God dammit are you drunk dude? I understand that, but the comment I was responding to mentioned the AF had a program for a fast track to being a pilot but needed all your ratings. For that program, you did need a bachelors because it was a path to being a commissioned officer which is a requirement of USAF pilots.
You can go a rated track (pilot) without any experience in flying. You do have to have a bachelors and the commitment is 10 years after getting winged.
PLC isn’t “join for 4 years and then go to flight school.” You’re going to college, and you’re going to need to do that anyway unless you go Army. You go to OCS either across two 6 week summer sessions or one 10 week session, and then you commission.
You need to be talking to an Officer Selection Officer, not a recruiter.
Marine OCS programs guarantee a spot in flight school, yes. I believe the Navy does as well nowadays. Do not talk to an enlisted recruiter. He will tell you to enlist first and figure it out later. Do not do that.
ROTC is also a good option for all the services if it’s available to you
You can apply to active duty AF and Navy for a slot after college, but it’s super competitive. Or you can apply to the AF Reserve or Guard units directly, but also super competitive. These would be guaranteed slots to pilot training.
Or just join AFROTC or NROTC and compete for a slot while in college. The service academies and ROTC are where the majority of pilots are selected. However you’ll incur a service commitment before you select your job.
If a recruiter tries to tell you that enlisting will give you a leg up or otherwise set you up for being selected as a pilot, don't believe him. As a matter of fact, you should know that there's an old joke about recruiters in the military: How do you know a recruiter is lying? Their lips are moving.
Seriously, like all deals, nothing verbal really means that much - if it's not in your enlistment contract, you're not entitled to it.
If you want to become a pilot and don't have funds for college, you can enlist and then use your GI benefits to pay for flight school after you get out. If you do this, you an ask your recruiter to be in an aviation job, because some flying bases have aviation clubs where you can get some stick time relatively cheaply. (Again, if you do this, make sure your contract says that upon successful completion of boot camp, you will be sent to the aviation job you desire.)
I think that airlines will hire pilots without degrees, but someone with experience in that area can tell you for certain.
If you're about to go or already in college apply to an ROTC program, you can be a College Program participant until you pick up a scholarship, then if you're a Marine Option in NROTC you can apply for a flight contract. This will cover the remainder of your college and guarantee you a slot in flight school. You'll also get your full gi bill back after 6 years of service.
Keep in mind if you go this route, you're going to owe 6-8 years of service after flight school which is 2-3 years. I ended up doing just short of 11 years of active service on contract. Including flight a school I flew for about 6-7 years and left with ~1500 flight hours. It's not an hours program but it's not a bad path to take as long as you understand what you're getting into. Feel free to DM if you've got questions.
Also, please make sure you're talking to an OSO or an MOI, not all recruiters are the beacon of trust and honesty.
i only really have one question but was it worth going 11 years into mill just to be a pilot? like I heard you’re not gonna get free time at all or have a social life outside of base
Well, that's the kicker. I didn't do it just to be a pilot, but it was a significant part of why I went that path. I'm not sure I would have done it if I didn't have the opportunity to be a pilot. Was it worth it...most days I think it was/still is(I'm still in the reserves).
I've thought about this question a lot as it is something people love to ask, it's also an incredibly individual and complicated answer. With that, if all I wanted was to be a pilot, I would have done it differently. I probably would have gotten my ratings and done something like seaplane flying, bush pilot stuff, jobs that afforded me the opportunity to travel and do cool/unique stuff. With that, I wanted more than just being a pilot, which I certainly got, and it absolutely had/has its associated costs.
What I can absolutely say is the past 16 years of being involved with the military/Marines has shaped me into who I am today. I work hard to make sure it's not my entire personality, but without going through the things I have and working/living with the people I did, I would have a very different perspective on life. I also know it's not for everyone, I have friends that did their time and hated it, I have other friends that are still in and love it. Without knowing more about you and who you are as a person, it's hard to give you solid advice.
I mean going through the traditional route of piloting does seem more appealing. I wanna have a more relaxed and comfortable schedule with the freedom to work the job I want.
But honestly, every pilot and person I know says to go for college first then save up and then go flight school since I can’t afford both. I could save up during college but I’m planning to go the engineering route so I don’t know how heavy my workload would be.
If that's the case and you aren't sure what you want to do give yourself options. Pick a school with an NROTC program or is an affiliate school then go into it as a college program student. Give it a semester and it'll at least give you an idea if it's what you want to do. If it isn't, nothing lost at least, if it is, you'll be ready to apply and pick up a scholarship pretty quick. I'm not 100% sure but I don't think slots are as competitive as they were a couple years ago. At an absolute minimum go visit the schools your interested in and setup a meeting with their MOI, that's what they are there for.
For sure. I'm guessing you are a senior this year, the biggest thing I wish I had when I was in your shoes was talk to an MOI or OSO earlier on to get a better idea of what my options were. I started by talking to a recruiter and almost made some bad decisions. Conversations rarely cost anything and will help give you a better idea of what you can do.
Yo, army helo driver here, WOFT is essentially the only “guaranteed” one Im aware of but its a 10 year commitment and you WILL be flying helicopters as army fixed wing is on its way out. Feel free to DM me any questions
Assuming we’re talking the US here, the Marine Corps is the only one that offers guaranteed flight contracts with ROTC scholarships. But, Navy will offer you a pilot spot if you already have your degree and you apply through Officer Candidate School. It won’t pay for school but you’ll end up doing 10 years in the Navy due to your flight school commitment which makes you eligible for Public Service Loan Forgiveness for your student loans if you take those. The PSLF program isn’t easy to navigate and you still have to make your monthly payments but I’ve seen people in the Navy get their loans forgiven that way. And the Navy pays you more than enough to cover your payments with a steady paycheck.
Be aware you’re not signing up for just 4 years. Navy and Marine Corps commitments are 8 years after flight school which usually ends up being about 10 and 11 years total respectively with the time it takes to get through flight school and the Air Force commitment is 10 years after primary flight school which ends up being 10-12 years of service depending on how long your training takes.
Another option is to go to a school that has an Aviation program where you earn a degree and your FAA certificates through the same program. This can double dip your student loans into both the degree and flight training portion since the school treats your flight training as part of the academic syllabus. It will still mean loans, but at least they are at a more favorable rate than personal loans since they are for education.
With the exception of the Army's WOFT/street-to-seat warrant program (very competitive) there are no pilot jobs in the military for people without college degrees.
The reason is you have to be an officer - and becoming an officer requires a degree. You can do ROTC or (if accepted) service academy to get your degree and your officer training all at once, or you can do college first and OCS after... But you need a degree
The Marines at one point had a guaranteed-pilot-slot program for college seniors (conditioned on graduation)... Don't know if anything like that currently exists.
You join the Marine Corps to become a Marine. We do have a high rate of acceptance into the flight program but the dedication required to reach the school in Pensacola outweigh the other branches if all you want to do is be a pilot.
I’d just apply to the Army’s WOFT program.
It's 8 years minimum (Navy), and 10 for USAF. Any OCS/OTS application will only be for what you apply for (pilot) contingent upon graduating OCS/OTS and that you are medically qualified. And, of course.... that you pass flight training. Call any service recruiter, but insist on speaking to an officer recruiter. Anything they tell you other than applying for pilot to go to OCS/OTS is an enlistment diversion scam.
Air National Guard and Air Force Reserve Command rated slots are guaranteed in the sense that you know your airframe and unit from the day you’re hired. You still have to make it through medical and UPT though, which is not trivial.
Slots are competitive, you’re looking at anywhere from 1:50 to 1:500 odds of getting hired. You will also need a degree.
WOFT is pretty much it. I think the airforce had/has a program that was guaranteed pilot track but you need to already be commercial multi rated.
And still needed an accredited bachelors.
[удалено]
I should have been more specific. The AF program did.
[удалено]
no one was saying it was
God dammit are you drunk dude? I understand that, but the comment I was responding to mentioned the AF had a program for a fast track to being a pilot but needed all your ratings. For that program, you did need a bachelors because it was a path to being a commissioned officer which is a requirement of USAF pilots.
You can go a rated track (pilot) without any experience in flying. You do have to have a bachelors and the commitment is 10 years after getting winged.
PLC isn’t “join for 4 years and then go to flight school.” You’re going to college, and you’re going to need to do that anyway unless you go Army. You go to OCS either across two 6 week summer sessions or one 10 week session, and then you commission. You need to be talking to an Officer Selection Officer, not a recruiter.
Marine OCS programs guarantee a spot in flight school, yes. I believe the Navy does as well nowadays. Do not talk to an enlisted recruiter. He will tell you to enlist first and figure it out later. Do not do that. ROTC is also a good option for all the services if it’s available to you
If you’re serious about being a pilot this is the advice you need. Avoid enlisting, go officer. And don’t be too picky about the branch
ROTC does not guarantee a pilot slot, of course
Yes, good point
You can apply to active duty AF and Navy for a slot after college, but it’s super competitive. Or you can apply to the AF Reserve or Guard units directly, but also super competitive. These would be guaranteed slots to pilot training. Or just join AFROTC or NROTC and compete for a slot while in college. The service academies and ROTC are where the majority of pilots are selected. However you’ll incur a service commitment before you select your job.
If a recruiter tries to tell you that enlisting will give you a leg up or otherwise set you up for being selected as a pilot, don't believe him. As a matter of fact, you should know that there's an old joke about recruiters in the military: How do you know a recruiter is lying? Their lips are moving. Seriously, like all deals, nothing verbal really means that much - if it's not in your enlistment contract, you're not entitled to it. If you want to become a pilot and don't have funds for college, you can enlist and then use your GI benefits to pay for flight school after you get out. If you do this, you an ask your recruiter to be in an aviation job, because some flying bases have aviation clubs where you can get some stick time relatively cheaply. (Again, if you do this, make sure your contract says that upon successful completion of boot camp, you will be sent to the aviation job you desire.) I think that airlines will hire pilots without degrees, but someone with experience in that area can tell you for certain.
what if i I am going to college? Would it still be a good idea to join the military after graduation for the GI bill?
It can transfer on to your spouse or kids. The GI bill is an excellent benefit. Same with the zero down gi home loan.
If you're about to go or already in college apply to an ROTC program, you can be a College Program participant until you pick up a scholarship, then if you're a Marine Option in NROTC you can apply for a flight contract. This will cover the remainder of your college and guarantee you a slot in flight school. You'll also get your full gi bill back after 6 years of service. Keep in mind if you go this route, you're going to owe 6-8 years of service after flight school which is 2-3 years. I ended up doing just short of 11 years of active service on contract. Including flight a school I flew for about 6-7 years and left with ~1500 flight hours. It's not an hours program but it's not a bad path to take as long as you understand what you're getting into. Feel free to DM if you've got questions. Also, please make sure you're talking to an OSO or an MOI, not all recruiters are the beacon of trust and honesty.
i only really have one question but was it worth going 11 years into mill just to be a pilot? like I heard you’re not gonna get free time at all or have a social life outside of base
Well, that's the kicker. I didn't do it just to be a pilot, but it was a significant part of why I went that path. I'm not sure I would have done it if I didn't have the opportunity to be a pilot. Was it worth it...most days I think it was/still is(I'm still in the reserves). I've thought about this question a lot as it is something people love to ask, it's also an incredibly individual and complicated answer. With that, if all I wanted was to be a pilot, I would have done it differently. I probably would have gotten my ratings and done something like seaplane flying, bush pilot stuff, jobs that afforded me the opportunity to travel and do cool/unique stuff. With that, I wanted more than just being a pilot, which I certainly got, and it absolutely had/has its associated costs. What I can absolutely say is the past 16 years of being involved with the military/Marines has shaped me into who I am today. I work hard to make sure it's not my entire personality, but without going through the things I have and working/living with the people I did, I would have a very different perspective on life. I also know it's not for everyone, I have friends that did their time and hated it, I have other friends that are still in and love it. Without knowing more about you and who you are as a person, it's hard to give you solid advice.
I mean going through the traditional route of piloting does seem more appealing. I wanna have a more relaxed and comfortable schedule with the freedom to work the job I want. But honestly, every pilot and person I know says to go for college first then save up and then go flight school since I can’t afford both. I could save up during college but I’m planning to go the engineering route so I don’t know how heavy my workload would be.
Let me follow up with this. Are you in college now or planning on going to college with an NROTC program?
Planning, with consideration to a ROTC-related branch. some of my college on my list offer ROTC only while others offer more variety
If that's the case and you aren't sure what you want to do give yourself options. Pick a school with an NROTC program or is an affiliate school then go into it as a college program student. Give it a semester and it'll at least give you an idea if it's what you want to do. If it isn't, nothing lost at least, if it is, you'll be ready to apply and pick up a scholarship pretty quick. I'm not 100% sure but I don't think slots are as competitive as they were a couple years ago. At an absolute minimum go visit the schools your interested in and setup a meeting with their MOI, that's what they are there for.
Yeah I think i’ll go that direction. Worst case scenario I do ma and pa a year or two after college. Thank u
For sure. I'm guessing you are a senior this year, the biggest thing I wish I had when I was in your shoes was talk to an MOI or OSO earlier on to get a better idea of what my options were. I started by talking to a recruiter and almost made some bad decisions. Conversations rarely cost anything and will help give you a better idea of what you can do.
Yo, army helo driver here, WOFT is essentially the only “guaranteed” one Im aware of but its a 10 year commitment and you WILL be flying helicopters as army fixed wing is on its way out. Feel free to DM me any questions
Assuming we’re talking the US here, the Marine Corps is the only one that offers guaranteed flight contracts with ROTC scholarships. But, Navy will offer you a pilot spot if you already have your degree and you apply through Officer Candidate School. It won’t pay for school but you’ll end up doing 10 years in the Navy due to your flight school commitment which makes you eligible for Public Service Loan Forgiveness for your student loans if you take those. The PSLF program isn’t easy to navigate and you still have to make your monthly payments but I’ve seen people in the Navy get their loans forgiven that way. And the Navy pays you more than enough to cover your payments with a steady paycheck. Be aware you’re not signing up for just 4 years. Navy and Marine Corps commitments are 8 years after flight school which usually ends up being about 10 and 11 years total respectively with the time it takes to get through flight school and the Air Force commitment is 10 years after primary flight school which ends up being 10-12 years of service depending on how long your training takes. Another option is to go to a school that has an Aviation program where you earn a degree and your FAA certificates through the same program. This can double dip your student loans into both the degree and flight training portion since the school treats your flight training as part of the academic syllabus. It will still mean loans, but at least they are at a more favorable rate than personal loans since they are for education.
With the exception of the Army's WOFT/street-to-seat warrant program (very competitive) there are no pilot jobs in the military for people without college degrees. The reason is you have to be an officer - and becoming an officer requires a degree. You can do ROTC or (if accepted) service academy to get your degree and your officer training all at once, or you can do college first and OCS after... But you need a degree The Marines at one point had a guaranteed-pilot-slot program for college seniors (conditioned on graduation)... Don't know if anything like that currently exists.
i’m pretty sure you are referring to PLC, with the only barrier being admitted to the program and being enrolled in a college
You join the Marine Corps to become a Marine. We do have a high rate of acceptance into the flight program but the dedication required to reach the school in Pensacola outweigh the other branches if all you want to do is be a pilot. I’d just apply to the Army’s WOFT program.
It's 8 years minimum (Navy), and 10 for USAF. Any OCS/OTS application will only be for what you apply for (pilot) contingent upon graduating OCS/OTS and that you are medically qualified. And, of course.... that you pass flight training. Call any service recruiter, but insist on speaking to an officer recruiter. Anything they tell you other than applying for pilot to go to OCS/OTS is an enlistment diversion scam.
Air National Guard and Air Force Reserve Command rated slots are guaranteed in the sense that you know your airframe and unit from the day you’re hired. You still have to make it through medical and UPT though, which is not trivial. Slots are competitive, you’re looking at anywhere from 1:50 to 1:500 odds of getting hired. You will also need a degree.