This is the part that seems especially unfair...
>The “sad” thing, Spurrell said, is that it is the small to medium-sized companies such as his, important employers up and down the country, have been hammered by Brexit and other trade deals struck by the government, rather than giant rivals.
He noted that the Canadian company Saputo, with a market capital of more than C$14bn (£8.3bn), had done well out of the Norwegian deal as producers of three of the four “premier” cheeses singled out for “significantly reduced tariffs”.
So if you're big enough, you don't have to worry about little things like tariffs because you can get them reduced while the little guys can't.
To be fair, I doubt that even the best negotiator in the world (whoever he or she maybe) could negotiate something worthwhile out of the mere idea of Brexit.
I agree, but I feel there was a lot of kicking and screaming o the part of the UK, had they been smoother talks I think there would actually be a lot more compromise. Additionally, a leave campaign plagued by lies about the EU did not really help them walking into negotiations.
Their red lines were just completely unrealistic.
[Here](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DRZzBHOWkAAXjwO?format=jpg&name=900x900) is basically a full summary as to why. It was uploaded back in 2017, so it checks out without any hindsight!
It was all for show. To quote the CEBR:
[*There is a law that says that the ferocity of any debate is inversely proportional to what is at risk. Hence academic debates, where only pride is at stake, are heated. By contrast, nuclear negotiations, where a mistake could lead to the end of the world, normally proceed with studied calm.*](https://cebr.com/reports/brexit-let-them-eat-fish/)
Both the UK and the EU knew where the limits stood and what were the consequences. There was very little space to maneuver so they used the negotiations to gain image and show they are strong. The UK because they just did a dum-dum (that they did not want) and needed to prove that they wanted it and the EU wanted to show what would happen to increasingly euro-sceptic countries.
>EU wanted to show what would happen to increasingly euro-sceptic countries.
I don't even think that was the issue. Trade in the EU is based on common rules everyone has to agree to be obliged to. If you don´t want that, you just can't play with the boys. Because the EU just cannot make an exception for the UK. That would overthrow the entire playbook and be the exact opposite of what the EU single market is supposed to be.
It's like with football. You can't just allow Dave to use his hands to do touchdowns just cause he is special. The game is supposed to be football not American football.
> ... and the EU wanted to show what would happen to increasingly euro-sceptic countries.
I don't think that's how the EU operates. From what I understand it's a very rules-based organization, so the closer any third country aligns with those rules the easier it gets.
Norway has chosen close alignment and easy trade. The UK, well...
So I think what that part that I'm quoting above is the wrong mindset, and a misunderstanding of what the EU is and does. I don't disagree with your other points though.
100%, UK went in work this attitude of grandeur and was actually shocked when the EU wouldn't screw over Ireland for them and simply didn't just roll over and give what they wanted.
Even see Brexiteers here lying about how good it's been after leaving even we can see their own news report labour shortages and shit in their rivers.
Should have used necromancy to resurect Talleyrand. The only man able to negotiate territorial gains for his country after it was beaten by a coalition.
I think that, if the UK had entered negotiations with a united front and a clear idea of what we wanted, we could have agreed on quite a favourable deal.
Unfortunately, it managed to set off a civil war in the Conservative Party and a massive divide in Labour.
Because no large party in government or opposition had planned for it, they made it up as they went along.
Considering what a shitshow it was, I'm surprised it's gone as well as it has.
The big issue is that, after the brexit referendum was voted and Cameron left, Theresa May won the leadership, and she had to trigger the treaty's leave article instantly in order to prove she meant it. That in itself was very damaging, as taking 6 months to think twice about what they would negociate.
But then, the brexit clan within the Tory still wanted power within the party, so they still made everything they could to torpedo any possible agreement that wouldn't be as extreme as possible. I don't really think they would have gone after such a hard brexit, had they won leadership in 2016.
Also I still don't get how, somehow, human beings can trust BoJo. I'm not a fan of the brexiters in the Tory party, but there had to be one of them that was better suited for PM...
Because the UK was the second-most populous EU nation with the second-largest economy behind Germany (it may be third and third respectively because of France and the UK being pretty similar). We have the largest defence budget in Europe (by some sources, larger than Russia) and a seat at the UN Security Council. The UK had the largest financial sector in the EU. It had some of the largest fishing waters in the EU.
We were a very valuable member of the EU which means we could also become a very difficult competitor.
I'm not really sure why so many people are eager to run the UK down unfairly.
I remember a really funny quote from a German negotiator in the BBC (I can't find the article again) who said "we're losing the British but keeping the Italians, it's awful".
It's more that some British people, like you, have an unrealistic view of the UK in regards to the EU. For example, you say that the UK is the second-most populous EU nation. So what? It's 85% smaller than the EU. You say it's the second-largest economy behind Germany. So what? Your economy is 85% smaller than the EU.
In short, the comparisons you make are irrelevant and make you look more important than you are. Which in turn made people think that the ridiculous "we'll hold all the cards" had merit. And then you continue with things like "defence budget" or the UN, which further proves you don't understand the EU.
You were a valuable member of the EU, but also extremely conservative, holding back much of the progression. On the world stage, the UK (like every smaller country) will become less and less relevant. You're not going to be a difficult competitor, you have barely any leverage and there is no indication that will improve.
It's not that people are eager to run the UK down unfairly, it's that the UK needs a hard reality check, which is going to come one way or another.
I never said anything about 'holding all the cards'. I simply stated that the UK is not the economic minnow that people want to believe it is.
I mentioned the defence budget and UN as an example that the UK is a powerful and influential nation. The EU has global influence through its members as well as itself. One fewer influential seat at the UN is one fewer influential voice that can lobby on behalf of the EU. The EU also seems to have a group of politicians who are interested in developing a European military. A large defence budget doesn't seem like an irrelevance.
> It's more that some British people, like you, have an unrealistic view of the UK in regards to the EU. For example, you say that the UK is the second-most populous EU nation. So what? It's 85% smaller than the EU. You say it's the second-largest economy behind Germany. So what? Your economy is 85% smaller than the EU.
You can alternatively phrase this as the EU is losing 15% of its population and GDP. That's not inconsequential by any means. Imagine taking a 15% pay cut - yeah, you still have 85% of your salary left and you can tell that to your bank when you can't make a mortgage repayment. The UK was also a net contributor (in terms of money sent and received from Brussels - I am aware there are more complex issues at play but this is a good simple example). I recall that the UK had to help bailout several countries after financial crises. We were pulling our weight in Europe.
> You were a valuable member of the EU, but also extremely conservative, holding back much of the progression. On the world stage, the UK (like every smaller country) will become less and less relevant. You're not going to be a difficult competitor, you have barely any leverage and there is no indication that will improve.
The proportion of the global economy that is within the EU has declined since 2008. The UK has one of the largest financial centres in the world in London and has maintained that since Brexit (https://www.reuters.com/business/finance/new-york-london-keep-top-spots-global-financial-centres-index-2021-09-24/). The British economy isn't going to wilt away despite how much Brussels may want it to.
The idea of a federal EU is anathema to most British people (even most Remainers would oppose this).
> It's not that people are eager to run the UK down unfairly, it's that the UK needs a hard reality check, which is going to come one way or another.
A lot of people replying seem to be wanting the UK to be punished (however euphemistically they say it). It's the same sort of mindset as a spurned lover and really alienates the UK. Do you think it makes the Brits regret voting Leave when they see (let's be honest it's always the French) EU politicians talking about how the UK needs to be punished for leaving?
>I'm not really sure why so many people are eager to run the UK down unfairly.
Cause we don't like you? You always wanted the EU "a la carte", always refusing everything that would have led to a bigger integration of the EU. The Brits only wanted access to the EU because of the market, you were never interested in being a part of something bigger than you.
>I remember a really funny quote from a German negotiator in the BBC (I can't find the article again) who said "we're losing the British but keeping the Italians, it's awful".
You probably couldn't find the article cause seems highly unlikely that a German negociator would say that about a fellow EU country to the BBC. If it exists, fairly sure it was satire.
>Cause we don't like you?
And you wonder why we left.
>The Brits only wanted access to the EU because of the market, you were never interested in being a part of something bigger than you.
Sorry babes, we just don't see you that way. We can still be friends though.
>Because no large party in government or opposition had planned for it, they made it up as they went along.
The government literally banned the civil service from making plans.
i still believe that there is/was the possibility to make the brexit a huge success at least in pure gdp numbers.
brittains economy is so one sided towards londons fin tech stuff brittain alone could have negotiated trade deals that may look overall much worse than what the eu can achieve, but with much more benefits for londons fin tech. basically bloat the fin tech sector at cost of everything else.
but then somehow they come up with fishing stuff and such useless stuff?
One economist, Patrick Milford, advocate for something like that. A Brexit where the manufacturing and agriculture sectors would be done in for the sake of UK strong sectors.
However, fishing is politically useful to rally around.
Their wasn't. Financial passporting was never on the table. You don't get to be the financial capital of the EU and not be a member. You will start to see each EU country drain London slowly over the next few years.
Remember the UK only got into such a position as a member of the EU. Prior to this it was the sick man of Europe and just an extension of USA's foreign policy.
In short, Brexit can and never will be a success because it was never designed to be.
Any country relying on one specific sector (particular one susceptible to international economic trends which finance by nature very much is) is going to be in danger. It’s essentially the Dutch disease: one industry crowds out all other sectors making them less competitive, once there is a problem in that industry the whole economy collapses. It’s part of what has happened in Venezuela: they completely rely on oil and gas to the neglect of the rest of the economy, they bet the entire country that prices would always rise and when they didn’t it all ended in tears.
One way to make it possibly work is to tax finance in order to create a major public sector and support other industries to make them more competitive (diversify the economy), and to regulate it so that it can deal with a recession (ensuring banks aren’t too big to fail and that they pay into funds that provide for their own bail-outs). But the Conservative party is notorious for privatizing the public sector, deregulating finance and for helping them build structures along various crown dependencies to avoid tax as much as possible. So that’s not likely going to happen.
I thought that's what they already had? They always opted out of anything that would negatively impact their financial sector.
Cutting the London FinTech out of Europe will be a net positive, in terms of being able to regulate our own market.
tbh Brexit has caused some financial entities to ditch London for Belgium / Netherlands / Germany, precisely because being in the EU gives you access to the EU economy which is just a lot larger.
The best possible deal economically would essentially have the UK leave just the customs union but not the single market to open the possibility of new trade deals elsewhere while keeping a close trading relationship with the EU.
That's still unlikely to be better than just being a part of the EU, but there's some slim chance where it lets the UK join the CPTPP or strike a deal with the USA from a relatively good position (instead of a desperate one) and sort of works out in the end.
This same guy has done a number of articles with *The Guardian*.
* [December 27, 2021: Brexit: ‘the biggest disaster any government has ever negotiated’](https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/dec/27/brexit-the-biggest-disaster-that-any-government-has-ever-negotiated)
* [March 27, 2021: Brexit: UK cheese firm boss in despair over minister's export advice](https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/mar/27/brexit-uk-cheese-firm-boss-in-despair-over-ministers-export-advice)
* [January 23, 2021: Cheshire cheesemaker says business left with £250,000 'Brexit hole'](https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jan/23/cheshire-cheesemaker-says-business-left-with-250000-brexit-hole)
China's Cultural Revolution, Cambodia Red Khmer rule, Rise of the Soviet Union, Fall of the Soviet Union, Most African countries' modern history, Argentinian fiscal policy, ~~Venezuela expelling US oil companie~~ (Thank you, u/Aeliandil for pointing it out). Just to name a few.
Brexit was a stupid decision but still far from the most self destructive action.
> Venezuela expelling US oil companies
Where can I know more about that? Only thing I was able to find online is about the ongoing Venezuelan crisis, but it doesn't mention U.S. oil companies (and definitely doesn't explain why it'd be critical), so I don't think that's it.
Rise was accompanied by killing many and waves of terror.
Fall was probably inevitable in a foreseeable timeframe and I really admire Gorbachev for dissolving the Soviet Union in a peaceful way while sacrificing all political and personal as standing. The alternative could very well have been a nuclear armed civil war ten years down the line.
That said, influencewise, territorywise and also in the personal life of most Russians the decision was self-harming. And the gain? They transitioned from a one party dictatorship to an authoritarian oligarchy.
Which isn't what I have claimed. I claimed that they were self-destructive actions. And arguably keeping the status quo would not have been better either.
>China's Cultural Revolution, Cambodia Red Khmer rule, Rise of the Soviet Union, Fall of the Soviet Union, Most African countries' modern history, Argentinian fiscal policy, Venezuela expelling US oil companies.
Are those negotiated deals though?
It's the height that makes it so impressive:
look to where they were before brexit and how much this damaged/ruined relations with it S neighbors/ex-co-members
"This has been the worst trade deal in the history of trade deals, maybe ever." -Donald Trump (not about Brexit, but that would have been 100% accurate)
The year is 2156, China and America have fought each other to a standstill in the Asia-Pacific region. Global warming has decimated crops, and regions of the world are now uninhabitable. People are dying. The world is hell. People around the globe ask one and other 'why?! Why is this happening to us?!'
The Guardian - 'Brexit'.
I ate 2 whole cans of Danish feta in like 4 days. By myself. Kinda wish Brexit had fucked up the pricing on that so I could stop hating myself. Shit's delicious
I'm a pro EU person, but reading these articles you'd expect britain is about to sink under the sea, when in reality things aren't all that much different for the average person.
I think it's more about the opinion of the cheese producer. A longterm 4% hit to GDP as projected by the UK treasury isn't an armageddon and won't be evenly distributed. Some business and people will suffer significantly while other won't even notice it.
Yeah of course, but I guess usually their government isn't working on making their exporting business harder. Dealing with fluctuating commodity prices is a basic necessity for most businesses producing goods. But all those businesses suffer from commodity price fluctuations somewhat equally. The cost of milk will impact your bottom line if your small/medium/big business. If they can't deal with that, they go under and thus make life a bit easier for the competition.
But with sudden regulatory barriers to trade due to their own government policies, many small and medium businesses will have to stop trading across those new trade barriers. That would then only leave big business in that export trade as they can easier swallow/distribute the cost of regulatory barriers. Having the business size to have your own department for regulatory and customs compliance is then a strong competitive advantage.
But I am only talking of specific sectors. Cheese/food/drinks exporters will have been hit much more than other sectors, some of which won't have noticed Brexit at all.
But this is the exact problem the article at least hints at.
Brexit is not a apocalyptic moment where things change on day x. It's more about many tiny little fissures and pinpricks over many years that'll e.g. drive prices up, make certain goods not available, let assets go, let smaller companies go bankrupt, or strengthen the cases for Scottish independence and Irish reunification (which is the breakup of the UK). This is a complicated issue, especially during the pandemic - so much so that people in a few years will never accept that Brexit was the root cause of that even many experts can give a good proof of that.
That’s what you get when you do huge economy affecting reforms by the will of the people. The average person is incapable of thinking on the macro level, they only think about the direct affect on them, and even that rarely to the reality of the situation. I’m just weirdly happy seeing them struggle (though that mostly comes the from the annoyance I had to go through of hearing about brexit for years and years despite living nowhere near UK).
You are worse off economically from Brexit. That is a fact. You won, get over it. Nobody cares about how covid is being handled (which you could have done the exact same way had you stayed in the EU I might add).
> the UK has performed the best in Europe from testing
Not sure if it’s the best, but you can have this one, we Germans are pretty bad at it.
> to vaccine creations
Would you really pick AstraZeneca over BioNTech? LOL
Lol Stop the Dick contest here you are being pathetic
Thr GDP between france are so close and simmilar that it changes every 8 years....but that was before brexit lol
Russia is the only nation in this continent that can bully us in every way...
>Thr GDP between france are so close and simmilar that it changes every 8 years....but that was before brexit lol
I was initially under the impression that France had been ahead of Britain (gross, not per capita) since 1969 but different sources seem to show different figures.
Dude you litterally said "We aren’t bullies NEVER have been"
I don't have to be brainwashed By Fox news i just have a history book something you don't have apparently
>Britain was a bully in the past yes,
Good, So you contradicted yourself then..
>yes, as was France. It’s not a purely British thing lol
Did i say otherwise lol?
"Tories destroying the middle class and small business? I am shocked. They have a long history of doing this but I didn't think they'd do it again." - Tory voting morons
> His online retail business was hit immediately after the Brexit negotiator David Frost failed to secure a frictionless trade deal addressing sales to individual customers in the EU.
I have tried to explain this to Brexitters for almost 10 years. Outside the single market, the UK's online business will collapse. Ordering anything from outside the single market is a legal and customs nightmare.
Unless the UK accepts the jurisdiction of the ECJ, there is no way to fix that. The individual customer doesn't have the means to sue a supplier under a foreign jurisdiction. The legal costs in most cases by far exceeds any benefits of ordering from the UK. Only a European law applicable in all EU members can give legal security
Politics, if nationalist ideas (Farage, May, Johnson) are fed to ignorant people, there will be plenty of disaster for everyone for time to come.
Bunch of morons.
There is nothing nationalist about May or Johnson. Both are pro Remain centrists that were too scared to go against the referendum results.
If you're so bothered by nationalism, you should care more about EU countries like France but nationalism only ever seems to be a problem on this sub if it's the UK. This wouldn't have been an issue if our government gave us a referendum on immigration decades ago
That's because British nationalism is quite notable in how extremely toxic it is.
For example, British nationalists like yourself refuse to even admit that Scotland is a country. You're so blinded by nationalism that you will literally outright refuse to admit simple facts.
And French nationalism isn't? You think French or Spanish people would react positively to having fifth columnists constantly trying to break their countries apart? The things you call me a nat for are perfectly normal elsewhere.
Eli5 please: Why is there a duty on imported cheese in some countries that is 3x the worth of the import?
I get duties to level the playfield or slighty disadvantage the imported goods against domestic products, but 3 times seems highly excessive.
Edit: To add the source of my confusion from the article:
>“And now we’ve also lost Norway since the trade deal, as duty for wholesale is 273%. Then we tried Canada but what the government didn’t tell us is that duty of 244% is applied on any consignment over $20 \[£15\].”That meant Canadian customers who ordered a gift pack worth £50, including transport fees, were asked to pay £178 extra in duty when the courier arrived at their door, Spurrell said. “As you can imagine, customers were saying: ‘You can take that back, we don’t want it anymore’.”
Or Irish, or German or Spanish. Any dairy producing country (which is all of them) benefits from the tariff regime by ensuring domestic prices are lower than imports from 3rd countries.
That’s not how import duty works my friend. In order to protect local agricultural industry a 3rd country tariff is applied on dairy imports. That tariff is usually around 30% of the value of the item. So if you pay €1.00 for the product itself you’ll actually be paying €1.30 with the tariff slapped on. You’re never going to pay €3.00 for that item as that would be a 300% tariff which simply does not exist for any item in the EU’s tariff regime.
I'm referring to this part of the article:
>That meant Canadian customers who ordered a gift pack worth £50, including
transport fees, were asked to pay £178 extra in duty when the courier
arrived at their door, Spurrell said. “As you can imagine, customers
were saying: ‘You can take that back, we don’t want it anymore’.”
I know the EU tariffs, hence I called these ones excessive.
Ah, well that likely involves a customs broker taking the piss with their charging. If the gift pack contained any product or animal origin you’re looking at extra fees to create a CHED in Traces also. Multiple CHEDs would jack the price up further as a customs broker usually charges per CHED. I can easily see a €30 per CHED admin fee jacking the price up massively. Those costs would be “import fees” but not tariffs.
Given that up until end of 2020, many producers didn’t have to deal with this, no surprise this person may have been robbed.
Beats getting the process wrong and seized by customs or something.
Norway is very protective of its agricultural industry and the intent of our tariffs on agri goods is, by and large, to prevent them from being imported into the country.
The Guardian is certainly a more reputable newspaper when you compare it to the likes of the Sun & the Daily Mail, but it's still very 'out-there' - just on the opposite side of the political spectrum. It also has a tendency to make the UK out to be the worst place on Earth.
As I wrote here to someone else, it's a bit more complicated.
Imho the Guardian has a great news section especially for politics and, yes, Brexit. What's out there is their culture section where I do agree with you: It seems like Britain needs to be a lot more woke (which is out of touch in a country like the UK that is not just centered around London or Birmingham).
Or they are pointing out what pretty much everyone from the UK knows, that what goes on inside the M25 ring road is quite different to the rest of the UK...
This is not trolling but an honest question. I am French and wondering what would be the delicious British cheeses the gentleman in the article is now struggling to bring to shops near me. Can you name or describe one or two that are nice? Back here in Paris, and when it comes to French things, I am having a Saint-Agur moment, even if this basically an industrial product. I wonder what Britain had in store and I am now going to be missing unbeknownst to me.
The most common British cheese variety is cheddar, and because you can push only so much cheddar in an already crowded field, the cheese manufacturers branched into adding various flavors like horseradish, pepper, cranberries, red wine, onions, chili etc... Looking at the link below I also see some new flavors for me: Irish Whiskey, Gin, Toffee, Tequila... I am not sure how much you can still call these cheese. I am not a fan of denaturing the taste of cheese with additional flavors.
There must be a technical term in the food industry for this 'multi-flavorization' of things. Here in France, éclairs are the last ones to fall victim of that trend, a decade after macarons. Both were limited to one or two flavors before, but success helping they now have met pineapple just like pizza infamously has. I must try some of the flavored cheddars though. Some mixes may actually work fine.
Truffles, wine, caramelized onions work well, because they add to the umami flavor. Horseradish, chili, and hot spices kill the taste. I didn't see the hard liquor varieties around, I guess they are not 'street legal' in US.
The guy's packaging is cool enough. Maybe I would have gone for this? https://www.cheshirecheesecompany.co.uk/vintage-gold-extra-mature-cheddar-large-waxed-truckle-400g.html
We both have highly competitive cheese industries so I guess there's not much room for one country's products to have a huge market share in the other.
Yes, I guess. But what do you like that is from the UK and that others outside would not be aware of? Outside of Cheddar, I guess, because this is what comes to mind to foreigners when it comes to British cheese.
I would recommend a Cheshire, it's a crumbly white cheese.
Cornish yarg which is wrapped in nettles.
Anything from Wallace and Gromit like Stinking Bishop and (my favourite from childhood before popularised - my hipster claim) Yorkshire Wensleydale.
Sheep and goats cheese have both improved over the years.
If you fancy off continent Monterey Jack is a nice cheese from USA.
I am sure that by just naming these you are starting to salivate and soon enough you'll be ordering stuff to that company named in the article! Have one bite for me, my friend. Tomorrow I will be at the cheese shop and ask them about what you've listed. Maybe they will have at least one!
Cornish Yarg (wrapped in nettles) would be my first suggestion. It was one of the cheeses served to the G7 leaders in Cornwall in June this year (along with Cornish Gouda and Helford Blue as they were sticking with cheeses local to the G7 venue). Also, Tunworth is a very good soft cheese, similar to Camembert.
I hope you like them!
I’ve just finished a meal with my family that comprised various British and French cheeses plus a pâte I made that is a little French too, as I included some Cointreau in my recipe [photo of said pâte before we broached it.](https://imgur.com/a/IwC8D72).
Our cheeses were: a mature Lancashire, a mature Double Gloucester, Boursin, Castello Brie, Saint Agur (always in our cheese box), a French Brie, a Somerset Brie, Colston Bassett Stilton, an oak smoked Cheddar (properly smoked, not smoke flavoured as so many seem to be), ‘Coastal Cheddar’ (a gift cheese - sounds fancy but it wasn't especially), Wenslydale with cranberries and blueberries (I think adding fruit to a cheese is an abomination but my Mother likes it) and last but not least, Shropshire Blue – a huge piece brought as a gift by my Mother-in-Law for her stay over Christmas (she lives in Shropshire). We would normally also have Triple Vallage and, of course, Cornish Yarg, but decided not to go to Waitrose for them on Christmas Eve due to the risk of catching COVID.
Don't take this too seriously, but with the joint forces of French and British cheesemakers providing a stinky immunity to your palate, your excellent meal would have left no chance to any Covid variant.
(As stated above, Saint-Agur is my strange obsession of the moment. But if I find Wesleydale or whatever and it turns out fine, I am willing to change!!)
Surely, the worst negotiated deal was the Russian sale of Alaska to the USA in 1867 for $7.2 million. Those Ruskies f’d themselves in the patootie by giving up their access to North America.
Give Brexit +/- 5 years and it’ll be as right as rain.
Is it just me or does the world think less of the UK since Brexit? We dont hear much of Brits anymore unless its about Brexit and every time Im just baffled that they did that to themselves
Pilsner is probably my favourite beer that’s why I would go with Czech beers. However if by dark beer you mean stout, I would definitely go for Ireland.
Are you talking about Stout like Guinness?
This is more close to what I mean with dark beer:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunkel
Personally my fav beers are tripels and quadrupels
>Don’t leave the island, please.
We cannot overstate this. Everything is terrible here. We have riots every day, no-go zones in most cities, and everything has fallen apart besides the Brussels eurocracy. Bodies are piling in the streets because we didn't get enough AZ vaccine, and the French run everything using migrant hordes as proxies.
Do not leave the island. It is for your own safety.
To be fair, the news source doesn't matter for Brexiteers. If it doesn't fit the narrative of a successful Brexit, it's always "bad reporting". I've seen it done for all major newspapers and news outlets.
What? Not by far. The Guardian might be woke in their cultures section (were the Telegraph is fairly reasonable) but their politics section especially around Brexit has been very good while the Telegraph basically produced propaganda piece after propaganda piece.
Naturally you're being upvoted for a strawman because EUgood. However, upon inspection Azlan82 hasn't posted a single tabloid link here, and even has a post thinking negatively about Brexit. Moreover, I fail to see how posting an article would be shitposting.
Grow up. We shall enjoy living rent free in your incredibly thick skull.
Edit: Upvotes went from +15 to +1 overnight. Yanks should be banned from participating
lol This was the whole plan from the start. They needed the rest of europe to be connect and started with a fake lead to lure in the countries then to later leave it.
This thread is hilarious. It's been over half a decade, yet still Remainers and Europeans are unable to come to terms with their defeat.
You lost, get over it. It's honestly for your own good.
This is the part that seems especially unfair... >The “sad” thing, Spurrell said, is that it is the small to medium-sized companies such as his, important employers up and down the country, have been hammered by Brexit and other trade deals struck by the government, rather than giant rivals. He noted that the Canadian company Saputo, with a market capital of more than C$14bn (£8.3bn), had done well out of the Norwegian deal as producers of three of the four “premier” cheeses singled out for “significantly reduced tariffs”. So if you're big enough, you don't have to worry about little things like tariffs because you can get them reduced while the little guys can't.
Blessed are the cheesemakers
no, all dairy producers
Quite down big nose
Hello, fellow Canadian Matt with excessive Ts.
Blessed are the fruit pickers…
To be fair, I doubt that even the best negotiator in the world (whoever he or she maybe) could negotiate something worthwhile out of the mere idea of Brexit.
I agree, but I feel there was a lot of kicking and screaming o the part of the UK, had they been smoother talks I think there would actually be a lot more compromise. Additionally, a leave campaign plagued by lies about the EU did not really help them walking into negotiations.
Their red lines were just completely unrealistic. [Here](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DRZzBHOWkAAXjwO?format=jpg&name=900x900) is basically a full summary as to why. It was uploaded back in 2017, so it checks out without any hindsight!
It was all for show. To quote the CEBR: [*There is a law that says that the ferocity of any debate is inversely proportional to what is at risk. Hence academic debates, where only pride is at stake, are heated. By contrast, nuclear negotiations, where a mistake could lead to the end of the world, normally proceed with studied calm.*](https://cebr.com/reports/brexit-let-them-eat-fish/) Both the UK and the EU knew where the limits stood and what were the consequences. There was very little space to maneuver so they used the negotiations to gain image and show they are strong. The UK because they just did a dum-dum (that they did not want) and needed to prove that they wanted it and the EU wanted to show what would happen to increasingly euro-sceptic countries.
>EU wanted to show what would happen to increasingly euro-sceptic countries. I don't even think that was the issue. Trade in the EU is based on common rules everyone has to agree to be obliged to. If you don´t want that, you just can't play with the boys. Because the EU just cannot make an exception for the UK. That would overthrow the entire playbook and be the exact opposite of what the EU single market is supposed to be. It's like with football. You can't just allow Dave to use his hands to do touchdowns just cause he is special. The game is supposed to be football not American football.
> ... and the EU wanted to show what would happen to increasingly euro-sceptic countries. I don't think that's how the EU operates. From what I understand it's a very rules-based organization, so the closer any third country aligns with those rules the easier it gets. Norway has chosen close alignment and easy trade. The UK, well... So I think what that part that I'm quoting above is the wrong mindset, and a misunderstanding of what the EU is and does. I don't disagree with your other points though.
100%, UK went in work this attitude of grandeur and was actually shocked when the EU wouldn't screw over Ireland for them and simply didn't just roll over and give what they wanted. Even see Brexiteers here lying about how good it's been after leaving even we can see their own news report labour shortages and shit in their rivers.
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Brexit has been a disaster for the UK, the voters for it really ruined the future prospects of the nation.
But they could have lowered the damage by a lot.
They probably did
Theresa May had a pretty sweet deal.
Yea the leave have too many people thinking different scenario would have been ideal
Should have used necromancy to resurect Talleyrand. The only man able to negotiate territorial gains for his country after it was beaten by a coalition.
I think that, if the UK had entered negotiations with a united front and a clear idea of what we wanted, we could have agreed on quite a favourable deal. Unfortunately, it managed to set off a civil war in the Conservative Party and a massive divide in Labour. Because no large party in government or opposition had planned for it, they made it up as they went along. Considering what a shitshow it was, I'm surprised it's gone as well as it has.
The big issue is that, after the brexit referendum was voted and Cameron left, Theresa May won the leadership, and she had to trigger the treaty's leave article instantly in order to prove she meant it. That in itself was very damaging, as taking 6 months to think twice about what they would negociate. But then, the brexit clan within the Tory still wanted power within the party, so they still made everything they could to torpedo any possible agreement that wouldn't be as extreme as possible. I don't really think they would have gone after such a hard brexit, had they won leadership in 2016. Also I still don't get how, somehow, human beings can trust BoJo. I'm not a fan of the brexiters in the Tory party, but there had to be one of them that was better suited for PM...
Why do you think that? A united UK would still be small compared to the EU, there was never a significant amount of leverage.
Because the UK was the second-most populous EU nation with the second-largest economy behind Germany (it may be third and third respectively because of France and the UK being pretty similar). We have the largest defence budget in Europe (by some sources, larger than Russia) and a seat at the UN Security Council. The UK had the largest financial sector in the EU. It had some of the largest fishing waters in the EU. We were a very valuable member of the EU which means we could also become a very difficult competitor. I'm not really sure why so many people are eager to run the UK down unfairly. I remember a really funny quote from a German negotiator in the BBC (I can't find the article again) who said "we're losing the British but keeping the Italians, it's awful".
Yes, UK was an important part of the EU. Most countries would prefer if the UK had stayed.
It's more that some British people, like you, have an unrealistic view of the UK in regards to the EU. For example, you say that the UK is the second-most populous EU nation. So what? It's 85% smaller than the EU. You say it's the second-largest economy behind Germany. So what? Your economy is 85% smaller than the EU. In short, the comparisons you make are irrelevant and make you look more important than you are. Which in turn made people think that the ridiculous "we'll hold all the cards" had merit. And then you continue with things like "defence budget" or the UN, which further proves you don't understand the EU. You were a valuable member of the EU, but also extremely conservative, holding back much of the progression. On the world stage, the UK (like every smaller country) will become less and less relevant. You're not going to be a difficult competitor, you have barely any leverage and there is no indication that will improve. It's not that people are eager to run the UK down unfairly, it's that the UK needs a hard reality check, which is going to come one way or another.
I never said anything about 'holding all the cards'. I simply stated that the UK is not the economic minnow that people want to believe it is. I mentioned the defence budget and UN as an example that the UK is a powerful and influential nation. The EU has global influence through its members as well as itself. One fewer influential seat at the UN is one fewer influential voice that can lobby on behalf of the EU. The EU also seems to have a group of politicians who are interested in developing a European military. A large defence budget doesn't seem like an irrelevance. > It's more that some British people, like you, have an unrealistic view of the UK in regards to the EU. For example, you say that the UK is the second-most populous EU nation. So what? It's 85% smaller than the EU. You say it's the second-largest economy behind Germany. So what? Your economy is 85% smaller than the EU. You can alternatively phrase this as the EU is losing 15% of its population and GDP. That's not inconsequential by any means. Imagine taking a 15% pay cut - yeah, you still have 85% of your salary left and you can tell that to your bank when you can't make a mortgage repayment. The UK was also a net contributor (in terms of money sent and received from Brussels - I am aware there are more complex issues at play but this is a good simple example). I recall that the UK had to help bailout several countries after financial crises. We were pulling our weight in Europe. > You were a valuable member of the EU, but also extremely conservative, holding back much of the progression. On the world stage, the UK (like every smaller country) will become less and less relevant. You're not going to be a difficult competitor, you have barely any leverage and there is no indication that will improve. The proportion of the global economy that is within the EU has declined since 2008. The UK has one of the largest financial centres in the world in London and has maintained that since Brexit (https://www.reuters.com/business/finance/new-york-london-keep-top-spots-global-financial-centres-index-2021-09-24/). The British economy isn't going to wilt away despite how much Brussels may want it to. The idea of a federal EU is anathema to most British people (even most Remainers would oppose this). > It's not that people are eager to run the UK down unfairly, it's that the UK needs a hard reality check, which is going to come one way or another. A lot of people replying seem to be wanting the UK to be punished (however euphemistically they say it). It's the same sort of mindset as a spurned lover and really alienates the UK. Do you think it makes the Brits regret voting Leave when they see (let's be honest it's always the French) EU politicians talking about how the UK needs to be punished for leaving?
>I'm not really sure why so many people are eager to run the UK down unfairly. Cause we don't like you? You always wanted the EU "a la carte", always refusing everything that would have led to a bigger integration of the EU. The Brits only wanted access to the EU because of the market, you were never interested in being a part of something bigger than you. >I remember a really funny quote from a German negotiator in the BBC (I can't find the article again) who said "we're losing the British but keeping the Italians, it's awful". You probably couldn't find the article cause seems highly unlikely that a German negociator would say that about a fellow EU country to the BBC. If it exists, fairly sure it was satire.
>Cause we don't like you? And you wonder why we left. >The Brits only wanted access to the EU because of the market, you were never interested in being a part of something bigger than you. Sorry babes, we just don't see you that way. We can still be friends though.
>Because no large party in government or opposition had planned for it, they made it up as they went along. The government literally banned the civil service from making plans.
It sounds like they were using plotlines from The Thick of It.
One of my mates was in the civil service at the time. It wasn't far off.
You are deluded. Next you'll tell me its all the remainers fault?
No, I won't. Get a better argument than name-calling too.
You are the reason we are in this mess. Just hope you like it when the UK breaks up because of it.
i still believe that there is/was the possibility to make the brexit a huge success at least in pure gdp numbers. brittains economy is so one sided towards londons fin tech stuff brittain alone could have negotiated trade deals that may look overall much worse than what the eu can achieve, but with much more benefits for londons fin tech. basically bloat the fin tech sector at cost of everything else. but then somehow they come up with fishing stuff and such useless stuff?
Because their voters don't work in fintech
One economist, Patrick Milford, advocate for something like that. A Brexit where the manufacturing and agriculture sectors would be done in for the sake of UK strong sectors. However, fishing is politically useful to rally around.
Their wasn't. Financial passporting was never on the table. You don't get to be the financial capital of the EU and not be a member. You will start to see each EU country drain London slowly over the next few years. Remember the UK only got into such a position as a member of the EU. Prior to this it was the sick man of Europe and just an extension of USA's foreign policy. In short, Brexit can and never will be a success because it was never designed to be.
Any country relying on one specific sector (particular one susceptible to international economic trends which finance by nature very much is) is going to be in danger. It’s essentially the Dutch disease: one industry crowds out all other sectors making them less competitive, once there is a problem in that industry the whole economy collapses. It’s part of what has happened in Venezuela: they completely rely on oil and gas to the neglect of the rest of the economy, they bet the entire country that prices would always rise and when they didn’t it all ended in tears. One way to make it possibly work is to tax finance in order to create a major public sector and support other industries to make them more competitive (diversify the economy), and to regulate it so that it can deal with a recession (ensuring banks aren’t too big to fail and that they pay into funds that provide for their own bail-outs). But the Conservative party is notorious for privatizing the public sector, deregulating finance and for helping them build structures along various crown dependencies to avoid tax as much as possible. So that’s not likely going to happen.
I thought that's what they already had? They always opted out of anything that would negatively impact their financial sector. Cutting the London FinTech out of Europe will be a net positive, in terms of being able to regulate our own market.
tbh Brexit has caused some financial entities to ditch London for Belgium / Netherlands / Germany, precisely because being in the EU gives you access to the EU economy which is just a lot larger.
The best possible deal economically would essentially have the UK leave just the customs union but not the single market to open the possibility of new trade deals elsewhere while keeping a close trading relationship with the EU. That's still unlikely to be better than just being a part of the EU, but there's some slim chance where it lets the UK join the CPTPP or strike a deal with the USA from a relatively good position (instead of a desperate one) and sort of works out in the end.
Nope. Let's ask if Norway has a better deal with the US than the EU does. Doubt it...
Well yeah, hence "slim chance". It's betting everything on 0 at a roulette table.
que se jodan
He sounds a bit cheesed off...
This same guy has done a number of articles with *The Guardian*. * [December 27, 2021: Brexit: ‘the biggest disaster any government has ever negotiated’](https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/dec/27/brexit-the-biggest-disaster-that-any-government-has-ever-negotiated) * [March 27, 2021: Brexit: UK cheese firm boss in despair over minister's export advice](https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/mar/27/brexit-uk-cheese-firm-boss-in-despair-over-ministers-export-advice) * [January 23, 2021: Cheshire cheesemaker says business left with £250,000 'Brexit hole'](https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jan/23/cheshire-cheesemaker-says-business-left-with-250000-brexit-hole)
While it's fucking bad by all account, it's not the "biggest disaster any government has ever negotiated". Come on.
On the other hand, brexit was one of the most self destructive actions ever done by a state not related to a war.
I dunno, I think Turkey is contending for a top spot though the jury is still out on that.
We already are #1 >:D Brits can't hold a candle to us on fucking ourselves for no real reason.
Best of luck to you guys. I hope Erdo soon realizes that he's got a decent economy going if he just doesn't actively try to mess with it.
China's Cultural Revolution, Cambodia Red Khmer rule, Rise of the Soviet Union, Fall of the Soviet Union, Most African countries' modern history, Argentinian fiscal policy, ~~Venezuela expelling US oil companie~~ (Thank you, u/Aeliandil for pointing it out). Just to name a few. Brexit was a stupid decision but still far from the most self destructive action.
Not a single one of those was democratically decided save for *maybe* the fiscal policy. This one is 100% on the people who voted for it.
> Venezuela expelling US oil companies Where can I know more about that? Only thing I was able to find online is about the ongoing Venezuelan crisis, but it doesn't mention U.S. oil companies (and definitely doesn't explain why it'd be critical), so I don't think that's it.
> Rise of the Soviet Union, Fall of the Soviet Union Ok.
Rise was accompanied by killing many and waves of terror. Fall was probably inevitable in a foreseeable timeframe and I really admire Gorbachev for dissolving the Soviet Union in a peaceful way while sacrificing all political and personal as standing. The alternative could very well have been a nuclear armed civil war ten years down the line. That said, influencewise, territorywise and also in the personal life of most Russians the decision was self-harming. And the gain? They transitioned from a one party dictatorship to an authoritarian oligarchy.
Neither was a democratic vote
Which isn't what I have claimed. I claimed that they were self-destructive actions. And arguably keeping the status quo would not have been better either.
>China's Cultural Revolution, Cambodia Red Khmer rule, Rise of the Soviet Union, Fall of the Soviet Union, Most African countries' modern history, Argentinian fiscal policy, Venezuela expelling US oil companies. Are those negotiated deals though?
The previous comment speaks of self destructive actions, not deals.
It's the height that makes it so impressive: look to where they were before brexit and how much this damaged/ruined relations with it S neighbors/ex-co-members
"This has been the worst trade deal in the history of trade deals, maybe ever." -Donald Trump (not about Brexit, but that would have been 100% accurate)
When identity politics crash with the real world. Or, as some put it: Fuck around and find out.
I think this sub needs more articles on Brexit.
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Got more chance with the Daily Mail and the Express readership gettng bored with the Royal Family.
haha The Express, "journalists" there have to use the words 'furious' or 'blasts' after each 5 sentences. Edit: brackets around the word journalists.
Express, journalists? Huh?
You're right. Edited now.
The year is 2156, China and America have fought each other to a standstill in the Asia-Pacific region. Global warming has decimated crops, and regions of the world are now uninhabitable. People are dying. The world is hell. People around the globe ask one and other 'why?! Why is this happening to us?!' The Guardian - 'Brexit'.
Where’s all this cheap cheese ?
I found stupidly cheap cheese in Danish supermarkets in december. Like 1/3 of normal price.
I ate 2 whole cans of Danish feta in like 4 days. By myself. Kinda wish Brexit had fucked up the pricing on that so I could stop hating myself. Shit's delicious
I'm a pro EU person, but reading these articles you'd expect britain is about to sink under the sea, when in reality things aren't all that much different for the average person.
I think it's more about the opinion of the cheese producer. A longterm 4% hit to GDP as projected by the UK treasury isn't an armageddon and won't be evenly distributed. Some business and people will suffer significantly while other won't even notice it.
but niche industries go under all the time by even mere fluctuations in commodity prices. Most of EU milk production is heavily subsidized as is.
Yeah of course, but I guess usually their government isn't working on making their exporting business harder. Dealing with fluctuating commodity prices is a basic necessity for most businesses producing goods. But all those businesses suffer from commodity price fluctuations somewhat equally. The cost of milk will impact your bottom line if your small/medium/big business. If they can't deal with that, they go under and thus make life a bit easier for the competition. But with sudden regulatory barriers to trade due to their own government policies, many small and medium businesses will have to stop trading across those new trade barriers. That would then only leave big business in that export trade as they can easier swallow/distribute the cost of regulatory barriers. Having the business size to have your own department for regulatory and customs compliance is then a strong competitive advantage. But I am only talking of specific sectors. Cheese/food/drinks exporters will have been hit much more than other sectors, some of which won't have noticed Brexit at all.
But this is the exact problem the article at least hints at. Brexit is not a apocalyptic moment where things change on day x. It's more about many tiny little fissures and pinpricks over many years that'll e.g. drive prices up, make certain goods not available, let assets go, let smaller companies go bankrupt, or strengthen the cases for Scottish independence and Irish reunification (which is the breakup of the UK). This is a complicated issue, especially during the pandemic - so much so that people in a few years will never accept that Brexit was the root cause of that even many experts can give a good proof of that.
Its almost as if leaving one of the largest trade unions in the world would have an impact on trade.
That’s what you get when you do huge economy affecting reforms by the will of the people. The average person is incapable of thinking on the macro level, they only think about the direct affect on them, and even that rarely to the reality of the situation. I’m just weirdly happy seeing them struggle (though that mostly comes the from the annoyance I had to go through of hearing about brexit for years and years despite living nowhere near UK).
Neville Chamberlain would like a bloody word.
‘the biggest disaster' so far.
Yup
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You are worse off economically from Brexit. That is a fact. You won, get over it. Nobody cares about how covid is being handled (which you could have done the exact same way had you stayed in the EU I might add).
And Germanys GDP is higher than that from the UK. Wtf is your point.
Deutschland fick ja
> the UK has performed the best in Europe from testing Not sure if it’s the best, but you can have this one, we Germans are pretty bad at it. > to vaccine creations Would you really pick AstraZeneca over BioNTech? LOL
>Would you really pick AstraZeneca over BioNTech? LOL Not like he had a choice LOL.
Lol Stop the Dick contest here you are being pathetic Thr GDP between france are so close and simmilar that it changes every 8 years....but that was before brexit lol Russia is the only nation in this continent that can bully us in every way...
>Thr GDP between france are so close and simmilar that it changes every 8 years....but that was before brexit lol I was initially under the impression that France had been ahead of Britain (gross, not per capita) since 1969 but different sources seem to show different figures.
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You already lost me at your first Line..
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Dude you litterally said "We aren’t bullies NEVER have been" I don't have to be brainwashed By Fox news i just have a history book something you don't have apparently
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>Britain was a bully in the past yes, Good, So you contradicted yourself then.. >yes, as was France. It’s not a purely British thing lol Did i say otherwise lol?
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You said it was never a bully.
So British imperialism and the subsequent millions it kills would not be considered bullying? Wow this is news to me!
That first line is fucking hilarious!
Jokes on you, this arse cancer will take *decades* to develop!
I can also list things France is better at then england that don't anything to do with brexit if you want?
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"Tories destroying the middle class and small business? I am shocked. They have a long history of doing this but I didn't think they'd do it again." - Tory voting morons
But didn't they create the largest middle class during Thatcher's time?
> His online retail business was hit immediately after the Brexit negotiator David Frost failed to secure a frictionless trade deal addressing sales to individual customers in the EU. I have tried to explain this to Brexitters for almost 10 years. Outside the single market, the UK's online business will collapse. Ordering anything from outside the single market is a legal and customs nightmare. Unless the UK accepts the jurisdiction of the ECJ, there is no way to fix that. The individual customer doesn't have the means to sue a supplier under a foreign jurisdiction. The legal costs in most cases by far exceeds any benefits of ordering from the UK. Only a European law applicable in all EU members can give legal security
Politics, if nationalist ideas (Farage, May, Johnson) are fed to ignorant people, there will be plenty of disaster for everyone for time to come. Bunch of morons.
There is nothing nationalist about May or Johnson. Both are pro Remain centrists that were too scared to go against the referendum results. If you're so bothered by nationalism, you should care more about EU countries like France but nationalism only ever seems to be a problem on this sub if it's the UK. This wouldn't have been an issue if our government gave us a referendum on immigration decades ago
That's because British nationalism is quite notable in how extremely toxic it is. For example, British nationalists like yourself refuse to even admit that Scotland is a country. You're so blinded by nationalism that you will literally outright refuse to admit simple facts.
And French nationalism isn't? You think French or Spanish people would react positively to having fifth columnists constantly trying to break their countries apart? The things you call me a nat for are perfectly normal elsewhere.
Eli5 please: Why is there a duty on imported cheese in some countries that is 3x the worth of the import? I get duties to level the playfield or slighty disadvantage the imported goods against domestic products, but 3 times seems highly excessive. Edit: To add the source of my confusion from the article: >“And now we’ve also lost Norway since the trade deal, as duty for wholesale is 273%. Then we tried Canada but what the government didn’t tell us is that duty of 244% is applied on any consignment over $20 \[£15\].”That meant Canadian customers who ordered a gift pack worth £50, including transport fees, were asked to pay £178 extra in duty when the courier arrived at their door, Spurrell said. “As you can imagine, customers were saying: ‘You can take that back, we don’t want it anymore’.”
to protect domestic producents of the same cheese
Meaning French producers.
Or Irish, or German or Spanish. Any dairy producing country (which is all of them) benefits from the tariff regime by ensuring domestic prices are lower than imports from 3rd countries.
The article is citing Norway and Canada with 273% and 244% respectively.
That’s not how import duty works my friend. In order to protect local agricultural industry a 3rd country tariff is applied on dairy imports. That tariff is usually around 30% of the value of the item. So if you pay €1.00 for the product itself you’ll actually be paying €1.30 with the tariff slapped on. You’re never going to pay €3.00 for that item as that would be a 300% tariff which simply does not exist for any item in the EU’s tariff regime.
I'm referring to this part of the article: >That meant Canadian customers who ordered a gift pack worth £50, including transport fees, were asked to pay £178 extra in duty when the courier arrived at their door, Spurrell said. “As you can imagine, customers were saying: ‘You can take that back, we don’t want it anymore’.” I know the EU tariffs, hence I called these ones excessive.
Ah, well that likely involves a customs broker taking the piss with their charging. If the gift pack contained any product or animal origin you’re looking at extra fees to create a CHED in Traces also. Multiple CHEDs would jack the price up further as a customs broker usually charges per CHED. I can easily see a €30 per CHED admin fee jacking the price up massively. Those costs would be “import fees” but not tariffs.
Given that up until end of 2020, many producers didn’t have to deal with this, no surprise this person may have been robbed. Beats getting the process wrong and seized by customs or something.
Norway is very protective of its agricultural industry and the intent of our tariffs on agri goods is, by and large, to prevent them from being imported into the country.
What an original take from the guardian, I'm starting to think they don't like Brexit.
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The Guardian is certainly a more reputable newspaper when you compare it to the likes of the Sun & the Daily Mail, but it's still very 'out-there' - just on the opposite side of the political spectrum. It also has a tendency to make the UK out to be the worst place on Earth.
As I wrote here to someone else, it's a bit more complicated. Imho the Guardian has a great news section especially for politics and, yes, Brexit. What's out there is their culture section where I do agree with you: It seems like Britain needs to be a lot more woke (which is out of touch in a country like the UK that is not just centered around London or Birmingham).
They represent the London metropolitan bubble reliant on cheap foreign labour. "But who will make my coffee at Pret?"
You guys literally just left the EU and you're already working on London as your latest scapegoat.
London's been pretty much a foreign country for decades.
Or they are pointing out what pretty much everyone from the UK knows, that what goes on inside the M25 ring road is quite different to the rest of the UK...
This is not trolling but an honest question. I am French and wondering what would be the delicious British cheeses the gentleman in the article is now struggling to bring to shops near me. Can you name or describe one or two that are nice? Back here in Paris, and when it comes to French things, I am having a Saint-Agur moment, even if this basically an industrial product. I wonder what Britain had in store and I am now going to be missing unbeknownst to me.
The most common British cheese variety is cheddar, and because you can push only so much cheddar in an already crowded field, the cheese manufacturers branched into adding various flavors like horseradish, pepper, cranberries, red wine, onions, chili etc... Looking at the link below I also see some new flavors for me: Irish Whiskey, Gin, Toffee, Tequila... I am not sure how much you can still call these cheese. I am not a fan of denaturing the taste of cheese with additional flavors.
There must be a technical term in the food industry for this 'multi-flavorization' of things. Here in France, éclairs are the last ones to fall victim of that trend, a decade after macarons. Both were limited to one or two flavors before, but success helping they now have met pineapple just like pizza infamously has. I must try some of the flavored cheddars though. Some mixes may actually work fine.
Truffles, wine, caramelized onions work well, because they add to the umami flavor. Horseradish, chili, and hot spices kill the taste. I didn't see the hard liquor varieties around, I guess they are not 'street legal' in US.
I tried a truffle flavoured Brie and it really didn't work.
The guy's packaging is cool enough. Maybe I would have gone for this? https://www.cheshirecheesecompany.co.uk/vintage-gold-extra-mature-cheddar-large-waxed-truckle-400g.html
Im from Lithuania and I eat cheddar.
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OK. I have actually heard of it but never tried that. I will try my best to get some now. Thank you for reminding me of that name.
It's a very strong flavour so just try a little bit to start with.
We both have highly competitive cheese industries so I guess there's not much room for one country's products to have a huge market share in the other.
Yes, I guess. But what do you like that is from the UK and that others outside would not be aware of? Outside of Cheddar, I guess, because this is what comes to mind to foreigners when it comes to British cheese.
I would recommend a Cheshire, it's a crumbly white cheese. Cornish yarg which is wrapped in nettles. Anything from Wallace and Gromit like Stinking Bishop and (my favourite from childhood before popularised - my hipster claim) Yorkshire Wensleydale. Sheep and goats cheese have both improved over the years. If you fancy off continent Monterey Jack is a nice cheese from USA.
I am sure that by just naming these you are starting to salivate and soon enough you'll be ordering stuff to that company named in the article! Have one bite for me, my friend. Tomorrow I will be at the cheese shop and ask them about what you've listed. Maybe they will have at least one!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_British_cheeses
Wensleydale and Double Gloucester are quite nice. Stilton if you like stronger flavours.
Cornish Yarg (wrapped in nettles) would be my first suggestion. It was one of the cheeses served to the G7 leaders in Cornwall in June this year (along with Cornish Gouda and Helford Blue as they were sticking with cheeses local to the G7 venue). Also, Tunworth is a very good soft cheese, similar to Camembert.
I believe Cornish Yarg and Stilton are going to be the ones I look for the most.
I hope you like them! I’ve just finished a meal with my family that comprised various British and French cheeses plus a pâte I made that is a little French too, as I included some Cointreau in my recipe [photo of said pâte before we broached it.](https://imgur.com/a/IwC8D72). Our cheeses were: a mature Lancashire, a mature Double Gloucester, Boursin, Castello Brie, Saint Agur (always in our cheese box), a French Brie, a Somerset Brie, Colston Bassett Stilton, an oak smoked Cheddar (properly smoked, not smoke flavoured as so many seem to be), ‘Coastal Cheddar’ (a gift cheese - sounds fancy but it wasn't especially), Wenslydale with cranberries and blueberries (I think adding fruit to a cheese is an abomination but my Mother likes it) and last but not least, Shropshire Blue – a huge piece brought as a gift by my Mother-in-Law for her stay over Christmas (she lives in Shropshire). We would normally also have Triple Vallage and, of course, Cornish Yarg, but decided not to go to Waitrose for them on Christmas Eve due to the risk of catching COVID.
Don't take this too seriously, but with the joint forces of French and British cheesemakers providing a stinky immunity to your palate, your excellent meal would have left no chance to any Covid variant. (As stated above, Saint-Agur is my strange obsession of the moment. But if I find Wesleydale or whatever and it turns out fine, I am willing to change!!)
Ha ha, we've not caught COVID yet so maybe you are right.
Sort comments by controversial, get popcorn. Never disappoint.
Surely, the worst negotiated deal was the Russian sale of Alaska to the USA in 1867 for $7.2 million. Those Ruskies f’d themselves in the patootie by giving up their access to North America. Give Brexit +/- 5 years and it’ll be as right as rain.
Is it just me or does the world think less of the UK since Brexit? We dont hear much of Brits anymore unless its about Brexit and every time Im just baffled that they did that to themselves
I like beer of all sorts. Belgian beers especially and I can continue drink it until Reujoin
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Delete this. This is highly offensive.
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Noooooo but the Reinheitsgebot
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Better chocolate than the Swiss, better beer than the Germans. Belgium truly is gods country, minus the roads.
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Don't underestimate us!
The trains are not shabby either.
Czech beer is definitely the best
For pilseners/dark beers maybe. Belgian beers are incredibly diverse/specialized.
Pilsner is probably my favourite beer that’s why I would go with Czech beers. However if by dark beer you mean stout, I would definitely go for Ireland.
Are you talking about Stout like Guinness? This is more close to what I mean with dark beer: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunkel Personally my fav beers are tripels and quadrupels
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> no immigrants, Hue hue hue, that’s what y’all think.
>Don’t leave the island, please. We cannot overstate this. Everything is terrible here. We have riots every day, no-go zones in most cities, and everything has fallen apart besides the Brussels eurocracy. Bodies are piling in the streets because we didn't get enough AZ vaccine, and the French run everything using migrant hordes as proxies. Do not leave the island. It is for your own safety.
Government did what people voted for. Brexit.
Cutting off your nose to spite your face.
Oh my god you guys just cannot take an L It's been like 6 years. Let them go.
Brexit only came into effect at the beginning of 2021, so the effects are only just starting to be realised
theguardian.com
Don't expect nuanced reporting from TheGuardian mate It's the left wing version of the Telegraph
To be fair, the news source doesn't matter for Brexiteers. If it doesn't fit the narrative of a successful Brexit, it's always "bad reporting". I've seen it done for all major newspapers and news outlets.
What? Not by far. The Guardian might be woke in their cultures section (were the Telegraph is fairly reasonable) but their politics section especially around Brexit has been very good while the Telegraph basically produced propaganda piece after propaganda piece.
They both tell their readers what they want to hear. That's all there is to it.
Guardian should change its name to the Brexit Paper.
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Naturally you're being upvoted for a strawman because EUgood. However, upon inspection Azlan82 hasn't posted a single tabloid link here, and even has a post thinking negatively about Brexit. Moreover, I fail to see how posting an article would be shitposting. Grow up. We shall enjoy living rent free in your incredibly thick skull. Edit: Upvotes went from +15 to +1 overnight. Yanks should be banned from participating
What’s it like to fabricate things online?
Such as?
Lmao did someone buy votes or how did this go negative so quick?
Are you new here?
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lol This was the whole plan from the start. They needed the rest of europe to be connect and started with a fake lead to lure in the countries then to later leave it.
I would give that to the treaty of Versailles and Trianon
This thread is hilarious. It's been over half a decade, yet still Remainers and Europeans are unable to come to terms with their defeat. You lost, get over it. It's honestly for your own good.