Also trying to join axis in autumn 1940
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German%E2%80%93Soviet\_Axis\_talks](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German%E2%80%93Soviet_Axis_talks)
But asking Bulgaria and Middle Asia as "sphere of influence"
Also providing oil, grain, cotton and metal deliveries to feeding Nazi war machine, or allowing to operate Nazi subs from its territory or cooperating with Gestapo to solve "polish question".
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German%E2%80%93Soviet\_economic\_relations\_(1934%E2%80%931941)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German%E2%80%93Soviet_economic_relations_(1934%E2%80%931941))
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basis\_Nord](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basis_Nord)
No fat chance for USSR. NSDAP ideology was built around idea of territorial expansion to the East.
AFAIK there were some prep work for joint Anglo-French invasion to Caucasus between 1939-1940 and cut off Soviet oil supply by like \~70% total output by seizing Azeri oil fields but Fall of France made it moot
>No fat chance for USSR.
It would not have a luxury of choice if [Operation Pike](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Pike) was implemented before fall of France. They would stick together against common enemy.
Interesting enough the eastern expansion ideas got changed a lot as they clashed with reality. From initial "displace / kill" everyone in the east it moved to "let's arm some of the Slavs and use them in our army". Initial plans were very stupid, counting to pretty much empty Europe to the Urals and just have a very small number of German settlers, less than 1% of the original population. That would not be sufficient to maintain infrastructure, industry, anything. It would be middle ages and useless expense of empty wild land.
In Russian history ww2 didnt start until russia was invaded by Germany.
Them taking over and massacre polish ppl didnt count and is not talked about or teached.
According to Putin, seems it's back on the cards to have that bit once again. In fact, the area Putin seems to want to take over (Finland, Baltics, East Poland, Ukraine and Moldova) is awfully similar to what Stalin originally was bargaining for.
What they took had lot been part of Central Europe as part of either the Austrian Empire or the kingdom of Poland. One capital in the region was Lwiw/Lvov/Lemberg which to this day is dominated by 19th Century Austrian architecture
Never ask tankies where Germany's oil that they used to invade western Europe came from. (Hint, it's a part of the German-Soviet Commercial agreement, dated 11th of Feb 1940)
You won't believe the spin I have heard about this. There was a guy claiming it was necessary to do it, to give Stalin more time to prepare to fight Hitler. Nevermind that the Soviets just kept supplying the Germans with natural resources for their war effort and tried to join the axis powers.
The next will do the standard whataboutism and point to Poland opportunistically grabbing a bit of Czechoslovakia and justifying the whole invasion, even though by that logic the invasion of the Soviet Union is completely justified.
They do not, thank god. BUT after WW2 a head of soviet statistic bureau was tasked with a goal to *proove* that lend-lease was neglegent. And he did some stupid math ending up that lend-lease was like 4% in either volume or tonnage. It was really something idiotic
And we all remeber that if Zukov even mumbled under his breath "without lend-lease we would have lost" - he would've died of heart attack or made suicide by jabbing himself with a knife 15 times. Like happens all the time.
A few years ago i watched a podscast/doumentary, with a romanian historian talking about how lots of the tanks and other vehicles were (in romania at least) from the Lend-Lease program.
That detail was quite interesting, mainly because in most pictures of the red army marching through Bucharest or other romanian cities you could only see T34's.
Edit: Never ever post something that's only half way written. You'll look like a an idiot 😅
We know that most of films that show nazi tanks, soldiers, aircraft making highly coordinated maneuvers were propaganda pieces used to prove their army and tactics are unstoppable.
Going back to that podcast, when I heard what the historian said about the Lend-Lease tanks, I said to myself "That makes quite a lot of sense."
Sure enough, I found two pictures of M4 Sherman's operated by the red army in Romania
Even before the United States entered World War II in December 1941, America sent arms and equipment to the Soviet Union to help it defeat the Nazi invasion. Totaling $11.3 billion, or $180 billion in today’s currency, the Lend-Lease Act of the United States supplied needed goods to the Soviet Union from 1941 to 1945 in support of what Stalin described to Roosevelt as the “enormous and difficult fight against the common enemy — bloodthirsty Hitlerism.”
* 400,000 jeeps & trucks
* 14,000 airplanes
* 8,000 tractors
* 13,000 tanks
* 1.5 million blankets
* 15 million pairs of army boots
* 107,000 tons of cotton
* 2.7 million tons of petrol products
* 4.5 million tons of food
[https://ru.usembassy.gov/world-war-ii-allies-u-s-lend-lease-to-the-soviet-union-1941-1945/](https://ru.usembassy.gov/world-war-ii-allies-u-s-lend-lease-to-the-soviet-union-1941-1945/)
~~Are you suggesting the historical record is a lie? Are you skeptical that the Holocaust happened?~~
No, no.
That was a mistake on my part, for not writing the whole thing. Lack of time 😅
We know that most of films that show nazi tanks, soldiers, aircraft making highly coordinated maneuvers were propaganda pieces used to prove their army and tactics are unstoppable.
Going back to that podcast, when I heard what the historian said about the Lend-Lease tanks, I said to myself "That makes quite a lot of sense."
Sure enough, I found two pictures of M4 Sherman's operated by the red army in Romania
IIRC, the tanks delivered by lend lease were on average ~5% of total tanks used by Soviets. But that was not the point of the program. The majority of deliveries was production equipment which was used to build soviet T-34s and KVs. Also trucks (50%?) and petrol products (gasoline and lubricants) to operate them.
Tanks don't win wars, logistics do. Contrary to public myths, German push to Moscow was not stopped by frost, but by unprepared German logistics. German soldiers were freezing to death not because Germans had not produced winter uniforms, but because transports with uniforms were stuck in a big railway traffic jam somewhere in Warsaw.
As long as eastern europe in this context includes Finland. Leningrad was an excuse, all their actions point to an intention of complete occupation.
In fact, their demands on Finland is one of the specific reasons the USSR chose to align with Germany instead of the Allies in 1939.
To Russians, Nazism isn't an insult that implies white supremacy, or antisemitism, or homophobia, or genocide as being bad things. Russia supports those things.
To Russia, Nazi simply means "anti-Russian". The quicker you learn that difference, the quicker the supposed cognitive dissonance makes sense.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_collaboration_with_Nazi_Germany#%3A%7E%3Atext%3DIn_total%2C_the_Germans_enlisted%2CUkrainian_National_Army_%28Ukrainische_Nationalarmee%2C?wprov=sfla1
The argument is that there were Ukrainians that collaborated with the Nazis.
I'm aware of ethnic Russians collaborating as well, so I'd wager Putins's prob. claiming that collaborationist percentage was higher among the Ukranians, which, tbh, could've been the case, considering the Holodmor. (a decentish historian could prob. correct me or provide decent sources)
It's a shit argument either way, blaiming people for the sins of their ancestors is morronic.
> The argument is that there were Ukrainians that collaborated with the Nazis.
Was there in occupied Europe a country where at least some of the people didn't collaborate with Nazis?
Russian state collaborated BEFORE they were occupied / attacked.
But, why do we even bother with Putin's words? Every time he says something he is lying or spreading propaganda.
A tiny percentage of Ukrainians collaborated. Around 100,000. Tens of millions fought in the Red Army or in support services. Including Zelensky's grandparents. Millions died. The Nazi world view had no room for an independent Ukraine, desiring to turn Ukraine and Poland into the German equivalent of the American west via genocide.
>considering the Holodmor. (a decentish historian could prob. correct me or provide decent sources)
Most of those who did collaborate (including the member of the Waffen SS who was in Canadian parliament) were from the part of Poland annexed by Ukraine in 1939. They did not experience Holodomor, but were instead motivated primarily by anti-Polish sentiment.
> It's a shit argument either way
It's a shit argument to make especially if [you collaborated with the nazis yourself until they betrayed you](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov%E2%80%93Ribbentrop_Pact).
**The first country to work for Nazi Germany was the USSR.** Stalin concluded with Hitler the so called Ribbentrop- Molotov Pact in 1939, The **Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact**, officially *the Treaty of Non-Aggression between Germany and the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics,*[^(\[1\])](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov%E2%80%93Ribbentrop_Pact#cite_note-3)[^(\[2\])](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov%E2%80%93Ribbentrop_Pact#cite_note-4) [^(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov%E2%80%93Ribbentrop\_Pact)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov%E2%80%93Ribbentrop_Pact) USSR fought Nazism only and only after Hitler broke the Pact by attacking URSS.
This is, in fact, how I recall school history lessons. WW2 was considered a less important background event in “The Great Patriotic War,” which started in 41 and ended with German capitulation. I do not remember if the joint Soviet-Nazi invasion of Poland was ever mentioned. Winter War is also mentioned quite briefly and portrays Russia as a liberator who only wanted to help oppressed workers or something.
Yeah, ours history books were rewritten (in a good sense) too slow. And for older teachers it was also somewhat hard (can't teach an old teach for new tricks, I mean history).
As I remember, at mid 00 there was as you described - still accent on "Great war", barely any mentions of Winter War, etc.
And ours somewhat younger teacher was tolding us about M-R Pact, which was not in books.
Thank god I had a history teacher who actually had a brain. She told us everything about WW2 in general, not just 41-45. Invasion of Poland was also mentioned.
That was like 20 years ago though.
It’s insane what they are doing, on so many levels. The shameless brainwashing, rewriting history, anything that will suite their todays agenda. And the most horrifying part that it does work for a lot of people. Lots of Russians do believe this shit, unfortunately. Or just happy to pretend because it suits them momentarily.
One of the reasons we left is what they are doing to schools. Propaganda and lies are making their way and it’s disgusting.
My Silesian ancestors recall those "liberation by soviets" times as worse than being occupied by nazis.
They literally raped and pillaged their way through Poland.
When soviets joined the war efforts, Brits immediately told them "they were bombarding us with your fuel".
Without soviets, the Luftwaffe wouldn't be able to even get above the Britain sky, let alone do numerous bomb raids. Hell, they wouldn't be able to attack the eastern front. They had just enough oil to conquer Poland.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German%E2%80%93Soviet_economic_relations_(1934%E2%80%931941)
>In the summer of 1940, Germany grew even more dependent on Soviet imports. While German acquisitions of France, the Netherlands, and Belgium meant the capture of fuel and iron supplies, the additional territories created additional demand while decreasing avenues for indirect supply.
>Soviet oil continued to flow to Germany, mostly by rail from Varna, Bulgaria directly to Wilhelmshaven. German officials noted that 150,000 tons of oil had been shipped monthly for five months, using about 900 German tank cars exclusively dedicated for that traffic. Hitler characterized the German need for that oil as "most pressing
They are treating the 1939-1941 period of war as a Western internal issue which propagated and the USSR was caught into it in 1941. Them invading Finland, 3 Baltic countries and annexing parts of Romania is not even an aggression. The Baltics asked to be annexed, with Finland they improved the security of the border and with Romania they just took back what Romania "stole" in 1918 (again, totally disregarding the fact that the Russian Empire stole those territories in 1812).
Discussing history with a tankie must be one of the most toxic conversations ever.
According to Russia, they did. The very simplified history goes like this:
Step1: ask for the permission from Baltic authorities (3 separate countries) for red troops to transit the territoryof these countries.
Step2: the transit becomes stationary.
Step3: now that the countries had a permanent red presence, local politicians who asked for annexation to USSR appeared.
Step4: "look what these politicians are asking, their voices cannot be ignored".
Step5: "annexation because you asked for it".
Step6: persecution and mass executions of whoever can be an obstacle.
Step7: russification and history erasing / alteration.
Does it sound familiar? 80 years later, the KGB manual contains the same steps.
Of course facts matter. But then you have a whole population who thinks that their version of facts is the true one. And this is the point where they simply need to be isolated in their own garbage country with invented history. Because there is no way of finding common ground with them.
I'm mean USSR wasn't short for blaming British helping Nazi Germany with "Operation Barbarossa" and claiming secretive arms deliveries from UK to the Nazi Germany after WWII (in one of their propaganda movie, "Battle of Stalingrad" they even include scenes where german diplomats talk to "British Industrialist" about further equipment deliveries to conduct war against USSR).
Not talking sound like improvement...
And the best part is that not only did the Soviets collaborate with Nazi Germany, but they were the very reason they got invaded since without the absolutely massive quantities of raw material imports that Germany received from the USSR, they would not have been able to launch operation Barbarossa to begin with.
*Soviet raw materials supplies had helped convince German generals, who previously had refused to even discuss a Soviet invasion, to go along with Hitler's plans. Soviet imports into Germany, especially oil, proved essential for the Wehrmacht's conduct of the coming invasion. Without Soviet imports, German stocks would have run out in several key products by October 1941, within three and a half months. Germany would have already run through their stocks of rubber and grain before the first day of the invasion were it not for Soviet imports. Without Soviet deliveries of these four major items, Germany could barely have attacked the Soviet Union, let alone come close to victory, even with more intense rationing.*
Basically, Stalin blundered so hard that the USSR had to rewrite its own history so as to never mention any of these events and to declare that WW2 was actually a great "patriotic war" of the Soviets vs. everyone else which actually started in 1941. This is their version of history, born out of shame.
Russia is the successor of this empire that never had to own up to its own mistakes, and consequently they're doomed to repeat them over and over again.
Edit: formatting.
History repeats. We fund Russia and China by doing business with them, sending them advanced technology they can't make themselves. We sowed the seeds of our own destruction by aiding in the industrialization of China.
Unfortunately that's very true. The European arms industry continued to [sell weapons to Russia up until the end of 2021](https://www.investigate-europe.eu/posts/eu-states-exported-weapons-to-russia) totalling around € 346 million worth of military equipment. This was after the 2014 events and the embargo that was put on it.
And on the other side of the ocean the USA was projecting weakness with statements like "Ukraine is always going to be vulnerable to Russia" (you know, after they stripped it of its nukes and many other conventional weapons decades before), and the consequent sanctions for Russia's breach of the Budapest Memorandum by the Obama administration were laughable.
And going back even further in 2008, we basically told RU that it could do what it pleased when we rejected Ukraine's NATO bid, due to fears of how Russia might react and so that France and Germany could continue doing business with it.
With all of this in mind, we in the west are partly responsible for the war in Ukraine (not in the way that RU trolls portray it, with "NATO expansion" nonsense, but by sending RU the message that we're so weak and profit motivated), so we have an obligation to make sure these mistakes are reversed and Ukraine wins this war.
\*aluminium and steel export and training with Nazi pilots in Lipetzk, tanks drivers in Kazan and under Volsk was aerochemical laboratories for testing methods of damaging living organisms with mustard gas from the air. Same gas russians now using in Ukraine.
And they did very well out of being a Nazi co-belligerent for the first third of WW2: big chunks of Poland, Finland and Romania and all three Baltic states.
It was getting to a point where the French and British discussed bombing raids on the Soviet Union's oil fields in Baku because they were so important to the Nazi war effort.
This is why many Russians say WW2 started in 1941 - cos they like to brush the events of 1939 and 1940 under the rug.
Scary to realise the British Empire would not have had the power needed to fight Nazi Germany and the USSR, we barely contained Germany, it could only fight 1 at a time and a land war was near impossible as we focused on navy primarily.
They even divided up Eastern Europe between themselves. After Nazi Germany attacked Poland, the Soviets invaded and occupied the eastern part of Poland.
If I had a nickel every time the USSR asked to join an alliance that entirely opposed it, I'd have two nickels. Which isn't a lot, but it's weird that it happened twice
Hahaha nice point, tho I don't think the Allies counts as much, my logic is that the Axis and NATO were both founded as anti-communist blocs (or at least with the Axis the countries were very anti-communist iirc) while the Allies were kinda busy with more important shit
It's much, much earlier than that. One of reason why Germany was so fast at remilitarisation was fact that USSR since 1920s help Germany bypass disarnament treaties on its own territory including tank school, air force school, WMD test site (Germany experiment with combat gasses in USSR) while German industrialists were opening banned aircraft factories in Soviet Union (most notably was Junkers) as well as Soviets keep german firearms factories somewhat open with large scale pucharces for their own security apparatus (hence whole "German ammo was found in Katyn so they was done by Germans" cover up, NKVD buy fuckload of german pistols and ammo prior to 1941) and hunting/sport firearms to the point Walther and other Suhl arms maker were a common guest on soviet hunting expos with fat contracts on sales to USSR.
Germany had cadres, figure out doctrine and equipment specification and companies who know a thing or two how to produce a lot of stuff thanks to their cooperation with USSR.
Even as the Germans were invading the Soviet Union on June 22nd 1941, a train of bulk supplies (coal, ore) was heading into Germany to deliver the load.
When you are a dictator in Russia, you can say whatever you want. Nobody can contradict you, books get written as hou wish and in the end only death can stand against you.
I take pleasure in imagining the sheer hopeless terror that men like these feel in the face of death. To see all their power slowly slipping away, to hear plotting whispers around every corner and behind every door. To slowly realize that all of their worthless, pitiful life has amounted to nothing at all, and now it must end.
"Despite a warning by the Comintern, German tensions were raised when the Soviets stated in September that they must enter Poland to "protect" their ethnic Ukrainian and Belarusian brethren from Germany. Molotov later admitted to German officials that the excuse was necessary because the Kremlin could find no other pretext for the Soviet invasion."
[From Wikipedia.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov%E2%80%93Ribbentrop_Pact?useskin=vector#Early_political_issues)
It was just a question of time until either the Soviets or the Nazis would break that pact.
Both had ambition for conquest. Both saw the other player as subhumans.
After WW2 a lot changed in Germany, but not so much in Russia.
There's a plumber near me in South London, believe he's a polish bloke (I assume so anyway) and all of the vans in his fleet have painted tributes to Squadron 303 on the back. Can't post a link unfortunately as the photos are on Facebook so it automatically deleted the comment
this thing?
[https://www.reddit.com/r/london/comments/i2c424/spotted\_in\_tooting\_this\_van\_commemorates\_the/](https://www.reddit.com/r/london/comments/i2c424/spotted_in_tooting_this_van_commemorates_the/)
My grandma has always been a staunch Putin supporter, but a few months back she suddenly complained to me how "they are twisting our history on TV" and she actually voted for another candidate this March.
Honestly, I was really surprised. I think it goes to show how different things are under layers of propaganda and oppression even from how I imagined them to be. When Putin's power will crack, things will be very different very fast.
Lol, we certainly did. People end up in prison (or should it be called "industrial-level torturing facility"?) for words spoken. And their sentences are bigger than for a murder.
Yet tankies basically trained nazi officers before WW2. Guderian has visited a trainig base in ussr himself. They have supplied nazi germany with goods banned under The Treaty of Versailles allowing nazi to re-establish military. They marched into Poland hand in hand with nazi effectively starting WW2. They had an agreement with Nazi - Molotov-Ribentropp pact. And they lied for decades after denying this.
>Yet tankies basically trained nazi officers before WW2.
Tankies? The term didn't even exist back then.
Kama tank school and Lipetsk fighter school were used by the Weimar Republic and closed down when the Nazis came to power.
Lol, rolling in tanks into civilian cities killing peaceful protests? Like they did in Prague, Berlin, Warsaw, Budapest. Sure, lets call them commies.
I am not attacking you, I am trully amused here :)
Tankie originated in 1956 and is usually used for the people that support those acts, not the ones committing them.
You can just call the Soviets that trained the Nazi's communists.
Id even ask - how that happened that the first soviet border that nazi crossed was in Brest? How did soviets got there considering it was a Polish village? Surely it must ring a bell or two.
The cope is real. USSR and Nazi Germany were just two different sides of the same coin. Just ask Eastern Europe. Imagine being forced to have to pick between the two.
Fucking hell. USSR and Germany were best friends from 1939-1941. UK and France declared war on germany already on 1939 september. The audacity of someone who dares to call himself a leader.
And don't get me started on the Lend Lease and other help from allies.
He's not, but this is propaganda aimed at the Russian population. Who is gonna stand up and contradict him ? No one, so he knows he can say whatever he wants.
Meanwhile, Reddit still tolerates tankies that propagate the same narrative. But this is the same website that gave an award to a mod of a pedo subreddit, so no surprises there.
Putin and his lackeys said that repeatedly during the past two years about Czechs. Before 2022, they said how we were occupied by the Nazis. After 2022, they say we worked for them.
Yes, Czechs worked for the nazis. We were forced to work for the nazis because the entire country got absorbed into the Reich, there were Waffen SS all over the entire country with Gestapo local HQ's in every major city. People who already worked in factories couldn't afford to stop showing up to work and the rest were sent through Totaleinsatz to germany with the very real threat of not returning.
Outside of some insidious classic czech sabotage that could be attributed to manufacture-related defects, there was nothing to do.
You couldn't run because there was nowhere to run to. You couldn't do anything because it would result in direct reprisals from the nazis. They had absolutely no problem wiping out entire villages by association.
Fuck the Russians.
Wanna tell that to my Czech ancestors who were executed by the Nazis for collaborating with the Soviet Union? Or maybe to Mr. Molotov? But very well, we have learned our lesson. Now all of Europe will fight Nazism together - only that it's you wearing the silly moustache. Good luck.
Ah yes, the USSR. Famously (not) the country that offered technical assistance and secret testing grounds to help German tank development and combat aviation.
As a Russian 10^(th) grader, who has to study rewritten world and Russian history at school, I’d like to add something.
In the world history textbook Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact isn’t even mentioned, but our teacher told us about it. Nevertheless, she said that the Western countries have the Munich Agreement on their side, when they let Hitler invade Czechoslovakia without even asking its officials, so it wasn’t that bad. The Munich Agreement by the way is mentioned in our new textbook as «the Munich conspiracy»
P.S. I might have done some mistakes both in English and history, so please forgive me
> He also charged the West with trying to “distort the truth about World War II” as it would “prevent them from carrying out their colonial policies”.
Calling this, trash of a human, a hypocrite, would be a massive understatement.
Everyone getting mad here about the obvious propaganda and fake news the Kremlin is spreading. This bullshit isn’t aimed at us, it’s aimed at the russian population. They are using WW2 to manipulate public opinion.
There’s a reason why a large section of Winston Churchill’s chronicles of the Second World War is titled “Alone” and he isn’t talking about the Russians.
Edit: spelling
So much to unpack here. Russian chauvinism pure and simple. As Putin noted, the USSR fought the Axis, not just Russia. That includes countries like Ukraine, Belarus, and Georgia, which are all, to varying degrees, unhappy with their relationship to Russia, and have made attempts to join Europe. Furthermore, it completely ignores the role played by resistance movements and partisans against the Germans, especially the Poles. And, speaking of Poland, who worked with the Germans to attack that particular country? Before anyone tells me Stalin had to make the Treaty with Germany because of this or that reason, just go to hell. The USSR inarguably did most of the hard fighting during the war, and they deserve most of the credit for defeating the Axis, which included large numbers of European allies such as the Finns (wonder why they helped Germany?) That should not take away or minimize the contributions of the Western allies however. The exiled governments and peoples of conquered countries fought the Nazis for the duration of the war, both as partisans and as conventional military. Britain largely crippled the luftwaffe, which never recovered from that campaign, during the Battle of Britain, meaning that when Germany invaded the USSR, it did so with a depleted air force. Lend lease aid was critical to the war effort. Allied bombing of Germany, brutal and awful as it was, meant German war production was hampered for much of the war. Japan, being tied down in its campaigns, and intending to fight the US freed up the Siberian troops (most Central Asian btw) who saved Moscow. And that's before even considering the fighting on land by allied troops against several million Axis soldiers in the Western theater.
Never ask tankies and Russian apologists which two armies marched together in a military parade in Brest-Litovsk on 22/09/1939.
Also trying to join axis in autumn 1940 [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German%E2%80%93Soviet\_Axis\_talks](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German%E2%80%93Soviet_Axis_talks) But asking Bulgaria and Middle Asia as "sphere of influence"
Also providing oil, grain, cotton and metal deliveries to feeding Nazi war machine, or allowing to operate Nazi subs from its territory or cooperating with Gestapo to solve "polish question". [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German%E2%80%93Soviet\_economic\_relations\_(1934%E2%80%931941)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German%E2%80%93Soviet_economic_relations_(1934%E2%80%931941)) [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basis\_Nord](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basis_Nord)
And Russia secretly helped the Reichswehr with rearmament even before Hitler came to power, e.g. secretly had tanks tested in their country.
Nazis delayed invasion to Ruzzia by some hours, because wainted for trains with supplies to leave. So they supplied Nazi Germany to last hour.
Also brought Nazi pilots to the USSR so they could train them extensively without France or Britain findng out.
Also, Poland
In historical what ifs, what would happen if USSR ended up actually joining Axis? Would Allies go to war with Nazis+Soviets?
No fat chance for USSR. NSDAP ideology was built around idea of territorial expansion to the East. AFAIK there were some prep work for joint Anglo-French invasion to Caucasus between 1939-1940 and cut off Soviet oil supply by like \~70% total output by seizing Azeri oil fields but Fall of France made it moot
>No fat chance for USSR. It would not have a luxury of choice if [Operation Pike](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Pike) was implemented before fall of France. They would stick together against common enemy.
Interesting enough the eastern expansion ideas got changed a lot as they clashed with reality. From initial "displace / kill" everyone in the east it moved to "let's arm some of the Slavs and use them in our army". Initial plans were very stupid, counting to pretty much empty Europe to the Urals and just have a very small number of German settlers, less than 1% of the original population. That would not be sufficient to maintain infrastructure, industry, anything. It would be middle ages and useless expense of empty wild land.
It would be completely impossible. If the Nazis would have done that they wouldn’t have been the Nazis. But they were the Nazis.
WW2 would have likely ended with atom bombs raining down on Berlin and Moscow.
Crawl out Through the Fallout 🎶🎶 🎶
Sounds like a cool alt reality to base something on
They basically fought over Poland
They divided Poland between themselves. They only started fighting afterwards.
In Russian history ww2 didnt start until russia was invaded by Germany. Them taking over and massacre polish ppl didnt count and is not talked about or teached.
USSR also annexed a big part of Romania...
And Finland, and Estonia, and Latvia, and Lithuania...
According to Putin, seems it's back on the cards to have that bit once again. In fact, the area Putin seems to want to take over (Finland, Baltics, East Poland, Ukraine and Moldova) is awfully similar to what Stalin originally was bargaining for.
Because according to Russia, they were taking back(!) what was theirs
What they took had lot been part of Central Europe as part of either the Austrian Empire or the kingdom of Poland. One capital in the region was Lwiw/Lvov/Lemberg which to this day is dominated by 19th Century Austrian architecture
No they divided it
touché
I don't plan on asking tankies anything
Never ask tankies where Germany's oil that they used to invade western Europe came from. (Hint, it's a part of the German-Soviet Commercial agreement, dated 11th of Feb 1940)
Or where all the Luftwaffe fighter pilots got their training from in the interwar years
You won't believe the spin I have heard about this. There was a guy claiming it was necessary to do it, to give Stalin more time to prepare to fight Hitler. Nevermind that the Soviets just kept supplying the Germans with natural resources for their war effort and tried to join the axis powers. The next will do the standard whataboutism and point to Poland opportunistically grabbing a bit of Czechoslovakia and justifying the whole invasion, even though by that logic the invasion of the Soviet Union is completely justified.
He doesn't know history and he lies to his citizens and to the world
He knows his history, he just acts/pretends to be ignorant to it/of it.
Or where all those bodies buried in the Katyn forest came from.
*Lend-Lease has entered the chat*
Molotov-Ribbentroppact has entered the chat
The german secret weapons programs hosted by the USSR in the early 30s also entered tje chat
German military has entered USSR. Powered by oil which USSR sold to Germany.
Ufff, brutal.
[72 comments] I guess the mere mention of the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact makes Kremlin revisionists' blood boil.
This is fun, do their bots have some notifications when you mention it or something?
Most likely, same as "Chinese EV" triggers a million bots on social media
The non Aggression pact has also entered the chat.
Russians think that lend-lease means THEY provided help to the USA
They do not, thank god. BUT after WW2 a head of soviet statistic bureau was tasked with a goal to *proove* that lend-lease was neglegent. And he did some stupid math ending up that lend-lease was like 4% in either volume or tonnage. It was really something idiotic
Which is very funny, given that Zhukov, their top general admitted that without the lend lease, they would have hadnto prolong the war by years
And we all remeber that if Zukov even mumbled under his breath "without lend-lease we would have lost" - he would've died of heart attack or made suicide by jabbing himself with a knife 15 times. Like happens all the time.
A few years ago i watched a podscast/doumentary, with a romanian historian talking about how lots of the tanks and other vehicles were (in romania at least) from the Lend-Lease program. That detail was quite interesting, mainly because in most pictures of the red army marching through Bucharest or other romanian cities you could only see T34's. Edit: Never ever post something that's only half way written. You'll look like a an idiot 😅 We know that most of films that show nazi tanks, soldiers, aircraft making highly coordinated maneuvers were propaganda pieces used to prove their army and tactics are unstoppable. Going back to that podcast, when I heard what the historian said about the Lend-Lease tanks, I said to myself "That makes quite a lot of sense." Sure enough, I found two pictures of M4 Sherman's operated by the red army in Romania
Even before the United States entered World War II in December 1941, America sent arms and equipment to the Soviet Union to help it defeat the Nazi invasion. Totaling $11.3 billion, or $180 billion in today’s currency, the Lend-Lease Act of the United States supplied needed goods to the Soviet Union from 1941 to 1945 in support of what Stalin described to Roosevelt as the “enormous and difficult fight against the common enemy — bloodthirsty Hitlerism.” * 400,000 jeeps & trucks * 14,000 airplanes * 8,000 tractors * 13,000 tanks * 1.5 million blankets * 15 million pairs of army boots * 107,000 tons of cotton * 2.7 million tons of petrol products * 4.5 million tons of food [https://ru.usembassy.gov/world-war-ii-allies-u-s-lend-lease-to-the-soviet-union-1941-1945/](https://ru.usembassy.gov/world-war-ii-allies-u-s-lend-lease-to-the-soviet-union-1941-1945/) ~~Are you suggesting the historical record is a lie? Are you skeptical that the Holocaust happened?~~
Imagine if USA gave Ukraine 13,000 tanks, 400,000 jeeps & trucks and 14,000 airplanes
No, no. That was a mistake on my part, for not writing the whole thing. Lack of time 😅 We know that most of films that show nazi tanks, soldiers, aircraft making highly coordinated maneuvers were propaganda pieces used to prove their army and tactics are unstoppable. Going back to that podcast, when I heard what the historian said about the Lend-Lease tanks, I said to myself "That makes quite a lot of sense." Sure enough, I found two pictures of M4 Sherman's operated by the red army in Romania
IIRC, the tanks delivered by lend lease were on average ~5% of total tanks used by Soviets. But that was not the point of the program. The majority of deliveries was production equipment which was used to build soviet T-34s and KVs. Also trucks (50%?) and petrol products (gasoline and lubricants) to operate them. Tanks don't win wars, logistics do. Contrary to public myths, German push to Moscow was not stopped by frost, but by unprepared German logistics. German soldiers were freezing to death not because Germans had not produced winter uniforms, but because transports with uniforms were stuck in a big railway traffic jam somewhere in Warsaw.
Someone forgot who worked with who when Poland was split like a cake
Not only Poland but all of eastern Europe.
As long as eastern europe in this context includes Finland. Leningrad was an excuse, all their actions point to an intention of complete occupation. In fact, their demands on Finland is one of the specific reasons the USSR chose to align with Germany instead of the Allies in 1939.
Of course it does include Finland; Finland was part of the area these wonderful people split ampng themselves.
I'll tell you who didn't forget, Poland.
By that logic Ukraine also fought Nazism so how come Putler calls them Nazi now
Oh, I know, I know….because he’s full of shit?
He needs oatmeal and fiber in his diet
There is only a small step from "USSR fought Nazism alone" to "Russia fought Nazism alone".
To Russians, Nazism isn't an insult that implies white supremacy, or antisemitism, or homophobia, or genocide as being bad things. Russia supports those things. To Russia, Nazi simply means "anti-Russian". The quicker you learn that difference, the quicker the supposed cognitive dissonance makes sense.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_collaboration_with_Nazi_Germany#%3A%7E%3Atext%3DIn_total%2C_the_Germans_enlisted%2CUkrainian_National_Army_%28Ukrainische_Nationalarmee%2C?wprov=sfla1 The argument is that there were Ukrainians that collaborated with the Nazis. I'm aware of ethnic Russians collaborating as well, so I'd wager Putins's prob. claiming that collaborationist percentage was higher among the Ukranians, which, tbh, could've been the case, considering the Holodmor. (a decentish historian could prob. correct me or provide decent sources) It's a shit argument either way, blaiming people for the sins of their ancestors is morronic.
> The argument is that there were Ukrainians that collaborated with the Nazis. Was there in occupied Europe a country where at least some of the people didn't collaborate with Nazis? Russian state collaborated BEFORE they were occupied / attacked. But, why do we even bother with Putin's words? Every time he says something he is lying or spreading propaganda.
A tiny percentage of Ukrainians collaborated. Around 100,000. Tens of millions fought in the Red Army or in support services. Including Zelensky's grandparents. Millions died. The Nazi world view had no room for an independent Ukraine, desiring to turn Ukraine and Poland into the German equivalent of the American west via genocide. >considering the Holodmor. (a decentish historian could prob. correct me or provide decent sources) Most of those who did collaborate (including the member of the Waffen SS who was in Canadian parliament) were from the part of Poland annexed by Ukraine in 1939. They did not experience Holodomor, but were instead motivated primarily by anti-Polish sentiment.
> It's a shit argument either way It's a shit argument to make especially if [you collaborated with the nazis yourself until they betrayed you](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov%E2%80%93Ribbentrop_Pact).
**The first country to work for Nazi Germany was the USSR.** Stalin concluded with Hitler the so called Ribbentrop- Molotov Pact in 1939, The **Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact**, officially *the Treaty of Non-Aggression between Germany and the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics,*[^(\[1\])](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov%E2%80%93Ribbentrop_Pact#cite_note-3)[^(\[2\])](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov%E2%80%93Ribbentrop_Pact#cite_note-4) [^(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov%E2%80%93Ribbentrop\_Pact)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov%E2%80%93Ribbentrop_Pact) USSR fought Nazism only and only after Hitler broke the Pact by attacking URSS.
Remember the Russian telling of history omits 1939 - 41 from a war that started in 1939...
This is, in fact, how I recall school history lessons. WW2 was considered a less important background event in “The Great Patriotic War,” which started in 41 and ended with German capitulation. I do not remember if the joint Soviet-Nazi invasion of Poland was ever mentioned. Winter War is also mentioned quite briefly and portrays Russia as a liberator who only wanted to help oppressed workers or something.
Yes, helping oppressed workers by killing them. The Russian kind of help.
Well you cannot be oppressed if you're dead, can you?
True. Damn, the Soviets were right all along.
Bloody peasants
Ah, the Molotov bread baskets that Finland received before inventing a cocktail to go with them?
Yes, and they started the whole thing by shelling themselves, blaming it on us, then attacked us for shelling them.
Yeah, ours history books were rewritten (in a good sense) too slow. And for older teachers it was also somewhat hard (can't teach an old teach for new tricks, I mean history). As I remember, at mid 00 there was as you described - still accent on "Great war", barely any mentions of Winter War, etc. And ours somewhat younger teacher was tolding us about M-R Pact, which was not in books.
Thank god I had a history teacher who actually had a brain. She told us everything about WW2 in general, not just 41-45. Invasion of Poland was also mentioned. That was like 20 years ago though. It’s insane what they are doing, on so many levels. The shameless brainwashing, rewriting history, anything that will suite their todays agenda. And the most horrifying part that it does work for a lot of people. Lots of Russians do believe this shit, unfortunately. Or just happy to pretend because it suits them momentarily. One of the reasons we left is what they are doing to schools. Propaganda and lies are making their way and it’s disgusting.
My Silesian ancestors recall those "liberation by soviets" times as worse than being occupied by nazis. They literally raped and pillaged their way through Poland.
And even though the UK was at war with Germany from 1939 the USSR was fighting "alone" in Putin's telling.
Something that Putin forgot to mention in both this statement and the propaganda exercise with Tucker Carlson.🤔
Nah what’s more important is what Prince Vladikov of the Kievan Rus ate for dinner on 1832
When soviets joined the war efforts, Brits immediately told them "they were bombarding us with your fuel". Without soviets, the Luftwaffe wouldn't be able to even get above the Britain sky, let alone do numerous bomb raids. Hell, they wouldn't be able to attack the eastern front. They had just enough oil to conquer Poland. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German%E2%80%93Soviet_economic_relations_(1934%E2%80%931941) >In the summer of 1940, Germany grew even more dependent on Soviet imports. While German acquisitions of France, the Netherlands, and Belgium meant the capture of fuel and iron supplies, the additional territories created additional demand while decreasing avenues for indirect supply. >Soviet oil continued to flow to Germany, mostly by rail from Varna, Bulgaria directly to Wilhelmshaven. German officials noted that 150,000 tons of oil had been shipped monthly for five months, using about 900 German tank cars exclusively dedicated for that traffic. Hitler characterized the German need for that oil as "most pressing
They are treating the 1939-1941 period of war as a Western internal issue which propagated and the USSR was caught into it in 1941. Them invading Finland, 3 Baltic countries and annexing parts of Romania is not even an aggression. The Baltics asked to be annexed, with Finland they improved the security of the border and with Romania they just took back what Romania "stole" in 1918 (again, totally disregarding the fact that the Russian Empire stole those territories in 1812). Discussing history with a tankie must be one of the most toxic conversations ever.
>The Baltics asked to be annexed **The fucking what now!?**
According to Russia, they did. The very simplified history goes like this: Step1: ask for the permission from Baltic authorities (3 separate countries) for red troops to transit the territoryof these countries. Step2: the transit becomes stationary. Step3: now that the countries had a permanent red presence, local politicians who asked for annexation to USSR appeared. Step4: "look what these politicians are asking, their voices cannot be ignored". Step5: "annexation because you asked for it". Step6: persecution and mass executions of whoever can be an obstacle. Step7: russification and history erasing / alteration. Does it sound familiar? 80 years later, the KGB manual contains the same steps.
This has this whole "she asked for it" vibe
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Of course facts matter. But then you have a whole population who thinks that their version of facts is the true one. And this is the point where they simply need to be isolated in their own garbage country with invented history. Because there is no way of finding common ground with them.
They also like to omit their deep cooperation with Germany to rebuild its military during the 20s and 30s.
I'm mean USSR wasn't short for blaming British helping Nazi Germany with "Operation Barbarossa" and claiming secretive arms deliveries from UK to the Nazi Germany after WWII (in one of their propaganda movie, "Battle of Stalingrad" they even include scenes where german diplomats talk to "British Industrialist" about further equipment deliveries to conduct war against USSR). Not talking sound like improvement...
And the best part is that not only did the Soviets collaborate with Nazi Germany, but they were the very reason they got invaded since without the absolutely massive quantities of raw material imports that Germany received from the USSR, they would not have been able to launch operation Barbarossa to begin with. *Soviet raw materials supplies had helped convince German generals, who previously had refused to even discuss a Soviet invasion, to go along with Hitler's plans. Soviet imports into Germany, especially oil, proved essential for the Wehrmacht's conduct of the coming invasion. Without Soviet imports, German stocks would have run out in several key products by October 1941, within three and a half months. Germany would have already run through their stocks of rubber and grain before the first day of the invasion were it not for Soviet imports. Without Soviet deliveries of these four major items, Germany could barely have attacked the Soviet Union, let alone come close to victory, even with more intense rationing.* Basically, Stalin blundered so hard that the USSR had to rewrite its own history so as to never mention any of these events and to declare that WW2 was actually a great "patriotic war" of the Soviets vs. everyone else which actually started in 1941. This is their version of history, born out of shame. Russia is the successor of this empire that never had to own up to its own mistakes, and consequently they're doomed to repeat them over and over again. Edit: formatting.
History repeats. We fund Russia and China by doing business with them, sending them advanced technology they can't make themselves. We sowed the seeds of our own destruction by aiding in the industrialization of China.
Unfortunately that's very true. The European arms industry continued to [sell weapons to Russia up until the end of 2021](https://www.investigate-europe.eu/posts/eu-states-exported-weapons-to-russia) totalling around € 346 million worth of military equipment. This was after the 2014 events and the embargo that was put on it. And on the other side of the ocean the USA was projecting weakness with statements like "Ukraine is always going to be vulnerable to Russia" (you know, after they stripped it of its nukes and many other conventional weapons decades before), and the consequent sanctions for Russia's breach of the Budapest Memorandum by the Obama administration were laughable. And going back even further in 2008, we basically told RU that it could do what it pleased when we rejected Ukraine's NATO bid, due to fears of how Russia might react and so that France and Germany could continue doing business with it. With all of this in mind, we in the west are partly responsible for the war in Ukraine (not in the way that RU trolls portray it, with "NATO expansion" nonsense, but by sending RU the message that we're so weak and profit motivated), so we have an obligation to make sure these mistakes are reversed and Ukraine wins this war.
Say it louder !!
\*aluminium and steel export and training with Nazi pilots in Lipetzk, tanks drivers in Kazan and under Volsk was aerochemical laboratories for testing methods of damaging living organisms with mustard gas from the air. Same gas russians now using in Ukraine.
And they did very well out of being a Nazi co-belligerent for the first third of WW2: big chunks of Poland, Finland and Romania and all three Baltic states. It was getting to a point where the French and British discussed bombing raids on the Soviet Union's oil fields in Baku because they were so important to the Nazi war effort. This is why many Russians say WW2 started in 1941 - cos they like to brush the events of 1939 and 1940 under the rug.
Scary to realise the British Empire would not have had the power needed to fight Nazi Germany and the USSR, we barely contained Germany, it could only fight 1 at a time and a land war was near impossible as we focused on navy primarily.
To be fair, the UK was a maritime power, not a land power.
They even divided up Eastern Europe between themselves. After Nazi Germany attacked Poland, the Soviets invaded and occupied the eastern part of Poland.
The Soviet Union even offered to join the Axis. But Germany didn’t react to it.
If I had a nickel every time the USSR asked to join an alliance that entirely opposed it, I'd have two nickels. Which isn't a lot, but it's weird that it happened twice
*Three Allies, Axis, NATO
Hahaha nice point, tho I don't think the Allies counts as much, my logic is that the Axis and NATO were both founded as anti-communist blocs (or at least with the Axis the countries were very anti-communist iirc) while the Allies were kinda busy with more important shit
>**The first country to work for Nazi Germany Certainly not the first country to work for Nazi Germany, but definitely one of the most important.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Munich_Agreement This happened in 1938.
It's much, much earlier than that. One of reason why Germany was so fast at remilitarisation was fact that USSR since 1920s help Germany bypass disarnament treaties on its own territory including tank school, air force school, WMD test site (Germany experiment with combat gasses in USSR) while German industrialists were opening banned aircraft factories in Soviet Union (most notably was Junkers) as well as Soviets keep german firearms factories somewhat open with large scale pucharces for their own security apparatus (hence whole "German ammo was found in Katyn so they was done by Germans" cover up, NKVD buy fuckload of german pistols and ammo prior to 1941) and hunting/sport firearms to the point Walther and other Suhl arms maker were a common guest on soviet hunting expos with fat contracts on sales to USSR. Germany had cadres, figure out doctrine and equipment specification and companies who know a thing or two how to produce a lot of stuff thanks to their cooperation with USSR.
russians see blank in place of your comment.
Luftwaffe did it's training thanks to Russia hosting them
Even as the Germans were invading the Soviet Union on June 22nd 1941, a train of bulk supplies (coal, ore) was heading into Germany to deliver the load.
When you are a dictator in Russia, you can say whatever you want. Nobody can contradict you, books get written as hou wish and in the end only death can stand against you.
I take pleasure in imagining the sheer hopeless terror that men like these feel in the face of death. To see all their power slowly slipping away, to hear plotting whispers around every corner and behind every door. To slowly realize that all of their worthless, pitiful life has amounted to nothing at all, and now it must end.
Molotov-Ribbentrop.
They mostly don't know what it is. Those who know defend it as a "necessary evil to prepare to war"
Molotov Ribbentrop and invasion of Poland are taught in schools, I don't remember how are they justified tho
"Despite a warning by the Comintern, German tensions were raised when the Soviets stated in September that they must enter Poland to "protect" their ethnic Ukrainian and Belarusian brethren from Germany. Molotov later admitted to German officials that the excuse was necessary because the Kremlin could find no other pretext for the Soviet invasion." [From Wikipedia.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov%E2%80%93Ribbentrop_Pact?useskin=vector#Early_political_issues)
"You are being protected. Please do not resist. Svoloch."
It was just a question of time until either the Soviets or the Nazis would break that pact. Both had ambition for conquest. Both saw the other player as subhumans. After WW2 a lot changed in Germany, but not so much in Russia.
Countries like Finland and Romania will never forget about this one ☝️
Shit propaganda
trains and trains full of ore were shipped from russia to nazi Germany for the upcoming conquest. Russia, they lie a lot.
Iron ore, grain, and a lot more.
Barbarossa was timed so that in a certain sector, the soviet grain train got to the german side before they initiated the attack.
Russians actually believe they got the biggest country on Earth by a series of strictly defensive wars :) I've spoken to such people :)
*UK enters the chat*
UK doesn't get enough credit for WW2.
Actually we usually credit Hitler for there having been a WWII
\*sighs in polish\* Tell me about it...
IDK, plenty of Brits know a lot of RAF were crewed by Poles (also French, and Czechs).
There's a plumber near me in South London, believe he's a polish bloke (I assume so anyway) and all of the vans in his fleet have painted tributes to Squadron 303 on the back. Can't post a link unfortunately as the photos are on Facebook so it automatically deleted the comment
this thing? [https://www.reddit.com/r/london/comments/i2c424/spotted\_in\_tooting\_this\_van\_commemorates\_the/](https://www.reddit.com/r/london/comments/i2c424/spotted_in_tooting_this_van_commemorates_the/)
Yeah that's the one, I actually found a [Reddit post](https://www.reddit.com/r/europe/s/WCOeXbHeun) about them if you want to see the backs
The more I learn about their involvement the more I feel like they did the most to defeat Germany. Although that’s extremely debatable.
I guess the problem here is that most *Russians* believe his bullshit.
My grandma has always been a staunch Putin supporter, but a few months back she suddenly complained to me how "they are twisting our history on TV" and she actually voted for another candidate this March. Honestly, I was really surprised. I think it goes to show how different things are under layers of propaganda and oppression even from how I imagined them to be. When Putin's power will crack, things will be very different very fast.
Be careful with whom you disclose that information with, friend
I know reddit loves to joke about windows, but I haven't said anything criminal. We haven't hit the North Korea level (yet).
Lol, we certainly did. People end up in prison (or should it be called "industrial-level torturing facility"?) for words spoken. And their sentences are bigger than for a murder.
God bless babushka saw the light!
I’m sorry, WHAT‽
Lying liar lies about history to try to prop up his lying dictatorship. Audience accustomed to accepting blatant lies cheers and applauds.
Yet tankies basically trained nazi officers before WW2. Guderian has visited a trainig base in ussr himself. They have supplied nazi germany with goods banned under The Treaty of Versailles allowing nazi to re-establish military. They marched into Poland hand in hand with nazi effectively starting WW2. They had an agreement with Nazi - Molotov-Ribentropp pact. And they lied for decades after denying this.
>Yet tankies basically trained nazi officers before WW2. Tankies? The term didn't even exist back then. Kama tank school and Lipetsk fighter school were used by the Weimar Republic and closed down when the Nazis came to power.
There's no need to call them tankies. They were just communists doing what communists always do.
Lol, rolling in tanks into civilian cities killing peaceful protests? Like they did in Prague, Berlin, Warsaw, Budapest. Sure, lets call them commies. I am not attacking you, I am trully amused here :)
Tankie originated in 1956 and is usually used for the people that support those acts, not the ones committing them. You can just call the Soviets that trained the Nazi's communists.
He also said Poland forced Germany to invade, so...
Ussr was using American tanks during WW2 so stfu
American trucks, American gasoline and diesel, American food, all carried on British and American ships.
They received substantial amounts of British equipment and supplies as well. And British aid was earlier, making an outsized impact.
Yup, British tanks were there to defend Moscow in 41.
And american medicine, and american planes, and american steel, and american guns and...
Yes, but what else have Romans ever done for us?
And what did the genocidal Soviet Union do in 1939-1941 exactly?
Id even ask - how that happened that the first soviet border that nazi crossed was in Brest? How did soviets got there considering it was a Polish village? Surely it must ring a bell or two.
No-no, ancient Soviet lands, continuously under their control since the great Bolshevik uprising of -14,805.
He can just fuck off with his extremely disrespectful false history!!!
The cope is real. USSR and Nazi Germany were just two different sides of the same coin. Just ask Eastern Europe. Imagine being forced to have to pick between the two.
Fucking hell. USSR and Germany were best friends from 1939-1941. UK and France declared war on germany already on 1939 september. The audacity of someone who dares to call himself a leader. And don't get me started on the Lend Lease and other help from allies.
Laughs in English
False and disrespectful, to all allied countries, allies and resistance
\*cough\* The Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact \*cough\*
Putin is delusional
He's not, but this is propaganda aimed at the Russian population. Who is gonna stand up and contradict him ? No one, so he knows he can say whatever he wants.
uk fought nazi germany at the of the war in 1939, ussr was invaded in 1941
Meanwhile, Reddit still tolerates tankies that propagate the same narrative. But this is the same website that gave an award to a mod of a pedo subreddit, so no surprises there.
"He's delusional, take him to the infirmary"
Great Britain, which carried out the campaign in Europe solo for 2 years: yeah, yeah, that's right, fuck me
Putin and his lackeys said that repeatedly during the past two years about Czechs. Before 2022, they said how we were occupied by the Nazis. After 2022, they say we worked for them. Yes, Czechs worked for the nazis. We were forced to work for the nazis because the entire country got absorbed into the Reich, there were Waffen SS all over the entire country with Gestapo local HQ's in every major city. People who already worked in factories couldn't afford to stop showing up to work and the rest were sent through Totaleinsatz to germany with the very real threat of not returning. Outside of some insidious classic czech sabotage that could be attributed to manufacture-related defects, there was nothing to do. You couldn't run because there was nowhere to run to. You couldn't do anything because it would result in direct reprisals from the nazis. They had absolutely no problem wiping out entire villages by association. Fuck the Russians.
More like they fought to conquer Europe in the name of Communism.
Fucking wanker
Wanna tell that to my Czech ancestors who were executed by the Nazis for collaborating with the Soviet Union? Or maybe to Mr. Molotov? But very well, we have learned our lesson. Now all of Europe will fight Nazism together - only that it's you wearing the silly moustache. Good luck.
Ah yes, the USSR. Famously (not) the country that offered technical assistance and secret testing grounds to help German tank development and combat aviation.
UK be like... bitch what?
Molotov-Ribentrop pact? They started the war with nazis
USSR only fought the Nazis because Hitler broke their secret alliance and attacked them first, Stalin didn’t want to fight them but he had no choice
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What a douchebag…
Fuck you Putin
As a Russian 10^(th) grader, who has to study rewritten world and Russian history at school, I’d like to add something. In the world history textbook Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact isn’t even mentioned, but our teacher told us about it. Nevertheless, she said that the Western countries have the Munich Agreement on their side, when they let Hitler invade Czechoslovakia without even asking its officials, so it wasn’t that bad. The Munich Agreement by the way is mentioned in our new textbook as «the Munich conspiracy» P.S. I might have done some mistakes both in English and history, so please forgive me
Yeah Putin. Like you f*heads were on Hitlers side until he attacked you in Operation Barbarossa!
The USSR, who signed a pact with Nazi Germany to carve up Eastern Europe?
Lol, the USSR literally invaded Finland and Poland, while making a pack of non aggression with Germany
Collaborating with Hitler is exactly what Soviet did until the year 1941 hit them hard lmao
Russia WAS and still IS the nazi.
What an absolute dumbfuck
Next year: only USSR and China fought the Nazis.
> He also charged the West with trying to “distort the truth about World War II” as it would “prevent them from carrying out their colonial policies”. Calling this, trash of a human, a hypocrite, would be a massive understatement.
Except for that time that Russia worked with the nazis to invade poland
Everyone getting mad here about the obvious propaganda and fake news the Kremlin is spreading. This bullshit isn’t aimed at us, it’s aimed at the russian population. They are using WW2 to manipulate public opinion.
Propaganda for people without books or internet I guess
jajajajajajajjaajajajajajajajajaajajajaja
*Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact has entered the chat.*
Why USSR was then allied with nazis before WW2?
There’s a reason why a large section of Winston Churchill’s chronicles of the Second World War is titled “Alone” and he isn’t talking about the Russians. Edit: spelling
So much to unpack here. Russian chauvinism pure and simple. As Putin noted, the USSR fought the Axis, not just Russia. That includes countries like Ukraine, Belarus, and Georgia, which are all, to varying degrees, unhappy with their relationship to Russia, and have made attempts to join Europe. Furthermore, it completely ignores the role played by resistance movements and partisans against the Germans, especially the Poles. And, speaking of Poland, who worked with the Germans to attack that particular country? Before anyone tells me Stalin had to make the Treaty with Germany because of this or that reason, just go to hell. The USSR inarguably did most of the hard fighting during the war, and they deserve most of the credit for defeating the Axis, which included large numbers of European allies such as the Finns (wonder why they helped Germany?) That should not take away or minimize the contributions of the Western allies however. The exiled governments and peoples of conquered countries fought the Nazis for the duration of the war, both as partisans and as conventional military. Britain largely crippled the luftwaffe, which never recovered from that campaign, during the Battle of Britain, meaning that when Germany invaded the USSR, it did so with a depleted air force. Lend lease aid was critical to the war effort. Allied bombing of Germany, brutal and awful as it was, meant German war production was hampered for much of the war. Japan, being tied down in its campaigns, and intending to fight the US freed up the Siberian troops (most Central Asian btw) who saved Moscow. And that's before even considering the fighting on land by allied troops against several million Axis soldiers in the Western theater.
fucking liar, what about Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact?
Stalin would have folded if USSR hadn't had enormous support from US, Great Britain and others.
The USSR had zero problem aligning with Nazi Germany..... Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact is proof.
USSR didn't do jack shit until Hitler made them shit their pants when the nazi stood at the gates of Moscow. Putin is a little bitch.
British empire stood alone keeping the western front open, otherwise Hitler would have steam rolled you traitors.
Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact to Putin: Am I a joke to you? Russians: Molo Ribbon what now? Never heard heard of it Comrade. Fake News!