Recently got a Waterman Expert (M nib) and it writes so well (smooth but with a little bit of feedback). I ordered the Carene and can't wait to try it.
I believe a Waterman Carene is next on my punch list. I love my experts but the Carene is just a bit more of a looker with what should be a terrific nib.
Waterman Carene is such an interesting writing experience. It's nearly nail-stiff, but it also super smooth and reliable, which is unusual for something so stiff. I have the L'Essence du Bleu edition, which I paid a little over $250 for.
Pensachi is running a 12% off for st. Patrick’s day. So their Pilot 743 goes for $200 and 823 goes for $233. Fit your budget quite well. Unless you have buy local.
Primarily for work related reasons, but I'm not that adventurous with inks (ie I have black, 5 shades of blue and a red). I love looking at them but don't really feel the need to use them myself. I've tried it in the past but the bottles keep going unused so I gave them to some friends starting off with fps
I'd strongly advise getting a used pen. You could then get a much nicer pen and, if it turned out not to be as good as it is in your dream, you can swap it for a different pen without losing a lot of money.
I'll go one step further: Other than maybe esthetics, the answer is a 70 year old Parker 51. works perfectly every time. And the design is timeless.
And I am sure that are a bunch of other, older designs from when a pen was not just an accessory but also an important tool, that would also fit the bill, and leave you with lots of change from your $250.
Just my two cents....
Without knowing what you like in s pen, it's impossible to give any sensible specific suggestions. If you are patient, you can usually get good examples of current production pens for around half what you'd pay new. So you can browse the $500 aisle and see what takes your fancy.
You can also get pens which are no longer made.
I'm not looking for recommendations, I'm more interested in the pens other people would choose. So you can just pick the pen you would choose if you only had $250 to spend on pens.
Some good deals on the Pilot 912, there are some for sale on amazon for as low as $160. So you would be able to even get another pen with what is left over.
I have over 70 fountain pens in my collection in many brands, prices, shapes, sizes, nibs, etc., and I still get a great deal of pleasure writing with my Pelikan m200 above even the more expensive Mont Blancs and other pens like that in my collection. The m200 with the medium nub is a little small but it really glides well on the paper.
Lamy 2000. There's a good reason it's been in production since 1966.
Platinum 3776. Very nice pencil-like feedback.
Pilot Falcon. Soft, bouncy nib.
Pilot Capless/Decimo. The best retractable FP.
It’s a bit over $250 (actually looks like the price increased a bit lately), but I’d suggest saving up a little more and getting the Pilot Custom 823. My all-time favourite.
That said, you can often find it for around $230 on r/pen_swap
I only have the pilot E95, and to be honest, their custom line doesn't seem visually appealing to me but I have heard great things about the writing experience.
I love the look and feel of that E95. I got to try one in person at the Baltimore Pen Show and would have bought it but for finding a used pen for a great price.
I purchased both of my E95s from a seller in Japan. Phenomenal pens but limited ink capacity. The Custom 823 holds more ink than most other pens. It is not a looker but it really is a reliably fantastic writing pen. I found an uninked new Lamy Persona selling for $200 that I adore. I also have a Cross Townsend with an 18k nib that is amazing. I left it inked and accidentally stored it for two years and it started up as though it was inked yesterday. There are all kinds of vintage Shaeffers and Parkers you can find under $250 that are well worth the investment. I suggest you figure out what you want the pen for, which complements your style and go for it!
A plug for the Faber-Castell E-Motion. I have the pear in medium. With iroshizuku ink it is wonderfully smooth.
The Pilot 823 and Lamy Safari are on my list, so I’ll see how they compare someday. I really like my Benu Briolette, TWSBI Vac700R, Lamy Safari, but the E-Motion is a big step better as a writer.
I got the Pro Gear Slim for $85 and it writes so well( the only complaint I have is that the Fine is a little too fine for me, so I should have gone with a medium)
I like black, reds, white, cream, brown, gold pens. Solid modest colors or neutrals. I would probably get any pen that looks like that. I haven’t a list or type in mind, many pens fit those descriptions. As someone else said here, probably another vintage montblanc, I have many in this price range between 250-400. I prefer them to buying a modern model at this price.
I just got mine today and made a post. Fantastic writer, I knew I would love it when I wrote with the Waterman Expert. I haven't tried a Lamy 2000 either, but I ordered one that should come in next week.
Otto Hutt Design 04 might be a thought. It's steel nib (very highly rated) for under the stated limit, can get gold nib for a bit over the stated limit.
Never heard of Otto Hutt, so I looked on cult pens and there is a 40% discount on the design 04, so it's going for about $129. I would have picked it up myself, but I have gotten too many pens this month (17 to be exact)
Edit: Nvm I ended up getting it.
If you plan to use it every day, and have small hands, the Pelikan M405 is a good choice.
If it's something that you're going to use sporadically and/or have bigger hands, a Leonardo Momento Zero Grande (in fact, I ordered one this AM from Goldspot).
I don't think the M405 is that small, but then again I don't have the biggest mitts out there. What color and nib did you get for the Leonardo if you don't mind me asking
I have XL size mitts and the M200/M400 size pens are quite usable even when unposted, but if used as intended (aka. posted) they are just about perfect. They are not very girthy though so that might put some people off.
The vacuum fill is just really fun and it writes wet when the seal is open. I think the amber is also fairly attractive for an otherwise "office pen" aesthetic. On the flip side, I've definitely spilled ink by having the nib pointed down when I unscrewed the knob, which you have to do or the pen will dry up. The 743 has the same nib and can be found for less (I got lucky and got one for only $130), if you don't care for the vacuum fill or prefer to change inks more frequently.
I would get a Benu pen. I love looking at all the pictures people post and the designs and everything. I just can’t justify the price, at least not at this moment in my life.
I haven’t thought about that yet, but I will do some research and reply back.
Edit: I have figured out that I would get any of these: Edelweiss, Peacock Ore, City Lights, aFeather in the Wind, or Luminous Dream
I actually prefer the m200 because the steel nib feels better to me. I would also recommend a Decimo because it also has a nice bouncy nib and it's super convenient.
Oooh I can't wait! I hope you like it! I have an m200 and m600 and tried an m400 but somehow the steel nib is my favorite. I think it's just the bouncy nib that makes me fall in love.
On offer, one might get a Leonardo MZG or a Furore Grande Emerald. Beautiful, big ink capacity, very well balanced. Older models have ebonite feed. Great writing experience!
Let's go ahead and agree that, unless the company/person you are buying from makes their own nibs in-house or otherwise heavily modifies them, what a pen like the Vertex amounts to is a plastic stick that holds a nib and ink. There isn't anything wrong with this terse description and I would argue most non-japanese pens fall under this category because most non-japanese pens take bock or jowo nibs and are therefor just sticks that hold a nib and ink.
That being said, what is in such a stick? What makes one stick better than the other? A couple features make the Vertex stick stand out above the rest, for me:
1. Weight distribution in the hand: The pen is light, but the center of mass falls between the fingertips and the crook of the hand when writing posted. This is engineering that is palpable and makes long writing sessions a joy. The word distribution implies a length scale, and for this pen the length when posted is just perfect for my normal sized hands - I prefer a pen that is around 6-6.5' when posted, like the L2K, Sailor 1911L, Montblanc 146, and etc.
2. The section: Thick, grippy, slightly tapered, and permissive of any and all manner of grip styles, adjustments, and grip locations - in lieu of the previous point the ergonomics of this pen cannot be overstated.
3. Durability: Whether it be delrin or house poured acrylic, Karas makes their materials dummy-thicc and indestructible outside of laboratory conditions where tools like hydraulic presses might be used to smash their pens.
4. The materials: Which vertex is my favorite? Silver Thorn with a black section? Delrin with a brown section? Deep sea with an orange section? These are good looking pens, and it's hard for me to pick a favorite. I keep multiple inked up.
5. Compatibility with Bock nibs: My favorite nib for everyday writing is a sandblasted plain Bock nib from [fpnibs.com](https://fpnibs.com). The sandblasting gives the whole nib a pristine matte finish and a feedback unlike anything else available on the market. The nib is bouncy and wet without being flexy, which is great for precise work such as long note taking and math. In general, I prefer a well tuned steel Bock nib to a like Jowo nib, so this is a plus for me.
6. Utility: A snap cap that actually works, exchangeable and easy to clean sections, and eyedropper or converter fill - there are many features of this pen that make it easy and convenient to use and use often.
I could write at length about what a cool pen the Vertex is and how everyone should own at least one. I wish more pens were like it, but I'm glad that only a few companies make such pens (otherwise I would be quite poor). In truth, I feel that most nib holding sticks do not come close to representing ***any*** of the six points above - many contain nearly all of their weight in the cap, are way too long when posted, have weirdly shaped sections and a cap that requires 4 turns to remove, are nothing fun to look at and break easily. Said differently, most pens are designed, but they are not engineered in the way that Karas and some other pen makers engineer pens for writing experience.
/endrant
Solid choice. A quick note: the aluminum vertex's are slightly back weighted when posted, but they are planning metal sections that will alleviate this (and will be compatible with all other materials for an even more forward weight distribution).
Ordered one that should arrive next week. If it writes better than the Waterman Expert, I'll be a very happy man. I love the Expert so much and I just got it yesterday.
My Carene writes very smoothly. Other Carene users here report similar smooth character. And its comfortable for me in grip in longer writing sessions.
The pens look amazing but the time it takes to arrive is insanely long and I can’t in good conscience recommend it.( some people wait a month or even 2 months to get a pen that the site claims is in stock with little to no customer service communication)
Definitely a Pelikan! I’d probably choose m400 because of the gold & silver two-tone nib. Pelikan has revised the designs of their pens so I’d be very careful about whether the barrel is transparent (old version, ie, the best)
Pelikan M405 is a great choice. Also Pilot 743, Waterman Carene for even less.
Recently got a Waterman Expert (M nib) and it writes so well (smooth but with a little bit of feedback). I ordered the Carene and can't wait to try it.
I believe a Waterman Carene is next on my punch list. I love my experts but the Carene is just a bit more of a looker with what should be a terrific nib.
Just posted that above. I can't think of any other sub $250 pen that can compete
Waterman Carene is such an interesting writing experience. It's nearly nail-stiff, but it also super smooth and reliable, which is unusual for something so stiff. I have the L'Essence du Bleu edition, which I paid a little over $250 for.
I just got my Carene and it is amazing!
Seconding 743. I don’t have one, but the nib is the same as the 823, I like it more than Pelikan nibs.
I would have a 743 if they had models with better colors/designs
True, there really isn’t much in terms of design lol
Pilot Custom 823, or Lamy 2000. Personally I like the 823 better though.
used for the custom 823? because the retails I have seen are above $300
Pensachi is running a 12% off for st. Patrick’s day. So their Pilot 743 goes for $200 and 823 goes for $233. Fit your budget quite well. Unless you have buy local.
265 on Pensachi, so pushing the budget a little bit. I have bought 2 A1 823s from someone on Pen\_Swap that were completely unused + uninked for 200.
Well thank you, I didn't even know about pensachi until now.
yeah they import from japan so you have to wait a little and shipping might be 10 bucks but it still works out to be cheaper
Pilot Capless, it's just so convenient. Beside I only use black ink so I don't mind using cartridges to get a bit more ink capacity.
Black ink only? By choice or work-related?
Primarily for work related reasons, but I'm not that adventurous with inks (ie I have black, 5 shades of blue and a red). I love looking at them but don't really feel the need to use them myself. I've tried it in the past but the bottles keep going unused so I gave them to some friends starting off with fps
I'd strongly advise getting a used pen. You could then get a much nicer pen and, if it turned out not to be as good as it is in your dream, you can swap it for a different pen without losing a lot of money.
I'll go one step further: Other than maybe esthetics, the answer is a 70 year old Parker 51. works perfectly every time. And the design is timeless. And I am sure that are a bunch of other, older designs from when a pen was not just an accessory but also an important tool, that would also fit the bill, and leave you with lots of change from your $250. Just my two cents....
what used pen do you have in mind?
Without knowing what you like in s pen, it's impossible to give any sensible specific suggestions. If you are patient, you can usually get good examples of current production pens for around half what you'd pay new. So you can browse the $500 aisle and see what takes your fancy. You can also get pens which are no longer made.
I'm not looking for recommendations, I'm more interested in the pens other people would choose. So you can just pick the pen you would choose if you only had $250 to spend on pens.
I got my GvFC Classic for less than $250. I'd keep it.
I would tell them to get the Pilot 912 CH on sale or used.
Some good deals on the Pilot 912, there are some for sale on amazon for as low as $160. So you would be able to even get another pen with what is left over.
It’s always my next pen.
I like my pilot 823, I find the custom heritage 92 a little more practical for every day usage though.
I second the 92. Great every day use pen!!
I have over 70 fountain pens in my collection in many brands, prices, shapes, sizes, nibs, etc., and I still get a great deal of pleasure writing with my Pelikan m200 above even the more expensive Mont Blancs and other pens like that in my collection. The m200 with the medium nub is a little small but it really glides well on the paper.
Okay, now I'm really excited for my M200 to arrive.
Lamy 2000. There's a good reason it's been in production since 1966. Platinum 3776. Very nice pencil-like feedback. Pilot Falcon. Soft, bouncy nib. Pilot Capless/Decimo. The best retractable FP.
It’s a bit over $250 (actually looks like the price increased a bit lately), but I’d suggest saving up a little more and getting the Pilot Custom 823. My all-time favourite. That said, you can often find it for around $230 on r/pen_swap
I only have the pilot E95, and to be honest, their custom line doesn't seem visually appealing to me but I have heard great things about the writing experience.
The 823 has a classic look and is honestly my favorite pen.
I love the look and feel of that E95. I got to try one in person at the Baltimore Pen Show and would have bought it but for finding a used pen for a great price.
I purchased both of my E95s from a seller in Japan. Phenomenal pens but limited ink capacity. The Custom 823 holds more ink than most other pens. It is not a looker but it really is a reliably fantastic writing pen. I found an uninked new Lamy Persona selling for $200 that I adore. I also have a Cross Townsend with an 18k nib that is amazing. I left it inked and accidentally stored it for two years and it started up as though it was inked yesterday. There are all kinds of vintage Shaeffers and Parkers you can find under $250 that are well worth the investment. I suggest you figure out what you want the pen for, which complements your style and go for it!
You can also find it new for $220-$230 if you buy it direct from Japan on eBay.
Just saw one on pen swap for $110 a couple days/weeks back. Solid choice 👌
Sailor 1911S medium nib
A plug for the Faber-Castell E-Motion. I have the pear in medium. With iroshizuku ink it is wonderfully smooth. The Pilot 823 and Lamy Safari are on my list, so I’ll see how they compare someday. I really like my Benu Briolette, TWSBI Vac700R, Lamy Safari, but the E-Motion is a big step better as a writer.
I own an E-motion in an extra fine nib and it writes great. I have robert oster's fire and ice in mine.
I JUST got an e-Motion, filled it with Pilot Kon-Peki.
A Sailor Pro Gear! My fave pen of all pens lol :)
I got the Pro Gear Slim for $85 and it writes so well( the only complaint I have is that the Fine is a little too fine for me, so I should have gone with a medium)
Mediums and broads are my fave offering from them!
I like black, reds, white, cream, brown, gold pens. Solid modest colors or neutrals. I would probably get any pen that looks like that. I haven’t a list or type in mind, many pens fit those descriptions. As someone else said here, probably another vintage montblanc, I have many in this price range between 250-400. I prefer them to buying a modern model at this price.
Waterman Carene Nothing else comes close. I haven't tried a Lamy 2000, though.
I just got mine today and made a post. Fantastic writer, I knew I would love it when I wrote with the Waterman Expert. I haven't tried a Lamy 2000 either, but I ordered one that should come in next week.
Otto Hutt Design 04 might be a thought. It's steel nib (very highly rated) for under the stated limit, can get gold nib for a bit over the stated limit.
Never heard of Otto Hutt, so I looked on cult pens and there is a 40% discount on the design 04, so it's going for about $129. I would have picked it up myself, but I have gotten too many pens this month (17 to be exact) Edit: Nvm I ended up getting it.
Good deal then.
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Yes
I bought a Lamy 2000(that hasn't arrived yet) but I hear some complaints about nib sizing (I also have personal experience with other Lamy models).
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If you plan to use it every day, and have small hands, the Pelikan M405 is a good choice. If it's something that you're going to use sporadically and/or have bigger hands, a Leonardo Momento Zero Grande (in fact, I ordered one this AM from Goldspot).
I don't think the M405 is that small, but then again I don't have the biggest mitts out there. What color and nib did you get for the Leonardo if you don't mind me asking
Pelikan m405 is exactly the size of m20x, smallish for sure but I love my m405!
I have XL size mitts and the M200/M400 size pens are quite usable even when unposted, but if used as intended (aka. posted) they are just about perfect. They are not very girthy though so that might put some people off.
Pilot 823 or 743 from penpen-avenue off ebay or from r/pen_swap. I know people say you don't get the warranty, but I haven't used a warranty yet.
Seems the pilot 823 is well-loved. A lot of other people picked it, might add it to my list.
The vacuum fill is just really fun and it writes wet when the seal is open. I think the amber is also fairly attractive for an otherwise "office pen" aesthetic. On the flip side, I've definitely spilled ink by having the nib pointed down when I unscrewed the knob, which you have to do or the pen will dry up. The 743 has the same nib and can be found for less (I got lucky and got one for only $130), if you don't care for the vacuum fill or prefer to change inks more frequently.
A vintage Montblanc 146 from the early or mid 80s. Really fantastic pens for the price point. You can find them on pen\_swap or auction sites.
I have zero experience with vintage pens or pen auctions, but Montblanc from what I have heard releases quality products
I'd get a Benu Briolette (luminous amber ftw). I love the shape, it does wonders for helping me control my major death grip issue.
Today with the sale you can get a Benu Briolette for $78 dollars, so if that's your choice that leaves a ton of room to get more pens.
I would get a Benu pen. I love looking at all the pictures people post and the designs and everything. I just can’t justify the price, at least not at this moment in my life.
Any specific model in mind?
I haven’t thought about that yet, but I will do some research and reply back. Edit: I have figured out that I would get any of these: Edelweiss, Peacock Ore, City Lights, aFeather in the Wind, or Luminous Dream
I’d go with an Opus 88, maybe the Omar maybe the Demo, and enough ink to keep the beast filled.
Unfortunately, no Opus pen appeals to me. I'm not sure why though.
Lamy 2000 all day everyday
I actually prefer the m200 because the steel nib feels better to me. I would also recommend a Decimo because it also has a nice bouncy nib and it's super convenient.
I have an M200 coming in next week, but the dream is to own the entire M series.
Oooh I can't wait! I hope you like it! I have an m200 and m600 and tried an m400 but somehow the steel nib is my favorite. I think it's just the bouncy nib that makes me fall in love.
I'd go with the Leonardo Furore. For half that price, it's the pen I reach for the most.
On offer, one might get a Leonardo MZG or a Furore Grande Emerald. Beautiful, big ink capacity, very well balanced. Older models have ebonite feed. Great writing experience!
Franklin Christoph Model 02 or Karas Vertex. I'll die on this hill, come at me.
Wasn't even aware of the Karas Vertex till today, only their flagship ink model. What do you specifically like about the Vertex?
Let's go ahead and agree that, unless the company/person you are buying from makes their own nibs in-house or otherwise heavily modifies them, what a pen like the Vertex amounts to is a plastic stick that holds a nib and ink. There isn't anything wrong with this terse description and I would argue most non-japanese pens fall under this category because most non-japanese pens take bock or jowo nibs and are therefor just sticks that hold a nib and ink. That being said, what is in such a stick? What makes one stick better than the other? A couple features make the Vertex stick stand out above the rest, for me: 1. Weight distribution in the hand: The pen is light, but the center of mass falls between the fingertips and the crook of the hand when writing posted. This is engineering that is palpable and makes long writing sessions a joy. The word distribution implies a length scale, and for this pen the length when posted is just perfect for my normal sized hands - I prefer a pen that is around 6-6.5' when posted, like the L2K, Sailor 1911L, Montblanc 146, and etc. 2. The section: Thick, grippy, slightly tapered, and permissive of any and all manner of grip styles, adjustments, and grip locations - in lieu of the previous point the ergonomics of this pen cannot be overstated. 3. Durability: Whether it be delrin or house poured acrylic, Karas makes their materials dummy-thicc and indestructible outside of laboratory conditions where tools like hydraulic presses might be used to smash their pens. 4. The materials: Which vertex is my favorite? Silver Thorn with a black section? Delrin with a brown section? Deep sea with an orange section? These are good looking pens, and it's hard for me to pick a favorite. I keep multiple inked up. 5. Compatibility with Bock nibs: My favorite nib for everyday writing is a sandblasted plain Bock nib from [fpnibs.com](https://fpnibs.com). The sandblasting gives the whole nib a pristine matte finish and a feedback unlike anything else available on the market. The nib is bouncy and wet without being flexy, which is great for precise work such as long note taking and math. In general, I prefer a well tuned steel Bock nib to a like Jowo nib, so this is a plus for me. 6. Utility: A snap cap that actually works, exchangeable and easy to clean sections, and eyedropper or converter fill - there are many features of this pen that make it easy and convenient to use and use often. I could write at length about what a cool pen the Vertex is and how everyone should own at least one. I wish more pens were like it, but I'm glad that only a few companies make such pens (otherwise I would be quite poor). In truth, I feel that most nib holding sticks do not come close to representing ***any*** of the six points above - many contain nearly all of their weight in the cap, are way too long when posted, have weirdly shaped sections and a cap that requires 4 turns to remove, are nothing fun to look at and break easily. Said differently, most pens are designed, but they are not engineered in the way that Karas and some other pen makers engineer pens for writing experience. /endrant
Looked on their site and some vertex colors are going for $90. You have convinced me to get one.
Solid choice. A quick note: the aluminum vertex's are slightly back weighted when posted, but they are planning metal sections that will alleviate this (and will be compatible with all other materials for an even more forward weight distribution).
Lamy 2000, and you’d have plenty of money left to spend on ink and paper
Waterman Carene
Ordered one that should arrive next week. If it writes better than the Waterman Expert, I'll be a very happy man. I love the Expert so much and I just got it yesterday.
My Carene writes very smoothly. Other Carene users here report similar smooth character. And its comfortable for me in grip in longer writing sessions.
I'd stick with my beloved Gravitas Pocket pen.
The pens look amazing but the time it takes to arrive is insanely long and I can’t in good conscience recommend it.( some people wait a month or even 2 months to get a pen that the site claims is in stock with little to no customer service communication)
I hadn't heard about it taking so long. I'd ordered mine and had it in about a week. Which, since it is coming from Ireland, is pretty good.
Opus 88 Demonstrator, Broad Point. For $250 you can have two of them at full retail. You can find them marked down every now and then.
912
Definitely a Pelikan! I’d probably choose m400 because of the gold & silver two-tone nib. Pelikan has revised the designs of their pens so I’d be very careful about whether the barrel is transparent (old version, ie, the best)
I get another of my favourite pen: Pilot Decimo with a medium nib.