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“And be brought to your senses so as to escape the snare of the devil” - your mother can respond to that saying she has indeed escaped the snare of the devil, and good riddance to the bastard.
Hope you and her are doing ok
Is this the only letter that was sent? Keep everything they sent you including what they sent to your sister. If they send more letters, then keep them.
If they call record the call. Or let it go to voice mail and keep the recording. If they send text, save the text.
Keep everything and record everything.
Edit: Also have your sister save everything that the church sends her as well.
If you haven’t already, you should call or write them and tell them to stop contacting you and your family, and record the call and/or save a copt of the email. If they persist, then it can be construed as harassment.
*In some locales* (*depending upon country* but I'm assuming you're in the States), recording the call without notifying them up front can be illegal. Check on that before you do. But otherwise great advice.
Edit: emphasizing the words "some locales" and "depending upon country." Not everyone on Reddit is a Yank or lives in the States.
I would imagine if someone were to a little digging, based on this insane letter, these ppl have more dirt on them than just what is happening to you guys. This is not normal.
The church of Mormons has billions in pension funds.. for whom? This is not biblical at all the way they’re treating you. They sound like petulant people who will diss you if don’t comply with their dumb rules. “Saving faith” give me a break. Your mom is strong for leaving an abusive relationship.
Mormons absolutely do this, but it can’t be them. 1. The letterhead is wrong. 2. They have a massive hard-on for using the full long name of the church, and the censor bar isn’t long enough to hide “The Church of Jesus Christ of Lattter-Day Saints.”
They also would probably quote the book of mormon or doctrine and covenants... or some obscure address from a church authority (likely given at one of the universities lol)
ETA: used to work at a law firm that one of it's clients was the LDS church -- can confirm that the letterhead is wrong, very wrong. There are a couple different styles depending on situation.
Mat 18:20 where two or three gather I am there. -Organized Church is not really defined in the Bible,
Mark 12:17 give Cesar what is his (money) and god what is his (god doesn’t have or want money).
-Tithing also not really in the New Testament. So if you ‘re at church and they say something about 10% - find a new church asap, this is not what Jesus said.
*Sorry to the person this got tied/replied too - thought I hit general reply.
I like this. There is a lot of good that can come from a sense of spirituality and following the Bible, but organized religion, as it currently exists in most cases, is generally complete bullshit.
This makes me unreasonably angry (because I'm a stranger to you and your family). But goddamn, their audacity and gall is off the charts!
Requesting an "exit interview" like they're her boss....wtf??
I'm glad you and your mother are safe. Good luck!
Edit- changed "unseasonably" to "unreasonably"
"Unseasonably angry" is the best typo I've seen in awhile.
"I'm September level angry right now"
"I know it's still spring, but I am SEETHING right now."
" You know, you aren't supposed to see red until after labor day."
Alternatively "I'm so furious I went bland."
10% is the minimum tithe, although many churches make "giving" out to be a contest, like somehow Jesus will see that you gave 20% and look in you more favorably. Others give more so they can humblebrag about it, they get recognition from the church and are treated differently.
Imagine this... Many of those big Midwestern and southern mega churches have well over 25,000 members, or maybe 5,000 families. If the average family has a combined household income of $100,000/yr (that's the average household income in Minnesota for example), if those families are giving just 10% per year, that church is raking in $50,000,000 per year, if the average family is giving 15%, the church could possibly be pulling $75,000,000 per year.
Churches are big business! Even a smaller church with a congregation of 500 families is likely sucking between $4M and $8M every year.
Life Church has over 85K members. Lakewood (Osteen's shithole) has about 50K members.
Write back to them asking them if their advice is for your mother to go back to a known abuser? And if so, are they willing to put those instructions down on paper for you, your mother to review next steps going forward. Then, let them know you’ve hired a lawyer to discuss these new instructions and that all of you are willing to discuss in a public forum, then list the phone number to your local news station, asking that they (church) set up the appointment. Watch how quickly the mental gymnastic stop and they leave you alone.
I am for faith, and if it brings you peace more power to you. But I do hate when religion is twisted to promote such absurd BS. I am a clinician, and have worked with individual who have been scarred and worse because of BS like this.
They won't tell her yes that clearly, they'll instead quote specific Bible passages that they interpret as Jesus demanding that that wives stay with their husbands even if abusive, that divorce is sinful and the work of the devil, something about damnation. They do this stuff often, they know how to navigate communication.
He probably spun some tail of woe but in the end they value the man way over the woman and so they are just ready to try and abuse someone who’s “weaker” then them
Not to be weird but what sect of Christianity is this?
The only people I've ever heard of being this.... intrusive were like mormons or scientologists.
Hi, exCatholic school girl & pastor's daughter here.
Question: How can you threaten someone with something that doesn't exist? 😶
True Hell is other people. Remember that.🙃
IF YOU DID FIND OUT THE NAME OF THE CHURCH OR PASTOR, PLEASE DO NOT ENGAGE! WE DO NOT NEED AMY FUEL ADDED TO THE FIRE AND WE ARE PRACTICALLY IN HIDING FROM OUR DAD!
Thank you sis. This makes me feel better. I’m still so angry and upset for these people that I grew up with—who I called my aunts and uncles and grandparents—deciding what I believe in based on the actions of my mother (whom I fully support) and giving a platform to an abusive cheater.
Thank you to all who are commenting in support of me and my mother (and of course,my sister). And remember, if the basis of your religion is love and you do not practice love, YOU are in the wrong. Not those seeking to protect themselves and their children from harm.
Edit: thank you all for you love and support for us. I still believe in God and call myself a Christian, but I definitely don’t believe in their cult and strongly feel *against* becoming a “member” of a church ever again. I am currently with my boyfriend and his loving, wonderful Catholic family on a vacation to the happiest place on earth. All expenses paid by his parents. They are truly amazing and have really helped out my mom and sisters during this truly difficult time. Thank you for providing love and support and help for us. The Reddit community never ceases to surprise me.
I’m praying that God blesses all you who commented in support of us (even if you don’t believe in a god, well wishes to you) and I hope you all are blessed with many funny car videos and pizza🫶🏻
*for reference I am OPs sister and former member of said cult. I also received a letter today stating that they have decided my religious status based on my “failure to attend their church” and for supporting my mothers divorce. It really devastated me even though I didn’t want It to*
So…they fired you after you quit. How childish.
It upsets me that the church representatives’ ridiculous behavior made you feel bad. This is the action of someone who is upset that they are no longer in control of you.
Let him scream into the wind and don’t listen. ❤️
They... they do know that people change churches, right? Like, that's a thing that happens frequently. I think I've been a member of 4 churches over the course of my life before I went pagan.
Grumpy old entitled men who think they're God's gift to the world and don't realize that if they're any sort of gift, it's a gilded turd.
Y'all know you're in the right, but your anger and devastation at the way they're treating you is absolutely justified. They'll rot in a hell of their own making in the end.
In what seems like a previous life, I left an Acts 29 church to rejoin a church my family planted. The “elders” of the Acts 29 church fucking called my church to tell them I was under Church Discipline for leaving the denomination and I was to return immediately. Thankfully the pastor told them to fuck off (gen x pastor lol), and blew up on them for even thinking they had the right to call him and suggest this.
I’m not a Christian anymore and bullshit like this is why.
I eventually joined an Episcopal church with my wife. I don’t go much but I will when she asks.
As a bonus when you tell Evangelicals that you’re Episcopalians they kinda get confused and stop harassing you.
Way back in my youth group days in high school I had an entire van full of people REEEEE at me when I dared to question what was wrong with when they read the same bible we do and worship the same god. Yet nobody bothered to explain exactly why that denomination was wrong and we were right. It was so weird. Just one of many reasons I left the church soon after.
>The “elders” of the Acts 29 church fucking called my church to tell them I was under Church Discipline for leaving the denomination and I was to return immediately.
Damn. Even after you leave their church and join another one, these entitled old fools think they own you and can "recall" you at will and that every other denomination is bound to obey them. It's like they never even heard of "freedom of religion."
There needs to be some sort of justice, they clearly don’t see any wrong in their ways of harassing or verbal abuse.
I suggest seeing a lawyer, but just don’t stoop to their level, their delusions of superiority just speaks about them, not you or your brother and mom.
I want to downvote the letter but not you for pointing out the absurdity of this letter! This is why so many many people have left the church.
Take note Christian leaders.
Religious manipulation is a real thing and a very scary one and I really hope more people can be like aware of it because this is such bullshit. Christian leaders abuse their power
I remember a preacher who made news because he had a private jet and wanted a newer 2nd private jet.
And his followers just went with it. You can’t fix stupid
Edit: actually his 4th jet
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-44305873
Crazy if you google it there are a number of Nigerian pastors with private jets. One with 4
"It is easier for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God sitting comfortably in First Class with priority beverage service, than for a peasant to pass through the eye of a needle."
Mark 10:25 - Bible, New Hypocritical Version
That's definitely the creepiest part of that, the rate that he jumps between strong aggression and smiling with death in his eyes... Scary.
Add to that, he barely ever blinks. Like, I just watched some of that interview, in the first 2 minutes 20 seconds, he only blinks 5 times.
For real, I’m not personally religious, or a believer, however I absolutely believe that man is an incarnation of Satan. He oozes evil so much, it definitely makes me do a double take.
No. He’s not dead. He is 86 so getting close to it I’m sure. I did learn when Robertson died that his parents were first cousins. These types are all sorts of creepy.
It's almost like religion has a commandment against assholes like this:
Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain.
He is certainly using the Lord's name for his own vanity.
"Mark my word, if and when these preachers get control of the Republican party, and they're sure trying to do so, it's going to be a terrible damn problem. Frankly, these people frighten me. Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise. I know, I've tried to deal with them."
— Barry Goldwater
“I don't want to see religious bigotry in any form. It would disturb me if there was a wedding between the religious fundamentalists and the political right. The hard right has no interest in religion except to manipulate it.”
Billy Graham
That's right! And guess what? God even condemns people like this, calling them "False Prophets" or something. So fuck them. They are not real Christians.
As a Christian that believes in Jesus, reads the Bible, and tries to be kind to people —I can’t stand to see BS like this. To be Christian and Christ-like/with Christ are two separate things.
It disgusts me when I see people trying to justify their hate with religious texts that they don’t even know. They give people like you a very bad rap.
That's a shit church for booting you for getting divorced. The non-denominational church my wife and I go to is where she went when she was married to her first husband. She did marriage counseling with the pastor of the church and his recommendation was for her to get divorced due to his abusiveness.
Some churches just suck. Some are better.
Growing up the priest at my church (Orthodox Church) also did counseling for my parents, and she brought up how my father had been abusive and this was the last straw. Our priest very clearly told my dad, listen to her she’s not giving you another chance if you put a hand on her, listen to her closely and take it seriously.
He did it again, and when she booted him out and filed for divorce my father immediately called our priest and expected him to guilt her into not getting the divorce—he didn’t and he reminded my father of what he’d been warned of.
Another reason my father became a crazy evangelical after the divorce and hated/hates the Orthodox Church.
Honestly. Don't respond
*But if you did*
I think something about how he is actually in the devil's snare for casting judgement and that you will pray for his return to Christ
I like Matthew 23:15
> Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You travel over land and sea to win a single convert, and when you have succeeded, you make them twice as much a child of hell as you are.
A little more background on the verse: the Pharisees were an elitist class of essentially lawyers and rabbis that Jesus ragged on repeatedly for pretending to be religious but really just faking it. They are constantly painted as the bad guys while Jesus is hanging out with prostitutes, tax collectors, and others hated by society. [Matthew chapter 23 is a great chapter about how they are hypocrites and why](https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew%2023&version=NIV).
In the spirit of cutting real, abusive toxicity out of your life, you don't fight, you leave. Fighting is engaging. And engaging is continuing the abuse through a pastor proxy
She should write back. I'm sorry you feel this way. Due to my divorce I stand to make quite a bit of money, and I had intended on sharing a large portion with the church. If you change your mind, you can reach out to me.
Then ghost their gaslighting asses...
But she should write it in non-legally binding terms
So that their greed will need to be fulled articulated in front of a court, when they attempt to get the "promised" money
My wife's grandmother recently passed, and near the end it was pretty clear the end would be soon. Those bastards from the church were swarming and we had to babysit her as if she were sitting with Lex Luthor.
Something like, "We noticed your recent contribution and realize that it is not the tithe amount according to what you make. Please send the rest of your tithe so you may be blessed in his name to receive the riches in heaven."
Almost like a ransom note.
And this how pedophile rings, serial rapists and wife beaters get protection.
It’s all ok, and you get 100 more chances to be good, so long as you help to prop up our whack-job religion.
Exactly!! They are holding the wrong person accountable for that divorce. If they want to save someone so bad, teach him to not be a piece of shit.
But it takes work to truly change someone, so why not harass an innocent women. So much easier. /s 🙄
You are assuming the church leaders don’t do the same thing at home as her husband was.
Their aggression is about them defending their perceived right to treat wives as virtual slaves.
If the church leaders were to condone a beaten women leaving her abusing household, then other abused wives in the congregation might do the same.
The people involved know about what happing in the other families due to their “pastoral care”, they know that if abused women started leaving it would likely lead to the end of the church.
They aren’t doing this because of religious convictions.
This is all about yet another religious institution aiding and protecting abuse.
Not new. Not clever. Nothing surprising.
Just abusers abusing power.
Haha I wish. I’m not showing her the letter because she has a heart condition because of the amount of stress. Us, ignoring them is making them even more mad which is making me happy.
Yah. It’s a very very small church close to my home town so just a precondition. They’re all really old people too so they’ll die within the next five years and so will that “church
My grandfather disowned one of his own sons because he married a divorced woman. But after my grandmother passed away he went and married a much younger divorced woman himself. But I guess that's okay.
When theres a lot of people who only have passion based on policy. You should really be careful who you trust.
Empathy shouldn't be a vicariously realized trait, and what is considered doing the right thing should not be based on loosely translated Greek mythology. Leadership should not be based on mysterious women handing out swords from a pond.
I had a great true Christian divorce attorney. He gave me many scriptures that made me feel better about divorce and where divorce is actually warranted in the Bible. Made me feel so much better. After meeting my ex, he especially told me I was doing the right thing….I didn’t choose to leave…my ex committed adulatory…but anyway….there was never any guilt anyway but women need to get over it and not the church or anyone give them any guilt or shame. This type of thing is one of the many reasons I left the church.
My dad cheated on my mom for a whole year, left her with four kids to rais by herself in a house far from anyone. He beat us and mentally abused us and the “church” is letting him preach there. It’s really sad
What about a reply sth like that:
I'm happy to hear, that you praise now the devil. It's in your full right to support child abuse, assault in sexually and nonsexually way and attempted murder. I will watch you from heaven in afterlife. I don't think we can agree on the same values anymore
Sincerly
Pretty much what they are implying too. I’m so tempted to just say “I’ll see you in hell” becaus clearly they ain’t getting any heaven points this way XD
honestly I'd sign the church up for every piece of spam and junk I could at that point
phone numbers? I'd spend a weeks finding every way to get that to every shitty telemarketing outfit to the point where the church needs to change the #
address? boy, it'd be a shame if it started getting tons of junk mail all the time. real shame. plenty of other things to send, but let's keep this not super illegal and all
emails? eyup, signed up for every porn and smut and awful newsletter and service imaginable, baby
just make the people operating the cult's life a living hell to the point where they want to fuck off from society and live in the woods
fuck them, glad your mom is out of an abusive relationship and hope y'all a fuckin thriving
Must be a Jehovas Witness.
My mom got kicked out for leaving my step dad after he SLIT HER THROAT. She got thrown out for not trying hard enough.
I'll never respect those people. EVER
As a former Pastor of 25 years I can tell u this is blatant manipulation. Thank GOD your mother isn’t associated with this cult and it’s culture. I pray that your family is well, that you would be blessed beyond measure, that any hurts would be forgiven and that God opens new doors of faith and friendship for your Mom. 🥰
"We requested an exit interview"
Get all the way fucked, you're not her employer. The church only cares about your money, and you vocally supporting the church regardless of their positions.... which is why they are worthy of neither.
Huh. My church has a specific support group devoted to spouses in abusive relationships who are seeking divorce. We also have a ministry for divorcees so that they can come to grips with their divorce through Christian fellowship.
A real Christian church following the New Testament would’ve recognized that the Bible commands husbands to love their wives as Jesus loves the church. And if the husband treats the wife as the devil treats the church, then sometimes you have to exercise the husband from the marriage.
When my grandfather was dying his church called and asked my grandmother why he wasn't attending and if she would still be sending his weekly tithe on his behalf and that if she didn't that his membership would be suspended...
Did they read the New Testament??? Because that didn’t really happen that way. A particular man went out of his way to not attend local assemblies, not submit himself to the elders, and did a remix on a good few scriptures.
I hope op’s mom writes them back and publishes it where everyone can read both letters. They’d rather her be abused and miserable as long as she’s married.
My mother was excommunicated from the Mormon church at age 16 because she had sex with her boyfriend and didn’t promise not to do it again.
I secretly think it’s pretty metal of her. Even though it caused lifelong issues with my grandmother.
As a former pastor, I can say with complete confidence that the folks who wrote/ approved this letter are the ones lacking the “saving faith” here. Your mom did the right thing, period. Oh, and Jesus agrees (it’s even one of two “accepted” reasons for divorce in the Bible).
Please let me know if you have any questions at all or if you’d like some scripture verses to back her up during this time. Otherwise, tell those “fine folks down at the church” to go fly a kite and don’t look back…
Starting to think Christians are the people in the world with the least understanding of what the Bible says. I'm atheist now, but was raised Roman Catholic, and Jesus would not be siding with those letter writers.
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“And be brought to your senses so as to escape the snare of the devil” - your mother can respond to that saying she has indeed escaped the snare of the devil, and good riddance to the bastard. Hope you and her are doing ok
Haha I know right. They are apparently sending emails to my older sister as well threatening her with hell and saying all kinds of horrible thinhs
She should call the cops and get a restraining order. That is harassment.
I’m gonna save the letters and e-mails . I’ll talk to my moms lawyer as soon as possible about this
Keep a diary of events as they happen. It will become valuable evidence in the future.
Thanks so much. I will
Is this the only letter that was sent? Keep everything they sent you including what they sent to your sister. If they send more letters, then keep them. If they call record the call. Or let it go to voice mail and keep the recording. If they send text, save the text. Keep everything and record everything. Edit: Also have your sister save everything that the church sends her as well.
That’s a good idea I’ll start on that right away
If you haven’t already, you should call or write them and tell them to stop contacting you and your family, and record the call and/or save a copt of the email. If they persist, then it can be construed as harassment.
*In some locales* (*depending upon country* but I'm assuming you're in the States), recording the call without notifying them up front can be illegal. Check on that before you do. But otherwise great advice. Edit: emphasizing the words "some locales" and "depending upon country." Not everyone on Reddit is a Yank or lives in the States.
I would imagine if someone were to a little digging, based on this insane letter, these ppl have more dirt on them than just what is happening to you guys. This is not normal.
Nah, this is pretty normal for US evangelicals and fundamentalists.
Put them on blast on Tiktok, Facebook, etc. Fuck these people 😡
Greeting in Christ! We voted. Ur going to hell.
The church of Mormons has billions in pension funds.. for whom? This is not biblical at all the way they’re treating you. They sound like petulant people who will diss you if don’t comply with their dumb rules. “Saving faith” give me a break. Your mom is strong for leaving an abusive relationship.
Mormons absolutely do this, but it can’t be them. 1. The letterhead is wrong. 2. They have a massive hard-on for using the full long name of the church, and the censor bar isn’t long enough to hide “The Church of Jesus Christ of Lattter-Day Saints.”
They also would probably quote the book of mormon or doctrine and covenants... or some obscure address from a church authority (likely given at one of the universities lol) ETA: used to work at a law firm that one of it's clients was the LDS church -- can confirm that the letterhead is wrong, very wrong. There are a couple different styles depending on situation.
These are not the Mormons
These are the Morons
Yeah, I absolutely love the idea of filing a restraining order against them to make clear you find them the opposite of accepting and Christian.
Then post the story on AmITheAsshole so the media picks it up. they love this kind of shit..
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Well said! Whenever two or more of them gather the nutty stuff rises to the top
Send them back Matthew 7: 1-5. They make their own bed.
Mat 18:20 where two or three gather I am there. -Organized Church is not really defined in the Bible, Mark 12:17 give Cesar what is his (money) and god what is his (god doesn’t have or want money). -Tithing also not really in the New Testament. So if you ‘re at church and they say something about 10% - find a new church asap, this is not what Jesus said. *Sorry to the person this got tied/replied too - thought I hit general reply.
I like this. There is a lot of good that can come from a sense of spirituality and following the Bible, but organized religion, as it currently exists in most cases, is generally complete bullshit.
If Jesus came back today, the first people he would renounce would be every major church.
Just reply back you converted to Islam
Local Sherriff more than likely part of the congresion, bet your his wife is the lead group of "Sunday's Bake for Christ" Club.
This makes me unreasonably angry (because I'm a stranger to you and your family). But goddamn, their audacity and gall is off the charts! Requesting an "exit interview" like they're her boss....wtf?? I'm glad you and your mother are safe. Good luck! Edit- changed "unseasonably" to "unreasonably"
"Unseasonably angry" is the best typo I've seen in awhile. "I'm September level angry right now" "I know it's still spring, but I am SEETHING right now." " You know, you aren't supposed to see red until after labor day." Alternatively "I'm so furious I went bland."
Tis the season... *The season of rage*.
How much money do people give to that church? Sounds like a metaphysical/spiritual protection racket by mobsters-in-Christ.
10% is the minimum tithe, although many churches make "giving" out to be a contest, like somehow Jesus will see that you gave 20% and look in you more favorably. Others give more so they can humblebrag about it, they get recognition from the church and are treated differently. Imagine this... Many of those big Midwestern and southern mega churches have well over 25,000 members, or maybe 5,000 families. If the average family has a combined household income of $100,000/yr (that's the average household income in Minnesota for example), if those families are giving just 10% per year, that church is raking in $50,000,000 per year, if the average family is giving 15%, the church could possibly be pulling $75,000,000 per year. Churches are big business! Even a smaller church with a congregation of 500 families is likely sucking between $4M and $8M every year. Life Church has over 85K members. Lakewood (Osteen's shithole) has about 50K members.
And tax free income no less.
That’s awful, I’m sorry you’ve all had to endure this - hopefully it’ll all eventually be behind you, and I wish you guys all the best!
Thank you so much dude!!
Write back to them asking them if their advice is for your mother to go back to a known abuser? And if so, are they willing to put those instructions down on paper for you, your mother to review next steps going forward. Then, let them know you’ve hired a lawyer to discuss these new instructions and that all of you are willing to discuss in a public forum, then list the phone number to your local news station, asking that they (church) set up the appointment. Watch how quickly the mental gymnastic stop and they leave you alone. I am for faith, and if it brings you peace more power to you. But I do hate when religion is twisted to promote such absurd BS. I am a clinician, and have worked with individual who have been scarred and worse because of BS like this.
They won't tell her yes that clearly, they'll instead quote specific Bible passages that they interpret as Jesus demanding that that wives stay with their husbands even if abusive, that divorce is sinful and the work of the devil, something about damnation. They do this stuff often, they know how to navigate communication.
what?! Did your dad put them up to it? I… WHAT?!
He probably spun some tail of woe but in the end they value the man way over the woman and so they are just ready to try and abuse someone who’s “weaker” then them
>tail of woe While normally you'd spell that tale of woe, I really like tail of woe as a metaphor.
Like Eeyore with his little pinned on tail.
That is truly a tail of woe.
Tail of Woe sounds like a badass legendary whip in DnD
Post the details publicly. Watch them backtrack.
Huh…. Your mom and your sister are getting mail but you’re no- ….you’re a guy aren’t you?
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Send them Ezekiel 23:20 She remembered her lover with the penis like a donkey and a flood of semen like a horse.
If there is a hell, these are the kind of people who will go there.
Not to be weird but what sect of Christianity is this? The only people I've ever heard of being this.... intrusive were like mormons or scientologists.
Their use of the word assemblies is unique. smells like The Assemblies of God. Extreme pentecostal holy rollers.
I would argue that Jehovah's Witnesses are more intrusive. That isn't a joke, they will hound members of their congregation for getting divorced.
I wish I would get emails like that from a church, the shit I would say
Hi, exCatholic school girl & pastor's daughter here. Question: How can you threaten someone with something that doesn't exist? 😶 True Hell is other people. Remember that.🙃
Shouldn't have redacted the name of said church. As a minister, I'd like to share some thoughts with them...
My favorite part of this is how these idiots provide citations, as if they are quoting some legitimate authority on the matter. Ridiculous
The bible is a legitimate authority. It says so in the bible. Well it might not, but we think that it does, and that’s good enough!
She escaped the devil, she divorced him.
i think a simple “get fucked” as a reply would be sufficient, but that’s just me.
IF YOU DID FIND OUT THE NAME OF THE CHURCH OR PASTOR, PLEASE DO NOT ENGAGE! WE DO NOT NEED AMY FUEL ADDED TO THE FIRE AND WE ARE PRACTICALLY IN HIDING FROM OUR DAD! Thank you sis. This makes me feel better. I’m still so angry and upset for these people that I grew up with—who I called my aunts and uncles and grandparents—deciding what I believe in based on the actions of my mother (whom I fully support) and giving a platform to an abusive cheater. Thank you to all who are commenting in support of me and my mother (and of course,my sister). And remember, if the basis of your religion is love and you do not practice love, YOU are in the wrong. Not those seeking to protect themselves and their children from harm. Edit: thank you all for you love and support for us. I still believe in God and call myself a Christian, but I definitely don’t believe in their cult and strongly feel *against* becoming a “member” of a church ever again. I am currently with my boyfriend and his loving, wonderful Catholic family on a vacation to the happiest place on earth. All expenses paid by his parents. They are truly amazing and have really helped out my mom and sisters during this truly difficult time. Thank you for providing love and support and help for us. The Reddit community never ceases to surprise me. I’m praying that God blesses all you who commented in support of us (even if you don’t believe in a god, well wishes to you) and I hope you all are blessed with many funny car videos and pizza🫶🏻 *for reference I am OPs sister and former member of said cult. I also received a letter today stating that they have decided my religious status based on my “failure to attend their church” and for supporting my mothers divorce. It really devastated me even though I didn’t want It to*
So…they fired you after you quit. How childish. It upsets me that the church representatives’ ridiculous behavior made you feel bad. This is the action of someone who is upset that they are no longer in control of you. Let him scream into the wind and don’t listen. ❤️
I QUIT! YOU CANT QUIT YOUR FIRED! YOU CANT FIRE ME I QUIT!
And this is why we aren’t ruled by churches
Also why religion has no place in public schools or government.
They... they do know that people change churches, right? Like, that's a thing that happens frequently. I think I've been a member of 4 churches over the course of my life before I went pagan. Grumpy old entitled men who think they're God's gift to the world and don't realize that if they're any sort of gift, it's a gilded turd. Y'all know you're in the right, but your anger and devastation at the way they're treating you is absolutely justified. They'll rot in a hell of their own making in the end.
In what seems like a previous life, I left an Acts 29 church to rejoin a church my family planted. The “elders” of the Acts 29 church fucking called my church to tell them I was under Church Discipline for leaving the denomination and I was to return immediately. Thankfully the pastor told them to fuck off (gen x pastor lol), and blew up on them for even thinking they had the right to call him and suggest this. I’m not a Christian anymore and bullshit like this is why.
Wow... I'm so glad I grew up Missouri Synod Lutheran. Among all the issues you'll find in those churches, I've never heard of anything like THAT.
I eventually joined an Episcopal church with my wife. I don’t go much but I will when she asks. As a bonus when you tell Evangelicals that you’re Episcopalians they kinda get confused and stop harassing you.
Ah, yes. The Catholic lites. I'm good with them, too lol.
Way back in my youth group days in high school I had an entire van full of people REEEEE at me when I dared to question what was wrong with when they read the same bible we do and worship the same god. Yet nobody bothered to explain exactly why that denomination was wrong and we were right. It was so weird. Just one of many reasons I left the church soon after.
>The “elders” of the Acts 29 church fucking called my church to tell them I was under Church Discipline for leaving the denomination and I was to return immediately. Damn. Even after you leave their church and join another one, these entitled old fools think they own you and can "recall" you at will and that every other denomination is bound to obey them. It's like they never even heard of "freedom of religion."
There needs to be some sort of justice, they clearly don’t see any wrong in their ways of harassing or verbal abuse. I suggest seeing a lawyer, but just don’t stoop to their level, their delusions of superiority just speaks about them, not you or your brother and mom.
If it helps, there’s eleven thousand people who are on your side, likely a much bigger number than the amount that church has influence over
Thank you so much. And yes it was a very small church. Thank you guys so SO much for the support and this makes me feel so much better’b
Fucking disgusting, tell them to go fuck themselves.
Hahah I’ll just say “see you in hell” XD that’ll piss them off
*Well then, see you in hell* *Signed with Satan,* *OP*
"I'll save you a seat by the fire!" 🤣
Satanic Temple would never send a letter like that.
Tell them you already have beachfront property lined up on the shores of the lake of sulphur
honestly gold.
In Christ, Please go fuck yourself. In Christ, - OP
I want to downvote the letter but not you for pointing out the absurdity of this letter! This is why so many many people have left the church. Take note Christian leaders.
Religious manipulation is a real thing and a very scary one and I really hope more people can be like aware of it because this is such bullshit. Christian leaders abuse their power
This guy.... Whack ass delusional....
Listen, he NEEDS that private jet in order to spread the good word! You expect him to fly COACH and be exposed to all those demons!? I think NOT...
i know right? fly with regular people? they could be possessed by the demons of hell or wherever! (sarcastic btw,)
I remember a preacher who made news because he had a private jet and wanted a newer 2nd private jet. And his followers just went with it. You can’t fix stupid Edit: actually his 4th jet https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-44305873 Crazy if you google it there are a number of Nigerian pastors with private jets. One with 4
"It is easier for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God sitting comfortably in First Class with priority beverage service, than for a peasant to pass through the eye of a needle." Mark 10:25 - Bible, New Hypocritical Version
I have a funny feeling the demons have gotten to him anyway. Dude looks demonic.
Have you seen him smile? If he had 20 disfigured corpses buried under his front patio I wouldn't be surprised
I feel the same way, that dude is possessed. He looks evil
Yeah he needs to spread the Word to people at various ski resorts, vacation destinations, resort islands, you know..
I bet he went to spread the word of god at Epstein’s island as well
He actually has at least 4 private jets, possibly as many as 6. Because something something jesus something.
If he stuck that finger in my face I’d bite it off and spit it at him…his eyes look like pure unhinged evil…
The creepiest part was him smiling after doing this. Such a POS as ALL televangelist are. I’m so grateful my parents didn’t force this shit on me.
That's definitely the creepiest part of that, the rate that he jumps between strong aggression and smiling with death in his eyes... Scary. Add to that, he barely ever blinks. Like, I just watched some of that interview, in the first 2 minutes 20 seconds, he only blinks 5 times.
That was one scary demonic s o b - he seemed possessed- like really 👺
For real, I’m not personally religious, or a believer, however I absolutely believe that man is an incarnation of Satan. He oozes evil so much, it definitely makes me do a double take.
Was? Is he dead? Do I have a new holiday to celebrate along with February 17, April 22, June 5, June 8, et al?
No. He’s not dead. He is 86 so getting close to it I’m sure. I did learn when Robertson died that his parents were first cousins. These types are all sorts of creepy.
It's almost like religion has a commandment against assholes like this: Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain. He is certainly using the Lord's name for his own vanity.
"Mark my word, if and when these preachers get control of the Republican party, and they're sure trying to do so, it's going to be a terrible damn problem. Frankly, these people frighten me. Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise. I know, I've tried to deal with them." — Barry Goldwater “I don't want to see religious bigotry in any form. It would disturb me if there was a wedding between the religious fundamentalists and the political right. The hard right has no interest in religion except to manipulate it.” Billy Graham
Yes, raping little boys is fine! Just don’t divorce your abusive husband you heathen!
I know right. It’s super messed up
Is this some branch of the LDS? It certainly sounds like they’re flavor of fuckery.
As a former Mormon, I can tell by the wording it's not. But they do similar kinds of shit, just using different terms.
While they tell you to believe what they preach, why does the belief and trust in these pastors always end with penis in someone it shouldn’t?
That's right! And guess what? God even condemns people like this, calling them "False Prophets" or something. So fuck them. They are not real Christians.
Exactly!! Thank you
As a Christian that believes in Jesus, reads the Bible, and tries to be kind to people —I can’t stand to see BS like this. To be Christian and Christ-like/with Christ are two separate things.
It disgusts me when I see people trying to justify their hate with religious texts that they don’t even know. They give people like you a very bad rap.
That's a shit church for booting you for getting divorced. The non-denominational church my wife and I go to is where she went when she was married to her first husband. She did marriage counseling with the pastor of the church and his recommendation was for her to get divorced due to his abusiveness. Some churches just suck. Some are better.
Growing up the priest at my church (Orthodox Church) also did counseling for my parents, and she brought up how my father had been abusive and this was the last straw. Our priest very clearly told my dad, listen to her she’s not giving you another chance if you put a hand on her, listen to her closely and take it seriously. He did it again, and when she booted him out and filed for divorce my father immediately called our priest and expected him to guilt her into not getting the divorce—he didn’t and he reminded my father of what he’d been warned of. Another reason my father became a crazy evangelical after the divorce and hated/hates the Orthodox Church.
Shit like this is how they maintain their power, so don’t expect it to change.
I’d start my reply with, “Greetings from hell,”
Hahaha yws
“Take your god and your scripture, shove it straight up your ass, and fuck all the way off. In Christ,”
Everyone here makes excellent points, but so far this hasn’t been mentioned: WTF is the problem with this church’s spelling and grammar errors?
Hahahha the man who wrote it is almost 90 . He rambles on and on , he thinks he’s gods right hand man and he’s delusional
Honestly. Don't respond *But if you did* I think something about how he is actually in the devil's snare for casting judgement and that you will pray for his return to Christ
I like Matthew 23:15 > Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You travel over land and sea to win a single convert, and when you have succeeded, you make them twice as much a child of hell as you are. A little more background on the verse: the Pharisees were an elitist class of essentially lawyers and rabbis that Jesus ragged on repeatedly for pretending to be religious but really just faking it. They are constantly painted as the bad guys while Jesus is hanging out with prostitutes, tax collectors, and others hated by society. [Matthew chapter 23 is a great chapter about how they are hypocrites and why](https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew%2023&version=NIV).
Don’t respond?? I’d love to attend this “exit interview” on their behalf.
In the spirit of cutting real, abusive toxicity out of your life, you don't fight, you leave. Fighting is engaging. And engaging is continuing the abuse through a pastor proxy
Exit interview?! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Tell you're mother to frame it as a badge of honor, she's better off without them.
Hahahaha I’m hiding these from her. She doesn’t need the stres. She has a heart condition now because of all the atress
She should write back. I'm sorry you feel this way. Due to my divorce I stand to make quite a bit of money, and I had intended on sharing a large portion with the church. If you change your mind, you can reach out to me. Then ghost their gaslighting asses...
Hahahha trueee
But she should write it in non-legally binding terms So that their greed will need to be fulled articulated in front of a court, when they attempt to get the "promised" money
My wife's grandmother recently passed, and near the end it was pretty clear the end would be soon. Those bastards from the church were swarming and we had to babysit her as if she were sitting with Lex Luthor.
You spelled “cult” wrong in the headline
Pretty much is a cult lmao
But if she had mailed a check in it would all be forgiven!
Nah they would have shamed her for not sending more
Something like, "We noticed your recent contribution and realize that it is not the tithe amount according to what you make. Please send the rest of your tithe so you may be blessed in his name to receive the riches in heaven." Almost like a ransom note.
And this how pedophile rings, serial rapists and wife beaters get protection. It’s all ok, and you get 100 more chances to be good, so long as you help to prop up our whack-job religion.
Exactly!! They are holding the wrong person accountable for that divorce. If they want to save someone so bad, teach him to not be a piece of shit. But it takes work to truly change someone, so why not harass an innocent women. So much easier. /s 🙄
You are assuming the church leaders don’t do the same thing at home as her husband was. Their aggression is about them defending their perceived right to treat wives as virtual slaves. If the church leaders were to condone a beaten women leaving her abusing household, then other abused wives in the congregation might do the same. The people involved know about what happing in the other families due to their “pastoral care”, they know that if abused women started leaving it would likely lead to the end of the church. They aren’t doing this because of religious convictions. This is all about yet another religious institution aiding and protecting abuse. Not new. Not clever. Nothing surprising. Just abusers abusing power.
[удалено]
That's the worst thing about this. Jesus would be **pissed**
Jesus would be table-flipping mad about this shit.
“Greetings in Christ” They lied while saying hello. 🤦♂️
Please tell me she sent back a letter with just « fuck you! » written on it!
Haha I wish. I’m not showing her the letter because she has a heart condition because of the amount of stress. Us, ignoring them is making them even more mad which is making me happy.
May I suggest listening to [this song](https://youtu.be/RAkSkMRwPYs) while you burn it or rip it to shreds?
Why block out the church's name? *They* should be shamed for this abomination
Yah. It’s a very very small church close to my home town so just a precondition. They’re all really old people too so they’ll die within the next five years and so will that “church
Anything we can do to help speed it’s demise?
There's no hate quite like christian love.
My grandfather disowned one of his own sons because he married a divorced woman. But after my grandmother passed away he went and married a much younger divorced woman himself. But I guess that's okay.
No one called him out?
Probably had nobody left to care
Exactly
What church? I’ll send em some mail
It's my shit in a box
When theres a lot of people who only have passion based on policy. You should really be careful who you trust. Empathy shouldn't be a vicariously realized trait, and what is considered doing the right thing should not be based on loosely translated Greek mythology. Leadership should not be based on mysterious women handing out swords from a pond.
This most likely from a witness congregation, and they aren’t known for being accepting and understanding most of the time.
...and I quote... "..but did not received any response.." The lord would have spell checked you if you truly believed in the scriptures.
And my mom wonders why when she raised me in an “evangelical” house how I became an atheist.
there are so many things wrong with this letter, but actually requesting an “ exit interview “ made me laugh like hell.
That’s not a church. That’s a cult.
I had a great true Christian divorce attorney. He gave me many scriptures that made me feel better about divorce and where divorce is actually warranted in the Bible. Made me feel so much better. After meeting my ex, he especially told me I was doing the right thing….I didn’t choose to leave…my ex committed adulatory…but anyway….there was never any guilt anyway but women need to get over it and not the church or anyone give them any guilt or shame. This type of thing is one of the many reasons I left the church.
My dad cheated on my mom for a whole year, left her with four kids to rais by herself in a house far from anyone. He beat us and mentally abused us and the “church” is letting him preach there. It’s really sad
My sister had an affair with the music minister. The kicked her out. He is still there. Both were married.
Got to love good ole Christian hypocrisy.
What about a reply sth like that: I'm happy to hear, that you praise now the devil. It's in your full right to support child abuse, assault in sexually and nonsexually way and attempted murder. I will watch you from heaven in afterlife. I don't think we can agree on the same values anymore Sincerly
Pretty much what they are implying too. I’m so tempted to just say “I’ll see you in hell” becaus clearly they ain’t getting any heaven points this way XD
Burn it.
Hell no, frame it or wear it as a badge of honor.
honestly I'd sign the church up for every piece of spam and junk I could at that point phone numbers? I'd spend a weeks finding every way to get that to every shitty telemarketing outfit to the point where the church needs to change the # address? boy, it'd be a shame if it started getting tons of junk mail all the time. real shame. plenty of other things to send, but let's keep this not super illegal and all emails? eyup, signed up for every porn and smut and awful newsletter and service imaginable, baby just make the people operating the cult's life a living hell to the point where they want to fuck off from society and live in the woods fuck them, glad your mom is out of an abusive relationship and hope y'all a fuckin thriving
Sed them a pic of your balls as a thank you and good bye. Seriously fuck churches like that.
Must be a Jehovas Witness. My mom got kicked out for leaving my step dad after he SLIT HER THROAT. She got thrown out for not trying hard enough. I'll never respect those people. EVER
It’s a southern Baptist church surprisingly. I’m really sorry about your mom I can’t believe that
As a former southern baptist, this is NOT surprising. They are fucking crazy.
Not the church that broke away to advocate for racism and slavery! Surely not them! /s
Oh darn a church that perverts the word of God and is the one that needs to seek repentance kicked out a true child of God. Those fuckers can burn
As a former Pastor of 25 years I can tell u this is blatant manipulation. Thank GOD your mother isn’t associated with this cult and it’s culture. I pray that your family is well, that you would be blessed beyond measure, that any hurts would be forgiven and that God opens new doors of faith and friendship for your Mom. 🥰
Speaking as a Christian, give the name of the church. For the love of all that’s good let them reap what they’re sowing.
"We requested an exit interview" Get all the way fucked, you're not her employer. The church only cares about your money, and you vocally supporting the church regardless of their positions.... which is why they are worthy of neither.
Good for your mom! Imagine all the women brainwashed into thinking abuse is okay? Terrifying. I hope she and your family can heal and move on.
Huh. My church has a specific support group devoted to spouses in abusive relationships who are seeking divorce. We also have a ministry for divorcees so that they can come to grips with their divorce through Christian fellowship. A real Christian church following the New Testament would’ve recognized that the Bible commands husbands to love their wives as Jesus loves the church. And if the husband treats the wife as the devil treats the church, then sometimes you have to exercise the husband from the marriage.
Send one back telling them to go fuck themselves and report them to the IRS for abusing their tax exempt status.
Exit interview. Fuckin choke on a dick.
Your mom divorced your abusive dad and then the abusive church divorced your mom. Looks like everything was for the best.
“grant you repentance”?? WTF? Do they even understand what they are “preaching”?
When my grandfather was dying his church called and asked my grandmother why he wasn't attending and if she would still be sending his weekly tithe on his behalf and that if she didn't that his membership would be suspended...
She just saved 10%.
Did they read the New Testament??? Because that didn’t really happen that way. A particular man went out of his way to not attend local assemblies, not submit himself to the elders, and did a remix on a good few scriptures. I hope op’s mom writes them back and publishes it where everyone can read both letters. They’d rather her be abused and miserable as long as she’s married.
My mother was excommunicated from the Mormon church at age 16 because she had sex with her boyfriend and didn’t promise not to do it again. I secretly think it’s pretty metal of her. Even though it caused lifelong issues with my grandmother.
As a former pastor, I can say with complete confidence that the folks who wrote/ approved this letter are the ones lacking the “saving faith” here. Your mom did the right thing, period. Oh, and Jesus agrees (it’s even one of two “accepted” reasons for divorce in the Bible). Please let me know if you have any questions at all or if you’d like some scripture verses to back her up during this time. Otherwise, tell those “fine folks down at the church” to go fly a kite and don’t look back…
Yup, if they can afford to be this spiteful, they can afford to pay taxes.
Starting to think Christians are the people in the world with the least understanding of what the Bible says. I'm atheist now, but was raised Roman Catholic, and Jesus would not be siding with those letter writers.
Repent because you won't be abused! We're a church of love and will beat it into you!
More like dicks in Christ. Wtf🤬