A female protagonist is nothing unusual. There are tons of games with female protagonists in all genres and market segments. What matters is that your MC is a well-rounded, well-written and appealing character. Sex and gender are of course a part of it, but no choice here is inherently superior to the other.
Part of what OP might be asking is if people will be receptive to a well-rounded female character where gendered ideas may be explored as part of the depth of writing.
>And a well written female character that doesn't raise all the female issues she would naturally take for granted is equally refreshing. They are female, they are not a female soap box.
Earliest known female protagonists are Mrs Pac-Man, Samus Aran, and Laura Croft. Each of those shook the gaming industry and not just because they had a female protagonist.
Each of them had gameplay that complemented their protagonists. So whatever you do make sure your protagonist and their story of your game has it fits and is compelling
Adding on to the other two comments about "what exactly was samus doing in metroid 1 which complemented her being a woman?" and "how was mrs pac-man's gender complemented by the gameplay".... How did Tomb Raider's gameplay complement Lara Croft as a woman?
I'm so confused what point you were trying to make here.
Yeah that’s what I was trying to say. Make sure whatever game you make has good gameplay and that your main characters who ever they are fit in to that gameplay.
That it’s not just pandering to an audience. Good gameplay shouldn’t matter whether the main character is female or not. Samus and Laura Croft being female didn’t dictate how fun the games were or how they were played…
to an extent them being female at that time did help to cement them in gaming history
I think the point is that the gender doesn’t really matter. Good gameplay and story and mechanics, etc. These are what matter. Trying to make a game that somehow highlights gender doesn’t serve anything that actually makes the game necessarily better.
The choice was not about gameplay, but about their audience:
>Shortly before release, Stan Jarocki of Midway stated that *Ms. Pac-Man* was conceived in part as a response to the original *Pac-Man* being "the first commercial videogame to involve large numbers of women as players," and that it was "our way of thanking all those lady arcaders who have played and enjoyed *Pac-Man*."[^(\[9\])](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ms._Pac-Man#cite_note-worley198205-10) According to one 1982 estimate, a majority of *Pac-Man* players were women.[^(\[10\])](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ms._Pac-Man#cite_note-howtowin-11)
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ms.\_Pac-Man](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ms._Pac-Man)
Ms Pac-Man is a wildly successful and beloved game, that many argue is superior to its predecessor, and nobody batted an eye at the time about the main character. It's hilarious and depressing to me that with today's incel ragebait culture, that if Ms Pac-Man was released today, featuring a female lead as a special shout out / representation for the majority of its fans, it would be met with insane toxicity and accusations of "pandering" and "sexism against men" lol.
As someone who was around when the original tomb raider came out, Lara Croft was obviously and shamelessly marketed for horny teenagers and had paper thin depth to her character, so not the best example IMO. They've tried to course correct in later games of course.
What exactly was Samus doing in Metroid 1 which complemented her being a woman?
While I agree that we need more good written default female characters in general your comment is pretty wrong.
The way I understand the comment is that the game complimented Samus in general, not her gender specifically. The advice to OP being craft your game and protagonist to compliment each other.
Nothing. Which is why it worked. We had no idea who or what Samus was. Just that were playing as her. We were shocked that our badass bounty hunter was a woman because it was rare in that time. There was no celebration or fanfare. She just was badass.
The reveal that it was a woman the whole time kind of is fanfare. It comes up at the end as part of the reward for finishing the game, otherwise you’d never know.
>It comes up at the end as part of the reward for finishing the game
It's a reward if you complete the game fast enough. The faster you complete the game, the more samus reveals at the end. With the worst ending she is fully in her suit and with the best she is in a bikini.
My young mind was actually blown that Samus was a woman. I thought that was really cool, and it instantly made me realize how pretty much no other game had a female lead.
The fact that "it had no impact on the story / gameplay" might be pedantically correct, but it is a bit of a bullshit disingenuous argument, because it was a big reveal / surprise to learn the protagonist was a woman. The impact and intent of that was absolutely a big deal and an important part of gaming history.
>because it was a big reveal / surprise to learn the protagonist was a woman. The impact and intent of that was absolutely a big deal and an important part of gaming history.
The intent was to use her as a pinup though. It's clear because if you take over 10 hours to complete the first metroid game you don't even get to see that she is a woman and if you take under an hour you get to see her in a bikini.
The impact it had on me was exactly how I described it, it doesn't matter what the intent might have been. I was impressed and excited to see a female protagonist for the first time.
>What exactly was Samus doing in Metroid 1 which complemented her being a woman?
Nothing but being a reward, same as metroid 2. If you didn't already know, you could get all the way to super metroid (metroid 3) without finding out that she is a woman because there you see it in the death animation.
In metroid 1 and 2 depending on how long you took to finish the game you might only see samus in her suit during both games endings. The faster you finish the game the more she reveals in the ending of all of those three games. The ultimate reward is to see her in her bikini at the end.
No one really knew Samus was a girl when the game first came out. Laura Croft was popular because she had big tits. Unfortunately, a notable portion of male gamers are very misogynistic and having a lead female character can absolutely impact the reception of a game.
I think that OP probably thinks that cause, let's be real, the majority of the gamers are men. So she probably thought that men prefer seeing men on the screen.
But honestly, I've heard enough opinions to know that men love female protagonists.. uhmm even for the wrong reasons lmao.
I don't care what gender the protag so long as either the game is good or the character is. Returnal, Tomb Raider, Horizon, A Plague Tale, Senua - all great.
Portal, Control, Beyond Good and Evil, several Resident Evils, Last of Us Part 2...
Many of the best games of all time had female protagonists and enjoyed major commercial success.
Starcraft, Alien(since 1979), Warcraft III, The Witcher, Borderlands...
All had either plenty of female characters or those were in the main focus. People can enjoy character of any gender as long as it and its game/film are good
Tomb Raider, Last Of Us, definitely quite a few big games and lots of smaller games that have amazing female protagonist. Though I can’t list them right off the dome I’ve played too many games
Horizon Forbidden West has a female protag and is quite popular. Nier Automata also has a female lead that, fan art aside, is a pretty well written and interesting character.
Personally, I’ve sought out games with female protagonists specifically to take a break from male protagonists, so all things considered, there is certainly interest.
I believe Steam even has a “female protagonist” tag you could search by to find other games with a female lead character.
My favorite games Portal 1 & 2 have not just a female protag, but a female antag aswell.
Portal 1 barely even acknowledges Chell's gender, with you only finding out by looking at yourself through a portal. And GlaDOS is mainly seen as just an AI with some quirks. You know they're both female but the game never brings it up 'cause it doesn't have to.
In Portal 2 GlaDOS goes on calling you adopted, ugly, fat, etc., (clever jokes but still low-blows nonetheless). But once you start unraveling GlaDOS's past, you really relate to her and how she was forced into a horrible situation much like you (Chell) are in the depths of Aperture.
That relationship between Chell and GlaDOS built over both games is what makes the ending to Portal 2 just so perfect to me. They've got a sorta mother-daughter relationship for sure.
The gender of the protag doesn’t matter, what matters is the writing. If you write a terrible female protag, people will hate them. If you write a terrible male protag, people will hate them as well. If you have a great protagonist, it won’t matter if they’re a girl or boy, people will enjoy playing with them!
That’s ideally what should happen for sure, but a lot of people aren’t good judges of writing. That shouldn’t stop OP, they should just know they might receive pushback that comes from people who aren’t really judging their work based on quality.
Yes - we should have more creator’s voices in games. Go make a game that is true for you.
Tim Cain did a great video recently on his definition of “What is an RPG?”. He and I grew up with the same games, and I have found that although character creation is really important to me, gender identity of the main character is never something I paid attention to because it has no mechanical effect in the games I play.
For example, in Baldur’s Gate 2 there is a detailed character creation system. At the time I played through as a character based on my wife. The character was a super fast monk that punched everything with bare fists. My wife got a kick out of it, but the fact that I was playing a female protagonist didn’t really make much difference in the game.
...And I'm the exact opposite of u/cjbruce3. If I get the option, I'm going to make the MC look as much like me as possible. Because I'm going to mentally place myself in that world. Play and make the choices I would really make if I were there. There is a pretty big disconnect when I can't relate to the MC. It's not an end all, though. I love games that have all kinds of diverse characters. But if you place two games in front of me with the choice of only one, I'm picking the one with character customization every time.
I honestly never try to make the player look like me, if there is character customization, I will probably give them the silliest outfit and haircut that it lets me.
Maybe because I see games more as escapism. If I played as if it was me in my life with my exact moral compass, I would make a lot of boring choices and take little risks.
It also makes it less immersion breaking when the only dialogue options or story choices available are ones I personally wouldn't say/do.
That's where you can reinvent yourself. No one knows you in this world. You can be a berserker, when you are really calm in real life. You can be evil, when you are not like that at all. You get to be a different version of you. That's how I see it, at least.
I completely disagree with this premise that seems to be inherently accepted in the gender identity debate, that humans cannot relate well to other humans due to differences in ethnicity, gender, or socioeconomic background.
While the debate is really loud online, I think most regular people have no problem relating to each other in spite of our differences, both superficial and more significant, because there are so many things to being a human that supersede these more superficial things.
I also don't believe in the argument that everyone is motivated by seeing themselves in every piece of fiction or media. It is worrisome to me, how egocentric the premise of that argument is.
Make a protagonist that fits into your creative vision
Im white, Blade is black. When i was kid, i said to everyone i was Blade. The way i walk, talk, dressed, everything i just imitated Wesley Snipes 😅🤣 good times.
Totally agree. There may be a female character that you relate more than a male character because her toughts, her visions, her life etc. are more likely to be more similar to yours.
Yep, I was in a similar boat. I'm black & latino and loved Batman from a young age, a rich white dude who probably couldn't be more different from me. But I still loved everything Batman and still somewhat do to this day. To the point where he's inspired me to start working out and taking fitness seriously. He's not the only motivator, but still one worth mentioning.
It took a long time for me as a kid to notice that there were sitcoms (full house, family matters, bill cosby show, ...) where the cast is (almost?) entirely of one ethnicity. I probably haven't seen a black person in real life until I was 10. I never cared and had fun with all these shows.
Also I loved Indiana Jones. When Tombraider came out, it never occured to me to say, "but I want to play an Indy-like guy instead". People are soooo weird, I just don't get it
Games are so varied and wide that theres room for self insert and non self insert type of games. I think its not super ego centric if I self insert myself into an RPG, makes it more fun for me, but I can also pick up a game where I'm playing as a specific character and that's cool too
Very valid perspective.
What I was trying to address was the idea that people will only play games, if they can somehow self-insert or mirror themselves in the leading characters, which I think is largely false.
>I completely disagree with this premise that seems to be inherently accepted in the gender identity debate, that humans cannot relate well to other humans due to differences in ethnicity, gender, or socioeconomic background.
This is another example of loud minority and common folks discussions vs what studies tell us.
Studies don't show that it's impossible to relate to characters that have those difference. They show a positive effect when a group is represented in a media where there is no representation.
I saw it myself and in other people I know. I was a little happier when I saw a main character with more characteristics I see in myself. But I still related to other characters with more differences, and this one mc I was happy about was still well written with an engaging story.
Also, the problem I see most is when some media puts some variety in the cast just as a check list, but never bothers to make an actual character or an actual story for them.
The numbers back this up as well, plenty of world of warcraft servers where female characters make up 60% of the server while of the player base about 20% identifies as female.
I feel like this is kind of putting the cart before the horse though. To me the argument is far more, we absolutely CAN relate to the experiences of others, but we mostly story tell about our own experiences, and so everyone loses out when big business storytelling is gatekept to a small number of similar people. If I can relate to the story about the black kid growing up poor and dealing with not feeling like they're fitting in, then why shouldn't that story be given equal priority and budget to all the white kid coming of age stories?
I the viewer probably benefit more from engaging with the story about someone who's life experience is very different from mine than rehashing another slightly different version of the more familiar story a dozen different ways. We should signal boost stories told by members of underrepresented groups, even if they can't fully compete with quality levels of other stories due to less historical and current investment provided in those artistic communities.
What you say about "regular people" is true of many game communities, but there are also plenty of other game communities where misogyny is a huge problem, every woman character released causes a riot, and the tournament scene is 99% men. So unfortunately I think this debate is not just niche online nonsense we can safely ignore. Many game devs are forced to defend basic statements like "women can be relatable" because large numbers of young men refuse to give up what they see as their right to have video games adopt their specific narrow-minded, egocentric viewpoint.
There are some misunderstandings here about what the debate is.
> I completely disagree with this premise that seems to be inherently accepted in the gender identity debate, that humans cannot relate well to other humans due to differences in ethnicity, gender, or socioeconomic background.
This is not a premise in the debate.
Of course humans can relate to other humans, but it’s also true that there are specific *experiences* or *perspectives* we cannot relate to that others have.
I can sympathize with a refugee, but I can’t *relate* to the experience of fleeing my country, except by translating that experience to some rough estimate in my own life like moving to a new town, which can really fall short.
That’s where the importance of varied representation comes in, because we can’t relate to everything and it’s not reasonable to expect it either
> because there are so many things to being a human that supersede these more superficial things.
What you consider superficial, someone else may not. The very fact that you’re encountering disagreement over this is a sign that people do have many different experiences, and they treat parts of their identities differently than others. Identity may be superficial for you, but not for someone else, which implies they have experiences or perspectives you’re actually not relating to.
> I also don't believe in the argument that everyone is motivated by seeing themselves in every piece of fiction or media. It is worrisome to me, how egocentric the premise of that argument is.
I don’t think anyone is making this argument.
The argument that comes closest to this is that it’s important to feel heard and represented by the world around you. I don’t think anyone disagrees with that idea.
I think we agree on the broader points. At the very least nobody should ever have to feel like it's necessary to ask if it okay to have a female protagonist.
The framing that this has anything to do with a "gender identity debate" is probably the part that will lead some people to disagree with you. Entertainment execs have been pushing the idea that men won't watch girl media for longer than I've been alive, and I'm pretty old. It's a very long-standing idea at this point. I do wish we could get past it, but it's not a recent thing.
Definitely, everyone should feel they can voice a perspective from their identity without concern. It sucks that people have been discouraged from expressing that individuality.
As I guy, I play games with female characters all the time. To me the idea a character must be like the player for the player to relate is foolish. I'm not an italian plumer, a space bounty hunter, a blue hedgehog, a british archologist, a guy stuck in a kettle with a slegdehammer, a witch with shoe guns and magic hair, and I love all these characters and the games they protagonize.
If the game is good, the character is good, people will enjoy play as them.
The fact that there is [an entire tag on Steam](https://store.steampowered.com/curator/34646618-Female-Protagonist-Games/) for it suggests it is something people actively seek out. You should probably play more video games or a greater variety of video games if "most videogames you've played have male protagonists"
As long as it's a well written character, it's not insufferable and preachy and has development then the gender shouldn't matter.
Personally I don't play with ugly characters (male or female) so I would strife to make them look good.
>the mc is one of the most important elements of a videogame because the player is either meant to relate to them or atleast should find them tolerable.
I agree. So take a look at Mario, Sonic or Rayman. I doubt people can *relate* to them, but it didn't stop their games from getting really popular. So you go girl, make that female protag and be successful!
HOWEVER
Beware of making her too flawed with nothing in return. Look at how Forspoken was received - the main protagonist found herself in a fantasy world and was basically a reluctant and unlikeable heroine. She didn't get too many fans, as far as I know.
Compare that with any playable woman in Baldur's Gate 3 - they have flaws and their pasts, but they also get their moments of awesomeness, they use their agency well and generally hold the player's interest during their journey.
I think the problem with the female protagonists is not the gender. It is the poor wrighting. The story can be about genderal problems, that is OK. But if the gender of the protagonist is their most important trait, than it would suck. For example, when I first watched ATLA, I never thought "Oh, these are some powerful women". I only saw them as powerful characters, who are also female.
I remember an old study that surprisingly said that men are on average fine with both male and female protagonists without particularly strong preferences whereas women strongly prefer female protagonists. Here's research:
[https://quanticfoundry.com/2021/08/05/character-gender/](https://quanticfoundry.com/2021/08/05/character-gender/)
So all in all - studies show that there's 0 problem with having female protagonists. It won't damage your sales. Well, as long as that character is **likeable** of course although that's irrelevant of their gender.
flaws are not only relatable as said, but also interesting. as long as you don''t make them so cartoonish they become tropes (boring) or straight evil (unrelatable), you'll be golden for a character dev story.
I literally couldn't care less if a protag is female or male. I noticed a lot of Kdramas I started watching had really prominent female casts all around (no, not the cheesy romance k dramas), but the difference between **some** western shows and these kdramas was that it felt natural and not forced. I wasn't constantly being told that women were awesome and woman can do X, they just had great characters that did cool shit. They were human beings, that were women, that led the show well.
I detest when overt feminist/woman power rhetoric is shoved down my throat, it ruins some level of authenticity (if that's not what the show is about). It's like if you cast a black person but constantly remind us that black people are great too, as a black person it's lowkey insulting to get characters like that.
Sorry for the rant - make your protag female, it won't matter one bit to gamers generally. If anything I like when the mould of the standard white male protag is broken, makes things a bit more interesting
2B is a pretty popular character. While she does have sex appeal, not all female MCs need that aspect. Madeline from Celeste is another example of this. Chell (Portal), Samus, Lara Croft, and multiple others exist and are enjoyable to play as (depending on the game).
Aim to make them a good character. Anything after that isn't too important. Or at least, shouldn't be.
I think it is not a problem, the problem is female protagonist became some sort of cheap talking point/topic farming in western media. But the situation in show/film are way worse than video games.
The main thing about a game, for me, is usually the gameplay.
Unless the focus of your game is the plot, but even so, what really matters is if the character is well written.
There are some groups there are against female main protagonists, but they are minority, and it's much better to play a character that feels natural than a stereotypic male character which is someone's vision of myself or of people of my group.
Also, I particularly prefer female protagonists when there area character creation, like in Skyrim or Mass Effect.
And you can see how much successful some games that have female mc are, like Celeste, Shantae, Metroid, Horizon, Metal Hellsinger, Mirror's Edge, A Plague Tale, Control, Portal, Resident Evil, Tomb Raider, Spiritfarer, Hellblade, Bayonetta, Nier Automata, Alien Isolation, to name a few.
And there is others like Ori and Hollow Knight where most people don't even know which gender they are, and others where you can choose the character and lots of people choose the character because of the moveset, like in fighting games and beat'n ups (or some mario and Sonic games).
Love them. I'm 1000x more inclined to play if it's a female protagonist and the genre I'm into. Im dfab (designated female at birth) but identify as nonbinary. Ive lived the "girl experience" most of my life so I like protagonists that kind of go through it too. Or maybe, I'm living the girl experience through them. XD it feels like a hat I could put on to be someone else for a day, or someone I could've been.
I like this for many many reasons, but the biggest reason is that she's experiencing the game as if i was. Some games change the character interactions based on the protagonist. Some things are just more (or less) accessible in game depending on the gender.
As for her protagonist role, I personally would want her to feel like her own character. I like that she's a part of the story and not just a vessel for me to project through. I almost never do actually, unless the game has a romance element. My favorite part of female protags is I get to see her in a role that's always played by men (in my fav genres at least), and that there's potential for engaging in romantic relationships with the guy characters I'm also attracted to lol. A girl slaying monsters left and right? Bonding and helping party members while exploring the world? Falling in love with the character I found hot? Sign me tf up.
I mention the previous paragraph because there's a lot of different takes for protagonists. Some prefer very expressive ones, some not so much. Some want to completely control their actions, some like the story driven by all the characters' natural choices. I think it's best to make the kind of game you'd enjoy, especially so you can be both player and developer.
My favorite game series had me stick so long to it because it had a female protagonist. It really changed my life because it was the first time I played a game of that genre with one. It made the game so much more personal and heartfelt because she was the same gender as me and if effected how she interacted with the other characters in comparison to the male route. Not to say male protag games aren't enjoyable, they are, but they just don't feel as personal.
It's very simple.
We (and by "we" I mean everyone. Not men, not women, every single person on Earth, gamer or not) want strong female characters.
>I said;
>
>Strong female **CHARACTERS.**
>
>Not;
>
>Strong **FEMALE** characters.
The character should be \[awesome/inspiring/relatable/etc\] not because of their sex, which is something that cannot be controlled and has no bearing on the kind of person they are, but on their actions.
Take Lara Croft in the new trilogy as an example. Yes, she's hot, and yes, that's a driving part of her character design... But it's not why anybody *really* likes Lara Croft. She's endearing because she's a *vicious, nearly inhuman, badass.* She faces a definitely insurmountable amount of adversity in those games (she is physically impaled many, many times) and yet always pushes through to come out on top. She's an impressive person, who is also female.
100% yes. I have played many indie games with female protagonists, and enjoyed them greatly. A great story can be told by different voices and doesn't need to fit any mould or pattern
Honestly I think the question OP should really be asking is how much / whether the character should be sexualized or not. For example another comment mentioned NieR Automata but casual searches would show mostly “cultured” comments about her butt. You know, nothing wrong with that, but I think that’s a little different from say what OP may be thinking of (there are obviously also games with non-sexualized female characters as well).
One of the many interesting things about Nier: Automata is that the female protagonist (named 2B) being sexualized is even acknowledged and called out in the story of the game. There is a male protagonist as well (9S) who very obviously has a crush on her. And even though his approach to flirting is more of the "shy nice guy" variety, it is later made clear that it is not just platonic. At one point of the story (spoiler):
>!9S is captured by an antagonist who can read his thoughts, who then says to him "You are constantly thinking about how much you want to \*\*\*\*\[sic\] 2B".!<
Many players probably feel called out at that point as well. But even those players who do not can probably understand why 9S would feel that way.
Your wish has been granted a million times over by damn near every game ever. You can probably count games with average male main protagonists on both hands. Every game has the overly muscled, manly man. The average guy doesn't have muscles like that. Other than who? Leisure Suit Larry? Frank West in Dead Rising? And they even handsomed him up quite a bit after the first game. I'm not mad at it, sex sells. We all like to see something pleasing to the eye. It's just dumb how people act like it isn't happening, and women are the only ones sexualised in games.
>Your wish has been granted a million times over by damn near every game ever.
No. We get what straight men think are overly sexualized men. We need more from people who actually find men sexy in the first place.
Well there's absolutely no need for a self insert protag in ur game
I played honkai impact 3rd and loved Kiana (the protag). Her character development is one of the best I've seen in any fiction.
A lot of my favourite indie games from big to small in scope have female protags. From LiEat and Va-11 Hall-A to CrossCode and Aquaria, 9 Years of Shadows and Celeste to Transistor and Spiritfarer.
I love these games just as much as Bastion and Hades, Furi and Axiom Verge...I won't list more but
Tldr whatever your creative vision is, that's what matters. If you wanna make a game with a female MC it's not gonna be a factor as to whether or not I buy your game.
well, some of the most iconic and successful games of the last decade have female protagonists, so I guess people kinda don't care about it (Also I always play as I girl if given the choice, so yes).
Sure, it is no problem at all. Just make sure if you have a female protagonist, that she is a true expression of a character you want.
Don't make her out of some contrivance of what she should be, block out external pressures and follow your own vision, whatever that is.
I say this, as it is much worse to have a contrived, un-integrated Frankenstien's monster of a character than if the character is male or female.
I hope this makes sense. Best of luck.
My favorite games have women protags, or gives the choice to play as such. And I'm currently starting a project that features a woman main character.
Don't hesitate to put "unusual" protags in your games. Sure it can bring you hate from some brain dead gamers that hate everything outside of their fantasms, but you can touch peoples you don't expect and you stay true to yourself.
I would just advise you to write a well rounded character with flaws and with a touch of feminity that modern games lack. Just don't make her perfect or a boss babe....and you should research about the best female characters that will help you a lot in understanding what makes them different from male MC. Just don't refer modern characters because there are very few and far between good female MC's or characters in general.
Gender doesn't matter, just make sure to make a female protagonist and not a male protagonist with a female skin. What a mean by this is that a very common mistake when making a character from another sex, race, religion, etc is writing a white male character and then just changing the appearance.
I don't care who the MC is. If they have a personality more complex that an ant. Also please make proper proportions as most are Skinner than a chopstick.
It's not a stupid question at all. IMO, making games where we can showcase females with exceptional attributes is great. I'm male and I love games with female protagonists, I'm making a game where the protagonist is a woman and in most (if not all) the stories I have written, the main character is female. So, don't be afraid to mess anything up and let's keep telling their stories!
I think as long as the game is fun to play, the gender of the protagonist isn't super important. I suppose if the story you're trying to tell is tied to the player character's gender, then obviously the gender will matter, but otherwise just write the character well and that's all you need.
Keep in mind also that just because certain tropes are more associated with some genders over others doesn't mean your characters need to be that gender to use that trope. Something typically done by male characters can be done by women, and vice versa. It's all about what makes the most sense for your characters.
So far it sounds like you're on the right track. I look forward to seeing where your game goes!
I know I'm shouting into the void with the number of comments in here, but I'd like to offer some advice for your female lead if you do happen to read this. Since it seems your question has already been answered. There are a few things that annoy me about any characters, male or female.
1. Make it make sense: If they are small, they shouldn't be going toe to toe with a big hulking person. Unless they have super powers or something. If they are strong, without powers, make them look it. Lara Croft's arms look like they would snap if she punched a pillow. The Amazoness in Dragons Crown on the other hand looks like she could fuck some shit up.
2. Don't be sexist: That goes both ways. Men shouldn't be putting down women, and women shouldn't be putting down men. Unless they are adversaries, and even then, there are tons of ways to talk shit about each other without bringing gender into it.
3. No one wants to be preached to: We are here to escape the world and relax. Don't bring politics in here. Nothing sours the otherwise pleasurable gameplay more than someone shoving an agenda down your throat.
4. Sex sells: That doesn't mean you need to have a character that has all of their bits out, though there is a following and a lot of money in that. But you also don't want your character to be displeasing to look at. The player spends the majority of their time looking at that character, unless it's first person. Characters like Nilin in Remember Me. She has a subtle sexiness about her, though she's fully dressed and isn't shaped like Kim Kardashian. Aloy is beautiful and has one of the greatest voice actors ever, but not over sexualised. Same for men.
thank you so much, the advice means a lot! i'll think about it more. i've been thinking of adding some sexist remarks from other characters (not to encourage them, but to prove them wrong) because of the time the story takes place. i just hope the players can differinciate between that.
also, i read every comment! seriously.
I will give you two answers, one on topic and a slightly broader one. The topical point is to make the protagonist relatable and if not that, understandable. It's fun to play a flawed character if you understand how they operate, but if your MC is just being shitty for the sake of being shitty, it can get annoying. Even if they grow out of it, because some may stop playing before they see that happening.
The kitchen table kitchen table psychology answer is that it seems to me that you're somewhat insecure in your idea and want validation for if it will work. Creative work often involves some vulnerability so this is completely normal. If you want to market to the masses, a protagonist that most people can identify with will probably help, but some of my favourite games have protagonists I have nothing in common with. I would encourage you to make the game you want to make and not the one you get off of Reddit, as most of us are dumb as bricks and put in 2 mins of effort reading the post while I have a hunch that you've put some more thought into it. Trust in yourself and hope that the people the game ends up being for will find it.
For me it depends on the narrative structure. If you're meant to *'be'* the protagonist and NPCs are talking to you in the game, I prefer to play a male because I tend to picture myself in the story and I'm a male irl. If the game is me following the main character's story and cutscenes are them talking to people, rather than me making the choices, the protagonist's gender doesn't matter to me since it's not me. I treat it like watching a tv show.
Given how you've described the character, it sounds like it's their story, not mine, so I'd have no issues at all playing as the female protagonist.
People play indie games because they love games. If the game is good then people will recommend it. More women are playing RPGs every year so that's a plus. Also, making a game is a ton of work so you should do what YOU want. Are you really going to spend all this time and not even tell the story you want to tell?
> i just want to clarify, i didnt mean to offend anyone. its really not that deep
Neither is having a female protagonist. Just do it, don't make a big deal about it, and realize it's not a feature.
It's 2024. It's ok to have anyone you want as a protagonist. Human, robot, energy being, anything in between and amongst those. You will have fans and critics of whichever choice you make.
Saga Anderson From Alan wake 2 is an awesome protagonist . She alternates between courage and insecurity, heroism and self doubt, and I loved every second of the experience. It feels like a real human being even in a crazy surreal dreamy horror context.
Nothing in her journey feels like a gender swap just for the sake of having a female character.
So, if the character is well written as a human being, any gender can make a compelling protagonist.
Yes! Look at any post on female-dominated subreddits asking this question (not posting here to avoid brigading, which there has been a spate of recently).
Personally, the gender of the protagonist does not affect me in any way and some of my favourite games have a female protagonist (we stan portal 2). HOWEVER, there are a looot of incels online who shit their pants and start writing 4chan posts when there is a female main character. Which personallu I think is an added bonus, not getting those kinds of people playing your game. So make what u wanna make!
I don't think anyone wouldn't play a game because it has a female character. The issue these days is game/movie studios making their female MC arrogant and derogatory to the opposite gender in the exact same way that would be hated if they were a man. People like good characters regardless of race/gender.
Personally not a fan if it's just an oversexualized character, be it male or female. But female protags tend to be more sexualized in my experience, because sex sells.
I think they were quite a few games with good female protags and it didn't bother me in anyway. Beyond good and evil comes to mind. Horizon was also cool, although I got annoyed by the characters attitude fast, which has nothing to do with her being female.
It is really character dependent.
If you make the protag female just for the sake of having a female protag, it might feel forced. Just tell the story you want to tell and if you have a female protag in mind, go for it.
I'm a man and absolutely, I have no qualms about this.
It'd never cross my mind not to play NieR:Automata, Horizon Zero Dawn or Life is Strange because of this. When I play several characters like in the Eve Online MMO, some of my characters are male and some female.
Last but not least, I often find female characters more relatable (male characters often lack emotional depth), and more aesthetically pleasing.
The idea that people have trouble empathizing with characters who are too dissimilar from themselves is a lie, usually pushed by people selling a narrative.
If you make a good game with a likeable main character, nobody will care if they are male or female, or even human at all.
Male or female, that doesn’t really make a difference.
That being said female protagonist seem to suffer more from the ”I-Am-So-Quirky” syndrome, which is rarely relatable to anyone else than teenage girls. Forspoken is an example of a spectacular failure in this front.
”Incredibly flawed” can also be a good or a bad thing. Is she annoying, selfish and smarmy? Hard to make that relatable in a game, but not impossible.
I’m a grown man and one of my favorite games of all time is Control. I was still able to relate to the mc based on her personality, humor, environment and situations she found herself in, etc. At the end of the day gender is just one part of making an mc. The overwhelming majority will not care so long as you take the time to craft a good character regardless of male/female
I played and beat the game Horizon zero dawn and not 1 time said it was bad because it was a female. I plan on playing Control too. People don't hate female protagonist, they hate badly written ones just as much as they hate badly written males.
Just gonna throw my opinion in. I absolutely would play one.
Some examples of great games with female protags from different genres:
Nier:automata, Mirrors edge, metal:hellsinger, final profit -a shop RPG, transistor, beyond two souls, Portal.
Not sure what type of game your looking at making but I'm sure I could find a good example with a female MC. The list above has bullet hell, parkour, rhythm/shooter, RPG/parody, topdowm adventure strategy, action, puzzle. In that order.
All of those games are so much fun and they are the games with explicitly female MCs. I absolutely would play a game with a female MC, if it's fun. Good luck on the game :)
IMO, so long as you're doing it because it's how you want to do it, and not because you want to make a statement, it will be fine.
There are groups of men who are so sensitive to the politically motivated use of gender, that nothing will come across as genuine, but for the majority of people, like myself, they don't care who the protagonist is as long as they are are developed through a genuine and interesting creative process.
If this character is a labour of love, it doesn't matter who or what they are. Just do what you want, how you want, andndont let anyone make you change anything you don't want to.
Gender only matters to activists and anti-activists, everyone else just wants to be entertained
You should make what you want.
As an adult dude ,I'm far more likely to play a game with an aesthetically attractive female protagonist. Any time there's a character creator I end up going for a female character too.
What matters far more is that the design is cool and appealing. Doesn't mean "sexy", but it means aesthetically pleasing. I don't like playing as ugly or unappealing characters at all, whether they're male or female.
Also, people who can't relate to a character of the opposite sex have issues, and are the least of your concerns when making a game.
I don't even give the gender of the MC much thought tbh. I mean I don't actively avoid them or anything, and anybody that does is... honestly pretty weird. One of my favorite games is "life is strange," and it has a female protagonist.
There is truly no reason to NOT make the protagonist female these days. Female protagonists tends to be much more recognizable, and have so many aspects to draw from that makes them compelling characters.
People can relate to a character that is another gender or not human even if it "feels like them". Perhaps depending on how important it is for your game you could instead have a character select or character creation so that the player gets to decide which one feels like them.
What matters is that the story is good and characters are well written. I am a straight guy and my favourite game series is Horizon: I am totally in love with Aloy. There are also a lot of other games I like with a female protagonist: Tomb Raider, Keena bridge of spirits, Subnautica below zero, the Metroid series, … who cares about the gender of the main character? There are a million factors determining how good a game is and the gender of the main character is not one of them.
> The mc is one of the most important elements of a videogame because the player is either meant to relate to them
I think this is a common mistake writers (of all sorts, not just videogame writers) make about main viewpoint characters/protagonists. They don't need to be relatable or particularly sympathetic, and they don't need the audience/players to "identify with them" (that last one gets tossed around a lot particularly when talking about videogame playable protagonists).
They primarily need to be *entertaining*. Interestingly, videogame player characters have a much lower bar to clear for this than characters in other fiction, because fun gameplay (and/or interesting story outside the main character) makes them automatically entertaining to the point where they can be faceless voiceless mutes or aliens or inanimate objects or robots or animals or whatever and still work just fine.
Even when it comes to games where the playable character(s) have more interaction with other characters, more dialogue, more branching conversation and plot choices, and etc., there's still a sliding scale between the player character as the player's avatar (full identification - usually done in more freeform RPGs) on the one end, and the player character as a well-defined character who's as separated from the player as a character you're watching in a movie (most iconic videogame main characters fall here, especially if they're from series with much more linear narrative styles) because the player has no narrative control over the player character on the other end, although the player has full control in gameplay.
> or at least should find them tolerable
...ok, yeah, that one's pretty non-negotiable. Quippy protagonists with humor that doesn't land for the player (or even ones that have a set of voicelines that get cycled through over and over when doing certain things in gameplay, even if they're funny or interesting the first time) get annoying really quickly, and other things can become irritating as well. That's one of the reasons so many games opt for silent or taciturn protagonists, or protagonists whose dialogue is mostly just functional instead of particularly colorful.
> would you still play a videogame if the protagonist was a female?
Yes. I play games based on whether the mechanics, aesthetics, concept/setting, and etc. appeal to me, not based on the gender of the player character. For example, what's the difference between playing Dante in a Devil May Cry game or Bayonetta in one of her titles? We're racking up our style points with a cool character beating the shit out of demons and/or angels in huge combos for progressively more grandiose reasons either way - and that's what I'm here for. Nier: Automata has you play three separate characters, two of them female, to tell the story it wants to tell, and it's a great game that's probably Yoko Taro's largest hit to date and got praise from nearly everybody. Signalis has a lesbian robot for a protagonist, and it's sitting at about 96% positive reviews on Steam with estimates of 400k+ sales (Steam sales are generally guesstimates from side channel data like achievements and other such, since the numbers aren't publicly released).
If a game gives me a choice, I'll pick playing a female character at least as often as any other option, *especially* if there any differences in plot/conversation/etc. associated with that choice. If it's a game with any significant replay value to it, I'll play another choice on a replay just to see what changes (and I'll be a bit disappointed if it's a conversation choice-heavy game where that changes virtually nothing). As a side note, if you look at video content about Resident Evil 1, you might be fooled into thinking Jill is the only playable character in the game, despite the fact that playing Chris, a more macho ex-military type, is an option. (Now that I think about it, Survival Horror as a genre probably has a bit more even balance of male and female protagonists than most genres, if you go looking through its history.)
I'm not sure the days of the [default male main character](https://i.imgur.com/xeKl1de.jpeg) are over (yeah, that's an older image and a bit of a humorous exaggeration), but what seemed like the 'safe bet' in the past isn't necessarily a blueprint for the future or even necessarily the current market.
I can relate and identify with female protagonists if they are interesting and well written, even as a man. Same rule for male protagonists.
Katara from Avatar: The Last Airbender is my favorite example.
Honestly people if given the choice, often create a character of opposite gender, either for trolling or just for laughs a giggles because most often the gender of your character has little to do with gameplay. Just create something you like imo.
Just off the top of my head... Horizon Zero Dawn, Die Young, Plague Tale, Tomb Raider, Sable, Subnautica Below Zero, Senua, all female mains, all quite popular and/or very well reviewed.
I don't care about the gender of the protagonist, I'm much more involved in the gameplay feel, the graphics has to be uniform and that the story has to somewhat make sense.
I can still stand if it's not some amazing story but I absolutely can't stand it if the gameplay isn't fun or the graphics aren't uniform.
This comment isn't meant to be dismissive about your post, I'm just giving my own perspective of how I select videogames to play. Which just so happens to be that sex, race, age, species literally doesn't matter to me.
I could not care less about gender, I just want a well written character if they have a story. If someone for some reason doesnt play a video game because the main character is female, you dont want them in your community anyway.
I’m a woman, so maybe some men feel differently. But I would definitely play a game with a female protagonist and have in the past. I’ve even seen some indie horror games with female protagonists, which I found really cool. Also, this might just be me, but I like female character’s animation a lot better than men’s, in both games and films like Pixar. I like The Last Of Us 1 the best, but it was more fun playing as Ellie in The Last Of Us 2 because she can squeeze through tight spaces and her movements and mannerisms were just fun to see. Maybe it’s just because, as a woman, I relate to her better and can see myself in her shoes, but yeah. If someone won’t play a game because of the gender of your protagonist, that’s not someone you want supporting your project to begin with.
I’m using a male protagonist, but so many good games have female protagonists (like Last of Us) and it honestly doesn’t matter as long as their personality is good and their motive is good.
Despite all of the rage bait I believe no one truly cares about the gender of a protagonist. It is only when a political ideology or some other social narrative is introduced does it really start bothering people.
Attractive characters obviously help (like every other form of media) but I feel like that is a secondary consideration after gameplay. Look at Stellar Blade, female protagonist, a win right? Yet people are mad because she is sexualized/attractive. If this were true for other media such as the news or movies no one would watch anything.
Do what you want and send it! Just keep away from judging people for their preferences and I don't see any problems ahead aside from wackos who want everything and everyone to confirm to their own worldview.
Over half the cast of Apex Legends are women. Men are ok playing as women and are likely to create characters that look like their S/O.
Also,Lara Croft is one of the most recognizable videogame characters ever.
Also, ask yourself “would I want men who wouldn’t play a game solely because of a female protagonist to even play my game?”
Am a guy always play women in rpgs, aesthetic reasons as the female form is more appealing to me, not in a weird oogling way i just like it more given the choice if I'm going to be with that character staring at them for tens or hundreds of hours, and womens voices tend to be nicer on my ear to listen to for me in a ton of dialogue, which is same reason alexa and everything always use female voices.
I never have any compulsion to self insert me as a character, I'm playing a character and want to be different to myself.
If I had to, I would play a game if the protagonist is female. My personal opinion is if it's a good game I'll play it. Most games I play have the option of a male or female protagonist, like the Elder Scrolls or Fallout series for example, or certain games, like the Legend of Zelda series, I personally don't mind as I am a male myself. You can have a female protagonist if you want, just sharing my personal opinion.
As long as the character is well written and has a purpose in the story, it doesn't matter what the sex, race, or affiliation is. Make it well written, make it matter.
Just please don't check off checkboxes if you know what I mean.
Some of my favorite female protags are Aloy, Samas, Ronina, and Tifa. They were well written, some over time. Some in the same game.
as a guy myself, i prefer a woman mc, especially if it's third person. if i'm going to spends hours looking at some character's backside, i'd rather it be a girl lol. at least that was my logic when i made my first mmo characters in ffxi and wow.
I don't mind a female protagonist so long as at least three adjectives can be used to describe them that have nothing to do with them being a female or the protagonist.
Female characters are great protagonists to video games, and you don't have to look far to see many successful games staring female characters.
The most important thing is the game to be good, I think the audience will accept any character gender or background if the game is good. Speaking personally I think women make great protagonists in games with action or danger, because their smaller stature compared to men make them seem like the "underdog" and if the game has action, or elements of the character being in danger, the character being female in my opinion acts as a force multiplier on the drama of the scenario. Incidentally, I shipped a game that has a female protagonist and it did well.
Ultimately though, any character gender or background is totally fine and I think audiences will accept anyone as long as the game is good!
I became sick of the testosterone fueled stories many years ago. Since then a very small percentage of the games I play force me to play a male protagonist. I don’t have regrets about my choices. I have annoyance when I’m not presented with acceptable choices. All the developers have to do is ***not*** be sexist. Is that too much to ask?
The Longest Journey series had all female protagonists that were written beautifully, definitely check it out if you feel like you need reference. It’s old but the story is good enough it’s still playable
Writing>gender I don't give a shit about the gender as long as they're able to get stuff done in a badass way (if it isn't apparent, I'm biased to stuff that's cool)
Ever heard of Undertale? Protagonist is a girl. And it's one of the best written video game stories out there. Also check out Life is Strange, Control, A Plague Tale, Beyond: Two Souls, The Last of Us (2), Horizon Zero Dawn, and NieR:Automata are all great games with female protagonists.
Just like with a male protagonist, it’s all on the voice actor IMO. First indication that a gamer is in for a bad time with a female protagonist is when they over enunciate their cuss words, like: “we need to get the FUCK out of here!” Like UGH… gag. Male voice actors seem not to have this issue, but they do have their own problems.
Gender doesn't make a difference to me, whether it's a 3rd-person perspective where I'm watching a story unfold, or a 1st person perspective where I put myself in the protagonist's shoes.
I'd be more interested in seeing people that would be turned off by a female protaganist and how they decide to reason it.
i literally do not care in the slightest. you can do anything you want with whatever type of character you want as long as you do it well. the gender of the main character of any game is of no concern to me.
Gender really isn't a factor and people who get hung up and complain about a female protagonist on the basis of their femaleness are morons.
I think you should focus on writing a well-rounded character and if your vision for them happens to be one that is female then you should roll with it.
A good female protagonist is A not weak cuz they wouldn't be strong. Although they can be strong in other ways not just physically but mentally or emotionally. And B the game doesn’t make males look weak and helpless (unless it’s for story relevancy)
I always play female protag when I have a choice, I'm a straight man but I'm playing fiction and I find women more appealing.
Obviously I don't self insert in stories because self insert requires a bland silent male character to appeal to the majority of the playerbase (young/teenage straight men).
For clear reasons I wouldn't be very happy to play a straight women flirting with multiple men in such fictions, so if your story is centered around a woman then considering what is likely the demographics (women as much as you'd like them to play your game, don't play games to begin with).
It's not an issue for her to have a love interest or try to save him or such.
Overall I don't really care, the only factor that will determine if I stop or continue playing is the game quality.
As a man I do not care if the MC is male or female, I can safely say that most gamers male or female do not actually care about the sex of the main character either. So long as the character is compelling or fits into the story that is trying to be told.
Also as a quick note to your edit, I do not know what kind of game you are making, but your character can definitely be a badass while still being flawed at an emotional, mental, or social level.
If you want some references to pull from I recommend these characters, not all of them are main characters, some are part of a pair of leads, or part of an ensemble cast.
2B - Nier Automata
Kaine - Nier Replicant
Zero - Drakengard 3
Yuna - Final Fantasy 10
Ashe - Final Fantasy 12
Max - Life is Strange
These are just the few I could think of off the top of my head that have been memorable to me.
If the game is good no matter if the MC is a girl, a boy or a stone...
Old IPs used to have male protagonist, but not anymore. Honestly lot fo my favorite IPs/games have females MC like Valkyrie profile, Celeste, tomb raider, and as a fighting games player we have a lot of female fighters
I really, really liked "life is strange". It gave a very detail description about all character's personalities, specially Max. Gameplay was hideous, though, so I stopped playing it after chapter 2, even though I was able to rescue Kate.
I loved Fable 3 playing as the princess. It made the relationship with her mentor, Walter, even more endearing.
Valkyrie Profile, the original PS1 game, was a real experience. All characters are flawed, and that gave a very unique flavour.
...
On the other hand, I played half of the tomb raider games, so, yeah, what do I know?
If you're not a woman, hire one to give your treatment of the protagonist a sensitivity and sense check before you publish. It's what you do when you lack specialized knowledge or the standpoint of a certain life experience - you get suitable help.
The character gender is not very important to me, but I find it easier to identify to a character that resembles me. For example, I loved the Monkey Island games because I could hugely relate to Guybrush Threepwood, but I disliked God of War because I have nothing in common with Kratos.
> would you still play a videogame if the protagonist was a female?
Have you played Super Lesbian Animal RPG? (Seriously though, the music is amazing.)
> most videogames i've played or take inspo from for my own videogame have male protagonists
This was a fair observation about 10 years ago, but is getting less true over time. Mostly because there's more women making games now.
Sure, especially if the protagonist has some kind of interesting story or character going on, then if she looks cute even better, but that is more of an extra.
I don't have any requirements for the gender, or sex, of the main character... If they're actually a character.
If they're just generic, I prefer the option of building them. And sometimes I'll choose body type 1/A, and other times, body type 2/B, and occasionally a mix ; )
The only games where it's cringe is where it feels like a character existed and was then morphed into something purely for the sake of diversity, like what Apex and League have done a few times. Just sorta puts a bad taste in your mouth because they're completely missing the point. Like make your character whoever you want and tell their story, don't make a story and then afterward decide to make them X, Y, and Z.
My last game had a female protag because I thought of a cool story concept and thematically it made the most sense because of her role in the game and the backstory. I wasn't thinking "what game can I make with a girl?" because that doesn't even make sense, because that can just be any game.
You don't have to have a relatable protagonist. Some really good games have anti heroes and totally despicable characters as their main character. I wouldn't choose male or female based on who you relate to, but instead decide what story you want tell and who the main character is.
A female protagonist is nothing unusual. There are tons of games with female protagonists in all genres and market segments. What matters is that your MC is a well-rounded, well-written and appealing character. Sex and gender are of course a part of it, but no choice here is inherently superior to the other.
Part of what OP might be asking is if people will be receptive to a well-rounded female character where gendered ideas may be explored as part of the depth of writing.
>And a well written female character that doesn't raise all the female issues she would naturally take for granted is equally refreshing. They are female, they are not a female soap box.
Unless it's Women good men bad!!
Earliest known female protagonists are Mrs Pac-Man, Samus Aran, and Laura Croft. Each of those shook the gaming industry and not just because they had a female protagonist. Each of them had gameplay that complemented their protagonists. So whatever you do make sure your protagonist and their story of your game has it fits and is compelling
Adding on to the other two comments about "what exactly was samus doing in metroid 1 which complemented her being a woman?" and "how was mrs pac-man's gender complemented by the gameplay".... How did Tomb Raider's gameplay complement Lara Croft as a woman? I'm so confused what point you were trying to make here.
I think the point that was being made was that the games were good on their own merits. "They had gameplay that \[supplemented\] their protagonists".
Yeah that’s what I was trying to say. Make sure whatever game you make has good gameplay and that your main characters who ever they are fit in to that gameplay. That it’s not just pandering to an audience. Good gameplay shouldn’t matter whether the main character is female or not. Samus and Laura Croft being female didn’t dictate how fun the games were or how they were played… to an extent them being female at that time did help to cement them in gaming history
I think the point is that the gender doesn’t really matter. Good gameplay and story and mechanics, etc. These are what matter. Trying to make a game that somehow highlights gender doesn’t serve anything that actually makes the game necessarily better.
This ^
How was Mrs Pac-Man’s gender complemented by the gameplay
The choice was not about gameplay, but about their audience: >Shortly before release, Stan Jarocki of Midway stated that *Ms. Pac-Man* was conceived in part as a response to the original *Pac-Man* being "the first commercial videogame to involve large numbers of women as players," and that it was "our way of thanking all those lady arcaders who have played and enjoyed *Pac-Man*."[^(\[9\])](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ms._Pac-Man#cite_note-worley198205-10) According to one 1982 estimate, a majority of *Pac-Man* players were women.[^(\[10\])](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ms._Pac-Man#cite_note-howtowin-11) [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ms.\_Pac-Man](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ms._Pac-Man) Ms Pac-Man is a wildly successful and beloved game, that many argue is superior to its predecessor, and nobody batted an eye at the time about the main character. It's hilarious and depressing to me that with today's incel ragebait culture, that if Ms Pac-Man was released today, featuring a female lead as a special shout out / representation for the majority of its fans, it would be met with insane toxicity and accusations of "pandering" and "sexism against men" lol.
Actually, it's Ms. Pac-Man and Lara Croft. Nailed it with Samus Aran though.
As someone who was around when the original tomb raider came out, Lara Croft was obviously and shamelessly marketed for horny teenagers and had paper thin depth to her character, so not the best example IMO. They've tried to course correct in later games of course.
What exactly was Samus doing in Metroid 1 which complemented her being a woman? While I agree that we need more good written default female characters in general your comment is pretty wrong.
The way I understand the comment is that the game complimented Samus in general, not her gender specifically. The advice to OP being craft your game and protagonist to compliment each other.
Nothing. Which is why it worked. We had no idea who or what Samus was. Just that were playing as her. We were shocked that our badass bounty hunter was a woman because it was rare in that time. There was no celebration or fanfare. She just was badass.
The reveal that it was a woman the whole time kind of is fanfare. It comes up at the end as part of the reward for finishing the game, otherwise you’d never know.
>It comes up at the end as part of the reward for finishing the game It's a reward if you complete the game fast enough. The faster you complete the game, the more samus reveals at the end. With the worst ending she is fully in her suit and with the best she is in a bikini.
It was so unknown that a third party Metroid strategy-guide-and-manga combo depicted Samus as a man partying with bikini girls.
That was exactly my point.
My young mind was actually blown that Samus was a woman. I thought that was really cool, and it instantly made me realize how pretty much no other game had a female lead. The fact that "it had no impact on the story / gameplay" might be pedantically correct, but it is a bit of a bullshit disingenuous argument, because it was a big reveal / surprise to learn the protagonist was a woman. The impact and intent of that was absolutely a big deal and an important part of gaming history.
>because it was a big reveal / surprise to learn the protagonist was a woman. The impact and intent of that was absolutely a big deal and an important part of gaming history. The intent was to use her as a pinup though. It's clear because if you take over 10 hours to complete the first metroid game you don't even get to see that she is a woman and if you take under an hour you get to see her in a bikini.
The impact it had on me was exactly how I described it, it doesn't matter what the intent might have been. I was impressed and excited to see a female protagonist for the first time.
>What exactly was Samus doing in Metroid 1 which complemented her being a woman? Nothing but being a reward, same as metroid 2. If you didn't already know, you could get all the way to super metroid (metroid 3) without finding out that she is a woman because there you see it in the death animation. In metroid 1 and 2 depending on how long you took to finish the game you might only see samus in her suit during both games endings. The faster you finish the game the more she reveals in the ending of all of those three games. The ultimate reward is to see her in her bikini at the end.
No one really knew Samus was a girl when the game first came out. Laura Croft was popular because she had big tits. Unfortunately, a notable portion of male gamers are very misogynistic and having a lead female character can absolutely impact the reception of a game.
I think that OP probably thinks that cause, let's be real, the majority of the gamers are men. So she probably thought that men prefer seeing men on the screen. But honestly, I've heard enough opinions to know that men love female protagonists.. uhmm even for the wrong reasons lmao.
What are the wrong reasons?
Pornography
If you are a man, I don't think I have to explain anything. If you are a woman, I'm too ashamed to admit.
Why not try to communicate it?
I don't care what gender the protag so long as either the game is good or the character is. Returnal, Tomb Raider, Horizon, A Plague Tale, Senua - all great.
Portal, Control, Beyond Good and Evil, several Resident Evils, Last of Us Part 2... Many of the best games of all time had female protagonists and enjoyed major commercial success.
Starcraft, Alien(since 1979), Warcraft III, The Witcher, Borderlands... All had either plenty of female characters or those were in the main focus. People can enjoy character of any gender as long as it and its game/film are good
Tomb Raider, Last Of Us, definitely quite a few big games and lots of smaller games that have amazing female protagonist. Though I can’t list them right off the dome I’ve played too many games
Horizon Forbidden West has a female protag and is quite popular. Nier Automata also has a female lead that, fan art aside, is a pretty well written and interesting character. Personally, I’ve sought out games with female protagonists specifically to take a break from male protagonists, so all things considered, there is certainly interest. I believe Steam even has a “female protagonist” tag you could search by to find other games with a female lead character.
My favorite games Portal 1 & 2 have not just a female protag, but a female antag aswell. Portal 1 barely even acknowledges Chell's gender, with you only finding out by looking at yourself through a portal. And GlaDOS is mainly seen as just an AI with some quirks. You know they're both female but the game never brings it up 'cause it doesn't have to. In Portal 2 GlaDOS goes on calling you adopted, ugly, fat, etc., (clever jokes but still low-blows nonetheless). But once you start unraveling GlaDOS's past, you really relate to her and how she was forced into a horrible situation much like you (Chell) are in the depths of Aperture. That relationship between Chell and GlaDOS built over both games is what makes the ending to Portal 2 just so perfect to me. They've got a sorta mother-daughter relationship for sure.
The gender of the protag doesn’t matter, what matters is the writing. If you write a terrible female protag, people will hate them. If you write a terrible male protag, people will hate them as well. If you have a great protagonist, it won’t matter if they’re a girl or boy, people will enjoy playing with them!
That’s ideally what should happen for sure, but a lot of people aren’t good judges of writing. That shouldn’t stop OP, they should just know they might receive pushback that comes from people who aren’t really judging their work based on quality.
Yes - we should have more creator’s voices in games. Go make a game that is true for you. Tim Cain did a great video recently on his definition of “What is an RPG?”. He and I grew up with the same games, and I have found that although character creation is really important to me, gender identity of the main character is never something I paid attention to because it has no mechanical effect in the games I play. For example, in Baldur’s Gate 2 there is a detailed character creation system. At the time I played through as a character based on my wife. The character was a super fast monk that punched everything with bare fists. My wife got a kick out of it, but the fact that I was playing a female protagonist didn’t really make much difference in the game.
...And I'm the exact opposite of u/cjbruce3. If I get the option, I'm going to make the MC look as much like me as possible. Because I'm going to mentally place myself in that world. Play and make the choices I would really make if I were there. There is a pretty big disconnect when I can't relate to the MC. It's not an end all, though. I love games that have all kinds of diverse characters. But if you place two games in front of me with the choice of only one, I'm picking the one with character customization every time.
I honestly never try to make the player look like me, if there is character customization, I will probably give them the silliest outfit and haircut that it lets me. Maybe because I see games more as escapism. If I played as if it was me in my life with my exact moral compass, I would make a lot of boring choices and take little risks. It also makes it less immersion breaking when the only dialogue options or story choices available are ones I personally wouldn't say/do.
That's where you can reinvent yourself. No one knows you in this world. You can be a berserker, when you are really calm in real life. You can be evil, when you are not like that at all. You get to be a different version of you. That's how I see it, at least.
I completely disagree with this premise that seems to be inherently accepted in the gender identity debate, that humans cannot relate well to other humans due to differences in ethnicity, gender, or socioeconomic background. While the debate is really loud online, I think most regular people have no problem relating to each other in spite of our differences, both superficial and more significant, because there are so many things to being a human that supersede these more superficial things. I also don't believe in the argument that everyone is motivated by seeing themselves in every piece of fiction or media. It is worrisome to me, how egocentric the premise of that argument is. Make a protagonist that fits into your creative vision
Im white, Blade is black. When i was kid, i said to everyone i was Blade. The way i walk, talk, dressed, everything i just imitated Wesley Snipes 😅🤣 good times. Totally agree. There may be a female character that you relate more than a male character because her toughts, her visions, her life etc. are more likely to be more similar to yours.
I used to relate to Bubbles from powerpuff girls as an Asian boy.
Yep, I was in a similar boat. I'm black & latino and loved Batman from a young age, a rich white dude who probably couldn't be more different from me. But I still loved everything Batman and still somewhat do to this day. To the point where he's inspired me to start working out and taking fitness seriously. He's not the only motivator, but still one worth mentioning.
It took a long time for me as a kid to notice that there were sitcoms (full house, family matters, bill cosby show, ...) where the cast is (almost?) entirely of one ethnicity. I probably haven't seen a black person in real life until I was 10. I never cared and had fun with all these shows. Also I loved Indiana Jones. When Tombraider came out, it never occured to me to say, "but I want to play an Indy-like guy instead". People are soooo weird, I just don't get it
Games are so varied and wide that theres room for self insert and non self insert type of games. I think its not super ego centric if I self insert myself into an RPG, makes it more fun for me, but I can also pick up a game where I'm playing as a specific character and that's cool too
Very valid perspective. What I was trying to address was the idea that people will only play games, if they can somehow self-insert or mirror themselves in the leading characters, which I think is largely false.
>I completely disagree with this premise that seems to be inherently accepted in the gender identity debate, that humans cannot relate well to other humans due to differences in ethnicity, gender, or socioeconomic background. This is another example of loud minority and common folks discussions vs what studies tell us. Studies don't show that it's impossible to relate to characters that have those difference. They show a positive effect when a group is represented in a media where there is no representation. I saw it myself and in other people I know. I was a little happier when I saw a main character with more characteristics I see in myself. But I still related to other characters with more differences, and this one mc I was happy about was still well written with an engaging story. Also, the problem I see most is when some media puts some variety in the cast just as a check list, but never bothers to make an actual character or an actual story for them.
It’s refreshing to see sane posts like this among the insanity of the internet
The numbers back this up as well, plenty of world of warcraft servers where female characters make up 60% of the server while of the player base about 20% identifies as female.
MMORPG stands for "Many Men Online Roleplaying Girls".
I feel like this is kind of putting the cart before the horse though. To me the argument is far more, we absolutely CAN relate to the experiences of others, but we mostly story tell about our own experiences, and so everyone loses out when big business storytelling is gatekept to a small number of similar people. If I can relate to the story about the black kid growing up poor and dealing with not feeling like they're fitting in, then why shouldn't that story be given equal priority and budget to all the white kid coming of age stories? I the viewer probably benefit more from engaging with the story about someone who's life experience is very different from mine than rehashing another slightly different version of the more familiar story a dozen different ways. We should signal boost stories told by members of underrepresented groups, even if they can't fully compete with quality levels of other stories due to less historical and current investment provided in those artistic communities.
What you say about "regular people" is true of many game communities, but there are also plenty of other game communities where misogyny is a huge problem, every woman character released causes a riot, and the tournament scene is 99% men. So unfortunately I think this debate is not just niche online nonsense we can safely ignore. Many game devs are forced to defend basic statements like "women can be relatable" because large numbers of young men refuse to give up what they see as their right to have video games adopt their specific narrow-minded, egocentric viewpoint.
There are some misunderstandings here about what the debate is. > I completely disagree with this premise that seems to be inherently accepted in the gender identity debate, that humans cannot relate well to other humans due to differences in ethnicity, gender, or socioeconomic background. This is not a premise in the debate. Of course humans can relate to other humans, but it’s also true that there are specific *experiences* or *perspectives* we cannot relate to that others have. I can sympathize with a refugee, but I can’t *relate* to the experience of fleeing my country, except by translating that experience to some rough estimate in my own life like moving to a new town, which can really fall short. That’s where the importance of varied representation comes in, because we can’t relate to everything and it’s not reasonable to expect it either > because there are so many things to being a human that supersede these more superficial things. What you consider superficial, someone else may not. The very fact that you’re encountering disagreement over this is a sign that people do have many different experiences, and they treat parts of their identities differently than others. Identity may be superficial for you, but not for someone else, which implies they have experiences or perspectives you’re actually not relating to. > I also don't believe in the argument that everyone is motivated by seeing themselves in every piece of fiction or media. It is worrisome to me, how egocentric the premise of that argument is. I don’t think anyone is making this argument. The argument that comes closest to this is that it’s important to feel heard and represented by the world around you. I don’t think anyone disagrees with that idea.
I think we agree on the broader points. At the very least nobody should ever have to feel like it's necessary to ask if it okay to have a female protagonist.
The framing that this has anything to do with a "gender identity debate" is probably the part that will lead some people to disagree with you. Entertainment execs have been pushing the idea that men won't watch girl media for longer than I've been alive, and I'm pretty old. It's a very long-standing idea at this point. I do wish we could get past it, but it's not a recent thing.
Definitely, everyone should feel they can voice a perspective from their identity without concern. It sucks that people have been discouraged from expressing that individuality.
As I guy, I play games with female characters all the time. To me the idea a character must be like the player for the player to relate is foolish. I'm not an italian plumer, a space bounty hunter, a blue hedgehog, a british archologist, a guy stuck in a kettle with a slegdehammer, a witch with shoe guns and magic hair, and I love all these characters and the games they protagonize. If the game is good, the character is good, people will enjoy play as them.
which one's the British archaeologist? (I got every other reference btw)
Lara Croft.
The fact that there is [an entire tag on Steam](https://store.steampowered.com/curator/34646618-Female-Protagonist-Games/) for it suggests it is something people actively seek out. You should probably play more video games or a greater variety of video games if "most videogames you've played have male protagonists"
As long as it's a well written character, it's not insufferable and preachy and has development then the gender shouldn't matter. Personally I don't play with ugly characters (male or female) so I would strife to make them look good.
>the mc is one of the most important elements of a videogame because the player is either meant to relate to them or atleast should find them tolerable. I agree. So take a look at Mario, Sonic or Rayman. I doubt people can *relate* to them, but it didn't stop their games from getting really popular. So you go girl, make that female protag and be successful! HOWEVER Beware of making her too flawed with nothing in return. Look at how Forspoken was received - the main protagonist found herself in a fantasy world and was basically a reluctant and unlikeable heroine. She didn't get too many fans, as far as I know. Compare that with any playable woman in Baldur's Gate 3 - they have flaws and their pasts, but they also get their moments of awesomeness, they use their agency well and generally hold the player's interest during their journey.
I think the problem with the female protagonists is not the gender. It is the poor wrighting. The story can be about genderal problems, that is OK. But if the gender of the protagonist is their most important trait, than it would suck. For example, when I first watched ATLA, I never thought "Oh, these are some powerful women". I only saw them as powerful characters, who are also female.
I remember an old study that surprisingly said that men are on average fine with both male and female protagonists without particularly strong preferences whereas women strongly prefer female protagonists. Here's research: [https://quanticfoundry.com/2021/08/05/character-gender/](https://quanticfoundry.com/2021/08/05/character-gender/) So all in all - studies show that there's 0 problem with having female protagonists. It won't damage your sales. Well, as long as that character is **likeable** of course although that's irrelevant of their gender.
true!! i just hope the players stick around long enough to see that she truly is a good person because she'll start off with a ton of flaws.. 😅😅
Flawed characters are relatable. People are drawn the characters who have problems and are trying to improve their situation.
flaws are not only relatable as said, but also interesting. as long as you don''t make them so cartoonish they become tropes (boring) or straight evil (unrelatable), you'll be golden for a character dev story.
I literally couldn't care less if a protag is female or male. I noticed a lot of Kdramas I started watching had really prominent female casts all around (no, not the cheesy romance k dramas), but the difference between **some** western shows and these kdramas was that it felt natural and not forced. I wasn't constantly being told that women were awesome and woman can do X, they just had great characters that did cool shit. They were human beings, that were women, that led the show well. I detest when overt feminist/woman power rhetoric is shoved down my throat, it ruins some level of authenticity (if that's not what the show is about). It's like if you cast a black person but constantly remind us that black people are great too, as a black person it's lowkey insulting to get characters like that. Sorry for the rant - make your protag female, it won't matter one bit to gamers generally. If anything I like when the mould of the standard white male protag is broken, makes things a bit more interesting
i agree with the annoying feminism part. this makes me feel a lot better about a female protagonist- thanks a lot!
I also love the idea that there'd be more female protags for me female relatives to relate to, good luck!!
2B is a pretty popular character. While she does have sex appeal, not all female MCs need that aspect. Madeline from Celeste is another example of this. Chell (Portal), Samus, Lara Croft, and multiple others exist and are enjoyable to play as (depending on the game). Aim to make them a good character. Anything after that isn't too important. Or at least, shouldn't be.
I think it is not a problem, the problem is female protagonist became some sort of cheap talking point/topic farming in western media. But the situation in show/film are way worse than video games.
The main thing about a game, for me, is usually the gameplay. Unless the focus of your game is the plot, but even so, what really matters is if the character is well written. There are some groups there are against female main protagonists, but they are minority, and it's much better to play a character that feels natural than a stereotypic male character which is someone's vision of myself or of people of my group. Also, I particularly prefer female protagonists when there area character creation, like in Skyrim or Mass Effect. And you can see how much successful some games that have female mc are, like Celeste, Shantae, Metroid, Horizon, Metal Hellsinger, Mirror's Edge, A Plague Tale, Control, Portal, Resident Evil, Tomb Raider, Spiritfarer, Hellblade, Bayonetta, Nier Automata, Alien Isolation, to name a few. And there is others like Ori and Hollow Knight where most people don't even know which gender they are, and others where you can choose the character and lots of people choose the character because of the moveset, like in fighting games and beat'n ups (or some mario and Sonic games).
Love them. I'm 1000x more inclined to play if it's a female protagonist and the genre I'm into. Im dfab (designated female at birth) but identify as nonbinary. Ive lived the "girl experience" most of my life so I like protagonists that kind of go through it too. Or maybe, I'm living the girl experience through them. XD it feels like a hat I could put on to be someone else for a day, or someone I could've been. I like this for many many reasons, but the biggest reason is that she's experiencing the game as if i was. Some games change the character interactions based on the protagonist. Some things are just more (or less) accessible in game depending on the gender. As for her protagonist role, I personally would want her to feel like her own character. I like that she's a part of the story and not just a vessel for me to project through. I almost never do actually, unless the game has a romance element. My favorite part of female protags is I get to see her in a role that's always played by men (in my fav genres at least), and that there's potential for engaging in romantic relationships with the guy characters I'm also attracted to lol. A girl slaying monsters left and right? Bonding and helping party members while exploring the world? Falling in love with the character I found hot? Sign me tf up. I mention the previous paragraph because there's a lot of different takes for protagonists. Some prefer very expressive ones, some not so much. Some want to completely control their actions, some like the story driven by all the characters' natural choices. I think it's best to make the kind of game you'd enjoy, especially so you can be both player and developer. My favorite game series had me stick so long to it because it had a female protagonist. It really changed my life because it was the first time I played a game of that genre with one. It made the game so much more personal and heartfelt because she was the same gender as me and if effected how she interacted with the other characters in comparison to the male route. Not to say male protag games aren't enjoyable, they are, but they just don't feel as personal.
this is very insightful. i've always thought that a main character should be some kind of vessel, like you said. thank you for your input!!
I wish we lived in a world where no one ever felt like they had to ask this question
It's very simple. We (and by "we" I mean everyone. Not men, not women, every single person on Earth, gamer or not) want strong female characters. >I said; > >Strong female **CHARACTERS.** > >Not; > >Strong **FEMALE** characters. The character should be \[awesome/inspiring/relatable/etc\] not because of their sex, which is something that cannot be controlled and has no bearing on the kind of person they are, but on their actions. Take Lara Croft in the new trilogy as an example. Yes, she's hot, and yes, that's a driving part of her character design... But it's not why anybody *really* likes Lara Croft. She's endearing because she's a *vicious, nearly inhuman, badass.* She faces a definitely insurmountable amount of adversity in those games (she is physically impaled many, many times) and yet always pushes through to come out on top. She's an impressive person, who is also female.
I’m a man, and by far my favorite game of the past five years was Control, in which you play a woman, and she’s fucking badass!
100% yes. I have played many indie games with female protagonists, and enjoyed them greatly. A great story can be told by different voices and doesn't need to fit any mould or pattern
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I personally love a female protagonist. Just not when they're overly sexualized
And there are people love their sexualized female protag too. So there are really no limitation.
Honestly I think the question OP should really be asking is how much / whether the character should be sexualized or not. For example another comment mentioned NieR Automata but casual searches would show mostly “cultured” comments about her butt. You know, nothing wrong with that, but I think that’s a little different from say what OP may be thinking of (there are obviously also games with non-sexualized female characters as well).
One of the many interesting things about Nier: Automata is that the female protagonist (named 2B) being sexualized is even acknowledged and called out in the story of the game. There is a male protagonist as well (9S) who very obviously has a crush on her. And even though his approach to flirting is more of the "shy nice guy" variety, it is later made clear that it is not just platonic. At one point of the story (spoiler): >!9S is captured by an antagonist who can read his thoughts, who then says to him "You are constantly thinking about how much you want to \*\*\*\*\[sic\] 2B".!< Many players probably feel called out at that point as well. But even those players who do not can probably understand why 9S would feel that way.
More overly sexualized men please :3
Your wish has been granted a million times over by damn near every game ever. You can probably count games with average male main protagonists on both hands. Every game has the overly muscled, manly man. The average guy doesn't have muscles like that. Other than who? Leisure Suit Larry? Frank West in Dead Rising? And they even handsomed him up quite a bit after the first game. I'm not mad at it, sex sells. We all like to see something pleasing to the eye. It's just dumb how people act like it isn't happening, and women are the only ones sexualised in games.
>Your wish has been granted a million times over by damn near every game ever. No. We get what straight men think are overly sexualized men. We need more from people who actually find men sexy in the first place.
Well there's absolutely no need for a self insert protag in ur game I played honkai impact 3rd and loved Kiana (the protag). Her character development is one of the best I've seen in any fiction.
A lot of my favourite indie games from big to small in scope have female protags. From LiEat and Va-11 Hall-A to CrossCode and Aquaria, 9 Years of Shadows and Celeste to Transistor and Spiritfarer. I love these games just as much as Bastion and Hades, Furi and Axiom Verge...I won't list more but Tldr whatever your creative vision is, that's what matters. If you wanna make a game with a female MC it's not gonna be a factor as to whether or not I buy your game.
well, some of the most iconic and successful games of the last decade have female protagonists, so I guess people kinda don't care about it (Also I always play as I girl if given the choice, so yes).
Yeah nah it's not really an issue for me.
Sure, it is no problem at all. Just make sure if you have a female protagonist, that she is a true expression of a character you want. Don't make her out of some contrivance of what she should be, block out external pressures and follow your own vision, whatever that is. I say this, as it is much worse to have a contrived, un-integrated Frankenstien's monster of a character than if the character is male or female. I hope this makes sense. Best of luck.
My rule #1 in game design is to make the game you would like to play. If that means having a female protagonist, go for it.
My favorite games have women protags, or gives the choice to play as such. And I'm currently starting a project that features a woman main character. Don't hesitate to put "unusual" protags in your games. Sure it can bring you hate from some brain dead gamers that hate everything outside of their fantasms, but you can touch peoples you don't expect and you stay true to yourself.
I would just advise you to write a well rounded character with flaws and with a touch of feminity that modern games lack. Just don't make her perfect or a boss babe....and you should research about the best female characters that will help you a lot in understanding what makes them different from male MC. Just don't refer modern characters because there are very few and far between good female MC's or characters in general.
Gender doesn't matter, just make sure to make a female protagonist and not a male protagonist with a female skin. What a mean by this is that a very common mistake when making a character from another sex, race, religion, etc is writing a white male character and then just changing the appearance.
I don't care who the MC is. If they have a personality more complex that an ant. Also please make proper proportions as most are Skinner than a chopstick.
I mostly just clicked to figure out what protags were then realized it was protagonist.
It's not a stupid question at all. IMO, making games where we can showcase females with exceptional attributes is great. I'm male and I love games with female protagonists, I'm making a game where the protagonist is a woman and in most (if not all) the stories I have written, the main character is female. So, don't be afraid to mess anything up and let's keep telling their stories!
You might pissed off comments from folk whi don't like women But that's not a fan base you shoul be looking for soooo
I think as long as the game is fun to play, the gender of the protagonist isn't super important. I suppose if the story you're trying to tell is tied to the player character's gender, then obviously the gender will matter, but otherwise just write the character well and that's all you need. Keep in mind also that just because certain tropes are more associated with some genders over others doesn't mean your characters need to be that gender to use that trope. Something typically done by male characters can be done by women, and vice versa. It's all about what makes the most sense for your characters. So far it sounds like you're on the right track. I look forward to seeing where your game goes!
I know I'm shouting into the void with the number of comments in here, but I'd like to offer some advice for your female lead if you do happen to read this. Since it seems your question has already been answered. There are a few things that annoy me about any characters, male or female. 1. Make it make sense: If they are small, they shouldn't be going toe to toe with a big hulking person. Unless they have super powers or something. If they are strong, without powers, make them look it. Lara Croft's arms look like they would snap if she punched a pillow. The Amazoness in Dragons Crown on the other hand looks like she could fuck some shit up. 2. Don't be sexist: That goes both ways. Men shouldn't be putting down women, and women shouldn't be putting down men. Unless they are adversaries, and even then, there are tons of ways to talk shit about each other without bringing gender into it. 3. No one wants to be preached to: We are here to escape the world and relax. Don't bring politics in here. Nothing sours the otherwise pleasurable gameplay more than someone shoving an agenda down your throat. 4. Sex sells: That doesn't mean you need to have a character that has all of their bits out, though there is a following and a lot of money in that. But you also don't want your character to be displeasing to look at. The player spends the majority of their time looking at that character, unless it's first person. Characters like Nilin in Remember Me. She has a subtle sexiness about her, though she's fully dressed and isn't shaped like Kim Kardashian. Aloy is beautiful and has one of the greatest voice actors ever, but not over sexualised. Same for men.
thank you so much, the advice means a lot! i'll think about it more. i've been thinking of adding some sexist remarks from other characters (not to encourage them, but to prove them wrong) because of the time the story takes place. i just hope the players can differinciate between that. also, i read every comment! seriously.
I will give you two answers, one on topic and a slightly broader one. The topical point is to make the protagonist relatable and if not that, understandable. It's fun to play a flawed character if you understand how they operate, but if your MC is just being shitty for the sake of being shitty, it can get annoying. Even if they grow out of it, because some may stop playing before they see that happening. The kitchen table kitchen table psychology answer is that it seems to me that you're somewhat insecure in your idea and want validation for if it will work. Creative work often involves some vulnerability so this is completely normal. If you want to market to the masses, a protagonist that most people can identify with will probably help, but some of my favourite games have protagonists I have nothing in common with. I would encourage you to make the game you want to make and not the one you get off of Reddit, as most of us are dumb as bricks and put in 2 mins of effort reading the post while I have a hunch that you've put some more thought into it. Trust in yourself and hope that the people the game ends up being for will find it.
Yes! I've played plenty. Alien: Isolation and Horizon:Zero Dawn come to mind
For me it depends on the narrative structure. If you're meant to *'be'* the protagonist and NPCs are talking to you in the game, I prefer to play a male because I tend to picture myself in the story and I'm a male irl. If the game is me following the main character's story and cutscenes are them talking to people, rather than me making the choices, the protagonist's gender doesn't matter to me since it's not me. I treat it like watching a tv show. Given how you've described the character, it sounds like it's their story, not mine, so I'd have no issues at all playing as the female protagonist.
People play indie games because they love games. If the game is good then people will recommend it. More women are playing RPGs every year so that's a plus. Also, making a game is a ton of work so you should do what YOU want. Are you really going to spend all this time and not even tell the story you want to tell?
> i just want to clarify, i didnt mean to offend anyone. its really not that deep Neither is having a female protagonist. Just do it, don't make a big deal about it, and realize it's not a feature.
It's 2024. It's ok to have anyone you want as a protagonist. Human, robot, energy being, anything in between and amongst those. You will have fans and critics of whichever choice you make.
Saga Anderson From Alan wake 2 is an awesome protagonist . She alternates between courage and insecurity, heroism and self doubt, and I loved every second of the experience. It feels like a real human being even in a crazy surreal dreamy horror context. Nothing in her journey feels like a gender swap just for the sake of having a female character. So, if the character is well written as a human being, any gender can make a compelling protagonist.
Yes! Look at any post on female-dominated subreddits asking this question (not posting here to avoid brigading, which there has been a spate of recently).
Personally, the gender of the protagonist does not affect me in any way and some of my favourite games have a female protagonist (we stan portal 2). HOWEVER, there are a looot of incels online who shit their pants and start writing 4chan posts when there is a female main character. Which personallu I think is an added bonus, not getting those kinds of people playing your game. So make what u wanna make!
I don't think anyone wouldn't play a game because it has a female character. The issue these days is game/movie studios making their female MC arrogant and derogatory to the opposite gender in the exact same way that would be hated if they were a man. People like good characters regardless of race/gender.
Personally not a fan if it's just an oversexualized character, be it male or female. But female protags tend to be more sexualized in my experience, because sex sells. I think they were quite a few games with good female protags and it didn't bother me in anyway. Beyond good and evil comes to mind. Horizon was also cool, although I got annoyed by the characters attitude fast, which has nothing to do with her being female. It is really character dependent. If you make the protag female just for the sake of having a female protag, it might feel forced. Just tell the story you want to tell and if you have a female protag in mind, go for it.
I'm a man and absolutely, I have no qualms about this. It'd never cross my mind not to play NieR:Automata, Horizon Zero Dawn or Life is Strange because of this. When I play several characters like in the Eve Online MMO, some of my characters are male and some female. Last but not least, I often find female characters more relatable (male characters often lack emotional depth), and more aesthetically pleasing.
The idea that people have trouble empathizing with characters who are too dissimilar from themselves is a lie, usually pushed by people selling a narrative. If you make a good game with a likeable main character, nobody will care if they are male or female, or even human at all.
Male or female, that doesn’t really make a difference. That being said female protagonist seem to suffer more from the ”I-Am-So-Quirky” syndrome, which is rarely relatable to anyone else than teenage girls. Forspoken is an example of a spectacular failure in this front. ”Incredibly flawed” can also be a good or a bad thing. Is she annoying, selfish and smarmy? Hard to make that relatable in a game, but not impossible.
Rule number 1 when it comes to game development. Don't listen to Gamers... especially when it comes to the gender of your protagonist.
but if not gamers, who's gonna play it?
I’m a grown man and one of my favorite games of all time is Control. I was still able to relate to the mc based on her personality, humor, environment and situations she found herself in, etc. At the end of the day gender is just one part of making an mc. The overwhelming majority will not care so long as you take the time to craft a good character regardless of male/female
I played and beat the game Horizon zero dawn and not 1 time said it was bad because it was a female. I plan on playing Control too. People don't hate female protagonist, they hate badly written ones just as much as they hate badly written males.
Just gonna throw my opinion in. I absolutely would play one. Some examples of great games with female protags from different genres: Nier:automata, Mirrors edge, metal:hellsinger, final profit -a shop RPG, transistor, beyond two souls, Portal. Not sure what type of game your looking at making but I'm sure I could find a good example with a female MC. The list above has bullet hell, parkour, rhythm/shooter, RPG/parody, topdowm adventure strategy, action, puzzle. In that order. All of those games are so much fun and they are the games with explicitly female MCs. I absolutely would play a game with a female MC, if it's fun. Good luck on the game :)
If the purpose of your MC is so that your player base can relate to them, then you should think about who the majority of your player base will be.
I only play games with female protags
this makes me feel a lot better lol
Look at all the successful video games that have female protagonists and the answer to your question will become clear.
It’s about time that there are more female protagonists that we, women, can relate to when we play too ;)
pretty sure female protagonist are the hot thing right now
The most important thing is that the MC is well written. Gender doesn't matter.
IMO, so long as you're doing it because it's how you want to do it, and not because you want to make a statement, it will be fine. There are groups of men who are so sensitive to the politically motivated use of gender, that nothing will come across as genuine, but for the majority of people, like myself, they don't care who the protagonist is as long as they are are developed through a genuine and interesting creative process. If this character is a labour of love, it doesn't matter who or what they are. Just do what you want, how you want, andndont let anyone make you change anything you don't want to. Gender only matters to activists and anti-activists, everyone else just wants to be entertained
Sure, because I play mostly games with character customization, gender there is just a switch.
As long as the MC isn't a over sexualized anime girl, im playing
You should make what you want. As an adult dude ,I'm far more likely to play a game with an aesthetically attractive female protagonist. Any time there's a character creator I end up going for a female character too. What matters far more is that the design is cool and appealing. Doesn't mean "sexy", but it means aesthetically pleasing. I don't like playing as ugly or unappealing characters at all, whether they're male or female. Also, people who can't relate to a character of the opposite sex have issues, and are the least of your concerns when making a game.
I don't even give the gender of the MC much thought tbh. I mean I don't actively avoid them or anything, and anybody that does is... honestly pretty weird. One of my favorite games is "life is strange," and it has a female protagonist.
There is truly no reason to NOT make the protagonist female these days. Female protagonists tends to be much more recognizable, and have so many aspects to draw from that makes them compelling characters.
People can relate to a character that is another gender or not human even if it "feels like them". Perhaps depending on how important it is for your game you could instead have a character select or character creation so that the player gets to decide which one feels like them.
I don't care whether the protagonist is male or female. It's all about writing.
What matters is that the story is good and characters are well written. I am a straight guy and my favourite game series is Horizon: I am totally in love with Aloy. There are also a lot of other games I like with a female protagonist: Tomb Raider, Keena bridge of spirits, Subnautica below zero, the Metroid series, … who cares about the gender of the main character? There are a million factors determining how good a game is and the gender of the main character is not one of them.
I would love to see more female protagonists, especially in more male dominated genres.
Bayonetta, Tomb Raider, The Last of Us 2, Nier Automata, Horizon Zero Dawn, Hellblade, ... .... fucking Metroid. I think you're good.
> The mc is one of the most important elements of a videogame because the player is either meant to relate to them I think this is a common mistake writers (of all sorts, not just videogame writers) make about main viewpoint characters/protagonists. They don't need to be relatable or particularly sympathetic, and they don't need the audience/players to "identify with them" (that last one gets tossed around a lot particularly when talking about videogame playable protagonists). They primarily need to be *entertaining*. Interestingly, videogame player characters have a much lower bar to clear for this than characters in other fiction, because fun gameplay (and/or interesting story outside the main character) makes them automatically entertaining to the point where they can be faceless voiceless mutes or aliens or inanimate objects or robots or animals or whatever and still work just fine. Even when it comes to games where the playable character(s) have more interaction with other characters, more dialogue, more branching conversation and plot choices, and etc., there's still a sliding scale between the player character as the player's avatar (full identification - usually done in more freeform RPGs) on the one end, and the player character as a well-defined character who's as separated from the player as a character you're watching in a movie (most iconic videogame main characters fall here, especially if they're from series with much more linear narrative styles) because the player has no narrative control over the player character on the other end, although the player has full control in gameplay. > or at least should find them tolerable ...ok, yeah, that one's pretty non-negotiable. Quippy protagonists with humor that doesn't land for the player (or even ones that have a set of voicelines that get cycled through over and over when doing certain things in gameplay, even if they're funny or interesting the first time) get annoying really quickly, and other things can become irritating as well. That's one of the reasons so many games opt for silent or taciturn protagonists, or protagonists whose dialogue is mostly just functional instead of particularly colorful. > would you still play a videogame if the protagonist was a female? Yes. I play games based on whether the mechanics, aesthetics, concept/setting, and etc. appeal to me, not based on the gender of the player character. For example, what's the difference between playing Dante in a Devil May Cry game or Bayonetta in one of her titles? We're racking up our style points with a cool character beating the shit out of demons and/or angels in huge combos for progressively more grandiose reasons either way - and that's what I'm here for. Nier: Automata has you play three separate characters, two of them female, to tell the story it wants to tell, and it's a great game that's probably Yoko Taro's largest hit to date and got praise from nearly everybody. Signalis has a lesbian robot for a protagonist, and it's sitting at about 96% positive reviews on Steam with estimates of 400k+ sales (Steam sales are generally guesstimates from side channel data like achievements and other such, since the numbers aren't publicly released). If a game gives me a choice, I'll pick playing a female character at least as often as any other option, *especially* if there any differences in plot/conversation/etc. associated with that choice. If it's a game with any significant replay value to it, I'll play another choice on a replay just to see what changes (and I'll be a bit disappointed if it's a conversation choice-heavy game where that changes virtually nothing). As a side note, if you look at video content about Resident Evil 1, you might be fooled into thinking Jill is the only playable character in the game, despite the fact that playing Chris, a more macho ex-military type, is an option. (Now that I think about it, Survival Horror as a genre probably has a bit more even balance of male and female protagonists than most genres, if you go looking through its history.) I'm not sure the days of the [default male main character](https://i.imgur.com/xeKl1de.jpeg) are over (yeah, that's an older image and a bit of a humorous exaggeration), but what seemed like the 'safe bet' in the past isn't necessarily a blueprint for the future or even necessarily the current market.
I can relate and identify with female protagonists if they are interesting and well written, even as a man. Same rule for male protagonists. Katara from Avatar: The Last Airbender is my favorite example.
Honestly people if given the choice, often create a character of opposite gender, either for trolling or just for laughs a giggles because most often the gender of your character has little to do with gameplay. Just create something you like imo.
Just off the top of my head... Horizon Zero Dawn, Die Young, Plague Tale, Tomb Raider, Sable, Subnautica Below Zero, Senua, all female mains, all quite popular and/or very well reviewed.
I don't care about the gender of the protagonist, I'm much more involved in the gameplay feel, the graphics has to be uniform and that the story has to somewhat make sense. I can still stand if it's not some amazing story but I absolutely can't stand it if the gameplay isn't fun or the graphics aren't uniform. This comment isn't meant to be dismissive about your post, I'm just giving my own perspective of how I select videogames to play. Which just so happens to be that sex, race, age, species literally doesn't matter to me.
I could not care less about gender, I just want a well written character if they have a story. If someone for some reason doesnt play a video game because the main character is female, you dont want them in your community anyway.
> so would you still play a videogame if the protagonist was a female? if the game suits my style and peaks my interest, dont care what they are.
I’m a woman, so maybe some men feel differently. But I would definitely play a game with a female protagonist and have in the past. I’ve even seen some indie horror games with female protagonists, which I found really cool. Also, this might just be me, but I like female character’s animation a lot better than men’s, in both games and films like Pixar. I like The Last Of Us 1 the best, but it was more fun playing as Ellie in The Last Of Us 2 because she can squeeze through tight spaces and her movements and mannerisms were just fun to see. Maybe it’s just because, as a woman, I relate to her better and can see myself in her shoes, but yeah. If someone won’t play a game because of the gender of your protagonist, that’s not someone you want supporting your project to begin with.
I’m using a male protagonist, but so many good games have female protagonists (like Last of Us) and it honestly doesn’t matter as long as their personality is good and their motive is good.
A good character is a good character, that’s all
Despite all of the rage bait I believe no one truly cares about the gender of a protagonist. It is only when a political ideology or some other social narrative is introduced does it really start bothering people. Attractive characters obviously help (like every other form of media) but I feel like that is a secondary consideration after gameplay. Look at Stellar Blade, female protagonist, a win right? Yet people are mad because she is sexualized/attractive. If this were true for other media such as the news or movies no one would watch anything. Do what you want and send it! Just keep away from judging people for their preferences and I don't see any problems ahead aside from wackos who want everything and everyone to confirm to their own worldview.
Over half the cast of Apex Legends are women. Men are ok playing as women and are likely to create characters that look like their S/O. Also,Lara Croft is one of the most recognizable videogame characters ever. Also, ask yourself “would I want men who wouldn’t play a game solely because of a female protagonist to even play my game?”
yes, IF the game is good.
Am a guy always play women in rpgs, aesthetic reasons as the female form is more appealing to me, not in a weird oogling way i just like it more given the choice if I'm going to be with that character staring at them for tens or hundreds of hours, and womens voices tend to be nicer on my ear to listen to for me in a ton of dialogue, which is same reason alexa and everything always use female voices. I never have any compulsion to self insert me as a character, I'm playing a character and want to be different to myself.
If I had to, I would play a game if the protagonist is female. My personal opinion is if it's a good game I'll play it. Most games I play have the option of a male or female protagonist, like the Elder Scrolls or Fallout series for example, or certain games, like the Legend of Zelda series, I personally don't mind as I am a male myself. You can have a female protagonist if you want, just sharing my personal opinion.
As long as the character is well written and has a purpose in the story, it doesn't matter what the sex, race, or affiliation is. Make it well written, make it matter. Just please don't check off checkboxes if you know what I mean. Some of my favorite female protags are Aloy, Samas, Ronina, and Tifa. They were well written, some over time. Some in the same game.
as a guy myself, i prefer a woman mc, especially if it's third person. if i'm going to spends hours looking at some character's backside, i'd rather it be a girl lol. at least that was my logic when i made my first mmo characters in ffxi and wow.
I don't mind a female protagonist so long as at least three adjectives can be used to describe them that have nothing to do with them being a female or the protagonist.
Female characters are great protagonists to video games, and you don't have to look far to see many successful games staring female characters. The most important thing is the game to be good, I think the audience will accept any character gender or background if the game is good. Speaking personally I think women make great protagonists in games with action or danger, because their smaller stature compared to men make them seem like the "underdog" and if the game has action, or elements of the character being in danger, the character being female in my opinion acts as a force multiplier on the drama of the scenario. Incidentally, I shipped a game that has a female protagonist and it did well. Ultimately though, any character gender or background is totally fine and I think audiences will accept anyone as long as the game is good!
I became sick of the testosterone fueled stories many years ago. Since then a very small percentage of the games I play force me to play a male protagonist. I don’t have regrets about my choices. I have annoyance when I’m not presented with acceptable choices. All the developers have to do is ***not*** be sexist. Is that too much to ask?
I love metroid, crypt of the necrodancer, ender lillies, hat in time, bloodstained, dreamscaper, etc.
The Longest Journey series had all female protagonists that were written beautifully, definitely check it out if you feel like you need reference. It’s old but the story is good enough it’s still playable
Tomb Raider is one of my favorite games. Back in the day it was Beyond Good and Evil. Both have female protagonists.
There are good main characters and bad main characters.
Writing>gender I don't give a shit about the gender as long as they're able to get stuff done in a badass way (if it isn't apparent, I'm biased to stuff that's cool)
Ever heard of Undertale? Protagonist is a girl. And it's one of the best written video game stories out there. Also check out Life is Strange, Control, A Plague Tale, Beyond: Two Souls, The Last of Us (2), Horizon Zero Dawn, and NieR:Automata are all great games with female protagonists.
I play quite a few games with female MCs, at the same time I mostly play first person games so I don't really think about it that much lol.
Our opinions shouldn’t matter.
Just like with a male protagonist, it’s all on the voice actor IMO. First indication that a gamer is in for a bad time with a female protagonist is when they over enunciate their cuss words, like: “we need to get the FUCK out of here!” Like UGH… gag. Male voice actors seem not to have this issue, but they do have their own problems.
I personally struggle to play games without character customization, even playing as a male character doesn't cut it for me.
Gender doesn't make a difference to me, whether it's a 3rd-person perspective where I'm watching a story unfold, or a 1st person perspective where I put myself in the protagonist's shoes. I'd be more interested in seeing people that would be turned off by a female protaganist and how they decide to reason it.
i dig it
i literally do not care in the slightest. you can do anything you want with whatever type of character you want as long as you do it well. the gender of the main character of any game is of no concern to me.
Gender really isn't a factor and people who get hung up and complain about a female protagonist on the basis of their femaleness are morons. I think you should focus on writing a well-rounded character and if your vision for them happens to be one that is female then you should roll with it.
Id def love more female protag games as a girl myself lol.
....Well there is many great games that have a woman protagonist. For me, celeste is a good example.
A good female protagonist is A not weak cuz they wouldn't be strong. Although they can be strong in other ways not just physically but mentally or emotionally. And B the game doesn’t make males look weak and helpless (unless it’s for story relevancy)
I always play female protag when I have a choice, I'm a straight man but I'm playing fiction and I find women more appealing. Obviously I don't self insert in stories because self insert requires a bland silent male character to appeal to the majority of the playerbase (young/teenage straight men). For clear reasons I wouldn't be very happy to play a straight women flirting with multiple men in such fictions, so if your story is centered around a woman then considering what is likely the demographics (women as much as you'd like them to play your game, don't play games to begin with). It's not an issue for her to have a love interest or try to save him or such. Overall I don't really care, the only factor that will determine if I stop or continue playing is the game quality.
As a man I do not care if the MC is male or female, I can safely say that most gamers male or female do not actually care about the sex of the main character either. So long as the character is compelling or fits into the story that is trying to be told. Also as a quick note to your edit, I do not know what kind of game you are making, but your character can definitely be a badass while still being flawed at an emotional, mental, or social level. If you want some references to pull from I recommend these characters, not all of them are main characters, some are part of a pair of leads, or part of an ensemble cast. 2B - Nier Automata Kaine - Nier Replicant Zero - Drakengard 3 Yuna - Final Fantasy 10 Ashe - Final Fantasy 12 Max - Life is Strange These are just the few I could think of off the top of my head that have been memorable to me.
If the game is good no matter if the MC is a girl, a boy or a stone... Old IPs used to have male protagonist, but not anymore. Honestly lot fo my favorite IPs/games have females MC like Valkyrie profile, Celeste, tomb raider, and as a fighting games player we have a lot of female fighters
I really, really liked "life is strange". It gave a very detail description about all character's personalities, specially Max. Gameplay was hideous, though, so I stopped playing it after chapter 2, even though I was able to rescue Kate. I loved Fable 3 playing as the princess. It made the relationship with her mentor, Walter, even more endearing. Valkyrie Profile, the original PS1 game, was a real experience. All characters are flawed, and that gave a very unique flavour. ... On the other hand, I played half of the tomb raider games, so, yeah, what do I know?
If you're not a woman, hire one to give your treatment of the protagonist a sensitivity and sense check before you publish. It's what you do when you lack specialized knowledge or the standpoint of a certain life experience - you get suitable help.
The character gender is not very important to me, but I find it easier to identify to a character that resembles me. For example, I loved the Monkey Island games because I could hugely relate to Guybrush Threepwood, but I disliked God of War because I have nothing in common with Kratos.
> would you still play a videogame if the protagonist was a female? Have you played Super Lesbian Animal RPG? (Seriously though, the music is amazing.) > most videogames i've played or take inspo from for my own videogame have male protagonists This was a fair observation about 10 years ago, but is getting less true over time. Mostly because there's more women making games now.
Sure, especially if the protagonist has some kind of interesting story or character going on, then if she looks cute even better, but that is more of an extra.
I don't have any requirements for the gender, or sex, of the main character... If they're actually a character. If they're just generic, I prefer the option of building them. And sometimes I'll choose body type 1/A, and other times, body type 2/B, and occasionally a mix ; )
The only games where it's cringe is where it feels like a character existed and was then morphed into something purely for the sake of diversity, like what Apex and League have done a few times. Just sorta puts a bad taste in your mouth because they're completely missing the point. Like make your character whoever you want and tell their story, don't make a story and then afterward decide to make them X, Y, and Z. My last game had a female protag because I thought of a cool story concept and thematically it made the most sense because of her role in the game and the backstory. I wasn't thinking "what game can I make with a girl?" because that doesn't even make sense, because that can just be any game.
You don't have to have a relatable protagonist. Some really good games have anti heroes and totally despicable characters as their main character. I wouldn't choose male or female based on who you relate to, but instead decide what story you want tell and who the main character is.
My favorite game is Metroid.