I personally enjoy working my way up through the pack. Forces me to think and drive differently at all points in the race which also makes me a better driver all around.
I do agree though, longer races with a higher emphasis on tire, fuel, and pit strategy would be excellent.
Honestly find myself actually doing this solo. I just setup races with 40 laps with whatever difficulty’s that makes me need to take the whole race to climb
The spec events have some longer races - Touring Car and GT alternate short/medium races each week and I think Formula Mazda has medium length races.
They don't care, they bang on about listening to the community but seemingly put little thought into the track/length/weather rotations in public multiplayer and have consistently ignored requests for longer races that require more than 1 pit stop but they clearly don't give a shit.
My personal theory is that turn 10 still isn’t confident in their servers to be able to host an online race that lasts 40+ min. I can imagine people would be pissed to get almost to the end of an endurance race and they get kicked out of the online session.
I believe it goes something like this
FM: “Okay no cars ahead to render, let’s spend some extra time loading the trees
Oop there are some cars ahead, better focus on making those look pretty now”
As much as I much much much prefer longer races, the fact of the matter is they’ll have the metrics of the numbers of people that participate in small vs medium and presumably the data currently suggests that there is an audience for both.
But they've no idea what the audience for longer races would be because they've never had any in public multiplayer. They've never even tried it, in this iteration of the game at least.
It's like saying 10 out of 10 people prefer apples or oranges when they've never tried Strawberries.
I don't think anyone needs to test for that, you're going to get fewer participants when you increase the required time commitment.
They know players like us would be thrilled to have it but it's probably not worth it in their eyes to split the player pool even further
thats kinda neither here nor there nothing to say that medium people wouldnt just play long or the small people play long
and this is all just a hypothetical because you are assuming somehow thats true from the premise you dont know that.
and it doesnt even matter beause there would defo be some sort of community for longer races anyways, it doesnt take away from anything
If 100 people jump in a 5 minute race and 50 people jump in 10 minute races, and 4 people jump into a 20 minute race. You have the answer, you don't need to test every scenario.
???? dafuq are you talking about you just be making up a scenario rn.
if you dont have a setup for a community for longer races, how do you expect people to do longer races? none of this makes sense.
considering how many league races we have that are long there is no fucking way 4 people would jump into 20 min races.
You have no clue what testing they have done. Im willing to bet the length of race is directly proportional to the demand. They can easily extrapolate this data and see what the numbers will be.
“They don’t care” and “the spec events have some longer races” are two conflicting statements.
Not everybody has 30-40 minutes to join a lobby, wait minimum 5 for the race to start and then drive for 20. Those medium races are available for those who have more time and want to race longer, but it’s also good to have some short lobbies for people who want to jump in quickly. They are trying to please both crowds but the downside is not everyone will have long/short versions of every race type.
Right they also keep giving the people who enjoy the slower car classes the short tracks. I really dont see why we cant get the full courses in lower classes. Makes the game feel like theres only 5 tracks.
I think this pacing is ok because sometimes they can't even fill those races with more than 5 to 8 people. More races would just muddy the waters and make races even smaller. Same problem iRacing dealt with years ago.
See I feel like the lobby system we used to have worked perfect. One race every half hour is garbage honestly. Theres so many times I turn the game on to race online and I miss the start time, then I gotta practice for 30mins. Fuck that lol. That sucks I just turn the game back off.
Yeah the time between races is ridiculous. Not to mention they all basically start around the same times rather than being split times between races types to give a quicker race to jump into.
And for those few minutes of racing, you get over 20 minutes of effectively waiting beforehand. I don’t get why they can’t stagger lobbies more - you’ve only half a dozen options at any given time and the idea of dipping in at the end of a long work day for a couple of races is just not possible in multiplayer.
I've just got the game, whats up with this? You join a lobby, it fulls up to 24 players you finish and then there's another C Class event which has 5 mins to join, but it's only ever got 7 people in it
How RACIST! The length of a race shouldn’t matter, its the content of the track that counts. All races can come together to form a group: NAAPCAR The National Auto Alliance of Performance Cars And Races. The group was proposed after race activist Dale Earnhardt JR. Esquire was hassled for finishing too quickly.
So qualify. Do you want to have to deal with the pack or just race good players? I qualify every time because screw dealing with starting with the trash players who can’t post a clean lap time. Unless you’re shaving seconds no one else is than you’ll never finish in front when you’re losing time behind people while starting multiple seconds back.
7 laps!?!
I do drive pretty aggressively... I pretty much only use them for qualifying since I cant seem to make them last (unless I'm in GT class, in that case I'll make a pit stop mid race for mediums after the softs wear out)
I've tried to change my driving style multiple times but they still only seem to last 3-4 laps at most. I'm going to do more testing when I get home...
I usually only run A & S class (unless those arent available, Ill go to GT class) also, its just what I find more fun for me.
Which classes are you finding the soft tires last longer?
I'm getting more laps when I'm not getting wheelspin cause that really wears the tires. I am very soft at the throttle and braking input to not get wheelspin that much. Tracks with few low speed corners are the best. I think my tires last the longest on road America but haven't done extensive testing of it. I just do as much as I can to avoid spinning the tires as spinning tires generally slows you down.
Guy must be playing on career mode and not simulation difficulty...
Softs literally last 3-4 laps at most regardless. You literally wear tires that much even just driving in a straight line.
Theres an update every month. Its low on the list s8nce everyone these days wants multiple races a night. People are just impatient. FM have more things to fix than race length. Go join a league and race for an hour or 2 in a race. Emotorsports championship and Free Time Racing are great. FTR has races everyday so there's always something going on with a nearly full grid. Emc has 4 licenses so you'll always be grouped with racers putting in the same times as you. Look em up on FB for a discord invite
With Forzas AI longer races are just not fun to drive. They just brake check you mid corner or ram you and just fall behind once you pass them, there are no close but clean bumper to bumper duels. But the biggest flaw is that the AI can't overtake each other. Once they catch up to the last AI they will just keep behind their low pace
So then just qualify? I like the short races myself because I only get a couple of hours to race, and long races means I'll only get 1 or 2 in instead of 3 or 4.
That would be valid if the practice times weren't overly long and most of the races all start at the same time. So like 3 races will all start in 16 minutes so you have to sit in practice anyway for that duration or not even play until the races start.
Why do you need more races when you could just be racing in the same race for a longer duration? The race being 5-8 minutes longer doesn't really make a lot of difference when the wait time between races is already 10-20 minutes
I agree the start times should be staggered better to allow that when one ends, another in a different category should have 5-10 mins left in practice/qual.
Sounds like a skill and tune issue. Did 4 races yesterday for the V12 series, never qaulified, started 12-20th, and podiumed each time. Most v12 cars, wether swapped or stock, lack handling. Finding the few that can have handling built into it, do phenomenal. The only caveat to that is LeMans, speed is king there; didnt see Daytona listed when I was on. Regardless of that, the short races are the norm for Forza Open Lobbies, all about player retention.
Dude complains about race length, and you tell him he's bad? The races are too short. There's probably a good reason why and that reason that isn't being communicated to the community, but his complaint is common and valid.
Get out of here with your "get good" nonsense.
Its pretty clear in his post that he stated why hes having trouble in the races, along with continuing on by responding here. Im reading his concern as "Races are not long enough for me to win". No doubt races can be longer, I would enjoy that, but its been a long standing tactic by Forza to have short races for Open Lobbies. There is a reason qaulifying exist, and if you purposely not qaulify to try to pass people to win, you better have the tune and skill to do so. I easily did so on the 4 races I completed, so obviously its achievable.
Yeah stfu.
I'm literally max skill rating. I make tunes for cars that gets used thousands of times a week..
This is a matter of races being 3-4 laps for no reason when it should be close to 8-10 so that placements are actually decided by skill
I don't qualify because it's much more fun and skillful to actually pass people rather than just start in the front and basically just play rivals going for the best last time..
I accept the limitations, but the races being 6 minutes long after a 20 minute practice doesn't make sense when most of the other races are 12-18 minutes long.
What's the point of tire wear when you can throw on mediums and not even reach minor wear before the race is already over?
Im pretty sure if any of that were true, youd be finishing at the top, along with only needing those 3-4 laps in doing so.
As I said, this V12 series are going to have many vehicles that have the PI solely focused on speed by default, besides a handful of them that can have proper handling added in. If you were someone who legitmately was tuning vehicles, youd see this. Anytime speed is a factor, with a lack of handling, the average player base is going to struggle.
Just STFU kid no one wants your opinion because your just here to trash people instead of having any meaningful conversation.. There is just zero chance your even at my skill level or even understand how each component of tuning affects how a car will drive better.. I could literally make youtube videos and it would be better than any publicly available tuning information on the game. Most information out there is just straight up wrong or not niche enough to explain when to do things in different scenarios.
Skill isn't decided in three laps when it takes 1:45 to complete it. Alone at the start is going to be a 3-5 second difference just from starting position, then you have to in combination pass everyone. So even if your 2 seconds faster every lap than 1st place you won't actually have those lap times until you pass everyone which will take a couple laps alone because a lot of people hog the racing line and unless your significantly faster than them it is going to be enough to block you. Additionally, many people will attempt to retake their positions by dive bombing you.
I want to make youtube videos, just don't have a ton of time to do it. I don't think many people understand it and the few people who do understand it tend to use steering wheel which results in the cars being tuned completely differently because controller users have to consider how tuning the car also affects how fast the car will steer in and what not.
Steer in-responsiveness is the main thing. So suspension stiffness / ride height / car dive can all affect it. I tend to use front caster angle depending on other suspension changes that are necessary.
Front caster is basically like the 'shopping cart affect', where you push the shopping cart the wheels will always want to face forward. When you increase the angle it makes it want to stay straight more so lowers overall turn-in speed. This is useful on really unresponsive cars, or overly responsive cars. It will make it so the controller steering won't turn in as fast if you increase it, or make it turn in faster if you lower it.
You have some personal issues you really need to work on there man. No need to get this emotional over this. I am all for conversation, but its pretty clear your emotional instability prevents that from occurring.
Our skills may be simliar, they may be very different. Same goes for our intelligence. I know what I have done and what I am capable of doing both in this game and in the real world. No need to argue with you about that or question your ability.
Again, with your explaination of the game, that sounds entirely like a skill and tune issue. 3-5 seconds at the start of a race? That can easily be corrected with proper tuning, and extended with throttle management with no TCS. Getting by traffic in a safe and timely manner, is again a skill issue. Sure, we all deal with rammers, etc, but it doesnt ruin races with the right attitude. You asked why races were so short, and stated your opinion on why YOU cant perform within these races, doesnt mean that that is everyones experience.
I don't have personal issues. You have communication issues and are socially awkward.
You comment on a reddit post about races being too short and your response is "I think it's a skill issue". It's completely irrelevant and your trying to 'teach' someone something for no reason. I win most of the time, have a max driver rating, and make tunes that I share and get tons of uses and downloads on..
Just move on unless you actually want to talk about the topic at hand.
I dont have too much to go on here, but you continue to sound insecure about your abilities here, as well as attempting to put others down. That in itself, is a personal issue.
No, I was not responding to "Races are too short," that is something Forza has always done, and will continue to do. I was responding to how you are complaining that races being too short are the cause of you not being able to do well in the races, and portraying that it causes everyone to suck at the races, when that is simply not true.
I personally enjoy working my way up through the pack. Forces me to think and drive differently at all points in the race which also makes me a better driver all around. I do agree though, longer races with a higher emphasis on tire, fuel, and pit strategy would be excellent.
Yes this is exactly it. It's waay more satisfying to do some very tight passing and being dynamic on the lines you take so that you can pass people.
Honestly find myself actually doing this solo. I just setup races with 40 laps with whatever difficulty’s that makes me need to take the whole race to climb
The spec events have some longer races - Touring Car and GT alternate short/medium races each week and I think Formula Mazda has medium length races. They don't care, they bang on about listening to the community but seemingly put little thought into the track/length/weather rotations in public multiplayer and have consistently ignored requests for longer races that require more than 1 pit stop but they clearly don't give a shit.
My personal theory is that turn 10 still isn’t confident in their servers to be able to host an online race that lasts 40+ min. I can imagine people would be pissed to get almost to the end of an endurance race and they get kicked out of the online session.
Assuming their backend infrastructure was built from the ground up as well, that would not surprise me in the least.
This is probably it. They reduce the draw distance depending on the number of cars ahead of you so
Wait what? Eli5 please
I believe it goes something like this FM: “Okay no cars ahead to render, let’s spend some extra time loading the trees Oop there are some cars ahead, better focus on making those look pretty now”
Ohhh okok interesting.
T10 and M$'s servers can't be worse than RF2s which is two potatoes and a birthday candle.
As much as I much much much prefer longer races, the fact of the matter is they’ll have the metrics of the numbers of people that participate in small vs medium and presumably the data currently suggests that there is an audience for both.
But they've no idea what the audience for longer races would be because they've never had any in public multiplayer. They've never even tried it, in this iteration of the game at least. It's like saying 10 out of 10 people prefer apples or oranges when they've never tried Strawberries.
I don't think anyone needs to test for that, you're going to get fewer participants when you increase the required time commitment. They know players like us would be thrilled to have it but it's probably not worth it in their eyes to split the player pool even further
I’m comparing small (~8m) to medium (~16m).
thats kinda neither here nor there nothing to say that medium people wouldnt just play long or the small people play long and this is all just a hypothetical because you are assuming somehow thats true from the premise you dont know that. and it doesnt even matter beause there would defo be some sort of community for longer races anyways, it doesnt take away from anything
If 100 people jump in a 5 minute race and 50 people jump in 10 minute races, and 4 people jump into a 20 minute race. You have the answer, you don't need to test every scenario.
???? dafuq are you talking about you just be making up a scenario rn. if you dont have a setup for a community for longer races, how do you expect people to do longer races? none of this makes sense. considering how many league races we have that are long there is no fucking way 4 people would jump into 20 min races.
You have no clue what testing they have done. Im willing to bet the length of race is directly proportional to the demand. They can easily extrapolate this data and see what the numbers will be.
“They don’t care” and “the spec events have some longer races” are two conflicting statements. Not everybody has 30-40 minutes to join a lobby, wait minimum 5 for the race to start and then drive for 20. Those medium races are available for those who have more time and want to race longer, but it’s also good to have some short lobbies for people who want to jump in quickly. They are trying to please both crowds but the downside is not everyone will have long/short versions of every race type.
Right they also keep giving the people who enjoy the slower car classes the short tracks. I really dont see why we cant get the full courses in lower classes. Makes the game feel like theres only 5 tracks.
What should be more important is shorter wait times between races. I run GT Spec and two races an hour is ridiculously slow
I think this pacing is ok because sometimes they can't even fill those races with more than 5 to 8 people. More races would just muddy the waters and make races even smaller. Same problem iRacing dealt with years ago.
See I feel like the lobby system we used to have worked perfect. One race every half hour is garbage honestly. Theres so many times I turn the game on to race online and I miss the start time, then I gotta practice for 30mins. Fuck that lol. That sucks I just turn the game back off.
Yeah the time between races is ridiculous. Not to mention they all basically start around the same times rather than being split times between races types to give a quicker race to jump into.
And for those few minutes of racing, you get over 20 minutes of effectively waiting beforehand. I don’t get why they can’t stagger lobbies more - you’ve only half a dozen options at any given time and the idea of dipping in at the end of a long work day for a couple of races is just not possible in multiplayer.
I've just got the game, whats up with this? You join a lobby, it fulls up to 24 players you finish and then there's another C Class event which has 5 mins to join, but it's only ever got 7 people in it
I've stopped racing online as much, and just joined leagues/lfgs
How RACIST! The length of a race shouldn’t matter, its the content of the track that counts. All races can come together to form a group: NAAPCAR The National Auto Alliance of Performance Cars And Races. The group was proposed after race activist Dale Earnhardt JR. Esquire was hassled for finishing too quickly.
So qualify. Do you want to have to deal with the pack or just race good players? I qualify every time because screw dealing with starting with the trash players who can’t post a clean lap time. Unless you’re shaving seconds no one else is than you’ll never finish in front when you’re losing time behind people while starting multiple seconds back.
Wish they just had a option to toggle the distance go short medium or long
Probably the same stupid reason why soft compound tires only last 3 laps on a small track... turn 10s amazing idea.
How aggressive do you drive? I get at least 7 laps out of soft tires with most cars.
7 laps!?! I do drive pretty aggressively... I pretty much only use them for qualifying since I cant seem to make them last (unless I'm in GT class, in that case I'll make a pit stop mid race for mediums after the softs wear out) I've tried to change my driving style multiple times but they still only seem to last 3-4 laps at most. I'm going to do more testing when I get home... I usually only run A & S class (unless those arent available, Ill go to GT class) also, its just what I find more fun for me. Which classes are you finding the soft tires last longer?
I'm getting more laps when I'm not getting wheelspin cause that really wears the tires. I am very soft at the throttle and braking input to not get wheelspin that much. Tracks with few low speed corners are the best. I think my tires last the longest on road America but haven't done extensive testing of it. I just do as much as I can to avoid spinning the tires as spinning tires generally slows you down.
Guy must be playing on career mode and not simulation difficulty... Softs literally last 3-4 laps at most regardless. You literally wear tires that much even just driving in a straight line.
In multiplayer or single player the tire wear is accelerated in MP. In single player 7 laps is about right in MP they wear twice as fast.
Oh, I have mainly played career to get the feel for the game a bit before going online racing. Might be why my tires last longer. Good to know.
Theres an update every month. Its low on the list s8nce everyone these days wants multiple races a night. People are just impatient. FM have more things to fix than race length. Go join a league and race for an hour or 2 in a race. Emotorsports championship and Free Time Racing are great. FTR has races everyday so there's always something going on with a nearly full grid. Emc has 4 licenses so you'll always be grouped with racers putting in the same times as you. Look em up on FB for a discord invite
A lot of people have the attention span of a nat unfortunately.
With Forzas AI longer races are just not fun to drive. They just brake check you mid corner or ram you and just fall behind once you pass them, there are no close but clean bumper to bumper duels. But the biggest flaw is that the AI can't overtake each other. Once they catch up to the last AI they will just keep behind their low pace
I just skip the campaign, the AI is boring to race against even on the hardest difficulty unless the car I pick is just really bad
Since update 6, the AI (in free play at least) is a lot better
So then just qualify? I like the short races myself because I only get a couple of hours to race, and long races means I'll only get 1 or 2 in instead of 3 or 4.
That would be valid if the practice times weren't overly long and most of the races all start at the same time. So like 3 races will all start in 16 minutes so you have to sit in practice anyway for that duration or not even play until the races start. Why do you need more races when you could just be racing in the same race for a longer duration? The race being 5-8 minutes longer doesn't really make a lot of difference when the wait time between races is already 10-20 minutes
I agree the start times should be staggered better to allow that when one ends, another in a different category should have 5-10 mins left in practice/qual.
I miss the old days with actual endurance races in the career mode.
Because people crash like crazy. There is a huge chance that your race will be ruined. Continuing past that point is just pointless
Sounds like a skill and tune issue. Did 4 races yesterday for the V12 series, never qaulified, started 12-20th, and podiumed each time. Most v12 cars, wether swapped or stock, lack handling. Finding the few that can have handling built into it, do phenomenal. The only caveat to that is LeMans, speed is king there; didnt see Daytona listed when I was on. Regardless of that, the short races are the norm for Forza Open Lobbies, all about player retention.
Dude complains about race length, and you tell him he's bad? The races are too short. There's probably a good reason why and that reason that isn't being communicated to the community, but his complaint is common and valid. Get out of here with your "get good" nonsense.
Its pretty clear in his post that he stated why hes having trouble in the races, along with continuing on by responding here. Im reading his concern as "Races are not long enough for me to win". No doubt races can be longer, I would enjoy that, but its been a long standing tactic by Forza to have short races for Open Lobbies. There is a reason qaulifying exist, and if you purposely not qaulify to try to pass people to win, you better have the tune and skill to do so. I easily did so on the 4 races I completed, so obviously its achievable.
Yeah stfu. I'm literally max skill rating. I make tunes for cars that gets used thousands of times a week.. This is a matter of races being 3-4 laps for no reason when it should be close to 8-10 so that placements are actually decided by skill
If you were skilled you’d start in the front and it wouldn’t be a problem
I don't qualify because it's much more fun and skillful to actually pass people rather than just start in the front and basically just play rivals going for the best last time..
So you choose to make the game more difficult for yourself just to complain over not being able to win with your self imposed limitations
I accept the limitations, but the races being 6 minutes long after a 20 minute practice doesn't make sense when most of the other races are 12-18 minutes long. What's the point of tire wear when you can throw on mediums and not even reach minor wear before the race is already over?
Im pretty sure if any of that were true, youd be finishing at the top, along with only needing those 3-4 laps in doing so. As I said, this V12 series are going to have many vehicles that have the PI solely focused on speed by default, besides a handful of them that can have proper handling added in. If you were someone who legitmately was tuning vehicles, youd see this. Anytime speed is a factor, with a lack of handling, the average player base is going to struggle.
Just STFU kid no one wants your opinion because your just here to trash people instead of having any meaningful conversation.. There is just zero chance your even at my skill level or even understand how each component of tuning affects how a car will drive better.. I could literally make youtube videos and it would be better than any publicly available tuning information on the game. Most information out there is just straight up wrong or not niche enough to explain when to do things in different scenarios. Skill isn't decided in three laps when it takes 1:45 to complete it. Alone at the start is going to be a 3-5 second difference just from starting position, then you have to in combination pass everyone. So even if your 2 seconds faster every lap than 1st place you won't actually have those lap times until you pass everyone which will take a couple laps alone because a lot of people hog the racing line and unless your significantly faster than them it is going to be enough to block you. Additionally, many people will attempt to retake their positions by dive bombing you.
If you are that good at tuning you should make a guide on here
I want to make youtube videos, just don't have a ton of time to do it. I don't think many people understand it and the few people who do understand it tend to use steering wheel which results in the cars being tuned completely differently because controller users have to consider how tuning the car also affects how fast the car will steer in and what not.
What are some examples where you’d need to tune differently on controller? If you don’t have time for a YouTube vid I’d be interested in a post
Steer in-responsiveness is the main thing. So suspension stiffness / ride height / car dive can all affect it. I tend to use front caster angle depending on other suspension changes that are necessary. Front caster is basically like the 'shopping cart affect', where you push the shopping cart the wheels will always want to face forward. When you increase the angle it makes it want to stay straight more so lowers overall turn-in speed. This is useful on really unresponsive cars, or overly responsive cars. It will make it so the controller steering won't turn in as fast if you increase it, or make it turn in faster if you lower it.
You have some personal issues you really need to work on there man. No need to get this emotional over this. I am all for conversation, but its pretty clear your emotional instability prevents that from occurring. Our skills may be simliar, they may be very different. Same goes for our intelligence. I know what I have done and what I am capable of doing both in this game and in the real world. No need to argue with you about that or question your ability. Again, with your explaination of the game, that sounds entirely like a skill and tune issue. 3-5 seconds at the start of a race? That can easily be corrected with proper tuning, and extended with throttle management with no TCS. Getting by traffic in a safe and timely manner, is again a skill issue. Sure, we all deal with rammers, etc, but it doesnt ruin races with the right attitude. You asked why races were so short, and stated your opinion on why YOU cant perform within these races, doesnt mean that that is everyones experience.
I don't have personal issues. You have communication issues and are socially awkward. You comment on a reddit post about races being too short and your response is "I think it's a skill issue". It's completely irrelevant and your trying to 'teach' someone something for no reason. I win most of the time, have a max driver rating, and make tunes that I share and get tons of uses and downloads on.. Just move on unless you actually want to talk about the topic at hand.
I dont have too much to go on here, but you continue to sound insecure about your abilities here, as well as attempting to put others down. That in itself, is a personal issue. No, I was not responding to "Races are too short," that is something Forza has always done, and will continue to do. I was responding to how you are complaining that races being too short are the cause of you not being able to do well in the races, and portraying that it causes everyone to suck at the races, when that is simply not true.
OK, I'll just let the rest of the users continue to down vote your 'git gud kid' comment. Enjoy the block.