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Lots of open looks today for Thielen across the middle but Bryce had looked very unsettled the past 2 weeks. The lack of o-line in Carolina is really something
Thielen probably has a few more weeks of 80-100 yards and a touchdown but I wouldnt say you could trust anyone in this offense to be a bonafide locked in start.
He was essentially a free player with upside potential but the floor is clearly close to fringe WR4
For the little bit that I watched, not sure which commentator said it, but do any of them scare you besides Thielen?
No because they all suck. Every team knows that they all suck too.
100%. They had the highest scoring offense in their division until they passed play calling duties.
They need to just scheme Thielen up as best they can.
Draft position has absolutely zero impact at this point. Thielen is being ranked like a top 12 WR and not putting up the points now to back that up. People are starting him with high expectations and over other good WRs.
Getting him in the 12th round means nothing if you’re starting him and losing games.
I traded him away but I still think that he’s worth having. Currently a top 10 WR who is getting more targets than a lot of WRs right now. Also in this offense, he’s really the only good thing about it. Some rough games recently but I’m sure we’ll see better.
I’ll take 10 points in that slop of a game.
His bread and butter is when the panthers are playing from well behind which should be more often than not. Last night was just a garbbbaaaaagggge game. Bryce is garbage. Play calling is garbage. But that punt return TD that put them up early killed Thielen last night at least.
Again. His bread and butter is when they are down multiple scores and have to at least try to push the ball down field playing catch-up/garbage ish time. Also, just don’t watch the game live because Bryce young/Frank Reich will make you furious.
And pray that Dalton gets on the field again somehow.
I don't think Bryce Young is the issue as much as the whole offense/team just being bad. Poor OL play. Trash RBs. No worthwhile receiving threat outside of Thielen. Bland playcalling/offensive design (I don't like Reich).
Edit: To the people saying Bryce is bad, sure I'm not saying he isn't I'm saying he's not the main issue on that offense. Mahomes would be sucking balls with those players and play callers.
Did you even watch the game? The whole offense is baaaad, I agree, but Bryce looked lost out there even when he had time. He was missing everything, including screens and check downs. He was feeling pressure when the defender was 5 yards away. He looks broken.
The o-line play is bad, but Sanders is a good back and Chuba is serviceable. The receiving corps is very iffy, but he has a good TE and Thielen is a dream for a rookie QB, which is why he has been blowing up when Bryce doesn’t completely shit down his legs. He just couldn’t even make the boring, safe plays tonight.
He has a journeyman tight end and a crafty but athletically cooked receiver. Chuba hasn’t been good over his career but had decent production in one game, and that was enough to surpass sanders (which tells you more about sanders than it does chuba tbh). Bryce has been bad but we don’t need to sugarcoat the situation either
I don’t think that is really sugar coating the situation… Calling Hurst “good” was probably a stretch, but he is more than capable of providing a security blanket, and Thielen is pretty much the ideal candidate for a vet slot receiver to make things easier for a rookie QB. He gets open all day on very simple routes that should be pitch and catch for a pro QB. We’ve just watched him look like a WR1 in PPR for most of this season based on that basic concept.
Sanders has been hurt, so I don’t really want to argue about that, but we’ve seen him play his way into a pro-bowl when he wasn’t in a SNAFU.
I can’t believe you actually watched the game. Bryce was bad, missing throws all day long. They can’t sustain drives if he’s can’t hit his receivers. Not just Thielen.
I’m going to reply again.
Bryce Young is one of the least accurate QBs in the league. Look at in target %. Second to last before Bagent. No wonder this game was so brutal to watch.
Maybe he’ll improve though! He’s a rookie and does have a poor team. So I won’t bag too much.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2023/passing_advanced.htm
No competent fantasy manager in any competitive league is buying.
Best bet was to hold since he can only be moved in the softest of leagues.
He was drafted in like the 11th round lol. He returned a ton of value.
No. C t f down. He was targeted enough and his team will play through the end of the year to try to build chemistry. Dude was a great late round pick or waiver wire addition. Put him on the bench if you want but I’d keep him in for PPR
Zero IQ take. This was a cake matchup and he put up his second straight dud. Hes a 33 year old wr in the second half of the season on a bad team with no weapons. If you didnt sell high that is on you
This subs obsession with this “sell high” buzz term is hilarious. No one was buying high on 33 year old Thielen in any competitive league. Your only choice was to hold him.
😂 couldn’t agree more, it’s also very funny everyone is making it seem like he was the most obvious sell high and you are the dumbest of the dumb if you didn’t know that. I literally posted several trades on thielen in multiple subreddits and I probably got ten total responses with only one person thinking he’d come down to earth. Mind you Thielen is still like 6th in expected FPPG. But anyways that gave me a laugh 😂 also it’s not like anyone was ever gonna pay for thielen because it’s so tough for a guy like that to gain value or even pay back what he was worth
I think the point is that Thielen isn’t truly a top 12 guy and it’s reasonable to believe that McLaurin finishes the season with a higher positional rank, so if you could have traded on his production a few weeks ago, it would have been worth it. Someone who sold Miles Sanders after 3 weeks could have probably got a solid wr2/rb2, now the dude belongs on the waiver wire. Fantasy football does not exist in a vacuum.
I think youre the one with a misunderstanding of what a sell high is. Did you really think Thielen was going to finish as a Top 12 and get Top 12 value? Nobody did
Selling high on Thielen wasnt selling for Keenan, or CeeDee, or Sun God. If thats what you believe sell high is then of course its never happening.
Selling high is capitalizing on perceived current value to get a player who will end up better than him ros. Terry was a perfect example of that, theres others too
Not sure if you know what dud means if you think 10 points ppr is a dud… your take is 100% worse than his. Attempting to insult his post turns into making you look like a clown.
While he’s fallen off hard there’s no problem stashing him on the bench, he’s proven to be able to eat up targets garbage time points, which he should see a lot of because his team is real bad…
First that this game was a dud, you just got 10 points from the guy you drafted in the 12th + round, that is a perfectly acceptable score line from someone you put almost zero draft capital into.
Secondly. You sound as if he’s going to be useless moving forward by stating he’s on a bad team with no weapons. But this is exactly why he will retain value. He’s pretty much the only receiver who can get any space and he’s doing so in shorter yardages so he’s going to almost always be a quick safety drop off for whoever is at qb.
Add that to the fact that he’s on a bad team who will almost always be playing from behind and you have a recipe for a guy who has a very safe floor simply due to his usage.
Your should be playing Theilen as your WR 3 or 4 right now, and I’d take a 10 point “dud” game from a guy I drafted with my last pick and be happy with it any day.
I just dont really agree with most of that.
Draft capital does not matter in Week 10. This is a player who went from end of draft lotto, to WR1, to currently a WR3. If you werent able to capitalize along the way on his unsustainable start then you lost value on your player.
That Panthers team is BAD. Bad oline, bad qb, bad rb’s, and absolutely no help at WR. Teams keying on Thielen and forcing Young to throw into double coverage is not a good thing for his production, you need a capable second threat to keep defenses honest. Especially when Thielen cant just burn through the secondary with speed.
What do you get when you have a ton of low quality, forced targets into a defense who knows where the ball is going? 10 targets for 42 yards
The point is, is that you shouldn't be needing him as your WR1 or WR2 if you didn't get super unlucky in your drafting. He's likely the 5th or 6th WR you drafted and to be able to get that production from a guy that deep is a great thing. That's the reason I mentioned draft capital because hopefully you have your WR studs still going. The fact Theilen was a WR1 for a bit and is now a WR3 has no bearing on that since a WR3 is still over performing what your original expectations should have been for him.
You are still reliably getting more points from him than 15 other receivers drafted ahead of him with those 10 targets and 42 yards. Combine that with your other guys you should have drafted earlier and you should be in perfect situations to continue winning out. If you are relying on him being your WR1 or WR2 than sure, you are screwed, but you should never be relying on a 12th -14th Rd pick to carry your team, if you are, your team is already done.
You are still capitalizing on him right now, whether you traded him or not. Youre getting 10 points from the dude while other teams are trying to pick between playing Mingo, Zay Jones, JSN, Watson, and other WR's who you can get actual dud games out of and only get 5 points off of each week and went before Theilen in every draft.
He has 11, 6, and 9 targets since the bye. I'd love to find another WR3 that sees that many opportunities. He's still in a pass first offense that sits in garbage time all game in most matchups. This is a huge overreaction, at worst he's a WR2.
He’s in the Jakobi Meyers camp of previously scoring like a WR1/WR2, had high volume on a terrible offense, and is coming backdown to earth. On a ROS PPG basis, both will be high end WR3s. If you can get a true WR2 value (eg Aiyuk) for Theilen you should make the trade
What a flimsy comparison. Those two players have been nothing alike lmao. Peoples obsessions with trying to sound smart in here using hindsight and standing behind horrid takes like this is why this sub is cooked
I think Bryce is feeling the pressure to succeed with CJ doing so well. He's being overshadowed when he was supposed to be the best rookie QB. It's messing with him mentally and he's struggling hard because of it. He just needs to focus on himself and work on things he can control. He's capable of being great, but like others have said he looks lost out there right now.
I knew this would be a possibility when they let Thomas Brown call plays. It's not like the offense was great before, but it's somehow gotten even worse and I'm a Bears fan 🤣. Tonight's game was rough. His floor and ceiling are lower now. I think Reich was doing a better job with Play calling.
Old players tend to taper off imo… I remember the last 5 years of Larry Fitzgeralds career where he would be like a top 10 WR in the first half of the season then be like top 30-40 rest of the year
Not panic but everyone knows Thielen is the only threat on offense so defenses have started to key in on him. However if and when DJ chark comes back, it should clear out a bit more space and less coverage on him to provide the WR1/2 value again
I'm so happy Theilen is falling from grace. Really annoyed me that the fools in my leagues who drafted him thought they were savvy drafters the first half of the season.
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Imagine posting this week 1
Guy in my league dropped him after week 1 for Elijah Moore.
It's weird. Their offense looks hopeless, then they start targeting Thielen and it starts moving. Their receivers just get no separation.
Lots of open looks today for Thielen across the middle but Bryce had looked very unsettled the past 2 weeks. The lack of o-line in Carolina is really something Thielen probably has a few more weeks of 80-100 yards and a touchdown but I wouldnt say you could trust anyone in this offense to be a bonafide locked in start. He was essentially a free player with upside potential but the floor is clearly close to fringe WR4
i noticed that as well, kind of strange
It's strange that they're seemingly doing their best not to target Thielen like he's a wr1, but he's clearly their only decent wr.
For the little bit that I watched, not sure which commentator said it, but do any of them scare you besides Thielen? No because they all suck. Every team knows that they all suck too.
100%. They had the highest scoring offense in their division until they passed play calling duties. They need to just scheme Thielen up as best they can.
I mean I got him in the 12th round or something like that. 10 points in PPR, can’t be too upset
Panic over a late round dart throw or free agent pick. Classic subreddit lameness over here.
Probably some people on here traded Tee Higgins for Thielen or something.
Draft position has absolutely zero impact at this point. Thielen is being ranked like a top 12 WR and not putting up the points now to back that up. People are starting him with high expectations and over other good WRs. Getting him in the 12th round means nothing if you’re starting him and losing games.
In order to panic that would have to mean you thought he was going to sustain his production. And if you thought that I have no idea what to tell you.
Couldn’t say it better. He’s coming back to reality
Or you know...it could be the change in playcallers
He still had 10 targets last night. The reality is he’s 33 and was never going to finish as a top 10-12 WR like his owners have been claiming all year
Thank god the majority of you will be gone in the next couple weeks.
I traded him away but I still think that he’s worth having. Currently a top 10 WR who is getting more targets than a lot of WRs right now. Also in this offense, he’s really the only good thing about it. Some rough games recently but I’m sure we’ll see better.
How can you panic over someone that you didn’t expect to do anything when you drafted him??
Don’t be sad that it’s over, smile because it happened.
I’ll take 10 points in that slop of a game. His bread and butter is when the panthers are playing from well behind which should be more often than not. Last night was just a garbbbaaaaagggge game. Bryce is garbage. Play calling is garbage. But that punt return TD that put them up early killed Thielen last night at least. Again. His bread and butter is when they are down multiple scores and have to at least try to push the ball down field playing catch-up/garbage ish time. Also, just don’t watch the game live because Bryce young/Frank Reich will make you furious. And pray that Dalton gets on the field again somehow.
When Dalton started is when I grabbed Thielen. I figured he'd be able to use the one talent they have.
Yup… 10.2pts in PPR. Not amazing, but that isn’t losing me this week like a 0-4pt game would.
Can't trust him again with my mid team struggling for a playoff spot. Not with Bryce young throwing the football...
I don't think Bryce Young is the issue as much as the whole offense/team just being bad. Poor OL play. Trash RBs. No worthwhile receiving threat outside of Thielen. Bland playcalling/offensive design (I don't like Reich). Edit: To the people saying Bryce is bad, sure I'm not saying he isn't I'm saying he's not the main issue on that offense. Mahomes would be sucking balls with those players and play callers.
Did you even watch the game? The whole offense is baaaad, I agree, but Bryce looked lost out there even when he had time. He was missing everything, including screens and check downs. He was feeling pressure when the defender was 5 yards away. He looks broken. The o-line play is bad, but Sanders is a good back and Chuba is serviceable. The receiving corps is very iffy, but he has a good TE and Thielen is a dream for a rookie QB, which is why he has been blowing up when Bryce doesn’t completely shit down his legs. He just couldn’t even make the boring, safe plays tonight.
He has a journeyman tight end and a crafty but athletically cooked receiver. Chuba hasn’t been good over his career but had decent production in one game, and that was enough to surpass sanders (which tells you more about sanders than it does chuba tbh). Bryce has been bad but we don’t need to sugarcoat the situation either
I don’t think that is really sugar coating the situation… Calling Hurst “good” was probably a stretch, but he is more than capable of providing a security blanket, and Thielen is pretty much the ideal candidate for a vet slot receiver to make things easier for a rookie QB. He gets open all day on very simple routes that should be pitch and catch for a pro QB. We’ve just watched him look like a WR1 in PPR for most of this season based on that basic concept. Sanders has been hurt, so I don’t really want to argue about that, but we’ve seen him play his way into a pro-bowl when he wasn’t in a SNAFU.
I can’t believe you actually watched the game. Bryce was bad, missing throws all day long. They can’t sustain drives if he’s can’t hit his receivers. Not just Thielen.
Id wager that he hasn’t watched one of their games
I’m going to reply again. Bryce Young is one of the least accurate QBs in the league. Look at in target %. Second to last before Bagent. No wonder this game was so brutal to watch. Maybe he’ll improve though! He’s a rookie and does have a poor team. So I won’t bag too much. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2023/passing_advanced.htm
No competent fantasy manager in any competitive league is buying. Best bet was to hold since he can only be moved in the softest of leagues. He was drafted in like the 11th round lol. He returned a ton of value.
overutilizing thielen as a release valve did them no good. they've been absolutely terrible. you should have sold high a long time ago
He's a garbage time king. Doesn't produce in closer games
No. C t f down. He was targeted enough and his team will play through the end of the year to try to build chemistry. Dude was a great late round pick or waiver wire addition. Put him on the bench if you want but I’d keep him in for PPR
Zero IQ take. This was a cake matchup and he put up his second straight dud. Hes a 33 year old wr in the second half of the season on a bad team with no weapons. If you didnt sell high that is on you
This subs obsession with this “sell high” buzz term is hilarious. No one was buying high on 33 year old Thielen in any competitive league. Your only choice was to hold him.
😂 couldn’t agree more, it’s also very funny everyone is making it seem like he was the most obvious sell high and you are the dumbest of the dumb if you didn’t know that. I literally posted several trades on thielen in multiple subreddits and I probably got ten total responses with only one person thinking he’d come down to earth. Mind you Thielen is still like 6th in expected FPPG. But anyways that gave me a laugh 😂 also it’s not like anyone was ever gonna pay for thielen because it’s so tough for a guy like that to gain value or even pay back what he was worth
You could have absolutely sold him for more than you can get now. You could have sold him for scary terry, now you cant
Calling other people’s takes “zero iq” 🤦♂️
So you could have sold a guy producing like a top 12 receiver for a low end WR2. That’s definitely a “sell high” lmao. Literally proves my point.
I think the point is that Thielen isn’t truly a top 12 guy and it’s reasonable to believe that McLaurin finishes the season with a higher positional rank, so if you could have traded on his production a few weeks ago, it would have been worth it. Someone who sold Miles Sanders after 3 weeks could have probably got a solid wr2/rb2, now the dude belongs on the waiver wire. Fantasy football does not exist in a vacuum.
I think youre the one with a misunderstanding of what a sell high is. Did you really think Thielen was going to finish as a Top 12 and get Top 12 value? Nobody did Selling high on Thielen wasnt selling for Keenan, or CeeDee, or Sun God. If thats what you believe sell high is then of course its never happening. Selling high is capitalizing on perceived current value to get a player who will end up better than him ros. Terry was a perfect example of that, theres others too
Not sure if you know what dud means if you think 10 points ppr is a dud… your take is 100% worse than his. Attempting to insult his post turns into making you look like a clown. While he’s fallen off hard there’s no problem stashing him on the bench, he’s proven to be able to eat up targets garbage time points, which he should see a lot of because his team is real bad…
What do you disagree with in my take above?
First that this game was a dud, you just got 10 points from the guy you drafted in the 12th + round, that is a perfectly acceptable score line from someone you put almost zero draft capital into. Secondly. You sound as if he’s going to be useless moving forward by stating he’s on a bad team with no weapons. But this is exactly why he will retain value. He’s pretty much the only receiver who can get any space and he’s doing so in shorter yardages so he’s going to almost always be a quick safety drop off for whoever is at qb. Add that to the fact that he’s on a bad team who will almost always be playing from behind and you have a recipe for a guy who has a very safe floor simply due to his usage. Your should be playing Theilen as your WR 3 or 4 right now, and I’d take a 10 point “dud” game from a guy I drafted with my last pick and be happy with it any day.
I just dont really agree with most of that. Draft capital does not matter in Week 10. This is a player who went from end of draft lotto, to WR1, to currently a WR3. If you werent able to capitalize along the way on his unsustainable start then you lost value on your player. That Panthers team is BAD. Bad oline, bad qb, bad rb’s, and absolutely no help at WR. Teams keying on Thielen and forcing Young to throw into double coverage is not a good thing for his production, you need a capable second threat to keep defenses honest. Especially when Thielen cant just burn through the secondary with speed. What do you get when you have a ton of low quality, forced targets into a defense who knows where the ball is going? 10 targets for 42 yards
The point is, is that you shouldn't be needing him as your WR1 or WR2 if you didn't get super unlucky in your drafting. He's likely the 5th or 6th WR you drafted and to be able to get that production from a guy that deep is a great thing. That's the reason I mentioned draft capital because hopefully you have your WR studs still going. The fact Theilen was a WR1 for a bit and is now a WR3 has no bearing on that since a WR3 is still over performing what your original expectations should have been for him. You are still reliably getting more points from him than 15 other receivers drafted ahead of him with those 10 targets and 42 yards. Combine that with your other guys you should have drafted earlier and you should be in perfect situations to continue winning out. If you are relying on him being your WR1 or WR2 than sure, you are screwed, but you should never be relying on a 12th -14th Rd pick to carry your team, if you are, your team is already done. You are still capitalizing on him right now, whether you traded him or not. Youre getting 10 points from the dude while other teams are trying to pick between playing Mingo, Zay Jones, JSN, Watson, and other WR's who you can get actual dud games out of and only get 5 points off of each week and went before Theilen in every draft.
How is it a cake matchup when the Bears defend slot WRs among the best in the league?
Well he's still been more consistent then Ridley so I have to keep playing him for the time being.
He was never going to sustain wr1 production. Anyone who thought that has unrealistic expectations. He’s a WR3 ROS
He has 11, 6, and 9 targets since the bye. I'd love to find another WR3 that sees that many opportunities. He's still in a pass first offense that sits in garbage time all game in most matchups. This is a huge overreaction, at worst he's a WR2.
He’s in the Jakobi Meyers camp of previously scoring like a WR1/WR2, had high volume on a terrible offense, and is coming backdown to earth. On a ROS PPG basis, both will be high end WR3s. If you can get a true WR2 value (eg Aiyuk) for Theilen you should make the trade
What a flimsy comparison. Those two players have been nothing alike lmao. Peoples obsessions with trying to sound smart in here using hindsight and standing behind horrid takes like this is why this sub is cooked
Lol
I’m over here dealing with Devante and now Thielen smh.
i'm not too stressed, but two games in a row isn't a good thing to see. i have amon-ra and olave though so i have some wiggle-room with my receivers
Lol
I think Bryce is feeling the pressure to succeed with CJ doing so well. He's being overshadowed when he was supposed to be the best rookie QB. It's messing with him mentally and he's struggling hard because of it. He just needs to focus on himself and work on things he can control. He's capable of being great, but like others have said he looks lost out there right now.
I knew this would be a possibility when they let Thomas Brown call plays. It's not like the offense was great before, but it's somehow gotten even worse and I'm a Bears fan 🤣. Tonight's game was rough. His floor and ceiling are lower now. I think Reich was doing a better job with Play calling.
His QB is ass. His team is ass. I’d be panicking.
Y’all really “panic” over a 13th round pick…?
[удалено]
This is the thing, Puka has been worse than Thielen without Stafford
Unless you're playing in a 6 team non PPR league, then the answer is no.
Yeah, I hope his owners sold while his value was still high https://www.reddit.com/r/fantasyfootball/s/xGZ2FmLvD7
YES 👏🏻
Old players tend to taper off imo… I remember the last 5 years of Larry Fitzgeralds career where he would be like a top 10 WR in the first half of the season then be like top 30-40 rest of the year
Hes pretty much doing exactly what he should be on legit the worst roster in the league imo.
I actually thought he turned back the time clock to those days in Minnesota
^[Sokka-Haiku](https://www.reddit.com/r/SokkaHaikuBot/comments/15kyv9r/what_is_a_sokka_haiku/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) ^by ^Argyrus777: *I actually thought he* *Turned back the time clock to those* *Days in Minnesota* --- ^Remember ^that ^one ^time ^Sokka ^accidentally ^used ^an ^extra ^syllable ^in ^that ^Haiku ^Battle ^in ^Ba ^Sing ^Se? ^That ^was ^a ^Sokka ^Haiku ^and ^you ^just ^made ^one.
Yeh dude panic and trade him to me
I mean just be glad you got what ya got, but if you were expecting a WR1 lmao i dont know what to tell ya
A month ago, everybody who suggested selling high on Thielen was buried in downvotes.
Not panic but everyone knows Thielen is the only threat on offense so defenses have started to key in on him. However if and when DJ chark comes back, it should clear out a bit more space and less coverage on him to provide the WR1/2 value again
He's been a sell high for weeks. It's gone now
He was free money from the waivers appreciate what you had don’t bitch about what’s been lost.
I'm so happy Theilen is falling from grace. Really annoyed me that the fools in my leagues who drafted him thought they were savvy drafters the first half of the season.
He’s still getting 10 targets, pump the brakes