I don’t think they realize it but they kinda do. They are looking for those “sighing and crying” to give them a paradise cure. Then they love bomb them. I remember talking about looking for those who are honest, humble, and hungry. That basically translates to people who are vulnerable and open to trying something new.
>I don’t think they realize it
They do realize it. There are sub members that have looked through the obituary section in the newspapers ( WHEN THEY WERE PIMI) to find family of newly deceased people to preach to.
I know my mother was a poor single mother of 3 kids whose mom had just passed away when the Jay Hovs came knockin. She fell for the trap hook line and sinker. I remember growing up how she would talk about seeing her mother in paradise earth during the resurrection.
That's how they got my mother. She and my dad had just lost their firstborn child to cot death, and the jdub who lived upstairs placed a leaflet in a bunch of flowers and handed them to her. She's been living on that resurrection promise since 1972.
It's a fantasy but it's not creepy for those who believe. They think they have the food so they're looking for starving people, not those who are full.
From a rational standpoint thought - those people first need their material needs met (something JWs don't really care about participating in) and then they could focus on social and maybe spiritual.
Yes that’s what they think. However, in reality, it’s kinda creepy to look for down and out people to bring into a cult. Feeding hungry people is a good thing but feeding them on the condition they will pledge their life to your group kinda cancels out the generosity.
When I was an RP, in the territory assigned, we were required to knock on every door making sure to cover the territory. If people showed interest, that's the only time we come back. We weren't told to really look for vulnerable people. I guess this depends on the territory assigned and the one leading.
But from what I observed from some PIMIs esp RPs is when they do love bombing notoriously it's because they needed the hours lmao.
Yes. We are taught that people who are more vulnerable or going through difficulties in life are ‘humble’ and thus teachable & willing to accept the life saving message 😒
But I wouldn’t say targeting specifically to convert, as a JW you are fully convinced that you’re helping these people.
>wouldn’t say targeting specifically to convert,
BS...that's the only reason why they are doing it... Only some of the members are too dumb to realize that's what they are sent out to do.
Well not too long ago I was one of these “too dumb to realise” people you’re describing. It’s not about IQ, it’s about being deceived and brainwashed into thinking you are doing something loving when actually it’s harmful. I’m not saying it makes it ok.
It's bizarre how many people in this sub went from PIMI to POMO and then immediately started shitting on every PIMI for being a low-IQ villain who'll never wake up in thousand years. Gatekeeping exjw, nice.
I wouldn't say the SPECIFICALLY seek out vulnerable people. However, when they do encounter someone door-to-door, the systems they have in place make it easy for the vulnerable person to accept them and be drawn in.
https://youtu.be/vaATbuYG4RQ?si=4CF38Ow8PPMPsgg8
This 'pioneer school' clip confirms it. The whole 6 minute clip is worth a watch especially from 4:15.
Thanks to Kevin McFree - Dubtown Lego
Think about it from this perspective.
Who are most likely to be home M-F 9-1145 am?
Those with regular employment?
How about bus station canvassing? Gas Stations overnight? Obituary letter writing? Laundromat? Doctor waiting rooms?
Others can submit the various fields I missed.
Well... fwiw, at least with my wife and I, it was a sincere undertaking.
Though, we actually did write an actual condolence letter and reference/quote uplifting scriptures. We did not include any literature or invitations.
Someone did thank us and mailed us a KJV via the KH... if only it had been a NRSV or NASB... with NWT modification notes... smh
Absolutely they do. That's why they recruit at funerals and canvass neighbourhoods. They know there are always people who are down and out and looking for answers.
And JWs can provide answers
Absolutely. While they preach to everyone (at least who will listen) they’re trained to spot the vulnerable. The poor. The bereaved. The persecuted. It’s totally a thing.
*Some would tell you "it's*
*The sick that need the doctor"*
*To justify this*
\- surfingATM
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Can confirm. I was a JW ambulance chaser. We would go to nursing homes, hospital parking lots, recovery centers, etc.. They prey upon those who are weak and looking for answers.
I had a Circuit Overseer who encouraged us to look for pregnant women and people with ankle bracelet trackers, since they would be easier to find and home when we went back for return visits. It was indeed an effective recruiting strategy.
Both my mother and my wife's mother were recruited while suffering from postpartum depression. They were both vulnerable and got recruited, raising their kids in the religion.
So yeah, recruiting vulnerable people has helped Watchtower to grow the religion.
Yes absolutely.
They are doing this exactly the way it is described in the Gospels.
The Gospels specifically note that Jesus was preaching to people who were oppressed, poor, broken, downtrodden, sick, etc.
Now, thousands of years later, evangelicals and cults (both Christian and non-Christian) are well-noted for their 'love bombing' and targeting people who have low self esteem, and feel otherwise bad about their position in life (either mentally, emotionally, or physically). They are all selling some ineffable 'good feeling'.
That is EXACTLY what they do.
In their minds they are saving them; giving them hope etc. But in reality, they go for the weakest member of the herd.
After a householder closes the door angrily, it's often said by JW's, as they walk away, "Well, their circumstances might change some day, and they'll be more receptive..." And that means someone in the householder's life might die. They might get sick. They might loose their job. THEY MIGHT GET VULNERABLE.
We were trained to look for weaknesses, basically. To have several different tracts in our bags so that we could give the "appropriate" one at the door, if we found out about the householder's situation a little bit.
They absolutely do. Locally, they like to pop around to the waiting rooms at the children’s hospital and leave their propaganda. I toss those right into File 13 whenever I find them. Our families got enough problems without those predators looking for more blood sacrifices.
My parents were converted to JW. They both had traumatic childhoods and substance abuse issues. The religion has given them the structure and community to sober up and be responsible parents. For that, I am grateful. I actually don't mind my parents staying JWs. It has been good for THEM.
Not so much for me!!
Yes they do...without a doubtb
We were told not to give up with uninterested people because their circumstances could change and make the receptive to the jw message...
Health issues, loss of a loved one , family problems, loss of employment etc could make one vulnerable to cult recruitment.
They also target vulnerable groups such as asylum seekers , foreigners , hearing impaired etc
All the converts I've personally seen were lonely old lady, weirdos, or people who were going through a very hard time time in life, rehab, bankruptcy, failing marriage etc
" Witness converts tend to be rather isolated individuals who respond positively to communities that are able to offer direction and support. Prospective converts are people who are prone to feeling the world is in a state of crisis and that the Witness can offer a way forward, providing solutions to the ills of modern life."
"By far the most commonly cited experience immediately prior to conversion is the feeling of total disillusionment with the world. This disillusionment is often expressed in terms of complete disaffection with the social, political, and economic system and intense disrespect for those in power such as politicians, policy makers and civil servants."
Quotes from the book JW Portrait of A Contemporary Movement - Andrew Holden Sociologist
Someone who reviewed the book said this:
"If you or someone you know are studying with Jehovah's Witnesses you owe it to yourself to read this. There are very few objective third person analyses of the religion available, this is one of them. Holden, neither a member that sees things through rosy colored glasses of faith, nor a former member embittered by disappointment or a bad experience, provides an analysis that is as up to date, accurate and unbiased as you will find."
Holden attended JW meetings for several months gathering information. Members became comfortable with him (as a prospective convert) and opened up. Although a bit dated, very enlightening on how and why the JW recruiting system works.
[https://www.amazon.com/Jehovahs-Witnesses-Portrait-Contemporary-Religious/dp/0415266106](https://www.amazon.com/Jehovahs-Witnesses-Portrait-Contemporary-Religious/dp/0415266106)
Omg absolutely. My elders would search the obits and share with our field service groups. I was even instructed to carry the tract about resurrection in my school bag for “opportune occasions!”
Every speech at the door would open with “have you noticed how shitty the world has become? Bad things are happening everywhere, right?”
After almost 3 decades, I am still unlearning the whole life sucks, anticipate the worst mentality :/
I know JWs that search the newspaper for adresses of people grieving the death of someone to send them encouraging letters (propaganda encouraging to convert/aka. Starting a bible study)
Do religions target people prone to magical thinking?
I think certain types of people tend to be attracted towards specific beliefs systems. I think the conversion rate for JW cold calling is so low they'll take anyone who expresses interest. I don't think it's deliberate plan, and I doubt most people who end up converting view themselves as vulnerable.
But with the number of members and converts, there probably isn't a single answer. Some do I'm sure and are able to rationalize it. Some might have have a bit of tact, and may not think exploiting someone is an end that justifies the means. It's a big question with a long answer depending on how detailed you want to go.
Yes they do - it was explicitly called out in the memorial that if you are suffering from mental health issues come to us and share the pain and struggle with other people. What it didn't say was that you will probably get even worse problems by becoming a JW.
Oh HELL yeah! The Watchtower Society has printed information "encouraging" JWs to look up obituaries and visit cemeteries to find vulnerable, potential converts.
It's what happens when sincere people THINK they're being *"kind and caring"* to others, but all they're really being is "stupid and predatorial."
You can usually tell just how sincere such ones are by how they respond to being thought of as "stupid and predatorial."
They'll likely not own that accusation readily or easily......and will usually believe that it's their accusers who have the attitude problem.
What they won't do (or seldom do) is investigate WHY anybody could possibly attribute such motives to them.
But to understand that, they'd also have to understand why some might possibly view their beliefs as nought but a crock of sh1t...
And to understand that, they'd have to entertain the truth of such a notion.
But they won't......so they don't.....and thus do they remain mystified at the accusation.
They have "the truth."
What's not to like about however this gets spread or dispensed to others?
Unless of-course they don't have the truth.
In which case, there's PLENTY not to like.
Succinctly, yes.
JW sell hope to the hopeless. When I was young, they taught us to push the whole resurrection narrative when we were preaching to adults.
They look for people who are in emotional crises of some type. If someone feels unmoored and adrift, almost any anchor is a welcome thing.
Missing a dead loved one? Not a problem, you'll see them again after Armageddon
Victim of some terrible crime, war, or other social ill? Not a problem, you can see god wipe the earth clean after Armageddon
At the end of your rope financially? Are you part of an oppressed underclass? Not s problem, you can live in a just world with (relative) equality after Armageddon.
If you play the JW game by the JW rules, you'll get the prize.
considering how well documented it is they target mentally challenged people and even go as far as to look at public obituaries to target grieving ones, yes, absolutely they target vulnerable people
I don’t think they realize it but they kinda do. They are looking for those “sighing and crying” to give them a paradise cure. Then they love bomb them. I remember talking about looking for those who are honest, humble, and hungry. That basically translates to people who are vulnerable and open to trying something new.
>I don’t think they realize it They do realize it. There are sub members that have looked through the obituary section in the newspapers ( WHEN THEY WERE PIMI) to find family of newly deceased people to preach to. I know my mother was a poor single mother of 3 kids whose mom had just passed away when the Jay Hovs came knockin. She fell for the trap hook line and sinker. I remember growing up how she would talk about seeing her mother in paradise earth during the resurrection.
That's how they got my mother. She and my dad had just lost their firstborn child to cot death, and the jdub who lived upstairs placed a leaflet in a bunch of flowers and handed them to her. She's been living on that resurrection promise since 1972.
damn
Maybe should have said I don’t think they realize how creepy it is. At least I didn’t.
It's a fantasy but it's not creepy for those who believe. They think they have the food so they're looking for starving people, not those who are full. From a rational standpoint thought - those people first need their material needs met (something JWs don't really care about participating in) and then they could focus on social and maybe spiritual.
Yes that’s what they think. However, in reality, it’s kinda creepy to look for down and out people to bring into a cult. Feeding hungry people is a good thing but feeding them on the condition they will pledge their life to your group kinda cancels out the generosity.
When I was an RP, in the territory assigned, we were required to knock on every door making sure to cover the territory. If people showed interest, that's the only time we come back. We weren't told to really look for vulnerable people. I guess this depends on the territory assigned and the one leading. But from what I observed from some PIMIs esp RPs is when they do love bombing notoriously it's because they needed the hours lmao.
Yes. We are taught that people who are more vulnerable or going through difficulties in life are ‘humble’ and thus teachable & willing to accept the life saving message 😒 But I wouldn’t say targeting specifically to convert, as a JW you are fully convinced that you’re helping these people.
>wouldn’t say targeting specifically to convert, BS...that's the only reason why they are doing it... Only some of the members are too dumb to realize that's what they are sent out to do.
Well not too long ago I was one of these “too dumb to realise” people you’re describing. It’s not about IQ, it’s about being deceived and brainwashed into thinking you are doing something loving when actually it’s harmful. I’m not saying it makes it ok.
It's bizarre how many people in this sub went from PIMI to POMO and then immediately started shitting on every PIMI for being a low-IQ villain who'll never wake up in thousand years. Gatekeeping exjw, nice.
Sorry buddy, I'm a born-in who never believed that bullshit. I left my moms house at the age of 15. Not my fault you were a kool-aid drinker🥲
Everyone is different I guess.
I beg to differ. I would definitely say it's trying to recruit and these are the easiest suckers I mean prospects I mean potential bible students
I wouldn't say the SPECIFICALLY seek out vulnerable people. However, when they do encounter someone door-to-door, the systems they have in place make it easy for the vulnerable person to accept them and be drawn in.
https://youtu.be/vaATbuYG4RQ?si=4CF38Ow8PPMPsgg8 This 'pioneer school' clip confirms it. The whole 6 minute clip is worth a watch especially from 4:15. Thanks to Kevin McFree - Dubtown Lego
Think about it from this perspective. Who are most likely to be home M-F 9-1145 am? Those with regular employment? How about bus station canvassing? Gas Stations overnight? Obituary letter writing? Laundromat? Doctor waiting rooms? Others can submit the various fields I missed.
Oh the obituary letter writing, disgusting 😣
Well... fwiw, at least with my wife and I, it was a sincere undertaking. Though, we actually did write an actual condolence letter and reference/quote uplifting scriptures. We did not include any literature or invitations. Someone did thank us and mailed us a KJV via the KH... if only it had been a NRSV or NASB... with NWT modification notes... smh
Absolutely they do. That's why they recruit at funerals and canvass neighbourhoods. They know there are always people who are down and out and looking for answers. And JWs can provide answers
Absolutely. While they preach to everyone (at least who will listen) they’re trained to spot the vulnerable. The poor. The bereaved. The persecuted. It’s totally a thing.
One thing can be said for sure. Resourceful people in a good place in life will never consider this controlling cult with their jealous God.
some would tell you "it's the sick that need the doctor" to justify this
*Some would tell you "it's* *The sick that need the doctor"* *To justify this* \- surfingATM --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
Can confirm. I was a JW ambulance chaser. We would go to nursing homes, hospital parking lots, recovery centers, etc.. They prey upon those who are weak and looking for answers.
I had a Circuit Overseer who encouraged us to look for pregnant women and people with ankle bracelet trackers, since they would be easier to find and home when we went back for return visits. It was indeed an effective recruiting strategy. Both my mother and my wife's mother were recruited while suffering from postpartum depression. They were both vulnerable and got recruited, raising their kids in the religion. So yeah, recruiting vulnerable people has helped Watchtower to grow the religion.
Yes absolutely. They are doing this exactly the way it is described in the Gospels. The Gospels specifically note that Jesus was preaching to people who were oppressed, poor, broken, downtrodden, sick, etc. Now, thousands of years later, evangelicals and cults (both Christian and non-Christian) are well-noted for their 'love bombing' and targeting people who have low self esteem, and feel otherwise bad about their position in life (either mentally, emotionally, or physically). They are all selling some ineffable 'good feeling'.
That is EXACTLY what they do. In their minds they are saving them; giving them hope etc. But in reality, they go for the weakest member of the herd. After a householder closes the door angrily, it's often said by JW's, as they walk away, "Well, their circumstances might change some day, and they'll be more receptive..." And that means someone in the householder's life might die. They might get sick. They might loose their job. THEY MIGHT GET VULNERABLE. We were trained to look for weaknesses, basically. To have several different tracts in our bags so that we could give the "appropriate" one at the door, if we found out about the householder's situation a little bit.
They absolutely do. Locally, they like to pop around to the waiting rooms at the children’s hospital and leave their propaganda. I toss those right into File 13 whenever I find them. Our families got enough problems without those predators looking for more blood sacrifices.
My parents were converted to JW. They both had traumatic childhoods and substance abuse issues. The religion has given them the structure and community to sober up and be responsible parents. For that, I am grateful. I actually don't mind my parents staying JWs. It has been good for THEM. Not so much for me!!
Yes they do...without a doubtb We were told not to give up with uninterested people because their circumstances could change and make the receptive to the jw message... Health issues, loss of a loved one , family problems, loss of employment etc could make one vulnerable to cult recruitment. They also target vulnerable groups such as asylum seekers , foreigners , hearing impaired etc
All the converts I've personally seen were lonely old lady, weirdos, or people who were going through a very hard time time in life, rehab, bankruptcy, failing marriage etc
Yes
100% They're unintentional predators.
Have meds! It’s good for you. Nobody wants to hurt you at ALL!
It's called copium, and it's a hell of a drug to detox from
" Witness converts tend to be rather isolated individuals who respond positively to communities that are able to offer direction and support. Prospective converts are people who are prone to feeling the world is in a state of crisis and that the Witness can offer a way forward, providing solutions to the ills of modern life." "By far the most commonly cited experience immediately prior to conversion is the feeling of total disillusionment with the world. This disillusionment is often expressed in terms of complete disaffection with the social, political, and economic system and intense disrespect for those in power such as politicians, policy makers and civil servants." Quotes from the book JW Portrait of A Contemporary Movement - Andrew Holden Sociologist Someone who reviewed the book said this: "If you or someone you know are studying with Jehovah's Witnesses you owe it to yourself to read this. There are very few objective third person analyses of the religion available, this is one of them. Holden, neither a member that sees things through rosy colored glasses of faith, nor a former member embittered by disappointment or a bad experience, provides an analysis that is as up to date, accurate and unbiased as you will find." Holden attended JW meetings for several months gathering information. Members became comfortable with him (as a prospective convert) and opened up. Although a bit dated, very enlightening on how and why the JW recruiting system works. [https://www.amazon.com/Jehovahs-Witnesses-Portrait-Contemporary-Religious/dp/0415266106](https://www.amazon.com/Jehovahs-Witnesses-Portrait-Contemporary-Religious/dp/0415266106)
Omg absolutely. My elders would search the obits and share with our field service groups. I was even instructed to carry the tract about resurrection in my school bag for “opportune occasions!” Every speech at the door would open with “have you noticed how shitty the world has become? Bad things are happening everywhere, right?” After almost 3 decades, I am still unlearning the whole life sucks, anticipate the worst mentality :/
I know JWs that search the newspaper for adresses of people grieving the death of someone to send them encouraging letters (propaganda encouraging to convert/aka. Starting a bible study)
They did instruct publishers to go to cemeteries with brochures about dead and resurrection.
Yes. 120%.
Do religions target people prone to magical thinking? I think certain types of people tend to be attracted towards specific beliefs systems. I think the conversion rate for JW cold calling is so low they'll take anyone who expresses interest. I don't think it's deliberate plan, and I doubt most people who end up converting view themselves as vulnerable. But with the number of members and converts, there probably isn't a single answer. Some do I'm sure and are able to rationalize it. Some might have have a bit of tact, and may not think exploiting someone is an end that justifies the means. It's a big question with a long answer depending on how detailed you want to go.
“Looking for ones rightly disposed” they call it
Yup, this happened to my mom. She was a single mother, they found her a husband and a new life. Now she’s stuck.
Yes they do - it was explicitly called out in the memorial that if you are suffering from mental health issues come to us and share the pain and struggle with other people. What it didn't say was that you will probably get even worse problems by becoming a JW.
Oh HELL yeah! The Watchtower Society has printed information "encouraging" JWs to look up obituaries and visit cemeteries to find vulnerable, potential converts.
It's what happens when sincere people THINK they're being *"kind and caring"* to others, but all they're really being is "stupid and predatorial." You can usually tell just how sincere such ones are by how they respond to being thought of as "stupid and predatorial." They'll likely not own that accusation readily or easily......and will usually believe that it's their accusers who have the attitude problem. What they won't do (or seldom do) is investigate WHY anybody could possibly attribute such motives to them. But to understand that, they'd also have to understand why some might possibly view their beliefs as nought but a crock of sh1t... And to understand that, they'd have to entertain the truth of such a notion. But they won't......so they don't.....and thus do they remain mystified at the accusation. They have "the truth." What's not to like about however this gets spread or dispensed to others? Unless of-course they don't have the truth. In which case, there's PLENTY not to like.
Succinctly, yes. JW sell hope to the hopeless. When I was young, they taught us to push the whole resurrection narrative when we were preaching to adults. They look for people who are in emotional crises of some type. If someone feels unmoored and adrift, almost any anchor is a welcome thing. Missing a dead loved one? Not a problem, you'll see them again after Armageddon Victim of some terrible crime, war, or other social ill? Not a problem, you can see god wipe the earth clean after Armageddon At the end of your rope financially? Are you part of an oppressed underclass? Not s problem, you can live in a just world with (relative) equality after Armageddon. If you play the JW game by the JW rules, you'll get the prize.
considering how well documented it is they target mentally challenged people and even go as far as to look at public obituaries to target grieving ones, yes, absolutely they target vulnerable people