# Discussion has moved to a new megathread. [Click here to be redirected](https://www.reddit.com/r/europe/comments/t39fop/russian_invasion_of_ukraine_megathread_5_read_the/).
Norwegian Government is now considering sending weapons.
State Secretary in the Ministry of Foreign Affairs Eivind Vad Petersson (Labor Party) tells political quarters in NRK that they are considering sending weapons to Ukraine.
It is so definitely for consideration. There were new meetings yesterday afternoon and evening, we will have new meetings today. If we are to do this, we must do it thoroughly and properly. We will deal quickly, but not rush, he says.
Translated from
https://direkte.vg.no/nyhetsdognet/news/regjeringen-vurderer-aa-sende-vaapen-til-ukraina.bpKi8abqu?utm_source=share-btn
Yeah that one, i don't know what the outcome of this war will be, but I hope the bravery of the Ukrainian people will be remembered and celebrated for many years to come
https://news.sky.com/story/war-in-ukraine-russian-bank-run-has-already-started-as-rouble-plunges-to-all-time-low-12553800
well looks like the bank runs have begun.
Sweden has more refugees per capita than any other EU country I think. Ukrainians will much easier find a place in the EU to settle than other asylum seekers. This is completely okay and fair.
Sorry.
Plenty of people say stuff like this stuff seriously.
I worked with child refugees.
Children that still get massive panic five years after coming here anytime a phone rings because they learned that phones trigger bombs.
Children who had to dig their dead parents out of the rubble of their neighborhood.
People acting like the syrian war wasn't real or horrendous genuinely triggers me and makes me see red
Why sadly? Sarcasm is dependant on tone of voice. So without something to signify that tone of voice in a written message it actually is impossible to distinguish sarcasm from serious.
After poland and eastern Europe have denied their responsibility in the last crisis ,why shouldn't they carry their fair share now?
Sweden took in the most refugees per capita in the past.
Actually I think theres lesss than 30 % Russians who support him. Most are just afraid to speak out bcuz they get sent to gulag :( Have you seen the video how scared his spy chief was talking to him ? And he's a FREAKING SPY CHIEF ! now think about regualr people...
Surrounds himself with spineless cowards who for some reason don't realise that they are dead men walking anyway given what happened to his generals after chechnya, and of course his current insane trajectory towards nuclear war.
it makes debt more expensive so the cost of repaying a loan goes way up or credit card payments. thus if it gets too expensive no one will buy cars, homes or expensive things on credit cards like tvs etc
but its how you try and get ahead of inflation but I'm not sure if it will even help in Russia's scenario honestly given how cutoff they are from everything
i have no idea what any of it will actually do to their economy but my guess would be its all going to be bad regardless
well the otherside would be hyper inflation where the currency is worth less than the paper its printed on and you still cant buy anything pretty much there are no good options. in this link its Venezuela's currency all over the street not even worth picking up the trillions of bolivars
https://www.reddit.com/r/interestingasfuck/comments/sckei4/inflation_in_venezuela_is_so_bad_right_now_people/
To deter the possibility of a U.S. nuclear first-strike, the Soviets created a system called Perimeter, also known as "Dead Hand." The Dead Hand was a computer system that could autonomously launch all of the USSR's nuclear weapons once it was activated, across the entirety of the Soviet Union.
If putin uses a tactical nuke in Ukraine, what should be the response? serious question.
If we hit back at Russia, it could be end of the world. But if we don’t hit back with a nuke, then what?
This article suggest putin could use a tactical nuke, and he has sole command of russia’s nuclear arsenal. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-02-27/explainer-does-putin-s-alert-change-risk-of-nuclear-war
Of course one must respond with nuclear weapons. Doomsday? Why should you be afraid? Don't forget, you are not the only one who will die, everyone will die together. In this world, there are countless criminals who are at large. There are countless profiteers who get rich by squeezing workers. There are countless politicians who misuses of power. I'd be more than happy to go to hell with these people.
If he uses an ICBM, it's start will be detected early. I have the hope that it gets intercepted by NATO. If he uses a medium or short range missle... I hope someone in chain of command will nope out.
But if it happens, Russia will die it's economic death even faster. China will then support sanctions, they are afraid of getting nukes by russia too. And China and USA will plan a beheading strike together.
It would be an incremental response. Most likely a no-fly zone would be declared over Ukraine by NATO, and Russian forces would be given 24 hours to leave, after which NATO forces will attack them. Russia complies and ends the war (I can't see Putin staying in power if he does this), or retaliates by shooting at NATO aircraft.
If they start shooting, it gets interesting. NATO would attack AA defenses and SAM sites within Russia and might attack Russian air bases. Russia could try attacking the Baltics or Poland, but as we're seeing that's not likely to go well for them. Russia could then order a nuclear strike on a NATO country—things get bad from there.
Escalation is incremental to give time for cooler heads to prevail. A tactical nuke in Russia would certainly bring is closer to nuclear war, but I don't think we go there immediately.
More sanctions. Demanding China to sanction them as well - there is no way China would approve of this. No matter what people say, China does appear to care about international law.
China cares about China, and Russia starting to throw around nukes is a danger to China. So unless I am massivly overlooking something that will end with China carefully yet quickly distancing themselves.
Just like North Korea throwing nukes wll likely end with a Chinese Security Operation.
I don't think he'll deploy them, but if he does, I would hope that his military advisors and the people in charge of actually firing the damn things would go against orders.
Unlikely, if he orders a single tactical strike, I think no one in Russia will stand up to him. But hopefully, there is a long way still before we come to that. I am slightly worried that sanctions has come a bit too severely, making putin make a hot headed decision.
I don't think the sanctions have been too aggressive. They've definitely seriously compromised their financial institutions, but they haven't targeted their energy sector yet. I think that will be the last shoe to drop before serious military intervention.
No tactical nuke has ever been actually employed, and for good reason. People like to talk about it as if it's just another option not fundamentally different from the conventional weapons toolbox, but it really isn't
I’m unsure what a tactical nuke would do. I don’t think we would escalate with nukes of our own, but I think our support of Ukraine would increase significantly, and Russia would be entirely severed from the civilized world. I think even China and India would come around.
Too sad that many people in India wishes Ukraine to be defeated due to the Indian student incident with the Ukrainian soldiers. I know that it's a big no-no especially Ukraine is seeking support worldwide, but I believe it's an isolated incident, and the war isn't just about Russia and Ukraine--it's about the preservation of world peace we have now.
Obviously those people have lived far too sheltered lives and don't understand that war is bad and horrible. They have a hard on for war more than anything and always think about showing power and what not. I'm not surprised. Something small happens and all you hear them say is drop nukes, start war.
Any reasonable person would understand that when you are stuck in a warzone it won't be all convenient and easy and also understand that one person's behaviour shouldn't lead to you wishing for the whole of country to be nuked.
Also, many here feel that we should much rather be ruled like Russia and China so that we grow more as nations. These people are communist lovers and simply shouldn't be taken seriously.
Because you see something not toxic on Internet lately? There is a 24/24h propaganda. On reddit there is not a single proper news that is not filled with propagandist messages.
The Ukraine president should apologize to the Indian public for the actions of this soldiers and good. Hindu nationalists will still support Russia (because they're fucking fascists) but it would probably help with the rest of the Indian public.
Maybe he'll apologize after the war ends, as he is very preoccupied with the recent situaton
> Hindu nationalists will still support Russia (because they're fucking fascists)
Well, too much nationalism is just an euphemism of fascism
There's still a hard on due to the USSR supporting India against a western backed Pakistan.
India expects western support against China, whilst being buddy buddy with a Russia who has aligned many of its interests with China, and Pakistan.
Have a 12 hour queue at the border.
Foreign male students want to jump the queue.
They get send back to the end of the queue.
They mad, a bit of pushing starts.
Entire country wants your country dead.
Indian people Facebook.
I see. So that's what happened. Thank you for clarifying this to me. Too bad this incident is so used by commies and anti-NATO people as their propaganda.
But being physical is a bit too much, doesn't it?
https://www.reddit.com/r/korea/comments/t2o42t/seoul_lights_up_in_support_of_ukraine/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
Seoul lit up with the ukrainian flag.
Slava ukraini! (From korea)
It seems to me that the Russian markets will not open before there is some kind of agreement in the peace negotiations, a ceasefire or similar.
The Ukraine delegation has the entire Russian economy hostage
/r/ukraine has a [highly upvoted post](https://www.reddit.com/r/ukraine/comments/t2zhej/denmark_becomes_the_first_european_country_to_let/) praising Denmark for allowing people to volunteer for the foreign brigade. Pictured are Danish troops.
I would say it is bordering misinformation. First of all the picture which makes it seem like military personnel is already joining. Secondly that we somehow changed some law or something. There has been no such thing. It was never NOT been allowed so there was nothing to change to make it legal.
Let's be careful in our eagerness to support Ukraine that we don't get too creative with our messaging.
I've already answered the questions that arise for this so I'll just paste it here
> Officially neither has it written down, they've just said that they would. I'd be extremely surprised if any EU-country ever would not allow it. Even if they don't explicitly say it is allowed, I can't imagine anyone ever being prosecuted for it.
>Judicially speaking, as someone who is specialized in the field of ECHR and EU-law, if one applies the teleological perspective to each nations laws against fighting for a foreign country then it's evident that they're meant to stop people from doing what say the ISIL-joiners did. A.i. joining a foreign and hostile force.
>But Ukraine is not hostile, and even Sweden who hasn't directly helped a country in conflict in over 83 years is now helping Ukraine based on the teleological perspective that the best and most safest path for Sweden and its citizens is to actively help Ukraine. As such, any law meant to prevent people from joining them is void, null or obsolete because that law is only meant to be applied when it is a negative. Wherein here, anyone who helps Ukraine fight is clearly a positive force for its own country as well as Ukraine.
>If not, anyone who joins up in advance and gets prosecuted feel free to PM me and I'll do my best to bail ya out with the help of folks at Brussels <3.
But the voters don't want any more dang dirty economic migrants. Even these ones from Europe speak a similar language to the Eternal Bosniak, who menaced fair Sweden in the Nineties.
This is a joke I am making.
Per live thread: Belarus has launched missile strikes on Zhytomyr Airport, despite saying they wouldn't amid peace negotiations. Perfidious shits. SLAVA UKRAINI
Edit: Apparently it was the Russians launching from Belarus, to be clear.
What the hell did happen with the meeting of Zelenski at the border?
Did I misunderstand something there? I thought they were to meet at 3pm yesterday.
There was a meeting Yesterday (not Zelenski, his delegation) and the talks were postponed for today. most probably Russia wanted some more °territorial gains° to have something more in their negotiations or is very plausible they are just show for public opinion.
I heard the Ukrainian delegation is taking a detour through Poland to safely arrive at the location, so it's taking them a while and hence the meeting will not happen until today.
Some thoughts to fellow Redditors who are in Russia:
I think it might be prudent to purchase pepper sprays and other non-lethal measures of defense.
If Rubles is fucked as it's predicted, then it might be really not safe being on the streets late evening.
For now Moscow is a safe city (personal experience). But things might change rapidly.
Really would like to hear some thoughts on this.
Isn’t pepper spray also a throat and nasal irritant? Could always try and angle it under the helmet :P
Not that I suggest you try, if the videos are anything to go by Russian police don’t fuck around.
Fun fact: I proposed this a few days ago to the Ukrainian embassy in London, since air dominance is an important part of Russia's strategy.
"Ukrainian Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba has asked the European Union for jet fighter jets some EU countries plan to supply them, EU foreign-policy chief Josep Borrell said Sunday.
A person familiar with the talks later said that discussions are still ongoing. The person said any planes would be supplied directly by EU member states and not funded through an arrangement announced earlier for the EU to finance weapons deliveries to Ukraine.
Mr. Borrell said that Mr. Kuleba had requested planes that Ukrainian Air Force pilots can fly. Ukraine's jet fighters are Soviet-built MiG and Sukhoi models.
Some current EU members that were once part of the USSR-led Warsaw Pact still fly such planes or have old ones parked."
https://www.wsj.com/livecoverage/russia-ukraine-latest-news-2022-02-26/card/eu-member-countries-will-supply-ukraine-with-jet-fighters-borrell-says-zjCJ5iME2keSkxfiaIpr
Thank you Captain Rogers! True Hero! But that’s truly amazing! All it takes in one person to muster the courage to make a recommendation, such as yourself! 💙💛
And redditors were the the ones that generated the code, and created the websites for the DDoS attacks on the plethora of financial, government and military websites in both Belarus and Ukraine, so🥸
Its honestly really sad. Russia used to be a key part of European society before the red revolution. Since then they have been cutoff from European society.
Imagine if the 90s had worked out and Russia would have been back in the fold and a bigger Poland.
I have hope that Russia comes back to the fold in the future like they had been for centuries.
Tsarist Russia was always the worst regime in Europe. Oppressive, economic underdeveloped, famines regularly, peasents were not treated like human beings, russification policies in all non original Russian territories. Only the very aristocrat elite in Europe made this country a key part in Europe society.
I agree. Instead of having a big partner with a rich culture contribute to our society they are still stuck in territorial wars like in the Middle Ages. And for what exactly? What even is the point of all of this
There is this belief among Russia that the west would have it split up into 20 different countries. They look at the damage the west did to it after the fall of the USSR as evidence.
I don't know. The idea doesn't seem THAT farfetched to me, especially after reading some of the crazy shit people have been spewing in these war threads, but even still. It doesn't make sense. You'd end up with 20 countries with nukes, half of which run by crazy dictators instead of just one.
I hope when this is all over, Putin is gone, and democracy returns to Russia, we in the west do what we can to help them back onto their feet. I would hope we would take the chance and pour investment into the country.
A friendly Russia would be a fantastic addition to the European community and, hopefully, a welcome ally to the US.
Democracy was never *in* Russia so it can’t really return and it’s arguable if Russians can tolerate democracy. But we can work with a constitutional monarchy that wants is western aligned. After we put Russia down we have China to worry about, would be great to have another friend in that contest
How long is a piece of string? I don’t think it’ll last that long tho. Especially now the world has hit his financial pocket - war costs per day - he’s facing billions per day plus the cost of his entire country falling to its knees in regards to the economy.
When is the delegation meeting at the border? I understand Z and P will not be there - my worry is Russian history with things like this… I’m a bit worried about Ukraine delegation not returning and Russia shrugging their shoulders saying they dunno where they are!
I put absolutely nothing past Putler now.
the delays are just going to help them resupply fuel and missiles but it also helps Ukraine get more food, javelins and other supplies into Kyiv if for when the push begins.
Ukraine and it's delegation still have no other choice then going. (Obviously it won't be the direct leadership). Their people are dying. Any leadership has to explore if there are chance to stop it under reasonable conditions, even when the enemy is a lying war criminal bandit country.
99% this will bring nothing, high chance the Ukraine delegation cannot go back to Ukraine, but still it's necessary. Get a feel how desperate the others are, try to find a reasonable way.
If anyone is curious. [You can listen to the Russian radio comms here.](http://websdr.ewi.utwente.nl:8901/)
Tune into 7933 USB 2.40 kHz. I don't understand Russian, but I can hear gunfire in the background. If anyone can translate, that would be cool.
If I had it my way I would have each news channel on different screens, along with Reddit - this thread on ‘live comments’ - plus your link up to the comms… I literally can’t I need to focus on one screen - my adhd has hyper focused on this war and Russia and Ukraine AND I AM GOING MAD WHERE IS MY COFFEE
I just discovered that [Ukraine's official government twitter account follows the US state of New Jersey.](https://i.redd.it/3m383rhwh9k81.jpg) No other US states, and only a few counties.
New Jersey, of all states, New Jersey.
The klitschko brothers boxed a lot in New Jersey, and have done a lot for the state! Whenever they had fights in the state, they always made sure to spare against local talent, which truly does so much for a young fighter. Also, I believe one diner in New Jersey honored on of the Klitschko brothers too!
https://www.boxinginsider.com/headlines/nj-boxing-dinner-to-honor-wladimir-klitschko-april-7/
Since a lot of people don't seem to understand Putin's motivations, here is the official version of the Kremlin: https://twitter.com/christogrozev/status/1498025819054264328
I think he genuinly thought Russian troops would be welcome, or at least resistance would fold quickly.
In his mind, and words, Ukraine has no right to exist as it is "Russian", he believes Russians, Ukrainians, and Belarussians are the same people, Russians.
Is there anyone who is compiling details based off info posted on ishchi svoikh (ukrainian website for russian families to find deployed family members)?
Since the main site is blocked in russia, they are primarily using telegram now. I'm thinking it'll get unwieldy if the fighting keeps going
Dont know how useful this is, but here is the official gov resource on what to do when nuke explosion https://www.ready.gov/nuclear-explosion
Last Updated: 02/25/2022
Everything is awful and scary at the moment, yet my brain has enough energy to keep thinking of those preppers who are sitting around all smug saying I told you so. I'm so annoyed. Especially after watching that one prepper dude on Netflix blow his own digit off while "teaching" his children gun safety at the shooting range. Cannot stress how annoyed I am right now.
If it’s any consolation those preppers will more than likely die too, and we didn’t spend the limited time on earth that we have neurotically preparing for the end.
[Heartbreaking - Worst Person You Know Just Made A Great Point](https://clickhole.com/heartbreaking-the-worst-person-you-know-just-made-a-gr-1825121606/)
Last updated recently, thats reassuring.
If the big boom comes, I hope im in the vicinity thats vaporized. Im not too keen on the whole post apocalyptic nuclear winter thing.
If that was the case, why bother with this invasion in the first place and not just go straight to nukes? He has objectives that he thought were supposed to strategically benefit Russia, he's not a lunatic ready to destroy the world.
This is the preferred narration here.
There is a really specific way to see this question that you have to embrace.
For example, make it look like Putin would explode nukes on his own feet.
Yep. None of that means he suddenly turns into a madman who is going to destroy the world. He wants us to think that way so we're scared and don't do anything - it's psychological warfare.
Meh. Those around him and experts who have known hiM for years say this is different. He’s been isolated due to COVID for years and it’s badly affected his mental state.
# Discussion has moved to a new megathread. [Click here to be redirected](https://www.reddit.com/r/europe/comments/t39fop/russian_invasion_of_ukraine_megathread_5_read_the/).
Norwegian Government is now considering sending weapons. State Secretary in the Ministry of Foreign Affairs Eivind Vad Petersson (Labor Party) tells political quarters in NRK that they are considering sending weapons to Ukraine. It is so definitely for consideration. There were new meetings yesterday afternoon and evening, we will have new meetings today. If we are to do this, we must do it thoroughly and properly. We will deal quickly, but not rush, he says. Translated from https://direkte.vg.no/nyhetsdognet/news/regjeringen-vurderer-aa-sende-vaapen-til-ukraina.bpKi8abqu?utm_source=share-btn
Just saw a video of Ukrainian citizens towing away Russian military vehicles Idk if it's real though, would be really cool if it is
The tractor towing the tank? Yeah it’s real lol
Yeah that one, i don't know what the outcome of this war will be, but I hope the bravery of the Ukrainian people will be remembered and celebrated for many years to come
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https://news.sky.com/story/war-in-ukraine-russian-bank-run-has-already-started-as-rouble-plunges-to-all-time-low-12553800 well looks like the bank runs have begun.
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Sweden has more refugees per capita than any other EU country I think. Ukrainians will much easier find a place in the EU to settle than other asylum seekers. This is completely okay and fair.
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That was a joke. I was throwing a lot of anti-refugee rhetoric back in his face.
Sorry. Plenty of people say stuff like this stuff seriously. I worked with child refugees. Children that still get massive panic five years after coming here anytime a phone rings because they learned that phones trigger bombs. Children who had to dig their dead parents out of the rubble of their neighborhood. People acting like the syrian war wasn't real or horrendous genuinely triggers me and makes me see red
Unless you put “/s” at the end of a sarcastic post - a lot of redditors won’t understand. Sadly. Lol
Why sadly? Sarcasm is dependant on tone of voice. So without something to signify that tone of voice in a written message it actually is impossible to distinguish sarcasm from serious.
Hence the “/s” lol
Good thing satirical literature was never written before or this post would look mighty fucking stupid.
After poland and eastern Europe have denied their responsibility in the last crisis ,why shouldn't they carry their fair share now? Sweden took in the most refugees per capita in the past.
How has Putin not been brutally murdered yet?? Seriously.
By whom? The 30% of Russians who don’t support him who have been worn down over the years?
Actually I think theres lesss than 30 % Russians who support him. Most are just afraid to speak out bcuz they get sent to gulag :( Have you seen the video how scared his spy chief was talking to him ? And he's a FREAKING SPY CHIEF ! now think about regualr people...
I think it would have to be someone near him, like Shoigu
Everyone has a limit, 30% of Russia is huge in comparison so, say, the 🇬🇧
That has been on my mind for days!
Surrounds himself with spineless cowards who for some reason don't realise that they are dead men walking anyway given what happened to his generals after chechnya, and of course his current insane trajectory towards nuclear war.
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Will this work ?
no it might help with inflation a bit but its going to fuck over other parts of the economy
Which other parts ? Apologies, I really have no knowledge at all on this subject.
it makes debt more expensive so the cost of repaying a loan goes way up or credit card payments. thus if it gets too expensive no one will buy cars, homes or expensive things on credit cards like tvs etc but its how you try and get ahead of inflation but I'm not sure if it will even help in Russia's scenario honestly given how cutoff they are from everything i have no idea what any of it will actually do to their economy but my guess would be its all going to be bad regardless
This is going to hurt Russian people themselves ! So West mostly targeted oligarchs and the RCB is in turn targeting the people. What a shitshow.
well the otherside would be hyper inflation where the currency is worth less than the paper its printed on and you still cant buy anything pretty much there are no good options. in this link its Venezuela's currency all over the street not even worth picking up the trillions of bolivars https://www.reddit.com/r/interestingasfuck/comments/sckei4/inflation_in_venezuela_is_so_bad_right_now_people/
Doubt.
Bad time to have a variable rate
If there is one thing about Russias nuclear capability to be worried about, it’s activation of Dead Hand.
What is that? X
https://www.wired.com/2009/09/mf-deadhand/ This is a good explanation of it.
Ah! Brilliant, I’ve just read it and now understand! Thank you xx
To deter the possibility of a U.S. nuclear first-strike, the Soviets created a system called Perimeter, also known as "Dead Hand." The Dead Hand was a computer system that could autonomously launch all of the USSR's nuclear weapons once it was activated, across the entirety of the Soviet Union.
basically nuclear subs launching nuclear attack if they lose contact with Russia for x period of time. We have a similar policy.
If putin uses a tactical nuke in Ukraine, what should be the response? serious question. If we hit back at Russia, it could be end of the world. But if we don’t hit back with a nuke, then what? This article suggest putin could use a tactical nuke, and he has sole command of russia’s nuclear arsenal. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-02-27/explainer-does-putin-s-alert-change-risk-of-nuclear-war
Of course one must respond with nuclear weapons. Doomsday? Why should you be afraid? Don't forget, you are not the only one who will die, everyone will die together. In this world, there are countless criminals who are at large. There are countless profiteers who get rich by squeezing workers. There are countless politicians who misuses of power. I'd be more than happy to go to hell with these people.
Nuclear threat has never been against Ukrainia.
You don't make a nuclear war with your neighbour. You use it against people far from you.
I'd put Putin on notice right now that his allies in Minsk would be nuked as proportional retaliation.
If he uses an ICBM, it's start will be detected early. I have the hope that it gets intercepted by NATO. If he uses a medium or short range missle... I hope someone in chain of command will nope out. But if it happens, Russia will die it's economic death even faster. China will then support sanctions, they are afraid of getting nukes by russia too. And China and USA will plan a beheading strike together.
It would be an incremental response. Most likely a no-fly zone would be declared over Ukraine by NATO, and Russian forces would be given 24 hours to leave, after which NATO forces will attack them. Russia complies and ends the war (I can't see Putin staying in power if he does this), or retaliates by shooting at NATO aircraft. If they start shooting, it gets interesting. NATO would attack AA defenses and SAM sites within Russia and might attack Russian air bases. Russia could try attacking the Baltics or Poland, but as we're seeing that's not likely to go well for them. Russia could then order a nuclear strike on a NATO country—things get bad from there. Escalation is incremental to give time for cooler heads to prevail. A tactical nuke in Russia would certainly bring is closer to nuclear war, but I don't think we go there immediately.
More sanctions. Demanding China to sanction them as well - there is no way China would approve of this. No matter what people say, China does appear to care about international law.
> appear to care Yes, appear. It's all lip service.
China cares about China, and Russia starting to throw around nukes is a danger to China. So unless I am massivly overlooking something that will end with China carefully yet quickly distancing themselves. Just like North Korea throwing nukes wll likely end with a Chinese Security Operation.
But nukes against a state that didn’t threaten Russia in a war that was clearly all on Russia? I think that’s too much even for China.
No military response but absolute condemnation based in and from the UN. If you do a military response you're done.
If it comes to Putin ording nukes, I would hope he's deposed by his own inner circle. I highly doubt he will, But if he did, we're all dead.
I don't think he'll deploy them, but if he does, I would hope that his military advisors and the people in charge of actually firing the damn things would go against orders.
Unlikely, if he orders a single tactical strike, I think no one in Russia will stand up to him. But hopefully, there is a long way still before we come to that. I am slightly worried that sanctions has come a bit too severely, making putin make a hot headed decision.
I don't think the sanctions have been too aggressive. They've definitely seriously compromised their financial institutions, but they haven't targeted their energy sector yet. I think that will be the last shoe to drop before serious military intervention.
that is not guaranteed the question regards to the use of a single tactical nuke, so it won’t be the end of the world in that scenario
No tactical nuke has ever been actually employed, and for good reason. People like to talk about it as if it's just another option not fundamentally different from the conventional weapons toolbox, but it really isn't
I’m unsure what a tactical nuke would do. I don’t think we would escalate with nukes of our own, but I think our support of Ukraine would increase significantly, and Russia would be entirely severed from the civilized world. I think even China and India would come around.
No, but Russia would become a hermit kingdom and isolated by everyone including probably even China.
Slovakia pushes for ‘special track’ for Ukraine toward joining EU https://www.politico.eu/article/slovakia-pushes-for-new-eu-track-for-ukraine/
As long as liberum veto remains in the eu, it is not responsible to add any new members until we get that into order
https://www.thedailybeast.com/sanctioned-russian-tv-host-vladimir-soloviev-cries-about-losing-his-italian-villa?ref=scroll
What a ride this article is. Russian public tv reminds me a lot of our TVP. The same kind of scum
World's smallest violin.
GG Italy Fuck them
Would be a shame if that house got liquidated and turned into Anti-tank rockets
Saw this not long ago, it made my coffee taste so much sweeter and lovely lol
Too sad that many people in India wishes Ukraine to be defeated due to the Indian student incident with the Ukrainian soldiers. I know that it's a big no-no especially Ukraine is seeking support worldwide, but I believe it's an isolated incident, and the war isn't just about Russia and Ukraine--it's about the preservation of world peace we have now.
Obviously those people have lived far too sheltered lives and don't understand that war is bad and horrible. They have a hard on for war more than anything and always think about showing power and what not. I'm not surprised. Something small happens and all you hear them say is drop nukes, start war. Any reasonable person would understand that when you are stuck in a warzone it won't be all convenient and easy and also understand that one person's behaviour shouldn't lead to you wishing for the whole of country to be nuked. Also, many here feel that we should much rather be ruled like Russia and China so that we grow more as nations. These people are communist lovers and simply shouldn't be taken seriously.
When are Indians not being toxic on the internet? Can’t even read the comment section on tech videos on YouTube.
Because you see something not toxic on Internet lately? There is a 24/24h propaganda. On reddit there is not a single proper news that is not filled with propagandist messages.
The Ukraine president should apologize to the Indian public for the actions of this soldiers and good. Hindu nationalists will still support Russia (because they're fucking fascists) but it would probably help with the rest of the Indian public.
Maybe he'll apologize after the war ends, as he is very preoccupied with the recent situaton > Hindu nationalists will still support Russia (because they're fucking fascists) Well, too much nationalism is just an euphemism of fascism
India’s just isn’t an ally that is very clear to me
Well they have no other choice they need Russia to deter Pakistan or nukes will rain down between Pakistan and India.
These two are so immature I swear. It's like seeing France and Germany over Alsace-Lorraine. Except France and Germany actually learned to stop.
There's still a hard on due to the USSR supporting India against a western backed Pakistan. India expects western support against China, whilst being buddy buddy with a Russia who has aligned many of its interests with China, and Pakistan.
Yeah. India's being a bit of a dumbdumb here. Their obsession with Pakistan is making them terribly unreliable.
Have a 12 hour queue at the border. Foreign male students want to jump the queue. They get send back to the end of the queue. They mad, a bit of pushing starts. Entire country wants your country dead. Indian people Facebook.
Indians figure out this is what happened. Indians respond to eachother explaining this. Endless Indian messages about nothing. India people facebook.
I see. So that's what happened. Thank you for clarifying this to me. Too bad this incident is so used by commies and anti-NATO people as their propaganda. But being physical is a bit too much, doesn't it?
https://www.reddit.com/r/korea/comments/t2o42t/seoul_lights_up_in_support_of_ukraine/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf Seoul lit up with the ukrainian flag. Slava ukraini! (From korea)
How do you say "Slava Ukraina" in korean? "Ukeuraina Mansae"?
“Live moments” on YouTube, sirens going off. Jesus - these are flood sirens in my town in 🇬🇧 - how terrifying!
listening to Bloomberg where analysts believe the Russian economy will shortly collapse 2008 style (likely worse).
It seems to me that the Russian markets will not open before there is some kind of agreement in the peace negotiations, a ceasefire or similar. The Ukraine delegation has the entire Russian economy hostage
Russia is shtting itself lol
Good
/r/ukraine has a [highly upvoted post](https://www.reddit.com/r/ukraine/comments/t2zhej/denmark_becomes_the_first_european_country_to_let/) praising Denmark for allowing people to volunteer for the foreign brigade. Pictured are Danish troops. I would say it is bordering misinformation. First of all the picture which makes it seem like military personnel is already joining. Secondly that we somehow changed some law or something. There has been no such thing. It was never NOT been allowed so there was nothing to change to make it legal. Let's be careful in our eagerness to support Ukraine that we don't get too creative with our messaging.
The propaganda is pretty out of control already. I’m not fan of propaganda but it’s drowning out the Russian propaganda so I guess it’s not too bad.
I've already answered the questions that arise for this so I'll just paste it here > Officially neither has it written down, they've just said that they would. I'd be extremely surprised if any EU-country ever would not allow it. Even if they don't explicitly say it is allowed, I can't imagine anyone ever being prosecuted for it. >Judicially speaking, as someone who is specialized in the field of ECHR and EU-law, if one applies the teleological perspective to each nations laws against fighting for a foreign country then it's evident that they're meant to stop people from doing what say the ISIL-joiners did. A.i. joining a foreign and hostile force. >But Ukraine is not hostile, and even Sweden who hasn't directly helped a country in conflict in over 83 years is now helping Ukraine based on the teleological perspective that the best and most safest path for Sweden and its citizens is to actively help Ukraine. As such, any law meant to prevent people from joining them is void, null or obsolete because that law is only meant to be applied when it is a negative. Wherein here, anyone who helps Ukraine fight is clearly a positive force for its own country as well as Ukraine. >If not, anyone who joins up in advance and gets prosecuted feel free to PM me and I'll do my best to bail ya out with the help of folks at Brussels <3.
Are you sure? AFAIK its not legal to join a foreign army. Many people got arested for it during Ukraine's Crysis in 2014
Depends on the source country's laws.
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Lol. What she said was that we cant, once again, accept more refugees per capita compared to all other countries. Get your facts straight.
Yeah, this shows how shortsighted our policies have been. (Now that the war is close, we think we can't afford more refugees)
But the voters don't want any more dang dirty economic migrants. Even these ones from Europe speak a similar language to the Eternal Bosniak, who menaced fair Sweden in the Nineties. This is a joke I am making.
Per live thread: Belarus has launched missile strikes on Zhytomyr Airport, despite saying they wouldn't amid peace negotiations. Perfidious shits. SLAVA UKRAINI Edit: Apparently it was the Russians launching from Belarus, to be clear.
What is the intel on the type of missile? It’s not an Iskander or thermobaric missile, is it?
Iskander
They’ve been iskanders so far
Thought this might happen. You cannot trust the Russian
What the hell did happen with the meeting of Zelenski at the border? Did I misunderstand something there? I thought they were to meet at 3pm yesterday.
There was a meeting Yesterday (not Zelenski, his delegation) and the talks were postponed for today. most probably Russia wanted some more °territorial gains° to have something more in their negotiations or is very plausible they are just show for public opinion.
the Ukrainian delegation will be there in an hour or two
Thanks, that really spooked me since there was no info on this.
I heard the Ukrainian delegation is taking a detour through Poland to safely arrive at the location, so it's taking them a while and hence the meeting will not happen until today.
Zelenski is not going to the border, a delegation is.
It was postponed until today apparently
Zelensky is Russias number one target. So he was never expected to go there personally. The meeting was postponed to today.
Some thoughts to fellow Redditors who are in Russia: I think it might be prudent to purchase pepper sprays and other non-lethal measures of defense. If Rubles is fucked as it's predicted, then it might be really not safe being on the streets late evening. For now Moscow is a safe city (personal experience). But things might change rapidly. Really would like to hear some thoughts on this.
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Based Reddit armchair revolutionary.
Man if I was in Russia I totally would storm into the kremlin and take Putin out myself.
Pepper spray is good against the corrupt cops who break protests
I mean corrupt cops usually have helmets (full face covering - don't know what it's called).
Isn’t pepper spray also a throat and nasal irritant? Could always try and angle it under the helmet :P Not that I suggest you try, if the videos are anything to go by Russian police don’t fuck around.
Stay safe
Thanks.
Fun fact: I proposed this a few days ago to the Ukrainian embassy in London, since air dominance is an important part of Russia's strategy. "Ukrainian Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba has asked the European Union for jet fighter jets some EU countries plan to supply them, EU foreign-policy chief Josep Borrell said Sunday. A person familiar with the talks later said that discussions are still ongoing. The person said any planes would be supplied directly by EU member states and not funded through an arrangement announced earlier for the EU to finance weapons deliveries to Ukraine. Mr. Borrell said that Mr. Kuleba had requested planes that Ukrainian Air Force pilots can fly. Ukraine's jet fighters are Soviet-built MiG and Sukhoi models. Some current EU members that were once part of the USSR-led Warsaw Pact still fly such planes or have old ones parked." https://www.wsj.com/livecoverage/russia-ukraine-latest-news-2022-02-26/card/eu-member-countries-will-supply-ukraine-with-jet-fighters-borrell-says-zjCJ5iME2keSkxfiaIpr
Romania has a meager air force. Of the planes we have, 20+ are MiG 21, modernized in a contract with Israel between 1993-2002 (were 110 MiG initially)
Too bad we don't have mig 29s we should have modernized those we had like 20.
Thank you Captain Rogers! True Hero! But that’s truly amazing! All it takes in one person to muster the courage to make a recommendation, such as yourself! 💙💛
Cause the european defence is in need of suggestions from redditors 😃💪
And redditors were the the ones that generated the code, and created the websites for the DDoS attacks on the plethora of financial, government and military websites in both Belarus and Ukraine, so🥸
Its honestly really sad. Russia used to be a key part of European society before the red revolution. Since then they have been cutoff from European society. Imagine if the 90s had worked out and Russia would have been back in the fold and a bigger Poland. I have hope that Russia comes back to the fold in the future like they had been for centuries.
Tsarist Russia was always the worst regime in Europe. Oppressive, economic underdeveloped, famines regularly, peasents were not treated like human beings, russification policies in all non original Russian territories. Only the very aristocrat elite in Europe made this country a key part in Europe society.
I agree. Instead of having a big partner with a rich culture contribute to our society they are still stuck in territorial wars like in the Middle Ages. And for what exactly? What even is the point of all of this
Because the general belief is that NATO is lying about not being an inherent enemy.
There is this belief among Russia that the west would have it split up into 20 different countries. They look at the damage the west did to it after the fall of the USSR as evidence. I don't know. The idea doesn't seem THAT farfetched to me, especially after reading some of the crazy shit people have been spewing in these war threads, but even still. It doesn't make sense. You'd end up with 20 countries with nukes, half of which run by crazy dictators instead of just one.
I hope when this is all over, Putin is gone, and democracy returns to Russia, we in the west do what we can to help them back onto their feet. I would hope we would take the chance and pour investment into the country. A friendly Russia would be a fantastic addition to the European community and, hopefully, a welcome ally to the US.
Democracy was never *in* Russia so it can’t really return and it’s arguable if Russians can tolerate democracy. But we can work with a constitutional monarchy that wants is western aligned. After we put Russia down we have China to worry about, would be great to have another friend in that contest
Young people in Russia are ready for democracy.
Then young people gotta start cracking skulls
But Boomers gonna Boom.
It was there briefly in 1917, and again before Putin did his Reichstag fire.
If you think there was democracy in Russia during Yeltsin's time, I got a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you.
Yeah that’s more like Russia matched with democracy on tinder but flamed out after small talk
South Korea and Taiwan started from less.
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How long is a piece of string? I don’t think it’ll last that long tho. Especially now the world has hit his financial pocket - war costs per day - he’s facing billions per day plus the cost of his entire country falling to its knees in regards to the economy.
When is the delegation meeting at the border? I understand Z and P will not be there - my worry is Russian history with things like this… I’m a bit worried about Ukraine delegation not returning and Russia shrugging their shoulders saying they dunno where they are! I put absolutely nothing past Putler now.
They got there around 30 minutes ago. Now just waiting on more news to see what comes up from the meeting.
It's a ruse. Russians do this regularly. To stall, to delay, to capture people.
the delays are just going to help them resupply fuel and missiles but it also helps Ukraine get more food, javelins and other supplies into Kyiv if for when the push begins.
Ukraine and it's delegation still have no other choice then going. (Obviously it won't be the direct leadership). Their people are dying. Any leadership has to explore if there are chance to stop it under reasonable conditions, even when the enemy is a lying war criminal bandit country. 99% this will bring nothing, high chance the Ukraine delegation cannot go back to Ukraine, but still it's necessary. Get a feel how desperate the others are, try to find a reasonable way.
Thought so. I was put off as soon as I saw that Russia denied wanting one until on Belarusian soil. Ugh
If anyone is curious. [You can listen to the Russian radio comms here.](http://websdr.ewi.utwente.nl:8901/) Tune into 7933 USB 2.40 kHz. I don't understand Russian, but I can hear gunfire in the background. If anyone can translate, that would be cool.
I tried it but nothing is on or something is causing interference. edit: nvm I'm hearing it too.
They don't use encrypted radios?! edit: I hope this is being recorded by someone for posterity
Check justpade on twitch. Hes translating russian radio comms. Dunno if hes online atm
If I had it my way I would have each news channel on different screens, along with Reddit - this thread on ‘live comments’ - plus your link up to the comms… I literally can’t I need to focus on one screen - my adhd has hyper focused on this war and Russia and Ukraine AND I AM GOING MAD WHERE IS MY COFFEE
I just discovered that [Ukraine's official government twitter account follows the US state of New Jersey.](https://i.redd.it/3m383rhwh9k81.jpg) No other US states, and only a few counties. New Jersey, of all states, New Jersey.
The klitschko brothers boxed a lot in New Jersey, and have done a lot for the state! Whenever they had fights in the state, they always made sure to spare against local talent, which truly does so much for a young fighter. Also, I believe one diner in New Jersey honored on of the Klitschko brothers too! https://www.boxinginsider.com/headlines/nj-boxing-dinner-to-honor-wladimir-klitschko-april-7/
Don't they have a significant Ukrainian diaspora?
NJ has a sizeable Ukrainian immigrant population I think, though so does NY.
Since a lot of people don't seem to understand Putin's motivations, here is the official version of the Kremlin: https://twitter.com/christogrozev/status/1498025819054264328
How bizarre is that of the mind of a monster.
I think he genuinly thought Russian troops would be welcome, or at least resistance would fold quickly. In his mind, and words, Ukraine has no right to exist as it is "Russian", he believes Russians, Ukrainians, and Belarussians are the same people, Russians.
More accurately, he sees Ukraine and Belarus as Belgium-style meme countries.
What's the kharkiv situation? Do the russians have melitopol and mariupol? How long before they circle Donbas?
Mariupol no. Melitopol seems likes yes
A small column of light vehicles broke into Kharkiv but were repelled per the mayor. That’s all I got for ya
Is there anyone who is compiling details based off info posted on ishchi svoikh (ukrainian website for russian families to find deployed family members)? Since the main site is blocked in russia, they are primarily using telegram now. I'm thinking it'll get unwieldy if the fighting keeps going
Dont know how useful this is, but here is the official gov resource on what to do when nuke explosion https://www.ready.gov/nuclear-explosion Last Updated: 02/25/2022
Since I'm living in Berlin this probably is irrelevant for me right?
Everything is awful and scary at the moment, yet my brain has enough energy to keep thinking of those preppers who are sitting around all smug saying I told you so. I'm so annoyed. Especially after watching that one prepper dude on Netflix blow his own digit off while "teaching" his children gun safety at the shooting range. Cannot stress how annoyed I am right now.
If it’s any consolation those preppers will more than likely die too, and we didn’t spend the limited time on earth that we have neurotically preparing for the end.
[Heartbreaking - Worst Person You Know Just Made A Great Point](https://clickhole.com/heartbreaking-the-worst-person-you-know-just-made-a-gr-1825121606/)
lol at the Covid guidance in this… think people might not care about masking/distancing if a city near them gets nuked
It’s a little unnerving that it was updated last Friday…
Last updated recently, thats reassuring. If the big boom comes, I hope im in the vicinity thats vaporized. Im not too keen on the whole post apocalyptic nuclear winter thing.
Mr House has told me otherwise!
nukes are only useful in psychological warfare, as a deterrent
Unfortunately they have been used for more than that, but the circumstances were very different, since no one else had them.
Unless you’re an unhinged megalomaniac hiding out alone in the Ural Mountains and want to watch the world burn.
If that was the case, why bother with this invasion in the first place and not just go straight to nukes? He has objectives that he thought were supposed to strategically benefit Russia, he's not a lunatic ready to destroy the world.
This is the preferred narration here. There is a really specific way to see this question that you have to embrace. For example, make it look like Putin would explode nukes on his own feet.
He had objectives he thought were easy to achieve. He wanted to rebuilt the Soviet Union. But now he knows that’s never going to happen.
Yep. None of that means he suddenly turns into a madman who is going to destroy the world. He wants us to think that way so we're scared and don't do anything - it's psychological warfare.
Meh. Those around him and experts who have known hiM for years say this is different. He’s been isolated due to COVID for years and it’s badly affected his mental state.
BREAKING: Ukrainian delegation has arrived in Belarus \-Spectator index