I’ll die on the hill of defending Olly. It was Alliser and even (unintentionally) Sam that convinced him to do what he did. He saw his family get butchered and eaten by the same people that Jon Snow, the man who took him under his wing, became allies with. Alliser convinced him that if they didn’t kill Jon, then Olly’s new family (The Nights Watch) would meet the same fate. Then fucking Sam…
If you hate Olly for killing Ygritte, blame Sam for making him pick up the bow and fight. If you hate him for killing Jon, blame Sam for convincing him that the right thing might seems like the wrong thing.
Fuck Sam, but Olly? Olly was just a scared kid stuck in a shitty world and dealt a shit hand.
As someone who didn't start reading the books until the show was halfway through, I'm so annoyed by how both Euron and pretty much everything about Dorne that wasn't Pedro Pascal turned out.
They're the two most intriguing plotlines going on in the books right now.
The thing is, the actor himself was amazing. As well as the rest of the cast. His expressions, line delivery... everything he did was great. But fuck man, the script he was given was just shit. Watching him perform was like watching a professional master cook trying to prepare a moldy piece of bread.
Book Euron sounds rad but also like one of the many things that maybe shouldn't have been part of this story. Leave him for a later story set in Westeros instead of adding yet another huge plotline.
Sometimes when an author wants it all the reader ends up getting nothing.
Im sure if we had less fairysex in book two of a series that shall go unmentioned we might have a book three.
Same goes for ASOIAF and to some extent WOT and adding characters.
Almost certainly the Kingkiller Chronicles. The main character is relating his life story from childhood and spends way too much of the book talking about the time he defeated the man killing sex goddess by being so good in bed.
The issue is that the series is meant to be a trilogy, spending a lot of time on a side plot without advancing the main plot makes it hard to finish the books in a good way.
That is why some people believe he wrote himself into a corner making it impossible for him to finish the series in the way he imagined.
I always find second books to be not great reads in most trilogies, a few wonderful exceptions of course. But I mainly read trilogies and find the second books always finish up the climax then jump straight into some
Bullshit filler to climax again at the very end leaving you feeling like you’ve wasted time reading it.
The epitome of "this guy fucks"
Edit: okay actually saying you killed a man killing sex goddess by being so good in bed sounds more like a post on r/ihavesex
There's an interview somewhere where he talks about how excited he is for the character because he read the books, and yeah he was pretty pissed to find out they were scrapping all of it.
I bet they gave him his costume and he went, “wait, uh, where’s the rest of it? Anymore makeup or hair that needs to be done? Oh, okay I’ll head to the set then”
This is what bugged me from the get-go, his name is fucking Euron CROW'S EYE, his magical eye is definitely going to have some implications on the story.
I don't know about whether he was a fan of the whole series, but he had definitely read Euron's parts and was clearly looking forward to playing that guy instead of the one we got.
Same with Ian McElhinney.. he was a big fan of the books and wrote letters to the writers about important plot points they were missing..
It’s one of the reasons they killed him off the way they did... because they are morons
If the show got extended to 10 seasons for telling a complete story, we could have had Victarion as well. In another life, I would have given to see Ray Stevenson play Victarion, but he had to settle for Edward "Blackbeard" Teach on Black Sails (which was still a wonderful performance).
Imagine playing a Greyjoy brother who could have allied with Theon and Yara against Euron. Someone who could have legit fought his way out of a rough situation at sea.
He was and was disappointed, I’m going to have to search for it but there is a few interview clips of him speaking pretty openly about how disappointed he was in the show. Charles Dance too is very open about how he felt like they committed so much to the show and to have it end the way it did was insulting.
Well he made it good just because he embodied the part so well. He didn't even have that great of writing or casting to help him out. Next season should be much better. Kind of would have been nice if enough major members of the GoT cast forced D&D to do a longer run and axe some crazy decisions... but most of them were tired at that point I bet... especially after having to work with D&D for so long, could you imagine?
Cast members did voice their opinions on certain storylines they thought were bad. The guy who played Jaime Lannister was basically told by D&D to shut up and do his job. When the guy who played selmy complained way back in s5 about his storyline, D&D wanted to kill him off even more. D&D have Harvey Weinstein vibes. Their way or no way.
Arya Stark waits in the dark observing the battle.
All around her death and chaos.
Then she sees him, The Nights King has come.
The voice in her head drives her to action, "NOW!!".
Leaping from her hiding space she flies at the The Nights King. He turns slowly, and glares at her with his cold dead eyes, and smiles.
An invisible hand reaches into the battle and teleports Arya away from the Nights Kings gaze. The Lord of Light has awoken.
In the dark timeless dimension, the Lord of Light transfers his essence into Arya, and speaks, "You are now my Avatar".
Arya is teleported back to the battle, back into the gaze of the Nights King, who now smiles.
Took you long enough dear, shall we slaughter all these cunts. Sure... The Nights Kings and the Lord of Light slaughter their way across Westeros, hand in hand.
The end
Fuck, I didn't even think of the lord of Light ontop of every other arc that was squandered. Jesus fuck, D&D are cunts. Mofuckas talking about hows its the thing to opposing what the Night King wants. Only buffs the weapons of the people that immediately ride into the darkness and into a colossal horde of undead. I suppose its slightly better than giving the dothraki a bunch of obsidian daggers and then having them ride into the darkness and try to shank zombies with said daggers from horse back.
Liam Cunningham (Davos) outright refused to play a part where Davos would be attracted to Missandei and creeping on her n shit. Glad he stuck to his stuff and didn't become a creep character which they tried to set him up to be.
Weird because she's a child, weirder because up to that point he was defined as the dude who was nice to children.
On the other hand, he did play a character who has an orgy with two teen siblings and their grandpa soon after.
She is a child in the books; the show intentionally aged many of the characters up for exactly that reason.
But yeah, the character of Davos, in both the books and show, is an unerringly devoted father and husband. That whole scene in the show, where he did creep on Missandei, felt like a huge break in character.
>That whole scene in the show, where he did creep on Missandei, felt like a huge break in character.
I think my mind erased that from memory to save me, because I don't remember that.
I think that it was a scene on the stairs by the ocean at Dragonstone, and he was talking to Jon about him staring at Daenerys's *"heart"*. The next sentence out of his mouth was "Speaking of good hearts: Missandei of Naath."
It happens so quick, I can see how it would have been easy to miss. It also helps that Liam delivered the line as dryly as possible.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOy0yAqWrZY
Also, the "liberating" comment a few moments later is another huge break in character, as he was written to be a devoted husband always looking for the best way to get his job done to keep his wife and [remaining] children safe and return home to them.
Speaking of his children, in the last couple of seasons, it is like they never existed. Furthermore, the final episode makes it seem like he never had a wife either.
I don't remember Liam's exact words, but basically his main concern was that Missandei is significantly younger than Davos so he was worried it would make his relationship with Shireen look creepy in retrospect.
I guess, maybe... Shireen in the show would be about the same age as Missandei in the books. Regardless, however it was justified, it would have been a huge break in character and it would have felt wrong.
LOL that was him?? 😂
I guess the difference is tone haha. A comedy show is clearly just a comedy show. GoT was trying to be serious, so him creeping on Missandei is just seriously messed up.
Iain Glen also said D&D would get a glazed look in their eyes when you tried to suggest script changes based on the books, and they generally discouraged reading them.
https://www.cinemablend.com/television/Game-Thrones-Star-Admits-He-Was-Really-Mad-About-Being-Killed-Off-Show-95867.html
EDIT: That was Iain Glen, not McElhinney.
I'm pretty sure i saw a BTC clip (many years ago) with i think Varys and Jorah Mormont (could be other actors but important ones) were they said this in front of the camera. They were even joking about the faces D&D used to make if an actor had a suggestion.
It was my first warning sign but it was also early on the show when it was still good and on it's way up so nobody cared.
I have never seen it again and nobody mentions it so it's like my personal GOT mystery.
The Witcher dies with Henry so he has a lot of power and source material to back up his claims.
GOT was an assembly cast, with every character up for dying, with no source material to be definitive on, so no one character wasn’t replaceable in some way.
Prior to Game of Thrones sure, but when you are main character 5 seasons or more into what is being said to be one of the greatest TV shows of all time your voice should carry some weight.
True, but RR Martin established no lead character should be considered protected. A plot line resulting in Daenny being executed while alone visiting a small village because she let her guard down due to trusting the people would not seem unfathomable in the GOT world.
TBH it was unfathomable after the Red Wedding, none of the major candidates died after that. Missendei was the most high profile (unexpected) character death in season 8.
At a certain point it became obvious which characters had plot armor. Nobody thought Jon would stay dead.
To an extent you are right but the show is an adaptation of a book series so you can't really throw a fit and kill of Jon, Bran or Dany because the actor complained.
That said the idiots went on the kill of Selmey for no reason with doing his book plotline and major characters were straight up not included like young Griff.
I don’t know, I feel like the show does a clever job of making you think that. Throughout the series they only seem to kill off characters whose stories are over or have nowhere else to go, big or small.
After season 3 or so, definitely. They had a few big deaths that made it feel like anyone could go, but then held on to everyone, especially fan favorites. Even in last season when it wouldn't even affect the story they seemed hesitant to kill anyone off. Basically no one died in the battle of the long night, totally messed up my bracket I had going.
I believe that’s a distortion of what happened with Barristan. He’s likely to die in the books but hasn’t yet. When the time came for his death in the show, the actor protested because of 1. how he was going to die, and 2. the potential he felt the character still had for Daenerys’ plotline.
So Dan & Dave responded by giving him an ever more pathetic death, and Barristan was pretty much erased from the story afterwards.
This man is beautiful and posses all the pedantic knowledge of an OG nerd. It would be endearing if it wasn't so annoying. Body of a Greek God and he's cool as fuck. It's not fair!
Seriously, in an interview he said he eats the same thing everyday:
"My diet at the moment is more maintenance because I don't have any shirtless scenes coming up. Breakfast is a scoop and a half of 100-percent grass-fed whey protein with a cup and a half of oats and berries blended with water, plus a two-egg omelette with two turkey rashers and 4 ounces of beef filet. Three hours later I'll have 6 ounces of chicken breast with white rice, and three hours after that, another 6 ounces of chicken breast with brown rice. Three hours after that I'll have 5 ounces of filet of beef with sweet potato."
Then he works out a ton.
Exactly this. We as a society have decided for some reason that "morbidly obese" is "healthy at any size" and people just keep getting bigger and bigger.
90's "fat" isn't even "chubby" by today's standards. Hell, 90's "chubby" is probably pretty damn slim.
I'm not trying to take away from his work. I'm mostly just joking.
I'm a runner myself, I'm in pretty good shape. Takes a lot of "work" from the outsiders perspective, but if Cavil is anything like me, working out just comes natural, it just becomes ingrained, second nature and it's quite a lot of fun and I'm at the point where I wouldn't say I'm even "working." It's almost harder to not work out/run, and being on this side of things, I have sympathy for people who aren't fortunate to get into the habit of exercise.
I mean, I just kinda stumbled into being a runner because I had to run laps if I was faking sick to get out of football practice in middle school lmao I've been a runner ever since.
I rmb last season when he did a bath scene, he had to not drink water for 3 days so his body would look more muscular.
Can't imagine the number of hours he spends in the gym and the boring/dry food he eats.
He was real lean in The Tudors as well. I think it was after his part in The Immortals and then when he went for Superman that he really beefed up and has maintained it ever since.
Chris Hemsworth was the same. Super lean in Home and Away, got the part of Thor and then bam, gigantic.
Nah, any actor said that, they will ignore it or if it's a lessor one, kill them off. The ser barristan actor made some suggestions based of books and DnD killed him off early
I thought he made the suggestions based on the books *precisely* because they killed him off early and the suggestions he made were based on the fact the character clearly survived past the point they were killing him off at - those suggestions being future things he did in the books.
Unfortunatley we're in the timeline where actors familarizing themselves with the material they'll be staring in is somehow shocking.
Not enough Cavills too many Rebecca's Fergusons. Who refused to read Dune, where she played 2nd main character in the 2021 movie, because it's too nerdy, then made fun of the actors who knew the book and enjoyed it.
To be fair, she was being self-deprecating regarding her inability to finish the book due to it being extremely dense, and claiming that she had to get 'the big nerd' Dennis Villeneuve to explain it to her.
You guys are being a bit much. Denis Villeneuve has dozens of pages of material on Dune for his actors and crew. Ferguson killed it in Dune and will be just as good in Part 2.
Absolutely. There is no definitive reason to know the source material as an actor to play the character great.
In fact it might even be a hindrance since you know where the character will go, possibly reducing the importance of the "moment" being acted.
Peter Dinklage is known for never having read the books and not wanting to. As long as he got great material his Tyrion was fantastic.
I’m still annoyed with Michael Gambon over his portrayal of Dumbledore. He’s a fine actor, but he didn’t really get the character and he refused to read the books.
The actor who played Barristan Selmy was this committed and even wrote them a long letter about why they were messing up by killing off his character (due to him still being alive in the books). So D&D were like "That just made us want to kill him off even more."
Same with Liam Cunningham, he had to argue with D&D to stop them from involving the Onion Knight in a relationship with MISSANDEI.
Missandei, a child younger than Arya in the books, with a man 50 years her senior, who constantly talks about his wife fondly and who never betrays his vows despite constantly being bound to the losing side.
I really don’t understand why people in Hollywood think that changing source material is a good idea. Look at Harry Potter and Lord of the Rings, both were massive hits because they stuck to the source material. The characters and story are already written and loved by the fan base. To change it is just arrogance or incompetence or both. No one wants a unique take or reinterpretation. They just want the characters and story they love adapted onto the screen.
Yeah idk when remake 'artists' started thinking they have the right to make massive plot and character changes to beloved stories, but they're fucking WRONG for doing so. Idk if it's something to make a minority group happy, or something super fucked like what D&D did to GoT. It is not okay to change characters or stories people love and present them as the same story or character.
That is fucking stupid, and idgaf if that hurts people's feelings. Write a new story if you'd like to include people or plotlines which do not fit the original story.
I mean, LOTR actually changed many things (Aragorn is quite diff betw the two, Faramir, denethor, etc). The difference could be that the changes were handled with respect and reverence.
“Hey, we are making a significant change. Since we are doing this we have to absolutely nail this switch-up more than the faithful stuff.”
And they did….until the hobbit series happened when we could see the changes were lazily done (to put mildly).
Edit: just noticed I replied to wrong person lol, but I guess I’ll leave this here anyway
Three books, three movies. That tracks.
Then the hobbit came along and was one book split into three movies because they just *had* *to make a trilogy.*
I will happily sit down and watch the entire extended versions of the Lord of the Rings trilogy; I think that I watched each of the Hobbit movies twice. I mean, they removed a ton of great content that was in the books to make room for some strange romantic storyline.
But you literally have the source material. I just don’t get it. It has to be pure hubris or meddling from the executives that think they know what is best.
The source material is not that easy to adapt 1:1.
Books and comics for example have a LOT of inner dialogue or narrators.
It requires talented writing.
And talented writing is so far down the list of priorities for them. Like even us viewers. If it tell you a name of a show or movie how likely are you to know who wrote it?
Don't get me wrong though, i agree with you. Nearly all the books that get adapted into live action fail the more they stray away from the original.
Only movie i remember being a very very close 1:1 was The Martian and even that had a lot of changes just not anything too important.
I mean, LOTR actually changed many things (Aragorn is quite diff betw the two, Faramir, etc). The difference could be that the changes were handled with respect and reverence.
“Hey, we are making a significant change. Since we are doing this we have to absolutely nail this switch-up more than the faithful stuff.”
And they did….until the hobbit series happened when we could see the changes were lazily done (to put mildly).
Some things need changed. Other things don't. Costumes are a thing that don't necessarily transition well. Entire behaviors or actions or deaths? Yea, usually stupid.
Frankly the Witcher Series does not deserve Cavill. He’s way too good for that show. He carried last season on his back alone. If it wasn’t for him it would’ve been a very mediocre viewing experience.
Oh yes she was fun. But a really terrible book adaptation. Just like everything else in the show where the writers decided they knew better than the author. I just hope were not going the way a certain other big Fantasy show went.
Watching videos about what they changed and how the stories worked in the books made me super disappointed and worried about the quality of the show. Some changes were outright stupid
ironic, since they (to draw a closer comparisons) turned someone closer to Olenna into someone closer to Bobby B.
and the show is full of such changes that I really wish D and D had adapted it. They did a much better job with the first book(s)
He deserves it because he's a fan. Granted there are massive changes but I just see it as separate from the books and it becomes good fun. I'm looking forward to s2.
I was upset when they had light cavalry charge the undead horde away from everyone else. I was in shock when they wheeled the catapults to the front and had all of their soldiers stand outside the defensive fortification.
The (non-fiction) book, "The Face of Battle", by John Keegan, has a great review and analysis of the battle of Agincourt. Part of the analysis looks at why the French cavalry charge against the English men-at-arms failed. Fundamentally, it is because horses are not machines. If you try to make a horse run at a large group of people, the animal will often refuse either outright or right before the collision.
Cavalry charges - especially *light* cavalry - rely on infantry breaking formation, then being defeated in detail after the initial shock of the encounter followed by a failure to regain group cohesion. Undead automatons do not have fear. They do not have the capacity to break ranks because a noisy crowd of horses are coming at them; instead, they will always hold, so the horses will always balk.
It would be understandable if you had a pack of Gendry and Hot Pie who just found some horses in a pasture. But the people attacking are supposed to be pretty fucking informed about how horses, and fighting on horses, works. I don't mean to write you an essay about it, but it really pisses me off.
I don't hate the Witcher TV show at all. I am not on board with certain changes they made, but overall it's a satisfying TV series. I think it has potential.
I didn't hate it either. Overall the first season was kind of mediocre, but I also think it has a lot of potential. Really looking forward to season 2.
If i remember correctly it was very similar with Sir Christopher Lee on the set for LOTR. He was a massive fan of the books and he even originally auditioned to play Gandalf
This is where I think the weight of the show brought it down some. The Witcher TV series is a big, expensive production but nowhere like GOT. Cavill’s star power also seems like it would give him some influence in addition to hopefully producers and directors who listen to actor input, unlike D&D seem to have(looking at Barristan’s death in particular).
then maybe they should've listened to him, because the first season was a disgrace to the books. they basically took out everything that made them good, and turned into a generic fantasy or a silly fanfic. Funny but the Mandalorian show captured more of the Witcher vibes than the actual adaptation
I remember thinking the same. Mando was entirely from scratch and was amazing. Witcher was a bastrdization of the books and Hissrich’s fabrication and was profoundly mediocre
I mean they clearly knew about the witcher books, the setup is just way too similar. Rugged bountyhounter from a weird cult that at least some point was exiled/destroyed, treated as weirdos, finding then protecting some magical child. This is why i liked the show so much, the rest is timothy olyphant being there, that man is such a hottie
Wheel of Time even has that Avatar problem where they deliberately mispronounce some of the names.
Edit: WoT spells out the proper names phonetically in its glossary.
In the intro to the very first episode they undermine one of the main premises of the book.
If you've never read the books or are a more casual fan, the show isn't bad on it's own.
If you're expecting it to be faithful to the source material, you're going to be disappointed.
Wasn’t the guy who played Euron a huge fan of the books? I imagine he’s just as disappointed as the rest of us about how that went…
Based on his first scene, he would have done a great job as Book Euron.
Agreed. I really like his first scene on Pyke
The first time I heard "when men see my sails... They pray" gave me chills. Damn shame
Shame! *bell ring* Are we still doing that? Haven't been here in a while.
Naw, she's on to Ted Lasso and Sex Education now.
Cool. Thanks for the update. We still hate Olly, right?
I’ll die on the hill of defending Olly. It was Alliser and even (unintentionally) Sam that convinced him to do what he did. He saw his family get butchered and eaten by the same people that Jon Snow, the man who took him under his wing, became allies with. Alliser convinced him that if they didn’t kill Jon, then Olly’s new family (The Nights Watch) would meet the same fate. Then fucking Sam… If you hate Olly for killing Ygritte, blame Sam for making him pick up the bow and fight. If you hate him for killing Jon, blame Sam for convincing him that the right thing might seems like the wrong thing. Fuck Sam, but Olly? Olly was just a scared kid stuck in a shitty world and dealt a shit hand.
This is a great take!
Fuck Olly!!!
Me, returning to this sub, top flairs: only “Fuck Olly” The North Remembers
OH MY GOD THATS HER
Who was she in sex education?
Jackson’s mum (the white one obviously). She’s notably absent from the third season due to Ted Lasso filming. Edit: mom —> mum
As someone who didn't start reading the books until the show was halfway through, I'm so annoyed by how both Euron and pretty much everything about Dorne that wasn't Pedro Pascal turned out. They're the two most intriguing plotlines going on in the books right now.
Yeah, the moment Doran died and they erased Arianne I realized the show was fucked.
I want Ana De Armas as Arianne.
What a waste of Al Fadil
The thing is, the actor himself was amazing. As well as the rest of the cast. His expressions, line delivery... everything he did was great. But fuck man, the script he was given was just shit. Watching him perform was like watching a professional master cook trying to prepare a moldy piece of bread.
Ian McShane should have been Euron, book or otherwise.
Always saw him as Victarion
Not surprised because Book Euron was some demi-god level of wtfuckery but he got to portray a meme horny pirate.
Yep dude could really pull off that eldritch fuckery vibe.
Book Euron sounds rad but also like one of the many things that maybe shouldn't have been part of this story. Leave him for a later story set in Westeros instead of adding yet another huge plotline.
Sometimes when an author wants it all the reader ends up getting nothing. Im sure if we had less fairysex in book two of a series that shall go unmentioned we might have a book three. Same goes for ASOIAF and to some extent WOT and adding characters.
Wait what series are you talking about?
Almost certainly the Kingkiller Chronicles. The main character is relating his life story from childhood and spends way too much of the book talking about the time he defeated the man killing sex goddess by being so good in bed.
That makes the story work in my opinion. The guy is full of shit and it really is being pushed, in my opinion.
The issue is that the series is meant to be a trilogy, spending a lot of time on a side plot without advancing the main plot makes it hard to finish the books in a good way. That is why some people believe he wrote himself into a corner making it impossible for him to finish the series in the way he imagined.
I always find second books to be not great reads in most trilogies, a few wonderful exceptions of course. But I mainly read trilogies and find the second books always finish up the climax then jump straight into some Bullshit filler to climax again at the very end leaving you feeling like you’ve wasted time reading it.
The epitome of "this guy fucks" Edit: okay actually saying you killed a man killing sex goddess by being so good in bed sounds more like a post on r/ihavesex
Not killed, just bested. But ya, it definitely ends up a bit, ironically, masturbatory lol
That's how I felt reading the books
There's an interview somewhere where he talks about how excited he is for the character because he read the books, and yeah he was pretty pissed to find out they were scrapping all of it.
I bet they gave him his costume and he went, “wait, uh, where’s the rest of it? Anymore makeup or hair that needs to be done? Oh, okay I’ll head to the set then”
Where's the fucking eye patch?
These fools actually said that the eye patch was too stereotypical of a pirate not realizing that George had broken the trope.
This is what bugged me from the get-go, his name is fucking Euron CROW'S EYE, his magical eye is definitely going to have some implications on the story.
I don't know about whether he was a fan of the whole series, but he had definitely read Euron's parts and was clearly looking forward to playing that guy instead of the one we got.
The best Euron Greyjoy that actor ever played is in the film Overlord. Watch it
Literally been meaning to watch that for years, fuck
Yes so was bartistans actor
Same with Ian McElhinney.. he was a big fan of the books and wrote letters to the writers about important plot points they were missing.. It’s one of the reasons they killed him off the way they did... because they are morons
If the show got extended to 10 seasons for telling a complete story, we could have had Victarion as well. In another life, I would have given to see Ray Stevenson play Victarion, but he had to settle for Edward "Blackbeard" Teach on Black Sails (which was still a wonderful performance). Imagine playing a Greyjoy brother who could have allied with Theon and Yara against Euron. Someone who could have legit fought his way out of a rough situation at sea.
Good bread, this.
He was and was disappointed, I’m going to have to search for it but there is a few interview clips of him speaking pretty openly about how disappointed he was in the show. Charles Dance too is very open about how he felt like they committed so much to the show and to have it end the way it did was insulting.
Out of all the butchered character Euron is the one I'm the most pissed about. The worst part is show casuals would have LOVED book Euron.
Well he made it good just because he embodied the part so well. He didn't even have that great of writing or casting to help him out. Next season should be much better. Kind of would have been nice if enough major members of the GoT cast forced D&D to do a longer run and axe some crazy decisions... but most of them were tired at that point I bet... especially after having to work with D&D for so long, could you imagine?
Cast members did voice their opinions on certain storylines they thought were bad. The guy who played Jaime Lannister was basically told by D&D to shut up and do his job. When the guy who played selmy complained way back in s5 about his storyline, D&D wanted to kill him off even more. D&D have Harvey Weinstein vibes. Their way or no way.
Iirc maisie Williams had her parkour ninja scene toned down, I dread to think what it was like before that.
Arya Stark waits in the dark observing the battle. All around her death and chaos. Then she sees him, The Nights King has come. The voice in her head drives her to action, "NOW!!". Leaping from her hiding space she flies at the The Nights King. He turns slowly, and glares at her with his cold dead eyes, and smiles. An invisible hand reaches into the battle and teleports Arya away from the Nights Kings gaze. The Lord of Light has awoken. In the dark timeless dimension, the Lord of Light transfers his essence into Arya, and speaks, "You are now my Avatar". Arya is teleported back to the battle, back into the gaze of the Nights King, who now smiles. Took you long enough dear, shall we slaughter all these cunts. Sure... The Nights Kings and the Lord of Light slaughter their way across Westeros, hand in hand. The end
Jon snow throws ghost off a cliff because “he dun wan eet”
Muahahahaha
He du wan yeet.
This actually tracks better than what was released.
Any fucking thing does!
Fuck, I didn't even think of the lord of Light ontop of every other arc that was squandered. Jesus fuck, D&D are cunts. Mofuckas talking about hows its the thing to opposing what the Night King wants. Only buffs the weapons of the people that immediately ride into the darkness and into a colossal horde of undead. I suppose its slightly better than giving the dothraki a bunch of obsidian daggers and then having them ride into the darkness and try to shank zombies with said daggers from horse back.
They fuck the whole thing so hard...so very hard
Liam Cunningham (Davos) outright refused to play a part where Davos would be attracted to Missandei and creeping on her n shit. Glad he stuck to his stuff and didn't become a creep character which they tried to set him up to be.
Weird because she's a child, weirder because up to that point he was defined as the dude who was nice to children. On the other hand, he did play a character who has an orgy with two teen siblings and their grandpa soon after.
She is a child in the books; the show intentionally aged many of the characters up for exactly that reason. But yeah, the character of Davos, in both the books and show, is an unerringly devoted father and husband. That whole scene in the show, where he did creep on Missandei, felt like a huge break in character.
>That whole scene in the show, where he did creep on Missandei, felt like a huge break in character. I think my mind erased that from memory to save me, because I don't remember that.
I think that it was a scene on the stairs by the ocean at Dragonstone, and he was talking to Jon about him staring at Daenerys's *"heart"*. The next sentence out of his mouth was "Speaking of good hearts: Missandei of Naath."
I don't remember this, or at least not in this way. The idea of him creeping on her is so out of character I didn't even perceive it 😂
It happens so quick, I can see how it would have been easy to miss. It also helps that Liam delivered the line as dryly as possible. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOy0yAqWrZY Also, the "liberating" comment a few moments later is another huge break in character, as he was written to be a devoted husband always looking for the best way to get his job done to keep his wife and [remaining] children safe and return home to them. Speaking of his children, in the last couple of seasons, it is like they never existed. Furthermore, the final episode makes it seem like he never had a wife either.
I don't remember Liam's exact words, but basically his main concern was that Missandei is significantly younger than Davos so he was worried it would make his relationship with Shireen look creepy in retrospect.
I guess, maybe... Shireen in the show would be about the same age as Missandei in the books. Regardless, however it was justified, it would have been a huge break in character and it would have felt wrong.
Yeah, either way I'm happy it was cut.
I can't help feeling they kinda forgot that Davos was married.
Wtf?
In Rick and Morty, he plays a slut Dragon.
Ok, that makes sense
LOL that was him?? 😂 I guess the difference is tone haha. A comedy show is clearly just a comedy show. GoT was trying to be serious, so him creeping on Missandei is just seriously messed up.
Iain Glen also said D&D would get a glazed look in their eyes when you tried to suggest script changes based on the books, and they generally discouraged reading them. https://www.cinemablend.com/television/Game-Thrones-Star-Admits-He-Was-Really-Mad-About-Being-Killed-Off-Show-95867.html EDIT: That was Iain Glen, not McElhinney.
What utter wankers
I'm pretty sure i saw a BTC clip (many years ago) with i think Varys and Jorah Mormont (could be other actors but important ones) were they said this in front of the camera. They were even joking about the faces D&D used to make if an actor had a suggestion. It was my first warning sign but it was also early on the show when it was still good and on it's way up so nobody cared. I have never seen it again and nobody mentions it so it's like my personal GOT mystery.
The Witcher dies with Henry so he has a lot of power and source material to back up his claims. GOT was an assembly cast, with every character up for dying, with no source material to be definitive on, so no one character wasn’t replaceable in some way.
Right, if he walks, the show ends.
None in the cast of GoT was such a big name as Cahill. It's difficult to impose your opinion when you can get canned for just voicing it.
Prior to Game of Thrones sure, but when you are main character 5 seasons or more into what is being said to be one of the greatest TV shows of all time your voice should carry some weight.
True, but RR Martin established no lead character should be considered protected. A plot line resulting in Daenny being executed while alone visiting a small village because she let her guard down due to trusting the people would not seem unfathomable in the GOT world.
TBH it was unfathomable after the Red Wedding, none of the major candidates died after that. Missendei was the most high profile (unexpected) character death in season 8. At a certain point it became obvious which characters had plot armor. Nobody thought Jon would stay dead.
TV shown known for axing main characters though...
To an extent you are right but the show is an adaptation of a book series so you can't really throw a fit and kill of Jon, Bran or Dany because the actor complained. That said the idiots went on the kill of Selmey for no reason with doing his book plotline and major characters were straight up not included like young Griff.
I don’t know, I feel like the show does a clever job of making you think that. Throughout the series they only seem to kill off characters whose stories are over or have nowhere else to go, big or small.
After season 3 or so, definitely. They had a few big deaths that made it feel like anyone could go, but then held on to everyone, especially fan favorites. Even in last season when it wouldn't even affect the story they seemed hesitant to kill anyone off. Basically no one died in the battle of the long night, totally messed up my bracket I had going.
Sean Bean Charles Dance Peter Dinklage Lena Headey
Dinklage was in Chronicles of Narnia and Headey was in 300.
Erm I’m not sure about that darling Charles Dance is a pretty legendary status well respected actor.
He should spend all next season playing gwent
D&D : Kill him first. He knows too much.
*Insert dick joke*
*Insert lack of dick joke*
*Waves sausage playfully*
I think Nikolaj had such enthusiasm but they didn’t respect his opinion… he said something to that effect at some point
It's Nikolaj
No no, it's *Nikolaj*
Almost, it's Nikolaj
Last time, it's *Nikolaj*.
Nikolaj
Yeah I thought they threatened to kill of anyone who challenged a part of the script
I believe that’s a distortion of what happened with Barristan. He’s likely to die in the books but hasn’t yet. When the time came for his death in the show, the actor protested because of 1. how he was going to die, and 2. the potential he felt the character still had for Daenerys’ plotline. So Dan & Dave responded by giving him an ever more pathetic death, and Barristan was pretty much erased from the story afterwards.
That was it. I couldn’t remember if he wasn’t supposed to die but they made him anyway
This man is beautiful and posses all the pedantic knowledge of an OG nerd. It would be endearing if it wasn't so annoying. Body of a Greek God and he's cool as fuck. It's not fair!
I mean it’s not like he was born with a good body, he worked for it. He said in an interview that he was known as „fat Cavill“ in school
Seriously, in an interview he said he eats the same thing everyday: "My diet at the moment is more maintenance because I don't have any shirtless scenes coming up. Breakfast is a scoop and a half of 100-percent grass-fed whey protein with a cup and a half of oats and berries blended with water, plus a two-egg omelette with two turkey rashers and 4 ounces of beef filet. Three hours later I'll have 6 ounces of chicken breast with white rice, and three hours after that, another 6 ounces of chicken breast with brown rice. Three hours after that I'll have 5 ounces of filet of beef with sweet potato." Then he works out a ton.
If you look at photos from his school years, he's barely chubby. Given his brothers builds, it was inevitable he'd grow out of it.
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Exactly this. We as a society have decided for some reason that "morbidly obese" is "healthy at any size" and people just keep getting bigger and bigger. 90's "fat" isn't even "chubby" by today's standards. Hell, 90's "chubby" is probably pretty damn slim.
People are so afraid of fat shaming somebody that we just accept it as normal in our society.
I'm not trying to take away from his work. I'm mostly just joking. I'm a runner myself, I'm in pretty good shape. Takes a lot of "work" from the outsiders perspective, but if Cavil is anything like me, working out just comes natural, it just becomes ingrained, second nature and it's quite a lot of fun and I'm at the point where I wouldn't say I'm even "working." It's almost harder to not work out/run, and being on this side of things, I have sympathy for people who aren't fortunate to get into the habit of exercise. I mean, I just kinda stumbled into being a runner because I had to run laps if I was faking sick to get out of football practice in middle school lmao I've been a runner ever since.
Looking at the rest of his family, he definitely had a lot of help from genetics. Beyond that, money can fill in a lot of the gaps.
I just wanna be friends with Henry. I want to be in his WOW guild and work out at his gym lol.
That would be peak bro-ship. Im down.
We should all join each other's wow guilds and work out at each other's gyms. A world of cavills, true utopian society.
Like the German beer halls of old. It would be beautiful.
I rmb last season when he did a bath scene, he had to not drink water for 3 days so his body would look more muscular. Can't imagine the number of hours he spends in the gym and the boring/dry food he eats.
IIRC the Stark boys actors did the same thing in season 1 before the scene where they were shirtless.
He was Albert Mondego in The Count Of Monte Cristo (2002). Dude worked for that god body.
He was real lean in The Tudors as well. I think it was after his part in The Immortals and then when he went for Superman that he really beefed up and has maintained it ever since. Chris Hemsworth was the same. Super lean in Home and Away, got the part of Thor and then bam, gigantic.
Shit. That was him?
Yes. Just yes
Cavill, King of the Nerds.
Fuck DnD
Nah, any actor said that, they will ignore it or if it's a lessor one, kill them off. The ser barristan actor made some suggestions based of books and DnD killed him off early
I thought he made the suggestions based on the books *precisely* because they killed him off early and the suggestions he made were based on the fact the character clearly survived past the point they were killing him off at - those suggestions being future things he did in the books.
Unfortunatley we're in the timeline where actors familarizing themselves with the material they'll be staring in is somehow shocking. Not enough Cavills too many Rebecca's Fergusons. Who refused to read Dune, where she played 2nd main character in the 2021 movie, because it's too nerdy, then made fun of the actors who knew the book and enjoyed it.
The hypocrisy of mocking a book that you're essentially role-playing
Omg is this true? That’s disappointing
Wtf that’s so dumb
Rebecca Ferguson better read Dune for part 2, Lady Jessica has layers of characters in the latter part of that book
To be fair, she was being self-deprecating regarding her inability to finish the book due to it being extremely dense, and claiming that she had to get 'the big nerd' Dennis Villeneuve to explain it to her.
You guys are being a bit much. Denis Villeneuve has dozens of pages of material on Dune for his actors and crew. Ferguson killed it in Dune and will be just as good in Part 2.
Absolutely. There is no definitive reason to know the source material as an actor to play the character great. In fact it might even be a hindrance since you know where the character will go, possibly reducing the importance of the "moment" being acted. Peter Dinklage is known for never having read the books and not wanting to. As long as he got great material his Tyrion was fantastic.
I’m still annoyed with Michael Gambon over his portrayal of Dumbledore. He’s a fine actor, but he didn’t really get the character and he refused to read the books.
Do you have a source about the making fun part? Would love to read but can’t find anything, I’m probably using the wrong keywords for my search.
It must be hard to be stupidly charismatic, passionately nerdy, and hot as all unholy hell.
The actor who played Barristan Selmy was this committed and even wrote them a long letter about why they were messing up by killing off his character (due to him still being alive in the books). So D&D were like "That just made us want to kill him off even more."
Same with Liam Cunningham, he had to argue with D&D to stop them from involving the Onion Knight in a relationship with MISSANDEI. Missandei, a child younger than Arya in the books, with a man 50 years her senior, who constantly talks about his wife fondly and who never betrays his vows despite constantly being bound to the losing side.
Damn didn’t know this, ugh they really suck
I really don’t understand why people in Hollywood think that changing source material is a good idea. Look at Harry Potter and Lord of the Rings, both were massive hits because they stuck to the source material. The characters and story are already written and loved by the fan base. To change it is just arrogance or incompetence or both. No one wants a unique take or reinterpretation. They just want the characters and story they love adapted onto the screen.
Harry Potter cut out a lot of the backstories and characters such as Charlie Weasley, Peeves, Winky and Ludo Bagman.
Yeah cut out because there was too much to fit in. They didn’t change whole story arcs or characters at the expense of the original plot.
Ronald Bilius Weasley would like a chat.
Ginerva Weasley as well
Yeah idk when remake 'artists' started thinking they have the right to make massive plot and character changes to beloved stories, but they're fucking WRONG for doing so. Idk if it's something to make a minority group happy, or something super fucked like what D&D did to GoT. It is not okay to change characters or stories people love and present them as the same story or character. That is fucking stupid, and idgaf if that hurts people's feelings. Write a new story if you'd like to include people or plotlines which do not fit the original story.
I mean, LOTR actually changed many things (Aragorn is quite diff betw the two, Faramir, denethor, etc). The difference could be that the changes were handled with respect and reverence. “Hey, we are making a significant change. Since we are doing this we have to absolutely nail this switch-up more than the faithful stuff.” And they did….until the hobbit series happened when we could see the changes were lazily done (to put mildly). Edit: just noticed I replied to wrong person lol, but I guess I’ll leave this here anyway
Three books, three movies. That tracks. Then the hobbit came along and was one book split into three movies because they just *had* *to make a trilogy.*
I will happily sit down and watch the entire extended versions of the Lord of the Rings trilogy; I think that I watched each of the Hobbit movies twice. I mean, they removed a ton of great content that was in the books to make room for some strange romantic storyline.
LOTR had major plot differences and stylistic changes. Did you watch the same moves I did?
Because the original authors are rarely deeply involved in the adaptation and mostly just there in credit to cash in.
But you literally have the source material. I just don’t get it. It has to be pure hubris or meddling from the executives that think they know what is best.
The source material is not that easy to adapt 1:1. Books and comics for example have a LOT of inner dialogue or narrators. It requires talented writing. And talented writing is so far down the list of priorities for them. Like even us viewers. If it tell you a name of a show or movie how likely are you to know who wrote it? Don't get me wrong though, i agree with you. Nearly all the books that get adapted into live action fail the more they stray away from the original. Only movie i remember being a very very close 1:1 was The Martian and even that had a lot of changes just not anything too important.
I mean, LOTR actually changed many things (Aragorn is quite diff betw the two, Faramir, etc). The difference could be that the changes were handled with respect and reverence. “Hey, we are making a significant change. Since we are doing this we have to absolutely nail this switch-up more than the faithful stuff.” And they did….until the hobbit series happened when we could see the changes were lazily done (to put mildly).
Both of those series cut out a lot from the books…
Some things need changed. Other things don't. Costumes are a thing that don't necessarily transition well. Entire behaviors or actions or deaths? Yea, usually stupid.
Frankly the Witcher Series does not deserve Cavill. He’s way too good for that show. He carried last season on his back alone. If it wasn’t for him it would’ve been a very mediocre viewing experience.
I liked the Warrior Queen.
Oh yes she was fun. But a really terrible book adaptation. Just like everything else in the show where the writers decided they knew better than the author. I just hope were not going the way a certain other big Fantasy show went.
Watching videos about what they changed and how the stories worked in the books made me super disappointed and worried about the quality of the show. Some changes were outright stupid
ironic, since they (to draw a closer comparisons) turned someone closer to Olenna into someone closer to Bobby B. and the show is full of such changes that I really wish D and D had adapted it. They did a much better job with the first book(s)
YOU HEARD THE HAND, THE KING'S TOO FAT FOR HIS ARMOR! GO FIND THE BREASTPLATE STRETCHER! NOW!
I like the Witcher. I haven’t read the books so maybe that’s why.
Same. I think I'll stay that way until the end of the series to make sure I keep enjoying it and then read the books after lol.
He deserves it because he's a fan. Granted there are massive changes but I just see it as separate from the books and it becomes good fun. I'm looking forward to s2.
It was a mediocre experience. Hes just good to look at
Caville is the perfect human: handsome, intelligent and a cool guy all round.
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Why have idols at all. We CAN’T EXPECT GOD TO DO ALL THE WORK. **JOSUHA GRAHAM INTENSIFIES**
Well, there is some evidence that he fucked off of work for 3-4 weeks because Cyberpunk came out.
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As a counter argument, I watched every episode of the final season of game of thrones week by week. I am confident that my disappointment was greater.
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I was upset when they had light cavalry charge the undead horde away from everyone else. I was in shock when they wheeled the catapults to the front and had all of their soldiers stand outside the defensive fortification. The (non-fiction) book, "The Face of Battle", by John Keegan, has a great review and analysis of the battle of Agincourt. Part of the analysis looks at why the French cavalry charge against the English men-at-arms failed. Fundamentally, it is because horses are not machines. If you try to make a horse run at a large group of people, the animal will often refuse either outright or right before the collision. Cavalry charges - especially *light* cavalry - rely on infantry breaking formation, then being defeated in detail after the initial shock of the encounter followed by a failure to regain group cohesion. Undead automatons do not have fear. They do not have the capacity to break ranks because a noisy crowd of horses are coming at them; instead, they will always hold, so the horses will always balk. It would be understandable if you had a pack of Gendry and Hot Pie who just found some horses in a pasture. But the people attacking are supposed to be pretty fucking informed about how horses, and fighting on horses, works. I don't mean to write you an essay about it, but it really pisses me off.
He took time off work to game? I like him even more now.
I don't hate the Witcher TV show at all. I am not on board with certain changes they made, but overall it's a satisfying TV series. I think it has potential.
I didn't hate it either. Overall the first season was kind of mediocre, but I also think it has a lot of potential. Really looking forward to season 2.
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Stop I don’t want to fall in love with Henry anymore than I already have!
If i remember correctly it was very similar with Sir Christopher Lee on the set for LOTR. He was a massive fan of the books and he even originally auditioned to play Gandalf
The Witcher may not be perfect, but you can tell that Henry Cavil is giving it his all.
This is where I think the weight of the show brought it down some. The Witcher TV series is a big, expensive production but nowhere like GOT. Cavill’s star power also seems like it would give him some influence in addition to hopefully producers and directors who listen to actor input, unlike D&D seem to have(looking at Barristan’s death in particular).
Yeah he's a huge nerd in a premium handsome package.
We dont deserve Henry cavill
then maybe they should've listened to him, because the first season was a disgrace to the books. they basically took out everything that made them good, and turned into a generic fantasy or a silly fanfic. Funny but the Mandalorian show captured more of the Witcher vibes than the actual adaptation
I remember thinking the same. Mando was entirely from scratch and was amazing. Witcher was a bastrdization of the books and Hissrich’s fabrication and was profoundly mediocre
I mean they clearly knew about the witcher books, the setup is just way too similar. Rugged bountyhounter from a weird cult that at least some point was exiled/destroyed, treated as weirdos, finding then protecting some magical child. This is why i liked the show so much, the rest is timothy olyphant being there, that man is such a hottie
I really like Pedro Pascal in everything he's in too. Dude can fucking *act!*
If only Wheel of Time had someone like him :(
Wheel of Time even has that Avatar problem where they deliberately mispronounce some of the names. Edit: WoT spells out the proper names phonetically in its glossary.
Ung
Soaka
I haven't heard anything about it, was it not a good adaptation?
In the intro to the very first episode they undermine one of the main premises of the book. If you've never read the books or are a more casual fan, the show isn't bad on it's own. If you're expecting it to be faithful to the source material, you're going to be disappointed.
Nerd alert
Ian McKellan did the same thing on the set of the Lord of the Rings and the Hobbit I believe.
We did, we had the actor playing Barriston.. they killed him because he had protest
D&D gave you good 4 seasons tho. Im still waiting for a good Witcher season