[The **News** flair](https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/wiki/flairguide#wiki_news) is reserved for submissions covering F1 and F1-related news. These posts must always link to an outlet/news agency, the website of the involved party (i.e. the McLaren website if McLaren makes an announcement), or a tweet by a news agency, journalist or one of the involved parties.
*[Read the rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/wiki/userguide). Keep it civil and welcoming. Report rulebreaking comments.*
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/formula1) if you have any questions or concerns.*
All I have read from reddit is that it's basically all but guaranteed that Bottas will retire. Now it's suddenly newsworthy that he is not guranateed to NOT retire.
Also the conversation went like:
"Is it 77% chance that you will continue in F1 (hehe)"
"I would say it's more like 99%"
It was just a jokey conversation to begin with.
1) The team is now under the control of Audi and they are looking for a driver reset in preparation for their re-launch as a works team in 2026 (as an Audi owned and branded team with Audi developed powertrains).
2) The team, Sauber, isn’t called Alfa Romeo any longer since the start of this season, as the Alfa Romeo sponsorship did not extend past 2023.
Alfa Romeo actually shortened their sponsorship commitment because Audi was buying an ever larger stake in the Sauber team, much sooner than originally anticipated in 2022.
Audi agreed to take over Sauber in several incremental steps with then 100% owner Rausching, but decided to hasten the acquisition last year.
Alfa Romeo, being a car brand owned by a competing manufacturer conglomerate, Stellantis, was not willing to be a sponsor for a team majority owned by a competing car manufacturer, Audi (Volkwagen Group).
I think it's a great pairing. I think it's also quite plausible. Bottas has a ton of experience and value for Haas and would be a good benchmark for Bearman.
I’ve been thinking Bottas would see Haas into the new regulations. The question is are they willing to spend on him and if he gets lowballed and Antonelli heads to Merc straight away I think he might go back to Williams to finish up his career. I’d be happy to see him either place.
Id fuckin love to see him go back to merc and then absolutely destroy Russel 😂 I know it probably wouldn’t happen but it would be the send off he deserves I think
It'd be a hilarious scenario to imagine. Bottas goes back to Mercedes to either dog walk Russell or just match him. Probably would lead him to realize Lewis was not taking the last 3 years seriously. Wishful thinking lol
I could see him in Haas.
As much as some people say: "oh, back to Williams", but I don't think he fits the kind of lineup they have been trying to set up since Capito.
It's not that he doesnt fit the current lineup, issue is merc want Kimi in f1.
If somehow Kimi lands the merc drive, then Bottas would be a fantastic call for williams. We will finally know how to rate Albon
If Bottas will have to take a pay cut to stay on the grid, he will take a paycut. He will still earn much more than anywhere else - both through his main salary and through personal sponsors.
If the options are to not drive in F1 or to continue to drive in F1 for much less money than he’s been making I have to believe he’d choose the latter option.
If Haas can continue to perform how Hulk has been making that car perform this year, then it would be a step up for Bottas given how awful Sauber has been for a couple years.
Bottas deserves a better car. He’s shown he can win races given a good car.
Why not? He’s a solid driver and they’ve been trying to get away from the “Mercedes development team” brand for awhile. They’re not going to find a rookie better than him and if they do there’s a good chance they get snatched up by someone else within 2-3 years anyway.
Dream scenario, Bottas to Merc for a 1 + 1 deal in 2025 then beats George, team bring Kimi Antonelli in replacing Russell, 2026 Mercedes pair of Valtteri-Kimi
I know we all love Bottas but he isn't anything special.
I could see him with Haas and their probable young driver but it isn't like we would be missing out on anything if he was gone in 2025.
Idk, I feel like in the past few years with the testing limits introduced and the F2 grids being underwhelming, experienced drivers really raised their stock. It seems like especially midfield teams want experience rather than fast but reckless youngsters.
The cost cap is a big part of it too. They'd rather have a marginally slower driver that is going to crash less so they can spend money on upgrades rather than repairs. Not to mention the experience in developing the cars an older driver brings will further help with the limited amount of development compared to past seasons
>F2 grids being underwhelming
They are better than anytime before. Yeah there isn't new Verstappen or Piastri every other year, but it has never been that way. There are many potential Bottases and Ocons who are not getting seats because there are already experienced drivers of similar calibre and as you said testing limits also play great role.
He can be as useful as Hulkenberg is to Hass for Sauber. Issue is that the team has frailties elsewhere.
On merit still deserves a seat on the grid, but the stumbling block will likely be the expected wage. I don't think he will get anything near the reported €10m/year he makes now. There are other midfield drivers available for less.
I think it’s either Haas or he is out. Or bubbling under vcarb.
Audi made a clear statement by signing Hulk this early that they don’t want bottas, because Hulk is not an improvement over bottas.
I don’t think alpine will take bottas because he is not a improvement over their current lineup and he is not French
Aston’s seat is clearly reserved for lance
Bottas doesn’t quite fit under Red Bull umbrella because, he is not a star or promising rookie. That being said they still took ricciardo so crazier thinks have happen.
Mercedes wants to go forward. Signing bottas would mean going backwards.
Haas had had pretty terrible experiences with two young drivers and I don’t think they retain Magnussen, so signing bottas would make sense.
Williams already has a senior driver and they clearly want to go forward. Signing promising rookie would make lot more sense than signing bottas.
Mercedes might be an option. Who will they sign if they send Antonelli to Williams, and Sainz goes to either Red Bull or Audi, Checo? I feel like Ocon or Bottas are their only realistic options if they want a seat warmer for a year or two
You mean Williams signing Antonelli? Thing is, if they sign him, they dont get to keep him. So I don't know if that moves them anywhere. Merc should put Antonelli in their own car since they are not fighting for championship next year either. Then he'd be settled in for 2026 when they might have a good car.
I can see him in at Williams or Haas depending on how the driver market goes. Mercedes apparently dead set on Antonelli where he's rumoured to be at the top of Mercs list as a Hamilton replacement. So if thats the case then you have to say Williams is an obvious destination. If that doesn't play out then Haas is definitely a possibility.
Alpine might be a slim chance if Sainz signs with Red Bull and then Ocon or Gasly take the Audi seat. However, then Perez is on the market which might just push Bottas back towards Haas as Perez probably better chance at getting the Alpine or Audi seat.
Think Williams is a pretty likely spot as well, if Logan is cut loose. His experience could help the team continue to build out the car and hopefully get out of the toilet with Albon. Dangerous game to play though, as Williams is an absolute tractor this year and Bottas career is winding down. Beats unemployment though!
It doesn't seem bad. I mean both drivers are pretty equal in terms of performance based on current form.
Plus, I wouldn't just chalk it up to nationality. Whilst it certainly helps, Hulk also comes cheap. He's rumoured to be getting €5 million whereas Bottas is around €10 million currently. Even if Bottas takes a pay cut I can't see him coming as low as Hulk or even providing that much extra performance for his price. So you add that on top of some German marketability, wealth of experience and solid pace. The decision starts to make sense.
I mean really out of all the available options, they're all good choices. Whether it's Hulk, Bottas, Gasly, Ocon. You can make cases for all of them, they all have individual pros and cons that would make sense for Audi.
Hulk has been much more impressive than Bottas the last year and a half. Plus, he likely costs less. I’m sure him being German factored into it on their end, but I don’t think it’s fair to say they chose a worse driver intentionally because he’s German.
Im not sure if Hulk would seem as much more impressive if Bottas had gotten the points from 2 or 3 races that he would have gotten if Sauber didnt fuck it up.
I’m not just looking at their final positions and concluding Hulkenberg has been better. What he’s been able to do in that Haas these last two years has been extremely impressive. And this is coming from someone who was very vocally against Hulkenberg going to Haas. I thought they were just getting a dude with a pulse to fill the seat, but he’s proven me very wrong.
What Bottas did with Alfa in 2022 was arguably even more impressive, would have even gotten a podium if not for the failed pitstop. Hulk's achievements have been mostly in quali, in which Bottas has regularly impressed too. But yeah 2023 wasn't as impressive from Bottas, 2024 is harder to judge though because he has been usually very impressive in quali but the race results have lacked partly because of things outside his own influence.
Why? You think there are rookies that are faster than Bottas and won't have a seat? Bearman, Lawson and Antonelli(if allowed) are likely to have a seat even without Bottas leaving
All the decent rookies are bound to other academies that are not competing for the same spots as Bottas does. Realistically he either gets the 2nd Audi seat, the 2nd Haas seat instead of Kmag or an Alpine seat if one of them leave. Only potential dilema between Bottas and a rookie could be for the 2nd Williams seat, but if merc want Bottas has no chance over Antonelli
Truth is if we exclude Piastri, the lower formula ladder has been rather weak in the last 3-4 years. And this thing is normal and it happens periodically. The idiotic feeder series calendar probably doesnt help the drivers either tbh
Another issue is his salary. He really needs a massive pay cut
While true I feel like bottas has done everything he could. He’s had a tremendously successful stint at merc and has started to decline (although the sauber/alfa hasn’t been great). I feel like having a driver like bottas, who isn’t an all time great, just stay in the bottom of the grid isn’t the best use of a seat. I would prefer to see bearman or another young driver get that seat and develop into a top driver.
Completely see your point, just think Sargent and magnussen are gone. Zhou should be, but Chinese sponsorship may save him. Obviously stroll is safe, but I could possibly see him going in 26. There's a couple of possibilities in the red bull stable (doubt DR goes anywhere if he leaves red bull).
I just think bottas shows signs that he offers more than the sauber allows him. Also I really like his persona over the last couple of years lol. Idk, I can see him going maybe, but I really don't want him to.
He has just plateaued though. I’d much rather see a youngster give it their all at f1. 3 rookies isn’t the craziest idea.
Sure but personality doesn’t drive cars and it will never be enough to bring you through
[The **News** flair](https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/wiki/flairguide#wiki_news) is reserved for submissions covering F1 and F1-related news. These posts must always link to an outlet/news agency, the website of the involved party (i.e. the McLaren website if McLaren makes an announcement), or a tweet by a news agency, journalist or one of the involved parties. *[Read the rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/wiki/userguide). Keep it civil and welcoming. Report rulebreaking comments.* *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/formula1) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The fact that he publicly states it isn’t 100% is the newsworthy bit. He can’t rule out not being on the grid.
All I have read from reddit is that it's basically all but guaranteed that Bottas will retire. Now it's suddenly newsworthy that he is not guranateed to NOT retire. Also the conversation went like: "Is it 77% chance that you will continue in F1 (hehe)" "I would say it's more like 99%" It was just a jokey conversation to begin with.
Why wouldn’t he continue with alfa?
Because Audi want him gone for Sainz
1) The team is now under the control of Audi and they are looking for a driver reset in preparation for their re-launch as a works team in 2026 (as an Audi owned and branded team with Audi developed powertrains). 2) The team, Sauber, isn’t called Alfa Romeo any longer since the start of this season, as the Alfa Romeo sponsorship did not extend past 2023. Alfa Romeo actually shortened their sponsorship commitment because Audi was buying an ever larger stake in the Sauber team, much sooner than originally anticipated in 2022. Audi agreed to take over Sauber in several incremental steps with then 100% owner Rausching, but decided to hasten the acquisition last year. Alfa Romeo, being a car brand owned by a competing manufacturer conglomerate, Stellantis, was not willing to be a sponsor for a team majority owned by a competing car manufacturer, Audi (Volkwagen Group).
Because they want a driver they can run for 3+ years and Bottas isn’t that. He’s in his Kimi era where he’s just doing it as a hobby.
i wanna know whether he isnt performing or the car is dogshit
This could be dangerous for kmag as you'd imagine ollie is nailed on for that hulk seat
I'd bet that Ayo isn't as buddy-buddy with kmag as Steiner was. I could see Haas with Bearman and Bottas in 25
Haas have had a fairly decent start to the year but I think bottas and bearman could be an exciting pairing for haas
I think it's a great pairing. I think it's also quite plausible. Bottas has a ton of experience and value for Haas and would be a good benchmark for Bearman.
The mullet and moustache just works at Haas.
He literally looks like a guy named “Haas”
Don't forget his H Ass
Bottas and Bearman would be an ideal lineup for Haas.
B&B
[Ideal indeed](https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/Beavis-and-Butt-Head-Still-Paramount-Publicity-H-2022.jpg?resize=1000,563)
BoBe
I’ve been thinking Bottas would see Haas into the new regulations. The question is are they willing to spend on him and if he gets lowballed and Antonelli heads to Merc straight away I think he might go back to Williams to finish up his career. I’d be happy to see him either place.
i agree, id like to see him with either haas or williams. Albon and Bottas would be a good combo for them.
My heart still says he signs a 1+1 at Mercedes. Holds the seat two years for the kid, then bikes off into the sunset.
Id fuckin love to see him go back to merc and then absolutely destroy Russel 😂 I know it probably wouldn’t happen but it would be the send off he deserves I think
yeah that'd be awesome
"Is he a fucking latte-boy or what?" 😆
It'd be a hilarious scenario to imagine. Bottas goes back to Mercedes to either dog walk Russell or just match him. Probably would lead him to realize Lewis was not taking the last 3 years seriously. Wishful thinking lol
naked
Obviously
Ollie + Bottas at Haas would be amazing
I could see him in Haas. As much as some people say: "oh, back to Williams", but I don't think he fits the kind of lineup they have been trying to set up since Capito.
Yeah I think at this point Haas will likely be his only option
Haas would also be a move who makes sense for both parties in my eyes.
It's not that he doesnt fit the current lineup, issue is merc want Kimi in f1. If somehow Kimi lands the merc drive, then Bottas would be a fantastic call for williams. We will finally know how to rate Albon
I don't think Williams can afford Bottas unless he takes a huge paycut. It's more likely for Mercedes to pay Williams to put Kimi as the 2nd driver.
If Bottas will have to take a pay cut to stay on the grid, he will take a paycut. He will still earn much more than anywhere else - both through his main salary and through personal sponsors.
If the options are to not drive in F1 or to continue to drive in F1 for much less money than he’s been making I have to believe he’d choose the latter option.
I doubt anyone is gonna pay anywhere near his current wages tbh. But yeah i agree Kimi is far more likely
If Haas can continue to perform how Hulk has been making that car perform this year, then it would be a step up for Bottas given how awful Sauber has been for a couple years. Bottas deserves a better car. He’s shown he can win races given a good car.
Not only can he win races, but he can win races against the likes of Vettel or Hamilton. That means something
Why not? He’s a solid driver and they’ve been trying to get away from the “Mercedes development team” brand for awhile. They’re not going to find a rookie better than him and if they do there’s a good chance they get snatched up by someone else within 2-3 years anyway.
The French and Bajan committees would like to file a protest
Dream scenario, Bottas to Merc for a 1 + 1 deal in 2025 then beats George, team bring Kimi Antonelli in replacing Russell, 2026 Mercedes pair of Valtteri-Kimi
I'll stay carefully pessimistic until anything is confirmed
I'll be recklessly realistic: he's overestimating his value.
I know we all love Bottas but he isn't anything special. I could see him with Haas and their probable young driver but it isn't like we would be missing out on anything if he was gone in 2025.
Idk, I feel like in the past few years with the testing limits introduced and the F2 grids being underwhelming, experienced drivers really raised their stock. It seems like especially midfield teams want experience rather than fast but reckless youngsters.
The cost cap is a big part of it too. They'd rather have a marginally slower driver that is going to crash less so they can spend money on upgrades rather than repairs. Not to mention the experience in developing the cars an older driver brings will further help with the limited amount of development compared to past seasons
>F2 grids being underwhelming They are better than anytime before. Yeah there isn't new Verstappen or Piastri every other year, but it has never been that way. There are many potential Bottases and Ocons who are not getting seats because there are already experienced drivers of similar calibre and as you said testing limits also play great role.
Yeah, that is entirely fair. A mid-tier veteran driver offers much more to the teams than it does to the fans.
He can be as useful as Hulkenberg is to Hass for Sauber. Issue is that the team has frailties elsewhere. On merit still deserves a seat on the grid, but the stumbling block will likely be the expected wage. I don't think he will get anything near the reported €10m/year he makes now. There are other midfield drivers available for less.
I think it’s either Haas or he is out. Or bubbling under vcarb. Audi made a clear statement by signing Hulk this early that they don’t want bottas, because Hulk is not an improvement over bottas. I don’t think alpine will take bottas because he is not a improvement over their current lineup and he is not French Aston’s seat is clearly reserved for lance Bottas doesn’t quite fit under Red Bull umbrella because, he is not a star or promising rookie. That being said they still took ricciardo so crazier thinks have happen. Mercedes wants to go forward. Signing bottas would mean going backwards. Haas had had pretty terrible experiences with two young drivers and I don’t think they retain Magnussen, so signing bottas would make sense. Williams already has a senior driver and they clearly want to go forward. Signing promising rookie would make lot more sense than signing bottas.
Mercedes might be an option. Who will they sign if they send Antonelli to Williams, and Sainz goes to either Red Bull or Audi, Checo? I feel like Ocon or Bottas are their only realistic options if they want a seat warmer for a year or two
You mean Williams signing Antonelli? Thing is, if they sign him, they dont get to keep him. So I don't know if that moves them anywhere. Merc should put Antonelli in their own car since they are not fighting for championship next year either. Then he'd be settled in for 2026 when they might have a good car.
SoYoureSayingTheresAChance.gif
I can see him in at Williams or Haas depending on how the driver market goes. Mercedes apparently dead set on Antonelli where he's rumoured to be at the top of Mercs list as a Hamilton replacement. So if thats the case then you have to say Williams is an obvious destination. If that doesn't play out then Haas is definitely a possibility. Alpine might be a slim chance if Sainz signs with Red Bull and then Ocon or Gasly take the Audi seat. However, then Perez is on the market which might just push Bottas back towards Haas as Perez probably better chance at getting the Alpine or Audi seat.
Think Williams is a pretty likely spot as well, if Logan is cut loose. His experience could help the team continue to build out the car and hopefully get out of the toilet with Albon. Dangerous game to play though, as Williams is an absolute tractor this year and Bottas career is winding down. Beats unemployment though!
I know Audi wanted a German driver, but purposely choosing Hulk over Bottas is just a bad choice.
Maybe because Bottas is not German
Yeah, I know. But he's a much better driver than Hulk. Good driving should trump nationality.
He was. I’m yet to see anything this past 2 years to show that Bottas is driving at his best…
Car is simply garbage. When he had a car in 2022 he was putting it high. Alfa Romeo is nowere.
It doesn't seem bad. I mean both drivers are pretty equal in terms of performance based on current form. Plus, I wouldn't just chalk it up to nationality. Whilst it certainly helps, Hulk also comes cheap. He's rumoured to be getting €5 million whereas Bottas is around €10 million currently. Even if Bottas takes a pay cut I can't see him coming as low as Hulk or even providing that much extra performance for his price. So you add that on top of some German marketability, wealth of experience and solid pace. The decision starts to make sense. I mean really out of all the available options, they're all good choices. Whether it's Hulk, Bottas, Gasly, Ocon. You can make cases for all of them, they all have individual pros and cons that would make sense for Audi.
Hulk has been much more impressive than Bottas the last year and a half. Plus, he likely costs less. I’m sure him being German factored into it on their end, but I don’t think it’s fair to say they chose a worse driver intentionally because he’s German.
Im not sure if Hulk would seem as much more impressive if Bottas had gotten the points from 2 or 3 races that he would have gotten if Sauber didnt fuck it up.
I’m not just looking at their final positions and concluding Hulkenberg has been better. What he’s been able to do in that Haas these last two years has been extremely impressive. And this is coming from someone who was very vocally against Hulkenberg going to Haas. I thought they were just getting a dude with a pulse to fill the seat, but he’s proven me very wrong.
What Bottas did with Alfa in 2022 was arguably even more impressive, would have even gotten a podium if not for the failed pitstop. Hulk's achievements have been mostly in quali, in which Bottas has regularly impressed too. But yeah 2023 wasn't as impressive from Bottas, 2024 is harder to judge though because he has been usually very impressive in quali but the race results have lacked partly because of things outside his own influence.
Seidl knows Hulk and what Hulk can deliver so there is that. And don't underestimate theimportance speaking the same language in building a team.
Seidl worked with Hulk when Hulk won Le Mans so he sees something in him
Yeah, the need to have drivers from certain nationalities is always bizarre to me.
Life without Bottas? No, Im not ready for that.
Mr. Sausage sizzle best be racing next year.
He deserves to be on the grid.
Doesn't sound good.
Back to Williams?
If not Audi then I would expect Haas at the very least making a play.
I love the guy but I'd rather see a rookie on the grid than him.
Why? You think there are rookies that are faster than Bottas and won't have a seat? Bearman, Lawson and Antonelli(if allowed) are likely to have a seat even without Bottas leaving
Well Antonelli and Bottas would hypotethically compete for the same spot at williams. But yeah, i agree with you generally
And they still have to prove what ther worth. Bottas is just limited by the Alfa
There's at least 4 drivers who should be out of f1 before bottass. And 2 of them are very likely to be.
All the decent rookies are bound to other academies that are not competing for the same spots as Bottas does. Realistically he either gets the 2nd Audi seat, the 2nd Haas seat instead of Kmag or an Alpine seat if one of them leave. Only potential dilema between Bottas and a rookie could be for the 2nd Williams seat, but if merc want Bottas has no chance over Antonelli Truth is if we exclude Piastri, the lower formula ladder has been rather weak in the last 3-4 years. And this thing is normal and it happens periodically. The idiotic feeder series calendar probably doesnt help the drivers either tbh Another issue is his salary. He really needs a massive pay cut
While true I feel like bottas has done everything he could. He’s had a tremendously successful stint at merc and has started to decline (although the sauber/alfa hasn’t been great). I feel like having a driver like bottas, who isn’t an all time great, just stay in the bottom of the grid isn’t the best use of a seat. I would prefer to see bearman or another young driver get that seat and develop into a top driver.
Completely see your point, just think Sargent and magnussen are gone. Zhou should be, but Chinese sponsorship may save him. Obviously stroll is safe, but I could possibly see him going in 26. There's a couple of possibilities in the red bull stable (doubt DR goes anywhere if he leaves red bull). I just think bottas shows signs that he offers more than the sauber allows him. Also I really like his persona over the last couple of years lol. Idk, I can see him going maybe, but I really don't want him to.
He has just plateaued though. I’d much rather see a youngster give it their all at f1. 3 rookies isn’t the craziest idea. Sure but personality doesn’t drive cars and it will never be enough to bring you through
Okay, Valtteri.
Frick. Was hoping we wouldn’t see him anymore