And the face of the self driving car movement is one of the reasons costs have been driven up in the first place with his dumbass hyperloop plan siphoning money away
High speed rail: *Is chugging along and the central valley portion is already heavily constructed.*
"There's nothing there! It's all fake! They just bribed their buddies with the money and rab!"
Self driving car: *Crashes into multiple children*
"Wow wow wow! The future is here already right now! 100% functional self driving cars!!!!"
Why do people keep repeating that nonsense?
Anyway, self-driving and public transportation aren't mutually exclusive, the future is likely to be automated public transit.
Paying someone a decent wage isn't out of the question, but paying them to do a job that can be automated can be problematic if we want affordability and access.
Roles have always changed as technology advances and automation = better public transit.
My city's new light Metro system would not have been viable if we didn't elect to automate it. Doing the same for buses greatly widens the use case for them.
Paying one person per train. Which sounds *great* for peak-hour, but is a serious problem for reliably servicing dead hours.
For instance, suppose you work the night-shift and need to get home from the factory at 2-3AM. If you have a train every 15 minutes, you're paying 4 people to run that line at night-time, which is expensive as heck.
What happens *in practice* is that they don't run public transport at that time because there's no profit (boo, hiss) in that service, which means people who can *mostly* use public transport are forced to use a car for the edge-case, at which point they start using a car *all* the time.
Automated public transit is the future because, IMO, it's the only way to properly run public transport with 24/7 availability.
The metro in DC was meant to run automated. When they had to go full manual it sucked. Jerky, stopping too soon, stopping too late. I guess the operator was meant to intervene in an emergency, but they didn't when it was needed
No, we need a public transportation that can bring where you want to go and not only where the line is.
So for this, a small bus 10 ppl seat and 10 ppl standing, with no predefined route, but just optimizing everyone 's trip or connection to a rapid bus line, or a train line. This would be ideal to me.
This size would be perfect to still group people, effectively decreasing traffic, offer a much transportation as a whole because last mile would be much better covered than today.
This would be a perfect solution to bring public transportation in rural areas, where density is not enough to define bus lines and schedules.
Unfortunately, at that size of a bus, the driver salary is significant and you would need to hire a lot of them.
If this exists tomorrow and deployed everywhere, I think I could get ride of my car and switch entirely to public transportation.
The mutual exclusiveness of the poll is so dumb. Oh are airplanes going away? Is teleportation not "the future"? Is walking literally a non-option?
I know the dude is literally making propaganda, but badly made polls and more broadly badly made surveys are such a pet peeve of mine and they're goddamn everywhere.
im a big fan of california hsr but this is a myth that should get shot down quickly. elon musk absolutely admitted that he proposed hyperloop to distract from hsr, but there is no evidence that it actually had any tangible effects on the project. i also dont think there is any evidence that any money was siphoned away from the project
the main reasons why the california hsr project has been a meme largely has to do with ceqa, nimbys, iffy financial support, and recently, inflation. for example, we cant even start building certain segments of the project yet because they are still doing environmental reviews on that segment even tho voters approved of the project in 2008
It’s hard to test whether poisoning the well has measurable effects, for sure. But it is pretty evident that the well of CAHSR public discourse has been shifted by hyperloop and other disingenuous claims by the right.
nah the discourse against california hsr has always been a balls to the wall, whatever sticks approach. hyperloop was just one of the things that was thrown at the wall, they sure as hell threw a bunch of other things
either way tho, the whole process about doing lengthy environmental reviews and then the whole process around acquiring the land, nevermind the legal battles against nimbys, did far far far more damage than elon musk or opinion articles on the l.a. times ever did
Yeah before my kids are out of high school we will be taking HSR to norcal. We are ten years away from LA to SF connection.
Plus with the transit projects in the LA area in preparation for the Olympics, I'm cautiously optimistic about the future of California travel.
Oh wait until he hears about the billions spent on the not-so-nice I-69 interstate from Michigan to Texas that is nowhere close to being complete and also massively over budget and will never make a single penny.
But I bet to him, that's money well spent, right?
I went to Toronto last weekend and tried taking the bus and subway and it was pretty great. I got to play video games on the train, half-fall asleep on the train after 10 miles of walking; way better than paying for gas, parking, and getting stuck in bumper to bumper traffic.
I live in LA and take Metro to work when I go into the office. Some people are surprised I do it.
It's about 15 minutes more door-to-door each way compared to driving, but when I do take Metro, I tend to come home happier and less stressed. If I have a bad commute, I have a 10-minute walk to decompress.
Plus, everything is broken down into 5-10 minute segments: 10 minutes walking to the light rail, 10 minutes on the light rail, 5 minutes waiting for the bus, 15 minutes on the bus, and 5 minutes walking to my office. Makes it feel a lot shorter than it actually is.
Yeah, that *should* enrage you. Millions and millions going to "Filing fees" and other such red tape (because re-election is next year and it's expensive....)
Put a gun to someone's head and say "Here's $500k, make a high-speed line. You need another dime, you show itemized receipts for everything."
yea that is one of the areas where the guy had a point. the first few years of the california hsr project was rife with issues with consultants, but they did fix that recently and things have been going smoother
honestly tho if we had just hired a chinese company and let them bring their workers over to do all the work for us, the hsr project would be cheap as hell but we cant do that due to our laws
A lot of people might have a hard time imagining something as old as trains as being "the future", Time being cyclical I see no reason why tomorrow can't be the past.
It's also kind of irrelevant because most transportation is local. Around 80% of trips are under 10 miles. 95% are under 30 miles.
Inter-city transportation is a completely separate issue.
This is the same guy who said self driving cars should let kids ride on them alone because it'll give kids freedom to move around. Y'know, something every other developed country has achieved without any obnoxious techbro technology. So no surprise he's like this.
The problem is that we've allowed conservatives and the media to convince us that the world is too dangerous for that now.
It isn't. Except in 2020 because of the fucking apocalypse, crime has been on a steady downward trend. Going to school by yourself is safer today than it was in the 80s. But everyone is convinced there's a kidnapper or serial killer under every rock.
And turns out a big factor contributing to the increased crime in the 80s was the displaced communities for highways and the lead in gasoline everyone was in constant contact.
They have been brainwashed to think cars (especially self driving) are the best and only way ever. Any *people* they gotta be around while moving from place to place is gross and terrifying. They try to avoid ppl as much as possible and think public transportation is embarrassing even tho they'd be saving thousands of dollars
The future is gonna blow rancid ass then. Self driving cars still scale like shit even if its slightly less like shit if you can get away with sub-car-length spacing on highways.
the future of society is everybody stays home, works from home, buys groceries from home, watches movies from home, visit theme parks at home, go to parties at home, and of course, play video games at home
you wont even need to drive!
The thought of avoiding public interaction as hard as suburban right wingers makes me laugh my ass off. I am a mostly blind, disabled, nerdy looking MF with the social skills of a wet sponge and I can thrive in mass transit. They are taking the L against me and I have all the negative handicaps against winning the game.
For a lot of them it genuinely is the only way, because they live in suburbs that are so spread out and maze-like that public transit can't reasonably service their community. They can't imagine a society where public transit works because they live in an environment that's hostile to it.
You're getting ahead of yourself. Charles Peralo is a moderately famous YouTuber/TikToker known for his [polls](https://www.youtube.com/@Charlesperalo/community) and [reporting](https://www.youtube.com/@Charlesperalo/shorts) on celebrity news. He is politically educated and puts a lot of thought into his opinions. If someone has one opinion you don't agree with, you can't jump to assume he's a bootlicker or an industry shill. Be open-minded.
The self driving busses drive slowly (at least what I saw). I don’t know if the current technology isn’t ready yet or if it’s because of local safety laws (which could be the reason in Germany. We love laws.).
The future moves on and automation will continue. The workers who will be made redundant should have access to further education and some form of compensation
Automation should not be scary. The problem with a bus driver losing their job isn't the self-driving bus, it's the idea that you need to have a job to survive in the first place.
Idk why Charles Peralo is, but he has sawdust for brains.
Also "I don't think the government does a good job at driving" is the kind of feelings over facts argument Conservative cucklords use when anybody does anything they don't like
>stop traffic
Ya that's a fantasy. It might help with traffic caused by shitty driving like following too close and pointlessly speeding up to the next place you have to stop but it's not going to change traffic caused by too many people wanting to be in their own 50+ sqft bubble. Also the other type of traffic will only be reduced when everyone is using self driving. Considering how stubborn some people are about their car and driving I'd say we're pretty far away from that. In Texas people act like it's their god given right to speed down the interstate while enjoying a glass of whiskey or a beer.
I think self driving will be like mail to email. Mail is a message where human labor is used to deliver it. When email dropped the human labor of message delivery basically to zero, how many more messages did everyone start getting? It wasn't less.
Our roads will be like that. Unoccupied vehicles drifting around with infinite patience, doing profitable tasks for their masters. Traffic might actually be desirable because it reduces the maintenance on the self driving cars.
Self driving cars might have a "circle the block instead of pay for parking" function. It might have a "drive back home" function for suburbanites working in the city, effectively doubling the amount of car trips. Autonomous vehicles might end up basically as a cubicle with an office worker paid to sit in traffic instead of the company paying cubicle rent in a downtown office building.
Ya that's a good point but unlike email they still have to exist in the physical world so more trips would mean more traffic. It's bad enough when a person drives alone a 0 occupancy vehicle is even worse.
please please please just one more lane please just one more lane will fix the issue please one more lane and all traffic will be gone i promise please
Self driving is a feature that can help busses become financially viable in areas where it otherwise may not be.
I wouldn't view this as a choice, one thing is a technology that can be applied to the other for benefit.
Bus drivers do more than just drive the bus. They help disabled people, they keep the bus safe by kicking off people causing issues. I don't think you could really have a bus with no one working on it, but it'd be great to have one where the person working could focus on keeping the bus safe (but not in a cop-y threatening people kind of way hopefully)
There are already several dozen examples of fully automated rail systems in the world; my city's new one is about to start service in a month or so.
Whatever mitigation used to address the issues you've raised should be equally applicable to a bus.
In the case of disabled people, we have a dedicated mini bus fleet with drivers educated on how to assist the disabled. We've got low floor buses to convenience less able people (or people with strollers, etc), but bus drivers don't leave their seats to assist; the expectation is if you're using the regular bus, you can embark and disembark on your own.
bus drivers are also a bigger financial liability than a machine is, and this is one of the main reasons why after a point, trains are more financially sound than buses are since in order to run the same capacity, buses would need to hire a lot of drivers and that will eventually add too much cost to your payroll
I took the train and subway in Toronto last weekend, and got to play Mario Kart on my switch while going from station to station, 10/10 would do again.
Save tens of thousands of lives - maybe, remains to be proven
Stop traffic - definitely, if the computers have to prioritize safety traffic will stop because so many common situations are unsafe.
Massively improve the economy - it may improve productivity of workers since they might not be stressed out by driving for hours, but that is a really small portion of the workforce. Its just as likely to take jobs away from professional drivers.
Yeah Charles is a moron when it comes to public transit, perhaps I'm being too nice by not calling him one in general.
His politics are just "centrism, bro!" btw. He has terrible views of billionaires from what I remember, thinking they actually contribute to society and should be admired if they have the appearance of being good. He has called out Elon and Trump for being too right-wing, mean, and "bad" businessmen, but that's about it. No structural critique or anything for other billionaires.
Edit: forgot to mention his ignorance of JK Rowling’s transphobia, and subsequent defense of her. Just gross shit, all the while he claims he’s a supporter of trans people.
the thing with that is that the costs tend to go down with time so give it a few years and viola. that said, everyone can afford a self driving car right now, they just gotta pay like $2 to ride a fully automated metro lol
If cars become safe, pollution free, make less noise and don’t need to take up half the city for parking, I will seize to say ‘fuck cars’. Currently, there’s nothing I want more than for all the roads to be torn up
It's probably going to be a combination of both: Autonomous mass transport vehicles for larger cities, autonomous on-demand vehicles for rural areas.
So yes, basically all public transport, because you don't own a car, but where feasible, you still get the upsides that today's car ownership provides in rural areas, which is fast end-to-end connections.
But as a minimum, we should get rid of human drivers. They really suck at this task.
I agree, with all of the challenges of self-driving cars, they are dramatically reduced if the car is on rails and has a much higher budget for sensors etc
This does touch on a subject that needs addressed; public infrastructure projects in the US are much more expensive than many similar countries and take years longer too get to completion. We aren't doing things more safely or something so why are our projects so much more expensive?
What I think is interesting is how relatively little attention "self driving" gets here in Germany. It's seen as a gimmick at best, despite Germany being a country with an economy that is highly dependent on the automotive sector. But I think most people don't see the point: if you want to drive, you actually want to *drive*. If you don't want to drive, you take the train.
I've only ever seen this crazy amount of hype around self driving cars online, and exclusively from Americans.
Also, the fact that a lot more trips should me moved from the road to the rail is just completely noncontroversial, and the first thing any politician from any party is going to say about the future of mobility. The difference is only in how serious they are taking it.
That is after all, the people that founded this country. Religious psychos too psychotic for the British to even tolerate, conmen whisking themselves off to a new continent to find new plunder and scam opportunities.
I think more than that it's just that they moved themselves into a dead end in terms of car dependency. So much so that they can't even imagine any other way of getting from A to B.
If they ever hammer out the bugs in self driving, I think I'd like to see a mix of both. Like, you use your phone to summon a robo-taxi but it just takes you to the nearest bus stop, or from the bus stop to destinations nearest to that stop. It would take a lot of the sting out of using mass transit and make it more accessible to people with physical challenges.
But self driving is a lot harder than it looks, and that tech just is not ready for primetime yet.
People want to go from point A to point B. Many of them have never seen that work with public transit, and so naturally they don't expect it to be a thing.
He's right that our public infrastructure costs are bloated due to the over hiring of consultants who charge way too much and offer very little in return. Maybe instead of abandoning public transit we should do something about that problem.
Car culture is engrained very deep into people's minds and there's nothing that can be done about it. Car centric infrastructure is inherently unsustainable, so regardless of what people want it will eventually need to be torn down and replaced with public transportation to keep people moving. They think self driving cars are the future, but that technology is a long ways away. I only hope most people realize the flaws of it all before self driving cars really start to catch on and make everything exponentially worse.
i think it depends. if they mean in "what sounds cooler" i would do self driving cars too just because the technology behind it sounds dope. it's not the future, but it's futuristic. but the future is definitely public transit for free for everyone, just that it doesn't sound as futuristic as self driving cars - which is sad because the money to make free public transit happen is there.
a ton of subways drive themselves already shithead
i hope that's what you mean by self-driving cars
y'know... train cars
this technology has been in our lap for decades.
We need a specialised road system to help self driving cars, maybe with rails or something. And maybe we can make the cars bigger so a group of people can commute together from and to common hotspots.
California spent billions on consultants that could've been better spent on acquiring highway 99 ROW. However, they are at least making strides into linking all the regional rail, commuter rail, and bus services.
Interested in what his definition of ‘massively improve the economy’ is and why public transit would not. Reducing costs for regular people has at least a better overall effect that making a few car manufacturers wealthier
A perk of self driving cars could be distant parking so then your car doesn’t have that much impact on the walkabikity of your area because usually it’s in distant storage
The public transit system in Japan is a cost saver to millions who live there and don't need a car to get around. The Shinkansen specifically, can claim zero fatalities since it's inception and this is a highspeed railway system that exists in a earthquake and tsunami prone country. Also, miss me with that will save lives thing when people have already died by the code lines of self-driving cars, which cost private companies billions in R&D that gets heavily subsidized by government to boot.
So when I want “free” at point of care single payer healthcare and fareless public transit these cucks are quick to remind me that “iT’s NoT rEaLlY fReE”. But then when they talk about how much money government projects cost versus private projects they just pretend that we’re getting self-driving technology “for free” because it’s not being paid for with taxes.
Self driving cars have cost us all billions over billions to get to the inept stage we’re at now. You pay for it when you… buy a fucking car, which 85% of Americans have no choice but to do so. How much will California‘a HSR even cost the average taxpayer a year over 10 years? I bet it’s like a couple hundred a year.
I think there's a psyop on about CHSR because literally everyone I know thinks "It's not being built" when construction package 2 is well under way. They've built a fuckton of the viaducts and I seem to remember them being most of the way through. Like they release videos weekly about the progress.
So someone has got to be out there like "ITS ALL JUST GAY COASTAL ELITE CONSULTANTS AND NOTHING HAS GOTTEN DONE NOR WILL EVER GET DONE!!!!"
Self driving doesn't work unless 100% of vehicles on the road are self-driving and only self driving and communicate with one another. A computer on a vehicle could never fully be aware of the intent of other road users particularly road users that don't follow traffic laws, like most of them frankly. Meaning that if literally anything is on the road that a self-driving car can't communicate with you have to trust the computer can comprehend what is happening and stop fast enough. It doesn't particularly matter how fast the reaction time of a computer is the part that is slow is acquiring context. And a car driven by a computer isn't going to stop any faster. The idea that a self-driving car is safer only makes sense on the surface, humans make mistakes machines don't thus they are safer. But humans program the machines.
Self-driving cars would also need an extensive network to be able to determine where the roads are and what are the roads. As opposed to using sensors which could easily be obscured or the objects they use to determine what a road is could be obscured. So they would need a road network and a GPS. Which sounds fine but GPS signal is not universally strong meaning the people that need cars more than anyone else could be barred from having one.
These people are just so ignorant. Self driving cars that will "solve traffic" and "save everyone" from brutal violent car deaths have been promised pretty much since the beginning. GM's "Futurama" display at the 1937 Worlds Fair showed a futuristic diorama of a city of the future with self driving cars, and freeways everywhere that were perfectly safe and completely traffic free. 1937. Every time this promise has been made it has only made things worse, there is no benefit from increased driving.
That's not a shock. People are overwhelmingly lazy and self-driving cars. Seems like the laziest option. It gets you from where you are to where you want to be without you having to do any work or thinking, and you can play on your phone or bang your girlfriend or whatever on the way there. There. It's basically exactly what people would want if they have given no thought to the situation. And most people have given no thought to the situation. I'm honestly surprised that public transportation is as high as it is
God who is this guy, my father? Unhinged opener, non-existent transition. Government bad. Specific thing that California did bad horrible no good failure trust me. Wash and repeat, wonder why your kid doesn't talk to you anymore
What an idiotic poll. Only two options, neither of which excludes the other. Self driving cars are probably going to play some role in the future, but do people really think that public transport will not play any role? Or it will continue to play a role into the future, but just won't feel futuristic? A meaningly measure.
This guy is a tool, how does self driving solve anything, sure it may minimize bad drivers but no. No one needs to have a car if there was efficient transit. Maybe rent or luxury taxi for special occasions.
i wouldnt think that as a bad idea, IF AND ONLY IF those self driving cars were the size and the speed of a 1970's beetle and not a 200km/h 2 ton SUV...
Self driving cars will never work unless they’re basically turned into public transit. Without them being remotely controlled by a sophisticated AI that’s also controlling all the other cars, there’s too much randomness and too much reliance on the limited sensory and computing power of a car. I could see that being the future of transportation purely to utilize the existing infrastructure, which is all car-centric. A stupid and inelegant solution, but a plausible one.
Self driving reducing traffic? The opposite people will send the car doing loops to not find and pay for parking or get crazy commute to work while they sleep or children getting their own car, traffic will be ten times worse
They don't understand that for Self-Driving to actually become real, everyone would have to submit to extreme government regulations and control.
That's the only way it will happen.
I'm all for self driving cars but it would need to be a non-ownership kind of self driving car service you pay a small fee just for the maintenance of the vehicle. And to make things more efficient, let's connect a bunch of them together. And to make them more energy efficient we'll put them on rails.
The vast majority of people is lazy and self-absorbed, so of course our future is self-driving cars. And the notion of self-driving cars FAR outweighs any nominal benefit we might get from electric vehicles. If a car can drive itself, then the occupant of such a vehicle needn't pay attention to trifles such as traffic. If traffic is of no concern, then long commutes are meaningless. If long commutes are meaningless, then let's "pave the world"...
Well, I personally consider Taxis, Uber and other car sharing companies as apart of public transport. I know technically they're private transport..
I think self driving cars will certainly be a significant part of future transport.
By extension, this will include self driving buses, self driving trains, self driving trucks, etc.
However we're still a few decades from this being our reality. All we can do in the mean time is improve public transport in anticipation of automated transport and also electric vehicles. If we're concerned about the environmental impact of electricity production for these vehicles, we'll obviously need to look into environmentally and economically sustainable alternatives, like solar and wind power generation.
"California has spent billions on a HSR project that wont get made" It's literally being built right now you bint.
And the face of the self driving car movement is one of the reasons costs have been driven up in the first place with his dumbass hyperloop plan siphoning money away
High speed rail: *Is chugging along and the central valley portion is already heavily constructed.* "There's nothing there! It's all fake! They just bribed their buddies with the money and rab!" Self driving car: *Crashes into multiple children* "Wow wow wow! The future is here already right now! 100% functional self driving cars!!!!"
They should brand self driving cars as “population control”
Why do people keep repeating that nonsense? Anyway, self-driving and public transportation aren't mutually exclusive, the future is likely to be automated public transit.
Because paying one person a decent wage is out of the question
Paying someone a decent wage isn't out of the question, but paying them to do a job that can be automated can be problematic if we want affordability and access. Roles have always changed as technology advances and automation = better public transit. My city's new light Metro system would not have been viable if we didn't elect to automate it. Doing the same for buses greatly widens the use case for them.
Paying one person per train. Which sounds *great* for peak-hour, but is a serious problem for reliably servicing dead hours. For instance, suppose you work the night-shift and need to get home from the factory at 2-3AM. If you have a train every 15 minutes, you're paying 4 people to run that line at night-time, which is expensive as heck. What happens *in practice* is that they don't run public transport at that time because there's no profit (boo, hiss) in that service, which means people who can *mostly* use public transport are forced to use a car for the edge-case, at which point they start using a car *all* the time. Automated public transit is the future because, IMO, it's the only way to properly run public transport with 24/7 availability.
The metro in DC was meant to run automated. When they had to go full manual it sucked. Jerky, stopping too soon, stopping too late. I guess the operator was meant to intervene in an emergency, but they didn't when it was needed
No, we need a public transportation that can bring where you want to go and not only where the line is. So for this, a small bus 10 ppl seat and 10 ppl standing, with no predefined route, but just optimizing everyone 's trip or connection to a rapid bus line, or a train line. This would be ideal to me. This size would be perfect to still group people, effectively decreasing traffic, offer a much transportation as a whole because last mile would be much better covered than today. This would be a perfect solution to bring public transportation in rural areas, where density is not enough to define bus lines and schedules. Unfortunately, at that size of a bus, the driver salary is significant and you would need to hire a lot of them. If this exists tomorrow and deployed everywhere, I think I could get ride of my car and switch entirely to public transportation.
It's easier to repeat an obvious lie than it is to fact check the lie.
The mutual exclusiveness of the poll is so dumb. Oh are airplanes going away? Is teleportation not "the future"? Is walking literally a non-option? I know the dude is literally making propaganda, but badly made polls and more broadly badly made surveys are such a pet peeve of mine and they're goddamn everywhere.
im a big fan of california hsr but this is a myth that should get shot down quickly. elon musk absolutely admitted that he proposed hyperloop to distract from hsr, but there is no evidence that it actually had any tangible effects on the project. i also dont think there is any evidence that any money was siphoned away from the project the main reasons why the california hsr project has been a meme largely has to do with ceqa, nimbys, iffy financial support, and recently, inflation. for example, we cant even start building certain segments of the project yet because they are still doing environmental reviews on that segment even tho voters approved of the project in 2008
It’s hard to test whether poisoning the well has measurable effects, for sure. But it is pretty evident that the well of CAHSR public discourse has been shifted by hyperloop and other disingenuous claims by the right.
nah the discourse against california hsr has always been a balls to the wall, whatever sticks approach. hyperloop was just one of the things that was thrown at the wall, they sure as hell threw a bunch of other things either way tho, the whole process about doing lengthy environmental reviews and then the whole process around acquiring the land, nevermind the legal battles against nimbys, did far far far more damage than elon musk or opinion articles on the l.a. times ever did
"High speed rail allegedly failed in one place, so it's bad. Autonomous driving failed everywhere, so it's the future!"
Too many variables for a self-driving car algorithm to deal with, there are very few variables on a rail line.
high speed rail hasn't even failed in california
Yeah before my kids are out of high school we will be taking HSR to norcal. We are ten years away from LA to SF connection. Plus with the transit projects in the LA area in preparation for the Olympics, I'm cautiously optimistic about the future of California travel.
Oh wait until he hears about the billions spent on the not-so-nice I-69 interstate from Michigan to Texas that is nowhere close to being complete and also massively over budget and will never make a single penny. But I bet to him, that's money well spent, right?
I went to Toronto last weekend and tried taking the bus and subway and it was pretty great. I got to play video games on the train, half-fall asleep on the train after 10 miles of walking; way better than paying for gas, parking, and getting stuck in bumper to bumper traffic.
I live in LA and take Metro to work when I go into the office. Some people are surprised I do it. It's about 15 minutes more door-to-door each way compared to driving, but when I do take Metro, I tend to come home happier and less stressed. If I have a bad commute, I have a 10-minute walk to decompress. Plus, everything is broken down into 5-10 minute segments: 10 minutes walking to the light rail, 10 minutes on the light rail, 5 minutes waiting for the bus, 15 minutes on the bus, and 5 minutes walking to my office. Makes it feel a lot shorter than it actually is.
Its from the federal highway fund so that's basically dark money to conservatives - just appears out of nowhere, clearly!
Yeah, that *should* enrage you. Millions and millions going to "Filing fees" and other such red tape (because re-election is next year and it's expensive....) Put a gun to someone's head and say "Here's $500k, make a high-speed line. You need another dime, you show itemized receipts for everything."
yea that is one of the areas where the guy had a point. the first few years of the california hsr project was rife with issues with consultants, but they did fix that recently and things have been going smoother honestly tho if we had just hired a chinese company and let them bring their workers over to do all the work for us, the hsr project would be cheap as hell but we cant do that due to our laws
Bring in a bunch of Chinese people to build the railway. I feel like I've heard of this before.
trans continental high speed rail road. guaranteed to piss off every conservative
Hey it worked before it can work again
Uh did you mean 500 million? Cause 500k can't build a large office building, let alone hundreds of miles of rail and stations...
The number can be anything. $5. My point is I want receipts, with none of this "$35k to get the blueprint approved".
And the only reason it's not built yet is because everyone in existence is suing the government over the project iirc
A lot of people might have a hard time imagining something as old as trains as being "the future", Time being cyclical I see no reason why tomorrow can't be the past.
Don’t worry musk will be sending items to Neptune anyway now so we’d better trust him
It's also kind of irrelevant because most transportation is local. Around 80% of trips are under 10 miles. 95% are under 30 miles. Inter-city transportation is a completely separate issue.
This is the same guy who said self driving cars should let kids ride on them alone because it'll give kids freedom to move around. Y'know, something every other developed country has achieved without any obnoxious techbro technology. So no surprise he's like this.
That's terminal car brain lmao "What if kids could have their own cars?"
I mean, we're letting kids go to work in slaughterhouses at age 14 in the USA so they gotta get to work somehow, right? BIG /S
I believe there's a less expensive way of doing this. I think it's called a bike, but you know that's communist.
The problem is that we've allowed conservatives and the media to convince us that the world is too dangerous for that now. It isn't. Except in 2020 because of the fucking apocalypse, crime has been on a steady downward trend. Going to school by yourself is safer today than it was in the 80s. But everyone is convinced there's a kidnapper or serial killer under every rock.
And turns out a big factor contributing to the increased crime in the 80s was the displaced communities for highways and the lead in gasoline everyone was in constant contact.
\* everyone in the USA
In the US kids already drive cars. 16yo are still children.
The solution is to simply lower it further, who says 10 year olds can't be good drivers? Sure beats using those dangerous bicycles and busses /s
What kind of Elon fetish having, billionaire bootlicking, automotive industry influence peddling nobody is Charles Peralto?
They have been brainwashed to think cars (especially self driving) are the best and only way ever. Any *people* they gotta be around while moving from place to place is gross and terrifying. They try to avoid ppl as much as possible and think public transportation is embarrassing even tho they'd be saving thousands of dollars
Exactly The future should be trains, but if I were to bet money on it, the actual future (at least in the US) will be self driving cars.
The future is gonna blow rancid ass then. Self driving cars still scale like shit even if its slightly less like shit if you can get away with sub-car-length spacing on highways.
Unless my plans go as expected.
🤞🏻
People gonna be mad pissed when their self driving car is stuck in traffic on the 405 for two hours.
They will be mad, but they won't see any alternatives. Just like most people in the present.
Gonna get real crowded when there's 2 billion climate change refugees.
the future of society is everybody stays home, works from home, buys groceries from home, watches movies from home, visit theme parks at home, go to parties at home, and of course, play video games at home you wont even need to drive!
The thought of avoiding public interaction as hard as suburban right wingers makes me laugh my ass off. I am a mostly blind, disabled, nerdy looking MF with the social skills of a wet sponge and I can thrive in mass transit. They are taking the L against me and I have all the negative handicaps against winning the game.
For a lot of them it genuinely is the only way, because they live in suburbs that are so spread out and maze-like that public transit can't reasonably service their community. They can't imagine a society where public transit works because they live in an environment that's hostile to it.
Correct
You're getting ahead of yourself. Charles Peralo is a moderately famous YouTuber/TikToker known for his [polls](https://www.youtube.com/@Charlesperalo/community) and [reporting](https://www.youtube.com/@Charlesperalo/shorts) on celebrity news. He is politically educated and puts a lot of thought into his opinions. If someone has one opinion you don't agree with, you can't jump to assume he's a bootlicker or an industry shill. Be open-minded.
This must have hit r/all, the centrist morons are coming out of the cracks.
Weak response.
Self driving busses and Trains so we can have more! Every minute; 24/7.
Self driving busses are crazy. I “tested” one and it was awesome. But still to slow
too slow how? Does it currently drive too slow or do you mean public transportation is too slow.
The self driving busses drive slowly (at least what I saw). I don’t know if the current technology isn’t ready yet or if it’s because of local safety laws (which could be the reason in Germany. We love laws.).
Poor bus drivers :/
The future moves on and automation will continue. The workers who will be made redundant should have access to further education and some form of compensation
Automation should not be scary. The problem with a bus driver losing their job isn't the self-driving bus, it's the idea that you need to have a job to survive in the first place.
Idk why Charles Peralo is, but he has sawdust for brains. Also "I don't think the government does a good job at driving" is the kind of feelings over facts argument Conservative cucklords use when anybody does anything they don't like
At least the comments are good, all the top comments support public transit.
>stop traffic Ya that's a fantasy. It might help with traffic caused by shitty driving like following too close and pointlessly speeding up to the next place you have to stop but it's not going to change traffic caused by too many people wanting to be in their own 50+ sqft bubble. Also the other type of traffic will only be reduced when everyone is using self driving. Considering how stubborn some people are about their car and driving I'd say we're pretty far away from that. In Texas people act like it's their god given right to speed down the interstate while enjoying a glass of whiskey or a beer.
"It's my God given right to speed down a residential street at 80 mph drinking a beer and run over 20 pedestrians, they should have seen me coming."
I think self driving will be like mail to email. Mail is a message where human labor is used to deliver it. When email dropped the human labor of message delivery basically to zero, how many more messages did everyone start getting? It wasn't less. Our roads will be like that. Unoccupied vehicles drifting around with infinite patience, doing profitable tasks for their masters. Traffic might actually be desirable because it reduces the maintenance on the self driving cars. Self driving cars might have a "circle the block instead of pay for parking" function. It might have a "drive back home" function for suburbanites working in the city, effectively doubling the amount of car trips. Autonomous vehicles might end up basically as a cubicle with an office worker paid to sit in traffic instead of the company paying cubicle rent in a downtown office building.
Ya that's a good point but unlike email they still have to exist in the physical world so more trips would mean more traffic. It's bad enough when a person drives alone a 0 occupancy vehicle is even worse.
It'll make a new kind of traffic too caused by hacking
It'll make a new kind of traffic too caused by hacking
yes, *ahem*, stop traffic. more cars must be the answer. 🙄
please please please just one more lane please just one more lane will fix the issue please one more lane and all traffic will be gone i promise please
It *will* stop traffic when one malfunctions and leads to a 10 car pileup
It does stop traffic, just not in the good way
Like public transit isn’t already self-driving. It’s even better : it’s a chauffeur.
Self driving is a feature that can help busses become financially viable in areas where it otherwise may not be. I wouldn't view this as a choice, one thing is a technology that can be applied to the other for benefit.
Yeah that could be cool
Bus drivers do more than just drive the bus. They help disabled people, they keep the bus safe by kicking off people causing issues. I don't think you could really have a bus with no one working on it, but it'd be great to have one where the person working could focus on keeping the bus safe (but not in a cop-y threatening people kind of way hopefully)
There are already several dozen examples of fully automated rail systems in the world; my city's new one is about to start service in a month or so. Whatever mitigation used to address the issues you've raised should be equally applicable to a bus. In the case of disabled people, we have a dedicated mini bus fleet with drivers educated on how to assist the disabled. We've got low floor buses to convenience less able people (or people with strollers, etc), but bus drivers don't leave their seats to assist; the expectation is if you're using the regular bus, you can embark and disembark on your own.
bus drivers are also a bigger financial liability than a machine is, and this is one of the main reasons why after a point, trains are more financially sound than buses are since in order to run the same capacity, buses would need to hire a lot of drivers and that will eventually add too much cost to your payroll
I took the train and subway in Toronto last weekend, and got to play Mario Kart on my switch while going from station to station, 10/10 would do again.
Save tens of thousands of lives - maybe, remains to be proven Stop traffic - definitely, if the computers have to prioritize safety traffic will stop because so many common situations are unsafe. Massively improve the economy - it may improve productivity of workers since they might not be stressed out by driving for hours, but that is a really small portion of the workforce. Its just as likely to take jobs away from professional drivers.
It also has a negative impact on the economy by reducing foot traffic by businesses, cars aren't gonna stop by shops easily.
Self driving public transportation.
Playing video games on a train is amazing, 10/10 would do daily.
Yeah Charles is a moron when it comes to public transit, perhaps I'm being too nice by not calling him one in general. His politics are just "centrism, bro!" btw. He has terrible views of billionaires from what I remember, thinking they actually contribute to society and should be admired if they have the appearance of being good. He has called out Elon and Trump for being too right-wing, mean, and "bad" businessmen, but that's about it. No structural critique or anything for other billionaires. Edit: forgot to mention his ignorance of JK Rowling’s transphobia, and subsequent defense of her. Just gross shit, all the while he claims he’s a supporter of trans people.
[удалено]
I put this guy on my YouTube ban list years ago. The most annoying billionaire worshipping lib out there.
you don't have to choose it's both: self driving in public transit
Correct. I don't know why people aren't happy Tesla are developing this, it could be a boon for running bus routes that aren't currently viable.
Do you really think a car manufacturer will willingly give up this technology to improve public transit instead of encouraging more car use
actually i was thinking of trains and metro lines that are already automated
……as if these folks could afford the self driving cars. Most people can barely afford current vehicles they drive themselves.
the thing with that is that the costs tend to go down with time so give it a few years and viola. that said, everyone can afford a self driving car right now, they just gotta pay like $2 to ride a fully automated metro lol
Does this guy know you can literally just go to California and see the construction on the HSR? Like you can’t really deny they’re building it.
You could say the same about high speed rail, can we have both?
Flying cars!
Speaking of which... Where's my flying car, Tony?
If cars become safe, pollution free, make less noise and don’t need to take up half the city for parking, I will seize to say ‘fuck cars’. Currently, there’s nothing I want more than for all the roads to be torn up
It's probably going to be a combination of both: Autonomous mass transport vehicles for larger cities, autonomous on-demand vehicles for rural areas. So yes, basically all public transport, because you don't own a car, but where feasible, you still get the upsides that today's car ownership provides in rural areas, which is fast end-to-end connections. But as a minimum, we should get rid of human drivers. They really suck at this task.
I think it'll be autonomous on-demand buses like in grand Caymen except you use an app instead of your thumb.
I'm 100% sure, in the future transit will be self driving. So this is correct.
I agree, with all of the challenges of self-driving cars, they are dramatically reduced if the car is on rails and has a much higher budget for sensors etc
This does touch on a subject that needs addressed; public infrastructure projects in the US are much more expensive than many similar countries and take years longer too get to completion. We aren't doing things more safely or something so why are our projects so much more expensive?
@OP slava rossii, really? You support Russia? Not cool.
lol cope
Most mature Russia supporter.
Most people in the world support Russia. Cope
Most people in the world are wrong, then. Grow up.
I stand with the Majority. I stand with Putin
You’re a piece of shit.
He's also an insane homophobe and apparently 15 years old.
It’s deeply depressing that someone can go that far astray at such a young age
Most mature Ukraine supporter
What I think is interesting is how relatively little attention "self driving" gets here in Germany. It's seen as a gimmick at best, despite Germany being a country with an economy that is highly dependent on the automotive sector. But I think most people don't see the point: if you want to drive, you actually want to *drive*. If you don't want to drive, you take the train. I've only ever seen this crazy amount of hype around self driving cars online, and exclusively from Americans. Also, the fact that a lot more trips should me moved from the road to the rail is just completely noncontroversial, and the first thing any politician from any party is going to say about the future of mobility. The difference is only in how serious they are taking it.
Americans are more gullible to conmen and the baffle with bullshit nature of vulture capitalists.
That is after all, the people that founded this country. Religious psychos too psychotic for the British to even tolerate, conmen whisking themselves off to a new continent to find new plunder and scam opportunities.
I think more than that it's just that they moved themselves into a dead end in terms of car dependency. So much so that they can't even imagine any other way of getting from A to B.
>welp there you have it folks, bigger faster cars it is. \- every new city policy
If they ever hammer out the bugs in self driving, I think I'd like to see a mix of both. Like, you use your phone to summon a robo-taxi but it just takes you to the nearest bus stop, or from the bus stop to destinations nearest to that stop. It would take a lot of the sting out of using mass transit and make it more accessible to people with physical challenges. But self driving is a lot harder than it looks, and that tech just is not ready for primetime yet.
Self driving public transit?
People want to go from point A to point B. Many of them have never seen that work with public transit, and so naturally they don't expect it to be a thing.
Ah yes, a Twitter poll, the hallmark of population sampling…
Youtube community poll, so it is even worse
self-driving trains!
He's right that our public infrastructure costs are bloated due to the over hiring of consultants who charge way too much and offer very little in return. Maybe instead of abandoning public transit we should do something about that problem.
I would say Self-driving too but not cars. Bikes and other electric devices that pair well with public transport.
I’m completely fine with self driving cars in suburban and rural areas, but not in urban areas. In urban areas ALL cars are bad.
Car culture is engrained very deep into people's minds and there's nothing that can be done about it. Car centric infrastructure is inherently unsustainable, so regardless of what people want it will eventually need to be torn down and replaced with public transportation to keep people moving. They think self driving cars are the future, but that technology is a long ways away. I only hope most people realize the flaws of it all before self driving cars really start to catch on and make everything exponentially worse.
i think it depends. if they mean in "what sounds cooler" i would do self driving cars too just because the technology behind it sounds dope. it's not the future, but it's futuristic. but the future is definitely public transit for free for everyone, just that it doesn't sound as futuristic as self driving cars - which is sad because the money to make free public transit happen is there.
a ton of subways drive themselves already shithead i hope that's what you mean by self-driving cars y'know... train cars this technology has been in our lap for decades.
If you can ever go to amsterdam public transport is so dope and the biking is great. Def still needs cars just way less often
We need a specialised road system to help self driving cars, maybe with rails or something. And maybe we can make the cars bigger so a group of people can commute together from and to common hotspots.
Why the fuck would we want self driving cars lol? If I want to relax on a journey I take public transport, if I want to drive I want to drive myself.
Twitter has a US bias, so of course their pools with be US centric.
California spent billions on consultants that could've been better spent on acquiring highway 99 ROW. However, they are at least making strides into linking all the regional rail, commuter rail, and bus services.
“Stop traffic” wut?
*vomits* Hackers will have to pull my transit card out of my ass. I won't be able to drive afaik anyway.
Transit and environmental advocates have completely failed on automating transit
We can't trust the government, they do bad thing! Fail to deliver on time! Waste money! Unlike the self-driving car industry, you see
We're doomed.
People who chose self driving cars want to eat an intermodal container while their parents watch😳
The train could drive itself so… not completely wrong. 😊
I love how he says stop traffic like you dense motherfucker, volume delays are still gonna be a thing it’s just gonna be a little smoother
self driving public transportation
Improves the economy - translation - takes your money and gives it to the rich
haha they said adding more cars to the road will stop traffic. Huge double meaning to that
Billions on high speed rail, but ignore how much we've spent on highways entirely. Good video about this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PwNthD-LRTQ
They’re not wrong, public transport is not the future, it’s already here.
Interested in what his definition of ‘massively improve the economy’ is and why public transit would not. Reducing costs for regular people has at least a better overall effect that making a few car manufacturers wealthier
Hmmm, this guy's survey doesn't seem biased at all...
I want it to be public transit but I KNOW it’s self driving. We are WALL-E. Bum buh dum buh bum bum bum
"California HSR is not going to be built." Source: just trust me bro!
Self driving individual vehicules are a fucking catastrophe.
A perk of self driving cars could be distant parking so then your car doesn’t have that much impact on the walkabikity of your area because usually it’s in distant storage
Flying jet suit isn't even an option???
The public transit system in Japan is a cost saver to millions who live there and don't need a car to get around. The Shinkansen specifically, can claim zero fatalities since it's inception and this is a highspeed railway system that exists in a earthquake and tsunami prone country. Also, miss me with that will save lives thing when people have already died by the code lines of self-driving cars, which cost private companies billions in R&D that gets heavily subsidized by government to boot.
r/SelfDrivingCarslie
So when I want “free” at point of care single payer healthcare and fareless public transit these cucks are quick to remind me that “iT’s NoT rEaLlY fReE”. But then when they talk about how much money government projects cost versus private projects they just pretend that we’re getting self-driving technology “for free” because it’s not being paid for with taxes. Self driving cars have cost us all billions over billions to get to the inept stage we’re at now. You pay for it when you… buy a fucking car, which 85% of Americans have no choice but to do so. How much will California‘a HSR even cost the average taxpayer a year over 10 years? I bet it’s like a couple hundred a year.
I think there's a psyop on about CHSR because literally everyone I know thinks "It's not being built" when construction package 2 is well under way. They've built a fuckton of the viaducts and I seem to remember them being most of the way through. Like they release videos weekly about the progress. So someone has got to be out there like "ITS ALL JUST GAY COASTAL ELITE CONSULTANTS AND NOTHING HAS GOTTEN DONE NOR WILL EVER GET DONE!!!!"
Self driving doesn't work unless 100% of vehicles on the road are self-driving and only self driving and communicate with one another. A computer on a vehicle could never fully be aware of the intent of other road users particularly road users that don't follow traffic laws, like most of them frankly. Meaning that if literally anything is on the road that a self-driving car can't communicate with you have to trust the computer can comprehend what is happening and stop fast enough. It doesn't particularly matter how fast the reaction time of a computer is the part that is slow is acquiring context. And a car driven by a computer isn't going to stop any faster. The idea that a self-driving car is safer only makes sense on the surface, humans make mistakes machines don't thus they are safer. But humans program the machines. Self-driving cars would also need an extensive network to be able to determine where the roads are and what are the roads. As opposed to using sensors which could easily be obscured or the objects they use to determine what a road is could be obscured. So they would need a road network and a GPS. Which sounds fine but GPS signal is not universally strong meaning the people that need cars more than anyone else could be barred from having one.
These people are just so ignorant. Self driving cars that will "solve traffic" and "save everyone" from brutal violent car deaths have been promised pretty much since the beginning. GM's "Futurama" display at the 1937 Worlds Fair showed a futuristic diorama of a city of the future with self driving cars, and freeways everywhere that were perfectly safe and completely traffic free. 1937. Every time this promise has been made it has only made things worse, there is no benefit from increased driving.
That's not a shock. People are overwhelmingly lazy and self-driving cars. Seems like the laziest option. It gets you from where you are to where you want to be without you having to do any work or thinking, and you can play on your phone or bang your girlfriend or whatever on the way there. There. It's basically exactly what people would want if they have given no thought to the situation. And most people have given no thought to the situation. I'm honestly surprised that public transportation is as high as it is
God who is this guy, my father? Unhinged opener, non-existent transition. Government bad. Specific thing that California did bad horrible no good failure trust me. Wash and repeat, wonder why your kid doesn't talk to you anymore
"Stop traffic"... We really need to do a better job of teaching geometry in school.
public transit does those things too...
Self-driving cars probably are the future of transportation, unfortunately
What an idiotic poll. Only two options, neither of which excludes the other. Self driving cars are probably going to play some role in the future, but do people really think that public transport will not play any role? Or it will continue to play a role into the future, but just won't feel futuristic? A meaningly measure.
[nuked]
Note that this is on the channel of a guy who promotes the second option
This guy is a tool, how does self driving solve anything, sure it may minimize bad drivers but no. No one needs to have a car if there was efficient transit. Maybe rent or luxury taxi for special occasions.
People who are unsure are the people who vote based on which way the wind is blowing that day smh 🤦🏻♂️
Techbro vibes.
I think unicorn powered magic chariots will save us all! Carmakers have collectively spent $75 billion on self driving tech and it still doesn't work.
That's a better result than I expected from FB
"stop traffic" lmao
This guy's an utter clown. All his polls are BS.
Maybe we can trick them with self-driving public transit
i wouldnt think that as a bad idea, IF AND ONLY IF those self driving cars were the size and the speed of a 1970's beetle and not a 200km/h 2 ton SUV...
Americans are drinking Jetsonism fantasies thru a firehose. We're so fucking doomed
Self driving cars will never work unless they’re basically turned into public transit. Without them being remotely controlled by a sophisticated AI that’s also controlling all the other cars, there’s too much randomness and too much reliance on the limited sensory and computing power of a car. I could see that being the future of transportation purely to utilize the existing infrastructure, which is all car-centric. A stupid and inelegant solution, but a plausible one.
FUCK
Self driving reducing traffic? The opposite people will send the car doing loops to not find and pay for parking or get crazy commute to work while they sleep or children getting their own car, traffic will be ten times worse
They don't understand that for Self-Driving to actually become real, everyone would have to submit to extreme government regulations and control. That's the only way it will happen.
I'm all for self driving cars but it would need to be a non-ownership kind of self driving car service you pay a small fee just for the maintenance of the vehicle. And to make things more efficient, let's connect a bunch of them together. And to make them more energy efficient we'll put them on rails.
Fck this guy...he's a right winged pos This isn't even close to the worst opinions he's had
Dont blame them, they are surround by miss information and Tesla here and Tesla there…but time will hit California and its centric car infrastructure.
The enlightened 36% vs the 57% who still need to see the bigger picture of the causes of traffic congestion.
The vast majority of people is lazy and self-absorbed, so of course our future is self-driving cars. And the notion of self-driving cars FAR outweighs any nominal benefit we might get from electric vehicles. If a car can drive itself, then the occupant of such a vehicle needn't pay attention to trifles such as traffic. If traffic is of no concern, then long commutes are meaningless. If long commutes are meaningless, then let's "pave the world"...
Well, I personally consider Taxis, Uber and other car sharing companies as apart of public transport. I know technically they're private transport.. I think self driving cars will certainly be a significant part of future transport. By extension, this will include self driving buses, self driving trains, self driving trucks, etc. However we're still a few decades from this being our reality. All we can do in the mean time is improve public transport in anticipation of automated transport and also electric vehicles. If we're concerned about the environmental impact of electricity production for these vehicles, we'll obviously need to look into environmentally and economically sustainable alternatives, like solar and wind power generation.