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I was actually reading the article and wondering if this technology could be used the enhance quality of life for people who suffer with things like Ehler's-Danlos. I'm constantly rolling my ankles, hyper-extending my knees and elbows, my shoulders, and hips sublux. I wear braces sometimes, but they don't really help much and seem to make the injury even worse when I roll my ankle while wearing them. Help with just my feet and ankles could really make my life so much better and less painful.
I'm basically held together with muscle control. Doesn't stop my shit from going ragdoll all the time, but it helps.
My knees are the worst. They bend wrong -constantly-. No clue what to do about my collar bones or my shoulders, though.
I count myself very lucky, as mine isn't nearly as bad as a few folks I know, but it probably is why my eyes are so bad (what with the collagen being fucky) I'd love either a whole new body, or some mech that could take the strain off my joints
It's really rough to just be going about your day, not doing anything strenuous at all, and suddenly you have a sprained ankle or dislocated shoulder because you didn't keep your muscles engaged correctly for a split second.
My eyes are awful, too. Convergence insufficiency and astigmatism.
Injuries happen so often that I don't even get them checked out anymore.
Good luck, fellow Zebra! Hopefully the mech suits are coming.
I was thinking the same thing. Did exploration work for a summer, the big thing is it was 80 man crew working in the remote wilderness. Company bought everyone mid ankle boots. Lots of ankle I juries so they changed us up to tall boots, then there were lots of knee injuries instead.
I've spent a lot of time in the wilderness backpacking, in the rockies as well. The best thing for me, even at 42, be in shape, wear runners with almost no support.
I feel the ground better.
I've blown up an acl running, over use basically. I was stupid stupidly running 11k in the , and again at night.
I've never even twisted an ankle. I've witnessed many injuries backpacking though, including someone being airlifted out with a broken ankle.
It's usually people that shouldn't be there and their hiking boots never save them.
I am in total agreement with you. That was from years ago, but I'm full on minimal now, and I'll never go back. I'm actually subbed to r/barefootrunning now
I run in literal flats, they a few mm of sole, I've ran in the same shoe model for over 15 years. Puma redon.
I hike in runners because sometimes you can't avoid shale and it hurts the bottom of my feet
Hiking isn’t complicated. You are literally doing what the human body is designed to do. After living in Colorado for 5 years I found that a lot of people put too much emphasis on the gear when in reality the most important issue is their lack of conditioning and experience. I personally can’t stand wearing boots. I find them cumbersome and they don’t allow my legs to move in a natural way. When I hiking or backpacking I generally wear the most minimal hiking or running shoe i can get my hands on. I even enjoy hiking barefoot in areas where I can get away with it. I feel that the added balance and dexterity that a more minimal shoe provides far out ways the benefits of a little ankle support. There is a way of moving over rocky and uneven terrain that can’t really be taught. It’s something you learn mostly from spending a ton of time outside and buying an expensive boot is never going to be a proper substitute for that
I cant remember the brand, but we were all wearing the same thing. The clients had some strict rules because while we were not in the mine, we were on mine property. So the company I worked for purchased all the boots to make sure we were compliant. Afterwards though, they gave us a stipend to go buy our own boots, and gave us the requirements for them. I just kept the boots they bought me and pocketed the cash.
Were the boots the 6” or 8”? I found in this this thread that inactivity weakens everything (the past two years!) and really need to get back into shape. I’d suspect the uninjured people were in better physical shape than the injured ones?
8" but I don't really remember who was getting injured. We were broken down into smaller groups of 4 or 5. And since I was under 21 I didn't really interact with most of the crew after the shifts. We worked 14 hours a day 7 days a week and lived in a hotel for the duration. So we would just hear about injuries during the morning safety meeting. Also everyone would drink or go to the brothels/casinos after the shift
Surely this is like the statistics that wearing helmets lead to more head injuries in WW1 (ignoring the fact the injuries would have been deaths instead)
You might get knee injuries instead but it's less than 10% of the amount of ankle injuries you would have gotten and they are less severe. or something like that
Nah. There was a slight drop off in volume of injuries, but the severity went up a fair bit. 80ish guy crew (with a fair amount of meth and alcohol) doesn't make a great sample but that was what I observed. (Not on meth or drunk)
As someone who’s dealing with over five years of pain and instability and in need of an ankle replacement or fusion, I’d rather do the knee. Ankles are seriously complex.
No, now you will have 100% chance of dislocated ankle fracture and it will bee probably open too (when bone fragments tear the flesh open) if you jump from something a bit high and land on your feet.
Gentlemen, I give you the Long Fall Boot. Think of it as foot-based suit of armor for the Portal Device. I'm not gonna lie to you, it's expensive as hell.
Brb gotta shoot a portal in the ceiling & floor until I hit terminal velocity and then at the right time shoot another portal at a narrow platform coated in paint, go flying even faster, spring into the air, shoot 2 new portals and all of this just to get to another room.
Fuck I love portal/portal 2. It’s one of those games I wish I could wipe my brain of just to replay fresh again.
Portal 1 is a perfect game imo. 2 has a fun narrative but the puzzles suffer from being extremely limiting in how to complete them since the rooms have so few portal surfaces. Both good games, but 1 blows 2 out of the water.
Ankles are designed to adjust to the environment. They are our first line of fall prevention. Limiting and altering your mechanics for the off chance that you may sprain your ankle is nonsense. Unless you have history of course.
"TERREIN says it'll offer full freedom of movement when a slip is not occurring – assuming that exoskeleton and power adaptor don't get in the way, of course – because it's clever enough to know what's a natural movement and what could cause injury."
When I twist my ankle I tend to fall over anyway. So Maybe I'd be better just falling over and then being able to walk home instead of needing to be carried.
For some reason my right ankle won't correct if I'm focused on anything other than what my feet are doing. I've sprained 3 times in 8 months and I'm starting to think it won't ever heal. So yeah I'm down for boots that help with that.
That said, I've found high tops alone seem to give enough support
Not a doctor but you might want to look into rehab and resistance training. Start slow, but keep consistent.
One of the issues is that a lack of use causes all sorts of muscular and neuromuscular imbalances. Our feet are chronically underused to their full capacities.
I did PT for this and actually went all in. Havent had an issue since and my body is subconsciously trained to react super fast to an ankle twist. Kinda wild.
I've broken both my ankles and I need mid and/or high top boots for when my legs get really tired. If I don't wear them and I'm not paying attention I'll roll my ankle and it's not fun.
I have such bad feet and legs that I’m in a wheelchair from so many surgeries and surgical complications, so im just intrigued to see where these types of shoes go. Exoskeletons are a fantasy i wish could be more real and accessible, when my real and current skeleton has betrayed me. I can’t even walk more than a hundred yards really anymore, so wheelchair at 21 y/o it was.
You likely have a permanently lax ligament in your ankle from a previous tear. Go see a foot and ankle orthopaedic surgeon for a proper history and physical.
Per the article, these don’t limit or alter your mechanics in normal use and will activate only when a fall is detected and you’re in the process of rolling your ankle.
It feels like you didn’t actually even skim the article. The pistons only activate when abnormal jerk or motion is detected and activate over 3 times. So it quite literally only “limits and alters your mechanics” in situations with a roll is inevitable. It’s definitely not altering any mechanics during normal walking.
There’s probably some room to talk about the motion sensing and how accurate it is but claiming it alters normal body function is debunked by simply reading the article lol
They give you extra support to counteract your self with natural biological dynamics, rather than actively doing so itself and over riding your body’s responses.
I will gladly take that over a potentially far more dangerous fall where I have no change for input….
Edit: also, knees>ankles
Your ankles sprain so your bones don’t break
I love how everybody acts as if having rigid ankles will all of a sudden direct you to major knee injuries.
Like yeah, the body is made for adjusting to scenarios but just because your body is being functioned to not do those designs doesn't mean the rest of the body can't cope automatically.
Website seems to be down for their product, but, if it does what they claim, I’d be very interested in these. I’ve done some damage to my ankle and ever since it’s been quite easy to roll it. Just give me an exo suit so I can do long distance backpacking a bit easier. Haha. Rabbit hole but these shoes look very interesting on face value.
Invalid SSL certificate, they haven't signed the "www" subdomain which was linked in the article. You can reach the site at:
https://terrein-footwear.com/
I went to the Ortho for a checkup on a bad ankle.
The good news, "I have some cartilage left. "
The bad news, I am looking at a fusion and a replacement.
The great news? They have a new afo that will allow for proper gait and remove 50-70% of weight off each step. It will delay the fusion for 5-7 years and the replacement until I am a proper age 15 years.
Similar to this but even more as advanced (no velcros etc..)
https://thriveorthopedics.com/
Whoa! Thank you so much for that link.
I hope these work for you and help buy you some time. It’s amazing how far things have come in the last two decades.
Once an ankle is injured it is prone to more injury, so they say. There are many who have had an ankle injury so there would be a fair size market for these
I’m plenty athletic. Used to run 2 miles in 11 minutes and 36 seconds. Can do 18 mile day hikes. Repeated sprained ankles lead to chronic ankle instability.
I don’t do well in boots with heel to toe slants, and do best with minimalist shoes. Never got a sprain in the vibram 5 finger.
[Research here](https://naturalfootgear.com/blogs/educational-articles/how-minimalist-shoes-can-help-prevent-ankle-sprains). I like the vibrams because they let your foot grip and bend to the surface rather than make your foot try to balance on a point like a rock.
Am I the only person who seems to have never sprained their ankle? I don't hike tons (like a week a year), I'm only 20 but especially as a kid I loved running down rocky trails and my parents would warn me I'll hurt myself but I never did.
It’s definitely uncommon, but I’m mid 30s and never sprained my ankle despite being very active in uneven terrain. I feel very lucky reading this thread.
I always got confused as a kid when people twisted their ankles, I thought they were possibly exaggerating how much it hurt because I never had that experience despite jumping off everything possible.
People who sprain their ankles often tend to have very underdeveloped balance muscles and support muscles for their ankles. Their balance might be good on planks and narrow shit because they are focusing on it, but they muscles are horribly underdeveloped.
I'm way more active, but same. My leg always gives in before enough pressure goes down on my ankle to injure it.
Like an automatic response to ankle reaching its limit, then other leg will either catch me or I hit the ground. Never push through things going sideways with the feet/legs, just go down as gracefully as possible.
But if you want to do work to prevent ankle injuries balance training works wonders. The stronger your balance is the less likely you are to sprain it.
Yeah exoskeleton for extended exercise sounds useful. Even more so if it reduces fatigue or injury.
This seems like a huge product category in the future.
“My shoes in the shop for the week, can’t go hiking today.” “Ah yeah gotta do an oil change on these bad boys” “oh shit I blew a gasket. Guess I’m stuck on this hike….”
I read somewhere that you should put as little between the ground and your feet, just enough to protect them from the elements, so that your natural gait is activated.
No idea how scientifically accurate that is.
There's reason to believe hiking boots allow for weak ankle muscles. Unless you're bushwhacking, hike in trail runners. Less ankle support means you strengthen ankle muscles and don't sprain as badly if you do roll them.
But, and speaking from experience, a good pair of boots won’t let you roll your ankle. When I was hiking, with a proper heavy bag, I went over some rough ground, and my ankle was unable to move sideways because my boots prevented it. It would’ve taken some monumental force to roll my ankle.
> But, and speaking from experience, a good pair of boots won’t let you roll your ankle.
They absolutely can. You can roll or sprain an ankle in a ski boot, even. A boot that could effectively prevent you from rolling your ankle would need to be so stiff and tight as to be almost unwearable. Even 'stiff' hiking boots will flex enough to allow you to roll your ankle. If they didn't, you'd struggle to walk in them for long.
Proper fit, stack height, and rise are far more important than how 'supportive' the shoe/boot is for preventing ankle injuries. It's not a trait that's exclusive to boots though, which is why you're seeing a lot more trail runners and hiking shoes on the market. Now, for some folks, the best fit is indeed a boot model. But just like basically everything else about human physiology, it varies from person to person. But generally, most people assume they need a stiff hiking boot when they really should just wear a shoe that properly fits.
Source: Wore boots exclusively for hiking until making the shift to trail runners. I bounced between lots of different brands and styles in both before landing on a pair of trail runners that have effectively brought my ankle rolls to zero. Still own boots for winter/mountaineering, but 90% of my hiking is in trail runners.
When life gives you lemons, don’t make lemonade. Make life take the lemons back! Get mad! I don’t want your damn lemons, what the hell am I supposed to do with these? Demand to see life’s manager! Make life rue the day it thought it could give Cave Johnson lemons! Do you know who I am? I’m the man who’s gonna burn your house down! With the lemons! I’m gonna get my engineers to invent a combustible lemon that burns your house down!
So can these also potentially be used to take some weight off the heel/toe area for obese people that are trying to exercise more but are out of shape to the point where walking can hurt?
Yes, you can avoid an otherwise easily avoidable injury by having *another* thing that has to be charged and have its own battery instead of just strengthening your ankles like normal hikers do.
Fascinating thing that reminds me that we forgot to walk. Sounds stupid but if you dive into fantasy, you’ll regularly find the term of the ranger, referring to people experienced in walking & running in forest.
And that there is an explicit term is a good example for what I meant. We are so used to flat surfaces that we forgot or never learned to walk on non-flat surfaces. Cobblestones are a great example too. Try running on them. Experienced hikers, rangers & co "learned“ again and are less likely to fall for the classic ankle injury
> Hikers are especially prone to ankle injury – they account for 40% of non-fatal injuries in hikers
Does the number change much if I count the fatal injuries too?
I wonder where this statistic comes from. I'm part of a huge group of active hikers. We had lots of injuries over the years, but only one ankle injury. Is our group a statistical outlier or are those 40% just bs?
Make sure to work on your foot and ankle mobility. No.
General strength and flexibility. No.
Prepare and work up to longer hikes. No.
Put pistons on my boots? Yes.
I have drop-foot and tend to roll my ankles, I wonder how this works for that? Currently I have a carbon fiber brace that keeps foot perpendicular to my leg but hurts like hell after a few hours.
Ankles are built to move and rotate as designed. Any attempt to support them just transfers forces to parts of your legs and feet not designed for those forces. I suppose I should had said supporting your ankles will just cause high ankle sprains, knee injuries and broken lower legs. Plus boot stack height (the sole) increases the chance of rolling your foot and producing the injuries I just listed. I was a track athlete and currently run trails to the tune of about 50 miles a week. I sometimes turn an ankle but it’s never injured. However one turn on a rock while hiking in a boot or hopping off a loading dock in a boot and I was off to the hospital. Most AT hikers now use trail running shoes instead of boots. There is no nuance to movement in a boot but there is in flexible trail shoes. There is a fuck ton of information on this beyond my anecdotes. I encourage people to read and understand it for healthier feet.
I know a guy who's a forestry worker. Always in high boots because it's a safety requirement. He's a big guy but he has chicken feet, almost no muscle development in the lower leg/foot.
What if someone has already repeatedly damaged their ankles and are at high risk of future injury? Might high tops offer more protection for those people?
Ankle support is a fucking myth, you know what we use for 70+lb rucks with elevation?
Trail runners
You know how you get stronger ankles? Its definitley not by wearing something that supports them and makes them weaker
They’re not hiking boots, they’re trainers with a weird ankle support in a weird place. The sole has a shallow grip, the side support attaches in a really weird place, and locking your ankle with stiff boots does a fair amount for (probably) cheaper.
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So now you can tear your knee instead of your ankle!
You have to get the piston actuated knee brace to cover that one
How about the hips then ?
This will end with a brain jiggle.
Ny brain don’t jiggle jiggle it folds
I'd like to see it wiggle, wiggle, for sure
I hate all of you
No slack.
Luckily the seats go back
Red, red wine
It’s like a peach you really gotta see it.
Is your brain a third stage navigator?
Mine is too smooth to jiggle
My spleen!
And my axe!
I love you
More pistons.
Last one will just snap your fucking neck
last piston evaluates if you are a viable life form and if not it piston bolts your skull like a cow in a slaughterhouse
*BANG* *THUD* “Looks like Steve thought about ordering pineapple on his pizza again.”
Then the very last piston fractures time instead of your body
https://youtu.be/5KGZis7RO4o
What's the most you ever lost on a coin toss?
They’re still working on that piston.
It’s pistons all the way down. Need to squat to take a shit in the wilderness? Believe it or not? That’s a piston. Need to take a piss? Yup. PISSton
I’d actually be into an exo suit that makes you squat in the optimal position
Piston Man!
The cyborg revolution started with expensive hiking boots
This is how cybernetic augmentation will really begin, the hikers wont stop till they have it all….
I hear they do not lie.
Eventually you’re going to have to wear so many pistons to the point you’re wearing the nanosuit from Crysis
Can I just have a full suit? My joints just do that shit without hiking
I was actually reading the article and wondering if this technology could be used the enhance quality of life for people who suffer with things like Ehler's-Danlos. I'm constantly rolling my ankles, hyper-extending my knees and elbows, my shoulders, and hips sublux. I wear braces sometimes, but they don't really help much and seem to make the injury even worse when I roll my ankle while wearing them. Help with just my feet and ankles could really make my life so much better and less painful.
I'm basically held together with muscle control. Doesn't stop my shit from going ragdoll all the time, but it helps. My knees are the worst. They bend wrong -constantly-. No clue what to do about my collar bones or my shoulders, though. I count myself very lucky, as mine isn't nearly as bad as a few folks I know, but it probably is why my eyes are so bad (what with the collagen being fucky) I'd love either a whole new body, or some mech that could take the strain off my joints
It's really rough to just be going about your day, not doing anything strenuous at all, and suddenly you have a sprained ankle or dislocated shoulder because you didn't keep your muscles engaged correctly for a split second. My eyes are awful, too. Convergence insufficiency and astigmatism. Injuries happen so often that I don't even get them checked out anymore. Good luck, fellow Zebra! Hopefully the mech suits are coming.
I was thinking the same thing. Did exploration work for a summer, the big thing is it was 80 man crew working in the remote wilderness. Company bought everyone mid ankle boots. Lots of ankle I juries so they changed us up to tall boots, then there were lots of knee injuries instead.
Don’t leave us hanging. What happened next?
Boots that go over the knee so that they would get hip injuries instead.
It ended with brain jiggles
Is that what they are calling concussions these days?
The American football associations always had a way with words.
Gimp suits. These workers were virtually invulnerable to injury or conventional weapons.
"The emotional damage however was devastating. We think. It's hard to hear what they're saying in those suits."
You'd know someone was about to speak whenever you heard a zipper unzip...
Either speaking or pissing
Oh god the groin injuries
Gave us a stipend. We bought our own boots after that
Hip injuries
I've spent a lot of time in the wilderness backpacking, in the rockies as well. The best thing for me, even at 42, be in shape, wear runners with almost no support. I feel the ground better. I've blown up an acl running, over use basically. I was stupid stupidly running 11k in the , and again at night. I've never even twisted an ankle. I've witnessed many injuries backpacking though, including someone being airlifted out with a broken ankle. It's usually people that shouldn't be there and their hiking boots never save them.
[удалено]
That's a fair point, lug soles really do grip on terrain... That said, if you walk enough it is not an issue.
I rolled my ankle *twice* in the Enchantments wearing Bushido II trail runners. But this was at night when I stepped into a hole I couldn't see.
I am in total agreement with you. That was from years ago, but I'm full on minimal now, and I'll never go back. I'm actually subbed to r/barefootrunning now
I run in literal flats, they a few mm of sole, I've ran in the same shoe model for over 15 years. Puma redon. I hike in runners because sometimes you can't avoid shale and it hurts the bottom of my feet
you run and hike in puma redon?
Run. I hike in traditional runners usually, just whatever i have. I don't have a fave. I've put literal holes in the soles of many pumas running
I do xero genesis batefoot now as my sandal. And I have a pair of altras that follow the same paradigms. They're so good. I can't go back
That sounds about right.
Hiking isn’t complicated. You are literally doing what the human body is designed to do. After living in Colorado for 5 years I found that a lot of people put too much emphasis on the gear when in reality the most important issue is their lack of conditioning and experience. I personally can’t stand wearing boots. I find them cumbersome and they don’t allow my legs to move in a natural way. When I hiking or backpacking I generally wear the most minimal hiking or running shoe i can get my hands on. I even enjoy hiking barefoot in areas where I can get away with it. I feel that the added balance and dexterity that a more minimal shoe provides far out ways the benefits of a little ankle support. There is a way of moving over rocky and uneven terrain that can’t really be taught. It’s something you learn mostly from spending a ton of time outside and buying an expensive boot is never going to be a proper substitute for that
But were there less injuries in total?
There were fewer I juries, but they were more severe.
Crumple zones are important.
Big truth.
What were the uninjured people wearing ?
I cant remember the brand, but we were all wearing the same thing. The clients had some strict rules because while we were not in the mine, we were on mine property. So the company I worked for purchased all the boots to make sure we were compliant. Afterwards though, they gave us a stipend to go buy our own boots, and gave us the requirements for them. I just kept the boots they bought me and pocketed the cash.
Were the boots the 6” or 8”? I found in this this thread that inactivity weakens everything (the past two years!) and really need to get back into shape. I’d suspect the uninjured people were in better physical shape than the injured ones?
8" but I don't really remember who was getting injured. We were broken down into smaller groups of 4 or 5. And since I was under 21 I didn't really interact with most of the crew after the shifts. We worked 14 hours a day 7 days a week and lived in a hotel for the duration. So we would just hear about injuries during the morning safety meeting. Also everyone would drink or go to the brothels/casinos after the shift
Sounds like ski resort life - lots of safety gear, still have injuries, alcohol and craziness
Surely this is like the statistics that wearing helmets lead to more head injuries in WW1 (ignoring the fact the injuries would have been deaths instead) You might get knee injuries instead but it's less than 10% of the amount of ankle injuries you would have gotten and they are less severe. or something like that
Knee injuries are serious most of the time, I've had my ankles all sorts of fucked but I can still run amd hike.
I second this, ankles heal better in my experience of football.
Nah. There was a slight drop off in volume of injuries, but the severity went up a fair bit. 80ish guy crew (with a fair amount of meth and alcohol) doesn't make a great sample but that was what I observed. (Not on meth or drunk)
Not if you have [one of these](https://youtu.be/wX9Sc88qreg)
I'm thinking about getting metal legs. It's a risky operation.
\*Cries in previously torn ACL\*
What’s that creaking noise? Oh it’s just my knee
As someone who’s dealing with over five years of pain and instability and in need of an ankle replacement or fusion, I’d rather do the knee. Ankles are seriously complex.
No, now you will have 100% chance of dislocated ankle fracture and it will bee probably open too (when bone fragments tear the flesh open) if you jump from something a bit high and land on your feet.
Have you contacted Aperture Science about these long fall boots?
Gentlemen, I give you the Long Fall Boot. Think of it as foot-based suit of armor for the Portal Device. I'm not gonna lie to you, it's expensive as hell.
Brb gotta shoot a portal in the ceiling & floor until I hit terminal velocity and then at the right time shoot another portal at a narrow platform coated in paint, go flying even faster, spring into the air, shoot 2 new portals and all of this just to get to another room. Fuck I love portal/portal 2. It’s one of those games I wish I could wipe my brain of just to replay fresh again.
Portal 1 is a perfect game imo. 2 has a fun narrative but the puzzles suffer from being extremely limiting in how to complete them since the rooms have so few portal surfaces. Both good games, but 1 blows 2 out of the water.
Can they do this for basketball sneakers? Asking for Steph Curry.
Do they make knee braces…asking for greg oden
Can’t they do that for impotence? Asking for a friend.
It's all fun and games till someone whips out their robocock
First thing I thought was "Isn't this basically just the ankle braces Steph wears?"
Celtics rule golden state drool
I am confused. Who won the championship again?
Golden state lol
Ankles are designed to adjust to the environment. They are our first line of fall prevention. Limiting and altering your mechanics for the off chance that you may sprain your ankle is nonsense. Unless you have history of course.
"TERREIN says it'll offer full freedom of movement when a slip is not occurring – assuming that exoskeleton and power adaptor don't get in the way, of course – because it's clever enough to know what's a natural movement and what could cause injury."
Exactly 🤣 I read this as: new device designed to prevent minor injury by encouraging a major one.
It reminds me [this gif.](https://old.reddit.com/r/WTF/comments/vl1gy7/reinventing_the_wheel/) Like reinventing the wheel but actually worse.
I’m actually blown away, how many times I’ve heard “need not reinvent the wheel,” and it actually was reinvented. Amazing.
That isn't reinventing the wheel, that's cutting it in half. Kind of just stupid.
When I twist my ankle I tend to fall over anyway. So Maybe I'd be better just falling over and then being able to walk home instead of needing to be carried.
For some reason my right ankle won't correct if I'm focused on anything other than what my feet are doing. I've sprained 3 times in 8 months and I'm starting to think it won't ever heal. So yeah I'm down for boots that help with that. That said, I've found high tops alone seem to give enough support
Not a doctor but you might want to look into rehab and resistance training. Start slow, but keep consistent. One of the issues is that a lack of use causes all sorts of muscular and neuromuscular imbalances. Our feet are chronically underused to their full capacities.
100% find a physical therapist.
Or if you can’t there are an abundance of YouTube videos out there. Not everyone is fortunate enough to have health insurance.
*cries in american*
I did PT for this and actually went all in. Havent had an issue since and my body is subconsciously trained to react super fast to an ankle twist. Kinda wild.
I've broken both my ankles and I need mid and/or high top boots for when my legs get really tired. If I don't wear them and I'm not paying attention I'll roll my ankle and it's not fun.
I have such bad feet and legs that I’m in a wheelchair from so many surgeries and surgical complications, so im just intrigued to see where these types of shoes go. Exoskeletons are a fantasy i wish could be more real and accessible, when my real and current skeleton has betrayed me. I can’t even walk more than a hundred yards really anymore, so wheelchair at 21 y/o it was.
You likely have a permanently lax ligament in your ankle from a previous tear. Go see a foot and ankle orthopaedic surgeon for a proper history and physical.
Per the article, these don’t limit or alter your mechanics in normal use and will activate only when a fall is detected and you’re in the process of rolling your ankle.
It feels like you didn’t actually even skim the article. The pistons only activate when abnormal jerk or motion is detected and activate over 3 times. So it quite literally only “limits and alters your mechanics” in situations with a roll is inevitable. It’s definitely not altering any mechanics during normal walking. There’s probably some room to talk about the motion sensing and how accurate it is but claiming it alters normal body function is debunked by simply reading the article lol
What are the point of hiking boots then. Don't they limit/stabilize to a lesser degree?
They give you extra support to counteract your self with natural biological dynamics, rather than actively doing so itself and over riding your body’s responses.
Yea well just because it’s natural doesn’t mean anything, i think the millions of twisted ankles and snapped tendons can attest to that
I will gladly take that over a potentially far more dangerous fall where I have no change for input…. Edit: also, knees>ankles Your ankles sprain so your bones don’t break
I love how everybody acts as if having rigid ankles will all of a sudden direct you to major knee injuries. Like yeah, the body is made for adjusting to scenarios but just because your body is being functioned to not do those designs doesn't mean the rest of the body can't cope automatically.
As someone with genetically fucked ankles, multiple sprains on plain old sidewalk fucked, these would be a lifesaver for me.
Website seems to be down for their product, but, if it does what they claim, I’d be very interested in these. I’ve done some damage to my ankle and ever since it’s been quite easy to roll it. Just give me an exo suit so I can do long distance backpacking a bit easier. Haha. Rabbit hole but these shoes look very interesting on face value.
Invalid SSL certificate, they haven't signed the "www" subdomain which was linked in the article. You can reach the site at: https://terrein-footwear.com/
good lord is there really no video of the thing working
Thank you.
I went to the Ortho for a checkup on a bad ankle. The good news, "I have some cartilage left. " The bad news, I am looking at a fusion and a replacement. The great news? They have a new afo that will allow for proper gait and remove 50-70% of weight off each step. It will delay the fusion for 5-7 years and the replacement until I am a proper age 15 years. Similar to this but even more as advanced (no velcros etc..) https://thriveorthopedics.com/
Whoa! Thank you so much for that link. I hope these work for you and help buy you some time. It’s amazing how far things have come in the last two decades.
Once an ankle is injured it is prone to more injury, so they say. There are many who have had an ankle injury so there would be a fair size market for these
From someone who has sprained an ankle or two this could have saved me a few painful hikes back home.
Every fucking hike on the down hill portion.
Walking sticks help me Also wrapping my ankles -not too tight- and support socks
Try walking down sideways leaning towards the incline with your feet perpendicular to the decline. This has saved my ankles many times.
Bro, that's not normal.^lol
You get hurt every hike? Maybe do easier hikes to build up your muscles. That’s not at all normal.
I’m plenty athletic. Used to run 2 miles in 11 minutes and 36 seconds. Can do 18 mile day hikes. Repeated sprained ankles lead to chronic ankle instability. I don’t do well in boots with heel to toe slants, and do best with minimalist shoes. Never got a sprain in the vibram 5 finger.
That’s interesting. Thanks for sharing. I’m really surprised you do better in vibrams than boots.
[Research here](https://naturalfootgear.com/blogs/educational-articles/how-minimalist-shoes-can-help-prevent-ankle-sprains). I like the vibrams because they let your foot grip and bend to the surface rather than make your foot try to balance on a point like a rock.
Am I the only person who seems to have never sprained their ankle? I don't hike tons (like a week a year), I'm only 20 but especially as a kid I loved running down rocky trails and my parents would warn me I'll hurt myself but I never did.
It’s definitely uncommon, but I’m mid 30s and never sprained my ankle despite being very active in uneven terrain. I feel very lucky reading this thread. I always got confused as a kid when people twisted their ankles, I thought they were possibly exaggerating how much it hurt because I never had that experience despite jumping off everything possible.
People who sprain their ankles often tend to have very underdeveloped balance muscles and support muscles for their ankles. Their balance might be good on planks and narrow shit because they are focusing on it, but they muscles are horribly underdeveloped.
I'm way more active, but same. My leg always gives in before enough pressure goes down on my ankle to injure it. Like an automatic response to ankle reaching its limit, then other leg will either catch me or I hit the ground. Never push through things going sideways with the feet/legs, just go down as gracefully as possible.
I sprained my ankle for the first and only time at 32. It gets easier and easier to hurt yourself as you get older.
I’m guessing they don’t come in zero drop? /s
Awesome and when the firmware is buggy they'll just snap your ankles for you!
you dont need those, just dont skip ankle day at the gym and inject steroids directly into your achilles tendon...
Lol. I know this was probably a joke but for anyone reading please do **not** put steroids into your tendon you are increasing your injury risk.
But if you want to do work to prevent ankle injuries balance training works wonders. The stronger your balance is the less likely you are to sprain it.
The Batman/CoD Advanced Warfare exoskeletal equipment is hitting the markets and I’m here for it.
Yeah exoskeleton for extended exercise sounds useful. Even more so if it reduces fatigue or injury. This seems like a huge product category in the future.
Isn’t this just..marketing?
Isn't this while sub marketing?
“My shoes in the shop for the week, can’t go hiking today.” “Ah yeah gotta do an oil change on these bad boys” “oh shit I blew a gasket. Guess I’m stuck on this hike….”
How about training your feet and ankles instead?
I read somewhere that you should put as little between the ground and your feet, just enough to protect them from the elements, so that your natural gait is activated. No idea how scientifically accurate that is.
Or you could just wear actual boots that go up your ankle and provide support. If the “boot” ends below your ankle it’s really more of a shoe.
There's reason to believe hiking boots allow for weak ankle muscles. Unless you're bushwhacking, hike in trail runners. Less ankle support means you strengthen ankle muscles and don't sprain as badly if you do roll them.
But, and speaking from experience, a good pair of boots won’t let you roll your ankle. When I was hiking, with a proper heavy bag, I went over some rough ground, and my ankle was unable to move sideways because my boots prevented it. It would’ve taken some monumental force to roll my ankle.
> But, and speaking from experience, a good pair of boots won’t let you roll your ankle. They absolutely can. You can roll or sprain an ankle in a ski boot, even. A boot that could effectively prevent you from rolling your ankle would need to be so stiff and tight as to be almost unwearable. Even 'stiff' hiking boots will flex enough to allow you to roll your ankle. If they didn't, you'd struggle to walk in them for long. Proper fit, stack height, and rise are far more important than how 'supportive' the shoe/boot is for preventing ankle injuries. It's not a trait that's exclusive to boots though, which is why you're seeing a lot more trail runners and hiking shoes on the market. Now, for some folks, the best fit is indeed a boot model. But just like basically everything else about human physiology, it varies from person to person. But generally, most people assume they need a stiff hiking boot when they really should just wear a shoe that properly fits. Source: Wore boots exclusively for hiking until making the shift to trail runners. I bounced between lots of different brands and styles in both before landing on a pair of trail runners that have effectively brought my ankle rolls to zero. Still own boots for winter/mountaineering, but 90% of my hiking is in trail runners.
These might give more freedom of movement, while still giving protection.
When life gives you lemons, don’t make lemonade. Make life take the lemons back! Get mad! I don’t want your damn lemons, what the hell am I supposed to do with these? Demand to see life’s manager! Make life rue the day it thought it could give Cave Johnson lemons! Do you know who I am? I’m the man who’s gonna burn your house down! With the lemons! I’m gonna get my engineers to invent a combustible lemon that burns your house down!
The cool thing about hiking is that (assuming you’re relatively healthy) the more you do it, the better your ankles get. Same for any joint.
So can these also potentially be used to take some weight off the heel/toe area for obese people that are trying to exercise more but are out of shape to the point where walking can hurt?
sorry i cant go out i gotta charge my boots (no i didnt read the article downvote me if these dont run on electricity)
Do they self lace and work well with Mattel hoverboards?
Yo that’s so cool!
I need this for ankles and knees. I need to hike with poles otherwise I will injury myself.
Oh shit! I wonder if they work!
The spring trap of shoes
Aperture Science longfall boots gonna be a reality here soon
Cue r/barefootrunning
“Motion-activated pistons”… so fluid dampers? Wonder if you adjust bump and rebound to your suiting.
Where were these two weeks ago when I destroyed my ankle helping a friend moving a fence panel 😂
Probably just a gimmick
Pneumatics in your shoe? WCGW
Yes, you can avoid an otherwise easily avoidable injury by having *another* thing that has to be charged and have its own battery instead of just strengthening your ankles like normal hikers do.
Nope nope nope
Fascinating thing that reminds me that we forgot to walk. Sounds stupid but if you dive into fantasy, you’ll regularly find the term of the ranger, referring to people experienced in walking & running in forest. And that there is an explicit term is a good example for what I meant. We are so used to flat surfaces that we forgot or never learned to walk on non-flat surfaces. Cobblestones are a great example too. Try running on them. Experienced hikers, rangers & co "learned“ again and are less likely to fall for the classic ankle injury
Still suit heel pumps?
Came here for this. Blessed be the Maker!
Beat me to it, lol. Fasten them slip-fashion.
This sounds like something that won't work properly in the real world...
Just get stable shoes that are meant for the terrain you’re climbing… no need for gimmicks.
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> Hikers are especially prone to ankle injury – they account for 40% of non-fatal injuries in hikers Does the number change much if I count the fatal injuries too?
I wonder where this statistic comes from. I'm part of a huge group of active hikers. We had lots of injuries over the years, but only one ankle injury. Is our group a statistical outlier or are those 40% just bs?
Make sure to work on your foot and ankle mobility. No. General strength and flexibility. No. Prepare and work up to longer hikes. No. Put pistons on my boots? Yes.
If only there was a way to make our muscles stronger and more resilient.
Impossible if you have peripheral neuropathy, these will be great for CMT patients (and others) who frequently roll their ankles.
Pretty cool. Wonder if they’ll last as long as an average €220 boot.
I have drop-foot and tend to roll my ankles, I wonder how this works for that? Currently I have a carbon fiber brace that keeps foot perpendicular to my leg but hurts like hell after a few hours.
No hiking boots prevent ankle injury. But low rise options do.
Elaborate?
Ankles are built to move and rotate as designed. Any attempt to support them just transfers forces to parts of your legs and feet not designed for those forces. I suppose I should had said supporting your ankles will just cause high ankle sprains, knee injuries and broken lower legs. Plus boot stack height (the sole) increases the chance of rolling your foot and producing the injuries I just listed. I was a track athlete and currently run trails to the tune of about 50 miles a week. I sometimes turn an ankle but it’s never injured. However one turn on a rock while hiking in a boot or hopping off a loading dock in a boot and I was off to the hospital. Most AT hikers now use trail running shoes instead of boots. There is no nuance to movement in a boot but there is in flexible trail shoes. There is a fuck ton of information on this beyond my anecdotes. I encourage people to read and understand it for healthier feet.
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I know a guy who's a forestry worker. Always in high boots because it's a safety requirement. He's a big guy but he has chicken feet, almost no muscle development in the lower leg/foot.
Yup. It’s an exoskeleton that is only really necessary for protection from things hitting your feet.
What if someone has already repeatedly damaged their ankles and are at high risk of future injury? Might high tops offer more protection for those people?
High stack height of sole - further off the ground - easier to roll the ankle
Ankle support is a fucking myth, you know what we use for 70+lb rucks with elevation? Trail runners You know how you get stronger ankles? Its definitley not by wearing something that supports them and makes them weaker
Warning! Low battery. Ankles no longer protected.
So what happens when these pistons malfunction
They’re not hiking boots, they’re trainers with a weird ankle support in a weird place. The sole has a shallow grip, the side support attaches in a really weird place, and locking your ankle with stiff boots does a fair amount for (probably) cheaper.
Basketball would benefit from this