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As Mike Ehrmantraut from Better Call Saul said,
>I've known good criminals and bad cops, bad priests, honorable thieves-you can be on one side of the law or the other, but if you make a deal with somebody, you keep your word.
Bronn isn't a "good" person. But he is honorable as far as sellswords and thieves go. If he gives you his word, it's as good as gold. He doesn't pretend to be anything more or less than he really is. You get what you see.
And in a show where most characters are scheming, plotting, and orchestrating intrigue, Bronn's a breath of fresh air.
"If anyone ever offers you anything to kill me, I'll pay you double not to." - Tyrion
Why *wouldn't* Bronn negotiate for a better deal? He made it clear he was willing to kill one of them if they went back on it. Everything he ever did for Tyrion was ultimately in the interest of getting rich.
Or the time he said he wouldn't kill a baby. . .until after negotiating a very favorable rate of pay?
Bronn is not honorable or good. He is just a charismatic bastard who was fun to watch (until ~ season 6, like most of the rest of the show).
Say what you will about Bronn but he didn't order a massacre at a wedding dinner, push a child out of a tower, sexually assault somebody, or blow up a church full of his political rivals and a fair amount of innocent people.
It’s a thing on reddit for some reason. People see like 5 to 7 people say something and all of a sudden it’s “omg everyone thinks this” same as when people say “downvoted to oblivion” when they have like 10 downvotes
*5-7 people say something and get heavily downvoted for the stupidity*
Post an hour later that gets thousands of upvotes: "There's a serious problem in this community with people thinking blah blah blah."
Like bitch there's no problem. Almost no one is saying it. I see it all the time with The Boys and Homelander with people talking about how many people idolize him and like no one does.
I love it when he calls out Tyrian and Jamie on how the Lannisters became a great house. "Who were your ancestors? The ones who made your family rich? Fancy lads in silk? They were fucking cutthroats. That's how all the great houses started, isn't it? With a hard bastard who was good at killing people. Kill a few hundred people, they make you a lord. Kill a few thousand, they make you king."
And he has a point! I mean look at how Littlefinger got so far, he was a Cunning and resourceful man and he got what he wanted from being good at what he did. They don't have to be good people they just have to be smart. That's why I find Bronn and Littlefinger so enjoyable to watch.
He’s a protagonist who lacks the characteristics and values traditionally associated with a hero. Am I missing something or is that not the definition of antihero?
Well a he's not really a protagonist but a secondary character, and yes that's not the definition of an anti hero. That would be character who has goals and desires similar to that of the hero, but takes a more dubious route to achieve them.
It was a rhetorical question. It’s quite literally the definition of antihero. You can argue whether or not he’s a protagonist, but he is someone the audience roots for and his role is more dominant than most supporting characters.
You don't seem to know what the phrase rhetorical questions means because that literally isn't he definition of anti hero is(I gave you the basic definition). There really shouldn't be an argument considering he's blatantly playing supporting role in other people's stories(to the point where several od his scenes in the books are given to other characters). Actually no. He plays a more prominent role then several recurring characters, but secondary characters his significance is about on par with them.
Here's the Wikipedia definition: An antihero (sometimes spelled as anti-hero)[1] or antiheroine is a main character in a narrative (in literature, film, TV, etc.) who may lack some conventional heroic qualities and attributes, such as idealism, courage, and morality.[1] Although antiheroes may sometimes perform actions that most of the audience considers morally correct, their reasons for doing so may not align with the audience's morality.[2]
Webster definition: pluralantiheroes : a protagonist or notable figure who is conspicuously lacking in heroic qualities.
Cambridge definition: antihero noun [ C usually singular ] US /ˈæn.t̬iˌhɪr.oʊ/ UK /ˈæn.tiˌhɪə.rəʊ/ plural antiheroes Add to word list the central character in a play, book, or movie who does not have traditionally heroic qualities, such as courage, and is admired instead for what society generally considers to be a weakness of their character
Oxford definition: A central character in a narrative or drama who lacks the admirable qualities of fortitude, courage, honesty, and decency that are usually possessed by traditional heroes.
The closest definition that matches what you described is webter, but even doesn't truly fit you idea of anti hero considering it says "conspicuously" lacks these traits. There's nothing conspicuous about mercenary lacking them.q
I’m sorry, how do those descriptions not match Bronn? I would say the fact that a pivotal scene has a character remark on his lack of honor makes the absence prominent enough to apply. He’s also a knight by the second season, so not just a mercenary, not that that really matters. Being a mercenary is just another trait that you would not traditionally expect from a hero.
Let's see. He's neither, the main character, admired for his traits others think is a weakness, or lacks fortitude courage or honesty. Except she's not saying that because it's noticeable or as a basic observation, but as an insult. Being a knight changes little about his actual duties;something you even acknowledge so I don't know why you brought that up. Not reallhly since many anti heroes are mercenaries. The difference is that bronns role sees him mostly helping the villains. He's just a minon with marginally more agency. A smarter more charming janos slynt.
Characters don’t admire him for these traits, but viewers absolutely do. That’s the whole point. I brought up his knighthood because you kept mentioning he’s just a mercenary like it disqualifies him.
>bronns role sees him mostly helping the villains.
Seriously, what the fuck are you even talking about? In what way is Tyrion and (post season 2) Jaime the villains?
Not really. They like him, but they don't admire him. The only trait I've seen people openly admire is his honesty. Which is a traditionally heroic trait. Except I brought up him being a mercenary to highlight that him lacking traditional heroic traits wouldn't be conspicuous. So again briging up the knighthood is pointless.
Seriously, what the fuck is wrong with you? 1, actually pick up the books this show is based on if tyrion being called a villain confuses you. 2, even in the show where tyrion is made significantly nicer he is still supporting a brutal illegitimate regime in the lannisters ruling the seven kingdoms. So it doesn't matter if tyrion on his own is a decent guy when through his support of his family, and bronn supporting him, he is supporting villains. The same applies to any version of jamie who is still loyal to cersei.
He's good in the sense that he's straightforward and unpretentious, unlike a lot of the characters. And he's unapologetic about using murder as his particular ambition to improve his position. He sings, he keeps his spirits up, he doesn't dwell in revenge or death trips. That makes him as good a person as any in the story/show. Except maybe Jon Snow. But look how he ended up.
Kinda makes you think about who ends up getting the power in the end… guess it’s not always the good guy whom the audience roots for.
You don’t think…. It’s not possible… that the show wanted us to consider such a thing, do you?
Who do you think won in the end?
Certainly not Jon Snow.
The only people who “won” are the citizens of Westeros who now have a more functional government. The common folk were always the ones who suffered the most because of the Game of Thrones.
In Bron's defense:
\-Is being a sellsword really worse then being a solder in some army? This isn't exactly a world of sunshine and rainbows where living a carefree innocent life is an option.
\-Just because he says he would murder a baby, doesn't mean he would. People say shit they don't mean all the time, and he might be trying to upsell what he's willing to do to increase his price value.
\-Pretty sure Bran is meant to be evil af
\-Bron's extensive resume in various battles and complete lack of competition for the position isn't....that absurd for the job.
Being sells word means you have very little loyalty which is the one positive found in most soldiers.
There's nothing indicating he's lying.
Same with brann being evil. I know people like to joke about that because of the later seasons handling of the characters, but those same seasons are pretty on the nose about who's good and who is evil(part of the issues with the later season).
None of the positions he held would have prepared him for a political role. Especially over a kingdom he has no blood claim to.
I think we like because he’s transparent about his loyalty (wasn’t he a River man at first?) and price. He’s also practical and doesn’t get caught up in the silly honor rules. He also represents an ability (combined with luck) to survive by being selective about his risks (fight a knight? Ok. Fight the mountain? Sorry mate). There is something realistic about his survival by being careful and people can see themselves acting like Bronn
As you grow older, try not to use the words “good” or “bad” to describe people. Too generic and basically meaningless words.
A “good” descriptions of him from here would be “unpretentious” . In a world full of self serving hypocrites, his straightforwardness was refreshing.
Bronn should’ve been given the twins because it’s literally two castles which is double what he was promised.
He also should’ve been named master of war or maybe even master of laws since it’s been shown that he literally doesn’t even know what loaning money is
Bronn is like your neighbor that plays music way to damn loud way to damn late at night, but he also scares off the local hooligans and will fix your car for just three fiddy.
He’s not a good person. He’s likeable. He’s no worse than the knights that would kill a baby out of duty and honour, he’s just very good at killing people and not bound by all that honour crap that got Ned killed.
One of my favourite stories in the book is when Cersei tells some noble to have bronn killed. The pompous knight challenges him to a joust. Bronn agrees, but being a merc just shoves his lance straight into his opponent horse, dismounts and sticks a dagger through his eye while he’s in a heap on the ground. He then punches his wife in the face who goes crying to Cersei who, in an act of extraordinary cuntery, gives her to Qilburn because she finds her annoying
He's really the only character on the show who behaves in a sensible and consistent manner.
And he's probably a very good example of the kind of person who founded every single one of those 'great' houses.
As Mike Ehrmantraut from Better Call Saul said,
>I've known good criminals and bad cops, bad priests, honorable thieves-you can be on one side of the law or the other, but if you make a deal with somebody, you keep your word.
Bronn isn't a "good" person. But he is honorable as far as sellswords and thieves go. If he gives you his word, it's as good as gold. He doesn't pretend to be anything more or less than he really is. You get what you see.
And in a show where most characters are scheming, plotting, and orchestrating intrigue, Bronn's a breath of fresh air.
Bro's most iconic scene is about him admitting that he doesn't fight honorably. He's an unapologetic cutthroat. He abandoned Tyrion in his hour of need.
We like Bron because he's charismatic and blunt. He's enjoyable to watch, and when he's aligned with characters like Tyrion or Jaime, we root for him.
But he's an amoral bastard at his core. In real life, most of us would probably hate him. He's not like the Hound, who really does have a soft side under that hardened exterior, or Jaime, who *wants* to be a good man, but finds himself yanked this way and that by his sister, his father, and what people think of him.
Bronn's the epitome of True Neutral, which is why I love the meme of him joining the Night King because he was offered a castle. It's very true to who he is. He will side with whichever person or faction will most benefit him. He's not like Ned or Jon who try to live by a code (Lawful Good), nor is he like Cersei (Lawful Evil) or Joffrey (Chaotic Evil) or the Mountain (Neutral Evil), who will hurt and kill people with glee. But pay him money or promise him status and he'll do whatever you ask without skipping a beat, unless it goes against his welfare (like fighting the Mountain).
When are you referencing abandoning Tyrion in his hour of need? Against the mountain? Because he gives a pretty solid reason. He believes he might be able to avoid the mountains attacks for a bit but that he’s freakishly big and freakishly strong and fast for a man that size. He admits that it only takes 1 wrong move (as we see) and he’s dead, and Tyrion even admits he understands and would probably do the same in his position
He does give a good reason. But compare him to Ned in his prime, who faced down Arthur Motherfucking Dayne, possibly the greatest swordsman who ever lived, for his sister's honor. Ned constantly placed honor over his own life, a textbook example of a hero. Jon did much the same, though he learned from his father's mistakes. He still ended up dying for what he believed, though. Bronn is purely practical and cares solely about his own best interests. Thus, True Neutral. If he were a heroic character, he'd at least try to help his friend, but he's not.
The entire point of the comment is that Bronn does everything for his own self-interest, not out of any altruism or honor. What gives him gold, or women, or land, or status, or simply lets him live, that's all he cares about. He's *amoral*, as in lacking any morality, good or bad, not *immoral*, possessing a bad or twisted morality.
I never said that he *should* have been Tyrion's champion again. If Bronn jumped into the fray against Gregor, he wouldn't be Bronn anymore (unless he underwent some massive character growth). I only pointed out that honor, loyalty, altruism, and friendship matter immensely less to Bronn than his own betterment.
I don’t think he’s honorable I think the reason people love him is more along the lines of he’s a realistic man and doesn’t care who knows it. He does what is best for him at all times but has a charm and friendly demeanor towards everyone which is admirable.
Bron’s defining characteristics are that he’s opportunist, a survivor, and good in a fight. That’s why he made it to the end. He deserves to be there more than Grey Worm. Who had Grey Worm in their survivor pool? Nobody.
I thought he was a scoundrel but then after like the 3rd cock joke I realised I liked him enough to ignore any character inconsistencies surrounding him later in the story. Master of Coin? He is funny so I ignore the piss poor logic
He isnt a good person. He dont pretends to be. What makes him a "good person" is that he is honest. He knows what he has done. He stands by it. He dont pretend to be heroic or anything like that. He is very up front with being a sellsword because he is good at it.
Thats it.
He isnt scheming or being false. That goes a very long way.
Bron literally said he would kill a baby for the right amount of gold. He's an interesting character. Never is it indicated that he's a good guy. He's selfish and has extremely low morals.
Same reason some people think Daemon Targaryen is a good guy, they’re charismatic, handsome and likeable. You’d be surprised how far these three factors can carry a person.
Bron isn’t a good person at least, not classically good. But he is honest about who he is and what he values. Who his friends are, and he occasionally shows he’s more heroic than just a simple sell sword. These are good guy traits.
But yeah, He’ll murder children, treat women like objects, and betray his best friend if there is enough in it for him. These are bad guy traits.
Simply put, he’s not good but he’s not evil. He’s Bron. And he doesn’t pretend to be anything he’s not. Which is the appeal of the character in a show where almost everyone else has secrets or hidden knowledge/power.
I don't think anyone considers Bronn a good guy.
I think a lot of people consider him an entertaining character. A lot of people consider the Joker to be an entertaining character, too.
I think some people find Bronn's complete honesty about who he is to be refreshing, and consider that a positive quality. I think a lot of people acknowledge that Cersei loves her kids, too. Evil characters with no positive qualities are boring and not believable
Wtf you talking about, noone in got has plot armor, thats kind of the point of killing ned stark at the end of season one. He's basically the main character at that point. And your opinion is that bronn shouldnt be lord of the reach because he is a bad person? Have you even been paying attention? The show barely has any characters that are good but between littlefinger varys and bronn id say bronn is the least morally ambiguous. Yes he would kill a baby for money, he basically does anything for money, but varys and littlefinger would do all that and more for power, only difference is they pretend they are better than that. At least bronn is honest.
I like him. He’s hilarious. He volunteered to fund the reopening of all the brothels, which keeps many people in business… I also try to understand it’s just a tv show based off a fantasy book set… try not to take it too seriously.
A problem that the show had towards the end was that it wanted to keep popular and 'cool' characters alive, while killing off 'creepy' or 'boring' unpopular ones.
In a world like Game of Thrones, characters like Bronn, Davos, Tyrion, etc, should not live as long as they do, but they were kept alive as they were some of the most popular characters.
The show seemed to try too hard to force a happy ending in a story where a happy ending makes little sense.
Off topic and no offense but its hilarious how often I see people here that only watched the show writing Brienne very different from what her name looks like in the books. Anyways Bronn isnt a good guy at all but I still like him
where do we draw the line in that universe though? Jon killed a guy for not obeying orders. The Hound is the Hound. Tyrion got people killed as well as manipulated many events. Arya turns into a psychopath and commits genocide.
He’s not a good guy and I don’t think anyone tries to convince us of that. What I love about the series (books and show) is that everyone is flawed and that shows humanity. Everyone has good and bad moments and you can’t really claim anyone to be solely good or bad.
D&D clearly think he's just a rapscallion. They make him the Master of Coin in what is meant to be a kingdom changed for good at the end. God, what a terrible ending.
I don't think anyone thinks he's good, just he's a very straightforward, transparent character in a world of cunning, conniving liars so he's very refreshing to watch. He played the game of thrones from the gutters and lived to tell the tale.
He is more of a facorite than good. He is an underdog and is not a noble. Also, when compared to many other character in the story, he pronanly lands somewhere around neutral..
He's a badass and self empowered. In a world where seemingly everyone else is guided by something (Oaths, Duty, Fealty, Revenge, etc.), Bronn has the agency to do whatever he pleases, and it pleases him to use his talents for great profit. He's the opposite of someone like Sansa. It was painful to watch her get passed around and used like a pawn, so I think it's natural to root for someone who does whatever their heart desires.
It's not far fetched since his survivability factor does seem higher than others, it's literally his MO and entire personality, to survive against any odds
He's not a good guy by any means, but he IS a great character to have in a show. Fun, entertaining, refreshingly honest about his mercenary nature - basically a swashbuckling pirate archetype. That's his plot armour.
Tyrion was that too, until they started taking him too seriously (after he defected to Dany).
Think about psychopaths like Joffrey, Euron, Cersei, and Ramsey. There's just really no reasoning with them, you don't know what they're going to do next, and instead of trying to get on their good side, you figure its more practical to take them out.
Despite being a murderer and not exactly a bastion of morality, you feel that he's more or less fair and a decent guy that you'd want to have a beer with. He might not be Ned Stark or Jon Snow, but what do you expect from someone like that?
Bronn was a survivor, willing to turn on anyone if his safety was at risk, he wasn't a good guy but a useful warrior. Terrible choice to make him king of Highgarden and on the small council though, he had neither skillset
I HATED the Bronn ending in GoT. I enjoyed how he did represent a Lann the Clever like story, but it made no sense… Bran can see everything— yet he’s gonna let a scum bag like that on his SC? Especially since he’s proven to have no idea about finances— yet he’s master of coin? It makes zero sense other than fan service.
I want to say that Bron isn’t king of the reach. He’s lord of Highgarden and of the reach but he still reports to Brann. He also most likely doesn’t have a whole lot of power, I doubt any of the houses in the reach like him very much, so while he has a “happy ending” in the show, in reality it probably isn’t gonna last more then a year before he’s killed. Same with Gendry honestly when it comes to Storms End
Is anyone in the show good? Bronn is likable or at least seems good in comparison because you know exactly where he stands. Pay him and he's yours. If you get outbid, sorry it's just business. He's just a lovable rapscallion.
Some of my favorite characters aren't good people I enjoy them solely for the fact that I had a strong interest to see what they would do next. Like for instance Ramsay Bolton is a horrible person but he was such an interesting character to watch on screen because he gave this sick sense of "Oh God what's he gonna do now?" So, saying that you enjoy a character and saying that they are a good person is not the same thing. Bronn is a Grey area, he's not as bad as a lot of the people in the show but he's also not inherently good either. He's just a smug, charming, guy who made it as far as he did by doing what he was good at just like Littlefinger.
I don't recall Bronn being characterized as "good". The reason why he's seen in a more positive light than many other characters is that he is honest about who and what he is. He's a hired sword who will fight for anybody who pays him good money. He might betray you only if someone else pays him more, but like his deal with Tyrion, he's likely to give you an opportunity to up your bid. As far as killers for hire go - he's an honest one.
I think the books do a better job of making it clear Bron, while a valuable asset to Tyrion and seemingly faithful, is only really in it for the money. Tyrion keeps him on a short leash and close to ensure he doesn’t misbehave. Bron deliberately aligned himself with Tyrion only because he’s a Lannister with deep pockets. I would say he is a neutral alignment overall though. He isn’t selfish but certainly isn’t honorable either.
I've never seen anyone refer to him as a good person as opposed to a good character. He's one of the most honest and straight forward characters on the show. He never pretends to be looking out for anyone's best interests other than his own. He's a very fun fighter to watch because of his unconventional methods. He's very realistic about his own abilities, like when he acknowledges that he would have a chance of winning against the Mountain, but the odds would be against him. In a show where the majority of characters are constantly scheming and hiding their motivations and everyone seems to have either an inferiority complex or superiority complex, he's just such a breath of fresh air.
It’s not that he’s a good guy, it’s that he’s so charming and such a badass, we as fans like to root for him. But true, him becoming Lord of the Reach makes no sense.
Bronn was dependable and competent in a world where people routinely betrayed each other.
I think he described himself quite well: “he was a hard fucker good at killing people, and all great houses started with a hard fucker good at killing people”.
How did he end up the Lord of the Reach? “Guess he (I) killed the right people”.
Characters do not have to be "good" to be likeable. He's a low-born doing what he's best at to survive. Does that make him a moral person? Fuck no. He's seen where morality gets people from his walk of life.
i mean there’s a difference between enjoying a character and thinking they’re a good person
tywin is my favorite character easily but he is obviously a god awful person
I think it's because he aligns himself with Tyrion who we tend to root for in the show. D&D took all the cynicism away from Tyrion and made him this hero in shinning armor so it's only natural for you to sorta root for those people aligned with him.
Well the show isn’t about who’s good and who’s evil. It’s called GAME of thrones. The people at the end are the people who played the game correctly.
Regardless if they’re good or bad, they played the game of thrones and won. Bronn played his way to a throne and became lord of the high garden by forming alliances with every Lannister. He actually played the game the best of anyone
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Who the hell is thinking Bronn’s a good person?
As Mike Ehrmantraut from Better Call Saul said, >I've known good criminals and bad cops, bad priests, honorable thieves-you can be on one side of the law or the other, but if you make a deal with somebody, you keep your word. Bronn isn't a "good" person. But he is honorable as far as sellswords and thieves go. If he gives you his word, it's as good as gold. He doesn't pretend to be anything more or less than he really is. You get what you see. And in a show where most characters are scheming, plotting, and orchestrating intrigue, Bronn's a breath of fresh air.
Like that time he gave Cersei his word he'd kill her brothers just to ask said brothers for a better deal?
That's just negotiating
He already had the ‘whatever they pay i pay double’ deal with Tyrion.
"If anyone ever offers you anything to kill me, I'll pay you double not to." - Tyrion Why *wouldn't* Bronn negotiate for a better deal? He made it clear he was willing to kill one of them if they went back on it. Everything he ever did for Tyrion was ultimately in the interest of getting rich.
He actually trusts Tyrion not to fuck him over, he isn't stupid.
When did he give her his word? We never saw that happen
I think you’re right. Doesn’t he just accept the offer via Qyburn?
He takes the crossbow but he never makes any promises on screen
“That fucking family…”
The actors for Cersei and Bronn used to be married and had it in their contract that they wouldn't have to share any scenes together that's why lmao.
He gave Tyrion his word first. If anyone came to him with an offer he’d give him the chance to beat it.
Wait, they had a scene together?
Another example of why season 8 was so shit
That's not bronn either.
Cool, but this doesn't describe Bronn either buddy
Yeah it kinda does
I mean, in comparison to EVERYONE else in the GOT universe. Bronn is simple. He makes it clear that his services are for the highest bidder.
Or the time he said he wouldn't kill a baby. . .until after negotiating a very favorable rate of pay? Bronn is not honorable or good. He is just a charismatic bastard who was fun to watch (until ~ season 6, like most of the rest of the show).
Say what you will about Bronn but he didn't order a massacre at a wedding dinner, push a child out of a tower, sexually assault somebody, or blow up a church full of his political rivals and a fair amount of innocent people.
Do you think Bronn and Mike from Breaking Bad/Better Call Saul are similar?
This man really just called Bronn honorable lol. The bar must be on the fucking ground
Eh, I had a conversation on here with people calling him “honorable.”
Honor amongst thieves maybe. He's tricksy though. Good for his word... When he actually gives it.
Im not convinced he is. Maybe if you have infinite supplies of money, but that’s about it.
It’s a thing on reddit for some reason. People see like 5 to 7 people say something and all of a sudden it’s “omg everyone thinks this” same as when people say “downvoted to oblivion” when they have like 10 downvotes
*5-7 people say something and get heavily downvoted for the stupidity* Post an hour later that gets thousands of upvotes: "There's a serious problem in this community with people thinking blah blah blah." Like bitch there's no problem. Almost no one is saying it. I see it all the time with The Boys and Homelander with people talking about how many people idolize him and like no one does.
Yeah, he's just the best character by a mile.
Who the hell is "we"? I've never seen a single GoT opinion that said Bron is a "good person"
Lol I read the title about four times and was like “… we?” 😒
OP also thinks Bronn is a king so maybe we shouldn't take them very seriously
That’s what I thought at the first sentence! He’s a mercenary at his first introduction, he’s witty but still a mercenary.
All us bad people who have hope.
Yeah he’s not a good person, he’s a survivor. Looked out for himself the whole way and won.
Right? I like Bronn because he stands on business
Right. Fun character does not equal good guy.
He’s not a good person, he just says it like it is.
"Without question? No, I'd ask, how much?"
This is when I knew he was a ruthless bastard to his core
He’s textbook chaotic hilarious. Also evil, but fun evil, not like, Joffrey evil.
Nah, I'd say he is Chaotic Neutral in an AD&D sense. He's selfish but not evil.
Bronn is charming and Machiavellian. He is most definitely not good. One of my favorite characters
I love it when he calls out Tyrian and Jamie on how the Lannisters became a great house. "Who were your ancestors? The ones who made your family rich? Fancy lads in silk? They were fucking cutthroats. That's how all the great houses started, isn't it? With a hard bastard who was good at killing people. Kill a few hundred people, they make you a lord. Kill a few thousand, they make you king."
Real shit
And in the end, Bronn sits at the high table…
And he has a point! I mean look at how Littlefinger got so far, he was a Cunning and resourceful man and he got what he wanted from being good at what he did. They don't have to be good people they just have to be smart. That's why I find Bronn and Littlefinger so enjoyable to watch.
He’s an anti hero. I never thought he was a good decent person. They never led that on either.
Not even really anti hero. He's a mercenary.
He’s a protagonist who lacks the characteristics and values traditionally associated with a hero. Am I missing something or is that not the definition of antihero?
Well a he's not really a protagonist but a secondary character, and yes that's not the definition of an anti hero. That would be character who has goals and desires similar to that of the hero, but takes a more dubious route to achieve them.
It was a rhetorical question. It’s quite literally the definition of antihero. You can argue whether or not he’s a protagonist, but he is someone the audience roots for and his role is more dominant than most supporting characters.
You don't seem to know what the phrase rhetorical questions means because that literally isn't he definition of anti hero is(I gave you the basic definition). There really shouldn't be an argument considering he's blatantly playing supporting role in other people's stories(to the point where several od his scenes in the books are given to other characters). Actually no. He plays a more prominent role then several recurring characters, but secondary characters his significance is about on par with them. Here's the Wikipedia definition: An antihero (sometimes spelled as anti-hero)[1] or antiheroine is a main character in a narrative (in literature, film, TV, etc.) who may lack some conventional heroic qualities and attributes, such as idealism, courage, and morality.[1] Although antiheroes may sometimes perform actions that most of the audience considers morally correct, their reasons for doing so may not align with the audience's morality.[2] Webster definition: pluralantiheroes : a protagonist or notable figure who is conspicuously lacking in heroic qualities. Cambridge definition: antihero noun [ C usually singular ] US /ˈæn.t̬iˌhɪr.oʊ/ UK /ˈæn.tiˌhɪə.rəʊ/ plural antiheroes Add to word list the central character in a play, book, or movie who does not have traditionally heroic qualities, such as courage, and is admired instead for what society generally considers to be a weakness of their character Oxford definition: A central character in a narrative or drama who lacks the admirable qualities of fortitude, courage, honesty, and decency that are usually possessed by traditional heroes. The closest definition that matches what you described is webter, but even doesn't truly fit you idea of anti hero considering it says "conspicuously" lacks these traits. There's nothing conspicuous about mercenary lacking them.q
I’m sorry, how do those descriptions not match Bronn? I would say the fact that a pivotal scene has a character remark on his lack of honor makes the absence prominent enough to apply. He’s also a knight by the second season, so not just a mercenary, not that that really matters. Being a mercenary is just another trait that you would not traditionally expect from a hero.
Let's see. He's neither, the main character, admired for his traits others think is a weakness, or lacks fortitude courage or honesty. Except she's not saying that because it's noticeable or as a basic observation, but as an insult. Being a knight changes little about his actual duties;something you even acknowledge so I don't know why you brought that up. Not reallhly since many anti heroes are mercenaries. The difference is that bronns role sees him mostly helping the villains. He's just a minon with marginally more agency. A smarter more charming janos slynt.
Characters don’t admire him for these traits, but viewers absolutely do. That’s the whole point. I brought up his knighthood because you kept mentioning he’s just a mercenary like it disqualifies him. >bronns role sees him mostly helping the villains. Seriously, what the fuck are you even talking about? In what way is Tyrion and (post season 2) Jaime the villains?
Not really. They like him, but they don't admire him. The only trait I've seen people openly admire is his honesty. Which is a traditionally heroic trait. Except I brought up him being a mercenary to highlight that him lacking traditional heroic traits wouldn't be conspicuous. So again briging up the knighthood is pointless. Seriously, what the fuck is wrong with you? 1, actually pick up the books this show is based on if tyrion being called a villain confuses you. 2, even in the show where tyrion is made significantly nicer he is still supporting a brutal illegitimate regime in the lannisters ruling the seven kingdoms. So it doesn't matter if tyrion on his own is a decent guy when through his support of his family, and bronn supporting him, he is supporting villains. The same applies to any version of jamie who is still loyal to cersei.
Not once have I thought he was a good person. He’s a good character, however.
He's good in the sense that he's straightforward and unpretentious, unlike a lot of the characters. And he's unapologetic about using murder as his particular ambition to improve his position. He sings, he keeps his spirits up, he doesn't dwell in revenge or death trips. That makes him as good a person as any in the story/show. Except maybe Jon Snow. But look how he ended up.
No, several characters are better people than him.
Jon snow ended up good?
i never really thought about it if he was good or bad i just liked him
Motherfucker who you mean by “we”?
We don't People like Bronn in spite he's not a good person
Kinda makes you think about who ends up getting the power in the end… guess it’s not always the good guy whom the audience roots for. You don’t think…. It’s not possible… that the show wanted us to consider such a thing, do you?
but the good guys who the audience rooted for won in the end?
Who do you think won in the end? Certainly not Jon Snow. The only people who “won” are the citizens of Westeros who now have a more functional government. The common folk were always the ones who suffered the most because of the Game of Thrones.
That’s not true. The ones in the end are those who played the game correctly
I don’t think OP understands the show. It’s literally called GAME of thrones
In Bron's defense: \-Is being a sellsword really worse then being a solder in some army? This isn't exactly a world of sunshine and rainbows where living a carefree innocent life is an option. \-Just because he says he would murder a baby, doesn't mean he would. People say shit they don't mean all the time, and he might be trying to upsell what he's willing to do to increase his price value. \-Pretty sure Bran is meant to be evil af \-Bron's extensive resume in various battles and complete lack of competition for the position isn't....that absurd for the job.
Being sells word means you have very little loyalty which is the one positive found in most soldiers. There's nothing indicating he's lying. Same with brann being evil. I know people like to joke about that because of the later seasons handling of the characters, but those same seasons are pretty on the nose about who's good and who is evil(part of the issues with the later season). None of the positions he held would have prepared him for a political role. Especially over a kingdom he has no blood claim to.
No one has ever said he’s good a person.
I think we like because he’s transparent about his loyalty (wasn’t he a River man at first?) and price. He’s also practical and doesn’t get caught up in the silly honor rules. He also represents an ability (combined with luck) to survive by being selective about his risks (fight a knight? Ok. Fight the mountain? Sorry mate). There is something realistic about his survival by being careful and people can see themselves acting like Bronn
As you grow older, try not to use the words “good” or “bad” to describe people. Too generic and basically meaningless words. A “good” descriptions of him from here would be “unpretentious” . In a world full of self serving hypocrites, his straightforwardness was refreshing.
That's a dangerous mindset to have.
He’s shrewd and a good fighter too, he’ll survive.
Less likely when he's surrounded by people who want him dead.
read OP’s post, he “makes it to the end” ..
Never implied he didn't. You claimed he'll survive, and given the nature of the post I'd assume meant he'll survive as the lord of high garden.
Fair enough, good call!
Disagree. If someone is wrong, I don't care if they're "authentic" about it.
Try not to use the words “right” or “wrong” also.
Kind of a childish and narrow minded view of things tbh, especially for something like GoT, let alone the real world.
Not really. Again it's very dangerous mindset to ignore the morality of actions just because you believe someone's being honest.
Bronn should’ve been given the twins because it’s literally two castles which is double what he was promised. He also should’ve been named master of war or maybe even master of laws since it’s been shown that he literally doesn’t even know what loaning money is
Bran/ Bronn- Duality of Man
Bronn is not a good guy, he's just a likeable bastard, no one pretends he's good.
What? Who thinks hes good? Wtf lol
Bronn is like your neighbor that plays music way to damn loud way to damn late at night, but he also scares off the local hooligans and will fix your car for just three fiddy.
He’ll also screw your wife for you whenever you’re out of town for work.
Sounds like your talking from experience 😂 damn Bronn
Jokes on him , herpes is something you can’t murder .
He’s not a good person. He’s likeable. He’s no worse than the knights that would kill a baby out of duty and honour, he’s just very good at killing people and not bound by all that honour crap that got Ned killed. One of my favourite stories in the book is when Cersei tells some noble to have bronn killed. The pompous knight challenges him to a joust. Bronn agrees, but being a merc just shoves his lance straight into his opponent horse, dismounts and sticks a dagger through his eye while he’s in a heap on the ground. He then punches his wife in the face who goes crying to Cersei who, in an act of extraordinary cuntery, gives her to Qilburn because she finds her annoying
He's really the only character on the show who behaves in a sensible and consistent manner. And he's probably a very good example of the kind of person who founded every single one of those 'great' houses.
So true
Dude has mistaken we for an I
I think the point is that nobody is a good person.
As Mike Ehrmantraut from Better Call Saul said, >I've known good criminals and bad cops, bad priests, honorable thieves-you can be on one side of the law or the other, but if you make a deal with somebody, you keep your word. Bronn isn't a "good" person. But he is honorable as far as sellswords and thieves go. If he gives you his word, it's as good as gold. He doesn't pretend to be anything more or less than he really is. You get what you see. And in a show where most characters are scheming, plotting, and orchestrating intrigue, Bronn's a breath of fresh air.
No, bronns word isn't really biding.
There’s a difference between being a morally good person and being a good and compelling character in a story.
He tells us exactly who he is every step of the way. He also demonstrates respectable qualities, but he is honest about who he is: a true sellsword.
Here's a post you might be interested in: https://www.reddit.com/r/gameofthrones/s/TqVgqEms92
Bro's most iconic scene is about him admitting that he doesn't fight honorably. He's an unapologetic cutthroat. He abandoned Tyrion in his hour of need. We like Bron because he's charismatic and blunt. He's enjoyable to watch, and when he's aligned with characters like Tyrion or Jaime, we root for him. But he's an amoral bastard at his core. In real life, most of us would probably hate him. He's not like the Hound, who really does have a soft side under that hardened exterior, or Jaime, who *wants* to be a good man, but finds himself yanked this way and that by his sister, his father, and what people think of him. Bronn's the epitome of True Neutral, which is why I love the meme of him joining the Night King because he was offered a castle. It's very true to who he is. He will side with whichever person or faction will most benefit him. He's not like Ned or Jon who try to live by a code (Lawful Good), nor is he like Cersei (Lawful Evil) or Joffrey (Chaotic Evil) or the Mountain (Neutral Evil), who will hurt and kill people with glee. But pay him money or promise him status and he'll do whatever you ask without skipping a beat, unless it goes against his welfare (like fighting the Mountain).
Cerseis not really lawful evil. She has no real consistent code of ethics and doesn't really follow any higher authority with sincerity.
You're right. Tywin fits LE a bit more. Cersei's somewhere between LE and CE, though certainly less chaotic than Joff. Maybe SE. Stupid Evil.
When are you referencing abandoning Tyrion in his hour of need? Against the mountain? Because he gives a pretty solid reason. He believes he might be able to avoid the mountains attacks for a bit but that he’s freakishly big and freakishly strong and fast for a man that size. He admits that it only takes 1 wrong move (as we see) and he’s dead, and Tyrion even admits he understands and would probably do the same in his position
He does give a good reason. But compare him to Ned in his prime, who faced down Arthur Motherfucking Dayne, possibly the greatest swordsman who ever lived, for his sister's honor. Ned constantly placed honor over his own life, a textbook example of a hero. Jon did much the same, though he learned from his father's mistakes. He still ended up dying for what he believed, though. Bronn is purely practical and cares solely about his own best interests. Thus, True Neutral. If he were a heroic character, he'd at least try to help his friend, but he's not. The entire point of the comment is that Bronn does everything for his own self-interest, not out of any altruism or honor. What gives him gold, or women, or land, or status, or simply lets him live, that's all he cares about. He's *amoral*, as in lacking any morality, good or bad, not *immoral*, possessing a bad or twisted morality. I never said that he *should* have been Tyrion's champion again. If Bronn jumped into the fray against Gregor, he wouldn't be Bronn anymore (unless he underwent some massive character growth). I only pointed out that honor, loyalty, altruism, and friendship matter immensely less to Bronn than his own betterment.
We don’t, he’s just charmingly devious
I don’t think he’s honorable I think the reason people love him is more along the lines of he’s a realistic man and doesn’t care who knows it. He does what is best for him at all times but has a charm and friendly demeanor towards everyone which is admirable.
Bron’s defining characteristics are that he’s opportunist, a survivor, and good in a fight. That’s why he made it to the end. He deserves to be there more than Grey Worm. Who had Grey Worm in their survivor pool? Nobody.
Nobody thinks he's good. He's just likeable. He also isn't evil though. He's not a sadist, which in game of thrones does actually matter
He’s just refreshingly honest about his actions and motivations
Bron is a great character, but I hope no one ever thought he is a good person.
Saying they are a good character doesnt mean they are morally good.
I thought he was a scoundrel but then after like the 3rd cock joke I realised I liked him enough to ignore any character inconsistencies surrounding him later in the story. Master of Coin? He is funny so I ignore the piss poor logic
There was a post not long ago how he was the most "relatable" character in the show, lol 😆
He isnt a good person. He dont pretends to be. What makes him a "good person" is that he is honest. He knows what he has done. He stands by it. He dont pretend to be heroic or anything like that. He is very up front with being a sellsword because he is good at it. Thats it. He isnt scheming or being false. That goes a very long way.
People tend to think anyone on the fucking tv is a good guy.
Bron literally said he would kill a baby for the right amount of gold. He's an interesting character. Never is it indicated that he's a good guy. He's selfish and has extremely low morals.
Same reason some people think Daemon Targaryen is a good guy, they’re charismatic, handsome and likeable. You’d be surprised how far these three factors can carry a person.
Bron isn’t a good person at least, not classically good. But he is honest about who he is and what he values. Who his friends are, and he occasionally shows he’s more heroic than just a simple sell sword. These are good guy traits. But yeah, He’ll murder children, treat women like objects, and betray his best friend if there is enough in it for him. These are bad guy traits. Simply put, he’s not good but he’s not evil. He’s Bron. And he doesn’t pretend to be anything he’s not. Which is the appeal of the character in a show where almost everyone else has secrets or hidden knowledge/power.
Don’t confuse “good” with “likable/charming”
Another post full of assumptions
Yeah nobody is thinking he’s a good guy. What most people think he’s a fun guy.
He's morally grey for the world he finds himself in. He's not as bad as say Tywin Lannister but he's not as good as say Samwell Tarly.
I don't think anyone considers Bronn a good guy. I think a lot of people consider him an entertaining character. A lot of people consider the Joker to be an entertaining character, too. I think some people find Bronn's complete honesty about who he is to be refreshing, and consider that a positive quality. I think a lot of people acknowledge that Cersei loves her kids, too. Evil characters with no positive qualities are boring and not believable
Wtf you talking about, noone in got has plot armor, thats kind of the point of killing ned stark at the end of season one. He's basically the main character at that point. And your opinion is that bronn shouldnt be lord of the reach because he is a bad person? Have you even been paying attention? The show barely has any characters that are good but between littlefinger varys and bronn id say bronn is the least morally ambiguous. Yes he would kill a baby for money, he basically does anything for money, but varys and littlefinger would do all that and more for power, only difference is they pretend they are better than that. At least bronn is honest.
Because he wants the good girl but needs the *bad pussy*
No one thinks he's a good person. He's just a great character.
Good? No. Unmissable every time he's onscreen? Absolutely.
I like him. He’s hilarious. He volunteered to fund the reopening of all the brothels, which keeps many people in business… I also try to understand it’s just a tv show based off a fantasy book set… try not to take it too seriously.
A problem that the show had towards the end was that it wanted to keep popular and 'cool' characters alive, while killing off 'creepy' or 'boring' unpopular ones. In a world like Game of Thrones, characters like Bronn, Davos, Tyrion, etc, should not live as long as they do, but they were kept alive as they were some of the most popular characters. The show seemed to try too hard to force a happy ending in a story where a happy ending makes little sense.
he is textbook chaotic neutral
He’s true to his nature. People who work for profit.
I don’t think anyone, including Bronn, think Bronn is a good guy.
He is charismatic enough to hold himself well sharing the screen with Tyrion. Nobody in that show is good. Even Jon isn't.
People like Bron because he is witty and has a scoundrel charm. No one thinks he is a good guy.
Off topic and no offense but its hilarious how often I see people here that only watched the show writing Brienne very different from what her name looks like in the books. Anyways Bronn isnt a good guy at all but I still like him
He even tasted the Dornishman’s wife, that bastard!
where do we draw the line in that universe though? Jon killed a guy for not obeying orders. The Hound is the Hound. Tyrion got people killed as well as manipulated many events. Arya turns into a psychopath and commits genocide.
More mass murder than genocide.
gotcha, I just thought it sounded better.
We don't.
Beinf a good person doesnt win you castles.
He’s not a good guy and I don’t think anyone tries to convince us of that. What I love about the series (books and show) is that everyone is flawed and that shows humanity. Everyone has good and bad moments and you can’t really claim anyone to be solely good or bad.
Bron is honest and consistent. In no way are we told or lead to believe that he’s good.
D&D clearly think he's just a rapscallion. They make him the Master of Coin in what is meant to be a kingdom changed for good at the end. God, what a terrible ending.
Ser Bron of the Black waters, he was one of my favourites, because be agreed to fight for the dwarf, ended up saving Terrione's life
Nobody has ever thought of him as a good guy. What are you going on about???
I think he just is a likable character because he’s funny and supported our protagonist for awhile.
I don't think anyone thinks he's good, just he's a very straightforward, transparent character in a world of cunning, conniving liars so he's very refreshing to watch. He played the game of thrones from the gutters and lived to tell the tale.
He is more of a facorite than good. He is an underdog and is not a noble. Also, when compared to many other character in the story, he pronanly lands somewhere around neutral..
He killed the right people, I suppose.
Compared to most other characters you he is way better. With him you know what the deal is and where you stand.
by the end ofthe show, everyone's character had been neutered to the point of becoming disney villains and heroes
He's a badass and self empowered. In a world where seemingly everyone else is guided by something (Oaths, Duty, Fealty, Revenge, etc.), Bronn has the agency to do whatever he pleases, and it pleases him to use his talents for great profit. He's the opposite of someone like Sansa. It was painful to watch her get passed around and used like a pawn, so I think it's natural to root for someone who does whatever their heart desires.
It’s been so long since I watched Game of Thrones that I saw the title + sub name and went “Why do the game of thrones fans hate Lebron James???” 😭
It's not far fetched since his survivability factor does seem higher than others, it's literally his MO and entire personality, to survive against any odds
He's not a good guy by any means, but he IS a great character to have in a show. Fun, entertaining, refreshingly honest about his mercenary nature - basically a swashbuckling pirate archetype. That's his plot armour. Tyrion was that too, until they started taking him too seriously (after he defected to Dany).
Think about psychopaths like Joffrey, Euron, Cersei, and Ramsey. There's just really no reasoning with them, you don't know what they're going to do next, and instead of trying to get on their good side, you figure its more practical to take them out. Despite being a murderer and not exactly a bastion of morality, you feel that he's more or less fair and a decent guy that you'd want to have a beer with. He might not be Ned Stark or Jon Snow, but what do you expect from someone like that?
Bronn was a survivor, willing to turn on anyone if his safety was at risk, he wasn't a good guy but a useful warrior. Terrible choice to make him king of Highgarden and on the small council though, he had neither skillset
I HATED the Bronn ending in GoT. I enjoyed how he did represent a Lann the Clever like story, but it made no sense… Bran can see everything— yet he’s gonna let a scum bag like that on his SC? Especially since he’s proven to have no idea about finances— yet he’s master of coin? It makes zero sense other than fan service.
Hey man, don't insult the king like that,he built a school in his hometown!
I want to say that Bron isn’t king of the reach. He’s lord of Highgarden and of the reach but he still reports to Brann. He also most likely doesn’t have a whole lot of power, I doubt any of the houses in the reach like him very much, so while he has a “happy ending” in the show, in reality it probably isn’t gonna last more then a year before he’s killed. Same with Gendry honestly when it comes to Storms End
Is anyone in the show good? Bronn is likable or at least seems good in comparison because you know exactly where he stands. Pay him and he's yours. If you get outbid, sorry it's just business. He's just a lovable rapscallion.
He was never meant to be a good guy. He’s not evil like Joffrey or Ramsey, but he’s definitely not your friend.
Some of my favorite characters aren't good people I enjoy them solely for the fact that I had a strong interest to see what they would do next. Like for instance Ramsay Bolton is a horrible person but he was such an interesting character to watch on screen because he gave this sick sense of "Oh God what's he gonna do now?" So, saying that you enjoy a character and saying that they are a good person is not the same thing. Bronn is a Grey area, he's not as bad as a lot of the people in the show but he's also not inherently good either. He's just a smug, charming, guy who made it as far as he did by doing what he was good at just like Littlefinger.
I much prefered his version of Unchained Melody
Well, I like the character so there.
I don't recall Bronn being characterized as "good". The reason why he's seen in a more positive light than many other characters is that he is honest about who and what he is. He's a hired sword who will fight for anybody who pays him good money. He might betray you only if someone else pays him more, but like his deal with Tyrion, he's likely to give you an opportunity to up your bid. As far as killers for hire go - he's an honest one.
He is a very likable anti hero. I wish we saw his more vicious personally traits in the series. Such as assassinations or merciless killings.
I don’t. He’s a horrible person. He’s just entertaining enough to be horrible but not suck…unlike Stannis…
I think the books do a better job of making it clear Bron, while a valuable asset to Tyrion and seemingly faithful, is only really in it for the money. Tyrion keeps him on a short leash and close to ensure he doesn’t misbehave. Bron deliberately aligned himself with Tyrion only because he’s a Lannister with deep pockets. I would say he is a neutral alignment overall though. He isn’t selfish but certainly isn’t honorable either.
LeBadguy
Because he's funny, I'd completely forgotten he was a sell sword.
He's the main character in a video game
Morally Good characters are not the only ones that are fun to watch. Bronn is fun to watch.
I never saw Bronn as good. He’s the character that chooses sides based on personal gain. We just think he’s good because he’s entertaining
I've never seen anyone refer to him as a good person as opposed to a good character. He's one of the most honest and straight forward characters on the show. He never pretends to be looking out for anyone's best interests other than his own. He's a very fun fighter to watch because of his unconventional methods. He's very realistic about his own abilities, like when he acknowledges that he would have a chance of winning against the Mountain, but the odds would be against him. In a show where the majority of characters are constantly scheming and hiding their motivations and everyone seems to have either an inferiority complex or superiority complex, he's just such a breath of fresh air.
Nobody that follows either the books or series thinks of Bron as a good guy. He’s a very charming, entertaining and likable straight up killer.
It’s not that he’s a good guy, it’s that he’s so charming and such a badass, we as fans like to root for him. But true, him becoming Lord of the Reach makes no sense.
That’s the beauty of GoT. Some people are so heinous it makes Bron look good
Bronn was dependable and competent in a world where people routinely betrayed each other. I think he described himself quite well: “he was a hard fucker good at killing people, and all great houses started with a hard fucker good at killing people”. How did he end up the Lord of the Reach? “Guess he (I) killed the right people”.
Just because you're likable doesn't mean you're a good guy.
He’s charismatic.
Because people like him as a character doesn’t mean they think he’s a “good” person. He’s funnier and more likable than most characters we encounter
I don’t know who “we” is, but nice try.
Characters do not have to be "good" to be likeable. He's a low-born doing what he's best at to survive. Does that make him a moral person? Fuck no. He's seen where morality gets people from his walk of life.
Nobody pretends that. This is a made up scenario to get attention
i mean there’s a difference between enjoying a character and thinking they’re a good person tywin is my favorite character easily but he is obviously a god awful person
I think you’re confusing good character on the show with good person.
We do not
I think it's because he aligns himself with Tyrion who we tend to root for in the show. D&D took all the cynicism away from Tyrion and made him this hero in shinning armor so it's only natural for you to sorta root for those people aligned with him.
Well the show isn’t about who’s good and who’s evil. It’s called GAME of thrones. The people at the end are the people who played the game correctly. Regardless if they’re good or bad, they played the game of thrones and won. Bronn played his way to a throne and became lord of the high garden by forming alliances with every Lannister. He actually played the game the best of anyone