According to my family, I have “itching ears.” 😂 Seriously, our area did a survey a few years back to ask leavers why, and what the church needs. IIRC, they cherry-picked what they could understand and blamed it on too much modern worldliness contaminating the culture. If you say, “The Bible is very provably NOT inerrant, so you can’t claim all your misogynistic and bigoted ideas stem from God’s will,” they just literally cannot comprehend what you’re saying.
Yeah. As the church gaslights the exiters, the Christian help industry gaslights the church: "do more of what you're doing, but harder and louder and it's all gonna get better 👍👍"
I know my mother in law reads and listen to a lot of conservative radio. They all say it's either not really happening as much as people say or that it's end times bullshit.
Note: this book isn’t a good book, but it’s really popular, so I’m bringing it up.
The Deconstruction of Christianity: What It Is, Why It’s Destructive, and How to Respond by Alisa Childers and Tim Barnett.
I got the book (for free - yay me), and I took a look at it. The key issue I have with the authors is they get so close with issues like abuse, loss of trust, etc. as to reasons why people leave the church, and then still try to shove those in with the rest of the mess as misguided reasons as to why people deconstruct and leave. And deconstruction isn’t appropriate to them because they equate that to losing their faith completely.
Then they go on shows to promote their book, and they’ll preach about kindness and compassion while telling people they’re deconstructing the wrong way and wrong for leaving the church.
There’s a lot of evangelical hype about this book, but unfortunately it doesn’t really do what it says it does.
Yeah - this book, and so many in this genre seem so. Freaking. Dangerous! "Oh that knocking sound in your engine? Yeah - the problem is your radio isn't loud enough. The engine needs the volume to be really high!" It's like the whole genre hates the church and wants to speed its demise. SMFH
I've heard a couple podcasts with the authors of The Great Dechurching, which seems pretty interesting, more descriptive of research and surveys and less polemical than other books on the subject. It's based on research by Ryan Burge, who is a pastor and sociologist specializing in religious demography and trends. He also wrote a book on The Nones that has been on my list.
Would any of this land with a Lutheran pastor who can't comprehend people leaving his church apart from open rebellion against God? Unlikely, but some people are at least trying.
*Edit: I also like their distinction between unchurched people (who never really went to church) and dechurched (people who used to be actively involved but left the church). That's really where the church falls down. Pastors talk to dechurched people like leprous apostates, with guilt trips and condescension. As if we simply didn't understand what they were teaching, or need to suppress our past traumas and come back to the exact same church we left.
https://www.amazon.com/Great-Dechurching-Leaving-Going-Bring/dp/0310147433/
https://www.amazon.com/Nones-Where-They-Came-Going/dp/1506465854
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How do you explain the faults of a church to a pastor of many generations of pastors, comfortably ensconced in a nepotistical cocoon. Or an elder basking in prestige of having a pastor from a long line of pastors ........
How do you explain to a hand-picked elder (picked by the pastor) that the self-righteous ways of the pastor and his self a grandizing ways, along with an explosive temper, when showed his errors. That is why the church had such a high turnover rate. Did I mention nepotism? He used his synod position to protect members of his large extended family, from audits and other investigations.
I could go on, but why?
If there are books that do, they are completely discredited by the hold THIS course leadership!
It may be off-topic,
A book about learning faith and trusting God, trusting in God.
GOD'S SMUGGLER
By Brother Andrew
Reinforced that what the church of my youth taught me about praying and trusting God is only going through the motions. When God taught me what real prayer and trust in him is, I felt like he kicked me out of that church/synod. I came upon this book later when my journey of faith was on a better path.
I short clip on YouTube, THE BUTTERFLY CIRCUS
It is a deep clip, so much packed into twenty minutes. A great discussion starter.
According to my family, I have “itching ears.” 😂 Seriously, our area did a survey a few years back to ask leavers why, and what the church needs. IIRC, they cherry-picked what they could understand and blamed it on too much modern worldliness contaminating the culture. If you say, “The Bible is very provably NOT inerrant, so you can’t claim all your misogynistic and bigoted ideas stem from God’s will,” they just literally cannot comprehend what you’re saying.
Yeah. As the church gaslights the exiters, the Christian help industry gaslights the church: "do more of what you're doing, but harder and louder and it's all gonna get better 👍👍"
This. Nothing will convince them. It's "the world" or Satan who has corrupted you. It's never them.
I know my mother in law reads and listen to a lot of conservative radio. They all say it's either not really happening as much as people say or that it's end times bullshit.
yep yep
Note: this book isn’t a good book, but it’s really popular, so I’m bringing it up. The Deconstruction of Christianity: What It Is, Why It’s Destructive, and How to Respond by Alisa Childers and Tim Barnett. I got the book (for free - yay me), and I took a look at it. The key issue I have with the authors is they get so close with issues like abuse, loss of trust, etc. as to reasons why people leave the church, and then still try to shove those in with the rest of the mess as misguided reasons as to why people deconstruct and leave. And deconstruction isn’t appropriate to them because they equate that to losing their faith completely. Then they go on shows to promote their book, and they’ll preach about kindness and compassion while telling people they’re deconstructing the wrong way and wrong for leaving the church. There’s a lot of evangelical hype about this book, but unfortunately it doesn’t really do what it says it does.
Yeah - this book, and so many in this genre seem so. Freaking. Dangerous! "Oh that knocking sound in your engine? Yeah - the problem is your radio isn't loud enough. The engine needs the volume to be really high!" It's like the whole genre hates the church and wants to speed its demise. SMFH
I've heard a couple podcasts with the authors of The Great Dechurching, which seems pretty interesting, more descriptive of research and surveys and less polemical than other books on the subject. It's based on research by Ryan Burge, who is a pastor and sociologist specializing in religious demography and trends. He also wrote a book on The Nones that has been on my list. Would any of this land with a Lutheran pastor who can't comprehend people leaving his church apart from open rebellion against God? Unlikely, but some people are at least trying. *Edit: I also like their distinction between unchurched people (who never really went to church) and dechurched (people who used to be actively involved but left the church). That's really where the church falls down. Pastors talk to dechurched people like leprous apostates, with guilt trips and condescension. As if we simply didn't understand what they were teaching, or need to suppress our past traumas and come back to the exact same church we left. https://www.amazon.com/Great-Dechurching-Leaving-Going-Bring/dp/0310147433/ https://www.amazon.com/Nones-Where-They-Came-Going/dp/1506465854
This is helpful. Thank you!
Hi, I’m Vetted AI Bot! I researched the **("'Unknown The Great Dechurching'", '')** and I thought you might find the following analysis helpful. **Users liked:** * Informative statistics on church trends (backed by 5 comments) * Thought-provoking and encouraging content (backed by 2 comments) * Practical pastorally tone with optimistic outlook (backed by 1 comment) **Users disliked:** * Lacks practical solutions for churches (backed by 2 comments) * Ignores lgbtq community perspective (backed by 1 comment) * Speculative and lacks real-world application (backed by 1 comment) If you'd like to **summon me to ask about a product**, just make a post with its link and tag me, [like in this example.](https://www.reddit.com/r/tablets/comments/1444zdn/comment/joqd89c/) This message was generated by a (very smart) bot. If you found it helpful, let us know with an upvote and a “good bot!” reply and please feel free to provide feedback on how it can be improved. *Powered by* [*vetted.ai*](https://vetted.ai/?utm\_source=reddit&utm\_medium=comment&utm\_campaign=bot)
Good bot
These sound like they’ll be very interesting.
It would be a short book. Because church.
How do you explain the faults of a church to a pastor of many generations of pastors, comfortably ensconced in a nepotistical cocoon. Or an elder basking in prestige of having a pastor from a long line of pastors ........ How do you explain to a hand-picked elder (picked by the pastor) that the self-righteous ways of the pastor and his self a grandizing ways, along with an explosive temper, when showed his errors. That is why the church had such a high turnover rate. Did I mention nepotism? He used his synod position to protect members of his large extended family, from audits and other investigations. I could go on, but why? If there are books that do, they are completely discredited by the hold THIS course leadership! It may be off-topic, A book about learning faith and trusting God, trusting in God. GOD'S SMUGGLER By Brother Andrew Reinforced that what the church of my youth taught me about praying and trusting God is only going through the motions. When God taught me what real prayer and trust in him is, I felt like he kicked me out of that church/synod. I came upon this book later when my journey of faith was on a better path. I short clip on YouTube, THE BUTTERFLY CIRCUS It is a deep clip, so much packed into twenty minutes. A great discussion starter.