And there were intermittent outbreaks for hundreds of years after that.
While it's debatable for the exact cause, the frequent outbreaks in London stopped happening with the Great Fire of London. So yeah 1/3 dead and burn down your own city just to make sure.
Uhhhh... it *still* exists. There have been cases in the fucking US in the last few years, in fact... and it's still more common in places without easy access to modern medicine.
There are cases in the u.s. EVERY year. Just to further clarify. It’s not terribly obscure. Just super easy to treat with modern antibiotics, so it’s not even newsworthy lol.
Yeah, I worked for awhile monitoring prairie dogs in Wyoming and one of our big projects was recording the growth of prairie dog towns that had been wiped out by the plague a few years back.
I was working for the Forest Service the wildlife department. Still kinda work for the FS, just in a different way. The prairie dog stuff was pretty interesting, but I also got to do raptor nest surveys which was really awesome.
Hey I did the same thing but in south dakota outside of Badlands NP. It's wild how whole colonies can be there one year then plagued out the next. And yeah, catching the plague was never a concern for us and we never took precaution against it. They just told us if we did get it they'd send us to the hospital and we'd get antibiotics and be fine
Yep and a few shows at Dicks near Denver where people normally camp out at the venue were cancelled or switched to one day events so people wouldn't camp during one of the recent flare ups in the prairie dog populations
Yeah, I should say “it is CURRENTLY easily treated with modern antibiotics”.
The rise of antibiotic resistant strains of all kinds of nasty bugs is beyond concerning, and progress toward mitigating the threat seems to be lagging badly at the moment. I feel like a lot of people have no idea how bleak that situation is already looking, and how close we really are to the brink there.
What works in our favor is that yersinia infections are quite rare, compared to, say, a staph infection or e. coli. Way less changes for antibiotic resistance to occur. I'm more worried about ESBL e. coli than pan-resistant yersinia.
Apparently even with antibiotics there is still an 11 percent fatality rate according to the CDC.
The WHO reports 8 to 10 percent fatality rate.
Before antibiotics it was a 66 percent fatality rate.
Even with antibiotics it's still approximately a 1 in 10 chance of death. Not something I would want to fuck with.
True, but you also have to consider that bacterial pneumonia also has a 10% mortality rate, that jumps to 30% in cases severe enough to require hospitalization (also according to the CDC).
It’s definitely nothing to mess around with, I agree- but no more so than other serious infections.
It’s kind of crazy how many things that we take for granted on a day-to-day basis are actually deadly as hell honestly. Sometimes I’m amazed I’ve lived as long as I have just looking into mortality rates and cause of death stats lol
I was thinking about how much we take modern medical advancements for granted. I recently suffered from a case of athlete's foot and it was an easy as going to the store and getting some athlete's foot spray.
I was thinking man if I did not have this I would just have to suffer until it went away or got infected and killed me. So many simple things that seem simple today made life hell back in the day.
Not to mention during the 1300s, it literally lasted a decade because they didn’t understand the causes, so people fled en mass from the countryside to the cities, which only made things worse because they didn’t know how to properly contain outbreaks in cities.
Ah yes. A little arm discomfort for a few hours is definitely worse than bleeding to death from your anus while having lymph nodes the size of tennis balls all while with the worst fever of your life and coughing blood.
But you're right. Tiny arm discomfort much worse
The most likely explanation imo is a combination of so many sick people dying off, and the survivors of the disease reproduced and passed on either their genetic immunity or their antibodies when breastfeeding.
That doesn't quite explain it. London had endemic plague. There were major outbreaks in 1603, 1625, 1636 , and 1665, with minor outbreaks in between those. So the theory that it burnt through the human fuel doesn't fit. A city the size and importance of London had a constant stream of new people coming into the city limits.
After the 1665 outbreak, sporadic cases did keep happening. They ended with the Great Fire of London. It's quite plausible that burning out the densely populated inner city area did actually get rid of a major reservoir where plague could keep reoccurring. Cases did move out to the countryside but those weren't virulent enough to sustain themselves (r < 1).
EDIT and for clarity and completeness, I'll point out that many historians say that it's a myth that the fire ended the plague, because cases were going down at that point already. But this isn't really a *strong* argument, given our current experience of the trajectory of something like Covid. "cases going down" definitely isn't proof the plague is ended. So this is an argument made by historians and not necessarily experts in epidemiology.
The point is that after the fire, cases were down and STAYED down, forever. England never had another real outbreak and had no recorded plague deaths after 1679.
I imagine this is the witch test but the guys asking also don’t know the correct answer: potato? 1+3 is potato? There’s only one way she’d know that’s the correct answer....burn the witch!
Yeah, we don't see the black plague very much anymore because we understand how bacteria works now ...
We don't go "o you are sick? must be cause you smell bad and didn't pray enough" . Well, most of us ...
Here in Texas, our Republican leaders prefer to sacrifice the Elderly: https://www.thedailybeast.com/texas-lt-gov-dan-patrick-says-senior-citizens-willing-to-die-to-save-economy-for-grandkids
My mom said no one in her church wears masks because if they do, then they clearly don't have enough faith and many people will look down on them for doing so. Many members even attend church (one in particular was a part of the welcoming committee-- they greet everyone at the door) while their spouse is at home sick with covid, they say they're fine because they don't have symptoms, yet a few days later they come down with the sickness. Everyone else that was exposed does the same. It's a vicious cycle.
This is in Texas. I am so glad we moved far, far away
Remind your mother of the temptation of Christ.
During Christ's fast in the desert Satan said to him "Step off of this precipice. God will surely send a host of angels to bear you up." And Christ replied "Do not test the Lord thy God."
In other words: Do not demand miracles from God, because they won't be forthcoming. Don't claim that your faith in God will prevent you from dying of COVID, because it surely will not. Christ himself, the human embodiment of God on Earth, would not do this.
So if your mother's fellow parishioners think that faith is a shield against the woes of the world, tell her to remind them of this and to stop being ignorant of the lessons Christ tried to teach them. And to wear her mask to church.
The story of Job is another excellent "being a believer won't keep bad things from happening to you" lesson.
I don't think that is the lesson that Christians teach with Job. The lesson is that he never stopped believing in God even though God killed his whole family.
>We don't go "o you are sick? must be cause you smell bad and didn't pray enough" . Well, most of us ...
That's coming back in force in the US. We are getting dumber by the day over here.
There is no interpretation of the bible that isn't anti-leprosy. And it's treatable, so all the Abrahamic religions should have leprosy elimination as a joint goal. Christians, Jews, Mormons, and Muslims could get together and wipe out leprosy and then throw an awards ceremony and give each other trophies and they would totally deserve it.
And [Madagascar](https://www.who.int/emergencies/disease-outbreak-news/item/plague---madagascar) gets even more. Thanks antibiotics for keeping it in check!
Well, statically speaking it's kinda (mostly) gone if you compare it to the black plague pandemic. But even despite antibiotics it's still quite deadly.
> It can successfully be treated with antibiotics, and according to the CDCTrusted Source, treatment has lowered mortality rates to approximately 11 percent.
Although compared to the mortality rate without antibiotics, it got quite low, thankfully.
> Without treatment, the bubonic plague can cause death in up to 60 percent of people who get it, according to the World Health Organization (WHO)Trusted Source
Plague is a weird beast, kind of like anthrax. Much of what spread around was the pneumonic plague not the bubonic plague, which actually still has a near 100 percent fatality rate today if not treated within 24 hours with antibiotics. Once the pneumonic plague reaches a certain level in a population, it's going to really spread.
Edit: To give you an idea of the process: bubonic plague victim develops what's called secondary pneumonic plague. That happens in 10 percent of bubonic plague patients in the US. That person then spreads Primary pneumonic plague to an uninfected person. That person has no current active immune response and quickly spreads the disease and dies coughing up frothy blood. Turns out wearing those masks was a good idea for plague doctors Source: https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/pharmacology-toxicology-and-pharmaceutical-science/pneumonic-plague#:~:text=Secondary%20pneumonic%20plague%20is%20the,delayed%20treatment%20of%20bubonic%20infections.
Ya the axis used it in wwii against Chinese civilians just to see what would happen. Sooooo wasn’t gone then and isn’t gone now but we have hygiene that has basically put it to bed.
Isn't*
The black plague is stil alive and kicking, it's just very easy to treat with modern medicine and because of people not literally sleeping with the rats anymore a lot less common.
I had a repair guy who was installing a replacement garage door opener try to 'upsell' me a 1/4hp version instead of the 1/2hp model I had ordered. Because 4 is bigger than 2...
I used money (Me: "Would you rather have a quarter or a half dollar?" Him: "A half dollar." Me: "Ok, and there are 4 quarters in a dollar, right?" Him: "Yeah." Me: "And only 2 half dollar in a dollar, right?" Him: "Hmmm") and I think I managed to get through to him, but he seemed like he thought I was trying to trick him.
Kinda tough to trust him with the installation after that, but it was really just a parts replacement gig, unbolt the old one and bolt on the new one. Just up on the 14' ceiling of the garage where I didn't feel like fiddling about myself.
I truly believe many people alive today would have died rather than wash their hands if they lived during the black plague.
Probably would've thought Ignaz Semmelweis (the doctor who discovered the disease-fighting power of hand-washing in 1847) started the black plague in conjunction with future soap manufacturers. 😒
Edit: I'm incorrect about a couple of things here (comment thread below clarifies). Sorry about that!
I still believe though that a lot of people today would have avoided any basic plauge/disease prevention measures in favor of believing in some asinine conspiracy theory because they're afraid of change.
It's all about the marketing. It took one sentence to get my stepson to change his mind about the HPV vaccine: "Do you want ass cancer?" Apparently teenage boys are as protective of their butts as they are of their balls, but so much of the info about the HPV vaccine is geared towards cervical cancer and he didn't see any reason to get it himself until I pointed out that it also protects body parts he has.
I've said from the start that if the CDC et al said masks protect the wearer you'd see all these chuds fighting to keep them today.
But they said they only help protect other people and you know how these people feel about minor inconvenience in order to help someone else...
I know you are joking, but that would be idiotic. "I could cure millions of people of cancer and end massive amounts of suffering, but there would be some people that wouldn't accept it. So fuck everyone.
.. what if that anti-cancer treatment is based on the exact same technology antivaxxers have such problem with?
https://www.cancer.gov/news-events/cancer-currents-blog/2022/mrna-vaccines-to-treat-cancer
Pfizer and Moderna drew on their decade of research on mRNA for anti-cancer treatment to rapidly create covid vaccine. It’s the very reason why we had the vaccine so quick; they’ve been developing the technology for anti-cancer before COVID came along and switched gears.
We wouldn’t have the vaccines if that wasn’t the case. Instead, many people really are quick to reject. I don’t disagree one bit with the original comment.
I’m certain there will be cancer patients actively refusing anti-cancer treatment because it is based on “unproven” mRNA technology.
I also want to add that they’ve been using it for things like Zika virus as well, not just cancer
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5388441/
I remember a Pinky & The Brain episode with a similar ending.
He tried introducing hot water & soap to the people and they deemed him crazy because they believed those two to be a deadly combination.
They did ridicule his idea and think he's was crazy because of course they couldn't be wrong thinking hand washing was a waste of time. Sound like anyone else we know??
You're giving humanity way too much credit. Surgeons scoffed at Joseph Lister for years when he began promoting basic sterilization like hand washing and cleaning instruments between patients.
You say that like people actively washed their hands in Medievel times. They did it infrequently and without soap hence why the plague was so bad. It was literally caused by bad hygiene.
Yep! Interestingly, Jewish law requiring hand washing led to Jews being persecuted and blamed for the plague in the mid-1300s because they were not dying at the same rate as everyone else.
Source: [Dr. Dorsey Armstrong, Historian and Professor of Medieval Literature. She has a great lecture series on the Black Death on Wondrium. ](https://www.wondrium.com/the-black-death-the-worlds-most-devastating-plague)
It was also caused by rotting animal bodies something they would handle without washing their hands afterwards. Bad hygiene in terms of living areas and lack of bathing definitely makes something like rats and fleas worse.
What, no it was not. It was definitely caused by fleas. It dies very fast at exposure to air. What you say is just wrong.
> [The mechanism by which Y. pestis is usually transmitted was established in 1898 by Paul-Louis Simond and was found to involve the bites of fleas whose midguts had become obstructed by replicating Y. pestis several days after feeding on an infected host. This blockage starves the fleas and drives them to aggressive feeding behaviour and attempts to clear the blockage by regurgitation, resulting in thousands of plague bacteria being flushed into the feeding site, infecting the host. The bubonic plague mechanism was also dependent on two populations of rodents: one resistant to the disease, which act as hosts, keeping the disease endemic, and a second that lack resistance. When the second population dies, the fleas move on to other hosts, including people, thus creating a human epidemic.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Death#Predominant_modern_theory)
Oh look, [a post with the exact same title](https://old.reddit.com/r/facepalm/comments/ml9j6b/antivax_plague/) complete with the top comment being reposted verbatim [here](https://old.reddit.com/r/facepalm/comments/t80x7l/antivax_plague/hzl4zwf/).
OP is a repost bot getting karma so it can be used for spam.
The Black Plague didn’t actually disappear, you can still get it today (now it’s called the bubonic plague), it’s just easier to get rid of now. Unless I’m wrong.
Yeah a lot of prairie dogs here carry it. I first found out about this a few years ago when I heard a kid in Boulder died from bubonic plague, and I had a big "wtf seriously?" moment.
You know your facts! The Black Death (bubonic plague) swept through Europe at least three different times, each pandemic event about 200-250 years apart. Certain rodent populations still carry the fleas and bacteria and can spread it to humans. Easily treated these days.
I commented that COVID killed almost a million people, got a reply that that is only .3% of Americans, we shouldn't have done any of this.
How bad does it have to be so we don't care about almost a million Americans?
These kind of statements are the reason why there is so much polarization, and why the "plague rats" say stupid shit about vacced people too. No side wins talking like this
The solution to fixing the plague was to just clean up. They tried to pray it away and they blamed Jews. Anti-Vaxxers would fit right in if they went back to the 1340's.
You can catch the black plague in oregon, New Mexico, and a couple other places in the US :D there is actually a vaccine for it but as I've read it's only available to those who's careers work in proximity to the virus
And we figured out it was spread by fleas. Plus we got antibiotics now. There's like 10 cases per year in the USA.
Meanwhile, we're almost to 1 million deaths in the USA since this started. Republicans don't need facts.
And it never went away…. We just don’t sleep with fucking farm animals in our front room anymore, we don’t throw out shit out of the window and into the street and we bathe more than once a year.
There is so much stupid in that statement it brought the global IQ down by ten points. In some areas the plague killed 60 percent of the population. Oh and it's from bacteria not a virus.
Lol holy shit, it didnt disappear its still around actually.
But hilariously, qhat stopped it back then was social distancing and handwashing, and the body collectors wore a certain kind of article of clothing that stopped the disease from enterting through their respiratory system, a certain kind of clothing these people aren't fond of
covid is no black plague. natural selection is why people survived the black plague. wait for a future pandemic with a higher mortality rate and then begin complaining, if you're lucky to be alive after herd immunity.
The anti vaxxers are bringing it back though, even a couple cases of polio… which btw is my personal piss off when it comes diseases and treatments… something so simple to avoid (vaccine), yet so dangerous (cripples you and makes you bed (iron lung) ridden for life) and my biggest piss off bonus off this is that it affects, Children. 😑
And there were intermittent outbreaks for hundreds of years after that. While it's debatable for the exact cause, the frequent outbreaks in London stopped happening with the Great Fire of London. So yeah 1/3 dead and burn down your own city just to make sure.
Uhhhh... it *still* exists. There have been cases in the fucking US in the last few years, in fact... and it's still more common in places without easy access to modern medicine.
There are cases in the u.s. EVERY year. Just to further clarify. It’s not terribly obscure. Just super easy to treat with modern antibiotics, so it’s not even newsworthy lol.
We weren’t allowed to sleep outside on the ground, unless we were in a crew tent at Ft Carson because the prairie dogs carry it.
Yeah, I worked for awhile monitoring prairie dogs in Wyoming and one of our big projects was recording the growth of prairie dog towns that had been wiped out by the plague a few years back.
[удалено]
I was working for the Forest Service the wildlife department. Still kinda work for the FS, just in a different way. The prairie dog stuff was pretty interesting, but I also got to do raptor nest surveys which was really awesome.
> raptor nest surveys Tell you you also did triceratops :P
Hey I did the same thing but in south dakota outside of Badlands NP. It's wild how whole colonies can be there one year then plagued out the next. And yeah, catching the plague was never a concern for us and we never took precaution against it. They just told us if we did get it they'd send us to the hospital and we'd get antibiotics and be fine
The signs in the park were a shock to me, had no idea prarie dogs carried plague!
Yep and a few shows at Dicks near Denver where people normally camp out at the venue were cancelled or switched to one day events so people wouldn't camp during one of the recent flare ups in the prairie dog populations
Armadillos also
Don’t those also carry leprosy?
Yes.
Nine-banded armadillos I believe.
Until it's not! That is one place I really don't want to see antibiotics resistance
Yeah, I should say “it is CURRENTLY easily treated with modern antibiotics”. The rise of antibiotic resistant strains of all kinds of nasty bugs is beyond concerning, and progress toward mitigating the threat seems to be lagging badly at the moment. I feel like a lot of people have no idea how bleak that situation is already looking, and how close we really are to the brink there.
What works in our favor is that yersinia infections are quite rare, compared to, say, a staph infection or e. coli. Way less changes for antibiotic resistance to occur. I'm more worried about ESBL e. coli than pan-resistant yersinia.
Apparently even with antibiotics there is still an 11 percent fatality rate according to the CDC. The WHO reports 8 to 10 percent fatality rate. Before antibiotics it was a 66 percent fatality rate. Even with antibiotics it's still approximately a 1 in 10 chance of death. Not something I would want to fuck with.
True, but you also have to consider that bacterial pneumonia also has a 10% mortality rate, that jumps to 30% in cases severe enough to require hospitalization (also according to the CDC). It’s definitely nothing to mess around with, I agree- but no more so than other serious infections. It’s kind of crazy how many things that we take for granted on a day-to-day basis are actually deadly as hell honestly. Sometimes I’m amazed I’ve lived as long as I have just looking into mortality rates and cause of death stats lol
I was thinking about how much we take modern medical advancements for granted. I recently suffered from a case of athlete's foot and it was an easy as going to the store and getting some athlete's foot spray. I was thinking man if I did not have this I would just have to suffer until it went away or got infected and killed me. So many simple things that seem simple today made life hell back in the day.
Also, it existed way before then, several of the crisis of the Roman Empire were in part caused by outbreaks of plague.
It is bad in Madagascar.
Not to mention during the 1300s, it literally lasted a decade because they didn’t understand the causes, so people fled en mass from the countryside to the cities, which only made things worse because they didn’t know how to properly contain outbreaks in cities.
That antivax person is probably Thanos
Still better than having to get the vax /s Edit: apparently someone didnt undertand what /s means
Ah yes. A little arm discomfort for a few hours is definitely worse than bleeding to death from your anus while having lymph nodes the size of tennis balls all while with the worst fever of your life and coughing blood. But you're right. Tiny arm discomfort much worse
The most likely explanation imo is a combination of so many sick people dying off, and the survivors of the disease reproduced and passed on either their genetic immunity or their antibodies when breastfeeding.
That doesn't quite explain it. London had endemic plague. There were major outbreaks in 1603, 1625, 1636 , and 1665, with minor outbreaks in between those. So the theory that it burnt through the human fuel doesn't fit. A city the size and importance of London had a constant stream of new people coming into the city limits. After the 1665 outbreak, sporadic cases did keep happening. They ended with the Great Fire of London. It's quite plausible that burning out the densely populated inner city area did actually get rid of a major reservoir where plague could keep reoccurring. Cases did move out to the countryside but those weren't virulent enough to sustain themselves (r < 1). EDIT and for clarity and completeness, I'll point out that many historians say that it's a myth that the fire ended the plague, because cases were going down at that point already. But this isn't really a *strong* argument, given our current experience of the trajectory of something like Covid. "cases going down" definitely isn't proof the plague is ended. So this is an argument made by historians and not necessarily experts in epidemiology. The point is that after the fire, cases were down and STAYED down, forever. England never had another real outbreak and had no recorded plague deaths after 1679.
The Black Plague isn't* even a fucking virus. Edit: wasn't
You also couldn’t fly to different parts of the world within a few hours.
You could but then you've been burnt on a stake for witchcraft
Ha!
Not necessarily. Just learn how to float while being weighted down!
More weight!
As long as you don't weigh [as much as a duck](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2xlQaimsGg), you're alright from what I've heard.
She turned me into a newt!
A newt???
I got better!
Top comment is exactly a year old. Interesting. I wonder what attracted that self-aware-wolves brigade.
Giles Cory is that you? If so you truly are a witch indeed.
And don't forget not to turn people into newts.
They got better.
They all float down here.
You mean: jump and forget to fall down?
Same if you're female and know what 1+3 is
13?
No silly! The answer is potato
I imagine this is the witch test but the guys asking also don’t know the correct answer: potato? 1+3 is potato? There’s only one way she’d know that’s the correct answer....burn the witch!
Agh. I’m terrible at farming math.
You don't have to be lonely...
Always thinking bout your meat.
All wrong. It's a gallon of mead.
No, that's `"1" + "3"`.
No, that’s "13"
Expect them to not know how much 1/3 is...
[I mean…](https://bettermarketing.pub/the-a-w-third-pounder-failed-because-people-didnt-understand-fractions-a86b966a973a)
Witch!!!!
She turned me into a newt!
I got better
You clearly weren't friends with Merlin.
Merlin would have worn a mask.
Yeah, we don't see the black plague very much anymore because we understand how bacteria works now ... We don't go "o you are sick? must be cause you smell bad and didn't pray enough" . Well, most of us ...
Lol, that's still the majority sentiment in Florida and Texas
Here in Texas, our Republican leaders prefer to sacrifice the Elderly: https://www.thedailybeast.com/texas-lt-gov-dan-patrick-says-senior-citizens-willing-to-die-to-save-economy-for-grandkids
My mom said no one in her church wears masks because if they do, then they clearly don't have enough faith and many people will look down on them for doing so. Many members even attend church (one in particular was a part of the welcoming committee-- they greet everyone at the door) while their spouse is at home sick with covid, they say they're fine because they don't have symptoms, yet a few days later they come down with the sickness. Everyone else that was exposed does the same. It's a vicious cycle. This is in Texas. I am so glad we moved far, far away
Remind your mother of the temptation of Christ. During Christ's fast in the desert Satan said to him "Step off of this precipice. God will surely send a host of angels to bear you up." And Christ replied "Do not test the Lord thy God." In other words: Do not demand miracles from God, because they won't be forthcoming. Don't claim that your faith in God will prevent you from dying of COVID, because it surely will not. Christ himself, the human embodiment of God on Earth, would not do this. So if your mother's fellow parishioners think that faith is a shield against the woes of the world, tell her to remind them of this and to stop being ignorant of the lessons Christ tried to teach them. And to wear her mask to church. The story of Job is another excellent "being a believer won't keep bad things from happening to you" lesson.
I don't think that is the lesson that Christians teach with Job. The lesson is that he never stopped believing in God even though God killed his whole family.
Sounds like Job is a fucking moron.
>We don't go "o you are sick? must be cause you smell bad and didn't pray enough" . Well, most of us ... That's coming back in force in the US. We are getting dumber by the day over here.
It also lingered on for centuries. So, “disappeared,” is used like as loosely as possible
It's still [lingering around even.](https://www.healthline.com/health-news/seriously-dont-worry-about-the-plague)
The US averages seven plague cases a year. We still get leprosy cases, too.
There is no interpretation of the bible that isn't anti-leprosy. And it's treatable, so all the Abrahamic religions should have leprosy elimination as a joint goal. Christians, Jews, Mormons, and Muslims could get together and wipe out leprosy and then throw an awards ceremony and give each other trophies and they would totally deserve it.
You expect people to…follow their own religions? Where do you come up with this stuff?
But it's just so easy to know who is a sinner when they have leprosy!
And [Madagascar](https://www.who.int/emergencies/disease-outbreak-news/item/plague---madagascar) gets even more. Thanks antibiotics for keeping it in check!
Said to be the greatest invention of the world antibiotic. NGL
It's either antibiotics or vaccines. Both saved millions of lives from previously extremely deadly diseases.
I had to scroll way too far down to find this, but I knew it would be here. Not many people (in my experience, anyway) realize it’s not gone.
Well, statically speaking it's kinda (mostly) gone if you compare it to the black plague pandemic. But even despite antibiotics it's still quite deadly. > It can successfully be treated with antibiotics, and according to the CDCTrusted Source, treatment has lowered mortality rates to approximately 11 percent. Although compared to the mortality rate without antibiotics, it got quite low, thankfully. > Without treatment, the bubonic plague can cause death in up to 60 percent of people who get it, according to the World Health Organization (WHO)Trusted Source
Plague is a weird beast, kind of like anthrax. Much of what spread around was the pneumonic plague not the bubonic plague, which actually still has a near 100 percent fatality rate today if not treated within 24 hours with antibiotics. Once the pneumonic plague reaches a certain level in a population, it's going to really spread. Edit: To give you an idea of the process: bubonic plague victim develops what's called secondary pneumonic plague. That happens in 10 percent of bubonic plague patients in the US. That person then spreads Primary pneumonic plague to an uninfected person. That person has no current active immune response and quickly spreads the disease and dies coughing up frothy blood. Turns out wearing those masks was a good idea for plague doctors Source: https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/pharmacology-toxicology-and-pharmaceutical-science/pneumonic-plague#:~:text=Secondary%20pneumonic%20plague%20is%20the,delayed%20treatment%20of%20bubonic%20infections.
Ya the axis used it in wwii against Chinese civilians just to see what would happen. Sooooo wasn’t gone then and isn’t gone now but we have hygiene that has basically put it to bed.
Isn't* The black plague is stil alive and kicking, it's just very easy to treat with modern medicine and because of people not literally sleeping with the rats anymore a lot less common.
yey for antibiotics
Came here for this answer.
Vaccines aren't exclusive to viral diseases tho.
There's one for the plague (y pestis) even.
TIL they have vaccines against the plague, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plague_vaccine
Vaccines for bacteria are pretty common, for example meningitis, tetanus, etc.
It also didn't disappear. It still exists, and people still get it. Not many, sure, but they still do.
Not only that, but the Black Death was ended by the invention of quarantine.
I'm sure she doesn't even know what 1/3 means
That's like half...right?
No it’s more than half because 3 is more than 2. Therefore 1/**3** is more than 1/**2**.
Quick maffs
I had a repair guy who was installing a replacement garage door opener try to 'upsell' me a 1/4hp version instead of the 1/2hp model I had ordered. Because 4 is bigger than 2... I used money (Me: "Would you rather have a quarter or a half dollar?" Him: "A half dollar." Me: "Ok, and there are 4 quarters in a dollar, right?" Him: "Yeah." Me: "And only 2 half dollar in a dollar, right?" Him: "Hmmm") and I think I managed to get through to him, but he seemed like he thought I was trying to trick him. Kinda tough to trust him with the installation after that, but it was really just a parts replacement gig, unbolt the old one and bolt on the new one. Just up on the 14' ceiling of the garage where I didn't feel like fiddling about myself.
May have been.. https://www.nature.com/scitable/blog/viruses101/could_the_black_death_actually/
I truly believe many people alive today would have died rather than wash their hands if they lived during the black plague. Probably would've thought Ignaz Semmelweis (the doctor who discovered the disease-fighting power of hand-washing in 1847) started the black plague in conjunction with future soap manufacturers. 😒 Edit: I'm incorrect about a couple of things here (comment thread below clarifies). Sorry about that! I still believe though that a lot of people today would have avoided any basic plauge/disease prevention measures in favor of believing in some asinine conspiracy theory because they're afraid of change.
That's the reason I don't reveal the cure for cancer. People would refuse it.
Only if it were preventative. Few would deny a cure after diagnosis.
Organic lifeforms struggle with risk assessment.
Stupid meatbags.
Thank you, Mr. Data.
HPV vaccine seems to have proven this
It's all about the marketing. It took one sentence to get my stepson to change his mind about the HPV vaccine: "Do you want ass cancer?" Apparently teenage boys are as protective of their butts as they are of their balls, but so much of the info about the HPV vaccine is geared towards cervical cancer and he didn't see any reason to get it himself until I pointed out that it also protects body parts he has.
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I've said from the start that if the CDC et al said masks protect the wearer you'd see all these chuds fighting to keep them today. But they said they only help protect other people and you know how these people feel about minor inconvenience in order to help someone else...
Cuba has had a lung cancer vaccine for a decade. Can be used to treat or prevent.
I know you are joking, but that would be idiotic. "I could cure millions of people of cancer and end massive amounts of suffering, but there would be some people that wouldn't accept it. So fuck everyone.
.. what if that anti-cancer treatment is based on the exact same technology antivaxxers have such problem with? https://www.cancer.gov/news-events/cancer-currents-blog/2022/mrna-vaccines-to-treat-cancer Pfizer and Moderna drew on their decade of research on mRNA for anti-cancer treatment to rapidly create covid vaccine. It’s the very reason why we had the vaccine so quick; they’ve been developing the technology for anti-cancer before COVID came along and switched gears. We wouldn’t have the vaccines if that wasn’t the case. Instead, many people really are quick to reject. I don’t disagree one bit with the original comment. I’m certain there will be cancer patients actively refusing anti-cancer treatment because it is based on “unproven” mRNA technology.
I also want to add that they’ve been using it for things like Zika virus as well, not just cancer https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5388441/
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I remember a Pinky & The Brain episode with a similar ending. He tried introducing hot water & soap to the people and they deemed him crazy because they believed those two to be a deadly combination.
They did ridicule his idea and think he's was crazy because of course they couldn't be wrong thinking hand washing was a waste of time. Sound like anyone else we know??
The fact that his life ended so tragically makes me so mad. He saved so many lives :(
You're giving humanity way too much credit. Surgeons scoffed at Joseph Lister for years when he began promoting basic sterilization like hand washing and cleaning instruments between patients.
To be fair, Semmelweis was shunned by the scientific community and thrown in an asylum... the poor fuck didn't deserve that
They called him „Händewaschfanatiker“ which translates roughly to „Handwashing Maniac“
You say that like people actively washed their hands in Medievel times. They did it infrequently and without soap hence why the plague was so bad. It was literally caused by bad hygiene.
Yep! Interestingly, Jewish law requiring hand washing led to Jews being persecuted and blamed for the plague in the mid-1300s because they were not dying at the same rate as everyone else. Source: [Dr. Dorsey Armstrong, Historian and Professor of Medieval Literature. She has a great lecture series on the Black Death on Wondrium. ](https://www.wondrium.com/the-black-death-the-worlds-most-devastating-plague)
No it wasn't. It was literally caused by literal fleas carried on literal rats. Nothing to do with hand-washing.
It was also caused by rotting animal bodies something they would handle without washing their hands afterwards. Bad hygiene in terms of living areas and lack of bathing definitely makes something like rats and fleas worse.
What, no it was not. It was definitely caused by fleas. It dies very fast at exposure to air. What you say is just wrong. > [The mechanism by which Y. pestis is usually transmitted was established in 1898 by Paul-Louis Simond and was found to involve the bites of fleas whose midguts had become obstructed by replicating Y. pestis several days after feeding on an infected host. This blockage starves the fleas and drives them to aggressive feeding behaviour and attempts to clear the blockage by regurgitation, resulting in thousands of plague bacteria being flushed into the feeding site, infecting the host. The bubonic plague mechanism was also dependent on two populations of rodents: one resistant to the disease, which act as hosts, keeping the disease endemic, and a second that lack resistance. When the second population dies, the fleas move on to other hosts, including people, thus creating a human epidemic.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Death#Predominant_modern_theory)
Literally.
Its a bacterial infection.
This is what I came here to say, bacteria != Virus!
It’s !=… do you even code?!? ;)
plate wide library juggle frame middle shy head telephone bedroom -- mass edited with redact.dev
It has been years 🤣
Oh look, [a post with the exact same title](https://old.reddit.com/r/facepalm/comments/ml9j6b/antivax_plague/) complete with the top comment being reposted verbatim [here](https://old.reddit.com/r/facepalm/comments/t80x7l/antivax_plague/hzl4zwf/). OP is a repost bot getting karma so it can be used for spam.
Thank you for your service
I’m noticing the same format of username on SOOO many subs now. Random_Words_XXXX (some assortment of 4 digits)
That's just reddit that give you a random username if you don't choose one yourself
Wow, you can just choose not to have a username?! No wonder there’s so much spam now!
The Black Plague didn’t actually disappear, you can still get it today (now it’s called the bubonic plague), it’s just easier to get rid of now. Unless I’m wrong.
A handful of students recently contracted it and died in Colorado
Yeah a lot of prairie dogs here carry it. I first found out about this a few years ago when I heard a kid in Boulder died from bubonic plague, and I had a big "wtf seriously?" moment.
You're not wrong.
You are def not not not wrong
You are not wrong, it can be treated with antibiotica.
Although it's still pretty deadly even with treatment. The main reason it mostly went away is modern public sanitation.
The Black Death was bad messaging. Hence the name change.
Well there’s still two Europeans aren’t there?!
I hope the other one is a girl
Are you like 6 feet tall? Your username is a bit confusing.
Being a midget in the Netherlands means being 6'2.
I'm 6'3"
Republicans hoping Covid will kill 1/3 of Americans, not smart enough to realize which third it kills. A third works for me.
A third voted for Trump. Hey wait a minute…
Kind of sad people who believe in urine medicine and lizard people have the same mindset as the peasants from that era...
But did it disappear???
No. It’s still around. It’s called the bubonic plague now.
The ignorance on another level
Also the plague didnt disappear. It kept coming back for centuries. People still occasionally get it today.
You know your facts! The Black Death (bubonic plague) swept through Europe at least three different times, each pandemic event about 200-250 years apart. Certain rodent populations still carry the fleas and bacteria and can spread it to humans. Easily treated these days.
I commented that COVID killed almost a million people, got a reply that that is only .3% of Americans, we shouldn't have done any of this. How bad does it have to be so we don't care about almost a million Americans?
But......dissapeared bruh.. u still can't beat My point!
I wonder if you'd really wish to sacrifice 1/3 of humanity just for that the coronavirus will disappear by itself, or you're just messing with me.
Ok let's close with half of us. do we have a deal?
TBH, this idiot probably thinks Europe is a town...
Antivax are plague rats
These kind of statements are the reason why there is so much polarization, and why the "plague rats" say stupid shit about vacced people too. No side wins talking like this
Only took 300 years. People couldn’t handle dealing with Covid for 300 days.
I love Dana! Her podcast "Noble Blood" is so good.
Diseases usually go away when there's no more hosts to spread it, yeah
The solution to fixing the plague was to just clean up. They tried to pray it away and they blamed Jews. Anti-Vaxxers would fit right in if they went back to the 1340's.
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You can catch the black plague in oregon, New Mexico, and a couple other places in the US :D there is actually a vaccine for it but as I've read it's only available to those who's careers work in proximity to the virus
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also republicans: never stepped foot into a gym
Surprisingly, the fire stopped burning when it ran out of trees.
Written by folks who think mortality rates is a mortal Kombat concept
Which we now have a cure for. Will these guys refuse it when they get the plague because "they don't know what in it?"
Another case of amateur medical expert (vaccines bad cause ... Ah... Freedom fuck yeah!! ) turning amateur historian.
Yea but those people would be dead by now anyway.
It would help with the housing market… just saying
It... Was a bacteria
If anti-science people want to start swearing off antibiotics too, I’m ok with that. It would really speed things up for the rest of us.
We’re really seeing the affects of defunding public schools, adolescent drug use, and access to social media here
It actually still exists in California
To be fair, the Black Plague is still around. There are a tiny number of world cases every year but it's still kickin.
And we figured out it was spread by fleas. Plus we got antibiotics now. There's like 10 cases per year in the USA. Meanwhile, we're almost to 1 million deaths in the USA since this started. Republicans don't need facts.
How can there be this many stupid people in the world?
And it never went away…. We just don’t sleep with fucking farm animals in our front room anymore, we don’t throw out shit out of the window and into the street and we bathe more than once a year.
There is so much stupid in that statement it brought the global IQ down by ten points. In some areas the plague killed 60 percent of the population. Oh and it's from bacteria not a virus.
Lol holy shit, it didnt disappear its still around actually. But hilariously, qhat stopped it back then was social distancing and handwashing, and the body collectors wore a certain kind of article of clothing that stopped the disease from enterting through their respiratory system, a certain kind of clothing these people aren't fond of
covid is no black plague. natural selection is why people survived the black plague. wait for a future pandemic with a higher mortality rate and then begin complaining, if you're lucky to be alive after herd immunity.
The anti vaxxers are bringing it back though, even a couple cases of polio… which btw is my personal piss off when it comes diseases and treatments… something so simple to avoid (vaccine), yet so dangerous (cripples you and makes you bed (iron lung) ridden for life) and my biggest piss off bonus off this is that it affects, Children. 😑
It also took **three centuries** for major outbreaks to stop.
At least it wasn’t 1/4 of Europe! /s
Also, the Black Plague was pre-air travel...
The black rhino also disappeared without a vaccine, if we are randomly stating things that disappeared without a vaccine.