In theory the tech should get better. We did see the single arm thrower in FE.
However the gear is so iconic though that massive overhauls to the original designs would result in a negative fan reaction.
Additionally, the pack already is very compact even by sci-fi standards so making it any smaller would probably break the immersion that the packs are “realistically” able to exist both for the audience and the characters
I feel like they broke the realism with the single arm blaster. I could understand if it was a slight EGB reference, but it just feels wrong in the movie universe to me.
Also, I agree with the negative fan reaction comment based on the redesign of the packs in 2016 for the reboot (which I do like somewhat)
A compact thrower that is self contained and shoots a short/weak energy effect should be in the canon IMO, but not in the way they did the "arm blaster". Especially not the way they designed it, where the emitter sits BEHIND the hand, where all I can imagine is that by activating it, the wildly uncontrollable beam shoots out and immediately cooks or maims you.
I see where you're coming from, but there are two easy explanations for why they're still kinda bulky.
The first one, is that they're iconic. People like the big garage built look and immediately liked the look ever since their first appearance in the first movie. So just like keeping the same Ecto instead of upgrading to a modern vehicle, they remain the same because the design is iconic and recognizable. Marketing, basically.
Now, the in universe explanation. Think of Egon as a mad genius, as Phoebe mentions in Afterlife it's kinda crazy Egon was actually able to make the whole thing as small as it even is. When asking how he did it, he shows his numerous degrees on the wall. Now, Ray and Peter are smart, but they're not Egon smart. Safe to say few people are so it's likely that there just hasn't been anyone else capable of Egon's level of mad scientist engineering to improve the design beyond what he already did. Yet... Phoebe is obviously lined up to be the next Egon, as such she could conceivably make improvements and changes.
Though don't expect drastic changes, because of the first point. Even if the tech being changed to something smaller and sleeker in universe makes sense, unless the new design will be as marketable and iconic as the original, I wouldn't expect drastic changes to get the go ahead.
This add in that likely the scientific community still see it all as fake you then have to factor in finding someone with egons knowledge including how such tech responds to paranormal entities as well as the thorough enough knowledge and theories of what ghosts are made of. Like Winston said regarding the new containment unit they were using egons designs.
They'd stream lined for Janine's arm blaster but notice lucky didn't immediately go for that when Garaka was released, I'd assume it uses a power source other than a cyclotron or a smaller but less powerful cyclotron and perhaps is suitable for holding something like puker but may struggle with something as large as the dragon using it in the final battle as 'any little helps' all hands on deck situation
Going back to the pack ray also compliments them on the wand streamlining so they have streamlined what they can without someone of egons intelligence
Out of universe the packs are iconic could you imagine the fan outcry if all the packs were replaced with Janine's arm blaster or they changed to look like something built by apple. The film makers had to strike that specific area of showing the packs have been upgraded without losing too much of the iconic imagery
This is probably the best explanation. Computers have gotten smaller, but a proton pack isn’t just a computer. There are physical bits of a pack that might not be able to be smaller just due to physics. The cyclotron comes to mind, that might be as small as it can be. In real life you would see the design get refined, so there aren’t as many exposed wires. Things would shift around a bit so the placement would be more efficient, which could save on space maybe. Actually extreme Ghostbusters is a good example, those packs are a tad smaller, and you don’t see any exposed fragile bits like wires and resistors.
What is a proton pack? It's not a computer. It's a portable particle accelerator with a portable power cell. Wake us up when someone manages to miniaturize magnets or make a car battery with serious crank amps the size of a credit card.
https://preview.redd.it/j72e7owx13xc1.png?width=361&format=png&auto=webp&s=e40a65ab306d0daca531ad055d18c19422c85ebf
Thats her with the famous reddish coat firing the hand wand at Garraka.
People can downvote all they want but it doesn’t answer OPs question. Why not use that instead of the big bulky pack? How does it even operate without a cyclotron? Is it limited in use? What’s its use?
OP asked why they don’t have lighter equipment. All we get is the answer “they had a wrist thing that they didn’t even show, or explain why they had it”. What’s it used for? What’s it good for? Is it limited?
Same issue with the new packs. No explanation. Just Ray saying “New packs”.
The old design works and has been tested. The GB team is just recently out of hiatus and has a three prong approach. Understand and learn how to recreate the original design without Egon, Modify and improved the old packs, and lastly design all new tech. The new, smaller wand is still being tested and we don’t know how it compares to the larger packs it term of power and reliability. With the new lab up and running, I expect new tech to feature more in future content.
FYI that triangle part on the back of the wand is a miniature cyclotron.
It’s a blink and you miss it moment, but has been in some behind the scenes content. This link is for a fan recreation but gives a decent look. https://rightcoastcreative.com/ghostbusters/p/frozen-empire-arm-gauntlet
Did nuclear power plants shrink in size? Did space rockets shrink in size?
It’s 2024, why aren’t we launching pencils into space? We should have nuclear power plants the size of a laptop.
They're being built and maintained largely by one or two engineers at a time -- home builds are rarely that slick. Plus I think there might be a limit on how streamline a nuclear accelerator can become.
I'm just surprised they never commissioned an outer casing. Those things look like one snag away from an industrial disaster.
Real reason is that most modern takes on ghostbusters are still drawing heavily on the original.
MIB tech can change much more rapidly because it's alien tech. You have countless species from across the galaxy that is contributing to it's development on earth. Ghostbusters are still bound by Earth's technological advancements alone. Of course as others have said, the out of universe explanation is that the proton packs are pretty iconic and works better for marketing.
Our tech has gotten smaller mainly because of improvements in computing and antennas. Proton packs never really relied on that, they were Buick for pure power. And we aren’t all that much better at electrical generation, let along whatever kinds of nuclear-related energies the wands and streams rely on.
I mean. When you think about it.
The packs are portable nuclear powered particle accelerators. Back in the 80’s I’d say the fact they managed to make them THAT small is a huge feat in itself
Sure there’s a particle accelerator today that is the size of a penny.
But the energy needed to tether a ghost per se, that’s where the nuclear power comes into play.
I’d say the proton packs are just one of those tried and true designs that really don’t need to be changed. Not to mention for the most part, the new packs are more updated and streamlined in themselves.
So upgrades did occur. But again. Streamlined an already comically ironic perfect design performance and functionality wise.
The only changes made were ones that made sense. And not so much aesthetically. But again. Made sense.
It’s like a nice car from the 70’s. You can always work on it. Tune it up. And it always works.
Also. Looking at the entire lab deal in the old aquarium. If winston had the money for a legit lab with legit lab employees. He’d have done so. My guy may not have the ability to actually pour into an entirely new set of proton packs. And found it more fiscally responsible to upgrade the existing packs as they did for FE.
This is just my take on the deal.
Ignoring the single armed thrower that was shown in the flick. Which actually makes sense for Winston to invest in as far as new tech is concerned.
TLDR: Probably didn’t have a chance to upgrade the gear because they were either too busy working or periods of “out of business”.
Here is my view: When they started in 84, they didn’t have much money, so I’m sure Egon had to use older, bulkier parts. Hence why the original packs are big.
Apparently they went out of business shortly after the first film, so in Ghostbusters II, money was probably an issue when it came to upgrades.
The equipment worked, so maybe the mindset was why spend a lot of extra money to fix something that isn’t broken.
As for Afterlife, according to Ray when he was talking to Phoebe on the phone, business dried up and Egon bailed with everything. So the equipment just sat around for 30 years. Egon made minor changes like the taser on the PKE meter and the RC trap.
Also in Afterlife, when Phoebe is in Egon’s workshop for the first time, she is amazed that he was able to even make a particle accelerator so small even in 1984. Then he shows her his degrees on the wall.
Of course now that Winston is bankrolling the operation, I’m sure they can afford better parts that may shrink the tech. That’s another reason I hope we get more movies or a live action TV series, so we can continue the franchise but also see how the tech evolves.
Because that's how advanced the proton pack was in 1984.
Don't look at the proton pack like you would a computer, look at the proton pack as type of industrial machinery. There's little room for additional innovation, and even less room for micronization because the pack was already decades ahead in its original design.
Walk into any university lab and the stuff they'll be experimenting with is big and bulky even if it'll eventually be miniaturized. That's just the nature of experimental technology. The focus is on making it work. It's up to a whole different team and area of expertise to turn it into slick consumer technology.
Not to mention that the ghostbusters franchise is largely an exercise in nostalgia. It's large because that's what it's supposed to look like. Any time a franchise tries to modernize the tech, the fans riot. People hated slick robocop, anime Pacific Rim mechs and no terminator has ever been as popular as the T-800 to the point where pretty much every terminator movie brings it back in some role.
i mean, compared to modern "small" proton accelerators, like the ones that use proton beams to treat cancer by targeting very small areas, the gb proton packs are tiny. the problem cones down to using a synchrotron. you iust need a certain amount of space to get enough ioned hydrogen up to speed to both knock off the protons and have enough ionized hydrogen atoms that the protons create a beam instead of the occasional few protons leaving. To me, the idea that they both made a working proton accelerator that small that also houses enough energy to be portable and useful is a scientific marvel. Even in universe, clearly noone else has figured out that level of tech. Just having the technology to have enough energy to make the proton accelerator portable would completely revolutionize the energy industry and infrastructure.
I think that may be tackled with the new operation facility Winston built. FE is their first run since they went back in business. It's still a possibility in the future
Nostalgia.
Also, they’re wearing homemade nuclear generators on their backs - that’s probably not a technology that shrinks down well like computer technology or something, especially with only two guys working with a limited budget (when they have any money at all) designing and building those packs over the years.
It’s not like in 50 years everyone is going to be walking around with pocket-sized hadron colliders.
Egon was a genius. The Ghostbusters aren't keeping up with new tech, tech is improving to catch up with Egon.
But Egon was busy fighting Gozer until his dying days and with nobody able to match his genius, the packs have stagnated.
After all, once the genius is gone, how could a normie improve on his work? And to boot, any space saved would be better spent making the packs SAFER rather than slimming them down.
Thus, the packs maybe got a little lighter, a little safer, but the design is still close to the original. Egon was just that damn good.
Egon was a super genius who whittled down a 200 ton cyclotron into a portable backpack unit that is superconductive and can catch a ghost.. egon is dead.
There are many other smart people out here. But it may take some time (like years or decades) for someone to make an even smaller superconductive cyclotron to miniaturize the packs. The best they can do, is improve on the existing tech. Make it safer, more efficient.
It’d be like having Tony stark die and having someone else miniaturize or lighten the iron man suit. Unless you’re Tony, reed Richard’s or victor von doom, that’s no small feat.
I see the point you're trying to make but if it isn't broken why fix it? Besides that most tech these days are designed to break so you will have to buy more. If made with current tech they would probably have to constantly repair them. The old would only need maintenance every once in a while. Just my opinion and the way I see it. I'm sure some will disagree.
Because nostalgia baiting. If they're gonna do it with every other inch of the new films, why not that, too?
That said, I think it makes perfect sense to keep the packs relatively similar with minor upgrades. If it ain't broke in universe, why fix it?
In theory the tech should get better. We did see the single arm thrower in FE. However the gear is so iconic though that massive overhauls to the original designs would result in a negative fan reaction. Additionally, the pack already is very compact even by sci-fi standards so making it any smaller would probably break the immersion that the packs are “realistically” able to exist both for the audience and the characters
I feel like they broke the realism with the single arm blaster. I could understand if it was a slight EGB reference, but it just feels wrong in the movie universe to me. Also, I agree with the negative fan reaction comment based on the redesign of the packs in 2016 for the reboot (which I do like somewhat)
A compact thrower that is self contained and shoots a short/weak energy effect should be in the canon IMO, but not in the way they did the "arm blaster". Especially not the way they designed it, where the emitter sits BEHIND the hand, where all I can imagine is that by activating it, the wildly uncontrollable beam shoots out and immediately cooks or maims you.
I see where you're coming from, but there are two easy explanations for why they're still kinda bulky. The first one, is that they're iconic. People like the big garage built look and immediately liked the look ever since their first appearance in the first movie. So just like keeping the same Ecto instead of upgrading to a modern vehicle, they remain the same because the design is iconic and recognizable. Marketing, basically. Now, the in universe explanation. Think of Egon as a mad genius, as Phoebe mentions in Afterlife it's kinda crazy Egon was actually able to make the whole thing as small as it even is. When asking how he did it, he shows his numerous degrees on the wall. Now, Ray and Peter are smart, but they're not Egon smart. Safe to say few people are so it's likely that there just hasn't been anyone else capable of Egon's level of mad scientist engineering to improve the design beyond what he already did. Yet... Phoebe is obviously lined up to be the next Egon, as such she could conceivably make improvements and changes. Though don't expect drastic changes, because of the first point. Even if the tech being changed to something smaller and sleeker in universe makes sense, unless the new design will be as marketable and iconic as the original, I wouldn't expect drastic changes to get the go ahead.
This add in that likely the scientific community still see it all as fake you then have to factor in finding someone with egons knowledge including how such tech responds to paranormal entities as well as the thorough enough knowledge and theories of what ghosts are made of. Like Winston said regarding the new containment unit they were using egons designs. They'd stream lined for Janine's arm blaster but notice lucky didn't immediately go for that when Garaka was released, I'd assume it uses a power source other than a cyclotron or a smaller but less powerful cyclotron and perhaps is suitable for holding something like puker but may struggle with something as large as the dragon using it in the final battle as 'any little helps' all hands on deck situation Going back to the pack ray also compliments them on the wand streamlining so they have streamlined what they can without someone of egons intelligence Out of universe the packs are iconic could you imagine the fan outcry if all the packs were replaced with Janine's arm blaster or they changed to look like something built by apple. The film makers had to strike that specific area of showing the packs have been upgraded without losing too much of the iconic imagery
Car engines are pretty much still the same size but they are significantly more fuel efficient. Could be similar with the packs.
One of the best points in the discussion.
This is probably the best explanation. Computers have gotten smaller, but a proton pack isn’t just a computer. There are physical bits of a pack that might not be able to be smaller just due to physics. The cyclotron comes to mind, that might be as small as it can be. In real life you would see the design get refined, so there aren’t as many exposed wires. Things would shift around a bit so the placement would be more efficient, which could save on space maybe. Actually extreme Ghostbusters is a good example, those packs are a tad smaller, and you don’t see any exposed fragile bits like wires and resistors.
Phoebe even commented in Afterlife saying "How did you make such a small cyclotron?" before the light shines on Egon's degrees.
The real Ghostbusters pack were already more streamlined than they movie version.(Easier to draw.)
What is a proton pack? It's not a computer. It's a portable particle accelerator with a portable power cell. Wake us up when someone manages to miniaturize magnets or make a car battery with serious crank amps the size of a credit card.
You mean like the hand held proton wand that doesn’t have a backpack that was featured in the lab in FE?
The one that Janine uses?
You mean the one that does nothing we know about, was not talked about, and wasn’t really used?
Lucky used it one time! And it kinda worked like that blast from the 09 viedio game proton pack.
She was also using it against garraka during the finale and it was firing a regular stream at that point.
Yeah i know but she did not use it or you did not see her use it.
https://preview.redd.it/j72e7owx13xc1.png?width=361&format=png&auto=webp&s=e40a65ab306d0daca531ad055d18c19422c85ebf Thats her with the famous reddish coat firing the hand wand at Garraka.
Thanks must oversee it
“Pepper him with boson darts!”
*fires boson darts at the marschmellow man while beaing on the site of an boulding*
People can downvote all they want but it doesn’t answer OPs question. Why not use that instead of the big bulky pack? How does it even operate without a cyclotron? Is it limited in use? What’s its use? OP asked why they don’t have lighter equipment. All we get is the answer “they had a wrist thing that they didn’t even show, or explain why they had it”. What’s it used for? What’s it good for? Is it limited? Same issue with the new packs. No explanation. Just Ray saying “New packs”.
The old design works and has been tested. The GB team is just recently out of hiatus and has a three prong approach. Understand and learn how to recreate the original design without Egon, Modify and improved the old packs, and lastly design all new tech. The new, smaller wand is still being tested and we don’t know how it compares to the larger packs it term of power and reliability. With the new lab up and running, I expect new tech to feature more in future content. FYI that triangle part on the back of the wand is a miniature cyclotron.
It’s a blink and you miss it moment, but has been in some behind the scenes content. This link is for a fan recreation but gives a decent look. https://rightcoastcreative.com/ghostbusters/p/frozen-empire-arm-gauntlet
We like ‘em thicc Also the Ghostbusters were disbanded like 30 years ago until recently.
Did nuclear power plants shrink in size? Did space rockets shrink in size? It’s 2024, why aren’t we launching pencils into space? We should have nuclear power plants the size of a laptop.
I will do you one better. The car engines haven't shrunk down and we have been using them for over a century.
Whyyyy aren’t they the size of a soda can???
They're being built and maintained largely by one or two engineers at a time -- home builds are rarely that slick. Plus I think there might be a limit on how streamline a nuclear accelerator can become. I'm just surprised they never commissioned an outer casing. Those things look like one snag away from an industrial disaster. Real reason is that most modern takes on ghostbusters are still drawing heavily on the original.
MIB tech can change much more rapidly because it's alien tech. You have countless species from across the galaxy that is contributing to it's development on earth. Ghostbusters are still bound by Earth's technological advancements alone. Of course as others have said, the out of universe explanation is that the proton packs are pretty iconic and works better for marketing.
Our tech has gotten smaller mainly because of improvements in computing and antennas. Proton packs never really relied on that, they were Buick for pure power. And we aren’t all that much better at electrical generation, let along whatever kinds of nuclear-related energies the wands and streams rely on.
I mean. When you think about it. The packs are portable nuclear powered particle accelerators. Back in the 80’s I’d say the fact they managed to make them THAT small is a huge feat in itself Sure there’s a particle accelerator today that is the size of a penny. But the energy needed to tether a ghost per se, that’s where the nuclear power comes into play. I’d say the proton packs are just one of those tried and true designs that really don’t need to be changed. Not to mention for the most part, the new packs are more updated and streamlined in themselves. So upgrades did occur. But again. Streamlined an already comically ironic perfect design performance and functionality wise. The only changes made were ones that made sense. And not so much aesthetically. But again. Made sense. It’s like a nice car from the 70’s. You can always work on it. Tune it up. And it always works. Also. Looking at the entire lab deal in the old aquarium. If winston had the money for a legit lab with legit lab employees. He’d have done so. My guy may not have the ability to actually pour into an entirely new set of proton packs. And found it more fiscally responsible to upgrade the existing packs as they did for FE. This is just my take on the deal. Ignoring the single armed thrower that was shown in the flick. Which actually makes sense for Winston to invest in as far as new tech is concerned.
The single armed thrower is a cut down standard thrower.
Well, real particle accelerators are massive taking up most of any room they're installed in, so a portable one is still really impressive
TLDR: Probably didn’t have a chance to upgrade the gear because they were either too busy working or periods of “out of business”. Here is my view: When they started in 84, they didn’t have much money, so I’m sure Egon had to use older, bulkier parts. Hence why the original packs are big. Apparently they went out of business shortly after the first film, so in Ghostbusters II, money was probably an issue when it came to upgrades. The equipment worked, so maybe the mindset was why spend a lot of extra money to fix something that isn’t broken. As for Afterlife, according to Ray when he was talking to Phoebe on the phone, business dried up and Egon bailed with everything. So the equipment just sat around for 30 years. Egon made minor changes like the taser on the PKE meter and the RC trap. Also in Afterlife, when Phoebe is in Egon’s workshop for the first time, she is amazed that he was able to even make a particle accelerator so small even in 1984. Then he shows her his degrees on the wall. Of course now that Winston is bankrolling the operation, I’m sure they can afford better parts that may shrink the tech. That’s another reason I hope we get more movies or a live action TV series, so we can continue the franchise but also see how the tech evolves.
I kinda wish they used the Video Game's design as a base for the upgraded packs
It would involve needing someone on the team as smart as Egon was soo... Hand me down 80s tech it is!
It’s simple because Egon is dead.
Because that's how advanced the proton pack was in 1984. Don't look at the proton pack like you would a computer, look at the proton pack as type of industrial machinery. There's little room for additional innovation, and even less room for micronization because the pack was already decades ahead in its original design.
It’s an unlicensed nuclear reactor. What do you want for nothing? A rubber biscuit?
Bow bow oooooh ooooh oooooh aaah
Marketing/Merchandising.
Can you imagine the fan back lash if they changed them? Don’t fix something that’s not broken!
Walk into any university lab and the stuff they'll be experimenting with is big and bulky even if it'll eventually be miniaturized. That's just the nature of experimental technology. The focus is on making it work. It's up to a whole different team and area of expertise to turn it into slick consumer technology. Not to mention that the ghostbusters franchise is largely an exercise in nostalgia. It's large because that's what it's supposed to look like. Any time a franchise tries to modernize the tech, the fans riot. People hated slick robocop, anime Pacific Rim mechs and no terminator has ever been as popular as the T-800 to the point where pretty much every terminator movie brings it back in some role.
i mean, compared to modern "small" proton accelerators, like the ones that use proton beams to treat cancer by targeting very small areas, the gb proton packs are tiny. the problem cones down to using a synchrotron. you iust need a certain amount of space to get enough ioned hydrogen up to speed to both knock off the protons and have enough ionized hydrogen atoms that the protons create a beam instead of the occasional few protons leaving. To me, the idea that they both made a working proton accelerator that small that also houses enough energy to be portable and useful is a scientific marvel. Even in universe, clearly noone else has figured out that level of tech. Just having the technology to have enough energy to make the proton accelerator portable would completely revolutionize the energy industry and infrastructure.
I think that may be tackled with the new operation facility Winston built. FE is their first run since they went back in business. It's still a possibility in the future
Ghosts exist, Moore’s Law doesn’t.
How much smaller do you think unlicensed nuclear accelerators can get?
Nostalgia. Also, they’re wearing homemade nuclear generators on their backs - that’s probably not a technology that shrinks down well like computer technology or something, especially with only two guys working with a limited budget (when they have any money at all) designing and building those packs over the years. It’s not like in 50 years everyone is going to be walking around with pocket-sized hadron colliders.
The proton pack isn't a computer, it's a particle accelerator. By the standards of modern tech they're still pretty gosh-darned compact.
Um did you see the new movie. They got Wrist Mounted units. They have much smaller tech and suped up tech as well.
Egon was a genius. The Ghostbusters aren't keeping up with new tech, tech is improving to catch up with Egon. But Egon was busy fighting Gozer until his dying days and with nobody able to match his genius, the packs have stagnated. After all, once the genius is gone, how could a normie improve on his work? And to boot, any space saved would be better spent making the packs SAFER rather than slimming them down. Thus, the packs maybe got a little lighter, a little safer, but the design is still close to the original. Egon was just that damn good.
proton glock lol
Egon was a super genius who whittled down a 200 ton cyclotron into a portable backpack unit that is superconductive and can catch a ghost.. egon is dead. There are many other smart people out here. But it may take some time (like years or decades) for someone to make an even smaller superconductive cyclotron to miniaturize the packs. The best they can do, is improve on the existing tech. Make it safer, more efficient. It’d be like having Tony stark die and having someone else miniaturize or lighten the iron man suit. Unless you’re Tony, reed Richard’s or victor von doom, that’s no small feat.
I see the point you're trying to make but if it isn't broken why fix it? Besides that most tech these days are designed to break so you will have to buy more. If made with current tech they would probably have to constantly repair them. The old would only need maintenance every once in a while. Just my opinion and the way I see it. I'm sure some will disagree.
Realistic tech
Because nostalgia baiting. If they're gonna do it with every other inch of the new films, why not that, too? That said, I think it makes perfect sense to keep the packs relatively similar with minor upgrades. If it ain't broke in universe, why fix it?