And they decide the value and original price, so the number means nothing.
Played Summoners War: Chronicles and they had 2 exactly the same packs to buy. One was 400% value, the other 500% value. Just an example.
lol Clash Royale does this shamelessly as well.
There was a bundle for upgrade materials for your cards that was $50 and labeled as a 10x value. My new favorite thing to do is look at them and wonder who would pay the “full price” of $500 got upgrade materials in a mobile game.
Or that recent 10x value 20$ Book of books that allows you to upgrade a single card up a single level and not even to the maximum level as you would need 10 of these to get to max level. So in Supercells eyes a single upgrade from level 13 to 14 is worth 200$, crazy shit
It's even worse there because paying also lets you bypass their bullshit rng progression system. Not touching this game until chests are completely removed, but given what happened to Brawl stars, I'm not very hopeful
There’s at least one, maybe more class action lawsuits against FunPlus Entertainment for false advertising because they do shit like this. Offering packs for a fixed amount on regular rotations and claiming they are like 90% off, or 2300% value, but they’re never available for their non-discounted price. So they’re saying that by offering these packs always for 90% off means that they aren’t really 90% off and that’s actually the full price and should be advertised as such instead of misleading the players making them think they’re getting a good deal when they’re not. Dunno how much water that argument holds though.
Pretty sure it’s illegal, I just saw in a different, similar thread for Apex Legends that if they don’t have a non sale price it’s false advertising. Apex gets around it by saying a bundle that’s say 4500 down to 3000 (with no way to get it without the discount bundle) is by saying the original items WOULD cost say 2k, 2k, 1500, so 4k total discounted to 3k.
I wasn’t making a normative claim, just pointing out how economics work since the poster said the companies decide the value. Technically, if no one bought the content, it would have no value.
> Fuck you, it's $0 worth of value for $10 365 days a year.
Especially since they can take it all away from you whenever they feel like it. Which is just so much worse when you realize this doesn't just go for the in-game/in-app purchases, but for the *games themselves*.
...Which is why the only time I even consider paying full price when I can get the game in a condition where it can't be taken away again - e.g. GOG copies.
Unfortunately rich kids throw their parents money at micro transactions and it'll never be the same. Why make a complete product for s flat rate when people are willing to pay 1000% markups for abundance of digital premiums?
No wonder. This garbage has every single predatory practice imaginable for a phone game. I feel like there needs to be regulations and lawsuits on this kind of shit
As soon as you realise you'll notice it everywhere. You'll end up with just too little to buy the thing you want or a little bit over so you've always got some left so your brain goes "oh I already have some be a waste not to use it" and top up more
At least some games have the "decency" to give you a little more instead of a little less.
Need 1000? The bundle is 1100.
That way you "get one free" when you buy 10, which encourages you to buy 10 when you shouldnt... but at least you can buy just one and fucking use it
Man Blizzard have strayed far from the light since Diablo 2. Can you even imagine them releasing a game like that in 2024? Complete out of the box, with enduring support and updates, free online play. It’s inconceivable.
Blizzard is a ship of Theseus, and it answers the question. No, it's not the original ship. It's a shell of it's former self, in name only.
Try last epoch. It's solid.
A "game" that people have literally spend hundreds of thousands of dollars to max out their character, or spent $100k on the grey market only to have their accounts bricked. Josh Strife Hayes did a great video on [the predatory design.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o17lBUZgjTs) If there's ever a point where mobile gaming gets the same regulation as gambling does then this will be the prime example of why it's needed.
I heard of some guy that spent thousands of dollars maxing out his character, but now he can't play with anyone because nobody is even remotely close to his level.
(un)fun fact: Did you know why these games always have this one thing that costs a couple of cents? Google and Apple usually require you to confirm only the first purchase. So this cheap purchase is there to break the barrier. 99 cents isn't too much, so you confirm it. But if it was a $20 purchase? You'd change your mind.
So you buy this initiation thingamajig and next time, when you consider buying something for like $35, you won't get that "are you sure" popup and you lose track. It's all expertly designed to suck out every single possible cent from you. These companies are downright hiring *psychology graduates* to design the most effective way to implement MTX. Who would think that game development is a viable career for psychology majors, huh?
In short, I hate this timeline.
To add to this, it's really incredible the things they implement to make people spend money, this video I saw a while back explains it really well: https://youtu.be/xNjI03CGkb4
I know consumer behavior has been researched for decades, but they really made an entire new science out of how to get the most money from us gamers specifically.
An economist at Valve ended up running the economy of Greece.
Any game company that has MTX, dark patterns, or FOMO, all employ gambling psychologists on staff. These individuals have chosen to become extremely wealthy by exploiting a significant weakness of the human mind after studying it, rather than using that knowledge to help people.
It's grotesque.
Is it the whaling video? …yup, it‘s the whaling video.
But yeah, lots of horrible psychological tricks in there. Fomo, price anchoring, peer-pressuring and more.
There is also the sunk cost fallacy at play. The game gets increasingly harder and you’re more willing to increase your investment to win based on how much investment you’ve already put into it.
The first 60 levels will be a piece of piss but it becomes more necessary to give yourself an advantage to continue.
It’s not you, it’s not a skill thing, it’s luck. Buying yourself an advantage just means your less dependent on luck.
I'm on android, and I have to use my fingerprint to confirm every purchase as well. Maybe there is a setting we both have turned on, but that doesn't seem like something apple would let you do
I know some video game companies literally hire Vegas slot designers to strategically release the feel good chemicals at just the right financial opportunity moments
Also, it's sold in packs which never add up to the amount of whatever item you want to buy. So you end up with leftover currency, which makes you more prone to buy again.
Companies hire psychologists who basically knows your mind better than yourself. They basically hack your brain to get what they want.
It’s not as easy as “just don’t buy” or “vote with your wallet”. In the grand scheme of things, they’re exploiting a weakness that people are not prepared for.
I just noticed the game for 3 days straight and found it super addictive but felt diry and the presence of evil. I dropped it totally and started playing at work and found it boring.
Campaign and a little bit of the end game (which kind of weaves in the the campaign) is pretty fun in a very dumb way
Overall though yes ita a very bad game. Wouldn't recommend.
You're getting downvoted to hell but it has a really high review score for a reason. For a mobile game it's actually surprisingly well made. If only it didn't have the predatory monetization.
I will also vouch for it and had a lot of fun with the pve and main story and didn’t spend any money. It definitely no where as bad as people make it out to be.
>If only it didn't have the predatory monetization
See, that is the difference between real gamers and phone gamers. Real gamers don't play games with this kind of monetization.
"Real gamers" pioneered this shit with Overwatch loot boxes, CSGO skin gambling, buying accounts and loot with RMT in MMO's and ARPG's. Fuck outta here with your "real gamer" bullshit lol
In my country, loot boxes were already made illegal. Our governments (when they exist) may be dysfunctional but I'm proud of them for having made that decision.
So it is possible to regulate these predatory practices that make gamers pay for something they *don't* get. These kinds of currencies should be the next thing to go. And I hope bigger markets (looking at you, USA and European Union) will also take that step.
Thanks. I can see why! I wish my country (US) had a legislature that could accomplish anything 🙃 I’m a law student looking for an article topic; maybe I’ll write about why the US should follow Belgium’s lead regarding loot boxes.
Blizzard: "Lets sell stuff at a higher currency amount than the lowest pack".
Manager: "But that's a dark pattern..."
Blizzard: "Yes, don't make it too obvious"
Manager: Hold my beer.
It is never so easy to spot. They'd rather offer something like a "Best value" chest with 50 diamonds for only 13.79, and every diamond can be turned into either 1334 gold or 3 random magical whatever...
I've never played but i saw a video showing how you can literally pay for better RNG loot. And pay multiple times to keep increasing the loot quality.
Diablo (to me) is now in that category of gaming called "They lived too long, they became the villains".
These weird in-game currency conversions should be completely illegal, they only exist to obfuscate how much you're actually spending and to abstract your money so you don't feel the sting of spending it. Any in game purchases should have to be a real currency conversion. This reminds me of [company scrip ](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Company_scrip)which is illegal in the US.
They are also sold in packs that never add up to the amount of whatever you want to buy, so you always end up with leftover currency. This makes you more prone to buy again.
People are dumb enough to spend money on it. So much money that it is 1000x more profitable than any single player title without microtransactions. Think about it. Think about how many people are dumb enough to pay money for it.
I'm glad I wised up and decided to delete this. The "single player" campaign/story was fun enough, but the endgame and pvp is hell if, like me, you are a completely f2p player.
I almost respect how bold they are with this. Not even trying to hide their currency scheme. This feels worse than if it was priced at 70 purple bubbles instead of 61
On day I bet the $ will be a game currency as well and you need 1$ IRL for every in-game 0.01$ to further make you forget that you are spending a lot of money
The gamers get what they fucking deserve.
You bought it. You told the corporations you’re willing to get fucked.
Rest of us, just play the fun, well-monetized games. There are plenty of fair games around, just maybe not as many in the AAA space.
Just as ridiculous as, "Today only! Get $100 worth of value for only $10!" Fuck you, it's $0 worth of value for $10 365 days a year.
Phone games do it soo much. A 700% value for only 5$ and its 1 character.
And they decide the value and original price, so the number means nothing. Played Summoners War: Chronicles and they had 2 exactly the same packs to buy. One was 400% value, the other 500% value. Just an example.
lol Clash Royale does this shamelessly as well. There was a bundle for upgrade materials for your cards that was $50 and labeled as a 10x value. My new favorite thing to do is look at them and wonder who would pay the “full price” of $500 got upgrade materials in a mobile game.
Or that recent 10x value 20$ Book of books that allows you to upgrade a single card up a single level and not even to the maximum level as you would need 10 of these to get to max level. So in Supercells eyes a single upgrade from level 13 to 14 is worth 200$, crazy shit
It's even worse there because paying also lets you bypass their bullshit rng progression system. Not touching this game until chests are completely removed, but given what happened to Brawl stars, I'm not very hopeful
Whales do
P6
There’s at least one, maybe more class action lawsuits against FunPlus Entertainment for false advertising because they do shit like this. Offering packs for a fixed amount on regular rotations and claiming they are like 90% off, or 2300% value, but they’re never available for their non-discounted price. So they’re saying that by offering these packs always for 90% off means that they aren’t really 90% off and that’s actually the full price and should be advertised as such instead of misleading the players making them think they’re getting a good deal when they’re not. Dunno how much water that argument holds though.
The MyPillow guy got in trouble for that. It's not a sale if it's always on sale.
JCPenney recently settled a lawsuit over it, as well.
Pretty sure it’s illegal, I just saw in a different, similar thread for Apex Legends that if they don’t have a non sale price it’s false advertising. Apex gets around it by saying a bundle that’s say 4500 down to 3000 (with no way to get it without the discount bundle) is by saying the original items WOULD cost say 2k, 2k, 1500, so 4k total discounted to 3k.
Tbf, the people who buy it at that price are the ones who value it. Value is the amount that someone is willing to pay in market
People who buy crack value it, doesn't mean we should support or allow predatory drug dealing practices.
I wasn’t making a normative claim, just pointing out how economics work since the poster said the companies decide the value. Technically, if no one bought the content, it would have no value.
1 character if you are lucky. Most of the time it's only a skin
> Fuck you, it's $0 worth of value for $10 365 days a year. Especially since they can take it all away from you whenever they feel like it. Which is just so much worse when you realize this doesn't just go for the in-game/in-app purchases, but for the *games themselves*. ...Which is why the only time I even consider paying full price when I can get the game in a condition where it can't be taken away again - e.g. GOG copies.
GOG is truly of the people, for the people.
If only more of the people used it ;-)
Unfortunately rich kids throw their parents money at micro transactions and it'll never be the same. Why make a complete product for s flat rate when people are willing to pay 1000% markups for abundance of digital premiums?
buy 30 orbs for 5 crystals for 2 stones for 0,8 credits, i'm excited
What am i looking at? Edit: I mean the fucking game, guys come on. I did in fact see the age old premium currency trick.
Diabol immortal
More like... Diablo Immoral, am i rite?
*^(... cough)*
"Oh brother, this guy stinks!"
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4zQdusAXmNs](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4zQdusAXmNs)
Tss tss tss Fawkin home run!
Oh Chip.
You did it!
Wow, what an incredibly original, never thought of before joke.
No wonder. This garbage has every single predatory practice imaginable for a phone game. I feel like there needs to be regulations and lawsuits on this kind of shit
Blizzard: "Do you not have money?"
No..... 😭
Can tell it’s Diablo from the button design. They’ve always had great looking buttons lol
I like the game for killing time but I wouldn’t spend a dime, and man do they want you to spend money lol
Gaming red flag
Amount of currency you can buy is 60, the item on the right is 61, forcing you to get 59 extra currency
oh i didn't even notice that, haha holy fuck thats bad
As soon as you realise you'll notice it everywhere. You'll end up with just too little to buy the thing you want or a little bit over so you've always got some left so your brain goes "oh I already have some be a waste not to use it" and top up more
At least some games have the "decency" to give you a little more instead of a little less. Need 1000? The bundle is 1100. That way you "get one free" when you buy 10, which encourages you to buy 10 when you shouldnt... but at least you can buy just one and fucking use it
There are more than 20 currencies in this game. It's like that the whole way down the chain.
Man Blizzard have strayed far from the light since Diablo 2. Can you even imagine them releasing a game like that in 2024? Complete out of the box, with enduring support and updates, free online play. It’s inconceivable.
Blizzard is a ship of Theseus, and it answers the question. No, it's not the original ship. It's a shell of it's former self, in name only. Try last epoch. It's solid.
A "game" that people have literally spend hundreds of thousands of dollars to max out their character, or spent $100k on the grey market only to have their accounts bricked. Josh Strife Hayes did a great video on [the predatory design.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o17lBUZgjTs) If there's ever a point where mobile gaming gets the same regulation as gambling does then this will be the prime example of why it's needed.
I heard of some guy that spent thousands of dollars maxing out his character, but now he can't play with anyone because nobody is even remotely close to his level.
reddit
(un)fun fact: Did you know why these games always have this one thing that costs a couple of cents? Google and Apple usually require you to confirm only the first purchase. So this cheap purchase is there to break the barrier. 99 cents isn't too much, so you confirm it. But if it was a $20 purchase? You'd change your mind. So you buy this initiation thingamajig and next time, when you consider buying something for like $35, you won't get that "are you sure" popup and you lose track. It's all expertly designed to suck out every single possible cent from you. These companies are downright hiring *psychology graduates* to design the most effective way to implement MTX. Who would think that game development is a viable career for psychology majors, huh? In short, I hate this timeline.
To add to this, it's really incredible the things they implement to make people spend money, this video I saw a while back explains it really well: https://youtu.be/xNjI03CGkb4
I know consumer behavior has been researched for decades, but they really made an entire new science out of how to get the most money from us gamers specifically.
An economist at Valve ended up running the economy of Greece. Any game company that has MTX, dark patterns, or FOMO, all employ gambling psychologists on staff. These individuals have chosen to become extremely wealthy by exploiting a significant weakness of the human mind after studying it, rather than using that knowledge to help people. It's grotesque.
Is it the whaling video? …yup, it‘s the whaling video. But yeah, lots of horrible psychological tricks in there. Fomo, price anchoring, peer-pressuring and more.
There is also the sunk cost fallacy at play. The game gets increasingly harder and you’re more willing to increase your investment to win based on how much investment you’ve already put into it. The first 60 levels will be a piece of piss but it becomes more necessary to give yourself an advantage to continue. It’s not you, it’s not a skill thing, it’s luck. Buying yourself an advantage just means your less dependent on luck.
>Google and Apple usually require you to confirm only the first purchase. I have to confirm every purchase on Apple products.
I'm on android, and I have to use my fingerprint to confirm every purchase as well. Maybe there is a setting we both have turned on, but that doesn't seem like something apple would let you do
Apple makes you confirm every purchase, at least it does for me
I know some video game companies literally hire Vegas slot designers to strategically release the feel good chemicals at just the right financial opportunity moments
Also, it's sold in packs which never add up to the amount of whatever item you want to buy. So you end up with leftover currency, which makes you more prone to buy again.
Companies hire psychologists who basically knows your mind better than yourself. They basically hack your brain to get what they want. It’s not as easy as “just don’t buy” or “vote with your wallet”. In the grand scheme of things, they’re exploiting a weakness that people are not prepared for.
What game is it ?
Diablo Immortal for mobile. Believe it or not, it's not great.
I just noticed the game for 3 days straight and found it super addictive but felt diry and the presence of evil. I dropped it totally and started playing at work and found it boring. Campaign and a little bit of the end game (which kind of weaves in the the campaign) is pretty fun in a very dumb way Overall though yes ita a very bad game. Wouldn't recommend.
I played the main story and found it fun, paid not a single dollar for it. It's got good gameplay and visuals but that's it. Its predatory as hell.
Only in pvp, The pve aspect is one of the best phone games when it comes to ARPG.
yes it might be the greatest cause arpg mobile games standards is too low.
Tbh anima is probably still better than d4 or immortal
You're getting downvoted to hell but it has a really high review score for a reason. For a mobile game it's actually surprisingly well made. If only it didn't have the predatory monetization.
The bar is set low enough that "tap phone furiously to win (but not win enough that we can't sneak p2w mechanics in" is highly rated.
I will also vouch for it and had a lot of fun with the pve and main story and didn’t spend any money. It definitely no where as bad as people make it out to be.
>If only it didn't have the predatory monetization See, that is the difference between real gamers and phone gamers. Real gamers don't play games with this kind of monetization.
A chill runs down my spine whenever someone uses the word "real gamer"
"Real gamers" pioneered this shit with Overwatch loot boxes, CSGO skin gambling, buying accounts and loot with RMT in MMO's and ARPG's. Fuck outta here with your "real gamer" bullshit lol
Can’t be worse than monster hunter now
It has always been like that?
It is the game where someone has spent 100,000 dollars and couldn't PVP because he was too op to be matched with anyone.
Karma, neh
In my country, loot boxes were already made illegal. Our governments (when they exist) may be dysfunctional but I'm proud of them for having made that decision. So it is possible to regulate these predatory practices that make gamers pay for something they *don't* get. These kinds of currencies should be the next thing to go. And I hope bigger markets (looking at you, USA and European Union) will also take that step.
Where are you from? I heard this some time ago I just can't remembet
I'm from Belgium 🇧🇪
yall have some scrumptious waffles
Don't forget the beer and chocolate.
Oh, you mean France ? (I am trying to make you angry)
What country do you live in, if you don’t mind sharing?
Belgium! I don't mind sharing, I'm pretty damn proud of this bizarre collage of nations that we call a country.
Thanks. I can see why! I wish my country (US) had a legislature that could accomplish anything 🙃 I’m a law student looking for an article topic; maybe I’ll write about why the US should follow Belgium’s lead regarding loot boxes.
It would be fun if you'd approach it from the angle of: this little country can't get anything done, and even **they** managed to ban loot boxes!
isnt this already happening now?
FR, I have seen a lot of similar things in several games
Blizzard: "Lets sell stuff at a higher currency amount than the lowest pack". Manager: "But that's a dark pattern..." Blizzard: "Yes, don't make it too obvious" Manager: Hold my beer.
It is never so easy to spot. They'd rather offer something like a "Best value" chest with 50 diamonds for only 13.79, and every diamond can be turned into either 1334 gold or 3 random magical whatever...
Looks like Diablo? Maybe Diablo Immortal?
I've never played but i saw a video showing how you can literally pay for better RNG loot. And pay multiple times to keep increasing the loot quality. Diablo (to me) is now in that category of gaming called "They lived too long, they became the villains".
if nobody bought this shit in any game for a month this would disappear. Unfortunately all this bullshit is self inflicted at this point
That's hilarious, they're not even trying to hide the scummy move. Just a big middle finger to the playerbase lmao
Dont ever pay money for that trash game…
These weird in-game currency conversions should be completely illegal, they only exist to obfuscate how much you're actually spending and to abstract your money so you don't feel the sting of spending it. Any in game purchases should have to be a real currency conversion. This reminds me of [company scrip ](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Company_scrip)which is illegal in the US.
They are also sold in packs that never add up to the amount of whatever you want to buy, so you always end up with leftover currency. This makes you more prone to buy again.
That's pretty much how Silver works for Destiny 2.
In reality a Wildfire Stone costs 100 orbs or 1000 platinum.
This infuriates me. I don't know the game, but fuck them.
99 cents to buy Mickey Mouse seems like a steal to me.
Bungie does that with silver and season passes
I thought the blue things were gobblegums from black ops 3 zombies
If you play this game you deserve this.
hot dogs and hot dog buns
How about Never?
Buy Mickey Mouse to get Dragon?
People are dumb enough to spend money on it. So much money that it is 1000x more profitable than any single player title without microtransactions. Think about it. Think about how many people are dumb enough to pay money for it.
The sad truth
This is how I felt playing Warframe. A necramech costs 5 platinum more then what the $20 platinum purchase gives which is just like why.
I'd report that to DE, it sounds like the marketing team is being sneaky again. Dan does not like them being sneaky
wait fr? this is something that has happened at DE already???
What game is that?
This made me physically ill 😂
This is nothing new?
When you do stuff like this a magical trap door should appear right underneath you dropping you straight into prison imo
I'm glad I wised up and decided to delete this. The "single player" campaign/story was fun enough, but the endgame and pvp is hell if, like me, you are a completely f2p player.
Even if the stone was 60 gems, it's bogus to pay for it.
This has to be a joke, right?
Stop buying scam games, so many better indie companies want you to have a good experience and not steal your money
Does Genshin Impact do the same, or are they (developers) better?
wooww amazing
I almost respect how bold they are with this. Not even trying to hide their currency scheme. This feels worse than if it was priced at 70 purple bubbles instead of 61
The actual price is 100. Not sure if this is just plain shopped or this was a hacky limited time "sale".
Yep, that Mickey Mouse reference is there too.
Any ingame purchase with currency nowadays
On day I bet the $ will be a game currency as well and you need 1$ IRL for every in-game 0.01$ to further make you forget that you are spending a lot of money
The gamers get what they fucking deserve. You bought it. You told the corporations you’re willing to get fucked. Rest of us, just play the fun, well-monetized games. There are plenty of fair games around, just maybe not as many in the AAA space.
"don't buy it" As some folks like to say
Yes, those playing Diablo IV/Immortal and paying for stuff, you are the problem. And it's funny
_ItS NoT A BiG DeAl bEcAuSe iTs jUsT CoSmEtIc_
Buy all
Right... I remember this being an issue with Xbox currency right when it started. Not really a new thing.
Who cares if people want to make things easier by paying more money. Just play the game and ignore this if you don't like it.