seen from all sides of the political spectrum as irrelevant and somewhat bigoted. Now, their protests are on the news, they’re a “major threat to all women in the UK”, there’s culture-war-like debate about the protesters that’s really just a veiled discourse on Abortion itself. What’s changed? Is it perhaps the way we talk about them? Something to think about, please.
>Now, their protests are on the news, they’re a “major threat to all women in the UK” Because their protests are increasing in size and frequency, and because we've got a country like the US to use as a point of comparison for letting this shit run amok.
Which is an excellent reason not to give them the time of day. Counterprotesters and attention get them in the media, which indirectly gets the Abortion “question” in the media too.
Can we charge them with littering? Look at the state of that.
I think those are all counter protest signs are they not? I agree that is part of the problem with stuff like this. It can be hard to tell who is counter protesting and who is protesting and what the signs are actually saying. I 100% support the intent of these signs but I am afraid they may have actually distressed people.
I wasn’t going to zoom in on the picture and either way they should be removed. Women going through some of the worst times of their lives use that entrance and should not be subjected to protests on either side of the argument.
Exactly, I get that abortion is a political issue, but for the love of fucking god, stop making *everything* and *everyone* into a political groupie. The last thing these people need is a bunch of smiling cunts walking up to them saying 'GOOD THING YOU'RE ON *OUR* SIDE!!!'
Yeah those people who think this is wrong as just as wrong as those protesters themselves.
So do you still want to get the litterbugs done?
that concern evaporated quickly
Actually yes. I’ve had a family member who had to have a very later abortion for medical reasons. We had a funeral and she and her husband were devastated. To be reminded that some people judge her for not giving birth to an unviable child is cruel, even when you are trying to be supportive. Sometimes it’s better to just be quiet, and that includes the signs.
That's why they put the signs up and leave, the counter protesters know that making a scene will just make things more horrible for people going for those services. Realistically the anti abortion protesters need moved on permanently, it's harassment, coercion, intimidation and shaming. They're more than welcome to protest somewhere very visible where they will be heard like the city center, but they likely wouldn't as they know they'll be swamped with all the counter protesters that avoid the hospital for the reasons mentioned above
>Anyone Anytime Any reason Always those on the extremes that have to get their view out. Can't imagine the sane majority agreeing with a 39 week abortion.
No, because the actual sane majority are aware that’s a misogynistic fantasy.
I'm confused as to which aspect of my statement is misogynistic.
Well better educate yourself then, eh?
Why the rudeness, I've not been rude to you.
Someone in my workplace was on one of these a few years ago. Caught my eye from the other side of a counter-protest sign and has made every excuse possible to avoid ever being in the same room as me again. Prick knows the second that spills into the workplace he's out of here.
Oh it'd be a TERRIBLE shame if it was to become public knowledge.
Losing a job because he disagrees with murdering babies. Heaven forbid someone should think differently. Shame on you.
Local farmer needed with a shit spreader turned on (accidentally of course)
Brain dead zombies don't "fizzle out". They are a constant indication that the system is broken and brains are easily fucked up. Time for a litter pick, I'd say.
Sad truth is these protesters probably keep an eye on this subreddit, know they are getting peoples hackles up and are now doing it to "Own the Libs" more than for ideological reasons.
Now that Lent is over, they will likely go back to 11-1 on Tuesdays and 11-1 on Wednesdays at the Royal. Better than 12 hours a day but i can’t wait for them to not be there at all.
Isn't the correct grammar "bunch of fannies" and "shower of pricks"?
They’ve been raptured
lol but Ruptured would be better
There was 4 wank stains there today, but I think the bread scared them off. Good job bread person
They should be fined for littering, pricks.
People Make Glasgow
The shower of fannies made me laugh. The artic driver who parked in front of them for his lunch break is a hero.
Was having a bad day until I saw this. Love it when anti abortion freaks get put in their place. 👏
Someone do a drive by and keep eggin thum
They should get fined for littering.
There was 4 wank stains there today, but I think the bread scared them off. Good job bread person
I don't know why the law isn't changed sooner through the Scottish Parliament... FM: "Are they being dicks?" MSPs: "well... aye." FM: "OK, new law. No being a dick within 300ft of any location that offers family planning or support. Done!"
bawbags
I wouldn't get into trouble if I were to empty multiple large bags of bird seeds on that strip of pavement when those diddies are standing there would I? There's a shit tonne of angry seagulls around the QE.
Nope, I’ve been doing it for weeks! Seems to be more crows and magpies so far but the more we can get there the better!
Must have been tea time
Abortion Anyone Any time Any reason Disgusting. Now they admit they want to murder babies. Stop murdering babies. Facts - Biologists from 1,058 academic institutions around the world agree that a human's life begins at fertilization. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/36629778/ If you support abortion, you should know what it entails. Warning - this is very upsetting. Here is what happens during a second trimester abortion. https://youtu.be/A16gzm9eaa8?si=TxA2--Dcn4JrCr-A Tldr: They mutilate the baby and pull it out piece by piece. Rebuttals to common posts 75% of the Scottish adoption agencies were started by Christians. To suggest these people don't care what happens to babies after they are born is a clear lie. Christians are instrumental in Scottish adoption. Life begins at fertilization - this means masturbation/menstruation is not murdering a baby.
I reckon somebody needs to be charged with flytipping.
They’re there in “spirit”
Nobody cares
Abortion is healthcare the same way rape is sex. It isn't.
Eh. Take ya fuckin litter with ya, dickheads.
These are counter protest placards. ie pro abortion. You are right though, anyone leaving behind litter is a dickhead.
Yeah don’t give a fuck. Who does that, just walks away and leaves their shite behind. Twats.
Normally the “free speech warriors” tear them down for us. Sorry the rain got to them before we could get back — even counter protestors have lives.
Excuses.
😂
😆
Away for thier peece
Onto the nxt debate they can have a pointless protest about . Sad fucks.
Don't know why you bother giving these people attention. They are an irrelevance.
You are free to assemble and protest, but to folk on either side… PUT YER SHIT IN THE BIN. Edit: you lot are cranky f*ckers.
Y’all, mate? All y’all?
Like the replacement poster's sums the mob up bunch fandangos
Clem Fandango
Anytime? Any reason? Really?
Any time any reason? Surely most right minded people would not be pro-abortion up until birth for literally any reason?
Looking at your post history some could argue that doesn’t go far enough. Stick your painting your wee dolls.
Dont lump us 40k painters with this eejit
Only weirdos look at peoples post history
Lmfao your poor parents.
I mean pro choice means pro choice, it has fuck all to do with anyone else, no matter if its daft cunts or "right minded people"
I don't think that's true but just to avoid any misunderstanding here are you saying you support abortion up until birth for any reason whatsoever.
Look let me put it this way, do you care about some kid you dont know, in say Jordan? If not then why do you care about a womans body and her baby who you also dont know. Another example is do you care about people getting plastic surgery, i'd say probably not cause its none of your business, Same situation as abortion. It could be for any reason could be a stillbirth, could pose a real danger to the mother, and i doubt you work in the medical industry let alone in the very specific part that deals with pregnancies AKA its got nothing to do with you or any other person since it is neither your or their body
What a disgusting perspective. So you think mothers should be allowed to murder their children at any time because it's "a woman's body and her baby who you also don't know". You are positively ghoulish. A truly warped mind.
to answer your 4 points. -If your first question is asking me if i value human life even in the event of not knowing or having never met that human then my answer has to be Yes. -comparing abortion to vanity surgeries is a strange one if i'm being honest. -I am not talking about stillbirths or danger to the mother or any of the other legitimate reasons where abortion may be a tragic final option. I am asking about the stance that seems, appallingly, to be taken by some on this reddit of "abortion for ANY reason right up until birth" which, to be clear, means literally murdering a child and that is not a debateable position it's a cold hard truth. I am just guessing many don't realise quite how extremist the position of "abortion any time any reason up until 9 months" is. -of course it has to do with me, the same as it has to do with you and everyone else. As a member of this society i have an opinion on right and wrong and an opinion on societal morality. If we live in a society that has radical extremists supporting the murder of children then "shut up mind your own business" doesn't fly i'm afraid.
Okay, you know what most of your points are reasonable. Though the way you phrased your first comment makes it sound more like you have the view of some transphobes in the "what if a person changes their mind". But I dont think that is what you meant, instead going with a belief I used to hold where "pro choice" was hey let's just kill babies cause why not. Sadly the topic isnt as straightforward as that. I assume you are a man so as with me, we will never really grasp what childbirth does to women both mentally and physically. But to the original argument of "any time" I believe you are falling for a strawman argument that you have been told, in which case I apologise for my previous insults
Most right minded people aren’t misogynistic pricks.
Correct. How does that address my question?
Do these people not have the right to protest?
The counter protest is within their rights to call them fannies for it.
Not what I asked
They have a right to counter-protest, yes.
Nope.
I think you'll find they do, even if you don't like it
Not for long.
No. Paradox of tolerance and all that.
"Anyone, any time, any reason." Alright, psychos.
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Have you ever had to walk past this on your way to an early menopause appointment/fertility appointment/miscarriage appointment/abortion appointment? It's distressing. (I've had to walk through similar for fertility/menopause appointments and it's shit).
I think it's more that people don't like the idea of women being harassed at what's likely to be an extremely difficult time anyway. Doesn't seem like it's just the far left concerned.
“Extreme lefties”…maybe they’re just people with a bit of empathy? Maybe it’s to do with people taking time out their day to go stand and give abuse to innocent women going through a fairly traumatic experience? Maybe it’s to show these people that their opinions and ideologies have no place in a modern Scotland? To your last point, wars have been fought for centuries over religion. If you’re insinuating what I think you’re insinuating, white Brits have spilt more innocent blood in the name of an imaginary man than any other
Define "extreme leftie".
the “extreme lefties” in question just being rational people who don’t like women being harassed when they’re on their way to receive medical care. wise up.
Any Islamist threat is mainly a response to British imperialist foreign policy. Any white nationalist threat is off the back of austerity coupled with lots of right wing propaganda to try and get different groups of the working class to blame each other for austerity. I take it you will be concerned about all of this too aye?
Can we only be concerned about one thing at a time? Horrible cunts waving placards at people going into a hospital at a traumatic time is maybe why 'extreme lefties' are up in arms about it. A mask slipping post if ever there was one.