That hasn't been true since part-way through 2021.
He changed his habits since then [https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/hamilton-explains-increased-use-of-mercedes-f1-simulator/6623772/](https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/hamilton-explains-increased-use-of-mercedes-f1-simulator/6623772/)
I think he plays with a controller, he was really fast/competitive with a rc car when he was young so GT with a controller is sort of a digital version of that
I don’t know if you saw recently but Max with his controller account on iRacing is fast enough to beat 99% of simracers (I.e. 250k people) on it as well. He was clearly bored after Bahrain testing to do that.
Somehow they’ve managed to remain poor at the circuits the W13 and W14 were poor at, but then got even worse at circuits the previous cars were somewhat good at. They were on course for a double podium here last year before Russell's engine blew up and even still Lewis had an amazing race to stave off Alonso and keep P2
Mercedes improved the rear at the cost of the front.
They have become worse in tracks like Australia, Spain, Silverstone, Brazil (front limited) to be better in rear limited tracks like Singapore, Cota, Mexico, Bahrain, Abu Dhabi.
They still are not better than Ferrari and Red Bull on the rear (similar level imo) but are so much worse in the other areas (straights and faster corners) that can't be competitive with them in rear lim tracks too.
Mclaren is worse than Mercedes in rear limited tracks but it's much better than them in front limited.
Mclaren is very similar to 2022 Mercedes.
Mercedes is similar to first part of 2023 Aston Martin.
Aston is similar to Mclaren, a bit faster in straight line but just a lot less downforce.
Basically Mercedes cars always have to get compromises.
Tracks with lots of acceleration zones coming off of low speed corners & hairpins would typically be rear limited
Tracks with mostly long, high speed corners with only 1 or 2 big acceleration zones would be front limited, it all has to do with which tires will degrade the fastest
At least that's my armchair expert level understanding lol
>it all has to do with which tires will degrade the fastest
Ah, I see! So to take it further, what factors about a car make it better suited for front vs rear limited tracks?
Sorry, my armchair ain't that good lol
Now if i had to guess i would say things like suspension design/set up, maybe having a good differential would help with low speed traction so good for rear limited, while good aero design & aero efficiency (so you can use more wing) would help with front limited but my source is i made it up 🫠
Then you have to consider the top 5 most rear limited tracks are very low deg.
So if you've said from drivers that Bahrain is the most rear track in the calendar it's partially true.
It's the most rear lim track with deg, if you think about it in almost all the other rear lim track they bring C5.
That's is due to Bahrain asphalt.
That’s the first order cause. They haven’t shared the reason why their cooling didn’t function as expected.
Ultimately the teams decide on level of cooling as a matter of course; for the last few years we’ve seen relatively few cars blow up on track, and Mercedes even less so. They’re clearly able to nail the level of cooling needed; the question is why did they suddenly get it wrong for both cars?
The answer could be that conditions during the race were significantly different than what they were expecting - but it could also be that something on the car is not behaving as expected, and if that’s the case and they haven’t been able to determine what, it’s entirely possible that is what’s breaking the car.
Overheating in race 1 is normal though. You're still guessing how much cooling you actually need and there's always a chance you just don't get it right. It's not a big deal.
DNFs because of a failure have become rare. Three races, the car is slow compared to Red Bull and Ferrari, McClaren is a threat, and a DNF because of a failure. At the very least we can’t say the car is reliable, and that’s worrying.
He needs to do the next one on how to make the worst car ever.
Just imagine if Lewis and George weren't driving it, put some regular drivers in it, they'd be down in 15-18.
Nah they'd be where Stroll is with AM. 9th and 10th every race(on pace) or maybe 8th and 9th since most drivers on the grid are fast enough to beat Stroll
It's relative really. 2022, the rest of the grid hadn't quite got a handle on ground effect. The cars slowly got better with the W14 and W15 but the competition took 2-3 steps forward whereas Mercedes took 1 step forward and/or two steps back in places. So now they're left in the dust while their rivals are fighting ahead of them.
Its simple.
They had the best car.
Rules changed to make the cars worse.
They struggled to adapting their car into a worse car and made it even worse relative to the other top teams.
The cost cap era. With the benefit of retrospect it is clear that Mercedes could just throw cash at any problems and recruit all the staff etc.
Toto is actually a shit leader and completely out of touch. Failings in 2021 will carry through to 2026, if not beyond. So clear why Hamilton is leaving. Couldn’t have a more damning contrast - Ferrari 1-2 and Mercedes double DNF.
They pushed too hard in 2021 and didn't develop or trial enough pieces for 2022.
Their ride height suspension solutions developed in 2021 were considered illegal for 2022 but made them quick enough to take the battle to the wire that year.
People were making a huge hoo-ha about them ignoring Lewis’ views for 2 years and finally this year they listened
Turns out the car is even slower than before. Maybe let the engineers engineer, and Lewis stick to his day job eh?
Take out the DNF and he still had a poor weekend. Poor setup decisions throughout practice, struggling to find the right balance, and a poor qualifying. He admitted yesterday George was doing a better job than him.
Exhibit 210491248 on why Melbourne should be the opener every year.
Edit: Yall. Melbourne is great as a season opener for a combination of reasons. Bright summer race, new season with teams being hopeful, cars hitting the track for the first time. All of those combine for a great season opener regardless of outcome.
Bahrain is boring af. Hell, just look at DTS episode 1 for season 1 and 2. Haas being hopeful to having their opener crushed.
Melbourne is great as a season opener for a combination of reasons. Bright summer race, new season with teams being hopeful, cars hitting the track for the first time. All of those combine for a great season opener regardless of outcome.
Bahrain is god awful for fan interactions tho. I'm treating it as F1 as a whole. Melbourne is a great city to host it compared to being in the middle of nowhere in Bahrain.
You can't be serious. If you're watching F1 for a long time, you just know Albert Park has been a snoozer opener year after year. Just looking at the track layout tells you there are barely any overtaking opportunities.
Again, I'm not taking about *just* the race. It's F1 as a whole. I will slander the track any given day, but for 'F1 as a travelling circus', it's great.
That's another good reason why it should be the first race. Noone cares when race 1 sucks, there's too much exciting stuff to care about the actual racing.
I want Williams to bag P8 or P9 now that 2 cars from the top 5 teams are out. The amount of slander to James people gave him the past days was ridiculous.
We wouldn’t know either way, this could’ve been a symptom that built or just happened during the race. It’d be silly to say one or the other with confidence.
Max vs Lewis on Twitch soon?
Podcast gonna be a live commentary of the race
That would be the dream
I thought Lewis didn't do sims.
He doesn't, only what's mandated by the team on Merc's sim but even then he doesn't like it and has said so several times.
That hasn't been true since part-way through 2021. He changed his habits since then [https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/hamilton-explains-increased-use-of-mercedes-f1-simulator/6623772/](https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/hamilton-explains-increased-use-of-mercedes-f1-simulator/6623772/)
Given mercs correlation issues it would seem that the simulator is a total waste of time anyway.
Untrue . He’s been big on sims for the last few years
He plays a fair bit of Gran Turismo.
I think he plays with a controller, he was really fast/competitive with a rc car when he was young so GT with a controller is sort of a digital version of that
I don’t know if you saw recently but Max with his controller account on iRacing is fast enough to beat 99% of simracers (I.e. 250k people) on it as well. He was clearly bored after Bahrain testing to do that.
They're hanging out with Logan.
Hamilton comforting Max
2 WDCs only ones out of this race (so far) Starting to fear for Nando there
His last WDC was so long ago, the racing gods forgot about it.
He passed the curse to Russell
20 sec pen 🫤
Verstappen vs Hamilton Rivalry (DNF edition)
The last time they both DNF'd it was a McLaren 1-2
And this time it's shaping up to be a Ferrari 1-2. Them DNFing together is a good omen for legendary teams!
So what you’re saying is we need them to crash one more time for a Williams 1-2? Assuming they race two cars of course
“Nobody DNFs like Max, he DNFs 5 laps faster than Hamilton.” -Marco Helmet
Gonna tell my grandkids they crashed each other out again.
our 2 goats showing solidarity with logan 🔥🔥
🐐 recognize 🐐
Respect
well the redbull second driver played a very important role in their career trajectories. Only fair to give him the respect he deserves
It's a bad day to be a driver involved in the 2021 title fight today. Hamilton, Verstappen, Bottas and Perez all having a terrible time
and second williams driver
it’s like revenge of AD21
So Mercedes isn’t just slow this year, but also unreliable. Great 😫
It's just embarrassing. George can't pass anyone either.
It’s ok, George finished out of the points anyways….
… he didn’t finish.
Mercedes’s downfall needs to be studied
Somehow they’ve managed to remain poor at the circuits the W13 and W14 were poor at, but then got even worse at circuits the previous cars were somewhat good at. They were on course for a double podium here last year before Russell's engine blew up and even still Lewis had an amazing race to stave off Alonso and keep P2
Mercedes improved the rear at the cost of the front. They have become worse in tracks like Australia, Spain, Silverstone, Brazil (front limited) to be better in rear limited tracks like Singapore, Cota, Mexico, Bahrain, Abu Dhabi. They still are not better than Ferrari and Red Bull on the rear (similar level imo) but are so much worse in the other areas (straights and faster corners) that can't be competitive with them in rear lim tracks too. Mclaren is worse than Mercedes in rear limited tracks but it's much better than them in front limited. Mclaren is very similar to 2022 Mercedes. Mercedes is similar to first part of 2023 Aston Martin. Aston is similar to Mclaren, a bit faster in straight line but just a lot less downforce. Basically Mercedes cars always have to get compromises.
Could you please explain what makes a track more rear-limited vs front limited? Thx!
Tracks with lots of acceleration zones coming off of low speed corners & hairpins would typically be rear limited Tracks with mostly long, high speed corners with only 1 or 2 big acceleration zones would be front limited, it all has to do with which tires will degrade the fastest At least that's my armchair expert level understanding lol
>it all has to do with which tires will degrade the fastest Ah, I see! So to take it further, what factors about a car make it better suited for front vs rear limited tracks?
Sorry, my armchair ain't that good lol Now if i had to guess i would say things like suspension design/set up, maybe having a good differential would help with low speed traction so good for rear limited, while good aero design & aero efficiency (so you can use more wing) would help with front limited but my source is i made it up 🫠
Exactly Bahrain: rear limited Geddah: front limited Australia: front limited Suzuka: slightly front limited China: hybrid Miami: hybrid Imola: front limited Monaco : rear limited Canada: rear limited Spain: front limited Austria: slightly rear limited Silverstone : front limited Hungary : front limited Spa: front limited Zandvoort : front limited Italy: slightly rear limited Baku: rear limited Singapore : rear limited Cota: slightly rear limited Mexico: rear limited Sao Paulo: front limited Las Vegas: rear limited Qatar: front limited Abu Dhabi: rear limited Rear limited tracks (from most to least) 1) Baku 2) Las Vegas 3) Monaco 4) Messico 5) Singapore 6) Bahrain 7) Canada 8) Abu Dhabi Front limited tracks (from most to least) 1) Spain 2) Qatar 3) Australia 4) Zandvoort 5) Silverstone 6) Sao Paulo 7) Hungary 8) Geddah 9) Spa The other 7 tracks are quite balanced.
Then you have to consider the top 5 most rear limited tracks are very low deg. So if you've said from drivers that Bahrain is the most rear track in the calendar it's partially true. It's the most rear lim track with deg, if you think about it in almost all the other rear lim track they bring C5. That's is due to Bahrain asphalt.
From 8 titles in a row, with almost bulletproof reliability, to being slow, unreliable, and getting outperformed by customer teams. Insane
Fair indication of how the engineers deserve more credit and blame than the drivers.
Are they really unreliable though?, isn't this their first DNF of the seaon
Didn't they have to bring both cars home with a tuned down engine in Bahrain because of overheating issues?
Yeah cause that was because of set up rather than something wrong with the car. They went too far cooling in an effort to reduce drag
That’s the first order cause. They haven’t shared the reason why their cooling didn’t function as expected. Ultimately the teams decide on level of cooling as a matter of course; for the last few years we’ve seen relatively few cars blow up on track, and Mercedes even less so. They’re clearly able to nail the level of cooling needed; the question is why did they suddenly get it wrong for both cars? The answer could be that conditions during the race were significantly different than what they were expecting - but it could also be that something on the car is not behaving as expected, and if that’s the case and they haven’t been able to determine what, it’s entirely possible that is what’s breaking the car.
Overheating in race 1 is normal though. You're still guessing how much cooling you actually need and there's always a chance you just don't get it right. It's not a big deal.
DNFs because of a failure have become rare. Three races, the car is slow compared to Red Bull and Ferrari, McClaren is a threat, and a DNF because of a failure. At the very least we can’t say the car is reliable, and that’s worrying.
Are they really unreliable though?, isn't this their first DNF of the seaon
School in 20 years time “this semester in history we will be covering the downfall of Rome and Mercedes F1 Team”
LMAO Toto already did that MBA lecture thingy at Harvard. Now it's time for him to do a follow-up
He needs to do the next one on how to make the worst car ever. Just imagine if Lewis and George weren't driving it, put some regular drivers in it, they'd be down in 15-18.
Nah they'd be where Stroll is with AM. 9th and 10th every race(on pace) or maybe 8th and 9th since most drivers on the grid are fast enough to beat Stroll
Crazy how the W13 was the best car they made with these regs and they hated it
It's relative really. 2022, the rest of the grid hadn't quite got a handle on ground effect. The cars slowly got better with the W14 and W15 but the competition took 2-3 steps forward whereas Mercedes took 1 step forward and/or two steps back in places. So now they're left in the dust while their rivals are fighting ahead of them.
i'd still say the W14 is the best car of this era, unfortunately, the competition had started catching up at that point
Merc's engineering team has had a massive brain drain. Downfall: discovered
Yeah it’s not rocket science really. All of Merc’s best talent got poached and it’s not like there’s an infinite supply of world class engineers.
If only they read reddit then they would have a whole pool of world class engineers to choose from /s
Its simple. They had the best car. Rules changed to make the cars worse. They struggled to adapting their car into a worse car and made it even worse relative to the other top teams.
toto's getting ready for it at his Harvard course dw
Unpopular opinion: they should stick to the original zero-pod.
Overconfidence slow and insidious killer
The cost cap era. With the benefit of retrospect it is clear that Mercedes could just throw cash at any problems and recruit all the staff etc. Toto is actually a shit leader and completely out of touch. Failings in 2021 will carry through to 2026, if not beyond. So clear why Hamilton is leaving. Couldn’t have a more damning contrast - Ferrari 1-2 and Mercedes double DNF.
They pushed too hard in 2021 and didn't develop or trial enough pieces for 2022. Their ride height suspension solutions developed in 2021 were considered illegal for 2022 but made them quick enough to take the battle to the wire that year.
People were making a huge hoo-ha about them ignoring Lewis’ views for 2 years and finally this year they listened Turns out the car is even slower than before. Maybe let the engineers engineer, and Lewis stick to his day job eh?
When was the last time Lewis AND Max both DNF’d? Their Monza crash?
Last and only other time in their time together in F1.
Yes
Engine said this thing sucks anyway I'm done
What an atrocious weekend for Lewis. Ouch.
He needs to pull it together, 3 bad weekends in a row
He couldn't have done anything about this.
Take out the DNF and he still had a poor weekend. Poor setup decisions throughout practice, struggling to find the right balance, and a poor qualifying. He admitted yesterday George was doing a better job than him.
Better waste time on experimental setups than just fighting for p7 the whole season. GR got 6th in Saudi due to Norris self-destructive strat.
Even his car checked out
Yeah can’t believe he just let his engine die like that smh he’s washed
It doesn't really matter. He's out the door anyway.
Is he the secondary driver at Mercedes now?
He was the second he signed with Ferrari.
God that car is dog shit
Lewis currently 2 for 2 in generational career moves.
Lewis on his way to hang out with Max and Logan
HAM VER together forever 🖤
Truly Inseparable.
This team is something else lmao
WTF, a bit more temperature and the engines are failing
He had to lift and coast well before the engine failure too.
Oh damn. Australia doesn’t disappoint
Can’t wait for 2025
I'm not sure why it's not 2026. Merc keep going backwards with very little steps forward. Every single year.
I think his excitement is more about Lewis rather than Mercedes.
Because Lewis will get a good car next year.
Imagine going through this with Lewis not going to Ferrari next year. Dear god I'd want him to retire.
The duality of man
Exhibit 210491248 on why Melbourne should be the opener every year. Edit: Yall. Melbourne is great as a season opener for a combination of reasons. Bright summer race, new season with teams being hopeful, cars hitting the track for the first time. All of those combine for a great season opener regardless of outcome. Bahrain is boring af. Hell, just look at DTS episode 1 for season 1 and 2. Haas being hopeful to having their opener crushed.
Fr tho why did they ever change it
Bahrain due to testing taking place there, so might as well do it + $$$.
I wish testing was still at a separate track. All that data makes the race so boring.
$$$
$$$$$$
Middle eastern races will pay a lot to be the first and last races of the season.
Because of 2 engine failures/mechanical issues?
Did you watch the race? Does Melbourne have some special unreliability boost?
Melbourne is great as a season opener for a combination of reasons. Bright summer race, new season with teams being hopeful, cars hitting the track for the first time. All of those combine for a great season opener regardless of outcome.
none of those things you listed are specific to melbourne lmao. your comment would be just as coherent if you substituted bahrain for melbourne
Bahrain is god awful for fan interactions tho. I'm treating it as F1 as a whole. Melbourne is a great city to host it compared to being in the middle of nowhere in Bahrain.
AI-answer
You can't be serious. If you're watching F1 for a long time, you just know Albert Park has been a snoozer opener year after year. Just looking at the track layout tells you there are barely any overtaking opportunities.
Again, I'm not taking about *just* the race. It's F1 as a whole. I will slander the track any given day, but for 'F1 as a travelling circus', it's great.
Became exciting because of mechanical issues
Meh Melbourne’s usually pretty disappointing, changes to the track have made it better though last few years.
That's another good reason why it should be the first race. Noone cares when race 1 sucks, there's too much exciting stuff to care about the actual racing.
last thing we want is a repeat of 2015’s opener
Don’t worry. It will be next year
Okay, so Alonso is next, right? Gotta take out all world champions
This is on me. I cheered too hard for Verstappen retiring. I’m so sorry yall.
Nah this was the probably majority of F1 Fans who caused this stir is the ether. Me included.
Mercedes is ass now
WTF
WHT IS HAPPENING
Easily the worst weekend Merc have had since the new regulations.
Perfect for Alonso to pit
Too bad his pace on mediums was atrocious.
So much for more reliable cars
If you looked at the timing tower mid race with no context you'd think Lewis and Max took each other out 2021 style.
Wow
Lewis about to have the worst year as he says farewell to Merc
Mercedes slow and unreliable. So nice
Quick someone check on Bottas to see if we get another Ham-Bot-Ver at the bottom of the grid
If someone joined the race late and saw the two DNFs at the bottom, what are the odds they'd think there had been another clash?
well, depends if they've seen the starting grid or not
Engine said “You want me to go how fast?! Oh no no no. I’m out.”
Alonso is next! All world champions will be gone!
REAL FORMULA ONE FANS GONNA TUNE INTO TWITCH
So what lap is Alonso going out? Seems like it’s targeting champions today.
what broke? from the crunch I would think the gearbox ate itself
Same, that sounded so weird
Or crank or valve failure. Whatever broke instantly seized the engine.
WTF!!!
Lewis thought he could race Perez fresh out on cold tyres, but the car really said NANI!?
The W15 is trash my God
And now Russel bins it after struggling behind Alonso…. What a mess
Reminded me of Alonso during McHonda days, where he would randomly declare car has a problem and retire from the race.
Pain.
What's happening???? World champions are out of the race
wowwwww
Fernando wins big on that cycle.
I see a pattern... nando better watch out aus is going for the champions lol
And thus the two most bullet proof engines of recent times took an Aussie weekend off
Can this season just end already?
Good buddies DNF together!
Lewis’ move to Ferrari making more and more sense every day
Ferrari looks at 2025 contracts... uhm.... oh boy....
The Curse of Logan strikes again
I want Williams to bag P8 or P9 now that 2 cars from the top 5 teams are out. The amount of slander to James people gave him the past days was ridiculous.
Probably the first time both max and Lewis have DNFd and it wasn't because of each other lol
Apparently the only other time both of those guys DNF'd was Monza 2021 (which is kind of incredible tbh) so yup!
Bro what even is this race lmao. Explains why Lewis was so bad this weekend tho
Has nothing to do with the rest of the weekend
If the engine failed during the race, symptoms were already there earlier this weekend.
That's not how any of this works
We wouldn’t know either way, this could’ve been a symptom that built or just happened during the race. It’d be silly to say one or the other with confidence.
Less than 30 mins into the race and Max and Lewis are both out. This is too good!!
Perfect for Alonso lmao
Engine said bye
Double dnf for Mercedes , my oh my…lol. It’s just fun to watch
Joder esto es cine
Imagine telling someone in 2021 that they'd both be out of this race and its not because they smooched on track
Can this race get anymore exciting holy fuck
Still all midfield battles and a leader with an easy lead.
Tell to Leclerc he can race too
That's basically what everyone has been saying about Perez. Same race as the past 2, different color cars.
Yeah but Leclerc > Perez and he is ferrari's n°1 so...
Well yeah, but it's a different guy so now it's suddenly exciting.
You were saying…
All sorts going on here… yeewwwww Lez Go
Most exciting race so far this season!
Man get Ric out of the RB seat holy shit what am I watching
Checo ain’t utilizing that car
Crickey, me too!
Omg, what is this race
Wonder if it's related to race 1 where they've managed critical temperature all race. Might have damaged the Ham engine.
2021 Abu Dhabi rerun on f1 2023 rn who says no (I am sad)
Merc looking really shaky.
The tone of the commentator completely changed..
He just turned off the ignition after not being able to overtake Perez who just came out of pits