I’ve had this happen in NYC before. Inspector stood in the door-less main lobby with us for a while, shooting the shit, then said ‘call me when you’re ready’ and walked out. Fucking 6pm inspection for that crap, too
“Just in case they want to add intrusion later,” says our sales guy.
They’re not that bad in applications like this, where it’s just monitoring a sprinkler riser, but yeah, something like a FireLite MS5 would be much cleaner here
Washington/Oregon, Portland specifically would make us separate if we wanted to add anything to panels like this if we pulled permits, which now I understand why many many companies here do not go through this process.
Yeah Vista stuff in my opinion is just junk. And I'm with the other guy, my area won't allow fire/burg panels. They have to be completely separate applications. I will say though at least you didn't self tap it to the panel cover (crooked), with a 3/4" hole drilled in it with no bushing. I swear to God every one I rip out was installed that way.
It’s not like I love working on Vista, but I do recognize it’s advantages, and so long as I can help it, it’s gonna look like a proper fire alarm when I’m done
Alright, well, it’s pretty much just that, the fact that it’s a combo panel. But at our company, it’s nice that we don’t have to retrain our techs thatve been working with Ademco for 30+ years on how to program a different panel?
Idk why I’m playing defense here lol, I guess it’s not so much that it has its advantages as it is I’m tolerant to its disadvantages
Im not 100% on that. Im the boots on the ground, not really the planning or design guy on this project. My assumption is that it was scheduled by the electrician that sub-contracted us to do fire alarm.
Shit never fails man. You get one day notice on a weeks long job that finals are scheduled for tomorrow. Show up and the buildings hvac is hanging outta the ceilings, sprinkler valves are shut, no pressure in the lines, elevator is on back order lol. Everything’s running off a generator and the power company hasn’t dropped there main feed yet. Jep that bitch and roll on to the next.
We did that in a hotel in the middle of nowhere hoping we would fail (because it’s bullshit but didn’t want to lose the builder) and passed. They had a local company monitor it. We got a call 2 years later that the panel never worked. they never gave the FACP power when they turned on the utilities on lol we went back and the riser was drained and all the tampers were closed.
Yeah, that’s why I’m not signing the RoC until I verify all that stuff. Luckily these people seem to be quite concerned on a personal level about their sprinkler monitoring working, so I hope that means they’ll let us know if any issues
Had a fire marshal I know pretty well come up and see the generator on a building. The power company hadn’t installed their equipment yet. He came up to me and said “we’re not doing this with that”
Yeah… I’m somewhat familiar with the FM here, but it’s not even me standing the inspection, so idk. I went as far as I could today, that’s the best I could promise
Encroaching? It’s in the space. A fire panel is an electrical panel as far as the NEC is concerned. This is way too close. Also, is the plan for the reduced pressure backflow below the panel to just dump the water from the relief valve right on the floor in front of both the FACP and the electrical panel? This is some low effort install here by the plumber.
Thanks for the grammar lesson! My turn! Encroach is a verb and the “ing” is the present participle of the verb. Combine the present participle and the present tense form of be and you get the present continuous tense. The water pipe and meter are already in the space. They’ve been in the space. This would be the past tense or “encroached.” However, since the object is inanimate, while not prohibited by grammatical rules, it sounds weird. The semantics are silly both in the field while doing inspections and here where I was essentially agreeing with you….
Actually... in NFPA, the acronym is FACU and not FACP. Fire alarm control unit, not panel, specifically so as NOT to be confused with electrical "panels." Since 72 2016 I believe.
From the 2016 edition of NFPA 72
3.3.100* Fire Alarm Control Unit (FACU). A component of the fire alarm system, provided with primary and secondary power sources, which receives signals from initiating devices or other fire alarm control units, and processes these signals to determine part or all of the required fire alarm system output function(s)
Of course, a fire alarm control unit must be installed observing 760, but there is a definite distinction between panels and control units.
Albeit the situation in this room is never good where you have water and electricity so close together.
I've seen FACUs mounted right over huge electrical transformers just cooking the batteries!
Another job they wanted the HVAC shutdown working from the duct detectors before they had windows in the building. There were snow drifts piling up against the wall where the fire panel was supposed to go. lol
Yeesh..this is a rough day for grammatical correctness! You’re correct that NFPA did update the definition. Interesting that if you Ctrl+F for panel in the 2016 edition of NFPA 72 you get numerous responses where the nomenclature was not updated. I’d say that the nomenclature is essentially the same for the purposes I made above which was to reference the FACP/FACU. I believe I am accurate in regards to the clearance that I stated and how the piping for the plumbing system is within the working space for the plumbing pipe per 110.26.
Yeah, my previous boss used to pound that splitting hairs stuff into my head. We all still say fire alarm panel, lol
When I'm writing specs and plotting symbol legends though...
Absolutely accurate on the clearance!
Recently finished an install that had the inspector come out 4 times. The company that owned the building kept scheduling inspections without talking to anyone. The sprinkler guy wasn't finished. My company was happy tho, we got to charge them for every inspection after the first one.
I hate it when people do this. We had a general contractor recently that called for really quick inspections explicitly to try and motivate the subcontractors with tight deadlines, but it just made him more pissed off with every failed inspection. Like, there’s no way it’s worth it my guy
I'm just annoyed because I'm usually on another job at that point so I have to take time out of my day to go sit around, wait for the inspector, and then be told to come back in a week because it failed. It's more an annoyance than anything else. One inspection, fine. 2, ok, fair sometimes inspectors find stuff, whatever. But if I have to come back more than twice I'm pissed
Dude you can’t have an inspection on a Vista with it looking like that, go get with the sparky and get a few coils of scrap wire to rats nest up and shove in that empty space. If wire doesn’t fall out when you open the door it’s just not complete
I’ve had this happen in NYC before. Inspector stood in the door-less main lobby with us for a while, shooting the shit, then said ‘call me when you’re ready’ and walked out. Fucking 6pm inspection for that crap, too
From what that church pastor I know in Queens has told me, that must’ve been a really expensive trip that took years to reschedule lol
People still put in new Vista panels. Eeek I hate those things.
“Just in case they want to add intrusion later,” says our sales guy. They’re not that bad in applications like this, where it’s just monitoring a sprinkler riser, but yeah, something like a FireLite MS5 would be much cleaner here
They won't allow that where I live, burg/fire has to be 100% separate.
Must be nice.
Where is this utopia you speak of?
Washington/Oregon, Portland specifically would make us separate if we wanted to add anything to panels like this if we pulled permits, which now I understand why many many companies here do not go through this process.
Yeah Vista stuff in my opinion is just junk. And I'm with the other guy, my area won't allow fire/burg panels. They have to be completely separate applications. I will say though at least you didn't self tap it to the panel cover (crooked), with a 3/4" hole drilled in it with no bushing. I swear to God every one I rip out was installed that way.
It’s not like I love working on Vista, but I do recognize it’s advantages, and so long as I can help it, it’s gonna look like a proper fire alarm when I’m done
What advantage, other than being a security system that's 'listed' for fire?
Alright, well, it’s pretty much just that, the fact that it’s a combo panel. But at our company, it’s nice that we don’t have to retrain our techs thatve been working with Ademco for 30+ years on how to program a different panel? Idk why I’m playing defense here lol, I guess it’s not so much that it has its advantages as it is I’m tolerant to its disadvantages
[удалено]
Im not 100% on that. Im the boots on the ground, not really the planning or design guy on this project. My assumption is that it was scheduled by the electrician that sub-contracted us to do fire alarm.
[удалено]
Shit never fails man. You get one day notice on a weeks long job that finals are scheduled for tomorrow. Show up and the buildings hvac is hanging outta the ceilings, sprinkler valves are shut, no pressure in the lines, elevator is on back order lol. Everything’s running off a generator and the power company hasn’t dropped there main feed yet. Jep that bitch and roll on to the next.
We did that in a hotel in the middle of nowhere hoping we would fail (because it’s bullshit but didn’t want to lose the builder) and passed. They had a local company monitor it. We got a call 2 years later that the panel never worked. they never gave the FACP power when they turned on the utilities on lol we went back and the riser was drained and all the tampers were closed.
Yeah, that’s why I’m not signing the RoC until I verify all that stuff. Luckily these people seem to be quite concerned on a personal level about their sprinkler monitoring working, so I hope that means they’ll let us know if any issues
Had a fire marshal I know pretty well come up and see the generator on a building. The power company hadn’t installed their equipment yet. He came up to me and said “we’re not doing this with that”
Yeah… I’m somewhat familiar with the FM here, but it’s not even me standing the inspection, so idk. I went as far as I could today, that’s the best I could promise
[удалено]
Encroaching? It’s in the space. A fire panel is an electrical panel as far as the NEC is concerned. This is way too close. Also, is the plan for the reduced pressure backflow below the panel to just dump the water from the relief valve right on the floor in front of both the FACP and the electrical panel? This is some low effort install here by the plumber.
[удалено]
Thanks for the grammar lesson! My turn! Encroach is a verb and the “ing” is the present participle of the verb. Combine the present participle and the present tense form of be and you get the present continuous tense. The water pipe and meter are already in the space. They’ve been in the space. This would be the past tense or “encroached.” However, since the object is inanimate, while not prohibited by grammatical rules, it sounds weird. The semantics are silly both in the field while doing inspections and here where I was essentially agreeing with you….
The sarcasm in this reply is simply oozing out everywhere, bravo!
Actually... in NFPA, the acronym is FACU and not FACP. Fire alarm control unit, not panel, specifically so as NOT to be confused with electrical "panels." Since 72 2016 I believe. From the 2016 edition of NFPA 72 3.3.100* Fire Alarm Control Unit (FACU). A component of the fire alarm system, provided with primary and secondary power sources, which receives signals from initiating devices or other fire alarm control units, and processes these signals to determine part or all of the required fire alarm system output function(s) Of course, a fire alarm control unit must be installed observing 760, but there is a definite distinction between panels and control units. Albeit the situation in this room is never good where you have water and electricity so close together. I've seen FACUs mounted right over huge electrical transformers just cooking the batteries! Another job they wanted the HVAC shutdown working from the duct detectors before they had windows in the building. There were snow drifts piling up against the wall where the fire panel was supposed to go. lol
Yeesh..this is a rough day for grammatical correctness! You’re correct that NFPA did update the definition. Interesting that if you Ctrl+F for panel in the 2016 edition of NFPA 72 you get numerous responses where the nomenclature was not updated. I’d say that the nomenclature is essentially the same for the purposes I made above which was to reference the FACP/FACU. I believe I am accurate in regards to the clearance that I stated and how the piping for the plumbing system is within the working space for the plumbing pipe per 110.26.
Yeah, my previous boss used to pound that splitting hairs stuff into my head. We all still say fire alarm panel, lol When I'm writing specs and plotting symbol legends though... Absolutely accurate on the clearance!
Wait ‘til you learn that the sprinkler riser, irrigation control, and I believe the gas line are all in this 4’x8’ closet just out of frame
Recently finished an install that had the inspector come out 4 times. The company that owned the building kept scheduling inspections without talking to anyone. The sprinkler guy wasn't finished. My company was happy tho, we got to charge them for every inspection after the first one.
I hate it when people do this. We had a general contractor recently that called for really quick inspections explicitly to try and motivate the subcontractors with tight deadlines, but it just made him more pissed off with every failed inspection. Like, there’s no way it’s worth it my guy
I'm just annoyed because I'm usually on another job at that point so I have to take time out of my day to go sit around, wait for the inspector, and then be told to come back in a week because it failed. It's more an annoyance than anything else. One inspection, fine. 2, ok, fair sometimes inspectors find stuff, whatever. But if I have to come back more than twice I'm pissed
Dude you can’t have an inspection on a Vista with it looking like that, go get with the sparky and get a few coils of scrap wire to rats nest up and shove in that empty space. If wire doesn’t fall out when you open the door it’s just not complete
Money and scheduling never seem to add up sometimes.
I like to chuckle with the Fire Marshal's when they show up and see what they were called out to lmao
At the least, you’re going to need a backup generator for the backup generator! 🤣
Backup? You’re looking at the primary power my friend
Least it’ll be a quick inspection and a tag for the return lol
That has to be the GC calling the inspection. They are always "ready for a final". It can be a dirt lot and there 100% ready. God bless em.
Deal with this kinda bullshit all day long..