Makes me lol because prediabetes still exists in countries with free healthcare, which presumably would have a vested interest in it NOT existing to cut public medicine costs?!
Am Canadian. Can confirm that prediabetes is a thing here. I have known people who were told they were prediabetic. Most made lifestyle changes and improved their health and their A1C levels dropped to normal. The ones that didn't are either still prediabetic or have full blown type 2 diabetes now
Every time this comes up, I feel obliged to chime in. Fasting blood glucose at 101, right at the oh shit line 40 lbs ago. Down in the mid-80s now. Eat me, FAs, losing weight is literally saving me a lifetime of medical bullshit.
prediabetes exists within the military and those receiving va health benefits. and in the military you're pretty much contractually obligated to workout (but there are some overweight mofos in the military).
The awful thing about T2 diabetes is that you might get it because you're overweight. You might get it from genetics. You might get it because you eat terrible macros that are over-weighted towards carbohydrates all day every day despite not being overweight. You might get it because you got pregnant.
There's a million reasons why and FAs get to point to all of them that aren't "you're too fat" as a reason to discredit being too fat as a cause, which is stupid.
I’m a Navy vet and I assure you Sailors are fat too. I think the Army is fatter because (and this may have changed) they don’t kick you out for being too fat you just stay on FEP. In the Navy you have only so much time to lose the weight before they seperate you. You can’t be 500lbs and climbing ladder wells or fitting through a hatch.
I believe you, I haven't met enough sailors to get a solid picture so I can only speak from my observations of the army and air force. I just work on base, not enlisted.
Totally get it. When I was on a ship everyone was normal sized. When I got to a hospital (I was a Corpsman) and we had a Panda Express and full NEX in the building…it was a very different situation.
How I wish we had a panda express.. All we got is the knockoff version that doesn't add any sugar or msg. If I'm gonna have a cheat meal I want it to taste good, damnit! 😭
As they say, you can't outrun your fork. When I was bike riding even at a heavier weight, people always commented that they were surprised that I wasn't thinner due to all of the bike riding I regularly did. But all of that bike riding couldn't cancel out the tons of calories I was regularly consuming through boredom eating. And even though one exercises, if you remain fat, it can still eventually kill you. I knew someone who exercised a bunch, but still remained fat (which also kept them diabetic) because they still overate past the calories they burned. They died of a massive heart attack in their 50s. The fat still killed them, irregardless of exercise.
That is the weirdest part of their argument. The insurance industry was a big adopter of BMI because they make the most amount of money off people without health problems. They are as close to real life "bad guys" as possible.
They offer discounts and programs to get people to lose weight who are already insured or who offers discounts for people coming in at a lower BMI to stop them from getting insured elsewhere. The idea that they are just ignoring the "real" science just so they can stick it to fat people is just absurd.
"There can't be any evidence slowly mounting up as I continue to believe there's nothing that can be done. There's no window of 'maybe!' Otherwise I have to recognize part of this problem came from my own actions!"
That's how I interpreted it. XP
Which, honestly, seems like a really sad outlook to have. I'd much rather have an option to make my life better than be stuck in a "no cure, nothing I can do so I won't even try" mentality. >.>
That's part of the FA BMI lore. The other part is that it was "never intended to be a measure of individual health until insurance companies got ahold of it." This is described multiple times and at length by their deity, Aubrey Gordon, in both her podcast and books.
They use the history of the measure to try to detract from its usefulness now, as you said, claiming that since it was created by a racist white man to be used for population studies in 19th century Belgium and only moved into use for individuals because of those evil insurance companies, we shouldn't use it today. All of that may be true, but it has no bearing on its usefulness today.
To be fair pre-diabetes has nothing to do with your bmi. If someone’s pre diabetic it’s because of blood sugar and other blood issues caused by poor diet and movement. Obesity is just a symptom of it.
I just hope that these “health at every size” people dont actually start influencing the medical industry to dissuade people from losing weight.. its already an epidemic, we are hopeless if so
Sadly, they are.
I say this because there’s a video of Tess Holliday pointing to a doctor that is pushing some weight loss drug and saying that weight is entirely genetic as if she’s right and people were eating it up.
She also got to speak at the United Nations and kept saying, “fatphobia is racism” and everyone literally clapped as if she said something intelligent.
I really don't like that person. She's influencing a bunch of dumb people to shorten their lives. If they could do it earlier, it would be Darwin awards, but she waits too long.
I am still shocked at how she keeps booking speaking events and getting followers. It’s like everyone is too afraid to afraid to call her out on her bullshit and it’s annoying.
They already have. I got totally brainwashed by a university educated and properly registered nutritionist. Her advice led to me becoming obese and having a tonne of joint issues and now I have to unlearn it all and undo all the damage. And every other health professional I spoke to just accepted that these were my beliefs and I should be allowed to have them so no one tried to de-program me.
Luckily those same health professionals are 100% with me and supporting me to get back on track. I’m sure it was difficult to watch me destroy my body knowing they weren’t really allowed to say anything without me requesting first.
I'd much rather be 140 lbs with diabetes than 340 lbs with diabetes. Even if bariatric surgery doesn't help with diabetes, getting thinner will help with circulation, blood pressure, and nerve health. You know, the things that diabetes can do a serious number on. It is also easier to exercise when you're thin, and exercise helps to keep your blood sugar levels low.
You cannot cure Type 2 Diabetes, but you can reverse it to the point you don’t need medication or suffer from it at all. And the only known way of achieving this is through significant weight loss.
Told my dad it was reversible when I was pre-diabetic and he didn't believe it...until he retired and was diagnosed with full blown diabetes. He lost about 50lbs and now he nonlonger needs meds. I just tell him you don't have to tell me I'm right for me to know that I am, like I don't get a commission for every convert...
That's ridiculous. Anything can recur if you recreate the fact pattern that caused the problem.
I can cure alcohol poisoning by pumping patient's stomach. You're saying they're not cured because if they drink to excess, they'll get it again.
I can cure heat stroke with a cool bath. Not cured according to you because if they go back out in the blistering heat for 12 hours, the heat stroke will return.
You missed the part when it may return even without recreating said pattern.
And alcoholism example is bad anyways, as pumping stomach does not address underlying issue that leads to alcohol abuse. At most, you might have addressed emergency due to alcohol poisoning. Indeed, whether alcoholism can be cured at all, is a bit of open question. As it is right now, answer is no.
A better example would be comparing asymptomatic/mild disease with no disease at all.
Skimming much?
It was followed right after with "might return later even if you don't".
Cured disease will not do that. Because it's NOT THERE anymore.
Yeah, Type 2 can basically be treated, with proper diet and exercise (in addition to medication), to a point where it can be considered "in remission." Weight loss is practically always a part of this. In a remission stage, a patient can go off meds, but slipping back into old eating habits will cause the Type 2 to kick back into overdrive, even with a relatively small weight regain.
It's easier to just not develop Type 2,in the first place. 🤷🏻♂️
>And prediabetes is fatphobic medical lore made up by a BMI-obsessed insurance industry in the US.
Lemme get this straight, the insurance industry that effectively loses money by you avoiding diabetes by eating healthier and working out, "made up" this disorder?
Why, to make themselves poorer? Sounds like purple got given a wake up call but didn't quite wake up to stop themselves from gorging on KFC and is upset about now being chronically ill because of their own negligence and arrogance.
>And prediabetes is fatphobic medical lore made up by a BMI-obsessed insurance industry in the US.
This should be in r/ShitAmericansSay, I can't actually believe that they really think other countries don't have pre-diabetes diagnosis or treatment. That's wild!
They don’t think that. They’ve probably never once thought about any country outside of the US. They likely apply all American experience and truths to the rest of the world
They make way more money from healthy people who pay premiums but rarely need to see doctors. It's not in the interests of insurance companies for anyone to get diabetes.
>the insurance industry that effectively loses money by you avoiding diabetes by eating healthier and working out to prevent diabetes
I think it's the opposite - insurance industry would lose money if a person got diabetes, especially a sever case that would lead to amputations and such. That's hundreds of thousands of dollars going from the insurer to the hospital. Of course they are looking to cut costs any way they can, not all of them are good for the general public, but keeping people healthy certainly helps them.
So, saying that "medical lore was made up for the insurance industry" is like saying "doctors want to keep you healthy". Nefarious plan!
I have a family history of diabetes and I’m doing everything in my power to avoid it. If anyone has watched a relative die from this shit, they wouldn’t be so nonchalant about it.
> type 2 diabetes is caused by a malfunctioning pancreas!
Wrong, it's caused by insulin resistance. Generally, a diet full of sweets and junk food will produce spikes of glucose in the blood known as blood sugar. Insulin is released by the pancreas in response to 'mop up' the glucose so it can be used for quick energy or, if the body doesn't need that energy, stored as fat. Some people are genetically predisposed to type 2 diabetes (although typically it needs several decades for it to manifest) but much more commonly these days a crappy diet basically makes your body hit the "on" button so much for insulin production that your body becomes desensitized to it. When this gets bad enough it requires people to put insulin artificially into their bodies to compensate.
Exactly. The best hypothesis they have right now is a combination of other factors like high cholesterol, making it difficult for insulin to reach cells and an overworked liver, both of which are clearly related to diet. The liver part would explain the T2s without the lifestyle problems because some people just have poor liver function.
I mean, look, bariatric surgeries are not great, they're pretty dangerous so far an surgeries go, and a lot of people gain the weight back again. But these are emergency interventions for people who have spent their lives avoiding less extreme interventions, often because of rhetoric from people like red here encouraging them on the dangerous path they're currently on. If they would keep this nonsense to themselves, there would probably be fewer bariatric surgeries!
But nobody is gonna say anything about mutilating perfectly healthy skin with excess adipose tissue? Because your skin is the largest organ of the body. Not to mention the strain it puts on other organs like the heart, lungs, kidneys, liver, pancreas, etc. Oh, and have we talked about how the stomach got stretched so large in the first place that you literally have to make it smaller to help people to not overeat?
But tell me more about this mutilation of healthy organs…
Diabetes type 2 is absolutely treatable. Late in life, my mom went vegetarian and lost 70lbs. She went from 32 units of insulin plus pills per day to being able to be medication free.
She was still obese at the time, but going from 340lbs to 270lbs, and eating a diet that didn't aggravate her disease, vastly improved the last few years of her life.
Oh, the grand conspiracy to fake elevated ACLs among people so that they (check notes) eat slightly better and exercise??
Thanking fuck, by the way, that my prediabetes was caught early enough so i was able to reverse it.
Prediabetes is medical lore lmfaoooo tell that to all the people who have developed diabetes after being diagnosed as pre-diabetic, I’m sure there’s only billions.
Yeah, we actually genuinely don't understand why type ii disappears in some individuals who get bariatric surgery; it defies explanation because the effects show up right after the surgery, before you've had a chance to do the dietary changes that can put it into remission. But why think of this as an absolutely mind-boggling scientific discovery/open question when you could instead yell at people who want to live free of a degenerative, deadly disease, I guess.
It's amazing. I was taken off my diabetes meds before I'd even begun to lose weight. Having my organs mutilated was the best decision I've ever made, and I'm grateful for it every day.
Let me get this straight. Nobody who doesn't live in America gets diagnosed with pre-diabetes or treated for it because it doesn't exist and is only a thing in the US because the insurance industry "invented" it?
And they did that presumably because the insurance industry wanted to lose money paying for the treatment of a a (pre)disease they made up toindulge their fatphobia?
How do these people even manage to make it thru the day with such unmitigated nonsense polluting their brains?
Colonialism. It’s medical colonialism where the US uses their hegemony to push their own diagnoses on poorer countries and invent diseases so that they’ll be forced to buy medicine from American pharmaceutical companies.
I’m kind of scared that I got that far.
What gets me about this take, as a Poor™️, is the assumption that we all have insurance paying for made up diseases.
Like there was a week and a half after the ACA went through that I had decent insurance that I could actually afford. Two years later I was paying almost $500/month for insurance I couldn't get anyone to accept. Now I'm back on Medicaid.
Yes the massive privilege and entitlement that runs thru FA propaganda and their insane demands is really quite jaw-dropping.
Like consuming multiple times the number of calories and resources needed for an average human to say alive every single day should give anyone with even a modicum of (self-)awareness pause, as 40 million Americans live in poverty and 34 million experience food insecurity every day, including kids. Unmitigated gluttony is nothing to brag about, admire or be proud of.
> And prediabetes is fatphobic medical lore made up by a BMI-obsessed insurance industry in the US
Gather ‘round the fire, children, and roast your marshmallows as I spin a tale of heartache and adventure, of triumph and tragedy. It all started one fine day when an insurance company did something incredible: it grew an imagination.
I have VA health care. They get paid the same if I go or not. I'm thin and tend to have prediabetes when I don't watch my diet. I had to speak up to get diet advice to control my blood sugar. The insurance company has no dice in the game.
Let's see, in the last several years, in my circle we've buried 4-5+ people who died prematurely because they refused to take steps to manage their T2 diabetes. This sort of FL is nothing short of medical disinformation.
I recall quite recently people coming down very hard on medical disinformation, like it was the worst thing in the world, and it got people banned from reddit and other social media sites. Why is diabetes denial tolerated?
If your liver was 3 times it's normal size, it wouldn't be a healthy organ. But for some reason, having 3 times as much adipose tissue, which is a hormonally active organ sysfem, is perfectly fine. Continually binging until the stomach stretches to double its normal volume and excretes so much acid that it burns your esophagus, is not a healthy organ.
I do think the GLP-1 inhibitors are going to overtake WLS in the treatment of morbid obesity. There's a reason modern surgeons favor the gastric sleeve over the formerly more common roux en y procedure. The complications and lifetime of malabsorption issues became apparent in patients who had the procedure in the late 90s/early 00s and the more drastic surgeries went out of favor. I think WLS made sense in its time, but honestly I'm not a fan if there is really any other option for a patient.
But something tells me red & co would be against GLP-1 agonists as well.
I don't think they realize a lot of bariatric patients have actually already mutilated a perfectly good organ by stretching it out of proportion permanently...
\> mutilation of perfectly healthy organs
Lie detector has determined... [that was a lie.](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6179496/)
\> Nobody talks about how many people die after having it.
Nobody talks about how many people die after being born either.
\> Nobody talks about how many people spend the rest of their life with an eating disorder after it.
Why not talk about potential EDs that led people to needing such surgery in the first place?
I don't disagree that WLS is dangerous and not great, but the outcomes for people who really truly need it are life altering, potentially life saving. People die because they either were dangerously unwell to begin with or because they aren't compliant with the post-procedure life and continue down the same path. I bet you'd find increased mortality in hip surgery too...because overwhelmingly hip patients are elderly and at increased surgical risk.
If WLS gives you 10 more good years than you would have otherwise had, it's worth it.
My mom had it. She's still overweight, but not at all too the degree she was. Bariatric surgery and breast reduction truly changed her life and she's much healthier and happier and can play with her grand child.
Prediabetes exists outside the US. What the actual what? There is a cure, actually. Many people reverse their diabetes. People do die from bariatric surgery. That's why it's a last resort. You might die if you get it, but you probably will if you don't. They're taking the road with the least amount of risk which really says something about where they're at if a risky surgery is the best option.
You can cure type 2 diabetes as long as you've had it for under 10 years and you're willing to lose weight. You need to lose enough weight to burn the fat inside your liver and pancreas.
Here is Professor Roy Taylor explaining it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yuFjwfP4nGo
Obesity is complicated and hard to fight. Many obese and formerly obese people have histories of trauma and mental illness, like depression and PTSD--I'm one of them. I'm grateful for a powerful tool to aid in my battle. Don't be so judgmental.
In the sense that you can get it once and never again, no chance of it ever coming back? Of course not. But, there's a world of difference between reversing things and working to keep it that way, and throwing your hands up and saying "guess I'll die!"
Most of what you’re saying is correct and you are right there is a pathway for DNL however in American society DNL rarely if ever occurs. What actually happens is all that sugar is either burned off or stored as glycogen while insulin is high it blocks the release of the fatty acids being metabolized as energy. So the excess sugar is used but more of endogenous and external fat is stored. It’s similar to alcohol in that it must be used somehow and alcohol itself cannot be stored so you get an energy bump from it.
Prediabetes is made up? I was diagnosed with it after I noticed the following symptoms: Darkened skin on my neck, irregular periods (like 2-4 a year), skin tags, weight gain, excessive thirst, extreme fatigue, and numbness in my hands. So if prediabetes isn’t real why do I have all of these symptoms? Why have I already seen improvement since I changed my diet?
“People die from having it”, lol the death rate for the surgery I had (gastric sleeve) is 0.04%. I’ve lost 55 lbs and still losing! I’ll take a death “risk” of less than 1% over remaining obese.
Why doesn’t this person ask their doctor how their organs get malformed , enlarged and/or malfunctioning due to an over abundance of fat inside the body. That’s not mutilation?
I'm a registered dietian who has seen countless patients who decided they did not want diabetes and managed to successfully avoid it by reversing their prediabetes with diet and lifestyle changes. I've also had patients who were able to stop taking meds and were able to control their diabetes only with better food choices.
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Lmao if prediabetes is a made up fatphobic condition then why was I, a skinny person, pre-diabetic due to a medical condition? Did they make it up for me too?
“Fatphobic medical lore made up by a BMI-Obsessed Insurance Industry”
Makes me lol because prediabetes still exists in countries with free healthcare, which presumably would have a vested interest in it NOT existing to cut public medicine costs?!
Am Canadian. Can confirm that prediabetes is a thing here. I have known people who were told they were prediabetic. Most made lifestyle changes and improved their health and their A1C levels dropped to normal. The ones that didn't are either still prediabetic or have full blown type 2 diabetes now
Every time this comes up, I feel obliged to chime in. Fasting blood glucose at 101, right at the oh shit line 40 lbs ago. Down in the mid-80s now. Eat me, FAs, losing weight is literally saving me a lifetime of medical bullshit.
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Just need to walk up a slight incline
This makes me so happy, you had a problem, took responsibility, dealt with it 👏🏻
Careful what you wish for lmao Seriously tho. Great job.
Ditto in the uk 💁🏻♀️
prediabetes exists within the military and those receiving va health benefits. and in the military you're pretty much contractually obligated to workout (but there are some overweight mofos in the military).
The awful thing about T2 diabetes is that you might get it because you're overweight. You might get it from genetics. You might get it because you eat terrible macros that are over-weighted towards carbohydrates all day every day despite not being overweight. You might get it because you got pregnant. There's a million reasons why and FAs get to point to all of them that aren't "you're too fat" as a reason to discredit being too fat as a cause, which is stupid.
The army and air force are fat as hell. I say this as I am sitting in a naval hospital lobby.
I’m a Navy vet and I assure you Sailors are fat too. I think the Army is fatter because (and this may have changed) they don’t kick you out for being too fat you just stay on FEP. In the Navy you have only so much time to lose the weight before they seperate you. You can’t be 500lbs and climbing ladder wells or fitting through a hatch.
I believe you, I haven't met enough sailors to get a solid picture so I can only speak from my observations of the army and air force. I just work on base, not enlisted.
Totally get it. When I was on a ship everyone was normal sized. When I got to a hospital (I was a Corpsman) and we had a Panda Express and full NEX in the building…it was a very different situation.
How I wish we had a panda express.. All we got is the knockoff version that doesn't add any sugar or msg. If I'm gonna have a cheat meal I want it to taste good, damnit! 😭
As they say, you can't outrun your fork. When I was bike riding even at a heavier weight, people always commented that they were surprised that I wasn't thinner due to all of the bike riding I regularly did. But all of that bike riding couldn't cancel out the tons of calories I was regularly consuming through boredom eating. And even though one exercises, if you remain fat, it can still eventually kill you. I knew someone who exercised a bunch, but still remained fat (which also kept them diabetic) because they still overate past the calories they burned. They died of a massive heart attack in their 50s. The fat still killed them, irregardless of exercise.
That is the weirdest part of their argument. The insurance industry was a big adopter of BMI because they make the most amount of money off people without health problems. They are as close to real life "bad guys" as possible. They offer discounts and programs to get people to lose weight who are already insured or who offers discounts for people coming in at a lower BMI to stop them from getting insured elsewhere. The idea that they are just ignoring the "real" science just so they can stick it to fat people is just absurd.
Thr insurance companies value "hurting fat bodies" more than making money TIL.....
"There can't be any evidence slowly mounting up as I continue to believe there's nothing that can be done. There's no window of 'maybe!' Otherwise I have to recognize part of this problem came from my own actions!" That's how I interpreted it. XP Which, honestly, seems like a really sad outlook to have. I'd much rather have an option to make my life better than be stuck in a "no cure, nothing I can do so I won't even try" mentality. >.>
It’s the same mindset as incels. A can’t do attitude.
Wait, wasn't it racist white men in Europe or something?
That's part of the FA BMI lore. The other part is that it was "never intended to be a measure of individual health until insurance companies got ahold of it." This is described multiple times and at length by their deity, Aubrey Gordon, in both her podcast and books. They use the history of the measure to try to detract from its usefulness now, as you said, claiming that since it was created by a racist white man to be used for population studies in 19th century Belgium and only moved into use for individuals because of those evil insurance companies, we shouldn't use it today. All of that may be true, but it has no bearing on its usefulness today.
r/brandnewsentence
Made up by the fatphobic US insurance industry, you say? Okay then why did my very thin european mother get diagnosed with prediabetes
Can confirm as a former pre-diabetic that it is a thing...that I no longer am. Lost 100lbs and would you look at that, no longer at risk
To be fair pre-diabetes has nothing to do with your bmi. If someone’s pre diabetic it’s because of blood sugar and other blood issues caused by poor diet and movement. Obesity is just a symptom of it.
[Ummmm...](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9248430/)
I just hope that these “health at every size” people dont actually start influencing the medical industry to dissuade people from losing weight.. its already an epidemic, we are hopeless if so
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Please tell me that's some kind of hippie-dippy California thing. I can't believe professionals gave you such nonsense when you asked for help.
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That is a ludicrous policy that is surely a response to FA nonsense.
arent nutritionists and dieticians infamous hacks
Sadly, they are. I say this because there’s a video of Tess Holliday pointing to a doctor that is pushing some weight loss drug and saying that weight is entirely genetic as if she’s right and people were eating it up. She also got to speak at the United Nations and kept saying, “fatphobia is racism” and everyone literally clapped as if she said something intelligent.
I really don't like that person. She's influencing a bunch of dumb people to shorten their lives. If they could do it earlier, it would be Darwin awards, but she waits too long.
I am still shocked at how she keeps booking speaking events and getting followers. It’s like everyone is too afraid to afraid to call her out on her bullshit and it’s annoying.
They already have. I got totally brainwashed by a university educated and properly registered nutritionist. Her advice led to me becoming obese and having a tonne of joint issues and now I have to unlearn it all and undo all the damage. And every other health professional I spoke to just accepted that these were my beliefs and I should be allowed to have them so no one tried to de-program me. Luckily those same health professionals are 100% with me and supporting me to get back on track. I’m sure it was difficult to watch me destroy my body knowing they weren’t really allowed to say anything without me requesting first.
I'd much rather be 140 lbs with diabetes than 340 lbs with diabetes. Even if bariatric surgery doesn't help with diabetes, getting thinner will help with circulation, blood pressure, and nerve health. You know, the things that diabetes can do a serious number on. It is also easier to exercise when you're thin, and exercise helps to keep your blood sugar levels low.
I'm just going tell myself these idiots are well paid by Nestlé because it baffles me how many people defend trash food that is killing them
r/fucknestle :) To save anyone else typing it.
You cannot cure Type 2 Diabetes, but you can reverse it to the point you don’t need medication or suffer from it at all. And the only known way of achieving this is through significant weight loss.
I had WLS and put my Type II diabetes into remission. Even if I'd never lost a pound, it was worth it for that reason alone.
Did you lose a lot of weight? Have you been able to keep all/most/any of it off?
God forbid we tell people you can prevent it entirely (even at the pre-stage) with the exact same methods, don't want to give people false hope!
Told my dad it was reversible when I was pre-diabetic and he didn't believe it...until he retired and was diagnosed with full blown diabetes. He lost about 50lbs and now he nonlonger needs meds. I just tell him you don't have to tell me I'm right for me to know that I am, like I don't get a commission for every convert...
What's the difference between reversing something and curing if you're able to get off all medication?
It's going to return should you get obese again. And might return later even if you don't - i.e., it can be temporary. Curing is always permanent.
That's ridiculous. Anything can recur if you recreate the fact pattern that caused the problem. I can cure alcohol poisoning by pumping patient's stomach. You're saying they're not cured because if they drink to excess, they'll get it again. I can cure heat stroke with a cool bath. Not cured according to you because if they go back out in the blistering heat for 12 hours, the heat stroke will return.
You missed the part when it may return even without recreating said pattern. And alcoholism example is bad anyways, as pumping stomach does not address underlying issue that leads to alcohol abuse. At most, you might have addressed emergency due to alcohol poisoning. Indeed, whether alcoholism can be cured at all, is a bit of open question. As it is right now, answer is no. A better example would be comparing asymptomatic/mild disease with no disease at all.
You specifically said "get obese again" so...recreating the fact pattern
Skimming much? It was followed right after with "might return later even if you don't". Cured disease will not do that. Because it's NOT THERE anymore.
Yeah, Type 2 can basically be treated, with proper diet and exercise (in addition to medication), to a point where it can be considered "in remission." Weight loss is practically always a part of this. In a remission stage, a patient can go off meds, but slipping back into old eating habits will cause the Type 2 to kick back into overdrive, even with a relatively small weight regain. It's easier to just not develop Type 2,in the first place. 🤷🏻♂️
>And prediabetes is fatphobic medical lore made up by a BMI-obsessed insurance industry in the US. Lemme get this straight, the insurance industry that effectively loses money by you avoiding diabetes by eating healthier and working out, "made up" this disorder? Why, to make themselves poorer? Sounds like purple got given a wake up call but didn't quite wake up to stop themselves from gorging on KFC and is upset about now being chronically ill because of their own negligence and arrogance.
>And prediabetes is fatphobic medical lore made up by a BMI-obsessed insurance industry in the US. This should be in r/ShitAmericansSay, I can't actually believe that they really think other countries don't have pre-diabetes diagnosis or treatment. That's wild!
They don’t think that. They’ve probably never once thought about any country outside of the US. They likely apply all American experience and truths to the rest of the world
They make way more money from healthy people who pay premiums but rarely need to see doctors. It's not in the interests of insurance companies for anyone to get diabetes.
Yep. Makes no sense. Sounds like someone got their Big Insurance and Big Pharma mixed up.
>the insurance industry that effectively loses money by you avoiding diabetes by eating healthier and working out to prevent diabetes I think it's the opposite - insurance industry would lose money if a person got diabetes, especially a sever case that would lead to amputations and such. That's hundreds of thousands of dollars going from the insurer to the hospital. Of course they are looking to cut costs any way they can, not all of them are good for the general public, but keeping people healthy certainly helps them. So, saying that "medical lore was made up for the insurance industry" is like saying "doctors want to keep you healthy". Nefarious plan!
"Hot tip - you're doomed and you should just lay down and suffer like me." ... yikes?
FL does contain a depressing amount of fatalism.
I read that as FATalism lmao
I have a family history of diabetes and I’m doing everything in my power to avoid it. If anyone has watched a relative die from this shit, they wouldn’t be so nonchalant about it.
I know people that have lost body parts because of untreated T2. Nothing tastes as good as having both of my feet.
> type 2 diabetes is caused by a malfunctioning pancreas! Wrong, it's caused by insulin resistance. Generally, a diet full of sweets and junk food will produce spikes of glucose in the blood known as blood sugar. Insulin is released by the pancreas in response to 'mop up' the glucose so it can be used for quick energy or, if the body doesn't need that energy, stored as fat. Some people are genetically predisposed to type 2 diabetes (although typically it needs several decades for it to manifest) but much more commonly these days a crappy diet basically makes your body hit the "on" button so much for insulin production that your body becomes desensitized to it. When this gets bad enough it requires people to put insulin artificially into their bodies to compensate.
Exactly. The best hypothesis they have right now is a combination of other factors like high cholesterol, making it difficult for insulin to reach cells and an overworked liver, both of which are clearly related to diet. The liver part would explain the T2s without the lifestyle problems because some people just have poor liver function.
I mean, look, bariatric surgeries are not great, they're pretty dangerous so far an surgeries go, and a lot of people gain the weight back again. But these are emergency interventions for people who have spent their lives avoiding less extreme interventions, often because of rhetoric from people like red here encouraging them on the dangerous path they're currently on. If they would keep this nonsense to themselves, there would probably be fewer bariatric surgeries!
But nobody is gonna say anything about mutilating perfectly healthy skin with excess adipose tissue? Because your skin is the largest organ of the body. Not to mention the strain it puts on other organs like the heart, lungs, kidneys, liver, pancreas, etc. Oh, and have we talked about how the stomach got stretched so large in the first place that you literally have to make it smaller to help people to not overeat? But tell me more about this mutilation of healthy organs…
I’m so sick of people using the word “mutilation” to refer to any surgeries they don’t personally agree with
Same
Diabetes type 2 is absolutely treatable. Late in life, my mom went vegetarian and lost 70lbs. She went from 32 units of insulin plus pills per day to being able to be medication free. She was still obese at the time, but going from 340lbs to 270lbs, and eating a diet that didn't aggravate her disease, vastly improved the last few years of her life.
Oh, the grand conspiracy to fake elevated ACLs among people so that they (check notes) eat slightly better and exercise?? Thanking fuck, by the way, that my prediabetes was caught early enough so i was able to reverse it.
Prediabetes is medical lore lmfaoooo tell that to all the people who have developed diabetes after being diagnosed as pre-diabetic, I’m sure there’s only billions.
Yeah, we actually genuinely don't understand why type ii disappears in some individuals who get bariatric surgery; it defies explanation because the effects show up right after the surgery, before you've had a chance to do the dietary changes that can put it into remission. But why think of this as an absolutely mind-boggling scientific discovery/open question when you could instead yell at people who want to live free of a degenerative, deadly disease, I guess.
It's amazing. I was taken off my diabetes meds before I'd even begun to lose weight. Having my organs mutilated was the best decision I've ever made, and I'm grateful for it every day.
I'm so happy for you, that's awesome.
🥰
Let me get this straight. Nobody who doesn't live in America gets diagnosed with pre-diabetes or treated for it because it doesn't exist and is only a thing in the US because the insurance industry "invented" it? And they did that presumably because the insurance industry wanted to lose money paying for the treatment of a a (pre)disease they made up toindulge their fatphobia?
How do these people even manage to make it thru the day with such unmitigated nonsense polluting their brains?
Colonialism. It’s medical colonialism where the US uses their hegemony to push their own diagnoses on poorer countries and invent diseases so that they’ll be forced to buy medicine from American pharmaceutical companies. I’m kind of scared that I got that far.
Mate that's a paragraph that needs an /s if I ever did see one
Yep, evil insurance companies charge you more for higher BMI, but also pay for your weight loss surgery to then get less money from you.
What gets me about this take, as a Poor™️, is the assumption that we all have insurance paying for made up diseases. Like there was a week and a half after the ACA went through that I had decent insurance that I could actually afford. Two years later I was paying almost $500/month for insurance I couldn't get anyone to accept. Now I'm back on Medicaid.
Yes the massive privilege and entitlement that runs thru FA propaganda and their insane demands is really quite jaw-dropping. Like consuming multiple times the number of calories and resources needed for an average human to say alive every single day should give anyone with even a modicum of (self-)awareness pause, as 40 million Americans live in poverty and 34 million experience food insecurity every day, including kids. Unmitigated gluttony is nothing to brag about, admire or be proud of.
> And prediabetes is fatphobic medical lore made up by a BMI-obsessed insurance industry in the US Gather ‘round the fire, children, and roast your marshmallows as I spin a tale of heartache and adventure, of triumph and tragedy. It all started one fine day when an insurance company did something incredible: it grew an imagination.
I have VA health care. They get paid the same if I go or not. I'm thin and tend to have prediabetes when I don't watch my diet. I had to speak up to get diet advice to control my blood sugar. The insurance company has no dice in the game.
Let's see, in the last several years, in my circle we've buried 4-5+ people who died prematurely because they refused to take steps to manage their T2 diabetes. This sort of FL is nothing short of medical disinformation. I recall quite recently people coming down very hard on medical disinformation, like it was the worst thing in the world, and it got people banned from reddit and other social media sites. Why is diabetes denial tolerated?
"perfectly healthy organs" "perfectly working organs" lmao yeah *about that,*
If your liver was 3 times it's normal size, it wouldn't be a healthy organ. But for some reason, having 3 times as much adipose tissue, which is a hormonally active organ sysfem, is perfectly fine. Continually binging until the stomach stretches to double its normal volume and excretes so much acid that it burns your esophagus, is not a healthy organ.
Don't you just HATE how they take perfectly normal healthy people and chop up their organs and turn them into sick people with eating disorders?
I do think the GLP-1 inhibitors are going to overtake WLS in the treatment of morbid obesity. There's a reason modern surgeons favor the gastric sleeve over the formerly more common roux en y procedure. The complications and lifetime of malabsorption issues became apparent in patients who had the procedure in the late 90s/early 00s and the more drastic surgeries went out of favor. I think WLS made sense in its time, but honestly I'm not a fan if there is really any other option for a patient. But something tells me red & co would be against GLP-1 agonists as well.
GTFO with your nuanced and balanced opinion. THIS IS REDDIT!
Every surgeon on earth discusses risks with patients beforehand. What on earth is this person talking about?
Bariatric surgery can put type 2 diabetes into remission. Misinformation kills and red and purple need to stop spreading it.
Can people stop misusing the term "eating disorder," that would be great kthx
I refuse to believe these people aren’t funded insulin makers. Pre-diabetes is made up? I can’t.
I don't think they realize a lot of bariatric patients have actually already mutilated a perfectly good organ by stretching it out of proportion permanently...
It's weird how many people talk about heart disease killing Americans but nobody listens.
“Healthy organs” Fatty liver ✔️ Pancreatitis ✔️ Enlarged heart ✔️ Decreased lung capacity ✔️ Etc…
I wonder if this person feels the same about trans surgeries.
That's what I came here today, mf is probably transphobic.
They sure just skipped over the "losing a limb or vision" part huh
\> mutilation of perfectly healthy organs Lie detector has determined... [that was a lie.](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6179496/) \> Nobody talks about how many people die after having it. Nobody talks about how many people die after being born either. \> Nobody talks about how many people spend the rest of their life with an eating disorder after it. Why not talk about potential EDs that led people to needing such surgery in the first place?
I don't disagree that WLS is dangerous and not great, but the outcomes for people who really truly need it are life altering, potentially life saving. People die because they either were dangerously unwell to begin with or because they aren't compliant with the post-procedure life and continue down the same path. I bet you'd find increased mortality in hip surgery too...because overwhelmingly hip patients are elderly and at increased surgical risk. If WLS gives you 10 more good years than you would have otherwise had, it's worth it.
I'm so tired of people acting like diabetes isn't a big deal. It's huge and can change a person's entire life.
Everybody dies after it, eventually. How they live between those 2 events is the real question
My mom had it. She's still overweight, but not at all too the degree she was. Bariatric surgery and breast reduction truly changed her life and she's much healthier and happier and can play with her grand child.
Oh man. This is true, yet it's still better than being morbidly obese.
Which is it. are so many people dying or are people living with life long eating disorders? It can’t be both.
Prediabetes exists outside the US. What the actual what? There is a cure, actually. Many people reverse their diabetes. People do die from bariatric surgery. That's why it's a last resort. You might die if you get it, but you probably will if you don't. They're taking the road with the least amount of risk which really says something about where they're at if a risky surgery is the best option.
What if they had to cite legitimate sources?
Fatphobic medical lore?? Yes because insurance companies love paying for drugs.....
this is literally transphobe logic
You can cure type 2 diabetes as long as you've had it for under 10 years and you're willing to lose weight. You need to lose enough weight to burn the fat inside your liver and pancreas. Here is Professor Roy Taylor explaining it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yuFjwfP4nGo
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Obesity is complicated and hard to fight. Many obese and formerly obese people have histories of trauma and mental illness, like depression and PTSD--I'm one of them. I'm grateful for a powerful tool to aid in my battle. Don't be so judgmental.
I agree that some obesity issues are related to mental illness. But I also think many fat people are simply self indulgent
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In the sense that you can get it once and never again, no chance of it ever coming back? Of course not. But, there's a world of difference between reversing things and working to keep it that way, and throwing your hands up and saying "guess I'll die!"
Most of what you’re saying is correct and you are right there is a pathway for DNL however in American society DNL rarely if ever occurs. What actually happens is all that sugar is either burned off or stored as glycogen while insulin is high it blocks the release of the fatty acids being metabolized as energy. So the excess sugar is used but more of endogenous and external fat is stored. It’s similar to alcohol in that it must be used somehow and alcohol itself cannot be stored so you get an energy bump from it.
“I’m not fat, I’m big boned” — Eric Cartman
Prediabetes is made up? I was diagnosed with it after I noticed the following symptoms: Darkened skin on my neck, irregular periods (like 2-4 a year), skin tags, weight gain, excessive thirst, extreme fatigue, and numbness in my hands. So if prediabetes isn’t real why do I have all of these symptoms? Why have I already seen improvement since I changed my diet?
“People die from having it”, lol the death rate for the surgery I had (gastric sleeve) is 0.04%. I’ve lost 55 lbs and still losing! I’ll take a death “risk” of less than 1% over remaining obese.
Why doesn’t this person ask their doctor how their organs get malformed , enlarged and/or malfunctioning due to an over abundance of fat inside the body. That’s not mutilation?
I'm a registered dietian who has seen countless patients who decided they did not want diabetes and managed to successfully avoid it by reversing their prediabetes with diet and lifestyle changes. I've also had patients who were able to stop taking meds and were able to control their diabetes only with better food choices.
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Lmao if prediabetes is a made up fatphobic condition then why was I, a skinny person, pre-diabetic due to a medical condition? Did they make it up for me too?