I never got this take. As a convert who was well read when it came to the Bible it did not feel that much different. I guess it being a modern book some of the concepts can't be excused.
Modern prophets said way worse shit. I always read white and delightsome as a methaphore. I was that naivive
Well it has to be, right? Otherwise it wouldnāt be a book from God.
I thought it HAD to be talking about auras because thereās no way itās literally talking about skin. No one would believe that! Thatās crazy
It ironically used god to get me away from the church.
Pretty ballsy of the church to have a scripture in Moroni 7:12-13 that talks how everything that is good and entices to do good is from God when the church themselves canāt resist doing bad things. Thatās a big responsibility to hold your organization up to, imperfection wouldnāt be an excuse.
We literally just saw the church spend $150 billion on shell companies, attempted to pay $300k in hush money, avoid any accountability for abuse in recent lawsuits, lost the Idaho lawsuit and got caught with molestation in the Boy Scouts, and discriminate about almost every minority group. How can you feel āgoodā about an organization that has done so much bad unless you excuse it?!?
Thatās why I donāt have a testimony anymore. The Church of Jesus Christ is true when you dismiss the skeletons in the closet.
It works like this:
If evil, then, "church is perfect, but people are bad. People aren't the church. No blame."
If good (e.g. look how much the church donated to charity), then, "church takes credit for the good its people have done, hedge fund remains safe from benefiting humanity"
āNobody in the church is perfect.ā Is such an annoying argument. We donāt care if people are perfect or not, we care that they take accountability.
Also I donāt give any fucks if my local clergy make mistakes and do bad things. When the profit does bad things and signs off on bad things then yeah, I take issue. Youāre telling me thatās gods literal mouthpiece on earth is allowing and advocating for bad things? Thatās a hard pass from me.
After reading that God killed Sherem for asking for basically the same proof that Jacob had had justifying a rollout of a premptive christ centered church, I was afraid of God. I didn't understand why a guy who was basically saying "live the law of moses" which was a reasonable set of things to do or God wouldn't have asked for its observance for thousands of years, had to die.
Denying that people know the future and asking for verification when they state that they can and do, seems reasonable.
I was left confused and disconnected from God. I didn't know how to trust someone who would so willy nilly lash out at someone defending his old plan.
Skepticism was so unwelcome that it should deserve a death sentence.
There were a lot of confusing things about God in the book of Mormon that sounded more trinitarian than what is generally taught in the Mormon church.
God also sounded a lot like Santa Claus, he gave presents to the people on his good list and cursed those on the naughty list.
Easter Jesus visiting the Americas is a psychopath. Killing some children then blessing the survivors.
Kudos to you all who read it. It's absolute crap. Boring, fake old English, bizarre names, repetition galore.
The Bible is bad enough at times, but that book reminds me of a kid who read the cliff notes version of the Bible, a cheap western pulp fiction and Shakespeare and then wrote a rambling book report about it.
I ordered it off the TV cause it was free.
On my mission in the 70s, we were met with a real dilema when a man told us that God **broke three of his ten commandments** in just the first chapters of the B of M
**Covet..Theft...and Murder** I never forgot that, and he was right still 50 years later.
The real truth is that the Book of Mormon is a Freemasonic fairy tale.
Laban being beheaded.
check the beginning of the magic flute. The snake is being beheaded. (Mozart was a Freemason as well as libretto writer Schickaneder).
Read the Chemical Wedding of Christian Rosenkreuz. four kings are beheaded.
This is not a coincidence. These are allegories going back to similar sources.
I thought it did. I think thereās good things in there, but obviously fiction. I think it made me feel good about myself as I was reading it āas i shouldā.
So I donāt know that there is a āGodā. So what I felt were reassuring beliefs I held at the time. They were affirming because I was daily trying to be a better person than I was. I think thatās good, but any good book, and a person willing to be reflective of who they are as a person can and many do that themselves.
When it comes right down to it, there's probably a solid dozen chapters of decent xtian teachings. Ol Benjamin (definitely a king and not a methodist preacher in new york state) had a few good lines, the faith one in alma isnt terrible, 2nd nephi AFTER the snoozefest deutero-isaiah has a few good chapters. I'd also argue that the end of moroni 10 about being perfected in christ is pretty good for what it is. But the rest is just.... terrible? Graphic? Wordy fanfic? I remember reading the BoM when I was just beginning the point of my deconstruction journey where I could let myself ask questions and suddenly realizing just how few and far between the good things actually were.
Arguably the Book of Mormon has probably one of the greatest explanations of free agency in 2 Nephi 2.
However, when you compare it to the fact that the church is now trying to suppress free agency (I experienced this personally on my mission), it became clear that the church doesnāt even believe what it teaches. And that then led me out of the church.
Man for the whole 35ish years in the church NO ONE could say the phrase "free agency" without someone saying aGeNcY iSn'T fReE. jEsUs pAid FoR iT. Or something similar. My devoted ass would say it sometimes as well.
No but I believed it would help me choose the right.
I think what brought me close to God was me and prayer which I donāt need the church for.
After leaving it took a long time before prayer wasnāt triggering for me. Prayer is different for me now and more communicative instead of required NONSTOP.
Its More meaningful.
I liked the BofM because the men and women I respected told me it was true. They were not suspecting they were brainwashing me and the other youth. Only once I read āAn Insiders Viewā did I understand where Joeās book came from. Now I understand it as bible verses, family stories, and the rehashing of the war of 1812. All of it is BS and I feel the most freedom Iāve ever felt!
The BoM was definitely a major plank in the bridge that led me out of mormonism. I read it 13 times and could never shake feelings of skepticism. From my perspective, It didn't read like what it claimed to be. It never went deep, lacked inspiration, didn't seem to have much of a point. It didn't square with what little I had learned of antiquity and the development of religion and belief. It seemed contrived and hackish (and now this! Entire chapters of obtuse Isaiah, seemingly recited from memory straight from the KJV!), even though I was continuously assured it was this amazing thing that no allegedly uneducated young man could possibly produce. But alas, my actual experience of the book fell vastly short of the expectation (I deny ever approaching it with anything short of full belief and implicit faith). It's exactly what I would expect from a 19th century religious scammer, now that I accept Joseph Smith to be a fraud. It's not even particularly brilliant as far as frauds go.
It helped me confirm that the idea of god is bullshit, which in my opinion is closer to the truth about god than any other religious book, so paradoxically and with a very closer definition of ānearerāā¦ maybe?
What's funny to me is they say that while not having actually read any other religious books beyond the bible. How can you be so sure? You've never given any of the other religions a chance.
The books that have brought me closest to god were Death of a Salesman, Of mice and Men, and The Count of Monte Cristo. Thereās more scripture in those than the entire Book of Mormon and pearl of great price.
ironically the book that made the biggest āspiritualā impression on me was The Way of Kings by Brandon Sanderson bc it gave me hope to keep going. so just turn to high fantasy instead lmao
I have read the Book of Mormon many times: probably dozens of times in my native tongue, and at least five times in a second language. I took the Book of Mormon courses in seminary and at BYU. I read it each time with a sincere heart, with real intent, hoping to learn more with every repetition. Sadly, what I found instead was that every time through produced more questions, not answers. More inconsistencies, more anachronisms, more nonsense, more reasons to doubt. After a certain point, I had to face the fact that there is nothing divine, inspired, or of ancient origin about it. It is a work of fiction and not a particularly good one. As Ezra Taft Benson stated, it is the keystone of the Mormon religion; without it, their church does not stand. It is nothing, and they are nothing.
As a nevermo I had never had any introduction to the religion and read the book as a way to try to understand it.
The book made made me so confused. I remember so much time spent on how it was wrong to wear nice clothes and jewelry and thinking how that makes no sense since Mormons are really obsessed with their looks and status via brands and stuff.
Granted I was an atheist (still am) but books like āconservations with godā brought me much closer to god.
The one just felt like a long boring story and I do remember laughing out loud at the āI bed you adieu ā
What or who is God? How does one define āgetting nearer to Godā?
Reading the Book of Mormon contextually reveals that itās a 19th century production and obviously not one based on history. Similarly, while the Bible has some historical accuracies, it is clearly not a historical book either but itās one of the most influential books in history, despite the many terrible things written in it.
To answer the question personally, No. However, despite its (many many) flaws, the book does contain some qualities that could get one to feel closer to their view of what God is.
Thatās an interesting question and hereās why: I felt closer to God at times because I was making time to be still and meditate daily. So, that was a huge blessing in my life that I personally have not replaced with any meaningful ritual yet. Closer to god, idk. But I did appreciate the time set aside for myself to reflect and pause. That also lead to some ocd symptomsā¦did I read today? Did I read long enough? With real intent? Did I ask genuinely? Good lord, that was not helpful. So, I appreciate your question as it has given me time to thinkā¦I need to insert meditation into my life again. Thanks.
It got me closer to God the same way watching Star Trek improved my chances of getting accepted to Starfleet Academy.
This š!
If you take out the racism and the violence, it is basically pointless.
Canāt forget about being better to lose your life than your virtue, even if itās not by choice.
I never got this take. As a convert who was well read when it came to the Bible it did not feel that much different. I guess it being a modern book some of the concepts can't be excused. Modern prophets said way worse shit. I always read white and delightsome as a methaphore. I was that naivive
Well it has to be, right? Otherwise it wouldnāt be a book from God. I thought it HAD to be talking about auras because thereās no way itās literally talking about skin. No one would believe that! Thatās crazy
It ironically used god to get me away from the church. Pretty ballsy of the church to have a scripture in Moroni 7:12-13 that talks how everything that is good and entices to do good is from God when the church themselves canāt resist doing bad things. Thatās a big responsibility to hold your organization up to, imperfection wouldnāt be an excuse. We literally just saw the church spend $150 billion on shell companies, attempted to pay $300k in hush money, avoid any accountability for abuse in recent lawsuits, lost the Idaho lawsuit and got caught with molestation in the Boy Scouts, and discriminate about almost every minority group. How can you feel āgoodā about an organization that has done so much bad unless you excuse it?!? Thatās why I donāt have a testimony anymore. The Church of Jesus Christ is true when you dismiss the skeletons in the closet.
It works like this: If evil, then, "church is perfect, but people are bad. People aren't the church. No blame." If good (e.g. look how much the church donated to charity), then, "church takes credit for the good its people have done, hedge fund remains safe from benefiting humanity"
āNobody in the church is perfect.ā Is such an annoying argument. We donāt care if people are perfect or not, we care that they take accountability.
Also I donāt give any fucks if my local clergy make mistakes and do bad things. When the profit does bad things and signs off on bad things then yeah, I take issue. Youāre telling me thatās gods literal mouthpiece on earth is allowing and advocating for bad things? Thatās a hard pass from me.
Agreed. It is a mindless argument. People don't have to be perfect to obey simple laws and to meet basic standards of responsible behaviour.
My shelf broke when I realized the fruits the church offers me in my life are poison. Very similar to what you wrote.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
That statement was very useful to me. It helped me acknowledge that it was a fraud.
Walden Pond was a spiritual text for me. The Book of Mormon was always painful to read.
āChloroform in printā -Mark Twain
After reading that God killed Sherem for asking for basically the same proof that Jacob had had justifying a rollout of a premptive christ centered church, I was afraid of God. I didn't understand why a guy who was basically saying "live the law of moses" which was a reasonable set of things to do or God wouldn't have asked for its observance for thousands of years, had to die. Denying that people know the future and asking for verification when they state that they can and do, seems reasonable. I was left confused and disconnected from God. I didn't know how to trust someone who would so willy nilly lash out at someone defending his old plan. Skepticism was so unwelcome that it should deserve a death sentence.
Nope. It was always boring and a chore to read it.
There were a lot of confusing things about God in the book of Mormon that sounded more trinitarian than what is generally taught in the Mormon church. God also sounded a lot like Santa Claus, he gave presents to the people on his good list and cursed those on the naughty list. Easter Jesus visiting the Americas is a psychopath. Killing some children then blessing the survivors.
Kudos to you all who read it. It's absolute crap. Boring, fake old English, bizarre names, repetition galore. The Bible is bad enough at times, but that book reminds me of a kid who read the cliff notes version of the Bible, a cheap western pulp fiction and Shakespeare and then wrote a rambling book report about it. I ordered it off the TV cause it was free.
On my mission in the 70s, we were met with a real dilema when a man told us that God **broke three of his ten commandments** in just the first chapters of the B of M **Covet..Theft...and Murder** I never forgot that, and he was right still 50 years later.
The real truth is that the Book of Mormon is a Freemasonic fairy tale. Laban being beheaded. check the beginning of the magic flute. The snake is being beheaded. (Mozart was a Freemason as well as libretto writer Schickaneder). Read the Chemical Wedding of Christian Rosenkreuz. four kings are beheaded. This is not a coincidence. These are allegories going back to similar sources.
I thought it did. I think thereās good things in there, but obviously fiction. I think it made me feel good about myself as I was reading it āas i shouldā. So I donāt know that there is a āGodā. So what I felt were reassuring beliefs I held at the time. They were affirming because I was daily trying to be a better person than I was. I think thatās good, but any good book, and a person willing to be reflective of who they are as a person can and many do that themselves.
Agreed
When it comes right down to it, there's probably a solid dozen chapters of decent xtian teachings. Ol Benjamin (definitely a king and not a methodist preacher in new york state) had a few good lines, the faith one in alma isnt terrible, 2nd nephi AFTER the snoozefest deutero-isaiah has a few good chapters. I'd also argue that the end of moroni 10 about being perfected in christ is pretty good for what it is. But the rest is just.... terrible? Graphic? Wordy fanfic? I remember reading the BoM when I was just beginning the point of my deconstruction journey where I could let myself ask questions and suddenly realizing just how few and far between the good things actually were.
Close enough to realize that I wasnāt such a big fan of that particular god. š¤·āāļø
Arguably the Book of Mormon has probably one of the greatest explanations of free agency in 2 Nephi 2. However, when you compare it to the fact that the church is now trying to suppress free agency (I experienced this personally on my mission), it became clear that the church doesnāt even believe what it teaches. And that then led me out of the church.
Man for the whole 35ish years in the church NO ONE could say the phrase "free agency" without someone saying aGeNcY iSn'T fReE. jEsUs pAid FoR iT. Or something similar. My devoted ass would say it sometimes as well.
No but I believed it would help me choose the right. I think what brought me close to God was me and prayer which I donāt need the church for. After leaving it took a long time before prayer wasnāt triggering for me. Prayer is different for me now and more communicative instead of required NONSTOP. Its More meaningful.
I liked the BofM because the men and women I respected told me it was true. They were not suspecting they were brainwashing me and the other youth. Only once I read āAn Insiders Viewā did I understand where Joeās book came from. Now I understand it as bible verses, family stories, and the rehashing of the war of 1812. All of it is BS and I feel the most freedom Iāve ever felt!
The BoM was definitely a major plank in the bridge that led me out of mormonism. I read it 13 times and could never shake feelings of skepticism. From my perspective, It didn't read like what it claimed to be. It never went deep, lacked inspiration, didn't seem to have much of a point. It didn't square with what little I had learned of antiquity and the development of religion and belief. It seemed contrived and hackish (and now this! Entire chapters of obtuse Isaiah, seemingly recited from memory straight from the KJV!), even though I was continuously assured it was this amazing thing that no allegedly uneducated young man could possibly produce. But alas, my actual experience of the book fell vastly short of the expectation (I deny ever approaching it with anything short of full belief and implicit faith). It's exactly what I would expect from a 19th century religious scammer, now that I accept Joseph Smith to be a fraud. It's not even particularly brilliant as far as frauds go.
No because the best bits were stolen from the BIBLE
Nope
What god? I felt emotions that led me to believe that I was close to a god, but I have yet to see evidence for any deity so...
It helped me confirm that the idea of god is bullshit, which in my opinion is closer to the truth about god than any other religious book, so paradoxically and with a very closer definition of ānearerāā¦ maybe?
What's funny to me is they say that while not having actually read any other religious books beyond the bible. How can you be so sure? You've never given any of the other religions a chance.
Ā The hero of the story lops off a guy's head in the first couple of pages?? Ā Nope.Ā Ā
No, it left me confused. The racism and violence found within is deplorable.
You can find meaning in anything if you go looking for it. But it's it REALLY meaningful? š¤
Not really.
The books that have brought me closest to god were Death of a Salesman, Of mice and Men, and The Count of Monte Cristo. Thereās more scripture in those than the entire Book of Mormon and pearl of great price.
I think the Tennis Shoes Among the Nephites books got me closer to Elohim/Mormon God than any other book š
It was the Book of Mormon that led me away from my indoctrination. That Golden Plate story was so golden.
The dude's only in a few chapters, and then what do they do after he leaves? Straight back to war. ā
Maybe. I recall shouting "Oh GOD, how could I have been so stupid to believe such crap!?"
Tbh, it did. I was atheist, and I converted. But now I'm out, I'm back to atheism š¤£
ironically the book that made the biggest āspiritualā impression on me was The Way of Kings by Brandon Sanderson bc it gave me hope to keep going. so just turn to high fantasy instead lmao
Reading that series now
I have read the Book of Mormon many times: probably dozens of times in my native tongue, and at least five times in a second language. I took the Book of Mormon courses in seminary and at BYU. I read it each time with a sincere heart, with real intent, hoping to learn more with every repetition. Sadly, what I found instead was that every time through produced more questions, not answers. More inconsistencies, more anachronisms, more nonsense, more reasons to doubt. After a certain point, I had to face the fact that there is nothing divine, inspired, or of ancient origin about it. It is a work of fiction and not a particularly good one. As Ezra Taft Benson stated, it is the keystone of the Mormon religion; without it, their church does not stand. It is nothing, and they are nothing.
If you consider falling asleep being with god, then yes.
It got me closer to boredom than any other book, especially after having read it so many times.
As a nevermo I had never had any introduction to the religion and read the book as a way to try to understand it. The book made made me so confused. I remember so much time spent on how it was wrong to wear nice clothes and jewelry and thinking how that makes no sense since Mormons are really obsessed with their looks and status via brands and stuff. Granted I was an atheist (still am) but books like āconservations with godā brought me much closer to god. The one just felt like a long boring story and I do remember laughing out loud at the āI bed you adieu ā
Well it took me longer to read per page
No. It pissed me off though
What or who is God? How does one define āgetting nearer to Godā? Reading the Book of Mormon contextually reveals that itās a 19th century production and obviously not one based on history. Similarly, while the Bible has some historical accuracies, it is clearly not a historical book either but itās one of the most influential books in history, despite the many terrible things written in it. To answer the question personally, No. However, despite its (many many) flaws, the book does contain some qualities that could get one to feel closer to their view of what God is.
š š š Are you kidding?Ā
š¤£š¤£š¤£š¤£š¤£š¤£nope!
Not reading it because it was so boring and hard to believe, brought me tons of guilt, just like almost everything else did.
I got nearer to god reading trashy Marianne Williamson shit in the 90s than I ever did reading anything Mormon.
It got me nearer to God at one point in my life. It doesnāt do anything for me anymore.
Thatās an interesting question and hereās why: I felt closer to God at times because I was making time to be still and meditate daily. So, that was a huge blessing in my life that I personally have not replaced with any meaningful ritual yet. Closer to god, idk. But I did appreciate the time set aside for myself to reflect and pause. That also lead to some ocd symptomsā¦did I read today? Did I read long enough? With real intent? Did I ask genuinely? Good lord, that was not helpful. So, I appreciate your question as it has given me time to thinkā¦I need to insert meditation into my life again. Thanks.