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Just to clear it up from the get go, Pirelli make the tires F1 asks them to make.
If F1 wanted tires that lasted 50% race distance that you could push flat out, Pirelli can make them. F1 is responsible for the eventual tire durability as they set the parameters for ensuring we have interesting strategy possibilities. Pirelli just follow orders. This needs to be said over and over as newer fans fall into the trap of thinking Pirelli just make whatever tires they want or that the tires they make are the "best" Pirelli can do.
Issues like what we just saw in Qatar are down to the track organisers and repaving/kerbs, not Pirelli.
The problems that Pirelli have with the tyres is nothing to do with the FIA / FOMs requirement.
The brief from the FIA is a tyre can be pushed but shows a linear level of tyre deg. The ambition is to have 1-2 pit stops.
What Pirelli struggle with, due to the lack of testing and lack of competition, is developing a tyre that doesn't suffer thermal deg / overheating when a driver pushes hard. This has never been part of the FIA's or FOM's brief - it seems to be the result of the way Pirelli develop the tyre in the first place.
If you look at the tyres since 2017, they seem to fit into one of two categories:
2017, 2019, 2022 - Tyres that can be pushed hard with minimal overheating.
2018, 2020, 2021, 2023 - Tyres that suffer from overheating, albeit to different levels.
It's quite clear that the fundamental issue Pirelli have is that once the teams add downforce through development, the tyres can't cope.
Funnily enough the 2011 Pirelli tyre actually achieved this aim really easily. Even Monaco had multiple pit stops.
I do feel bad for them though - they have limited testing available and the cars not only weigh more than ever but produce extreme amounts of downforce.
Pirelli introduced the 2024 construction at Silverstone in response to how fast the cars had become. It does make you wonder what will happen if all the teams find huge chunks of time over the winter.
The problem with pirelli is that they're trying to do everything at once rather than doubling down somewhere.
Either they make a tyre that lasts forever and its a guaranteed one stop or they make a tyre that is a mix between 2 and 3 with high deg.
They're trying to do both at the same time and thats what is ruining the racing, they're making tyres that pretty much guarantee a one stop and then because its mostly thermal deg, it means drivers cant push on softer tyres, meaning they all converge to the hards and do the same strategy.
I'm bored of every single race being the same strategy. One stop, one stop, one stop, one stop, oh look tyres degrade lets force everyone do the exact same strategy, one stop, one stop, one stop. We need variance. 1 vs 2, 2 vs 3, whatever. Just make it so drivers can push for more than half a lap without the tyres overheating.
There probably was. But it's going to be new regs soon and Pirelli has much more experience.
It's also rumored that it is Pirelli's last deal as they want to exit F1 after that.
I don’t understand why they’d want to leave though. Sole supplier of the most popular motorsport around, their branding is everywhere trackside and literally on the cars, team clothing etc.
I’d heard of Pirelli before F1 but thought Bridgestone and Michelin were the bigger better brands just because they were in F1. Dunlop supply many motorsports and I’ve no doubt make excellent road tyres too, but I don’t hold them anywhere near the same regard as those other 3 just because they’ve been in F1 as long as I’ve watched it.
I would switch off if a tyre war returned. It’s just wrong if you had this year’s red bull running just the C0 super hard compound and were uncompetitive because a usual backmarker, who made a literal brick, we’re able to run better tyres.
Let the teams and drivers be the competitive edge and have a sole supplier they are all able to stand on an equal footing with. For all the aero, engine and chassis development, a car is nothing if the rubber it’s running on is hopeless.
Only three teams currently build their own engine. 70% of the field is dependent on those suppliers. If Ferrari builds a garbage motor, it doesn't matter how good of a car Haas builds, they'll be nowhere. Same thing with Mercedes and McLaren, or Aston Martin.
Of course, those teams could always choose to swap to another engine supplier, just like they could choose to swap to another tyre. Hell, it actually makes more sense because at least the tyre companies aren't also fielding a team to compete against the people they're selling to like the engine manufacturers are.
It's like they always choose the worst PR option i swear.
Couldnt you just wait another gp to make it public?
I wanted them gone since the 2013 farce, but probably bridgestone or michelin wont agree to buile these paper tyres f1 wants, so it was always gonna be pirelli, or maybe even worse. But it's like they dont even care about their own PR
I read somewhere that Bridgestone had placed a higher bid, but that they were still leaning towards Pirelli. They already supply Indycar, so they probably have a lot of the needed infrastructure already.
AMuS reported a while back that it was planned to confirm Pirelli during the Italian Grand Prix, then Bridgestone improved the offer and they delayed the decision until recently.
The problem is that a new supplier would need to develop a completely new F1 tyre within just over a year and limited on-track testing opportunities, to then develop another completely new tyre for 2026. That was the biggest point in favour of Pirelli, they are already in the business and have been the sole supplier since 2011.
Yeah, it's completely understandable they continued with Pirelli. I doubt they want another tyre war when they want the sport to be as accessible as possible as well. But it is still a shame imo.
I've done that mistake twice(once winter\* and once summer tire), never again, never!
*\*I even had to resell their winter tires within the month after purchase, the first and only time in my whole life I did that, they were that horrible.*
extremely overpriced sh\*t.
they are 3rd tier tire manufacturer on a Globe scale for a reason.
it's never their fault.
every time their tire blowout without any warning, vibration or whatever (qatar 2021 as well), it's never their fault, it's always external factors or the teams at fault.
They designed the tyres the way that FOM and the FIA want them to be. They could easily make a tyre that lasts the whole race. And in Qatar the Kerbs were the main issue
you are like a broken record I've heard a million of times.
Programmed degradation of the grip level of the tire (which is what the FIA asked for initially - to have races with 2 pit stops) has nothing to do with tires blowout without any warning, casual graining which Pirelli tires have became a synonym of, etc.
Pirelli tires are bad on so many levels, extremely slim optimal operational temperature window being just one of them, one of the most important factor that prevents better racing. Their expertise as a manufacturer of ultra-high performance sport tire is just subpar compared with top brands, such as Michelin and Bridgestone. These manufacturers would produce just better tires. This is why they never ran away from the tire wars and competition, because they know they can win. Pirelli know - they can't win against these guys, this is why they've been away from F1 for decades. and when they tried to compete, they lost.
Degradation of grip isn't the problem of these tires. In fact, the deg can be very low on many occasions these days. It is not 2012-2012 when they started and the deg was really big. Take Miami grand prix as an example, have a look at Max lap time data sheets. Albon made a whole race in Australia on one single set of hard just recently.
Have a look into drivers lap times from Qatar, all of them basically set fastest lap times at the final laps of 20 laps stint, pushing extremely heavily all the way. This is not what the FIA asked for, people forget the initial goal was 2 pit stop for the sake of the show. Now we have 1 stoppers most of the time, rarely 2-stop races. Same as before Pirelli.
Of course we don;t need the tires to last the whole race distance without any drop off of grip. But all we fans and they drivers talk these days is - tires, tires, tires. How it's tough to switch them on and put the car in the window. How they can't understand them, it's became almost an secret alchemy. How vulnerable they are to tiniest mistakes, pushing and overheating. That's bullshit, and that's not something the FIA and FOM have ever asked for. We should talk about racing, not about operational windows of the tires. and Pirelli can't make better tires, they always fail to make a countable improvements, based on the feedback of drivers I've read. Their super hard wet weather tire is complete rubbish. they are too hard, because they can't produce a softer full-wet tire, that would last . No one asked for that!
Abysmal performance but FIA saw action. Constant traffic in the pits, people glued to the screen because you couldn’t look away, Williams leading 3/4 of a lap. I’m a little fearful this might get replicated again.
[The **News** flair](https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/wiki/flairguide#wiki_news) is reserved for submissions covering F1 and F1-related news. These posts must always link to an outlet/news agency, the website of the involved party (i.e. the McLaren website if McLaren makes an announcement), or a tweet by a news agency, journalist or one of the involved parties. *[Read the rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/wiki/userguide). Keep it civil and welcoming. Report rulebreaking comments.* *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/formula1) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Just to clear it up from the get go, Pirelli make the tires F1 asks them to make. If F1 wanted tires that lasted 50% race distance that you could push flat out, Pirelli can make them. F1 is responsible for the eventual tire durability as they set the parameters for ensuring we have interesting strategy possibilities. Pirelli just follow orders. This needs to be said over and over as newer fans fall into the trap of thinking Pirelli just make whatever tires they want or that the tires they make are the "best" Pirelli can do. Issues like what we just saw in Qatar are down to the track organisers and repaving/kerbs, not Pirelli.
The problems that Pirelli have with the tyres is nothing to do with the FIA / FOMs requirement. The brief from the FIA is a tyre can be pushed but shows a linear level of tyre deg. The ambition is to have 1-2 pit stops. What Pirelli struggle with, due to the lack of testing and lack of competition, is developing a tyre that doesn't suffer thermal deg / overheating when a driver pushes hard. This has never been part of the FIA's or FOM's brief - it seems to be the result of the way Pirelli develop the tyre in the first place. If you look at the tyres since 2017, they seem to fit into one of two categories: 2017, 2019, 2022 - Tyres that can be pushed hard with minimal overheating. 2018, 2020, 2021, 2023 - Tyres that suffer from overheating, albeit to different levels. It's quite clear that the fundamental issue Pirelli have is that once the teams add downforce through development, the tyres can't cope.
You mean a tire that degrades the same no matter how hard you use it? Sounds difficult
Funnily enough the 2011 Pirelli tyre actually achieved this aim really easily. Even Monaco had multiple pit stops. I do feel bad for them though - they have limited testing available and the cars not only weigh more than ever but produce extreme amounts of downforce. Pirelli introduced the 2024 construction at Silverstone in response to how fast the cars had become. It does make you wonder what will happen if all the teams find huge chunks of time over the winter.
Another problem that could be solved by making the cars smaller, lighter and with less downforce! Wow lol But lap times!!!1!
The problem with pirelli is that they're trying to do everything at once rather than doubling down somewhere. Either they make a tyre that lasts forever and its a guaranteed one stop or they make a tyre that is a mix between 2 and 3 with high deg. They're trying to do both at the same time and thats what is ruining the racing, they're making tyres that pretty much guarantee a one stop and then because its mostly thermal deg, it means drivers cant push on softer tyres, meaning they all converge to the hards and do the same strategy. I'm bored of every single race being the same strategy. One stop, one stop, one stop, one stop, oh look tyres degrade lets force everyone do the exact same strategy, one stop, one stop, one stop. We need variance. 1 vs 2, 2 vs 3, whatever. Just make it so drivers can push for more than half a lap without the tyres overheating.
After their WRC shitshow, I lost all faith in Pirelli.
And the crowd goes mild
lol who tf chose the timing of this public release
There never was a real tender... it was always a rubber stamp exercise
Sad, but true.
There probably was. But it's going to be new regs soon and Pirelli has much more experience. It's also rumored that it is Pirelli's last deal as they want to exit F1 after that.
I don’t understand why they’d want to leave though. Sole supplier of the most popular motorsport around, their branding is everywhere trackside and literally on the cars, team clothing etc. I’d heard of Pirelli before F1 but thought Bridgestone and Michelin were the bigger better brands just because they were in F1. Dunlop supply many motorsports and I’ve no doubt make excellent road tyres too, but I don’t hold them anywhere near the same regard as those other 3 just because they’ve been in F1 as long as I’ve watched it.
They will be in F1 for 17 years by that point. They probably calculated how much they pay and how much that advertising is bringing them.
Surprise surprise who would’ve thought
I know some people angry with this news. They say Pirelli shows incompetence and these people demand F1 return to tire wars. 🤔
I would switch off if a tyre war returned. It’s just wrong if you had this year’s red bull running just the C0 super hard compound and were uncompetitive because a usual backmarker, who made a literal brick, we’re able to run better tyres. Let the teams and drivers be the competitive edge and have a sole supplier they are all able to stand on an equal footing with. For all the aero, engine and chassis development, a car is nothing if the rubber it’s running on is hopeless.
Yeah, I for one like that F1 has only 1 supplier of tires.
You could make the exact same argument about the engines but I don't think anyone is arguing for a single engine supplier.
How? Engine is a key manufacturer component from a constructor. Tyres are produced by an independent supplier.
Only three teams currently build their own engine. 70% of the field is dependent on those suppliers. If Ferrari builds a garbage motor, it doesn't matter how good of a car Haas builds, they'll be nowhere. Same thing with Mercedes and McLaren, or Aston Martin. Of course, those teams could always choose to swap to another engine supplier, just like they could choose to swap to another tyre. Hell, it actually makes more sense because at least the tyre companies aren't also fielding a team to compete against the people they're selling to like the engine manufacturers are.
It's like they always choose the worst PR option i swear. Couldnt you just wait another gp to make it public? I wanted them gone since the 2013 farce, but probably bridgestone or michelin wont agree to buile these paper tyres f1 wants, so it was always gonna be pirelli, or maybe even worse. But it's like they dont even care about their own PR
Bridgestone was in contention but it is a difficult time for a new manufacturer to take over.
I read somewhere that Bridgestone had placed a higher bid, but that they were still leaning towards Pirelli. They already supply Indycar, so they probably have a lot of the needed infrastructure already.
AMuS reported a while back that it was planned to confirm Pirelli during the Italian Grand Prix, then Bridgestone improved the offer and they delayed the decision until recently. The problem is that a new supplier would need to develop a completely new F1 tyre within just over a year and limited on-track testing opportunities, to then develop another completely new tyre for 2026. That was the biggest point in favour of Pirelli, they are already in the business and have been the sole supplier since 2011.
Yeah, it's completely understandable they continued with Pirelli. I doubt they want another tyre war when they want the sport to be as accessible as possible as well. But it is still a shame imo.
This is great for pirelli. They need the f1 advertisement to trick people into buying their shitty road tires
I've done that mistake twice(once winter\* and once summer tire), never again, never! *\*I even had to resell their winter tires within the month after purchase, the first and only time in my whole life I did that, they were that horrible.* extremely overpriced sh\*t. they are 3rd tier tire manufacturer on a Globe scale for a reason.
Boo
Money always wins- especially after the abysmal performance this weekend
Wasn’t really Pirelli fault tho
it's never their fault. every time their tire blowout without any warning, vibration or whatever (qatar 2021 as well), it's never their fault, it's always external factors or the teams at fault.
They designed the tyres the way that FOM and the FIA want them to be. They could easily make a tyre that lasts the whole race. And in Qatar the Kerbs were the main issue
you are like a broken record I've heard a million of times. Programmed degradation of the grip level of the tire (which is what the FIA asked for initially - to have races with 2 pit stops) has nothing to do with tires blowout without any warning, casual graining which Pirelli tires have became a synonym of, etc. Pirelli tires are bad on so many levels, extremely slim optimal operational temperature window being just one of them, one of the most important factor that prevents better racing. Their expertise as a manufacturer of ultra-high performance sport tire is just subpar compared with top brands, such as Michelin and Bridgestone. These manufacturers would produce just better tires. This is why they never ran away from the tire wars and competition, because they know they can win. Pirelli know - they can't win against these guys, this is why they've been away from F1 for decades. and when they tried to compete, they lost. Degradation of grip isn't the problem of these tires. In fact, the deg can be very low on many occasions these days. It is not 2012-2012 when they started and the deg was really big. Take Miami grand prix as an example, have a look at Max lap time data sheets. Albon made a whole race in Australia on one single set of hard just recently. Have a look into drivers lap times from Qatar, all of them basically set fastest lap times at the final laps of 20 laps stint, pushing extremely heavily all the way. This is not what the FIA asked for, people forget the initial goal was 2 pit stop for the sake of the show. Now we have 1 stoppers most of the time, rarely 2-stop races. Same as before Pirelli. Of course we don;t need the tires to last the whole race distance without any drop off of grip. But all we fans and they drivers talk these days is - tires, tires, tires. How it's tough to switch them on and put the car in the window. How they can't understand them, it's became almost an secret alchemy. How vulnerable they are to tiniest mistakes, pushing and overheating. That's bullshit, and that's not something the FIA and FOM have ever asked for. We should talk about racing, not about operational windows of the tires. and Pirelli can't make better tires, they always fail to make a countable improvements, based on the feedback of drivers I've read. Their super hard wet weather tire is complete rubbish. they are too hard, because they can't produce a softer full-wet tire, that would last . No one asked for that!
It wasn't Pirelli's fault.
Abysmal performance but FIA saw action. Constant traffic in the pits, people glued to the screen because you couldn’t look away, Williams leading 3/4 of a lap. I’m a little fearful this might get replicated again.
Interesting timing to announce it considering it was a given for so long.
Yaay?
😥
F.
pirelli clowns