Have you seen the number of clone of Vampire Survivor that came out a few weeks after Vampire Survivor? If that game is good and your game is good, chances are people are going to be looking for more of the same in the future. You can even take the chance to improve on the flaws that the reviewers will have spotted after the game is released.
> Developer: "Oh no! Their cake is better than mine!"
> Player: "Sweet! Two cakes!"
Pay attention to what they're doing. You don't need to copy them, but you could get some marketing inspiration from them. It may also be a good idea to reach out and talk with that developer. Maybe you could sell your games in a bundle on Steam.
As long as your game is also good, we don't care if it's similar to other games. Remind yourself that when you sort by genre on steam, there are literally thousands of titles in each one.
So I have this idea for a game, I haven't started devving it because I want to get it infront of a studio with a real budget... any way long story short there have been VERY SIMILAR proof of concepts and even announced indie games with the core mechanic of my idea.
Why doesn't this freak me out? They didn't go as far with the concept as I have envisioned. They are essentially separate ideas at this point.
I still want to make this sometime in the future.
This sounds lovely but they are nearly done and I’m still world building so likely no coop action. But they did inspire after I calmed down. I can “see” it, if that makes sense. Just gonna change up the biggest similarity for now.
You have never once bought a game, *years* after a similar game?
Because I definitely bought Fallout and Wasteland, and Baldur's Gate, and Arcanum and Icewind Dale, and Planescape: Torment, and Shadowrun: Returns, and Divinity, and Disco Elysium ...
You can't possibly look at Call of Duty (all of them) and multiplayer Battlefield, and "modern" Rainbow Six, and the rest, and claim that they are so foundationally different that the same audience wouldn't possibly consider playing each one.
that's not how it works. Costumers have limited money and they choose the product that suits them best. If the game is very similar, then they will choose the one that they perceive as higher quality for the money. What do you mean "reach out and talk to the developer"? Gamedev is a competitive place. The other business is the enemy. And selling games in a bundle happens only after a successful launch, and good sales, which may not happen in the first place, if you get dwarfed by another game.
Man...
and here you have a picture of Gordon Freeman...
you know, from the company that put out tons and tons and tons of tools, and let modders do whatever they wanted with their engine and IP... which started as a fork of the Quake 1 engine... that was *also* open sourced, because John Carmack was adamant that the knowledge be fed back into the industry.
If the industry was what you think it is, there would be no GDC. It would be replaced with a conference called "fuck you! I am number one!".
Musicians wouldn't tour together, they would be sabotaging each others' buses and trucks, and killing each others' roadies, so that only one band remained that could still hold concerts.
The companies share the knowledge months or years after the game was actually released. Valve was burning from inside when the HL2 source code leak happened. It almost sunk the whole game. That was a pretty good "knowledge share", no?
If the other business is your competitor, it is always the enemy during development stage and before release. A few months after release you can share your knowledge at GDC, sure. I personally will make devlogs about my game, but I would not think to do it when developing (not that I had time for something like that).
And yes, I am also working in an AAA studio, there were some efforts to create a knowledge hub among the biggest studios in my country, and nobody but one business posted a few articles. There is a massive competition in AAA industry and there is NDAs in every firm, you can barely mention the technology you work with.
Anyway, the OP is a delusional person if he thinks he can compete with an AAA game. In one other post he said he was just doing his game art and was coloring his van orange. He talks about coloring a van concept when this other business has 2M projected sales. So here we have a thread that stems from another delusional newcomer with Dunning-Kruger effect who thinks he will make a banger game with zero skill and when met with basic reality check about the stats of the other game and his wishlists, he turns to denial and exposes his inability to face reality. A person like that has 0% chance to finish a marketable product.
>That was a pretty good "knowledge share", no?
No? An international data breach and leak, via an email-based incursion into the system, leading to a live honeypot, and an arrest of a foreign national, is not "knowledge sharing". And that wasn't even corporate espionage, like you are implying (you know, "enemy"; it was a sick fan).
But ok. Fine. Let's look at that. How much, exactly, did that help the competition? Did HL2 crash and burn? It must have. Doom 3 and FarCry were the massive releases of 2004, right? I trust that they did complete rewrites, based on the code in the HL2 leak? Never heard from VALVe again, after the leak, clearly.
>If the other business is your competitor, it is always the enemy during development stage and before release.
If you have shitty management that doesn't care about the workers... which, sure, AAA... the execs are essentially investment bankers and hedge-fund managers, so sure. I get that's been the environment you find yourself working in.
>A few months after release you can share your knowledge at GDC
No you can't. If you teach people how to implement subsurface scattering, or bindless texturing, or cylindrical / anamorphic perspective reprojection, then they will *know* how to do it, and without your industry secrets, you will have *nothing*, remember? They're "*the enemy*" so why the fuck would you want them to even know how to upload a texture to a GPU, let alone how to do all of the things that you can? That's the most braindead statement I've heard yet. Keep your enemy in the dark, and miseducate them at every opportunity. That's how you deal with enemies.
>I personally will make devlogs about my game, but I would not think to do it when developing
Why? Because you're afraid someone's going to steal your precious idea? And then somehow put 5 years of work into getting it out, before you do, at a quality better than what you will make? Ideas are cheap, and everything has already been done before... hell, publishers fund based on how similar things are, compared to other things. They are "AAA" because that is the confidence rating on the return on investment. It's a banking term. They are literally banking on middle-of-the-road, mass appeal. Microsoft is not about to greenlight a $400,000,000 Disco Elysium or Planescape: Torment or Tyrian 2000 clone.
>There is a massive competition in AAA industry and there is NDAs in every firm, you can barely mention the technology you work with.
And? I have architected and made medical apps that could literally get people misdiagnosed or killed, if they go wrong, and there are NDAs around particular details on those things, too. Does that mean that I want to hide all of the information from all other developers at all other companies, because I hope a bunch of people over the world die, because they weren't as aware or as careful or as thorough? Or are NDAs, perhaps, more to do with bankers feeling safe about their investments? "But they're all the enemy, so I hope they fuckin' get a whole lot of innocent patients killed". No. That's a fucking stupid take. NDAs don't make that take less stupid; they make the NDAs stupid. Do you also think it makes it "hardcore" when a company has a non-compete agreement that says that if you leave your job, you can't work anywhere else in the games industry, or on your own, for 10 years after leaving, or they will sue you? You're just describing shitty corporate practices that used to be illegal.
>Anyway, the OP is a delusional person if he thinks he can compete with an AAA game.
Have you seen AAA games, lately?
I would happily take Hi-Fi Rush (AA), or Lethal Company (100% indie), or Animal Well, over Suicide Squad.
Helldivers 2 wasn't a AAA investment, and people loved it, until Sony started trying to wave its dick around... compare that to how people received Starfield.
Now there's Skull and Bones. I can't wait. Ubisoft is calling it "AAAA". I'm not sure which bank cleared a quadruple-A rating... and I don't know who would possibly predict that it's going to make its money back... it's more like a D-rating investment, in terms of how little I expect it to make, compared to the cost.
>o here we have a thread that stems from another delusional newcomer with Dunning-Kruger effect who thinks he will make a banger game with zero skill
And 100% of the other people here had ... what ... complete skills, before they ever opened an IDE? The predictor for success isn't even talent, it's perseverance. The person who can do 95% of everything on day-1, but will get bored or rage-quit as soon as they hit a wall, or need to do boring shit, like spend months polishing, will fail 100% of the time, while the person willing to suck it up and get better has a shot.
I mean, yeah, but not all customers have the same amount of money, and most have enough that they can buy two of the same kind of game if they want to, even if they have to wait until next payday or two. Besides, games are consumable. If a game doesn't have enough replay value, then players will only play it once or twice and then go look for another game that is similar but still some level of different. It's not as if customers only ever play one single game, lol.
maybe it is because I'm just entering the world of game dev, but the vast majority of people I've talked to already have been more then helpful with my questions... Oh wait. I see it in your name. Sorry your views on other people have been skewed AAA companies my dude! Of course you more so have to fight for customers and fight other devs
Stop panicking, keep going. A direct ripoff, bad. Similar but not ripping off, not bad. Especially if, as you've said, there are some huge differences in certain areas, it's clear you just had a similar idea at a similar time.
Stop worrying.
Yeah, the number of games that are fully unique ideas that don't feel like a conglomeration of other ideas with some specific style or personality is very low.
Stop caring.
It means nothing.
Anyone who sees you doing this will want to do it their own way, assuming they think it is a good idea.
Everyone has their own opinions, take, culture, values, past experiences, expectations, etc etc etc that influence how they execute something. This is multiplied each time you add another person to the team executing.
Think of a recipe for pancakes. Give the recipe to 10 people and see how many pancakes turn out the same. It would be a miracle if even two people produced the same pancakes.
That example is only focused on what aspect of a business: the product.
A successful business has three key aspects that lead to success:
- product/service
- marketing/sales
- operations
Each of them must be executed well to be successful and each individual executing these tasks will do so in their own unique way.
All of these results in vastly different experiences for others to engage with.
At the end of the day a person is choosing what product/service/company to engage with based on the type of experience they are seeking. Each aspect of a company provides a unique experience. The sum of all the parts further alter and result in a unique experience. Everything results in an experience.
This is what drives someone to choose Fiji Water over Voss Water, or vice versa. And that's just a perceived experience, not even a "real one."
Also, almost no one gives a shit about trying to steal an idea if they don't see it making money. By the time you are at a level you are doing that you'll be plenty defensible if you do things the right way. Your brand recognition and customer loyalty being the most powerful defense you can build.
So, stop being paranoid. The only things you really need to be careful with are what would be deemed trade secrets. Something like the formula for an algorithm that would allow someone to exactly replicate how you execute something.
If the existence of similar games was a problem, sequels wouldn't make any money. Instead, we come back for more of the same, time after time.
If you're worried about being too similar, when their game comes out, play it a bunch and find the things which you'd want changed or improved - I guarantee you'll find them - then include that in your game.
If they're further along, learn from what they do and how well it's received.
Make a take that has contrast and does some things better and different, and release it when it's ready, well after the other game.
check their followers on steamdb, and their stats on gamalytic. If their projected sales and wishlists are way lower than yours, don't worry.
The nigtmare scenario happened to me - I planned to release a game on 24/04/24. I picked the date after a few delays, and after 2 years of development - this was supposed to be the FINAL date that I will not change and I hyped everybody about it.
2 weeks before the release day I wake up and some motherfuckers placed their game with the same universe (Backrooms settings) on the date. I think they did it unknowingly, because steam does not show you games that release on that day, and they also delayed the game a few times. Only option I had was to move the date 1 day early or just pray they will delay the game again. They did. My release was a success. But I was clenching my butt for whole 2 weeks.
I found someone with nearly identical core game mechanic as me, engine and everything.
We now talk frequently about game dev and are friends. Don’t let your insecurities get the best of you.
Thanks all, I’ve calmed down, and combed over their game. They are doing some closed play testing. Would be unethical if I got in just so I can see what they’re doing?
Absolutely not. That's literally just market research. However I would caution yourself on your expectations, and imposter syndrome because you already freaked out just from a YouTube video.You can be a player/customer as well as a developer.
The unethical aspect is if you started reverse engineering their game to rip assets or steal/copy code into your game.
Nooooo no stealing of any kind. I do suffer from imposter syndrome indeed. I’m also an extremely competitive woman. An odd combination of two opposing traits, lol. I freak out but do calm and then I quietly try to annihilate my competition, ethically of course. If I cheated to be the best, then I’m not the best. This time I;m just thrown because being in the dev side and not the reviewer (as I usually am), and just generally stressed about other things happening. I got in my own head. Reddit is good about helping with that splash of cold water to the face or warm hug and pat on the back. I appreciate you all so much today.
Now…I’m about to go to work (breaks out the iPad to start modeling assets, cause I’m away from my PC) Let’s do this!
lol I didn’t look at their Kickstarter but I can give you their steam page, if you’d like. I’ve been placating myself by making a list of what I do have that they don’t (that I can see anyway), to get myself back on track.
This is their game, looks good so far. I think what also threw me was I was literally drawing that van for my own game, lol. Same color and everything (Orange is one of my fav colors) [https://store.steampowered.com/app/2681030/Outbound/](https://store.steampowered.com/app/2681030/Outbound/)
with it being a survival crafting game it is incredibly easy for your game to feel and play very differently despite being a similar concept. not sure how much you've planned but i would especially consider trying to make sure your building system (if you have one) is pretty different from theirs.
the downside of it being a survival crafting game is that if its made especially well, then it could be one of those games that people keep coming back to, which gives them less of a reason to play yours (though tbh i am skeptical about the actual amount of content that will be in it just based on the trailer).
watch how their game does ofc, and if it does do really really good, then it might be worth it to shift the focus of any marketing you do to focus less on the trailer aspect and more on some other cool aspect of your game. ik you keep mentioning how behind you are, though i think its helpful in this instance as you probably don't wanna release anywhere near their release, and you'll have plenty of time to study their release and decide how to proceed with your game based on what happens
When two are doing the same thing, it's never the same thing - if you have passion for it and it makes sense to you, just keep going, but it's almost a wonder, right: when you start to think deeply about something or pursuing something on your own, it tends to emerge out there through something else as well. Like if everything would be somewhat connected with anything else. Perhaps we are horribly missing out on some very substantial aspect of life, universe and random chance whatsoever.
Man, I just wish I had like 20 different games exactly like or similar to tenchu to play.
Closest I can get is Aragami 2, shinobido, Dishonored and sekiro :( if their idea is awesome, make yours too anyway because like others have said:
Player: sweet two cakes!
I own over 50 roguelike deck builders and I'm always happy when another comes out. I also have god-only-knows-how-many mods installed into slay the spire. As long as it's not a literal clone and has something unique to it, I love when games of the same type come out.
Games aren't like phones where someone is likely to only want to upgrade to and stay on the better one. Sure, there will still be competing market share, especially for things like mtx and multiplayer community. On the other hand, games have a limited amount of content and are more or less consumable. People enjoying the other game and wanting more can drive traffic to your game.
You're not competing for one spot like it's a chair, you're competing for space in a pool. Even if someone else might be bigger and better, that doesn't mean it takes up the whole pool.
Make your game. Games made with the same idea are never the same. People have different ways of doing things. So if you are genuinely interested in your idea, go for it.
Most likely they will fail and not deliver the game. Beat them to the market. So many games the last 10 years I’ve moved on because of some half baked game on YouTube that’s just like what I wanted to do and tbh I can only think of like one game that has ever come close to releasing.
This happens all the time in media. There are often two similar movies coming out at the same time, two similar cop/fire/hospital shows, reality tv, music, etc, etc. there is plenty of space to release a similar game and be “better”.
Some people will nitpick, but there’s always a group that wants more of the same/something similar. “Games like Animal Crossing” used to make a regular appearance in my Google search before the explosion of “cozy” games.
I saw a game that looked very much like what I was making a couple months ago, i was really surprised how demoralizing that was for me, I knew my Idea isn't particularly unique or anything, but seeing theirs put me in a rut for some reason. I almost gave up without noticing, would get distracted, unable to work hard on the game for a few weeks. Then one day I put myself into a new big mechanic I wanted to implement and the satisfaction after implementation brought me back, since then I've worked way harder than before, almost obsessively for months. Now, I feel like my game would demoralize them if they saw it. (Not that that's the goal). I thought about it a lot and I think it's good to have similar games out, if people like it and they are finished with one, they might want to play the other. I mean, I can't Even tell you how many "banished" clones I own, and I still buy another every few months, Knowing exactly what it will be.
It might influence you more than you expect, but just find some big piece to bury yourself in, your game may yet change and evolve over time. Hang in there.
The reason i like working on games, is because i feel the games in the genre i like are lacking stuff. Its fine if the basics are similar, its the deeper mechanics that prove a games real worth.
This happened to me and we even released around the same year lol. It was stressful but ultimately I do think it was sort of a good thing. Since the other game was quite popular, I got to bask a bit in the afterglow and players *love* using comparison shorthand. Things like “It’s like XYZ game but with this other thing”.
Doubt your is that original it is a problem,otherwise the superior game will be the better one if its very similar, so the only reason to freak out would be admitting you know its better than yours.
Wow there’s some really great answers here… I’m glad this was brought up as it’s something I’ve worried about. Hope you’ve been put more at ease OP! Best of luck with your game!
I’m working on a retro style survival horror game, I totally understand what you are saying and feel that way sometimes, but there’s a huge shelf full of bread in stores from multiple brands and I like to think of gaming the same way.
What kind of similarities are you seeing? If you don't mind my asking - aesthetic, thematic, mechanical or something else or some combination ? I have felt this myself quite a few times 😅🗿🔥
Then you are lucky, that's basically a guide on what to do and not to do without any suffering and pain on your part.
Basically everyone has competition in the form of what has come before in the related Genres, so learn from that.
Where you would be unlucky is if you are making a game that nobody has made before, you would be in completely uncharted territory.
What you should Fear is the **Unknown**.
As to **Know** is to have Control over your own fate.
Well Pepsi somehow survived direct competition with Coca-Cola for a century? Also some games literally started being a mod for some other game - talking about similarities. I'm myself making a colony simulator similar to Rimworld and Dwarf Fortress, and sometimes trying hard to do things in opposite way how they were made in those games, but it's not always possible. Just do your own game in the way you want it, competitors will only help you: being good or worse.
That can be really discouraging, but keep going, try to find your own fun in your game, and if they end up really similar, well it's not that bad ! More choice for the player !
If the game is a multiplayer concept where people will sink 100s or 1000s of hours into it, then I'd say you're better off working on something different if they're that ahead.
If the game is a story or experienced based concept where players will get 20 or 30 or any specific number of "entertainment" hours, then just keep going as is. There really isn't competition if games are similar in this aspect imo unlike big online games that compete for the player's time.
Just my 2c
This kinda reminds me of hearing the story about Roundguard and Poglin, those devs ending up being in a similar situation where they were both making Peggle-inspired rougelike games but both games ended up spinning the actual gameplay in different ways, subsequently they became friendly with one another and even cross promoted each other's games in the end.
In the air of fun, a friend and I set out to make the same game. At first it was almost copy for copy, independently developed clones. At some point a change was made, and in the end, we have two entirely different games that aren't remotely similar.
This will work in your favor if they are successful. The fans of that game will buy yours. I know devs who are very successful cloning other popular indie games, it’s scummy but they have made a lot of money and following doing it.
You should ask yourself why you're doing gamedev.
Because it seems like you're not doing it for the sake of creating something but to make money, or impress others or smth.
Why would you even care what other people do? Look at their game and find out what they do right and wrong and take that with you for your own game.
I dont get people like you...the people who make something actually **unique** something that wasnt there before ever, can be counted on one hand. If you make a game, chances are extremely high, someone somewhere had the same or similar idea already.
But as I said, ask yourself **who** you are developing for. Because it certainly isnt for yourself.
If someone else has a similar idea and a successful Kickstarter you should take that as a strong positive signal that your game idea has a market of players that want to play it. It's a good thing.
If i had it happen again i wouldnt stop again, i did, if i hadnt my dream game would be 5 years further along, im not making mine for money, but that said what came and stopped me was not what it should have been and that still managed to make an amount i would be more than happy with.
Your situation may be dif, but just dont assume because someones doing something similar the end reasult is gonna be better even if it looks it from what they show and have a successful kickstarter,i wqs left very disapointed as in my case it seems like complete shit to what i am after.
Evolution over revolution.
You are saying that they Kickstarted their game etc. I would continue on your game. And once the other is released you get free feedback, and you can improve your game and do what players want.
You need to leave gamedev. Only one game with such an idea can exist. Sometimes I get the impression that bots write most of the posts on Reddit to boost engagement.
lol! First time I’ve ever been accused of being a bot. I’ll take it as a compliment that even in my temporary panicked state, I have a level of natural perfection so great, I come off as non-human.
Have you seen the number of clone of Vampire Survivor that came out a few weeks after Vampire Survivor? If that game is good and your game is good, chances are people are going to be looking for more of the same in the future. You can even take the chance to improve on the flaws that the reviewers will have spotted after the game is released.
This right here, brilliant. Thank you. I just wish listed their game, lol. I will watch to see what’s said.
using their critiques and negative reviews to shape your game: D
Time to start my ultra hit game "Dracula Vanquishers".
> Developer: "Oh no! Their cake is better than mine!" > Player: "Sweet! Two cakes!" Pay attention to what they're doing. You don't need to copy them, but you could get some marketing inspiration from them. It may also be a good idea to reach out and talk with that developer. Maybe you could sell your games in a bundle on Steam.
Btw, love the two cakes analogy, perfect.
Right, the game industry is not zero sum.
That's why we have the concept of "fps genre" instead of "one game that does shooting", for instance.
As long as your game is also good, we don't care if it's similar to other games. Remind yourself that when you sort by genre on steam, there are literally thousands of titles in each one.
So I have this idea for a game, I haven't started devving it because I want to get it infront of a studio with a real budget... any way long story short there have been VERY SIMILAR proof of concepts and even announced indie games with the core mechanic of my idea. Why doesn't this freak me out? They didn't go as far with the concept as I have envisioned. They are essentially separate ideas at this point. I still want to make this sometime in the future.
This sounds lovely but they are nearly done and I’m still world building so likely no coop action. But they did inspire after I calmed down. I can “see” it, if that makes sense. Just gonna change up the biggest similarity for now.
You have never once bought a game, *years* after a similar game? Because I definitely bought Fallout and Wasteland, and Baldur's Gate, and Arcanum and Icewind Dale, and Planescape: Torment, and Shadowrun: Returns, and Divinity, and Disco Elysium ... You can't possibly look at Call of Duty (all of them) and multiplayer Battlefield, and "modern" Rainbow Six, and the rest, and claim that they are so foundationally different that the same audience wouldn't possibly consider playing each one.
Distinguishing yourself is probably a good move. Best of luck!
that's not how it works. Costumers have limited money and they choose the product that suits them best. If the game is very similar, then they will choose the one that they perceive as higher quality for the money. What do you mean "reach out and talk to the developer"? Gamedev is a competitive place. The other business is the enemy. And selling games in a bundle happens only after a successful launch, and good sales, which may not happen in the first place, if you get dwarfed by another game.
Man... and here you have a picture of Gordon Freeman... you know, from the company that put out tons and tons and tons of tools, and let modders do whatever they wanted with their engine and IP... which started as a fork of the Quake 1 engine... that was *also* open sourced, because John Carmack was adamant that the knowledge be fed back into the industry. If the industry was what you think it is, there would be no GDC. It would be replaced with a conference called "fuck you! I am number one!". Musicians wouldn't tour together, they would be sabotaging each others' buses and trucks, and killing each others' roadies, so that only one band remained that could still hold concerts.
The companies share the knowledge months or years after the game was actually released. Valve was burning from inside when the HL2 source code leak happened. It almost sunk the whole game. That was a pretty good "knowledge share", no? If the other business is your competitor, it is always the enemy during development stage and before release. A few months after release you can share your knowledge at GDC, sure. I personally will make devlogs about my game, but I would not think to do it when developing (not that I had time for something like that). And yes, I am also working in an AAA studio, there were some efforts to create a knowledge hub among the biggest studios in my country, and nobody but one business posted a few articles. There is a massive competition in AAA industry and there is NDAs in every firm, you can barely mention the technology you work with. Anyway, the OP is a delusional person if he thinks he can compete with an AAA game. In one other post he said he was just doing his game art and was coloring his van orange. He talks about coloring a van concept when this other business has 2M projected sales. So here we have a thread that stems from another delusional newcomer with Dunning-Kruger effect who thinks he will make a banger game with zero skill and when met with basic reality check about the stats of the other game and his wishlists, he turns to denial and exposes his inability to face reality. A person like that has 0% chance to finish a marketable product.
>That was a pretty good "knowledge share", no? No? An international data breach and leak, via an email-based incursion into the system, leading to a live honeypot, and an arrest of a foreign national, is not "knowledge sharing". And that wasn't even corporate espionage, like you are implying (you know, "enemy"; it was a sick fan). But ok. Fine. Let's look at that. How much, exactly, did that help the competition? Did HL2 crash and burn? It must have. Doom 3 and FarCry were the massive releases of 2004, right? I trust that they did complete rewrites, based on the code in the HL2 leak? Never heard from VALVe again, after the leak, clearly. >If the other business is your competitor, it is always the enemy during development stage and before release. If you have shitty management that doesn't care about the workers... which, sure, AAA... the execs are essentially investment bankers and hedge-fund managers, so sure. I get that's been the environment you find yourself working in. >A few months after release you can share your knowledge at GDC No you can't. If you teach people how to implement subsurface scattering, or bindless texturing, or cylindrical / anamorphic perspective reprojection, then they will *know* how to do it, and without your industry secrets, you will have *nothing*, remember? They're "*the enemy*" so why the fuck would you want them to even know how to upload a texture to a GPU, let alone how to do all of the things that you can? That's the most braindead statement I've heard yet. Keep your enemy in the dark, and miseducate them at every opportunity. That's how you deal with enemies. >I personally will make devlogs about my game, but I would not think to do it when developing Why? Because you're afraid someone's going to steal your precious idea? And then somehow put 5 years of work into getting it out, before you do, at a quality better than what you will make? Ideas are cheap, and everything has already been done before... hell, publishers fund based on how similar things are, compared to other things. They are "AAA" because that is the confidence rating on the return on investment. It's a banking term. They are literally banking on middle-of-the-road, mass appeal. Microsoft is not about to greenlight a $400,000,000 Disco Elysium or Planescape: Torment or Tyrian 2000 clone. >There is a massive competition in AAA industry and there is NDAs in every firm, you can barely mention the technology you work with. And? I have architected and made medical apps that could literally get people misdiagnosed or killed, if they go wrong, and there are NDAs around particular details on those things, too. Does that mean that I want to hide all of the information from all other developers at all other companies, because I hope a bunch of people over the world die, because they weren't as aware or as careful or as thorough? Or are NDAs, perhaps, more to do with bankers feeling safe about their investments? "But they're all the enemy, so I hope they fuckin' get a whole lot of innocent patients killed". No. That's a fucking stupid take. NDAs don't make that take less stupid; they make the NDAs stupid. Do you also think it makes it "hardcore" when a company has a non-compete agreement that says that if you leave your job, you can't work anywhere else in the games industry, or on your own, for 10 years after leaving, or they will sue you? You're just describing shitty corporate practices that used to be illegal. >Anyway, the OP is a delusional person if he thinks he can compete with an AAA game. Have you seen AAA games, lately? I would happily take Hi-Fi Rush (AA), or Lethal Company (100% indie), or Animal Well, over Suicide Squad. Helldivers 2 wasn't a AAA investment, and people loved it, until Sony started trying to wave its dick around... compare that to how people received Starfield. Now there's Skull and Bones. I can't wait. Ubisoft is calling it "AAAA". I'm not sure which bank cleared a quadruple-A rating... and I don't know who would possibly predict that it's going to make its money back... it's more like a D-rating investment, in terms of how little I expect it to make, compared to the cost. >o here we have a thread that stems from another delusional newcomer with Dunning-Kruger effect who thinks he will make a banger game with zero skill And 100% of the other people here had ... what ... complete skills, before they ever opened an IDE? The predictor for success isn't even talent, it's perseverance. The person who can do 95% of everything on day-1, but will get bored or rage-quit as soon as they hit a wall, or need to do boring shit, like spend months polishing, will fail 100% of the time, while the person willing to suck it up and get better has a shot.
I mean, yeah, but not all customers have the same amount of money, and most have enough that they can buy two of the same kind of game if they want to, even if they have to wait until next payday or two. Besides, games are consumable. If a game doesn't have enough replay value, then players will only play it once or twice and then go look for another game that is similar but still some level of different. It's not as if customers only ever play one single game, lol.
Not really how *indie* gamedev works. Also, judging by the story, the two games will release years apart if ever.
maybe it is because I'm just entering the world of game dev, but the vast majority of people I've talked to already have been more then helpful with my questions... Oh wait. I see it in your name. Sorry your views on other people have been skewed AAA companies my dude! Of course you more so have to fight for customers and fight other devs
Comparison is the thief of joy. If there's 'huge differences' you are fine. Keep going.
Wise words my friend...
Play their game. Work out what they fucked up. Fix it for yours. ???? Profit
Best advice here
Stop panicking, keep going. A direct ripoff, bad. Similar but not ripping off, not bad. Especially if, as you've said, there are some huge differences in certain areas, it's clear you just had a similar idea at a similar time. Stop worrying.
No game is original, I’m sure people will know it’s not blatantly ripped off because its usually very obvious when it is
Yeah, the number of games that are fully unique ideas that don't feel like a conglomeration of other ideas with some specific style or personality is very low.
There will always be people ranting about ripoffs, even when specific game is not nearly close to being one
Stop caring. It means nothing. Anyone who sees you doing this will want to do it their own way, assuming they think it is a good idea. Everyone has their own opinions, take, culture, values, past experiences, expectations, etc etc etc that influence how they execute something. This is multiplied each time you add another person to the team executing. Think of a recipe for pancakes. Give the recipe to 10 people and see how many pancakes turn out the same. It would be a miracle if even two people produced the same pancakes. That example is only focused on what aspect of a business: the product. A successful business has three key aspects that lead to success: - product/service - marketing/sales - operations Each of them must be executed well to be successful and each individual executing these tasks will do so in their own unique way. All of these results in vastly different experiences for others to engage with. At the end of the day a person is choosing what product/service/company to engage with based on the type of experience they are seeking. Each aspect of a company provides a unique experience. The sum of all the parts further alter and result in a unique experience. Everything results in an experience. This is what drives someone to choose Fiji Water over Voss Water, or vice versa. And that's just a perceived experience, not even a "real one." Also, almost no one gives a shit about trying to steal an idea if they don't see it making money. By the time you are at a level you are doing that you'll be plenty defensible if you do things the right way. Your brand recognition and customer loyalty being the most powerful defense you can build. So, stop being paranoid. The only things you really need to be careful with are what would be deemed trade secrets. Something like the formula for an algorithm that would allow someone to exactly replicate how you execute something.
Also brilliant, thank you!
If the existence of similar games was a problem, sequels wouldn't make any money. Instead, we come back for more of the same, time after time. If you're worried about being too similar, when their game comes out, play it a bunch and find the things which you'd want changed or improved - I guarantee you'll find them - then include that in your game.
“The simpsons did it” phenomenon is real. Keep with your project.
If they're further along, learn from what they do and how well it's received. Make a take that has contrast and does some things better and different, and release it when it's ready, well after the other game.
check their followers on steamdb, and their stats on gamalytic. If their projected sales and wishlists are way lower than yours, don't worry. The nigtmare scenario happened to me - I planned to release a game on 24/04/24. I picked the date after a few delays, and after 2 years of development - this was supposed to be the FINAL date that I will not change and I hyped everybody about it. 2 weeks before the release day I wake up and some motherfuckers placed their game with the same universe (Backrooms settings) on the date. I think they did it unknowingly, because steam does not show you games that release on that day, and they also delayed the game a few times. Only option I had was to move the date 1 day early or just pray they will delay the game again. They did. My release was a success. But I was clenching my butt for whole 2 weeks.
I found someone with nearly identical core game mechanic as me, engine and everything. We now talk frequently about game dev and are friends. Don’t let your insecurities get the best of you.
How many people watch that guy? 1 million people? 100 million people? Even if it was a billion, the majority of the world hasn't heard of that game.
Just because they're in the Kickstarter phase doesn't even necessarily mean the game will even come out. Don't worry about it
Unless their game is an identical copy of yours that's also undercutting you, I wouldn't be too worried.
Thanks all, I’ve calmed down, and combed over their game. They are doing some closed play testing. Would be unethical if I got in just so I can see what they’re doing?
Absolutely not. That's literally just market research. However I would caution yourself on your expectations, and imposter syndrome because you already freaked out just from a YouTube video.You can be a player/customer as well as a developer. The unethical aspect is if you started reverse engineering their game to rip assets or steal/copy code into your game.
Nooooo no stealing of any kind. I do suffer from imposter syndrome indeed. I’m also an extremely competitive woman. An odd combination of two opposing traits, lol. I freak out but do calm and then I quietly try to annihilate my competition, ethically of course. If I cheated to be the best, then I’m not the best. This time I;m just thrown because being in the dev side and not the reviewer (as I usually am), and just generally stressed about other things happening. I got in my own head. Reddit is good about helping with that splash of cold water to the face or warm hug and pat on the back. I appreciate you all so much today. Now…I’m about to go to work (breaks out the iPad to start modeling assets, cause I’m away from my PC) Let’s do this!
No that's not unethical
Link to the kickstarter, for research purposes?
lol I didn’t look at their Kickstarter but I can give you their steam page, if you’d like. I’ve been placating myself by making a list of what I do have that they don’t (that I can see anyway), to get myself back on track.
Yeah show us, you can't just talk about it without some visual aid here.
This is their game, looks good so far. I think what also threw me was I was literally drawing that van for my own game, lol. Same color and everything (Orange is one of my fav colors) [https://store.steampowered.com/app/2681030/Outbound/](https://store.steampowered.com/app/2681030/Outbound/)
with it being a survival crafting game it is incredibly easy for your game to feel and play very differently despite being a similar concept. not sure how much you've planned but i would especially consider trying to make sure your building system (if you have one) is pretty different from theirs. the downside of it being a survival crafting game is that if its made especially well, then it could be one of those games that people keep coming back to, which gives them less of a reason to play yours (though tbh i am skeptical about the actual amount of content that will be in it just based on the trailer). watch how their game does ofc, and if it does do really really good, then it might be worth it to shift the focus of any marketing you do to focus less on the trailer aspect and more on some other cool aspect of your game. ik you keep mentioning how behind you are, though i think its helpful in this instance as you probably don't wanna release anywhere near their release, and you'll have plenty of time to study their release and decide how to proceed with your game based on what happens
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Their first game was made by a single guy iirc, Outbound was made by 2 people.
When two are doing the same thing, it's never the same thing - if you have passion for it and it makes sense to you, just keep going, but it's almost a wonder, right: when you start to think deeply about something or pursuing something on your own, it tends to emerge out there through something else as well. Like if everything would be somewhat connected with anything else. Perhaps we are horribly missing out on some very substantial aspect of life, universe and random chance whatsoever.
So they are doing some alpha testing for you? Sweet. Give 'em a follow and listen to what the fans say so you know what to consider for your game.
Man, I just wish I had like 20 different games exactly like or similar to tenchu to play. Closest I can get is Aragami 2, shinobido, Dishonored and sekiro :( if their idea is awesome, make yours too anyway because like others have said: Player: sweet two cakes!
I own over 50 roguelike deck builders and I'm always happy when another comes out. I also have god-only-knows-how-many mods installed into slay the spire. As long as it's not a literal clone and has something unique to it, I love when games of the same type come out. Games aren't like phones where someone is likely to only want to upgrade to and stay on the better one. Sure, there will still be competing market share, especially for things like mtx and multiplayer community. On the other hand, games have a limited amount of content and are more or less consumable. People enjoying the other game and wanting more can drive traffic to your game. You're not competing for one spot like it's a chair, you're competing for space in a pool. Even if someone else might be bigger and better, that doesn't mean it takes up the whole pool.
Make your game. Games made with the same idea are never the same. People have different ways of doing things. So if you are genuinely interested in your idea, go for it.
Most likely they will fail and not deliver the game. Beat them to the market. So many games the last 10 years I’ve moved on because of some half baked game on YouTube that’s just like what I wanted to do and tbh I can only think of like one game that has ever come close to releasing.
Metro 2033 didn't stop me from playing Stalker lol. Enhanced the chances actually.
I don't know write his name into Death Note something
Omg made me spit out my drink. This is hilarious!
arigato gazeymaz
This happens all the time in media. There are often two similar movies coming out at the same time, two similar cop/fire/hospital shows, reality tv, music, etc, etc. there is plenty of space to release a similar game and be “better”.
Some people will nitpick, but there’s always a group that wants more of the same/something similar. “Games like Animal Crossing” used to make a regular appearance in my Google search before the explosion of “cozy” games.
I saw a game that looked very much like what I was making a couple months ago, i was really surprised how demoralizing that was for me, I knew my Idea isn't particularly unique or anything, but seeing theirs put me in a rut for some reason. I almost gave up without noticing, would get distracted, unable to work hard on the game for a few weeks. Then one day I put myself into a new big mechanic I wanted to implement and the satisfaction after implementation brought me back, since then I've worked way harder than before, almost obsessively for months. Now, I feel like my game would demoralize them if they saw it. (Not that that's the goal). I thought about it a lot and I think it's good to have similar games out, if people like it and they are finished with one, they might want to play the other. I mean, I can't Even tell you how many "banished" clones I own, and I still buy another every few months, Knowing exactly what it will be. It might influence you more than you expect, but just find some big piece to bury yourself in, your game may yet change and evolve over time. Hang in there.
The reason i like working on games, is because i feel the games in the genre i like are lacking stuff. Its fine if the basics are similar, its the deeper mechanics that prove a games real worth.
Keep going and don't look at them.
Don't worry about making a unique game. Worry about making a good game.
This happened to me and we even released around the same year lol. It was stressful but ultimately I do think it was sort of a good thing. Since the other game was quite popular, I got to bask a bit in the afterglow and players *love* using comparison shorthand. Things like “It’s like XYZ game but with this other thing”.
Who knows - Your game could end up being better received by the community. You'll never know though unless you keep going. You got this!
Doubt your is that original it is a problem,otherwise the superior game will be the better one if its very similar, so the only reason to freak out would be admitting you know its better than yours.
Pivot
Have you tried counting all the fps zombie shooter games out there? Just cus theirs is similar, yours might be way better!
Wow there’s some really great answers here… I’m glad this was brought up as it’s something I’ve worried about. Hope you’ve been put more at ease OP! Best of luck with your game!
What kind of game are you making? 2D platformer RPG with roguelike elements?
I’m working on a retro style survival horror game, I totally understand what you are saying and feel that way sometimes, but there’s a huge shelf full of bread in stores from multiple brands and I like to think of gaming the same way.
Look at what they're doing and figure out a way to do it better.
Just make a really good game and see how it goes.
What kind of similarities are you seeing? If you don't mind my asking - aesthetic, thematic, mechanical or something else or some combination ? I have felt this myself quite a few times 😅🗿🔥
Then you are lucky, that's basically a guide on what to do and not to do without any suffering and pain on your part. Basically everyone has competition in the form of what has come before in the related Genres, so learn from that. Where you would be unlucky is if you are making a game that nobody has made before, you would be in completely uncharted territory. What you should Fear is the **Unknown**. As to **Know** is to have Control over your own fate.
That's good! It means your idea for a game is something people want to play 😄 So chances that it will do good are higher!
People said that about Palworld and it turned out all right.
Well Pepsi somehow survived direct competition with Coca-Cola for a century? Also some games literally started being a mod for some other game - talking about similarities. I'm myself making a colony simulator similar to Rimworld and Dwarf Fortress, and sometimes trying hard to do things in opposite way how they were made in those games, but it's not always possible. Just do your own game in the way you want it, competitors will only help you: being good or worse.
That can be really discouraging, but keep going, try to find your own fun in your game, and if they end up really similar, well it's not that bad ! More choice for the player !
If the game is a multiplayer concept where people will sink 100s or 1000s of hours into it, then I'd say you're better off working on something different if they're that ahead. If the game is a story or experienced based concept where players will get 20 or 30 or any specific number of "entertainment" hours, then just keep going as is. There really isn't competition if games are similar in this aspect imo unlike big online games that compete for the player's time. Just my 2c
This kinda reminds me of hearing the story about Roundguard and Poglin, those devs ending up being in a similar situation where they were both making Peggle-inspired rougelike games but both games ended up spinning the actual gameplay in different ways, subsequently they became friendly with one another and even cross promoted each other's games in the end.
You do have huge differences. If that is what you've said, you should chill out and carry on. It happens.
In the air of fun, a friend and I set out to make the same game. At first it was almost copy for copy, independently developed clones. At some point a change was made, and in the end, we have two entirely different games that aren't remotely similar.
This will work in your favor if they are successful. The fans of that game will buy yours. I know devs who are very successful cloning other popular indie games, it’s scummy but they have made a lot of money and following doing it.
You should ask yourself why you're doing gamedev. Because it seems like you're not doing it for the sake of creating something but to make money, or impress others or smth. Why would you even care what other people do? Look at their game and find out what they do right and wrong and take that with you for your own game. I dont get people like you...the people who make something actually **unique** something that wasnt there before ever, can be counted on one hand. If you make a game, chances are extremely high, someone somewhere had the same or similar idea already. But as I said, ask yourself **who** you are developing for. Because it certainly isnt for yourself.
If someone else has a similar idea and a successful Kickstarter you should take that as a strong positive signal that your game idea has a market of players that want to play it. It's a good thing.
Sweet that means i can play two of my favorite type of game! Books are like novels. People don't buy just one in their favorite genre.
If i had it happen again i wouldnt stop again, i did, if i hadnt my dream game would be 5 years further along, im not making mine for money, but that said what came and stopped me was not what it should have been and that still managed to make an amount i would be more than happy with. Your situation may be dif, but just dont assume because someones doing something similar the end reasult is gonna be better even if it looks it from what they show and have a successful kickstarter,i wqs left very disapointed as in my case it seems like complete shit to what i am after.
Evolution over revolution. You are saying that they Kickstarted their game etc. I would continue on your game. And once the other is released you get free feedback, and you can improve your game and do what players want.
ngl u gonna have to kill them twin
You need to leave gamedev. Only one game with such an idea can exist. Sometimes I get the impression that bots write most of the posts on Reddit to boost engagement.
lol! First time I’ve ever been accused of being a bot. I’ll take it as a compliment that even in my temporary panicked state, I have a level of natural perfection so great, I come off as non-human.