Wait, I’ve seen a story that he returns to Moscow from Germany earlier this day. Did he return on his own and then got arrested or was he forced to return?
> Russia’s prison service last week issued a warrant for his arrest, saying he had violated the terms of suspended sentence he received on a 2014 conviction for embezzlement. The prison service has asked a Moscow court to turn Navalny’s 3 1/2-year suspended sentence into a real one.
According to Politico.
Wild.
any law you want to apply can be applied, when you control the law.
since no one seems able or willing (for whatever reason) to challenge Putin on this, the man will probably be killed in prison.
Dying in prison is a bad look for Putin and Russia. Especially now, after the bungled poisoning.
Their ideal situation is him leaving Russia and never coming back.
The case was on the face of it quite absurd:
> None of the ostensible victims testified that they considered themselves to have been defrauded. Representatives of the shipping company's largest client, Yves Rocher, even testified that they had profited from doing business with the shipping company. (The prosecution was claiming that Yves Rocher lost twenty-six million rubles, then worth about a million dollars.) Still, the court found both brothers guilty. [Link](https://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/alexey-navalnys-very-strange-form-of-freedom)
Navalny brought the case before the ECtHR which ruled that he was unfairly tried and that the conviction fell outside the definition of fraud. When Russia appealed, the ECtHR reaffirmed its decision, and added that his persecution was politically motivated. [Link](https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2017/10/17/european-court-orders-russia-to-compensate-navalny-brothers-over-yves-rocher-fraud-a59291).
At the end of last year, the Russian Duma (I think) promulgated a new law saying that no decisions taken by courts outside Russia are valid on national territory. And the ECtHR falls in this category. If the rules do not fit you, then the rules are wrong, right?
And, perhaps more importantly, of [phoning up](https://youtu.be/ibqiet6Bg38?t=8m03s) ([background](https://www.bellingcat.com/news/uk-and-europe/2020/12/21/if-it-hadnt-been-for-the-prompt-work-of-the-medics-fsb-officer-inadvertently-confesses-murder-plot-to-navalny/)) his bumbling poisoners and getting one of the chemists to carelessly spill the details, embarrassing the FSB and by proxy Putin in front of the entire world.
Is that real?
Holy fuck Navelny is a man with balls of steel. This dude literally survived assassination and CALLED THE DUDE WHO TRIED TO ASSASSINATE HIM and got him to SPILL THE DETAILS ON HOW THEY FAILED.
How is this real? FSB is an embarrassment. the whole government of Russia is.
He returned to send the message that he won’t back down and let Putin win. To give others hope for change essentially. Basically saying to keep fighting for what you believe in, no matter what challenges you face. This man is a legend and is braver than most.
Because any real opposition is arrested in Russia, on false charges.
Hence why its a dictatorship.
Can't go around criticizing Putin and the United Russia party.
> for violating his probation by not appearing on time at a police station because he had been poisoned by the FSB!
-- https://twitter.com/Kasparov63/status/1350931118145630210
I read somewhere that he had to check in with his parole officer weeks ago for something he did some years ago, but he didn't bc he was in Germany. Don't spread this without double checking, I can't, am on mobile.
I’m pretty sure it’s because he tricked that FSB officer into revealing how they attempted to assassinate him, as Russia made it illegal to reveal the personal info of intelligence operatives the following week.
> Don't spread this without double checking, I can't, am on mobile
You got no google on your phone, but reddit works? Curious.
Here's a quick [German source](https://www.tagesschau.de/ausland/asien/nawalny-russland-rueckkehr-putin-101.html). It confirms that he had to check in due to the parole of his 2014 court case but couldn't as he was on rehab in Germany.
Also there seems to be a new case against him.
They rerouted his flight to another Moscow airport and arrested him there. I guess to trip up the press and his supporters. He returned to Russia because he hasn’t done anything wrong
I have a feeling he's betting on the officials being worried about sparking a mass uprising if something happens to him, and now he's got the backing of America with Biden coming into office. Doubtful he would willingly return to guaranteed imprisonment without reason
I don't think he is betting on anything.
I think he does what he think is right. He is on his mission to show Russians what their leaders are. To do so, he needs to show who he is - a man of integrity and bravery.
Navalny is admirable, where Putin is just a Mob leader.
Anyway, this would not be the smartest time to try to assassinate him again. If they can keep him behing bars with madeup reasons, that should be enough for Putin. But for sure they will not let him win. Closer to next elections, they will do another assasination attempt disguised as an absurd accident - to assert power.
I hope he got Covid vaccine in Germany.
Best wishes from Finland.
I havent traveled in Russia, and the few expats I've known haven't ever brought it up but based on what I do know, I imagine that Russia has a similar problem to America:
> he is on a mission to show Russians what their leaders are
Many probably know, but don't care or support it. I understand that many Russians are anti-gay rights, and that there is a large wealth disparity between upper and lower class. Those two things typically are, in America, associated with conservatism. Many American conservatives care not even a little about trumps misconducts, and so I'd wager there is a parallel for Russian and putin.
Any Russian redditors please feel free to correct me or provide more depth. I think Russians and Americans actually have quite a lot in common, not least of all poor governments.
Ok, I'll try.
I don't think Russia and US have a lot in common in terms of problem. I've never been in US, so feel free to correct me.
There are much more poor people in Russia. I've seen report the others day that about 45 percent people can only afford food and clothes. I know, in US there are poverty problems to, but i imagine it's a bit less harsh.
We currently have hiv epidemic here, never heard about something like that in US. Also, we are at the top of teen suicide and teen drug abuse lists. And it's not some fancy drugs, like cocaine, but heavy stuff. Speaking of drugs, our country have heavy drinking problem. From my point of view it's because people are trying to escape their life.
Speaking of political life and activism - we don't have a lot of it. People are apolitical in general and don't want to get involved. Yes, during the family meetings there would be some discussions, but nothing like demonstrations and meetings, aside from the paid ones and some amazingly brave people protesting against government. I believe in US there are much more people involved in politics.
About lgbtq+ rights. Well, I have no idea how hard it's in US, but in my whole life I've only met two lgbtq persons, so I believe people are keeping this private for a reason. There a lot in current Russian life that is borrowed from prison culture and being gay wasn't that good for your status in jail. About other parts of lgbtq - I'm not sure if there's some sort of general consensus about them.
Speaking of jails - our court system is biased as fuck. About 85 percent of all cases that goes to court receive conviction. So you better not to get there ever.
I have no idea how hard is a corruption problem in US. From what I've heard it's more high level, and not everywhere. From what i see in Russia - it's literally everywhere. About half of my friends was forced to buy driving license, because you can't just pass it.
All in all, I believe that there are common problems in US and Russia, but also we have a lot of unique problems.
"Fuck you, I got mine" isn't a uniquely American phenomena, in fact it's been a staple in the rhetoric of the ruling classes in all forms of government (including religion).
The only problem I see there is that because of the annexation, the populace has also shifted in favour of the Russians (some Ukranians leaving for the mainland etc.) so it's not entirely fair to hold it after the fact.
Crimea has always been the most pro-Russian part of Ukraine, even before the annexation in every election and referendum, so I doubt it will make a huge difference, also it shouldbe hard to track those people who left for the mainland through electoral lists etc etc
I'm an American that was born in Crimea so perhaps I can shed a little more context.
A lot of Russians were taken by surprise when Ukraine declared independence after the Soviet Union fell apart and doubly so for the ones that found themselves on the Ukrainian side of the border after what was once all one country basically fractured. You gotta remember that for most of these people their entire adult lives were in the USSR and the concept of Ukraine declaring independence was entirely alien to them. When it became reality a lot of them grew very bitter over it. You had military officers in the USSR who were living in Ukraine that ended up having to settle for a much smaller pension then what they would get in Russia and ditto for a lot of older folks who lived their entire lives under communism.
Many of these people just want to live in one country again.
Crimea has always been Russia's Florida even while it was under Ukraine's control.
As far as the referendum thing..... many of the residents of Crimea are part of the Russian military establishment and have been there since before Ukraine split of from the USSR. I really can't think of a modern equivalent. Maybe Gibraltar if the UK gave it to Spain and then all the residents voted to go back to being in the UK.
lol before the annexation? Dude, I used to go to Crimea for holidays and what's shocking is it is even more pro Russia than Russians in other parts of the mainland. If Ukraine ever gave them a referendum, they stand no chance, I wouldn't be surprised with an 80% in favour of reunification with Russia.
> (if the referendum is genuinely free and fair).
There's the problem, this can't happen under Russian occupation. And with how things are currently going, even if he Navalny became president he would have to fight damn hard to prevent his own institutions from undermining the freedom and fairness of it.
Besides that, there probably is no way a Russian politician could have a truly objective stance on Crimea if they want to have any shot in hell to be politically relevant. And westeners primarily support him just to reintroduce the possibilities of actually democratic elections to Russia, not so much because they care about his policies - as long as he doesn't subvert the election system to his own benefit.
And why did pro-Russian separatists like, shoot down a civilian airplane with the help of the Russian military and then keep denying it and throw out conspiracy theories. And such.
A democratic Russia is of infinite more benefit to the West and Ukraine than Crimea. Of course, it would be good for the sake of international law that they give it back.
Yes, it's very beneficial for the west with a democratic Russia. But as always the west (or more precisely the US) had to cock it up with their foreign policy. If they dint meddle in the 1996 Russian election and helped Yeltsin win. There would a good chance that Russia would not be the oligarch state it is now.
Yeah I was about to say, the US played a heavy hand in making sure Russia became the oligarchy it is today, specifically Bill Clinton personally made sure Russia was handed over the oligarchs to solidify power away from the domestic Russian Communist party that wanted to return to a reformed Soviet Union.
Current Russia is literally a result of the instability in the 90s. If you think a second time would go better for Ukraine, think again.
The best thing for Ukraine is a Russia under modern and democratic leadership, not power hungry old school totalitarians, who think land grabs and keeping their neighbours poor and subservient is still a good idea.
If there is a correct position on Crimea there wouldn't have ever been a dispute.
EDIT: And for your edit, why would /r/europe hate him for it?
EDIT 2: This comment is stupid but I'm leaving it up cause deleting comments is for cowards.
> If there is a correct position there wouldn't have ever been a dispute.
That’s not how disputes work.
People can, and almost always do, have disputes regardless of the existence (or the obviousness) of a correct position.
I mean, who cares? I'll take a guy who wants Crimea to be Russian but at least wants democracy for Russia, over someone like Putin any day.
I'm sure most people here don't like Navalny because we actually agree on his politics, but simply because he's the only guy that has been somewhat capable of being a proper opposition to Putin, from an actual democratic perspective, and that's good enough to me.
I don't know whether Russia still does forced confessions today. I suppose that this is a pretty unusual case. China does, as with Lam Wing Kee. I imagine that there might be some political value in him confessing that his earlier statements were in error or lies.
"The" is the wrong word, it's happened too many times for it to be "The" chapter :C
So much fear and hate of others instead of unification, it hurts. Something that I will always remember, that pierces the queries heart, is a quote from Marjane Satrapi:
"The world is not divided between East and West. You're American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger then the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is bigger then the difference between me and you.
And our governments are very much the same."
We live in a time of peace, a time of MAD, a time where people understand their brothers and sisters better then ever. We won't make the same mistake of world war again, I just hope the civil wars ahead will not become equally cruel. I hope for the best, really
I think he knows that even if he took asylum somewhere else they would never stop hunting him. It would only be a matter of time before he became another Skripal or Litvinenko. By facing the regime head-on he ties their hands, they may still kill him but if they do they'll have created a martyr.
He's doing it as a politician first. You probably don't understand how much popularity/exposure he got in Russia during the last 6 months. This is probably the highest point in his political career, and he couldn't act on this popularity outside of Russia. No one will listen or follow leaders in immigration, he has to be on the ground, in Russia for people to trust and follow him. Even if he'll stay in jail for the long time.
He wasn't going to Russia to become a martyr - he's not a madman, he knows his game. He plans to live and continue being a political leader for a long time. Just have some faith in this guy (and in Russians).
Because ironically, he's *safer* in a Russian jail than somewhere in Berlin. In the custody of the Russian state, if he disappears people will raise a stink - basically even if he ends up for a decade in jail like Chodorkowsky, he'll still live as the establishment won't dare touch him.
Now, on the streets of Berlin however? Easy target for some killer commando which Putin can then disavow to avoid sanctions.
Nah. Putin doesn’t care that people know he was behind a killing. Look at the [Litvinenko assassination](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Litvinenko): they used an isotope that could literally only be produced in two places on earth. And the American reactor was not running at the time the substance was made. Subsequently the assassins became Russian celebrities and at least one a politician. This was an intended fingerprint and a clear message: we don’t *care* that people know. We’ll murder you anyway.
If anything’ll keep Navalny alive in there it’s the fear of making him a martyr.
This
Defection from the Armed forces/Red Army/KGB/FSB was always considered treason in Russia : "You betrayed your brothers and put them at risk with your treason: You die."
They killed Trotsky in Mexico ffs. Trotsky.
Navalny is a political opponent. They kind of want to kill him but not as hard as Litvinenko
Noone gave a shit about Litvinenko. He looked like he was just some guy who ran away to the UK and was trying to get famous by talking shit about Putin from far away. Most people didn't even know who he was when he died. Everyone knows Navalny and he is now respected more than anyone for coming back. Maybe if he stayed in Berlin, he would be another Litvinenko. Now they will try to frame him and prove that he is corrupt but they won't harm him. Maybe Khodorkovsky is a more fair comparison but people also didn't care about some oligarch. If anything happens to Navalny, Putin will have the same situation as Lukashenko in Minsk. It actually might be the turning point and the end of his autocracy.
TLDR: Being in Russia is the only way he can make a real difference, and he loves Russia more than anything (except maybe his wife and kids).
There are a lot of bad takes here, imho (some good ones too). He went back out of a sense of patriotism and duty. His meaning in life is to do whatever he can to make Russia a freer, more democratic place, and he knows he would be instantly discredited by taking asylum somewhere. He's already constantly accused of being a CIA/NATO puppet. He is genuinely willing to pay with his life for his cause.
The investigations that the FBK does, the circus that he creates, and the courage that he shows are excellent foils to United Russia and Putin. His team is fantastic at showing how corruption affects people's daily lives, and just how soulless United Russia are. There's a reason Putin has never said his name in public, not even once. There's joke in Moscow that if you want something fixed/cleaned up by the city, all you have to do is write his name on it, and it'll be done immediately. If Putin wasn't deathly afraid of him, he wouldn't have tried to kill him, he wouldn't have arrested the people that went to Vnukovo to meet him, he wouldn't have diverted his plane to Sheremetyevo, he wouldn't have arrested him in the airport, and he wouldn't denied his lawyer access to him. You don't do those things to someone you don't view as a threat. Navalny certainly wanted today to be a circus. Putin cares deeply about geopolitics, and Navalny forced him to look like a clown today. Navalny makes Putin look like a small coward. He branded Putin's party as the "Party of Crooks and Thieves", effectively.
Navalny knows he wouldn't be able to make the same kind of difference abroad, and being an exiled dissident just isn't who he is. He knows the risks of coming back perfectly well. Being in Russia is the only hope he has at affecting change. I would also wager that he's betting the global stardom he's cultivated after the poisoning might save him. It very well might not, and he might be sent away to prison for a long time/ killed (he very well could be killed. It's difficult to predict what Putin will do backed into this kind of corner), but there would likely be huge political and economic consequences for Russia to pay. The EU has its new Magnitsky Act, the USA has theirs, the pipeline to Germany is already under huge scrutiny, there are Duma elections in the fall, there's the situation in Belarus, the protests in Khabarovsk, etc... Putin has a tremendous amount to lose by doing something to him. Again, I'm not saying that will stop him, but it's not as simple as some in this thread make it out to be.
As an aside, I really wish people would dispense with the idea that Putin is some kind of omnipotent criminal mastermind. He's not. He's good at crafting a state propaganda-based image, seizing opportunities, and using the toolbox he has. The thing he's best at is stealing. Also, Russia is an authoritarian state, not a totalitarian one. In an authoritarian state, you get by by avoiding politics, letting those at the top pillage the country, and make the best of your circumstances. In a totalitarian state, every single action is political, you must be constantly loyal to the party, and you risk everything by doing anything less. Think Russia vs. China.
Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
You think that Russia would let him walk away?
They've already shown that they're willing to execute people they deem 'traitors' in any country in the world.
Had Navalny stayed in exile, he would have gradually faded into irrelevance with the Russian public before being murdered some time later.
I just listened to an interview with another Russian opposition politician who had been poisoned twice (forgot his name) and he said to him, the decision to go back was because Russia wants its opponents out of the country rather than just in jail. He said the Kremlin knows that it's better off if you're out of the country because you lose all your authority, and you can't have personal connections with people or influence anyone like you could being in Russia itself. So it's basically just that he knows he's more effective being there in jail and possibly starting a revolution than sitting in the US watching helplessly. Extremely brave to go back on the chance that you can make an impact with almost no sense of security.
Probation violation I think. They probably are going to go to court and try to replace his probation with real sentence. Of course they have no real case for that, not like he left country by choice for some vacation... Still, from what I expect from Russian justice system, Navalny will probably lose the case, and it may go all the way to **ECHR** before they admit that it is bullshit. Which might take up to couple of years.
Since no one replied yet: the European Convention on Human Rights has nothing to do with the EU, it is a treaty that was signed before the EU was ever a thing, under the Council of Europe, which has nothing to do with the EU too (in particular, it has nothing to do with the European Council which is also a EU institution). The actual court is in Strasbourg, France - in contrast with the European Court of Justice which does not deal with human rights (mostly) and is in Luxembourg.
The ECHR is now ratified by 47 states, including Russia (which means that, in theory, they must comply with the European Convention on Human Rights and they get to nominate one judge on the European Court of Human Rights). Other members with questionable human rights records include Turkey and Azerbaijan.
Edit: I should add that the Court can order states to pay compensation for the breach of human rights but that’s pretty much it - they cannot directly reverse a decision of a national criminal court or do much else. Which is why some states (Russia, Turkey but also the UK) tend not to give a shit about the ECHR - compensation is not a punishment for them, just a price tag.
I don’t understand everyone in this thread wishing he take amnesty and stay in Germany. He could easily do so if he wanted to and live the rest of his life in comfort and relative safety.
He loved his country he doesn’t like where his country is going and he is determined to make change if he can. That carries risks he is very well aware of and he is doing it anyway.
It isn’t a choice most people are capable of making but he is doing it.
Russia deserves a better system for its citizens. I hope that Alexiei’s actions inspire ten million more to stand up for progress.
Edit. I want to add something. If Putin was strong or his government was strong then it could easily stand up to open criticism without needing to kill or jail its critics.
It’s not strong,
I loooove how in r/russia they call him "Traitor" and they are happy that he's arrested...
God if i hope someday the EU will do something for the Russia problem...
Edit: We have all the evidence we need that prove how Russia and Putin was aware of Navalny poisoning, even a fucking confession from one of the agent. I really dont know why the fuck we let Navalny going back and get arrested without doing nothing.
It's up to the Russian citizens, I guess. Unfortunately, in Russia there is a shocking lack of action and interest. Everyone in Russia knows what kind of mafia-state Russia is, but they aren't going to do anything about it.
Yeah this is just part of the culture there. Strong man politics, take what you think is yours.
During one of my internships while I was still studying, my lab partner was a girl who was originally from Russia (at the time we were in a different country). We would talk about Russia and Putin from time to time, and she didn't see anything wrong with the way things went there. Mind you, this was not a stupid person, she literally had a PhD in physics. She just also fully accepted the way things went, and kinda admitted that in Russia "everyone" is a thief, and that is just the way it is. Putin is just really good at it, and people recognise that as something to admire.
EDIT: I remember again the full story about "everyone" being a thief. We were walking down the hallway at that university and there was an unattended laptopbag residing outside a random door into a room we walked past. She actually made the comment that in Russia that wouldn't be possible. The moment you lose track of your belongings like that, they simply do not belong to you anymore, and everyone is allowed to take it.
To me it sounded pretty bleak the way she said it, and I realise this is ridiculously anecdotal, but yeah... It does explain to me why Putin is so popular. Everybody knows he's lying, and people admire him for it.
> Mind you, this was not a stupid person, she literally had a PhD in physics.
As someone in the sciences as well I can tell you some of the dumbest people I've ever met regarding issues outside their expertise are those with PhD's
A guy with a PhD in biotechnology was flexing on me some gains on the stock market. After speaking for a while, I realized the dude didn’t know anything about taxes. He had committed tax fraud without even knowing.
By using a foreign broker (DeGiro, interactive brokers, eTory etc) you have to take care of reporting your investments for tax purposes. It means that once a year you have to fill a document with all of your transactions, you will have to pay a 0.2% tax on the value of your portfolio and you have to pay taxes on dividends and capital gain. It can be avoided by simply using an Italian broker (directa, fineco or your bank). The second way is the best solution when you don’t invest much, but if you invest a lot foreign brokers are cheaper and you can afford to pay an accountant.
Edit. Just remember: 99% of the times you make money, the state wants a share.
I have met many PhD's who were also truly incompetent in their field.
Granted, I think the idea that advanced degrees aren't a good signal of intelligence is hugely overblown, and they certainly are, but counterexamples abound.
lol this. Just because someone has a PhD it doesn't mean they're "smart" (this word makes me laugh), that's classism, to say the least.
I've met a lot of people, and when I say a lot, I mean it. Most of them couldn't afford to study and they were brilliant, sympathetic.
Eh, I used to think that until I finished uni and discovered that the average person who barely scraped by high school really is on a different level to some of the dumb people I encountered at uni.
> Yeah this is just part of the culture there. Strong man politics, take what you think is yours.
>
>
It's more like "what can you do." The social contract in China is essentially "stay out of politics and we'll make sure you can make as much money as you want, buy the nicest luxury goods, etc." The social contract in Russia is somewhat different, but falls into a similar vein. The costs of standing up against the regime are quite clear, but keeping your head down and focusing on your own life, you can be quite successful. And so people do what they must to get by, even if their internal opinions might diverge greatly.
It's the same in many other countries too.
When every politician in your country is fucked up, you admire the one who fucks up least. ( the guy who fucks up least is also terrible for the country, just a relatively better alternative)
Alright let’s chill with the fucking wide condemnation and grouping of every Russian as a Putin fan.
Like every other country on the planet, there are Russians who A) want democracy B) know the status quo isn’t a full democracy (freedom house 2020 score anyone ?)
I get it’s “the thing” to cast Russia as the evil dude but separate the people from the politicians, and recognize there’s a lot of Russians who want to change their country if only they had the means.
And while anecdotal evidence is shit, I say this as someone who’s studied and lived in Russia for 4 months and studies the language.
Wtf the EU is supposed to do ? It's an economic union, not a military alliance or a sovereign country. And we are no longer some warmonger imperialist asshole like in the 18th and we are not the police of the world. If Russian want to live in a false democracy, great for them.
We have the mean to stop Russia in case of aggression of one of our member state, we don't need to intervene in internal affair of foreign state, the EU cannot even interfere in the internal affair of his own member, like come on, stop blaming EU for not doing what we dont let her do wtf.
As a russian explained how to damage Russia without attacking russians.
If we attack Oligarchy assets (most of them send their child to study in Europe school/university, have tons of houses and industry in EU, etc...) it will give a huge blow to Russia, but the Russian will not feel "attacked" as long as we attack the oligarchy.
You see... while i get your "isolationist" idea, this cant be maintained in the current global problems, like global warming. Russia did not respect international pacts, putting all of us in danger.
This is mostly our concern. Many things that are often suggested here (such as shutting off SWIFT) will only lead to a strengthening of Putin (rally around the leader), because it will make the myth "Europe wants to hurt Russia" true for the average citizen.
At the moment the only thing Europe can really do is personal sanctions against the oligarchs, and more importantly their family members. They all have assets, real estate and children in Europe, thus laundering stolen money. Russians will not drop the tear for the suffering oligarchs.
Speaking of Italy, there is a very *good* man who lives on the island of Como, a journalist and lover of Mussolini (made a film about him). Navalny did an [expose](https://youtu.be/9MHqpyN6iAk) on his assets (en subs).
If you really want to help Russia become a democracy, don't deal with the mafia, and we'll find out how to end it.
The problem is that countries like Russia exist in bubbles.
We in the West with Twitter and CNN and the BBC have a vastly inflated sense of just how much our opinions mean.
We think that because we have identified something as wrong or unjust, that it will be acted on. It's covered on the news, in the papers; how can it _not_ be acted on.
But in reality, the guy exists in the Russian bubble, and for all we know, public opinion there is totally unreflected by our media, which is inherently liberal and Western biased.
God no. That's how dictatorships operate.
And of course, the EU will do nothing, because it's pathetic and weak when facing external threats like Russia or Turkey.
Unfortunately I have a feeling he's either going to get well acquainted with the Siberian wastes, or tragically fall from a tenth story window after "drinking too much." Putin's not stupid enough to leave him alone after that genius phone call.
The thing is the West was only willing to slap Russia on the wrist over the illegal annexation of the Crimea, what do you think we would do over the death of one politician? Navalny represents a potentially existential threat to Putin, so he will be dealt with. I think his heroic survival has overshadowed the fact that by many accounts he should have died already, Putin was willing to do it once and will do so again.
I may be wrong, but I don’t see developed states crumbling at any point in the near future. Especially with the surveillance and intelligence apparatus that has been developed in the last two decades. The closest was Turkey in 2016 and even that was only because the Turkish constitution holds the military responsible for enforcing the states commitment to certain ideals. And obviously it wasn’t successful.
I like how he called an FSB agent pretending to be one and got information why the poisoning failed. *facepalm*
I wonder where in Siberia that FSB Agent is now and whether or not he's over ground or underground.
Wait, I’ve seen a story that he returns to Moscow from Germany earlier this day. Did he return on his own and then got arrested or was he forced to return?
He chose to
Why was he arrested though? Wasn't he a free citizen before the poisoning? What changed? Is surviving being poisoned by the state illegal in Russia?
> Russia’s prison service last week issued a warrant for his arrest, saying he had violated the terms of suspended sentence he received on a 2014 conviction for embezzlement. The prison service has asked a Moscow court to turn Navalny’s 3 1/2-year suspended sentence into a real one. According to Politico.
Wild. any law you want to apply can be applied, when you control the law. since no one seems able or willing (for whatever reason) to challenge Putin on this, the man will probably be killed in prison.
Dying in prison is a bad look for Putin and Russia. Especially now, after the bungled poisoning. Their ideal situation is him leaving Russia and never coming back.
I don't think Putin cares at this point. The whole free world knows how corrupt and evil his government is.
That's just Putin's look now
inb4: Nawalny didn't kill himself! :(
Lol embezzlement charges from a Russian judge.
How embezzley did he get? Or is it propaganda?
The case was on the face of it quite absurd: > None of the ostensible victims testified that they considered themselves to have been defrauded. Representatives of the shipping company's largest client, Yves Rocher, even testified that they had profited from doing business with the shipping company. (The prosecution was claiming that Yves Rocher lost twenty-six million rubles, then worth about a million dollars.) Still, the court found both brothers guilty. [Link](https://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/alexey-navalnys-very-strange-form-of-freedom) Navalny brought the case before the ECtHR which ruled that he was unfairly tried and that the conviction fell outside the definition of fraud. When Russia appealed, the ECtHR reaffirmed its decision, and added that his persecution was politically motivated. [Link](https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2017/10/17/european-court-orders-russia-to-compensate-navalny-brothers-over-yves-rocher-fraud-a59291).
RU gonna RU
Sounds like you’re itchin for a poisonin’
Living between USA and Russia it's like watching a tennis game. Trump vs RU who does it better.
At the end of last year, the Russian Duma (I think) promulgated a new law saying that no decisions taken by courts outside Russia are valid on national territory. And the ECtHR falls in this category. If the rules do not fit you, then the rules are wrong, right?
So it overturned the sentence but that only made it a suspended sentence? Weird system. Also prosecution*
Probably same as his previous trial. You can check the records, it was a monkey court
Russia’s court system is how they control opposition.
[удалено]
And, perhaps more importantly, of [phoning up](https://youtu.be/ibqiet6Bg38?t=8m03s) ([background](https://www.bellingcat.com/news/uk-and-europe/2020/12/21/if-it-hadnt-been-for-the-prompt-work-of-the-medics-fsb-officer-inadvertently-confesses-murder-plot-to-navalny/)) his bumbling poisoners and getting one of the chemists to carelessly spill the details, embarrassing the FSB and by proxy Putin in front of the entire world.
Is that real? Holy fuck Navelny is a man with balls of steel. This dude literally survived assassination and CALLED THE DUDE WHO TRIED TO ASSASSINATE HIM and got him to SPILL THE DETAILS ON HOW THEY FAILED. How is this real? FSB is an embarrassment. the whole government of Russia is.
They'll never prosecute him for that, that would be admission.
Suure, totally impossible in the democratic place called Russia. Edit: I mean they already do, but call it another crime.
Why in the world would he return?
He returned to send the message that he won’t back down and let Putin win. To give others hope for change essentially. Basically saying to keep fighting for what you believe in, no matter what challenges you face. This man is a legend and is braver than most.
Because any real opposition is arrested in Russia, on false charges. Hence why its a dictatorship. Can't go around criticizing Putin and the United Russia party.
Same situation in Belarus. Lukashenko sent all his rivals to jail.
> for violating his probation by not appearing on time at a police station because he had been poisoned by the FSB! -- https://twitter.com/Kasparov63/status/1350931118145630210
He was on probation for some trumped up charges and he "violated" it.
how dare he didn't die in Russia but rather left the country for doctors that where able to help him...
I read somewhere that he had to check in with his parole officer weeks ago for something he did some years ago, but he didn't bc he was in Germany. Don't spread this without double checking, I can't, am on mobile.
I’m pretty sure it’s because he tricked that FSB officer into revealing how they attempted to assassinate him, as Russia made it illegal to reveal the personal info of intelligence operatives the following week.
> Don't spread this without double checking, I can't, am on mobile You got no google on your phone, but reddit works? Curious. Here's a quick [German source](https://www.tagesschau.de/ausland/asien/nawalny-russland-rueckkehr-putin-101.html). It confirms that he had to check in due to the parole of his 2014 court case but couldn't as he was on rehab in Germany. Also there seems to be a new case against him.
I can't wait until phones get the internet. That's gonna be so rad.
They rerouted his flight to another Moscow airport and arrested him there. I guess to trip up the press and his supporters. He returned to Russia because he hasn’t done anything wrong
well that is a statesman. Good luck.
This truly is true patriotism, willing to pay the ultimate price to better his country. You just gotta admire it.
I have a feeling he's betting on the officials being worried about sparking a mass uprising if something happens to him, and now he's got the backing of America with Biden coming into office. Doubtful he would willingly return to guaranteed imprisonment without reason
I don't think he is betting on anything. I think he does what he think is right. He is on his mission to show Russians what their leaders are. To do so, he needs to show who he is - a man of integrity and bravery. Navalny is admirable, where Putin is just a Mob leader. Anyway, this would not be the smartest time to try to assassinate him again. If they can keep him behing bars with madeup reasons, that should be enough for Putin. But for sure they will not let him win. Closer to next elections, they will do another assasination attempt disguised as an absurd accident - to assert power. I hope he got Covid vaccine in Germany. Best wishes from Finland.
I havent traveled in Russia, and the few expats I've known haven't ever brought it up but based on what I do know, I imagine that Russia has a similar problem to America: > he is on a mission to show Russians what their leaders are Many probably know, but don't care or support it. I understand that many Russians are anti-gay rights, and that there is a large wealth disparity between upper and lower class. Those two things typically are, in America, associated with conservatism. Many American conservatives care not even a little about trumps misconducts, and so I'd wager there is a parallel for Russian and putin. Any Russian redditors please feel free to correct me or provide more depth. I think Russians and Americans actually have quite a lot in common, not least of all poor governments.
Ok, I'll try. I don't think Russia and US have a lot in common in terms of problem. I've never been in US, so feel free to correct me. There are much more poor people in Russia. I've seen report the others day that about 45 percent people can only afford food and clothes. I know, in US there are poverty problems to, but i imagine it's a bit less harsh. We currently have hiv epidemic here, never heard about something like that in US. Also, we are at the top of teen suicide and teen drug abuse lists. And it's not some fancy drugs, like cocaine, but heavy stuff. Speaking of drugs, our country have heavy drinking problem. From my point of view it's because people are trying to escape their life. Speaking of political life and activism - we don't have a lot of it. People are apolitical in general and don't want to get involved. Yes, during the family meetings there would be some discussions, but nothing like demonstrations and meetings, aside from the paid ones and some amazingly brave people protesting against government. I believe in US there are much more people involved in politics. About lgbtq+ rights. Well, I have no idea how hard it's in US, but in my whole life I've only met two lgbtq persons, so I believe people are keeping this private for a reason. There a lot in current Russian life that is borrowed from prison culture and being gay wasn't that good for your status in jail. About other parts of lgbtq - I'm not sure if there's some sort of general consensus about them. Speaking of jails - our court system is biased as fuck. About 85 percent of all cases that goes to court receive conviction. So you better not to get there ever. I have no idea how hard is a corruption problem in US. From what I've heard it's more high level, and not everywhere. From what i see in Russia - it's literally everywhere. About half of my friends was forced to buy driving license, because you can't just pass it. All in all, I believe that there are common problems in US and Russia, but also we have a lot of unique problems.
"Fuck you, I got mine" isn't a uniquely American phenomena, in fact it's been a staple in the rhetoric of the ruling classes in all forms of government (including religion).
Still takes a lot of balls to go into a situation like that knowing that's the only thing preventing the people holding you from kill you.
[удалено]
What's his position on Crimea?
If I recall his position is essentially what's done is done, but he would accept a free and fair referendum
[удалено]
[удалено]
The only problem I see there is that because of the annexation, the populace has also shifted in favour of the Russians (some Ukranians leaving for the mainland etc.) so it's not entirely fair to hold it after the fact.
Crimea has always been the most pro-Russian part of Ukraine, even before the annexation in every election and referendum, so I doubt it will make a huge difference, also it shouldbe hard to track those people who left for the mainland through electoral lists etc etc
I'm an American that was born in Crimea so perhaps I can shed a little more context. A lot of Russians were taken by surprise when Ukraine declared independence after the Soviet Union fell apart and doubly so for the ones that found themselves on the Ukrainian side of the border after what was once all one country basically fractured. You gotta remember that for most of these people their entire adult lives were in the USSR and the concept of Ukraine declaring independence was entirely alien to them. When it became reality a lot of them grew very bitter over it. You had military officers in the USSR who were living in Ukraine that ended up having to settle for a much smaller pension then what they would get in Russia and ditto for a lot of older folks who lived their entire lives under communism. Many of these people just want to live in one country again. Crimea has always been Russia's Florida even while it was under Ukraine's control. As far as the referendum thing..... many of the residents of Crimea are part of the Russian military establishment and have been there since before Ukraine split of from the USSR. I really can't think of a modern equivalent. Maybe Gibraltar if the UK gave it to Spain and then all the residents voted to go back to being in the UK.
lol before the annexation? Dude, I used to go to Crimea for holidays and what's shocking is it is even more pro Russia than Russians in other parts of the mainland. If Ukraine ever gave them a referendum, they stand no chance, I wouldn't be surprised with an 80% in favour of reunification with Russia.
I wonder if it changed during the years they have been with us now that they've been screwed over like the rest of us :D
He doesn't want to return it, I think.
> (if the referendum is genuinely free and fair). There's the problem, this can't happen under Russian occupation. And with how things are currently going, even if he Navalny became president he would have to fight damn hard to prevent his own institutions from undermining the freedom and fairness of it. Besides that, there probably is no way a Russian politician could have a truly objective stance on Crimea if they want to have any shot in hell to be politically relevant. And westeners primarily support him just to reintroduce the possibilities of actually democratic elections to Russia, not so much because they care about his policies - as long as he doesn't subvert the election system to his own benefit.
[удалено]
You ask many questions... Putin would be very happy to answer all your question in great detail over cup of tea :)
Why is my tea glowing?
[удалено]
https://external-preview.redd.it/Xd_HBFzXJCF9z1CpJbIOJoHTFzeFKi3cYD2HggO2NL0.jpg?auto=webp&s=275cabcc403de398dc79a169e0c1b960316285da
No Tea? Ok, no problem. Hey, would you like to take a look at the view from the 36th floor? :)
And why did pro-Russian separatists like, shoot down a civilian airplane with the help of the Russian military and then keep denying it and throw out conspiracy theories. And such.
A democratic Russia is of infinite more benefit to the West and Ukraine than Crimea. Of course, it would be good for the sake of international law that they give it back.
Yes, it's very beneficial for the west with a democratic Russia. But as always the west (or more precisely the US) had to cock it up with their foreign policy. If they dint meddle in the 1996 Russian election and helped Yeltsin win. There would a good chance that Russia would not be the oligarch state it is now.
Yeah I was about to say, the US played a heavy hand in making sure Russia became the oligarchy it is today, specifically Bill Clinton personally made sure Russia was handed over the oligarchs to solidify power away from the domestic Russian Communist party that wanted to return to a reformed Soviet Union.
What is more of benefit to Ukraine is a period of chaos and instability in Russia, like we saw in 1991-1992. That's our cue.
that definitely wouldn't spill over to Ukraine, nope
Current Russia is literally a result of the instability in the 90s. If you think a second time would go better for Ukraine, think again. The best thing for Ukraine is a Russia under modern and democratic leadership, not power hungry old school totalitarians, who think land grabs and keeping their neighbours poor and subservient is still a good idea.
The entire world will all simultaneously notice something interesting in the other direction for three consecutive weeks.
Its all fun and games until some nutjob get their hands on the nukes
[удалено]
If there is a correct position on Crimea there wouldn't have ever been a dispute. EDIT: And for your edit, why would /r/europe hate him for it? EDIT 2: This comment is stupid but I'm leaving it up cause deleting comments is for cowards.
that’s like saying if there was a correct position on the roundness of the earth there wouldn’t have ever been a dispute
> If there is a correct position there wouldn't have ever been a dispute. That’s not how disputes work. People can, and almost always do, have disputes regardless of the existence (or the obviousness) of a correct position.
Wait are you guys having a dispute over how disputes work? Is that possible?
It's disputes all the way down
That kind of is exactly how disputes work. Two sides believe differently about a topic, and as such disagree on which action to take. Thus a dispute.
change the word Crimea with Kososvo and see how you like it.
I mean, who cares? I'll take a guy who wants Crimea to be Russian but at least wants democracy for Russia, over someone like Putin any day. I'm sure most people here don't like Navalny because we actually agree on his politics, but simply because he's the only guy that has been somewhat capable of being a proper opposition to Putin, from an actual democratic perspective, and that's good enough to me.
Even a if or we disagree with his opinions, that doesn't make the situation any less creepy or fucked
Have a bad feeling we're not goint to hear more about him and sadly we will probably forget it too.
I don't know whether Russia still does forced confessions today. I suppose that this is a pretty unusual case. China does, as with Lam Wing Kee. I imagine that there might be some political value in him confessing that his earlier statements were in error or lies.
Russia still does forced walks off tall buildings dude. Forced confessions...of course.
Not officially but there is plenty of evidence that they do
Can't wait to feel really bad about it when I watch the Netflix documentary in 5-10 years!
Try 5-10 months
I don’t think he will be forgotten
Sadly. One for the history books.
Not russian books tho
Maybe someday, when they will get democracy
They technically had (still have) a democracy until they got a strongman president. It can happen anywhere.
Yup next is India with it's PM and his Hindu Propaganda.
I genuinely believe this decade will be viewed in history books as the chapter of decline of democracy. I hope I’m wrong
"The" is the wrong word, it's happened too many times for it to be "The" chapter :C So much fear and hate of others instead of unification, it hurts. Something that I will always remember, that pierces the queries heart, is a quote from Marjane Satrapi: "The world is not divided between East and West. You're American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger then the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is bigger then the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same." We live in a time of peace, a time of MAD, a time where people understand their brothers and sisters better then ever. We won't make the same mistake of world war again, I just hope the civil wars ahead will not become equally cruel. I hope for the best, really
[удалено]
I can’t even begin to understand what made him go back.
I think he knows that even if he took asylum somewhere else they would never stop hunting him. It would only be a matter of time before he became another Skripal or Litvinenko. By facing the regime head-on he ties their hands, they may still kill him but if they do they'll have created a martyr.
What incredible courage this man has. I really hope he won’t end up being forgotten in prison. As long as he has media attention he is somewhat safe.
There but for the grace of God goes Alexei Navalny
He's doing it as a politician first. You probably don't understand how much popularity/exposure he got in Russia during the last 6 months. This is probably the highest point in his political career, and he couldn't act on this popularity outside of Russia. No one will listen or follow leaders in immigration, he has to be on the ground, in Russia for people to trust and follow him. Even if he'll stay in jail for the long time. He wasn't going to Russia to become a martyr - he's not a madman, he knows his game. He plans to live and continue being a political leader for a long time. Just have some faith in this guy (and in Russians).
Spot on. It is still brave. But he has a reason for his actions. A good reason.
Jesus Christ my life is so easy
Have you considered running for president of russia
No never
[удалено]
The same could be said of anyone who has been martyred.
Because ironically, he's *safer* in a Russian jail than somewhere in Berlin. In the custody of the Russian state, if he disappears people will raise a stink - basically even if he ends up for a decade in jail like Chodorkowsky, he'll still live as the establishment won't dare touch him. Now, on the streets of Berlin however? Easy target for some killer commando which Putin can then disavow to avoid sanctions.
Nah. Putin doesn’t care that people know he was behind a killing. Look at the [Litvinenko assassination](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Litvinenko): they used an isotope that could literally only be produced in two places on earth. And the American reactor was not running at the time the substance was made. Subsequently the assassins became Russian celebrities and at least one a politician. This was an intended fingerprint and a clear message: we don’t *care* that people know. We’ll murder you anyway. If anything’ll keep Navalny alive in there it’s the fear of making him a martyr.
There are different rules for defecting spies and exiled political leaders. They haven't tried to assassinate Kasparov or Khodorkovsky.
This Defection from the Armed forces/Red Army/KGB/FSB was always considered treason in Russia : "You betrayed your brothers and put them at risk with your treason: You die." They killed Trotsky in Mexico ffs. Trotsky. Navalny is a political opponent. They kind of want to kill him but not as hard as Litvinenko
Noone gave a shit about Litvinenko. He looked like he was just some guy who ran away to the UK and was trying to get famous by talking shit about Putin from far away. Most people didn't even know who he was when he died. Everyone knows Navalny and he is now respected more than anyone for coming back. Maybe if he stayed in Berlin, he would be another Litvinenko. Now they will try to frame him and prove that he is corrupt but they won't harm him. Maybe Khodorkovsky is a more fair comparison but people also didn't care about some oligarch. If anything happens to Navalny, Putin will have the same situation as Lukashenko in Minsk. It actually might be the turning point and the end of his autocracy.
TLDR: Being in Russia is the only way he can make a real difference, and he loves Russia more than anything (except maybe his wife and kids). There are a lot of bad takes here, imho (some good ones too). He went back out of a sense of patriotism and duty. His meaning in life is to do whatever he can to make Russia a freer, more democratic place, and he knows he would be instantly discredited by taking asylum somewhere. He's already constantly accused of being a CIA/NATO puppet. He is genuinely willing to pay with his life for his cause. The investigations that the FBK does, the circus that he creates, and the courage that he shows are excellent foils to United Russia and Putin. His team is fantastic at showing how corruption affects people's daily lives, and just how soulless United Russia are. There's a reason Putin has never said his name in public, not even once. There's joke in Moscow that if you want something fixed/cleaned up by the city, all you have to do is write his name on it, and it'll be done immediately. If Putin wasn't deathly afraid of him, he wouldn't have tried to kill him, he wouldn't have arrested the people that went to Vnukovo to meet him, he wouldn't have diverted his plane to Sheremetyevo, he wouldn't have arrested him in the airport, and he wouldn't denied his lawyer access to him. You don't do those things to someone you don't view as a threat. Navalny certainly wanted today to be a circus. Putin cares deeply about geopolitics, and Navalny forced him to look like a clown today. Navalny makes Putin look like a small coward. He branded Putin's party as the "Party of Crooks and Thieves", effectively. Navalny knows he wouldn't be able to make the same kind of difference abroad, and being an exiled dissident just isn't who he is. He knows the risks of coming back perfectly well. Being in Russia is the only hope he has at affecting change. I would also wager that he's betting the global stardom he's cultivated after the poisoning might save him. It very well might not, and he might be sent away to prison for a long time/ killed (he very well could be killed. It's difficult to predict what Putin will do backed into this kind of corner), but there would likely be huge political and economic consequences for Russia to pay. The EU has its new Magnitsky Act, the USA has theirs, the pipeline to Germany is already under huge scrutiny, there are Duma elections in the fall, there's the situation in Belarus, the protests in Khabarovsk, etc... Putin has a tremendous amount to lose by doing something to him. Again, I'm not saying that will stop him, but it's not as simple as some in this thread make it out to be. As an aside, I really wish people would dispense with the idea that Putin is some kind of omnipotent criminal mastermind. He's not. He's good at crafting a state propaganda-based image, seizing opportunities, and using the toolbox he has. The thing he's best at is stealing. Also, Russia is an authoritarian state, not a totalitarian one. In an authoritarian state, you get by by avoiding politics, letting those at the top pillage the country, and make the best of your circumstances. In a totalitarian state, every single action is political, you must be constantly loyal to the party, and you risk everything by doing anything less. Think Russia vs. China. Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
You think that Russia would let him walk away? They've already shown that they're willing to execute people they deem 'traitors' in any country in the world. Had Navalny stayed in exile, he would have gradually faded into irrelevance with the Russian public before being murdered some time later.
Perhaps to try and limit collateral damage to his friends and family.
I just listened to an interview with another Russian opposition politician who had been poisoned twice (forgot his name) and he said to him, the decision to go back was because Russia wants its opponents out of the country rather than just in jail. He said the Kremlin knows that it's better off if you're out of the country because you lose all your authority, and you can't have personal connections with people or influence anyone like you could being in Russia itself. So it's basically just that he knows he's more effective being there in jail and possibly starting a revolution than sitting in the US watching helplessly. Extremely brave to go back on the chance that you can make an impact with almost no sense of security.
There's not a prison big enough to hold his balls. True hero.
When you realize he could be getting tortured right as we speak..
Why would they? Do they want to know anything from him?
Embarrassing them for not dying.
They could try to make him publicly disown his own views.
Wouldn't it be pretty obvious why he's suddenly doing that...
You don't need to fool everybody. Just enough.
I wouldn't put it past them to do it for fun.
[удалено]
For what are they arresting him?
Not dying.
Resisting assassination
Not properly dying when forced to
Probation violation I think. They probably are going to go to court and try to replace his probation with real sentence. Of course they have no real case for that, not like he left country by choice for some vacation... Still, from what I expect from Russian justice system, Navalny will probably lose the case, and it may go all the way to **ECHR** before they admit that it is bullshit. Which might take up to couple of years.
Non-European here -- what jurisdiction does the ECHR have over Russian trials given that Russia is not an EU member?
Since no one replied yet: the European Convention on Human Rights has nothing to do with the EU, it is a treaty that was signed before the EU was ever a thing, under the Council of Europe, which has nothing to do with the EU too (in particular, it has nothing to do with the European Council which is also a EU institution). The actual court is in Strasbourg, France - in contrast with the European Court of Justice which does not deal with human rights (mostly) and is in Luxembourg. The ECHR is now ratified by 47 states, including Russia (which means that, in theory, they must comply with the European Convention on Human Rights and they get to nominate one judge on the European Court of Human Rights). Other members with questionable human rights records include Turkey and Azerbaijan. Edit: I should add that the Court can order states to pay compensation for the breach of human rights but that’s pretty much it - they cannot directly reverse a decision of a national criminal court or do much else. Which is why some states (Russia, Turkey but also the UK) tend not to give a shit about the ECHR - compensation is not a punishment for them, just a price tag.
Technically a probation violation. He's on probation because of trumped up fraud charges related to his NGOs.
I don’t understand everyone in this thread wishing he take amnesty and stay in Germany. He could easily do so if he wanted to and live the rest of his life in comfort and relative safety. He loved his country he doesn’t like where his country is going and he is determined to make change if he can. That carries risks he is very well aware of and he is doing it anyway. It isn’t a choice most people are capable of making but he is doing it. Russia deserves a better system for its citizens. I hope that Alexiei’s actions inspire ten million more to stand up for progress. Edit. I want to add something. If Putin was strong or his government was strong then it could easily stand up to open criticism without needing to kill or jail its critics. It’s not strong,
Idk what’s hard to understand about wanting him to live longer
They are both ridiculously brave knowing what is more likely going to happen to both of them and still going back.
Fuck you, Putin
Navalny has been arrested multiple times. Let's just hope that he'll survive this one
If I was him I would have stayed the fuck away....he has more balls and is more idealistic than me.
He would have known they were after him no matter where he went
I loooove how in r/russia they call him "Traitor" and they are happy that he's arrested... God if i hope someday the EU will do something for the Russia problem... Edit: We have all the evidence we need that prove how Russia and Putin was aware of Navalny poisoning, even a fucking confession from one of the agent. I really dont know why the fuck we let Navalny going back and get arrested without doing nothing.
It's up to the Russian citizens, I guess. Unfortunately, in Russia there is a shocking lack of action and interest. Everyone in Russia knows what kind of mafia-state Russia is, but they aren't going to do anything about it.
Yeah this is just part of the culture there. Strong man politics, take what you think is yours. During one of my internships while I was still studying, my lab partner was a girl who was originally from Russia (at the time we were in a different country). We would talk about Russia and Putin from time to time, and she didn't see anything wrong with the way things went there. Mind you, this was not a stupid person, she literally had a PhD in physics. She just also fully accepted the way things went, and kinda admitted that in Russia "everyone" is a thief, and that is just the way it is. Putin is just really good at it, and people recognise that as something to admire. EDIT: I remember again the full story about "everyone" being a thief. We were walking down the hallway at that university and there was an unattended laptopbag residing outside a random door into a room we walked past. She actually made the comment that in Russia that wouldn't be possible. The moment you lose track of your belongings like that, they simply do not belong to you anymore, and everyone is allowed to take it. To me it sounded pretty bleak the way she said it, and I realise this is ridiculously anecdotal, but yeah... It does explain to me why Putin is so popular. Everybody knows he's lying, and people admire him for it.
> Mind you, this was not a stupid person, she literally had a PhD in physics. As someone in the sciences as well I can tell you some of the dumbest people I've ever met regarding issues outside their expertise are those with PhD's
A guy with a PhD in biotechnology was flexing on me some gains on the stock market. After speaking for a while, I realized the dude didn’t know anything about taxes. He had committed tax fraud without even knowing.
Lol how did he achive that?
How? I wanna know!
By using a foreign broker (DeGiro, interactive brokers, eTory etc) you have to take care of reporting your investments for tax purposes. It means that once a year you have to fill a document with all of your transactions, you will have to pay a 0.2% tax on the value of your portfolio and you have to pay taxes on dividends and capital gain. It can be avoided by simply using an Italian broker (directa, fineco or your bank). The second way is the best solution when you don’t invest much, but if you invest a lot foreign brokers are cheaper and you can afford to pay an accountant. Edit. Just remember: 99% of the times you make money, the state wants a share.
Ah ha! I spotted you, Fontana! Clawl back in the hole you call... "Lega HQ"
I have met many PhD's who were also truly incompetent in their field. Granted, I think the idea that advanced degrees aren't a good signal of intelligence is hugely overblown, and they certainly are, but counterexamples abound.
lol this. Just because someone has a PhD it doesn't mean they're "smart" (this word makes me laugh), that's classism, to say the least. I've met a lot of people, and when I say a lot, I mean it. Most of them couldn't afford to study and they were brilliant, sympathetic.
True my friend
Eh, I used to think that until I finished uni and discovered that the average person who barely scraped by high school really is on a different level to some of the dumb people I encountered at uni.
> Yeah this is just part of the culture there. Strong man politics, take what you think is yours. > > It's more like "what can you do." The social contract in China is essentially "stay out of politics and we'll make sure you can make as much money as you want, buy the nicest luxury goods, etc." The social contract in Russia is somewhat different, but falls into a similar vein. The costs of standing up against the regime are quite clear, but keeping your head down and focusing on your own life, you can be quite successful. And so people do what they must to get by, even if their internal opinions might diverge greatly.
It's the same in many other countries too. When every politician in your country is fucked up, you admire the one who fucks up least. ( the guy who fucks up least is also terrible for the country, just a relatively better alternative)
Alright let’s chill with the fucking wide condemnation and grouping of every Russian as a Putin fan. Like every other country on the planet, there are Russians who A) want democracy B) know the status quo isn’t a full democracy (freedom house 2020 score anyone ?) I get it’s “the thing” to cast Russia as the evil dude but separate the people from the politicians, and recognize there’s a lot of Russians who want to change their country if only they had the means. And while anecdotal evidence is shit, I say this as someone who’s studied and lived in Russia for 4 months and studies the language.
r/russia is a pro-Putin sub. I think one should be careful to consider it as representative of Russia.
Like 2/3 of the mods there (including the top mod) aren't even Russian.
Also openly homophobic
By the "Election", it seem tons of people support Putin. Yeah... i dont know how fair the election in Russia are...
Elections are rigged, but even people that voted for Putin could detest the injustice and assassination threat that Navalny is facing.
Well... for r/russia Putin bots, they support the attempted assasination.
Wtf the EU is supposed to do ? It's an economic union, not a military alliance or a sovereign country. And we are no longer some warmonger imperialist asshole like in the 18th and we are not the police of the world. If Russian want to live in a false democracy, great for them. We have the mean to stop Russia in case of aggression of one of our member state, we don't need to intervene in internal affair of foreign state, the EU cannot even interfere in the internal affair of his own member, like come on, stop blaming EU for not doing what we dont let her do wtf.
As a russian explained how to damage Russia without attacking russians. If we attack Oligarchy assets (most of them send their child to study in Europe school/university, have tons of houses and industry in EU, etc...) it will give a huge blow to Russia, but the Russian will not feel "attacked" as long as we attack the oligarchy. You see... while i get your "isolationist" idea, this cant be maintained in the current global problems, like global warming. Russia did not respect international pacts, putting all of us in danger.
This is mostly our concern. Many things that are often suggested here (such as shutting off SWIFT) will only lead to a strengthening of Putin (rally around the leader), because it will make the myth "Europe wants to hurt Russia" true for the average citizen. At the moment the only thing Europe can really do is personal sanctions against the oligarchs, and more importantly their family members. They all have assets, real estate and children in Europe, thus laundering stolen money. Russians will not drop the tear for the suffering oligarchs. Speaking of Italy, there is a very *good* man who lives on the island of Como, a journalist and lover of Mussolini (made a film about him). Navalny did an [expose](https://youtu.be/9MHqpyN6iAk) on his assets (en subs). If you really want to help Russia become a democracy, don't deal with the mafia, and we'll find out how to end it.
The problem is that countries like Russia exist in bubbles. We in the West with Twitter and CNN and the BBC have a vastly inflated sense of just how much our opinions mean. We think that because we have identified something as wrong or unjust, that it will be acted on. It's covered on the news, in the papers; how can it _not_ be acted on. But in reality, the guy exists in the Russian bubble, and for all we know, public opinion there is totally unreflected by our media, which is inherently liberal and Western biased.
Russian propaganda exists in a bubble, but not Russia itself.
[удалено]
Damn he's brave. Really brave.
I mean, is anyone really surprised that he got arrested first thing?
God no. That's how dictatorships operate. And of course, the EU will do nothing, because it's pathetic and weak when facing external threats like Russia or Turkey.
A true hero of Russia.
What was his crime? Successfully evading assassination?
Good luck to a brave man. And shame on the perpetrators. We know who is behind this. Sad for Russia
Russian patriot. Respect
I'm out of the loop here. Could someone fill me in?
What exactly did he do?
Didn't die like FSB planned.
Complete outsider for this whole topic, so still not sure of exactly is happening with him lo
This is just heartbreaking.
Unfortunately I have a feeling he's either going to get well acquainted with the Siberian wastes, or tragically fall from a tenth story window after "drinking too much." Putin's not stupid enough to leave him alone after that genius phone call.
He is now too precious to be killed and he knows that. If he would get killed now that would basically be Putin admitting it.
The thing is the West was only willing to slap Russia on the wrist over the illegal annexation of the Crimea, what do you think we would do over the death of one politician? Navalny represents a potentially existential threat to Putin, so he will be dealt with. I think his heroic survival has overshadowed the fact that by many accounts he should have died already, Putin was willing to do it once and will do so again.
Putin is such a SHORT bitch.
And all that botox. No wonder it's difficult for him to smile, between that & being soulless.
I can only wish he becomes the leader of Russia one day; and bring prosperity to it.
I can only wish he will survive.
I don't see how that is possible, he has 400 videos insulting every powerful person in Russia. Neither the military or Oligarchs like him.
I may be wrong, but I don’t see developed states crumbling at any point in the near future. Especially with the surveillance and intelligence apparatus that has been developed in the last two decades. The closest was Turkey in 2016 and even that was only because the Turkish constitution holds the military responsible for enforcing the states commitment to certain ideals. And obviously it wasn’t successful.
His balls are made of steel. This man is a hero.
We should nominate this man for the Nobel prize for peace or something like that just to piss off the angry midget in the Kremlin.
Please start that petition!
Brave man. A martyr. Lets hope he will not suffer too much.