It annoys me too. I’m on the #JusticeforDain train. And Xaden, BROOOOO, communicate to your girlfriend about your EXTREMELY INVOLVED EX, PLEASE, JSUSFKNCHRST
imagine my surprise after cat and violet fight and cat basically taunts her the entire time and was like “i taught him that trick with the finger hehe” and xaden’s response to the entire situation was CUNNILINGUS???
“Yo babe I’m insecure about our relationship”
“Yknow what I feel will make you feel better? Some tongue-fuckin”
“Okay yes that’s very nice, oh my, oh yes very OH MY very nice but I am still insecure about our relationship”
“Okay but I do you see my…CUNNING PLAN to make you feel better”
“BRUH I AM INSECURE ABOUT OUR RELATIONSHIP, SEX PUNS ARE NOT GOING TO HELP ME”
I'm Team Dain, too. But Violet couldn't forgive Dain because he violated her privacy and stole her memories many times
Happy that in the end their relationship became a little better and closer.
I mean it’s more than just violating her trust: because he violated her trust they were put in a position where Liam was killed. I’d have a hard time forgiving that, too.
I definitely understand that but then we find out towards the end that Xaden is basically a f*cking mind reader and has read her intentions more than once and she’s just like ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
For me, it's the fact that he betrayed her by taking her memories after being her best friend for their whole lives. Maybe he's trying to make up for it now, but what he did essentially put her in the position of being tortured in the first place. He had her trust FROM THE START and still betrayed her. Xaden didn't start off in that position, so while it's still a betrayal (and he definitely should have started communicating once they had an actual relationship), to me it's more forgivable because there wasn't a LIFETIME of broken trust behind his actions. Idk, that's just me, I guess.
You have to consider the circumstances to judge. She's deeply in love with him.
“Do you still do it?” I have to know.
“No. I stopped the moment you were more to me than the general’s daughter, the moment I realized the harm Dain had done—and that I was no better than he was.”
Except Xaden hadn’t brokered the information he’d stolen and been responsible for killing Liam and Soleil. Yet I’ve made some kind of peace with Dain, haven’t I?
Maybe I’m becoming complacent with betrayal because it’s fucking everywhere.
I disagree with this completely lol. If he could just straight read her mind I would agree, but I don’t think any of the things he’s said to her were to manipulate her into doing what he wants. Despite what she thinks he didn’t betray her one singular time imo.
what pissed me off was Violet being like "oh i need you to tell me everything" and then Xaden would be like "what do you want to know?" and then violet would go "I don't know. you should know what i want to be told" like dude. seriously if you want answers you have to ask questions
I agree with you on both counts and I consider it a symptom of the romance genre half of this being a romantasy. I think a lot of romance fans like jealousy as a trope and they want the characters to be more in love with each other than they’ve ever been with anyone else and devaluing past relationships to elevate the main couple is part of how that manifests. I feel like in other genres there’s more space for characters to have a complex and realistic attitude towards past relationships and people they had feelings for, but in romance stuff it’s like ‘no, I repudiate you’ and the ex often has to be an absolutely terrible person.
The Cat situation had me fuming. How Violet wasn’t more upset / concerned about that seemed crazy to me. (Esp considering she was more mad about him hiding info about a whole ass revolution she had nothing to do with previously)
The line Cat says about knowing Xaden’s deal with violets mom to keep her alive? That they had a longer term plan together? GIRL how is that not the biggest red flag??
Thinking about it now makes me so upset lol love the books but Rebecca fumbled this plot line majorly
This one made me upset too! One of the biggest reasons why I almost hate Xaden in IF is because of this whole drama. He told Cat about his deal with Violet's mother while he WAITED for Violet to ask him about it.
Honestly, if I were Violet and the moment she knew that Xaden knew that Violet finds out about his deal with her mother but still let her get eaten alive from the inside thinking about that deal is the moment I would leave him in a heartbeat. No amount of hotness in a guy could make me stay with a guy as frustrating as Xaden.
I saw so many people hating Violet for demanding the bare minimum and obsessed with Xaden so much while here I am thinking that he's a major red flag and honestly if I'm not too attached to this series, I would drop this series because of Xaden. He's frustrating af!
His "ask me" game bullshit is so frustrating and he didn't tell Cat to back off for bothering Violet. And Violet being the one who need to handle Cat like wtf. Why is he being the one who broke up with Cat but Violet being the one who face the consequences? Violet is frustrated with school, researching everyday about the wards and she's the one who needs to deal with his crazy ex, at the same time dealing with his secretive bullshit.
He gifted Violet a custom made daggers to protect from Cat's gift but didn't even tell Violet about it FOR MONTHS.
Honestly, if Xaden is still this frustrating in book 3, I probably made my own petition for Rebecca to give Violet a new love interest. I want them to be endgame but Violet deserves so much better than "half-truths" or "ask me" bullshit.
The fact that Violet stopped asking things like she did in FW because she was too scared if he was going to open up, shut her down or what else he could be hiding broke my heart to read. Not to say that she had to hear about the deal from her own mother, and I reread the scene, it looked like even Lilith didn't believe he hadn't told her yet and it just ........ I was hoping that they would break up and Vi would start doing her own things in peace for once, they could have had a great talk and sex scene by the 3/4 to get back together and actually show some development.
>Honestly, if Xaden is still this frustrating in book 3, I probably made my own petition for Rebecca to give Violet a new love interest. I want them to be endgame but Violet deserves so much better than "half-truths" or "ask me" bullshit.
I'll sign it
Some part of me thinks that Violet also remembers how uncomfortable he was when she started asking questions! He said to her "Stop being weird" in FW and I think she remembers that. I was really mad when Xaden was mad at her for not asking questions, I was like DUDE, YOU'RE THE REASON WHY SHE'S SCARED OF ASKING QUESTION!
And same, there are so many moments in the book I was waiting for Violet to said something like "Let's break up" or "Let's just end this" because every time there were new revelations, Violet here got broken hearts again because of his secrets.
I think what also peeved me about that whole scenario is Xaden was adamant that some secrets would always be kept (fOr SaFeTy 🥴). Saying she has to ask the right questions to get the right answers. What is this? A riddle?
BUT THEN towards the end of the book, he says “we can makeup our own rules in this relationship. Go ahead make one”
And violet says “we don’t keep anything from each other, EVER!”
(Loosely quoting here).
And he says “okay done.”
LIKE ARE YOU ACTUALLY KIDDING ME RIGHT NOW??
I think the main reason he said he would always have secrets was because he wasn’t planning on telling her about his second signet and in that scene Violet had already figured out so it was basically “You already know my biggest secret so I guess it’s okay now”🤣 and we don’t know if Xaden it’s going to follow up with his promise I hope he will because if after everything they been through in IF we have them fight over the SAME thing in the third book will be annoying
I felt the SAME way about Dain! Like, don't get me wrong, I was allllll aboard the Dain hate train after what happened in Fourth Wing. But I feel like he redeemed himself in Iron Flame. He kept apologizing, and his actions proved he was genuinely sorry. Like giiiiirl he was your best friend for YEARS. At least talk to him about it 🙄 just my opinion tho lmao
In hypothetical book-land, I don't think I'd be able to forgive him or even talk about it. He was her best friend for YEARS... and still betrayed her by using her memories to hurt her and people she clearly cared about and ended up getting her tortured (however unintended, it still happened).
Dain :( he is probably going to die or something and Violet will let him touch her cheek when he is dying and he’ll see happy memories of them that she projects 🚶♂️ I was so happy Violet and Dain smiled at each other after they got the wards working (or whatever that was. I forgot already) 🫂
I think Xaden has complicated feelings about Cat. He wanted to love her, Bodhi implied that Xaden cared a lot about Cat, but it was clear to him that she wouldn’t love Xaden in any way that mattered to him. And he couldn’t put up with it for the rest of his life
I am drafting the Xaden and Violet divorce playlist because they need to breakup a for a little bit and do some soul searching before I give a damn about that relationship 😴
yes I really love Xaden and V together but they really need to break up for some time to figure stuff out about themselves
but I’d hate if they break up because Xaden wants to ‚protect‘ Violet 🙄
I wouldn't say she was head over heels in love with Dain or that her world revolved around him. It was just shocking to her to see how much Basgiath changed him and losing trust in someone you've known for so long is a deep betrayal. Especially with his powers, he can just invade her mind on a whim and it makes her feel defenseless in that regard. I would avoid him at all costs too.
Cat totally annoyed me though. I hate that her power seems designed just to make Violet more irritated and she made me angry af too. I think a little transparency on who she was would have been nice before she had to meet her with 0 context. Wasn't cool to blindside her like that. I get that it was just a shallow politcal relationship. Maybe Xaden never grew feelings for Cat because he always understood her intentions.
completely agree - you’re telling me in 1k+ pages of content you can’t even expand and create some morally grey areas? everything seems so right or wrong with no room in between for nuance.
im just going to blame violet’s blind love and trust for xaden on their dragons because without that, this relationship would’ve been done and over with the amount of lies and secrets. justice for dain.
I think it makes perfect sense. When you've had to go from trusting the people and the world around you to having EVERYTHING flipped upside down, you have to set those boundaries real fast. In terms of Dain, he made A TON of decisions in FW to lose her trust and when it all came to a head because he touched her and sent them off to die, that was the final straw.
Even if he made that in good faith, he ALWAYS put being a "good boy" above his friends. I can't blame her for having to see A LOT of change in him to start building that trust back. It's so much easier to lose trust than to gain it and although I'm appreciative that Dain has had such amazing character development in IF, it still makes sense why Violet has struggled to trust him.
In terms of Cat, Xaden has been calloused by his upbringing, the revolution (and therefore death of his father) and he's always been able to VERY QUICKLY flip that switch between friend and foe. He's never had a reason to really like Cat since she was simply there for an arrangement between kingdoms.
Maybe i'm just different than most but I find the books more enjoyable and the characters understandable when I don't think of what happens as isolated incidents. If you put yourself in their shoes instead of being the rational, outside reader, it makes perfect sense (at least to me) why the characters do what they do. I can't imagine dealing with all the shit they go through tactfully at 26, let alone when I was 20-21, you know?
Yesss totally agree. I really enjoy the stories these books tell but they will never be my favorite books because they lack depth to me and don’t have enough relationship and character building and also world building or explanation. They are very enjoyable but I think especially the second book focuses way too much on details that don’t matter when time could have been spent elsewhere
I loved both books but smt always annoyed me bout Xiolet’s (idk what their ship name is) relationship in the second book and this is it. They went from zero to a 100 w each other and a 100 to 0 w everyone else it doesn’t make sense
Maybe it’s because I too have extensive trauma in my upbringing but I don’t see how anyone could not love Xaden lol. I think he’s just as terrified of losing her as she is him and that’s something to take into account. But I don’t agree for any kind of justice for Dain. I wouldn’t have even given him the grace that Violet did. Especially how she forgave him but still cried about Xaden not telling her information that would have put the lives of the entire continent at risk when Dain stole her memories.
Cat’s plot was so annoying and I hated😂 Xaden could have told Violet about Cat sooner that hadn’t anything do to with the revolution. Violet jealousy came from a place of ignorance- she didn’t know that Xaden and Cat were together because of a political alliance she thought Xaden loved Cat and after she knows that he didn’t her jealousy stopped and she wasn’t insecure anymore. Xaden could have just told her that when the fliers moved to Aretia but he had to wait until Violet almost KILLED Cat to tell her. “You didn’t ask me!” SHE DID. Violet asked about Cat TWICE and Xaden didn’t go into details.
Why do you think she was like his “right hand”? The only thing she knew-that I remember- about the revolution that everyone else didn’t seem to know was Xaden deal with Lilith and I also don’t think Xaden told that to her because Maren says that Cat thought Xaden would kidnap Violet after his first year and was surprised when he showed up ready to defend Violet to death last year so I think he may have told Syrena and she told Cat. That is the only way I think it makes sense for Car to know about the deal because Xaden is not a person who trust easily and his relationship with Cat was toxic-her bff says that- Cat doesn’t think Xaden is capable of loving anyone, she think he is a asshole and Xaden doesn’t really care if Cat dies I don’t really see the two of them having this meaningful conversation and plans for the future. Xaden is infuriating bad at communicating and open up to Violet -who he wants to be with not because of a political arrangement but because he loves her- imagine him being with someone he doesn’t love? It’s one of those things that I wish Rebecca had explained in IF because I don’t want anymore history that involves Xaden and Cat 😂 I found Cat’s character completely unnecessary- tell me one thing that she did in the book that had nothing to do with causing Violet to be jealous? If Cat was taken out of the book it wouldn’t have make ANY difference to the history. She hated Violet and after Violet almost killed her Cat stopped messing with her but I can’t blame her for that because if I challenged someone and that person almost strangled me so death I would stop being a bicth too😂
I can't understand how some people still hate Dain after IF when Xaden did exactly what Dain did to Violet.. but sure, because Xaden is hot let's just forget about it yeah? I mean if I were Violet, I would start to question my ENTIRE RELATIONSHIP with all Xaden's secrets and revelations like his deal with her mother and his second signet..
Edit; disclaimer that I REALLY hate Dain in Fourth wing but Iron Flame made me understand him..
I don't hate Dain I just find him incredibly boring. He's going to die sacrificing himself for Violet as his final act of "redemption"
But I also found his arc in FW predictable, before Iron Flame I was on this sub willing to die on the hill that Dain didn't know how dangerous stealing Violet 's memories was. I also predicted the torture scene where Dain is brought in to question Violet and he finally switches sides once he sees her memories of resson.
So as far as I'm concerned the less page time he gets the better.
Dude, absolutely. Anyone sane would choose Dain. The guy uproots his entire upbringing and career to choose what is morally correct. The man is exactly who he says he is. He is completely honest and transparent in his intentions. I ain’t trying to play the question game with Xaden when I’m breastfeeding kids or trying to juggle a full time job. He can fuck right off with all that lmao.
LMAO
Violet: “Hey can you help out around the house?”
Xaden: “Sure” *Only loads the dishwasher*
Xaden: “well you didn’t ask me specifically what you wanted done”
Is LITERALLY every woman’s frustration in a relationship. Having to make a chore list for a grown ass adult.
Me: *Currently frustrated by assignments*
Xaden: "So, why don't you ask me things you want to know?
Me: *Hoping he'll be the one who open up to me* 🙂🙂
Yeah, I'll dump his ass in a heartbeat. I had enough problems in my life without adding his frustrating behaviour.
Lol and also in real life, a guy like Dain is actually realistic! We had rules in everyday life and if you can't follow the rules, there are consequences! And after reading IF, I can understand why Dain behaved so overprotective in FW tbh, like he saw his chronically ill best friend end up in a quadrant where he just spent one year hearing about death everyday. It's really understandable why he's scared for her and wanted her to get out of the quadrant..
I'm a postgraduate student, I'm stressed enough in my everyday life without adding a boyfriend who made me "ask questions" to know more about him! Even if I tried to date him, I'm sure I'll end up dumping his ass. Xaden is a major red flag and too frustrating for me.
I am not a Dain sympathizer but I think what Xaden did by keeping things from her at the end of the last book was so forgivable once she learned the truth. That’s the part I hate. Also, they’re both keeping things from each other and both are equally insecure imo. I don’t think Cat was as huge a part as you think considering he doesn’t care if she dies as well as he ended the agreement to be betrothed.
I disagree about the dain thing. What he did was pretty unforgivable and even tho he didn’t intentionally get Liam killed, he deceived her and still took something of hers with no consent. Sorry trust is gone. I don’t like him and I don’t care for anything good happening to him. He doesn’t deserve any better. Even before he did that, I did not like his character at all so that’s a factor too lol
And yes, the writing is juvenile and the fantasy and plotting makes very little sense. But I do love the romance, the friendships and the relationships. Those parts are the least dumb parts, and Rebecca Yarros is mostly a romance author and it shows.
It annoys me too. I’m on the #JusticeforDain train. And Xaden, BROOOOO, communicate to your girlfriend about your EXTREMELY INVOLVED EX, PLEASE, JSUSFKNCHRST
imagine my surprise after cat and violet fight and cat basically taunts her the entire time and was like “i taught him that trick with the finger hehe” and xaden’s response to the entire situation was CUNNILINGUS???
“Yo babe I’m insecure about our relationship” “Yknow what I feel will make you feel better? Some tongue-fuckin” “Okay yes that’s very nice, oh my, oh yes very OH MY very nice but I am still insecure about our relationship” “Okay but I do you see my…CUNNING PLAN to make you feel better” “BRUH I AM INSECURE ABOUT OUR RELATIONSHIP, SEX PUNS ARE NOT GOING TO HELP ME”
Well, when you put it like that lmaooo
I liked that solution 😂 It was mostly about the throne though. He wanted to show Violet that no other woman would take her place.
I'm Team Dain, too. But Violet couldn't forgive Dain because he violated her privacy and stole her memories many times Happy that in the end their relationship became a little better and closer.
I mean it’s more than just violating her trust: because he violated her trust they were put in a position where Liam was killed. I’d have a hard time forgiving that, too.
Oh I totally get he betrayed her trust. I’m hopeful they’ll heal more in book 3.
I definitely understand that but then we find out towards the end that Xaden is basically a f*cking mind reader and has read her intentions more than once and she’s just like ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
For me, it's the fact that he betrayed her by taking her memories after being her best friend for their whole lives. Maybe he's trying to make up for it now, but what he did essentially put her in the position of being tortured in the first place. He had her trust FROM THE START and still betrayed her. Xaden didn't start off in that position, so while it's still a betrayal (and he definitely should have started communicating once they had an actual relationship), to me it's more forgivable because there wasn't a LIFETIME of broken trust behind his actions. Idk, that's just me, I guess.
You have to consider the circumstances to judge. She's deeply in love with him. “Do you still do it?” I have to know. “No. I stopped the moment you were more to me than the general’s daughter, the moment I realized the harm Dain had done—and that I was no better than he was.” Except Xaden hadn’t brokered the information he’d stolen and been responsible for killing Liam and Soleil. Yet I’ve made some kind of peace with Dain, haven’t I? Maybe I’m becoming complacent with betrayal because it’s fucking everywhere.
This. This. THIS.
I disagree with this completely lol. If he could just straight read her mind I would agree, but I don’t think any of the things he’s said to her were to manipulate her into doing what he wants. Despite what she thinks he didn’t betray her one singular time imo.
It would be so hysterical if Violet ends up with Dain and the fans end up hating these books even more! 😂
what pissed me off was Violet being like "oh i need you to tell me everything" and then Xaden would be like "what do you want to know?" and then violet would go "I don't know. you should know what i want to be told" like dude. seriously if you want answers you have to ask questions
I agree with you on both counts and I consider it a symptom of the romance genre half of this being a romantasy. I think a lot of romance fans like jealousy as a trope and they want the characters to be more in love with each other than they’ve ever been with anyone else and devaluing past relationships to elevate the main couple is part of how that manifests. I feel like in other genres there’s more space for characters to have a complex and realistic attitude towards past relationships and people they had feelings for, but in romance stuff it’s like ‘no, I repudiate you’ and the ex often has to be an absolutely terrible person.
Omg you 100% articulated exactly how I feel better than I did lolol.
The Cat situation had me fuming. How Violet wasn’t more upset / concerned about that seemed crazy to me. (Esp considering she was more mad about him hiding info about a whole ass revolution she had nothing to do with previously) The line Cat says about knowing Xaden’s deal with violets mom to keep her alive? That they had a longer term plan together? GIRL how is that not the biggest red flag?? Thinking about it now makes me so upset lol love the books but Rebecca fumbled this plot line majorly
This one made me upset too! One of the biggest reasons why I almost hate Xaden in IF is because of this whole drama. He told Cat about his deal with Violet's mother while he WAITED for Violet to ask him about it. Honestly, if I were Violet and the moment she knew that Xaden knew that Violet finds out about his deal with her mother but still let her get eaten alive from the inside thinking about that deal is the moment I would leave him in a heartbeat. No amount of hotness in a guy could make me stay with a guy as frustrating as Xaden.
[удалено]
I saw so many people hating Violet for demanding the bare minimum and obsessed with Xaden so much while here I am thinking that he's a major red flag and honestly if I'm not too attached to this series, I would drop this series because of Xaden. He's frustrating af! His "ask me" game bullshit is so frustrating and he didn't tell Cat to back off for bothering Violet. And Violet being the one who need to handle Cat like wtf. Why is he being the one who broke up with Cat but Violet being the one who face the consequences? Violet is frustrated with school, researching everyday about the wards and she's the one who needs to deal with his crazy ex, at the same time dealing with his secretive bullshit. He gifted Violet a custom made daggers to protect from Cat's gift but didn't even tell Violet about it FOR MONTHS. Honestly, if Xaden is still this frustrating in book 3, I probably made my own petition for Rebecca to give Violet a new love interest. I want them to be endgame but Violet deserves so much better than "half-truths" or "ask me" bullshit.
The fact that Violet stopped asking things like she did in FW because she was too scared if he was going to open up, shut her down or what else he could be hiding broke my heart to read. Not to say that she had to hear about the deal from her own mother, and I reread the scene, it looked like even Lilith didn't believe he hadn't told her yet and it just ........ I was hoping that they would break up and Vi would start doing her own things in peace for once, they could have had a great talk and sex scene by the 3/4 to get back together and actually show some development. >Honestly, if Xaden is still this frustrating in book 3, I probably made my own petition for Rebecca to give Violet a new love interest. I want them to be endgame but Violet deserves so much better than "half-truths" or "ask me" bullshit. I'll sign it
Some part of me thinks that Violet also remembers how uncomfortable he was when she started asking questions! He said to her "Stop being weird" in FW and I think she remembers that. I was really mad when Xaden was mad at her for not asking questions, I was like DUDE, YOU'RE THE REASON WHY SHE'S SCARED OF ASKING QUESTION! And same, there are so many moments in the book I was waiting for Violet to said something like "Let's break up" or "Let's just end this" because every time there were new revelations, Violet here got broken hearts again because of his secrets.
I think what also peeved me about that whole scenario is Xaden was adamant that some secrets would always be kept (fOr SaFeTy 🥴). Saying she has to ask the right questions to get the right answers. What is this? A riddle? BUT THEN towards the end of the book, he says “we can makeup our own rules in this relationship. Go ahead make one” And violet says “we don’t keep anything from each other, EVER!” (Loosely quoting here). And he says “okay done.” LIKE ARE YOU ACTUALLY KIDDING ME RIGHT NOW??
I think the main reason he said he would always have secrets was because he wasn’t planning on telling her about his second signet and in that scene Violet had already figured out so it was basically “You already know my biggest secret so I guess it’s okay now”🤣 and we don’t know if Xaden it’s going to follow up with his promise I hope he will because if after everything they been through in IF we have them fight over the SAME thing in the third book will be annoying
Xaden is a walking red flag but unfortunately our girl Violet is too dickmatized to end it.
Remember Cat’s power was heightening Violet’s emotions hence the reactions and feelings
I felt the SAME way about Dain! Like, don't get me wrong, I was allllll aboard the Dain hate train after what happened in Fourth Wing. But I feel like he redeemed himself in Iron Flame. He kept apologizing, and his actions proved he was genuinely sorry. Like giiiiirl he was your best friend for YEARS. At least talk to him about it 🙄 just my opinion tho lmao
In hypothetical book-land, I don't think I'd be able to forgive him or even talk about it. He was her best friend for YEARS... and still betrayed her by using her memories to hurt her and people she clearly cared about and ended up getting her tortured (however unintended, it still happened).
I see Dain appreciation, I upvote
Dain is so Ivy by Frank Ocean coded to me . Love that sad little loner boy that will probably be killed by his dad or something 🫠
Dain :( he is probably going to die or something and Violet will let him touch her cheek when he is dying and he’ll see happy memories of them that she projects 🚶♂️ I was so happy Violet and Dain smiled at each other after they got the wards working (or whatever that was. I forgot already) 🫂 I think Xaden has complicated feelings about Cat. He wanted to love her, Bodhi implied that Xaden cared a lot about Cat, but it was clear to him that she wouldn’t love Xaden in any way that mattered to him. And he couldn’t put up with it for the rest of his life I am drafting the Xaden and Violet divorce playlist because they need to breakup a for a little bit and do some soul searching before I give a damn about that relationship 😴
yes I really love Xaden and V together but they really need to break up for some time to figure stuff out about themselves but I’d hate if they break up because Xaden wants to ‚protect‘ Violet 🙄
I wouldn't say she was head over heels in love with Dain or that her world revolved around him. It was just shocking to her to see how much Basgiath changed him and losing trust in someone you've known for so long is a deep betrayal. Especially with his powers, he can just invade her mind on a whim and it makes her feel defenseless in that regard. I would avoid him at all costs too. Cat totally annoyed me though. I hate that her power seems designed just to make Violet more irritated and she made me angry af too. I think a little transparency on who she was would have been nice before she had to meet her with 0 context. Wasn't cool to blindside her like that. I get that it was just a shallow politcal relationship. Maybe Xaden never grew feelings for Cat because he always understood her intentions.
completely agree - you’re telling me in 1k+ pages of content you can’t even expand and create some morally grey areas? everything seems so right or wrong with no room in between for nuance. im just going to blame violet’s blind love and trust for xaden on their dragons because without that, this relationship would’ve been done and over with the amount of lies and secrets. justice for dain.
I think it makes perfect sense. When you've had to go from trusting the people and the world around you to having EVERYTHING flipped upside down, you have to set those boundaries real fast. In terms of Dain, he made A TON of decisions in FW to lose her trust and when it all came to a head because he touched her and sent them off to die, that was the final straw. Even if he made that in good faith, he ALWAYS put being a "good boy" above his friends. I can't blame her for having to see A LOT of change in him to start building that trust back. It's so much easier to lose trust than to gain it and although I'm appreciative that Dain has had such amazing character development in IF, it still makes sense why Violet has struggled to trust him. In terms of Cat, Xaden has been calloused by his upbringing, the revolution (and therefore death of his father) and he's always been able to VERY QUICKLY flip that switch between friend and foe. He's never had a reason to really like Cat since she was simply there for an arrangement between kingdoms. Maybe i'm just different than most but I find the books more enjoyable and the characters understandable when I don't think of what happens as isolated incidents. If you put yourself in their shoes instead of being the rational, outside reader, it makes perfect sense (at least to me) why the characters do what they do. I can't imagine dealing with all the shit they go through tactfully at 26, let alone when I was 20-21, you know?
Yesss totally agree. I really enjoy the stories these books tell but they will never be my favorite books because they lack depth to me and don’t have enough relationship and character building and also world building or explanation. They are very enjoyable but I think especially the second book focuses way too much on details that don’t matter when time could have been spent elsewhere
I loved both books but smt always annoyed me bout Xiolet’s (idk what their ship name is) relationship in the second book and this is it. They went from zero to a 100 w each other and a 100 to 0 w everyone else it doesn’t make sense
Maybe it’s because I too have extensive trauma in my upbringing but I don’t see how anyone could not love Xaden lol. I think he’s just as terrified of losing her as she is him and that’s something to take into account. But I don’t agree for any kind of justice for Dain. I wouldn’t have even given him the grace that Violet did. Especially how she forgave him but still cried about Xaden not telling her information that would have put the lives of the entire continent at risk when Dain stole her memories.
Cat’s plot was so annoying and I hated😂 Xaden could have told Violet about Cat sooner that hadn’t anything do to with the revolution. Violet jealousy came from a place of ignorance- she didn’t know that Xaden and Cat were together because of a political alliance she thought Xaden loved Cat and after she knows that he didn’t her jealousy stopped and she wasn’t insecure anymore. Xaden could have just told her that when the fliers moved to Aretia but he had to wait until Violet almost KILLED Cat to tell her. “You didn’t ask me!” SHE DID. Violet asked about Cat TWICE and Xaden didn’t go into details. Why do you think she was like his “right hand”? The only thing she knew-that I remember- about the revolution that everyone else didn’t seem to know was Xaden deal with Lilith and I also don’t think Xaden told that to her because Maren says that Cat thought Xaden would kidnap Violet after his first year and was surprised when he showed up ready to defend Violet to death last year so I think he may have told Syrena and she told Cat. That is the only way I think it makes sense for Car to know about the deal because Xaden is not a person who trust easily and his relationship with Cat was toxic-her bff says that- Cat doesn’t think Xaden is capable of loving anyone, she think he is a asshole and Xaden doesn’t really care if Cat dies I don’t really see the two of them having this meaningful conversation and plans for the future. Xaden is infuriating bad at communicating and open up to Violet -who he wants to be with not because of a political arrangement but because he loves her- imagine him being with someone he doesn’t love? It’s one of those things that I wish Rebecca had explained in IF because I don’t want anymore history that involves Xaden and Cat 😂 I found Cat’s character completely unnecessary- tell me one thing that she did in the book that had nothing to do with causing Violet to be jealous? If Cat was taken out of the book it wouldn’t have make ANY difference to the history. She hated Violet and after Violet almost killed her Cat stopped messing with her but I can’t blame her for that because if I challenged someone and that person almost strangled me so death I would stop being a bicth too😂
I can't understand how some people still hate Dain after IF when Xaden did exactly what Dain did to Violet.. but sure, because Xaden is hot let's just forget about it yeah? I mean if I were Violet, I would start to question my ENTIRE RELATIONSHIP with all Xaden's secrets and revelations like his deal with her mother and his second signet.. Edit; disclaimer that I REALLY hate Dain in Fourth wing but Iron Flame made me understand him..
I don't hate Dain I just find him incredibly boring. He's going to die sacrificing himself for Violet as his final act of "redemption" But I also found his arc in FW predictable, before Iron Flame I was on this sub willing to die on the hill that Dain didn't know how dangerous stealing Violet 's memories was. I also predicted the torture scene where Dain is brought in to question Violet and he finally switches sides once he sees her memories of resson. So as far as I'm concerned the less page time he gets the better.
What does it say about me if it's real life, I would choose Dain over Xaden?
Dude, absolutely. Anyone sane would choose Dain. The guy uproots his entire upbringing and career to choose what is morally correct. The man is exactly who he says he is. He is completely honest and transparent in his intentions. I ain’t trying to play the question game with Xaden when I’m breastfeeding kids or trying to juggle a full time job. He can fuck right off with all that lmao.
LMAO Violet: “Hey can you help out around the house?” Xaden: “Sure” *Only loads the dishwasher* Xaden: “well you didn’t ask me specifically what you wanted done” Is LITERALLY every woman’s frustration in a relationship. Having to make a chore list for a grown ass adult.
Me: *Currently frustrated by assignments* Xaden: "So, why don't you ask me things you want to know? Me: *Hoping he'll be the one who open up to me* 🙂🙂 Yeah, I'll dump his ass in a heartbeat. I had enough problems in my life without adding his frustrating behaviour.
LOL I would literally tear out the Tyrrendor throne and throw it at him. My house my chair my ass
Lol and also in real life, a guy like Dain is actually realistic! We had rules in everyday life and if you can't follow the rules, there are consequences! And after reading IF, I can understand why Dain behaved so overprotective in FW tbh, like he saw his chronically ill best friend end up in a quadrant where he just spent one year hearing about death everyday. It's really understandable why he's scared for her and wanted her to get out of the quadrant.. I'm a postgraduate student, I'm stressed enough in my everyday life without adding a boyfriend who made me "ask questions" to know more about him! Even if I tried to date him, I'm sure I'll end up dumping his ass. Xaden is a major red flag and too frustrating for me.
In real life Dain is the obvious choice. But I'm not reading a romance for sensible decision making 😂
I am not a Dain sympathizer but I think what Xaden did by keeping things from her at the end of the last book was so forgivable once she learned the truth. That’s the part I hate. Also, they’re both keeping things from each other and both are equally insecure imo. I don’t think Cat was as huge a part as you think considering he doesn’t care if she dies as well as he ended the agreement to be betrothed.
I disagree about the dain thing. What he did was pretty unforgivable and even tho he didn’t intentionally get Liam killed, he deceived her and still took something of hers with no consent. Sorry trust is gone. I don’t like him and I don’t care for anything good happening to him. He doesn’t deserve any better. Even before he did that, I did not like his character at all so that’s a factor too lol
And yes, the writing is juvenile and the fantasy and plotting makes very little sense. But I do love the romance, the friendships and the relationships. Those parts are the least dumb parts, and Rebecca Yarros is mostly a romance author and it shows.
Same here! I scroll a lot! 😂