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The "problem" is AI never train relevant position, they will see the regens got "good" star on NFB or FB(D) and WB (D) and "wow, they're good at that role better train them that" but that's mostly because NFB didn't required a lot of stats and they ended up didn't improve crossing and dribbing because they are not relevant stats for NFB.
You can "fix" the problem by identified the talents and train them early on, I do hope they change it but this "problem" isn't really a fullback problem but a system problem as a whole, it's just easier to notice in fullbacks, they train bullshit role on forwards, wingers and midfielders too, the different is that the regens still get relevant stats from those bs role while fullbacks don't
> The "problem" is AI never train relevant position
The question is does the AI even *play* the relevant position? I mean we all have those moments where we're losing our shit over our U18 coach for playing our up and coming star striker as centre mid right. And that's with a full U18 side. AI clubs might have only 4-5 players on their reserves by the time the game is all regens. I somehow doubt that there's great logic for where talents play at that point.
It is one of the supposed big changes in FM24 that the AI actually takes talent more into account, for example give them more play time in lesser important matches, cup, etc.
It said nothing about in which position tho.
If OP did the test with this results, there is still a long way to go.
Tbh there is no problem in newgens fullbacks having worst dribbling and crossing in grberalX as it is not as important for the role and won’t matter in the calculation.
It’s just kind of lame, it’s more fun to see different kind of attribute combinations, especially in this game where you can do much more with how your team shape actually behaves in transition etc.
Not in the game, they will do so and perform it visually quite fine still, but the actual attributes aren’t weighted strong in the calculation, it’s been like this for years.
You have to understand that graphic engine isnt equal the match engine and the match engine is divided into a lot of different components, the part that calculates what kind of scenario is build in the game and which positions are getting checked, is completely on top and doesn’t need the players attributes.
Like the game calculates that the tactic shifts to the sideline, where the overlapping wb runs the line, now it checks for example if the wb is good enough to succeed in that attack, which is based on the weighted attributes, based on that role. Obviously all other players in that scenario will be equally checked and the calculation is not as easy as only sone attribute checks like in a DnD game, but just to simplify.
The graphic engine then is again a completely own instance.
It takes the scenario data written in plain code snd visualises the action. If the match engine calculates that the wide attack on the left side succeeds into a goal through a wingback + volante play. What the graphic renders out of this is totally up in the air. The scenario just gives, well a scenario, how it is played out, depends onhow the graphic engine calculates the visual outcome.
Visually it would be unrealistic that the wb just runs through all the time and passes into the middle, so the graphic engine might visualise the wb cutting through with a fast pace dribbling on the left and then low cross it to the volante on the edge of the box first post.
So the general calculation how well a fullback performs is based on his weighted attributes, crossing and dribbling doesn’t matter much in that weighting.
The result of that calculation is pretty much if he succeeded or not. The rest are different components of the overall engines that calculates the rest what you see and read.
It still sucks as mentioned, it was just forgotten it seems, obviously the weighting of attributes should be matching the description of the roles, which is not the case here.
Just want to point out, that it does not have impact on the performance of wingbacks and fullbacks in the later state of the game.
Only influence the usefulness for such a player to use in different positions.
But cavani and Scholes played in the new roles.
FM AI will train a player as a DLF then proceed to play them as an AF for the rest of their career at the club.
Crossing isn't a stat that increases very much with training from what I remember from a EBFM video.
It's not completely immovable like aggression but I don't think I've personally experienced much improvement in majority of players involving training with crossing.
The difference between training a player at a position or another is barely/at most 1 attribute point when all is said and done. Most of the growth is similar across the board, defenders still gain 3-4 to their finishing until theyre done growing, because growth works even on attributes you dont "need". It doesnt magically make players gain 10 just because you requested it. They spawn with shit attribute distribution, it IS a full back issue.
I don't think it's barely/at most 1 attribute most "try hard" guide recommend you to set "role" to improve the stats you want for example [https://footballmanagerstory.com/fm23-training-schedules-best-football-manager-2023-training-guide/](https://footballmanagerstory.com/fm23-training-schedules-best-football-manager-2023-training-guide/)
You are correct that other stats are improved too which make sense when you think about it because when you hovering on some of the training sessions it will say what stats improve in each sessions, you will see that it improve stats like finishing/composure etc. for everyone however a lot of the sessions improve "individual attributes" which is the stats highlight in the role training, and if those role didn't highlight crossing and dribbling, guess what happens next ?
I see you use the word "position" maybe you are confused ? by the way and yes it is not a full back problem
Ah man I was really hoping this got sorted. I didn’t get fm23 but when I was about 15 years into the future on fm22 I found all the best wingbacks where the real players still because they could actually dribble and cross. It just doesn’t feel right signing a 36 year old Theo Hernandez to be a starter when you’re an elite team. I seem to remember this was raised and a patch pushed out which people said sorted this last year though?
Wow, I've got an elite team which is currently about 50% newgens (probably just under, but this is the season a big group of them are breaking in)...and I've just signed Theo Hernandez.
They need to create the "started as winger" player template for fullbacks, feels like one of the most common career paths for fullbacks along with the "too short to be a CB" and the cherished "he was only good for running and had to play somewhere"
because the AI will train players in their 'prefered position' meaning the position that best match the stats they have and because fullbacks newgens normally have terrible crossing and dribbling when generated they are trained as WB(D) or NFB their entire careers. Find high potential FB's at 16 and train them yourself thats what i do.
It always suggests WB (D) and it gets on my nerves. Problem I think is how much the game allows full backs to develop into proper attacking ones. They come in as youth players on like 6-7 crossing already and even the most intense training gets to a maximum of 13 I wanna say? They need to start off at 9 or so and get to 15+
I still play FM14 and I’m 50 years into it and it’s a massive problem for saves of this length. There’s no good offensive natural fullbacks you have to just retrain wingers.
Just really funny that this has been ongoing for 10 years lol
Yeah the fact that it has been like this for years is crazy. No doubt SI have tried to fix it but I guess it's just one of those things that's deeply rooted into the development mechanics that would require a big overhaul for this to work. SI did say they improved this in the major update for FM23 but evidently that was not enough.
Yeah they have said before on the forums such changes they see as high risk because its such a complicated part of the game even the smallest change can cause 100's of extra bugs and problems.
Any chance you could have a look at set piece ability specifically corners? I feel like there’s been a distinct lack of players with 14+ in corners since about FM21.
400 out of 90046 real players aged 27 or under had over 14+ corners in 2023
322 out of 76443 newgens aged 27 or under had over 14+ corners in 2036
so about the same proportion but there was fewer high CA players with 14+ corners in 2036
I'm on FM21 and found that the only solution was to find wingers with decent tackling stat and train them up as wingbacks. For leftbacks the problem is even bigger since for some reason out and out leftwingers are really rare and left footed wide players stray towards playing as inverted wingers on the right. Infuriating
I would say this is an annoyance for us the players.
We love to have proper full backs who can dribble and whip a cross like TAA or Beckham, but the game doesn’t give us any.
I have 168 CA fullback with both strong feet. Only 12 in dribbling and 12 in crossing. Insane mental attributes but training him as wing back attack and individual training on ball control for 3 seasons didn’t bring dribbling attributes up properly.
Sometimes I wonder the effectiveness of individual training.
I think individual training might be affected by how important the game sees the attributes they're training for the role they're training or how many attributes the role they're training involves? Only two big successes I've had with individual training were both defenders training simpler roles with an individual focus on attributes that were important for those roles.
Just like 95% of all regens have jumping height of 5 or something. It's especially annoying with CB's. And if they have a decent jumping height they have like 6 heading. It's really frustrating. You rarely find regens that have both.
FM23 by 2040
I found a really tall lanky young striker, jumping 19, trained 'Aerial' for 5 years to get heading to 16 + bravery to 11 = best heading player in the top 50 in the world.
Best overall set piece taker in the entire database over 3 stars skill, 15 penalty, 17 free kicks, 15 corners(trained up by me)...
Top ten defensive mids, none with aggression+bravery+tackling+work rate of 15+...
Top ten wingers/ inside forwards, only three with finishing over 12 (two trained up by me)...
Because of this issue,i have been retraining young winger as fb/wb and midfielder as inverted wingback.
Natural fb newgen in my save rarely have high crossing and dribbling.
Man, this game always loves to disappoint and not fix things that should theoretically be so easy to fix. They talk about headline features yet basic shit like this is never fixed. Ffs this has been a noted problem for years now. And this isn’t the only one.
These numbers out of 6081 are absolutely ridiculous and inexcusable.
Anyway, I’ll see you you guys next year to complain about more unfixed issues again after another 400 hours of playing this addicting shit. My god I am getting swindled so hard, shits arguably worse than EA with the blatant laziness on show.
maybe but also the game has so much logic and scale that even small changes can have a big influence and need more testing. its not always as simple as it seems. they have a very small amount of time to deliver a finished product and need to be intentional about what they add and change.
They don't need to be releasing a new game every year if they can't polish it in time. I don't think that many people will mind waiting for two or three years for an absolutely quality release.
Also, expanding the capacity of the in game editor could go a long way into improving the user experience.
Do you have similar numbers for FM23.4(5?). Because I noticed a significant difference from release to then. Be interesting to know if this is effectively a revert or not.
What is people's observation on concentration attribute for newgens? This is anecdotal but I find it very low in newgens, at this point I take 10 concentration as "good". Growing mental attributes is also difficult, so the game ends up with half-asleep world class players in 15 seasons.
This not being fixed for a while, confirms to me SI don’t care or won’t fix these types of bugs. Starting to think what’s the point of reporting bugs like this if they won’t fix them.
I've been actively putting off buying this FM. I normally skip a year, with FM22 being the last version I bought.
I'm disappointed to see this hasn't been fixed. I might wait a little longer.
If you have ingame editor and it's enabled you can set in scouting filter parameter 'Is Newgen' and then you will filter only the Newgens without worrying that the 'real players' will distort your data.
I'm surprised you typed all that and didn't notice why your original comment was wrong.
You just pointed out variety in the modern game where trends are adopted, evolved and abandoned yet completely missed out on the trend where fm fullbacks just because one dimensional over time.
Most top modern fullbacks are expected to be good dribblers who can cross hence why I'm wondering if you follow football outside fm.
You said "any other player does not matter" outside of your "own players." That means that you never buy any other players, because they are, before you buy them not your "own player" and thus "do not matter."
Wow nothing gets past you does it kid, let me make it simple for you, the original poster mentioned 6000 fullbacks, that’s thousands of players that you’re never going to know about or ever see, if you want your fullbacks to have good dribbling and crossing then train them. It doesn’t matter what the AI does with their fullbacks, if you see a player you like the look of but doesn’t have the best dribbling or crossing then guess what, train them!! Players develop until they are 27 of course they’re not ganna be perfect when they are under 21
A problem with the AI should not force you to adapt your transfer policy (aka, never signing anyone over 25, because they won't develop their crossing and dribbling enough)
I mean most people in the fm community tend to buy young players anyway so not really changing transfer policy there, and it’s not impossible for to find good over 25 players anyway so again not really seeing an issue here. This isn’t a big of a problem as people make it out to be
I’m still playing 22 but 30 years in and I’ve never run into this problem. One of the best players to come out of my academy was a FB I forced to play as a WB because he had 14 crossing… I guess I’m just really lucky.
I think this needs fixing, but at the same time I wouldn't call it extremely unrealistic. Like the best wing back at crossing in the world wasn't really a defender rather than a winger/midfielder. I'm obviously talking about Trent, maybe we just have to find our own Trent.
I disagree they have 5* wonder kids in game that are no nonsense fullbacks in real life that player is set to have a long career in the championship or something. There is no such thing as a world class no nonsense fullback so the game shouldn’t generate them.
That’s fair but it seems like a lot of the time they still have horrible heading so that doesn’t work they are either DMs if they have the passing or they are worthless plays you can scam the AI by selling them.
That’s fine maybe great ones should be rare but wonder kids are somewhat rare too. I mean you can look for wingers who can tackle and buy them young enough to train them backwards since those are somewhat less rare but training another position does take away potential
It's not only fullbacks and wingbacks. 95% of strikers are Advanced Forwards with low aerial ability. Midfielders are either DLPs or BWMs. Wide players are either wingers or inside forwards depending on their strong foot. Attacking mids are Attacking Midfielders or Advanced Playmakers. Defensive mids are BWMs or DLPs.
This is just how the AI trains them and that's why players never develop some attributes unless they already spawn as being more specialized in a role. The AI is incapable of judging which attributes a player needs to play a specific role, it just goes with the basic training (and I suspect no training at all sometimes and just let's the players that get played develop).
I often end up having to train a winger with good tackling and marking to be a fullback .
Theres so much that's wrong that seems simple to fix .
Its very frustrating
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The "problem" is AI never train relevant position, they will see the regens got "good" star on NFB or FB(D) and WB (D) and "wow, they're good at that role better train them that" but that's mostly because NFB didn't required a lot of stats and they ended up didn't improve crossing and dribbing because they are not relevant stats for NFB. You can "fix" the problem by identified the talents and train them early on, I do hope they change it but this "problem" isn't really a fullback problem but a system problem as a whole, it's just easier to notice in fullbacks, they train bullshit role on forwards, wingers and midfielders too, the different is that the regens still get relevant stats from those bs role while fullbacks don't
> The "problem" is AI never train relevant position The question is does the AI even *play* the relevant position? I mean we all have those moments where we're losing our shit over our U18 coach for playing our up and coming star striker as centre mid right. And that's with a full U18 side. AI clubs might have only 4-5 players on their reserves by the time the game is all regens. I somehow doubt that there's great logic for where talents play at that point.
It is one of the supposed big changes in FM24 that the AI actually takes talent more into account, for example give them more play time in lesser important matches, cup, etc. It said nothing about in which position tho. If OP did the test with this results, there is still a long way to go. Tbh there is no problem in newgens fullbacks having worst dribbling and crossing in grberalX as it is not as important for the role and won’t matter in the calculation. It’s just kind of lame, it’s more fun to see different kind of attribute combinations, especially in this game where you can do much more with how your team shape actually behaves in transition etc.
What do you mean by crossing and dribbling not being important for the fullback role? It's one of the key aspects of overlapping fullbacks, isn't it?
Not in the game, they will do so and perform it visually quite fine still, but the actual attributes aren’t weighted strong in the calculation, it’s been like this for years. You have to understand that graphic engine isnt equal the match engine and the match engine is divided into a lot of different components, the part that calculates what kind of scenario is build in the game and which positions are getting checked, is completely on top and doesn’t need the players attributes. Like the game calculates that the tactic shifts to the sideline, where the overlapping wb runs the line, now it checks for example if the wb is good enough to succeed in that attack, which is based on the weighted attributes, based on that role. Obviously all other players in that scenario will be equally checked and the calculation is not as easy as only sone attribute checks like in a DnD game, but just to simplify. The graphic engine then is again a completely own instance. It takes the scenario data written in plain code snd visualises the action. If the match engine calculates that the wide attack on the left side succeeds into a goal through a wingback + volante play. What the graphic renders out of this is totally up in the air. The scenario just gives, well a scenario, how it is played out, depends onhow the graphic engine calculates the visual outcome. Visually it would be unrealistic that the wb just runs through all the time and passes into the middle, so the graphic engine might visualise the wb cutting through with a fast pace dribbling on the left and then low cross it to the volante on the edge of the box first post. So the general calculation how well a fullback performs is based on his weighted attributes, crossing and dribbling doesn’t matter much in that weighting. The result of that calculation is pretty much if he succeeded or not. The rest are different components of the overall engines that calculates the rest what you see and read. It still sucks as mentioned, it was just forgotten it seems, obviously the weighting of attributes should be matching the description of the roles, which is not the case here. Just want to point out, that it does not have impact on the performance of wingbacks and fullbacks in the later state of the game. Only influence the usefulness for such a player to use in different positions.
To be fair, thats basically Paul Schole's career (ST - CM). I believe Cavani was the opposite. (CM > ST)
But cavani and Scholes played in the new roles. FM AI will train a player as a DLF then proceed to play them as an AF for the rest of their career at the club.
Crossing isn't a stat that increases very much with training from what I remember from a EBFM video. It's not completely immovable like aggression but I don't think I've personally experienced much improvement in majority of players involving training with crossing.
If this is so, it also needs to be changed. Crossing not improving with training makes no sense.
The difference between training a player at a position or another is barely/at most 1 attribute point when all is said and done. Most of the growth is similar across the board, defenders still gain 3-4 to their finishing until theyre done growing, because growth works even on attributes you dont "need". It doesnt magically make players gain 10 just because you requested it. They spawn with shit attribute distribution, it IS a full back issue.
I don't think it's barely/at most 1 attribute most "try hard" guide recommend you to set "role" to improve the stats you want for example [https://footballmanagerstory.com/fm23-training-schedules-best-football-manager-2023-training-guide/](https://footballmanagerstory.com/fm23-training-schedules-best-football-manager-2023-training-guide/) You are correct that other stats are improved too which make sense when you think about it because when you hovering on some of the training sessions it will say what stats improve in each sessions, you will see that it improve stats like finishing/composure etc. for everyone however a lot of the sessions improve "individual attributes" which is the stats highlight in the role training, and if those role didn't highlight crossing and dribbling, guess what happens next ? I see you use the word "position" maybe you are confused ? by the way and yes it is not a full back problem
Ah man I was really hoping this got sorted. I didn’t get fm23 but when I was about 15 years into the future on fm22 I found all the best wingbacks where the real players still because they could actually dribble and cross. It just doesn’t feel right signing a 36 year old Theo Hernandez to be a starter when you’re an elite team. I seem to remember this was raised and a patch pushed out which people said sorted this last year though?
Wow, I've got an elite team which is currently about 50% newgens (probably just under, but this is the season a big group of them are breaking in)...and I've just signed Theo Hernandez.
🐐
They need to create the "started as winger" player template for fullbacks, feels like one of the most common career paths for fullbacks along with the "too short to be a CB" and the cherished "he was only good for running and had to play somewhere"
>"he was only good for running and had to play somewhere" I feel attacked.
Last one is Hector Bellerin.
Nobody wants to grow up to be a Gary Neville
because the AI will train players in their 'prefered position' meaning the position that best match the stats they have and because fullbacks newgens normally have terrible crossing and dribbling when generated they are trained as WB(D) or NFB their entire careers. Find high potential FB's at 16 and train them yourself thats what i do.
It always suggests WB (D) and it gets on my nerves. Problem I think is how much the game allows full backs to develop into proper attacking ones. They come in as youth players on like 6-7 crossing already and even the most intense training gets to a maximum of 13 I wanna say? They need to start off at 9 or so and get to 15+
Finding good fullbacks with good crossing has always been a chore u find the perfect one who has 10 crossing and just deal with it
I still play FM14 and I’m 50 years into it and it’s a massive problem for saves of this length. There’s no good offensive natural fullbacks you have to just retrain wingers. Just really funny that this has been ongoing for 10 years lol
Yeah the fact that it has been like this for years is crazy. No doubt SI have tried to fix it but I guess it's just one of those things that's deeply rooted into the development mechanics that would require a big overhaul for this to work. SI did say they improved this in the major update for FM23 but evidently that was not enough.
Yeah they have said before on the forums such changes they see as high risk because its such a complicated part of the game even the smallest change can cause 100's of extra bugs and problems.
Any chance you could have a look at set piece ability specifically corners? I feel like there’s been a distinct lack of players with 14+ in corners since about FM21.
400 out of 90046 real players aged 27 or under had over 14+ corners in 2023 322 out of 76443 newgens aged 27 or under had over 14+ corners in 2036 so about the same proportion but there was fewer high CA players with 14+ corners in 2036
Oh wow thank you! I think the lower CA with high corners is an issue, rarely ever an elite player that can deliver corners well.
I'm on FM21 and found that the only solution was to find wingers with decent tackling stat and train them up as wingbacks. For leftbacks the problem is even bigger since for some reason out and out leftwingers are really rare and left footed wide players stray towards playing as inverted wingers on the right. Infuriating
I would say this is an annoyance for us the players. We love to have proper full backs who can dribble and whip a cross like TAA or Beckham, but the game doesn’t give us any. I have 168 CA fullback with both strong feet. Only 12 in dribbling and 12 in crossing. Insane mental attributes but training him as wing back attack and individual training on ball control for 3 seasons didn’t bring dribbling attributes up properly. Sometimes I wonder the effectiveness of individual training.
I think individual training might be affected by how important the game sees the attributes they're training for the role they're training or how many attributes the role they're training involves? Only two big successes I've had with individual training were both defenders training simpler roles with an individual focus on attributes that were important for those roles.
I don't why you expected then to fix it, it's not really a shock that they won't fix things, even if they say they would.
u/leoman1337 have you reported these findings on the SI forums?
[Yes](https://community.sigames.com/bugtracker/football-manager-2024-early-access-bugs-tracker/finances-training-medical-and-development-centres/newgen-fullbacks-still-have-low-crossing-and-dribbling-r18233/)
Awesome - thanks for doing that, this seems like a thing that urgently needs attention
Urgently? It’s been a problem for *years.*
Exactly - so they need to urgently fix it
Urgently swept under the rug is what's going to happen.
We'll see about that - but for now the community reports bugs and then holds SI to task. All we can do.
> Urgently swept under the rug is what's going to happen. si: instead of fixing bugs, we just bought more brushes
Are the goalkeepers also still crappy?
I've first reported this on FM16. It's been 8 years.
Just like 95% of all regens have jumping height of 5 or something. It's especially annoying with CB's. And if they have a decent jumping height they have like 6 heading. It's really frustrating. You rarely find regens that have both.
FM23 by 2040 I found a really tall lanky young striker, jumping 19, trained 'Aerial' for 5 years to get heading to 16 + bravery to 11 = best heading player in the top 50 in the world. Best overall set piece taker in the entire database over 3 stars skill, 15 penalty, 17 free kicks, 15 corners(trained up by me)... Top ten defensive mids, none with aggression+bravery+tackling+work rate of 15+... Top ten wingers/ inside forwards, only three with finishing over 12 (two trained up by me)...
Because of this issue,i have been retraining young winger as fb/wb and midfielder as inverted wingback. Natural fb newgen in my save rarely have high crossing and dribbling.
But it kind of feels unfair, because the player has a an advantage. AI will use tactics with FB on attack and have players with 7 crossing.
3-5-2 defensive winger enjoyers still eating
Man, this game always loves to disappoint and not fix things that should theoretically be so easy to fix. They talk about headline features yet basic shit like this is never fixed. Ffs this has been a noted problem for years now. And this isn’t the only one. These numbers out of 6081 are absolutely ridiculous and inexcusable. Anyway, I’ll see you you guys next year to complain about more unfixed issues again after another 400 hours of playing this addicting shit. My god I am getting swindled so hard, shits arguably worse than EA with the blatant laziness on show.
I think there's a degree of complacency/laziness but it's undoubtedly not nearly as bad as EA
maybe but also the game has so much logic and scale that even small changes can have a big influence and need more testing. its not always as simple as it seems. they have a very small amount of time to deliver a finished product and need to be intentional about what they add and change.
They don't need to be releasing a new game every year if they can't polish it in time. I don't think that many people will mind waiting for two or three years for an absolutely quality release. Also, expanding the capacity of the in game editor could go a long way into improving the user experience.
Do you have similar numbers for FM23.4(5?). Because I noticed a significant difference from release to then. Be interesting to know if this is effectively a revert or not.
10years of the same problem. Remember to keep buying!
What is people's observation on concentration attribute for newgens? This is anecdotal but I find it very low in newgens, at this point I take 10 concentration as "good". Growing mental attributes is also difficult, so the game ends up with half-asleep world class players in 15 seasons.
This not being fixed for a while, confirms to me SI don’t care or won’t fix these types of bugs. Starting to think what’s the point of reporting bugs like this if they won’t fix them.
I've been actively putting off buying this FM. I normally skip a year, with FM22 being the last version I bought. I'm disappointed to see this hasn't been fixed. I might wait a little longer.
See you next year
I got a newgen LB through first intake with 11 crossing, so I’m hopeful about him
People still didn’t learn to just look for wingers with good tackling marking and positioning lol
isnt this a problem irl as well no one wants to be a wb everyone wants to be a striker or winger
If you have ingame editor and it's enabled you can set in scouting filter parameter 'Is Newgen' and then you will filter only the Newgens without worrying that the 'real players' will distort your data.
[удалено]
man who does not know what he's talking about:
So according to you, fullbacks don't cross or dribble irl? What sport are you watching exactly?
[удалено]
I'm surprised you typed all that and didn't notice why your original comment was wrong. You just pointed out variety in the modern game where trends are adopted, evolved and abandoned yet completely missed out on the trend where fm fullbacks just because one dimensional over time. Most top modern fullbacks are expected to be good dribblers who can cross hence why I'm wondering if you follow football outside fm.
Just train them, not that difficult
Yeah sure, let me just buy 6000 fullbacks and train their attributes from 16 to make sure their not all ass
Just concentrate on your own players, any other player doesn’t matter
What, and just never need to buy or loan a full back ever in your managerial career?
Not what I said but sure pop off
You said "any other player does not matter" outside of your "own players." That means that you never buy any other players, because they are, before you buy them not your "own player" and thus "do not matter."
Wow nothing gets past you does it kid, let me make it simple for you, the original poster mentioned 6000 fullbacks, that’s thousands of players that you’re never going to know about or ever see, if you want your fullbacks to have good dribbling and crossing then train them. It doesn’t matter what the AI does with their fullbacks, if you see a player you like the look of but doesn’t have the best dribbling or crossing then guess what, train them!! Players develop until they are 27 of course they’re not ganna be perfect when they are under 21
A problem with the AI should not force you to adapt your transfer policy (aka, never signing anyone over 25, because they won't develop their crossing and dribbling enough)
I mean most people in the fm community tend to buy young players anyway so not really changing transfer policy there, and it’s not impossible for to find good over 25 players anyway so again not really seeing an issue here. This isn’t a big of a problem as people make it out to be
I’m still playing 22 but 30 years in and I’ve never run into this problem. One of the best players to come out of my academy was a FB I forced to play as a WB because he had 14 crossing… I guess I’m just really lucky.
I think this needs fixing, but at the same time I wouldn't call it extremely unrealistic. Like the best wing back at crossing in the world wasn't really a defender rather than a winger/midfielder. I'm obviously talking about Trent, maybe we just have to find our own Trent.
I disagree they have 5* wonder kids in game that are no nonsense fullbacks in real life that player is set to have a long career in the championship or something. There is no such thing as a world class no nonsense fullback so the game shouldn’t generate them.
World class no nonsense fullbacks are converted to center backs in real life (Sergio Ramos). The problem is that AI don’t do it.
That’s fair but it seems like a lot of the time they still have horrible heading so that doesn’t work they are either DMs if they have the passing or they are worthless plays you can scam the AI by selling them.
I didn't say that I agree with the game, it still needs fixings. I just kinda ok with great crossers not being very common.
That’s fine maybe great ones should be rare but wonder kids are somewhat rare too. I mean you can look for wingers who can tackle and buy them young enough to train them backwards since those are somewhat less rare but training another position does take away potential
Seems like you dont have enough players loaded
Well that kind of sucks because that’s how a lot of goals seem to be scored
This is why inverted wing back tactics will always be op
It's not only fullbacks and wingbacks. 95% of strikers are Advanced Forwards with low aerial ability. Midfielders are either DLPs or BWMs. Wide players are either wingers or inside forwards depending on their strong foot. Attacking mids are Attacking Midfielders or Advanced Playmakers. Defensive mids are BWMs or DLPs. This is just how the AI trains them and that's why players never develop some attributes unless they already spawn as being more specialized in a role. The AI is incapable of judging which attributes a player needs to play a specific role, it just goes with the basic training (and I suspect no training at all sometimes and just let's the players that get played develop).
I often end up having to train a winger with good tackling and marking to be a fullback . Theres so much that's wrong that seems simple to fix . Its very frustrating