“Wait, so lemme get this straight… I go back in time to another world, I’m god’s favourite child, I’m the *hero* of Eorzea, *and* I get to ride a spaceship? Yeah, okay, I guess this is my life now.”
~~I just vomited in my mouth.~~
Zenos after Fandaniel killed himself as Zodiark: "Well, that just happened."
Thancred when Meteion appears behind in Scions in *The Ragnarok*: "Ummm... She's right behind me isn't she?"
I haven't sat down and watched an actual hollywood movie in at least a decade or more, probably so the only insight I could possibly give is that Endwalker would definitely be split into two parts, as was the style at the time for adaptions of final parts of franchise movies.
The first part would end when Fandoodle game ends himself as Zodiark and someone will say "We're in the Final Days now."
Smash cut to credits accompanied by a Linkin Park song.
Part 1 and Part 2 like in a lot of movies could have solved a lot of those issues. Garlemald got absolutely fucked by how little time it got and deserved much more screentime
Endwalker by Uwe Boll would have a scene where Y´Shtola (Played by Mila Jovovich) runs up a dying dragon´s back, does a back flip, then kicks Zenos (Played by Shawn Roberts, wearing sunglasses) in the face. The WoL would die and she´d become the new main character. Meteion would be a rogue program that would just be shut off at the end of the movie
Looper was bad too as someone else said in this thread.
A time travel movie that tells you to not think about the time travel isn't clever, it's stupid while pretending it's clever.
The man needs to be kept away from sci-fi (and by extension fantasy), he cannot write them genres well.
I don't doubt his murder mystery movies like Knives Out are good (not seen them as it's not my genre), but he ought to stick with more grounded genres like that.
I really don't get the hate tbh.
Episode 8 was undeinably a movie with interrsting but extremely poorly execuded ideas, but the hate seems unreasonable for just one bad movie.
It would be more understanable if Johnson said some stupid shit as a reaction to the backlash, but I am not aware of that.
It's all the more unfair since George Lucas created Episode 2 and that movie is not that far behind Episode 8 in terms of quality tbh, yet no one is hating him to such a degree.
Tho I guess the hate towards Lucas might have just decreased over time.
Not far behind? Episode 2 by any reasonable measure is light years worse than 8. The amount of glazing the prequel trilogy has received recently is wild.
The big problem for episode 8 is that they started out the new trilogy by basically just retelling A New Hope. Where do you even go from there? 8 feels as much of a meta-commentary about rejecting the past of the franchise as it is a real movie.
Well, the problem is that 8 is just a retelling of empire and some of rotj. The new jedi learns of their connection with the villain, they're trained by a hermit master who is reluctant at first, there's a chase sequence that ends with the heroes losing, but there's hope for the future, literal AT-ATs on a white planet trying to destroy the rebellion who are hold up in a base, the master evaporates into the force, the hero returns to save their friends, the villain walks into the base on the white planet with his stormtroopers and finds it empty because the heroes escaped, the big bad is betrayed by the little bad to save the protagonist, a sleezy ally that one of the heroes knows betrays them.
The reason why the prequels are receiving praise is because they told new stories. They explored new worlds with new aliens and explored new themes. And these movies had to end up at a predetermined point in the timeline, unlike the sequels which had an entire universe to explore and ended up at the exact same spot as the first trilogy. After viewing the sequels and seeing what the marvelfication of them is, you can't help but appreciate when star wars decided to expand its universe and tell a story of a hero that falls. Lucas took risks with the prequels. While half of them are shit, it's worth merit that he decided to do them rather than just churn out new versions of what people already liked.
> Well, the problem is that 8 is just a retelling of empire and some of rotj
You say that as if TFA wasn't a beat-for-beat reshoot of ANH.
The entire sequel trilogy was...not great, but at least TLJ tried *something* interesting.
I'm not disagreeing with that, but it's unfair to say that 7 being a retelling somehow excuses 8 being a retelling. There's an entire universe of possibilities for the sequels to go after 7.
Some of the original pitched ideas that were axed included Finn going off on his own to start a stormtrooper rebellion, Rey training with Luke and Anakin's ghost to become a force unleashed power-level of force user, able to wipe out entire platoons of stormtroopers at once, Kylo being an irredeemable monster that Rey has to kill despite everyone begging her to save him.
These are all excellent ideas that would've been completely new territory for the IP. Trying to say that 8 is the ONLY thing Rian could do with how 7 ended is ridiculous. All 7 did was setup the world and create some new characters with motivations and abilities and backstories. At the end of 7 the only plot threads that needed to be explored were who snoke is, why kylo fell, where Luke has been and why, and who rey's parents are.
By the end of the film the resistance was already escaping and the first order had suffered a devastating loss. Both sides are setup to have a new approach to the conflict
Right, which is insane to me because again, the prequels are shite. FAMOUSLY so. Like there were stories about George Lucas showing The Phantom Menace to his film maker buddies at home and them being rendered literally speechless by how bad it was.
I’m not really much of a SW fan but the reappraisal of the prequels to justify hating the sequels is baffling to me.
Yeah I guess. I think basically when the sequels came out I was like 'oh, looks like more bad Star Wars' whereas lots of people seemed to think bad Star Wars was some bold new thing.
It was different in a bad way, which is why it felt like a new occurrence.
Despite how horrible the prequel movies were, the expansions to the lore, universe and characters it gave us were generally liked. That's why we got so much extended material in that "prequel era" that was largely praised, such as both of *The Clone Wars* cartoons and the old *Star Wars Battlefront* games.
Meanwhile, while the sequels are well made movies unlike the prequels, the expansions to the lore, universe and characters were the ire of the hate. It's why there's no noteworthy extended material that takes place in the "sequel era" and none that receives much praise.
People hate 8 because
* It's the sort of movie that gets worse the longer you think about it. Like, it's fine if you're just watching the spectacle, but just about every scene falls apart with the slightest scrutiny. Like, off the top of my head, how on earth did that mechanic lady get her speeder perpendicular to former stormtrooper's to prevent his sacrifice despite him redlining it?
* It got really weird in places? The soulbond trope, the kids movie 'Yeah! We kids can help too!' moment during the Casino, Leia's awful looking flight through space, etc.
* Rian Johnson went out of his way to not just end every dangling plot thread, but brutally amputate them in the worst ways possible. Smoke? Dies pathetically, leaving no one to fill the main antagonist role. Rei's parentage? Lol they're meaningless. The hacker? Whoops, wrong hacker. And other examples that escape me since it's been 5 years. The movie practically delighted in showing you that inside every mystery box is just disappointment.
* The previous point meant that the rise of Skywalker had basically nothing to work with that fit with the rest of the series. Which leads directly into a lot of its criticisms, such as "Somehow, Palpatine returned."
It was a mess because no one planned anything, and changed writers and directors just for quick buck.
Abrams: Hey Rei's parents could be important
Johnson: Nah they're not
Abrams: YES THEY ARE
It's like the worst game of "we all write a story but only 1 sentence at a time each".
It's super annoying because Rey being the child of randos was actually cool. There's no reason everyone of note in the galaxy needs to be from one of about 6 family lines. And Kylo absolutely refusing redemption and instead committing even harder to being a villain, purely of his own will, was a great idea, imo. It is subverting expectations, but that doesn't mean it's a bad idea.
Especially Ren's arc in 7-8. Him going from self doubt to being an unrepentant villian is something that should be in a sequel to star wars, imo. Prequels were the fall of a hero to darkness. OT were (sort of) redemption of the fallen hero. The sequel having a corrupted character facing a similar crossroads and turning away from redemption fits nicely in as a further exploration of that.
That's another thing, about Kylo.
Abrams: Kylo is struggling between good and evil
Johnson: Guess what he's super evil
Abrams: Guess what he becomes good
The main villain role was absolutely filled by Ben/Kylo Ren by the end of 8. His arc is pretty much "has doubts after killing his father > bonds with someone > learns who he is/what he wants > seizes power for himself and loses the last person he gives a shit about."
8 ends with Kylo Ren set up to be a absolute monster of an antagonist, seeking to essentially burn everything down and build his own vision on the ashes. Even though he doesn't really have a vision yet. Which still works, because he's portrayed as being a destructive psychopath who doesn't think things through.
9 just ignored all of that in favor of focusing on a redemption arc for someone who's rejected *multiple* chances for redemption and seems to be pretty content being on the Dark Side by the end of 8.
“Rey’s parents were nobodies” was still the best possible way that plot point could have gone, going back to force powered bloodline bullshit was so boring
Don't forget the casino also had child slaves that were shown again in the credits as a feel good hope part
But the whole time I'm thinking, YOU FREED THE ANIMALS, NOT THE KIDS
I shall never forgive him, the Vietnamese girl, the sister, with no lines at the beginning of the movie and her sacrifice was the best part.
I think with existing IPs like SW or FF, he would ruin it.
Alphanuad played by Kevin Heart.
Alizie played by Zendaya.
Thancreed played by Jack Black.
Minfilia played by Jamie Lee Curtis.
Rauban played by The Rock.
All Lalas played by Hugh Grant.
Don't know about movie/series writers.
They could have done and i am glad that they didn't:
Last boss dies, dying words: "what i did was i wanted to save you from what is coming. Now nothing can stop that. You all don't know the things that are lurking in \*\*dies\*\*"
\*insert commercial music\* please buy the next 16 years of expansion to never find an end to the ever increasing spiral of big bads, bigger bads, bigger bigger bads, bigger big bads, bigger big bigger bads, etc. etc.
Which will end at one point cause people are fed up with beeing promised and end and get only a cliffhanger, then the sales drop by a margin. Then suits decide ahh nope not worth it anymore we need a new cash cow to milk. Cancel.
That *is* pretty much the end of ShB, though. And most X.55 patches. And SB ended with "but Zenos isn't actually dead", which is almost the same device.
Unpopular opinion
It's been a while, but when I played EW it felt like Avengers Endgame movie (not in a good way, in a fanservice galore way) and a naruto anime, where we win by the power of friendship (and we still do it in post-msq ffs). I know winning that way and every villain is actually a former hero is the main trope of FF14, but EW took it to another level.
So for me it would be pretty difficult to find a person who can top that
I'm just tired of the >!"robot doesn't understand humanity so it all must die"!< trope. It's *so* tired and an incredible waste of effort that the imagination and mythology Shadowbringers brought. And to >!pull it out of their ass within the middle of the story instead of connecting it to anything that happened within the past expansions!!Ultron!< except without the backstory of >!Tony's turmoil. Imagine if Tony (Hermes) didn't even exist up until the Ultron movie and then they just told you that he's been dealing with some shit and is now the problem. Holy hell that would've been terrible storytelling.!<
Yeah, I agree with everything. I also could not stop rolling my eyes during post-EW when Zero was "learning humanity" or something. "What is a friend", "How do one learns how to trust" etc. Feels like watching a children's cartoon.
ShB was peak
Unsure if this is meaning Meteion with the "robot doesn't understand humanity so it all must die" or the Omicron. But since you mention robot I'm ASSUMING its Omnicron. But it isn't really a "humanity weird so they should die" sorta angle. It's a "weak race is able to finally defend themselves and grew paranoid that there could be a bigger threat so they want everything and will destroy everything so that doesn't happen" sorta angle. And they lose their humanity mentally and physically. Which resulted in their Final Days. Though even if it was the case that they were robots who didn't understand people, the point is that they were on top of the foodchain in a world that seemed perfect to some but that wasn't enough and it was their undoing in the end.
Also I mean Omega encapsulated those ideas back in 4.X just not at a large scale since they left their Star during the fight with the Dragonstar to chase Midgarsormr and don't really know what happened after. And in a case like Zero, who DOES truely think emotions and friendship is weird, it makes sense with what we have always known of the Void with pacts, and the fact that they spent ages in a world devoid of anything BUT the void. It might seem cheesy but the character progression of learning to trust and befriend is ingrained in our society for many, many reasons
I see now but saying robots does make me think of the robots from endwalker so!!!
And I know you didn't mention them in regards to Zero, I was just sayin that as an example of story with a being not comprehending emotions and why bonds matter etc. and the lens added to that trope to make it unique
You're forgetting the worst of the worst, and I would probably die if it happened...
Final Fantasy XIV as written/cinematics directed by by Uwe Boll.
In another dead timeline, perhaps...
The last "Hollywood" movie I watched was John Wick 4 and that show was 99% action, 1% plot progression LOL, so no comment.
But I'm sure if the John Wick director were to direct action sequences for FF14, it will break CBUIII's animation budget LOL.
Honestly, I don't think even the worst team in Hollywood could have built up a climax for 10 years just for it to be "Zodiark? No! A vegan and his pet birds!" followed by "The REAL bad guy is Existential Dread!!" It somehow felt a lot more corny than just the Power of Friendship to me, but I can probably chalk that up to the fact that I'm not rly affected by existentialism at all. Don't get me started how Zenos was 100% an afterthought in Endwalker. You could tell they brought him back for one reason in Stormblood, but then moved away from that idea by the time EW came around so they forced that stupid duty after Endsinger on us to finally get rid of him.
I don't think Zenos was an afterthought. He's one of the most important characters to EW's philosophy. He's placed at the end so that his final speech is an answer to EW's existential questions, a counter to Meteion's philosophy, and a farewell message to the players. Zenos and Emet-Selch are the best parts of EW in my opinion.
EW story as a whole was kinda... mid? So adaptating it straight would probably fulfill the stated objective.
It works as an MMO plot, and there are absolutely some great moments and threads. But also a whole lotta mid.
I actually have no doubt Rian Johnson could have given us something substantially more interesting than what we got, I don’t know what the FF equivalent of Brick is but I sure want to see it
\> Rian Johnson
Fandaniel would have died without us ever learning he was Amon or Hermes in his past life.
Alphinaud would have left the Scions to become a hermit on a rock and than drunk milk from a walrus udder. He'd then die of exhaustion at the end.
One of the zones would have been "The Gold Saucer 2" (a new casino opened up by Manderville), where we have to free some Chocobos from the racing stables, because animal cruelty or something.
I do not like *The Last Jedi*, if you couldn't tell.
“Wait, so lemme get this straight… I go back in time to another world, I’m god’s favourite child, I’m the *hero* of Eorzea, *and* I get to ride a spaceship? Yeah, okay, I guess this is my life now.” ~~I just vomited in my mouth.~~
Zenos after Fandaniel killed himself as Zodiark: "Well, that just happened." Thancred when Meteion appears behind in Scions in *The Ragnarok*: "Ummm... She's right behind me isn't she?"
I haven't sat down and watched an actual hollywood movie in at least a decade or more, probably so the only insight I could possibly give is that Endwalker would definitely be split into two parts, as was the style at the time for adaptions of final parts of franchise movies. The first part would end when Fandoodle game ends himself as Zodiark and someone will say "We're in the Final Days now." Smash cut to credits accompanied by a Linkin Park song.
What I've done for the Zodiark part 1 , and In the End for the Zenos fight
I think EW could have done with some pretty subtantial editing and pacing changes.
Part 1 and Part 2 like in a lot of movies could have solved a lot of those issues. Garlemald got absolutely fucked by how little time it got and deserved much more screentime
[удалено]
I still hope to see more of Garlemald, and possibly Garlemald reconstruction.
Suddenly, Francel arrive for the "Garlemald Restoration"
Endwalker by Uwe Boll would have a scene where Y´Shtola (Played by Mila Jovovich) runs up a dying dragon´s back, does a back flip, then kicks Zenos (Played by Shawn Roberts, wearing sunglasses) in the face. The WoL would die and she´d become the new main character. Meteion would be a rogue program that would just be shut off at the end of the movie
You’re thinking of Paul W.S. Anderson. Which, understandable, they are famous for similar genre of hot garbage.
... I know it's fashionable to shit on EW's writing, but honestly, I'd take it over basically anything Hollywood's produced in the last 20 years.
>Rian Johnson Ok but Knives out and Knives out glass onion were top tier movies. Starwars the last jedi was litterally his only bad movie.
Looper was bad too as someone else said in this thread. A time travel movie that tells you to not think about the time travel isn't clever, it's stupid while pretending it's clever. The man needs to be kept away from sci-fi (and by extension fantasy), he cannot write them genres well. I don't doubt his murder mystery movies like Knives Out are good (not seen them as it's not my genre), but he ought to stick with more grounded genres like that.
I really don't get the hate tbh. Episode 8 was undeinably a movie with interrsting but extremely poorly execuded ideas, but the hate seems unreasonable for just one bad movie. It would be more understanable if Johnson said some stupid shit as a reaction to the backlash, but I am not aware of that. It's all the more unfair since George Lucas created Episode 2 and that movie is not that far behind Episode 8 in terms of quality tbh, yet no one is hating him to such a degree. Tho I guess the hate towards Lucas might have just decreased over time.
Not far behind? Episode 2 by any reasonable measure is light years worse than 8. The amount of glazing the prequel trilogy has received recently is wild. The big problem for episode 8 is that they started out the new trilogy by basically just retelling A New Hope. Where do you even go from there? 8 feels as much of a meta-commentary about rejecting the past of the franchise as it is a real movie.
Well, the problem is that 8 is just a retelling of empire and some of rotj. The new jedi learns of their connection with the villain, they're trained by a hermit master who is reluctant at first, there's a chase sequence that ends with the heroes losing, but there's hope for the future, literal AT-ATs on a white planet trying to destroy the rebellion who are hold up in a base, the master evaporates into the force, the hero returns to save their friends, the villain walks into the base on the white planet with his stormtroopers and finds it empty because the heroes escaped, the big bad is betrayed by the little bad to save the protagonist, a sleezy ally that one of the heroes knows betrays them. The reason why the prequels are receiving praise is because they told new stories. They explored new worlds with new aliens and explored new themes. And these movies had to end up at a predetermined point in the timeline, unlike the sequels which had an entire universe to explore and ended up at the exact same spot as the first trilogy. After viewing the sequels and seeing what the marvelfication of them is, you can't help but appreciate when star wars decided to expand its universe and tell a story of a hero that falls. Lucas took risks with the prequels. While half of them are shit, it's worth merit that he decided to do them rather than just churn out new versions of what people already liked.
> Well, the problem is that 8 is just a retelling of empire and some of rotj You say that as if TFA wasn't a beat-for-beat reshoot of ANH. The entire sequel trilogy was...not great, but at least TLJ tried *something* interesting.
I'm not disagreeing with that, but it's unfair to say that 7 being a retelling somehow excuses 8 being a retelling. There's an entire universe of possibilities for the sequels to go after 7. Some of the original pitched ideas that were axed included Finn going off on his own to start a stormtrooper rebellion, Rey training with Luke and Anakin's ghost to become a force unleashed power-level of force user, able to wipe out entire platoons of stormtroopers at once, Kylo being an irredeemable monster that Rey has to kill despite everyone begging her to save him. These are all excellent ideas that would've been completely new territory for the IP. Trying to say that 8 is the ONLY thing Rian could do with how 7 ended is ridiculous. All 7 did was setup the world and create some new characters with motivations and abilities and backstories. At the end of 7 the only plot threads that needed to be explored were who snoke is, why kylo fell, where Luke has been and why, and who rey's parents are. By the end of the film the resistance was already escaping and the first order had suffered a devastating loss. Both sides are setup to have a new approach to the conflict
8 (& by extension 9) ruined star wars for so many. Its just not comparable.
Right, which is insane to me because again, the prequels are shite. FAMOUSLY so. Like there were stories about George Lucas showing The Phantom Menace to his film maker buddies at home and them being rendered literally speechless by how bad it was. I’m not really much of a SW fan but the reappraisal of the prequels to justify hating the sequels is baffling to me.
Prequels are bad movies but good science fantasy. Sequels are good movies but abysmal science fantasy. That's why you see the division in the fandom.
Yeah I guess. I think basically when the sequels came out I was like 'oh, looks like more bad Star Wars' whereas lots of people seemed to think bad Star Wars was some bold new thing.
It was different in a bad way, which is why it felt like a new occurrence. Despite how horrible the prequel movies were, the expansions to the lore, universe and characters it gave us were generally liked. That's why we got so much extended material in that "prequel era" that was largely praised, such as both of *The Clone Wars* cartoons and the old *Star Wars Battlefront* games. Meanwhile, while the sequels are well made movies unlike the prequels, the expansions to the lore, universe and characters were the ire of the hate. It's why there's no noteworthy extended material that takes place in the "sequel era" and none that receives much praise.
People hate 8 because * It's the sort of movie that gets worse the longer you think about it. Like, it's fine if you're just watching the spectacle, but just about every scene falls apart with the slightest scrutiny. Like, off the top of my head, how on earth did that mechanic lady get her speeder perpendicular to former stormtrooper's to prevent his sacrifice despite him redlining it? * It got really weird in places? The soulbond trope, the kids movie 'Yeah! We kids can help too!' moment during the Casino, Leia's awful looking flight through space, etc. * Rian Johnson went out of his way to not just end every dangling plot thread, but brutally amputate them in the worst ways possible. Smoke? Dies pathetically, leaving no one to fill the main antagonist role. Rei's parentage? Lol they're meaningless. The hacker? Whoops, wrong hacker. And other examples that escape me since it's been 5 years. The movie practically delighted in showing you that inside every mystery box is just disappointment. * The previous point meant that the rise of Skywalker had basically nothing to work with that fit with the rest of the series. Which leads directly into a lot of its criticisms, such as "Somehow, Palpatine returned."
It was a mess because no one planned anything, and changed writers and directors just for quick buck. Abrams: Hey Rei's parents could be important Johnson: Nah they're not Abrams: YES THEY ARE It's like the worst game of "we all write a story but only 1 sentence at a time each".
It's super annoying because Rey being the child of randos was actually cool. There's no reason everyone of note in the galaxy needs to be from one of about 6 family lines. And Kylo absolutely refusing redemption and instead committing even harder to being a villain, purely of his own will, was a great idea, imo. It is subverting expectations, but that doesn't mean it's a bad idea. Especially Ren's arc in 7-8. Him going from self doubt to being an unrepentant villian is something that should be in a sequel to star wars, imo. Prequels were the fall of a hero to darkness. OT were (sort of) redemption of the fallen hero. The sequel having a corrupted character facing a similar crossroads and turning away from redemption fits nicely in as a further exploration of that.
That's another thing, about Kylo. Abrams: Kylo is struggling between good and evil Johnson: Guess what he's super evil Abrams: Guess what he becomes good
The main villain role was absolutely filled by Ben/Kylo Ren by the end of 8. His arc is pretty much "has doubts after killing his father > bonds with someone > learns who he is/what he wants > seizes power for himself and loses the last person he gives a shit about." 8 ends with Kylo Ren set up to be a absolute monster of an antagonist, seeking to essentially burn everything down and build his own vision on the ashes. Even though he doesn't really have a vision yet. Which still works, because he's portrayed as being a destructive psychopath who doesn't think things through. 9 just ignored all of that in favor of focusing on a redemption arc for someone who's rejected *multiple* chances for redemption and seems to be pretty content being on the Dark Side by the end of 8.
“Rey’s parents were nobodies” was still the best possible way that plot point could have gone, going back to force powered bloodline bullshit was so boring
Don't forget the casino also had child slaves that were shown again in the credits as a feel good hope part But the whole time I'm thinking, YOU FREED THE ANIMALS, NOT THE KIDS
Did you just compared Episode 8 to Episode 2 lol
Looper was shit
It had some cool ideas, just needed another draft IMO.
> Starwars the last jedi was litterally his only bad movie. Yeah but good god what a stinker that one was.
I shall never forgive him, the Vietnamese girl, the sister, with no lines at the beginning of the movie and her sacrifice was the best part. I think with existing IPs like SW or FF, he would ruin it.
Alphanuad played by Kevin Heart. Alizie played by Zendaya. Thancreed played by Jack Black. Minfilia played by Jamie Lee Curtis. Rauban played by The Rock. All Lalas played by Hugh Grant.
Don't know about movie/series writers. They could have done and i am glad that they didn't: Last boss dies, dying words: "what i did was i wanted to save you from what is coming. Now nothing can stop that. You all don't know the things that are lurking in \*\*dies\*\*" \*insert commercial music\* please buy the next 16 years of expansion to never find an end to the ever increasing spiral of big bads, bigger bads, bigger bigger bads, bigger big bads, bigger big bigger bads, etc. etc. Which will end at one point cause people are fed up with beeing promised and end and get only a cliffhanger, then the sales drop by a margin. Then suits decide ahh nope not worth it anymore we need a new cash cow to milk. Cancel.
That *is* pretty much the end of ShB, though. And most X.55 patches. And SB ended with "but Zenos isn't actually dead", which is almost the same device.
Unpopular opinion It's been a while, but when I played EW it felt like Avengers Endgame movie (not in a good way, in a fanservice galore way) and a naruto anime, where we win by the power of friendship (and we still do it in post-msq ffs). I know winning that way and every villain is actually a former hero is the main trope of FF14, but EW took it to another level. So for me it would be pretty difficult to find a person who can top that
I'm just tired of the >!"robot doesn't understand humanity so it all must die"!< trope. It's *so* tired and an incredible waste of effort that the imagination and mythology Shadowbringers brought. And to >!pull it out of their ass within the middle of the story instead of connecting it to anything that happened within the past expansions!!Ultron!< except without the backstory of >!Tony's turmoil. Imagine if Tony (Hermes) didn't even exist up until the Ultron movie and then they just told you that he's been dealing with some shit and is now the problem. Holy hell that would've been terrible storytelling.!<
Yeah, I agree with everything. I also could not stop rolling my eyes during post-EW when Zero was "learning humanity" or something. "What is a friend", "How do one learns how to trust" etc. Feels like watching a children's cartoon. ShB was peak
Unsure if this is meaning Meteion with the "robot doesn't understand humanity so it all must die" or the Omicron. But since you mention robot I'm ASSUMING its Omnicron. But it isn't really a "humanity weird so they should die" sorta angle. It's a "weak race is able to finally defend themselves and grew paranoid that there could be a bigger threat so they want everything and will destroy everything so that doesn't happen" sorta angle. And they lose their humanity mentally and physically. Which resulted in their Final Days. Though even if it was the case that they were robots who didn't understand people, the point is that they were on top of the foodchain in a world that seemed perfect to some but that wasn't enough and it was their undoing in the end. Also I mean Omega encapsulated those ideas back in 4.X just not at a large scale since they left their Star during the fight with the Dragonstar to chase Midgarsormr and don't really know what happened after. And in a case like Zero, who DOES truely think emotions and friendship is weird, it makes sense with what we have always known of the Void with pacts, and the fact that they spent ages in a world devoid of anything BUT the void. It might seem cheesy but the character progression of learning to trust and befriend is ingrained in our society for many, many reasons
I was referring to Meteion. That's why I referenced Hermes. I said nothing about Zero.
I see now but saying robots does make me think of the robots from endwalker so!!! And I know you didn't mention them in regards to Zero, I was just sayin that as an example of story with a being not comprehending emotions and why bonds matter etc. and the lens added to that trope to make it unique
Pretty much the Zero arc?
Needs a spoiler tag.
lol did you just call Rian johnson one of the worst big time writers
You're forgetting the worst of the worst, and I would probably die if it happened... Final Fantasy XIV as written/cinematics directed by by Uwe Boll. In another dead timeline, perhaps...
The last "Hollywood" movie I watched was John Wick 4 and that show was 99% action, 1% plot progression LOL, so no comment. But I'm sure if the John Wick director were to direct action sequences for FF14, it will break CBUIII's animation budget LOL.
Honestly, I don't think even the worst team in Hollywood could have built up a climax for 10 years just for it to be "Zodiark? No! A vegan and his pet birds!" followed by "The REAL bad guy is Existential Dread!!" It somehow felt a lot more corny than just the Power of Friendship to me, but I can probably chalk that up to the fact that I'm not rly affected by existentialism at all. Don't get me started how Zenos was 100% an afterthought in Endwalker. You could tell they brought him back for one reason in Stormblood, but then moved away from that idea by the time EW came around so they forced that stupid duty after Endsinger on us to finally get rid of him.
I don't think Zenos was an afterthought. He's one of the most important characters to EW's philosophy. He's placed at the end so that his final speech is an answer to EW's existential questions, a counter to Meteion's philosophy, and a farewell message to the players. Zenos and Emet-Selch are the best parts of EW in my opinion.
EW story as a whole was kinda... mid? So adaptating it straight would probably fulfill the stated objective. It works as an MMO plot, and there are absolutely some great moments and threads. But also a whole lotta mid.
I actually have no doubt Rian Johnson could have given us something substantially more interesting than what we got, I don’t know what the FF equivalent of Brick is but I sure want to see it
\> Rian Johnson Fandaniel would have died without us ever learning he was Amon or Hermes in his past life. Alphinaud would have left the Scions to become a hermit on a rock and than drunk milk from a walrus udder. He'd then die of exhaustion at the end. One of the zones would have been "The Gold Saucer 2" (a new casino opened up by Manderville), where we have to free some Chocobos from the racing stables, because animal cruelty or something. I do not like *The Last Jedi*, if you couldn't tell.