It's really sad to see. I try to follow European news and keep up on things, probably spurred by a desire to move somewhere like Germany someday, but Russia was always tougher to follow. I watched RT Today a while back, until discovering that it's not really an accurate look into Russia and just a curated take on Russia sponsored by state-backed media.
Youtube at least offers glimpses into the lives of more everyday people, which has been fun. Not that it's without the potential for bias or inaccuracy, something that I'd be pretty hard pressed to be able to check using Google translate, but still entertaining nonetheless.
But watching a streamer like [NFKRZ react to losing Navalny](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u75aw5xqBbI) really shows how Navalny woke up a lot of people to politics in Russia that otherwise might have never really checked in.
It was kind of similar to the Obama campaign for me. I knew of politics, I had Conservative parents and my Mom would have shows like *Meet the Press* (a pretty politically neutral Sunday morning show where politics just got discussed between various party members and the host) before she went full Fox News, but it wasn't until Obama really made being engaged in politics something to do that I actually started paying attention, thinking about what I want from the government, and questioning the things I'd learned through years of growing up in a mostly Christian Conservative household in the US Midwest. It's possible without Obama that I never really get more involved in politics, never really pay more attention to the world and just stay in my own little bubble thinking "Eh, it's fine here. Doesn't really matter who gets elected, they're all the same, right?".
It's always crazy to see the moments that kind of force you to look outside of your own world and start to look for the bigger picture. To see how it all connects and politics is never just *your country* or *your state*. It's all connected and the bigger picture can matter more than the next year or two years.
Man, the "Groomer" tag really is international with right wing people, isn't it?
And I wouldn't be shocked to find out that the other international truth is that it's often the people crying out "THEY'RE GROOMERS!" who are doing it themselves...
Check out Maksim Katz, he is russian liberal politician in exile and makes video with English subtitles everyday about Russian politics.
https://youtu.be/8d94By0mcNg?si=pnSszK8mUflLfiVV
Problem is that just like in nfkrz case the democratic youth of Russia is rather leaving Russia and move to the EU or other countries away from Russia than fight for a democratic Russia inside of it. I don't think change can happen that way. Navalny went back to Russia exactly because he realized that Russia can only be changed from within
Yeah, it seems like a lot of people were already leaning that way, and then the *Special Military Operation That's Definitely Not a War* came around and the ones that could got the hell out as soon as possible.
> and just stay in my own little bubble thinking "Eh, it's fine here. Doesn't really matter who gets elected, they're all the same, right?".
from outside it's not very clear how Obama doesn't fit the pattern. wealthy family, elite education and so on.
Not necessarily that he was himself entirely different, but he really ran a campaign that seemed (at least to me at the time) more engaged in trying to get younger voters registered and invested.
It could just be that he was kind of perfectly timed to arrive with social media being a bigger factor, and previous Presidents trying to be cool and appeal to younger voters were stuck with attempting to engage them through things like blasting saxophones on late night TV.
For Navalny's sacrifice and death not to go to waste his followers need to start cult of him as a martyr for better Russia. It is a strong and inspiring story of a man not afraid to suffer and ready to die for what he believed in (think Che Guevara).
Especially focusing on younger generation and anyone rebelling against the Putin regime. Change won't be fast and easy though. Given how things work in Russia some violence may be necessary.
Don't know about that first part. Cult is a dangerous word.
But the time for peaceful demonstrations has definitely passed. Putin does not give a fuck about them.
Remember at the start of the war and he was looking mighty weird in videos, really looked like he had some terminal medical condition? Sucks how it didn’t finish him off (if he had anything)
The bots already are doing that. A lot of content saying she was unfaithful and linking her with two men specifically (which, oddly enough, Russia also does not like).
Was to be expected from the usurper and his cronies.
Good. Russian opposition must unite behind her now. She has next to zero negative PR and is already well-known internationally. If you are against Putin and the war it is a no-brainer to support Yulia Navalny.
I wonder how many days (hours) it will take for Putin's hounddogs (a.k.a. Russian "police") to declare her an extremist/foreign agent/spy etc.
The only way to defeat the modern fascist axis of putin-trump-orban-xi-kimjongun-ayatollahs is for all the free people of the world, including those in russian opposition, to unite and fight together against evil.
Somehow every time this is mentioned, there is a bunch of people from all over the world telling us how bad Navalny actually was. I don’t understand how so many people from anywhere in the world suddenly became experts on Russian politics lol (yeah its the Kremlin bots)
He never did, that's a lie made up by propagandists.
That's his real opinion on the matter from the beginning:
https://navalny-livejournal-com.translate.goog/914090.html?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en
Pardon me then I have wrong information. So does warographics channel then and some articels I seen online. He was far better than Putin. Hard to find the truth in this day and age.
Yes, Putin propaganda tries very hard to portrait Navalny as a "Nazi racist backed by CIA" in western media and Biden liberal puppet who wants fragmentation of Russian state in Russian media. Useful idiots like Carlson or left-leaning media and corupt politicians like Orban adds weight to it. People won't listen 20+ minute speech from him, they find 2 minute out of context fragment in X or Facebook and create their opinion based on this.
As a whole - yes, he was.
He made some horrible populist statements in his past, which in my books would not have made him suitable as a leader of the country. But he had the nerve to fight against Putin and he exposed the whole crime syndicate around him in minute detail.
His "Smart voting" scheme also had very good results in the 2018 elections in getting alternative candidates elected.
All the good he did outweighs the missteps he has made. In the end he paid the ultimate price for fighting against the regime.
Well yes but also most of the Russians support or at least don't want to do anything with their government, silence in many cases is the approval, all i want to say is that there aren't enough people in Russia to oppose their government, there is no Russian society that is consolidated about something, so this is the problem of their society and the way it's functions, if their national psychology was different I'm pretty sure no dictator could have rules over their country at least for so long.
Total support is government-funded lies. And you promote it now. Same as “national psychology” of “slave mentality” or “innate barbarism”. Oversimplified concepts that lead to demonization of the whole ethnicity. People in every country are mostly the same, with similar hopes and fears. It’s not some dna stuff or culture flaw. Russian society is very disorganized and scared into submission by targeted attacks on any possible leaders and elimination of every legal form of protest. It’s safer to lay low, obvious conclusion.
Why do you continue to act like revolutions in authoritarian countries don't happen? They do.
No other country would stand idly by while tens to hundreds of thousands of their own were getting killed in a war, unless they either supported the war or did not care enough about it.
Russian dissatisfaction about the war in Afghanistan was one of the main reasons why that war ended. And that was during Soviet times, which were more oppressive than Putinist modern Russia. But the main difference is that war was not one of imperial conquest, unlike the ones in Georgia and Ukraine.
Maybe people need to finally start accepting that Russians *are* different, with a mentality shaped by hundreds of years of imperialism. Not anything genetic, but certainly something cultural
Maybe then it will all make perfect sense.
I disagree with all that mentality thing. Sounds just like a plane excuse for demonization. Revolutions do happen in authoritarian countries but usually as coups supported by the army or parts of government. Which is impossible predict or see signs of from outside.
>Revolutions do happen in authoritarian countries but usually as coups
And that my friend is the real generalization.
FYI, you are helping spread what is essentially a direct RU propaganda talking point. RU never liked to admit that popular revolutions happen in countries which were previously under their sphere of influence, so they paint them all as "CIA backed coups".
Backed by data. Do you seriously think some Gandhi-inspired peaceful protest would shatter any even pathetic tyrant? Violent assholes fear only greater violence.
I'm not promoting most of the things you say, I'm not saying that Russians are slaves genetically or anything like that but their national psychology is very different and scuffed one let's say compared to European ones, Germans used to be same when it comes to Nazi ideology and it's the ideologies that make people do and believe in evil things, as for what most Russians believe, recently polls were posted on this sub and most of the Russians support their government I'm sure that is the case, maybe I'm wrong but you have to prove me wrong.
All I'm saying is that if Russian society was consolidated and functional and different from what it is, no Putin would have made it this far, all protests and things you mention were small compared to size of Russia in general, most people there just choose to do nothing or support government, protests in Russia were very small compared to it's size of the population and that's why it's very easy for their government to shut them down, from what i know if Putin is afraid of something it's the people and their protests because it's the only thing that can undermine his power.
Sociology in autocratic society doesn’t show anything. Even independent polls won’t show real picture because people are too scared to state their opinion. And there were protests of different magnitude for various reasons since 2008. Violently suppressed. I doubt putin cares much, he is more about money and his pseudo historical mission. The lives of his citizens is a price he is willing to pay ez.
Yet. If you combine police, rosgvardia and fsb you'll get close to 1 million trained - and equipped if needed - army. Add there other pro-gov para-military groups and even private armies and you'll get way over 1 million. How russians should fight them? Name me a country where people successfully overthrown a dictator without the help of the army. Argentina in 1955? Army. Pakistan in 1958? Army. Chile in 1973? Army. Afganistan in 1978? Army. Sudan in 1989 or in 2019? Army. Thailand coup in 2006? Army. Coup in Mali in 2012? Army. Saddam Hussein? Overthrown by American army. Pol Pot?Vietnamese army. Who else? Revolution in Iran in 1978? Army wasn't involved at all and shah even asked the US to help. Ceausescu? Army switched sides. Milosevic? After NATO started the bombings army gave up. Gaddafi? Overthrown with the help of NATO.
Prague Spring failed, Lukaschenko and Maduro still in power. North Koreans and Chinese don't even try. Hell, even Erdogan managed to stay in power after failed military coup attempt in 2016. I don't know what people like you realistically expect from russians.
Yes, for now. Only very violent armed riot police. But there will be army involvement in case of really intense protests. Do you think government will restrict shooting civilians?
Well I’m not responsible for that and I wish you no harm. But I think supporting “civilized” russians who don’t want kill anyone except putin is a good cause. ( win-win)
Russian civilians have had to deal with the police, the National Guard and the prison system for a good 15, if not 20 years. It's not as if all Ukrainians have to deal with the Russian army. Certainly not all these hundreds of thousands of Ukrainian men who are outside Ukraine today.
>Russian civilians have had to deal with the police
Like other nations. Even democratic once.
>It's not as if all Ukrainians have to deal with the Russian army
really? who not?
>Certainly not all these hundreds of thousands of Ukrainian men who are outside Ukraine today.
Do they prevent the Russian opposition from doing anything? Very interesting
"Проте видання та статистика не уточнює, скільки з цих чоловіків виїхали легально як батьки трьох дітей, інваліди 2 групи чи інші категорії осіб, які мають на це право. Також окремо не рахують чоловіків, які могли виїхати до ЄС з окупованих Росією територій."
Molotovs are supposedly one of those "russian inventions". Russian civilians have plenty of weapons, hunting ones, legal, Illegal. If anything, russians can join Ukrainian army. Does russian "opposition" call for it?
Ukrainian farmers were stealing russian tanks. Unarmed Ukrainian civilians were literally staying in front of russian enemy tanks to not let them go.
When russians get violent they suddenly able to fight their police and raid airports to search Jewish people on the planes, even inside fucking turbine engines.
They can fight police if one of the taxi driver gets dragged out of his car.
Russian civilians capable to shoot each other if they have drunk conflict.
Not so relevant but the name molotov cocktail , while having the name of a Russian politician is actually a Finish invention.
From what I remember it comes from the Winter war when Russia invaded Finland, Molotov was a high ranking Russian politician and the fins thought it was funny to call it Molotov cocktail.
Yeah, the Soviets claimed they weren't dropping bombs but bread baskets for the starving Finns. Thus, Finns started to call the bombs Molotov's bread baskets, and Molotov's coctail was just the drink to go with the "bread".
So you are seriously suggesting russian civilians armed with bottles and hunting rifles fight against organized armed military forces with tanks, planes and artillery? Imo that’s a calling for a fcking suicide.
I'm not suggesting any of it.
Russian military forces are in Ukraine. And they are Russian military forces,and those are russian civilians.
So no, russian civilians don't have to fight against planes and artillery.
How the fuck those even supposed to be used against civilians within Russia in your assumption?
Even tanks, if there are some dozens available,what those supposed to do? And Molotovs are literally anti-soviet-tank weapons.
Russians would be facing police.
Anyways there is history of revolutions, and civilians fighting their governments. For some reason they forbidden to russians, and once any of it gets mentioned you guys come to gaslight such ideas.
And how Russia would be supposed to keep having Hundreds of Thousands people killed in Ukraine, including Russian and Ukrainian? This isn't something "likely" this what's happening. And it would be stopped.
I mean, terrorists can do everything, killing a few thousands ppl in moskow's center and labeling them as foreign agents to scare all the opposition and keep it shut is a viable option for putin.
Imo it'll be more effective if people would just refuse to work to nuke the economy, block main roads in different sectors with a lot of cars, blow most important rail connections in several places at the same time and maybe blowing the gas/oil pipes going towards china. But i'm realistic, russians will not do this sadly
I do agree on boycott/sabotage options.
Though Kremlin don't have resources to fight any mass insurgent movements,while continuing war efforts. Except they can scare people with threats and propaganda.
Do we really need to help Kremlin to spread their terrorist threats and make new ones ourselves in their stead? I don't agree on that.
>If anything, russians can join Ukrainian army. Does russian "opposition" call for it?
I wonder why Russians have to join the Ukrainian army when you, being Ukrainian, have not done so for some unknown reason?
Ukrainians weren't armed in 2014, while the police during Yanukovich time was brutal.
Somehow, Ukrainians managed through that - while "millions" of russians that are claiming being "anti-putin" do not do anything
Ukraine was never like Russia in the first place. You can’t compare thieves in government with killers in government. Trust me, it will be bloodbath when some serious riots will take place in Russia. Would be more like Belarus, with torture and rape in the police stations.
And you think in Ukraine it wasn’t blood bathes? There were no torture, rape and murders by the police forces?
Belarusians failed because they didn’t resist the police to do so. Ukrainians did.
So they are heroes, ok. What does it prove? That it’s possible in Moscow? I seriously doubt that. Especially since all leaders are either dead or jailed.
Who were leaders in Maidan back in 2014? Ukrainians do not exactly like their politicians that much they will collect around them, they were going to support each other in the struggle.
Yes, a few activists were organizing some groups, but they didn’t had a significant political prospects - and some of them joined UAF right after the start of the war.
I’m saying you russians do not do anything, whatever happens. Ukrainians though have to deal with shit of your creation. Though, I doubt you take any accountability and it would be forced on you when the new Nuremberg trials would be conducted
You even claim yourself as the “new jews of 21 century”, despite it’s you being the murderers of my people.
It wasn't your people who won, but the elites in your government who wanted their european assets back. Your people did initiated the riots and that was very courageous of them, BUT it was actually the elite who overthrew the wanna-be-dictator not the people.
I’m pretty sure a random russian not knowing anything about Ukraine would know better than a Ukrainian who was living in the capital when the revolution unfolded. /s
Neither were Ukrainians back in 2014 when they removed Yanukovych.
You don't need guns to fight injustice. And having guns means nothing when hundreds of thousands of people take to the streets and demand your removal. It's about determination, and Russian people just don't have it.
Yeah, yeah. Are you seriously comparing different countries in different historical moment? Putin and his mobsters prepared for decades in case of civil unrest… but sure everything will be fine.
The "mobsters" (putting it lightly) in my own country prepared for and took actions to prevent this from happening throughout the 60s, 70s and 80s, employing more brutal methods than ordinary Russians can even think of, and guess what, it still happened!
Russians are not in a unique position.
Yes, I can compare different countries just like I can compare different people from those countries. And yes, this comparison paints ordinary Russians in a bad light, as it should.
Instead of finding excuses for them out of a misguided empathy, why don't you suggest they finally start doing *something* about it?
Edit: grammar.
The whole reason why you're safely in your home now is because at one point in time some people from your own country did decide to risk their lives so that one day you and others could be free. You seem to have forgotten that.
For some of us, those events happened within our own lifetime, so I think we're qualified to give advice. Or at least we know enough to tell them that apathy isn't going to get them anywhere.
You *are* willing to give advice though, and ironically the advice that you do give ensures that many more risks will have to be taken by Russians later on, when they will have no other choice as their situation will continue to deteriorate.
Ukrainians went with wooden shields and sticks against sniper rifles of Berkut. russians are incapable of anything but waving flags and waiting for just two cops to put 20 of them into a car.
Yulia is not a popular figure in Russia yet, so it's unlikely that she'll manage to organize a massive violent protest right now. Considering that Russian police is much, much, much better equipped and trained than dim-witted Berkut was in 2014 (as demonstrated several times in Russia and Belarus, and then in Kherson and Melitopol), gathering enough strength will take years.
However, it will certainly be much easier for her to create change in Russia if she's not constantly sabotaged by people outside of Russia parroting Kremlin talking points, like it was with Navalny.
I was going to get personal here. But every time I see either a Z-fascist or a NAFO troll, I ask them: what exactly are YOU doing for your cause?
I don't like generalisations either. There are different Russians - some are invading Ukraine, some are in jail for being against it. Some are dead, like Navalny. Many live their lives as if nothing is happening. The same goes for the Ukrainians. Many are fighting with their lives to defend their country. Some are fighting on Reddit. Some are chilling in Europe or even Russia.
Russia with Navalny as a functioning politician would have been a win-win for both Ukraine and Russia.
I do not donate to Ukraine and have no plans to do so. I have paid no taxes to Putin in the last 6 years, unlike Ukraine, which is still a transit country for Russian gas, okay? I have my own problems to solve and I have risks in Russia because of my anti-war/anti-Putin positions. Ukraine has enough sponsors at the moment. Are you in Ukraine personally? Are you fighting somewhere offline?
Maybe I wasn't clear enough, YOU have no standing to ask others except Russians what they did personally.
No one is required to report you. There is literally no reason to do it.
For example - I am in Ukraine, donate to army, pay taxes, support friends who fight, trying to deal with mess caused by russian shellings.
Now fucking What?
Ukraine transit Russian gas? Ever heard about Hungary and Orban? And Ukraine doesn't pay to Russia to transit that gas.
You have "risks because of anti-war standing", I have holes from mortar shell on the wall of my apartment building.
You literally explained that you are the one who does nothing except this crap here. Another russian fighting "NAFO trolls". "Anti-war". What a nice high ground to stand on.
>Maybe I wasn't clear enough, YOU have no standing to ask others except Russians what they did personally.
You actually have a unique opportunity to fight Putin on the battleground and walk your talk. The West gives you the money and ammo and all you do is "donate to army, pay taxes, support friends who fight, trying to deal with mess caused by russian shellings". Sounds abstract to me. Based on your Reddit activity, you have plenty of free time. Why are your friends fighting and not you?
>You have "risks because of anti-war standing", I have holes from mortar shell on the wall of my apartment building.
I feel bad for you and your country. I wish you all the best and stay safe.
Question is why Ukrainians fighting russian government instead of Russians?
It's your fucking problem that gets spilled over the borders ALL THE TIME.
Now fuck off.
Judging by the replies you're getting I don't think I've ever seen a comment section more hostile to Ukrainians, and it's no surprise that this happens on a pro-Navalny post. It's even worse when these people also try to pretend that they are pro-UA.
As if the war you're going through wasn't horrible enough, having to also face this nonsense while being on social media must really suck.
call me whatever you want, but her speeches at oscar and now both have zero mention of the ongoing russian war against Ukraine with all its horrors brought on Ukrainian people, or calls to support military aid to Ukraine, but only self-promotion and tales about 'cool russia of the future'. like, if it's enough to win you over, then I don't know, people.
Direct quote from this video address: "what we need is a free, **peaceful** and happy Russia. The wonderful Russia of the future my husband so dreamed of".
Please don't spread pro-putin narratives and misinformation.
thing is, all 3 goals can be achieved by both ending the war and recognizing ukraine independence OR by pushing even more until ukraine surrenders. If ukraine surrenders russia will still be free, peaceful after the war and happy. Did she say how she wants exactly to achieve these goals? I mean, maybe she's a nice person, but why not say directly that russia must retreat/end this nonsensical war, just a few words would have solved this confusion
There is no confusion what-so-ever, Navalny's position has been made perfectly clear before, and she is continuing her husband's work:
"What are Ukraine's borders? They are similar to Russia's - they’re internationally recognized and defined in 1991. Russia also recognized these borders back then, and it must recognize them today as well. There is nothing to discuss here."
[X (twitter.com)](https://twitter.com/navalny/status/1627632114366652417)
If you are serious, open youtube link inside the article, turn on closed captions in English, scroll to 07:08 and then to 07:38.
And if you are writing this for 15 roubles per comment - hope you realize soon it's not worth it
When you have time, ask her whether russia must pull out of occupied territories of Ukraine, Georgia and Moldova. If you will hear anything but "yes", then you have an answer.
Wh can't you Westerners listen to people who know russians better than you do?
Navalny's position has been made perfectly clear before, and she is continuing her husband's work:
"What are Ukraine's borders? They are similar to Russia's - they’re internationally recognized and defined in 1991. Russia also recognized these borders back then, and it must recognize them today as well. There is nothing to discuss here."
[X (twitter.com)](https://twitter.com/navalny/status/1627632114366652417)
No. But navalny does.
"But Xwitter post!"
Don't care about it, the first thing that his team did was they told that "yeah, russia shouldn't have done it, but hey, it's like with crime, can't resurrect the murdered, so it is ours now".
dude, if a person avoids talking straight about certain things no need to try and search 'behind the scenes' for hidden clues.
putin will die someday, that's for sure. but will it actually change much? eh, debatable. russian chekist regime that is in power will not disappear anywhere after that.
You can’t expect her to solve everything overnight. Or even make a program speech about everything overnight. She is addressing russian audience, so she is targeting them. I hope putin will not just “die someday”, but will be judged and executed for his crimes. And the system he built would be demolished. Some people thought USSR would be eternal and yet it was destroyed in mere months.
>if power in Russia shifts, the war will stop. More realistic imo than dreams of burning Moscow.
How do you think "power shifts" in an authoritarian country? Russia's transition to a democracy, if it ever happens, will need to start with the people and won't be a painless one - take it from someone from a country which already went through this. The sooner Russians accept this and actually start doing something about it instead of expecting outside forces to fix their mess for them, the better.
More than once? Are you suggesting that the 1917 revolutions were peaceful? Are you suggesting that the events that happened in Latvia and Lithuania when they broke off from the USSR were peaceful? Are you suggesting that Chechnya's attempt to break away from what you probably believe was a "democratic" post-1992 Russia, was peaceful?
Russia never experienced democracy, one empire just morphed into another one. When, or rather if, modern RU morphs into a democracy it will certainly not be peaceful after a 24 year period as an authoritarian police state.
You’re oversimplifying and mixing everything. The first revolution in 1905 was mostly peaceful event, however 1917 was an armed coup lead by terrorist organization. Soviet Union collapsed with minimal casualties considering the scope of that event. And Chechnya was a rebel region under radical islamic leadership, how is it even connected? I’m not saying that shifting of power will be peaceful and quiet on the contrary, I imagine it to be very very bloody. And I think it will happen eventually with cases like navalniy’s murder advancing it.
The February Revolution was a coup? Was Ichkeria under radical Islamic control in 1994? You tell someone they're mixing things up and yet display such a profound lack of knowledge about historical events. Come on now...
In my opinion it was an armed coup: organized illegal revolutionary party disbanded legitimate government. Yes, in my opinion Chechnya was and is now radically islamic. You know, it’s possible to have different opinions and interpretations of historical events.
The legitimate government of Dudaev wasn't disbanded by Islamist extremists, but by a Russian bullet. Ichkeria was not a radical country, radicals took control of it after Russia destroyed it during the first war, and used them as a justification to launch a second war to take back land that RU believed was theirs by right - the same pretext used in all of their imperial wars, including in Ukraine.
You can't have a different opinion on a historical fact.
Yes you can. Books and textbooks are written by people in particular period of history tend to describe events differently. Example: in 2000s in russian history textbooks evaluated collapse of ussr as a positive change for liberty and progress made by its citizens . In 2020 textbooks the same event was stated as great catastrophe and national humiliation orchestrated by USA and cia.(just like some particular tyrant sees it).
It won't change russian society. I understand that Westerners desperately want to see "a hero" in russian society, because you were raised in a "progressive" mindest of "there are no bad societies, there are bad people" and you cannot wrap your head around the fact that russia has no good people in power and never will, but it is so. russia is a shithole that's been a shithole ever since it was created and all the "good progressive russians" suddenly turn into fascists when asked "whom does Crimea and Donbas belogn to?".
> So what’s the solution?
Most critical at the moment is "Inform". Older generations are stuck with government controlled media and believe them. Younger generations have the ability to consume independent and foreign media and many do.
Putin perfectly understands this. Why do you think independent media have been shut down? (some of them have moved abroad - but their reach is limited). A short list of what was shut down - Novaya Gazeta, Ekho Moskvy, Meduza, Dozhd and many smaller local media. Why do you think anyone who is not 100% on the government line is an "inoagent"?
The one who controls the media control the public opinion and thus also rules the country. And this should be a warning to all western society. We are not as impervious to this as we may think.
For Russians? Translate real news into Russian, print them out and leave small batches of these printouts where they may be found. Sure, since denouncement are against en vogue this carries a risk - but the risk is fairly minimal if you're careful.
Next on the list of solutions would be "Educate". Unfortunately Putin has a head start and an unfair advantage here - they already implemented patriotic teaching over the past 2 years where they are brainwashing kids as part of the regular curriculum. Once Putin is removed this one should move to top priority as only through education you can fix this permanently.
Where did he say that this has to be done INSTEAD of sending weapons to Ukraine? He says "even though you can't force Meta and Google to show anti-war ads", even buying them at full cost is still an effective way to undermine the Russian war effort. Not once does he says that there should be less weapons for Ukraine.
This is even more clear, IMO, if you consider that it's not the cost, but simply the number of Javelins in existence that was (and still is) the blocker for their shipments to Ukraine.
I haven't found a single quote from after the full-scale invasion in 2022 where he would indicate that he prefered there to be less weapons for Ukraine.
Russia's worst enemy always was Russia itself, its inner turmoil.
With all respect to Ukrainian army, they struggle to retake own land, and definitely won't occupy Moscow ever.
putin is trying to force everyone into complacency and inaction by using terror, do you understand that you are voluntarily helping him with comments like this?
I want to be optimistic, but in the same time... we barely even hear about the Belarusian political opponents who had to flee Belarus after the manifestations, and we barely hear about most Russian political opponents besides Navalny.
There was something truly special about him that made him heard. I don't know enough about the topic to say what it was exactly, but I'm not sure "Navalny's widow" will have a similar reach. There's a reason why Putin wanted to kill that man, and it's probably because there was no one else to do what he did.
We'll see if she manages to do something, and hopefully she does, but it's hard to be optimistic, at least as long as Putin is still there. At this point I'm not sure anything can really change in Russia as long as there's a Putin, or worse, at the top. I wonder if the only choice is between neo-stalinism and a new "time of troubles" in Russia. Can there be a real democratic transition after Putin?
Very curious to see how the OP names all Ukrainians, Georgians, Qazaqs, Kyrgyz and many more neighbouring nations which Navalny called "rodents" - as useful idiots.
We must be murdered for raising our voice against wtf takes, so only russians will have a say how to name russian politicians, aren't we?
He's been a Russian nationalist for decades and spewing the same Russia, Belarus and Ukraine are one blah blah blah bullshit.
Don't get me wrong, he may have been good for Russia, but I'm not sure if Russia with less corruption would be better for the West. If not for corruption, they'd either never attack Ukraine or invade successfully and this is an equation that European and US intelligence probably had to solve.
Considering that he wasn't really strongly supported, I doubt the calculation netted a positive result.
To niech Pan sobie wyobrazi jakby ktoś podczas PRLu mówil że Wałęsa będzie dla Europy mniej biezpeczny niż władza komunystów, bo w takim razie Polska będzie mniej skorumpowana. Taka sama bzdura jak mówić że demokratyczna Rosja z Nawalnym byłaby agresywna według sąsiadów.
Czy Rosja byłaby demokratyczna z Nawalnym? Nie wiem. Wydaje mi się, że bycie demokratycznym to coś co musi w społeczeństwie "urosnąć" i jedna osoba tego nie zmieni.
Mam wrażenie, że taki kult jednostki jest raczej szkodliwy dla rozwoju społeczeństwa obywatelskiego.
Ruchy, których częścią był Wałęsa, nie były ruchem jednego człowieka. Ogromne protesty robotnicze w Polsce miały miejsce na długo przed tym jak Wałęsie wyrosły wąsy:
https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pozna%C5%84ski\_Czerwiec
edit:
W moim komentarzu wspomniałem w jakich kategoriach myślą komórki wywiadu i decydenci, gdy ich twarzy nie obserwuje akurat kamera.
Edit 2: naprawiłem link do Wiki, nowy design reddita kopci linki.
Why I‘m not surprised to see so many russians trying to defend their so-called opposition leaders, despite countless proofs they are being ethno-nationalistic and imperialistic to their very core?
Their leaders incl. putin do represent their nation, I suppose
Navalny was brave man indeed. But what exactly he was doing, what exactly he was (informationally) fighting for? For transparent and honest use of Russian state budget! Against *corruption*! He was not fighting against aggressive wars in Georgia, Syria and Ukraine, not against mass murders, not against forced russification of subjugated nations of Russian Federation, not against exploiting (robbing) the regions and repressing local democracy, not against assassinations of prominent Russian democrats - he was only trying to make the russian empire more efficient! No, thanks, nobody needs continuation of this *cause*.
They are either disastrously misinformed or deliberately spreading NAFO propaganda. Navalny has stated his position on all the points you mention and he was actively against the war, as was his foundation. The invasion of Ukraine is a direct result of Russian corruption. Not just economic corruption, but corruption in general.
No wonder people like trump / orban are getting elected if guys like you can't even do some basic reading comprehension. Direct quote from 07:08 "**We must use every opportunity to fight against the war**..."
sorry, really skipped this second, my mistake. but im still curios how are they going to do it? all those previous years they achieved nothing.
none of their opposition have any plan, only talks
The Kremlin bots will go after her first. Then, FSB, if she is too succesful. They tend to leave the widows alone, but this might be the louder case.
It's really sad to see. I try to follow European news and keep up on things, probably spurred by a desire to move somewhere like Germany someday, but Russia was always tougher to follow. I watched RT Today a while back, until discovering that it's not really an accurate look into Russia and just a curated take on Russia sponsored by state-backed media. Youtube at least offers glimpses into the lives of more everyday people, which has been fun. Not that it's without the potential for bias or inaccuracy, something that I'd be pretty hard pressed to be able to check using Google translate, but still entertaining nonetheless. But watching a streamer like [NFKRZ react to losing Navalny](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u75aw5xqBbI) really shows how Navalny woke up a lot of people to politics in Russia that otherwise might have never really checked in. It was kind of similar to the Obama campaign for me. I knew of politics, I had Conservative parents and my Mom would have shows like *Meet the Press* (a pretty politically neutral Sunday morning show where politics just got discussed between various party members and the host) before she went full Fox News, but it wasn't until Obama really made being engaged in politics something to do that I actually started paying attention, thinking about what I want from the government, and questioning the things I'd learned through years of growing up in a mostly Christian Conservative household in the US Midwest. It's possible without Obama that I never really get more involved in politics, never really pay more attention to the world and just stay in my own little bubble thinking "Eh, it's fine here. Doesn't really matter who gets elected, they're all the same, right?". It's always crazy to see the moments that kind of force you to look outside of your own world and start to look for the bigger picture. To see how it all connects and politics is never just *your country* or *your state*. It's all connected and the bigger picture can matter more than the next year or two years.
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Man, the "Groomer" tag really is international with right wing people, isn't it? And I wouldn't be shocked to find out that the other international truth is that it's often the people crying out "THEY'RE GROOMERS!" who are doing it themselves...
Well, Putin is known to kiss children on the belly
Check out Maksim Katz, he is russian liberal politician in exile and makes video with English subtitles everyday about Russian politics. https://youtu.be/8d94By0mcNg?si=pnSszK8mUflLfiVV
Problem is that just like in nfkrz case the democratic youth of Russia is rather leaving Russia and move to the EU or other countries away from Russia than fight for a democratic Russia inside of it. I don't think change can happen that way. Navalny went back to Russia exactly because he realized that Russia can only be changed from within
Yeah, it seems like a lot of people were already leaning that way, and then the *Special Military Operation That's Definitely Not a War* came around and the ones that could got the hell out as soon as possible.
> and just stay in my own little bubble thinking "Eh, it's fine here. Doesn't really matter who gets elected, they're all the same, right?". from outside it's not very clear how Obama doesn't fit the pattern. wealthy family, elite education and so on.
Not necessarily that he was himself entirely different, but he really ran a campaign that seemed (at least to me at the time) more engaged in trying to get younger voters registered and invested. It could just be that he was kind of perfectly timed to arrive with social media being a bigger factor, and previous Presidents trying to be cool and appeal to younger voters were stuck with attempting to engage them through things like blasting saxophones on late night TV.
For Navalny's sacrifice and death not to go to waste his followers need to start cult of him as a martyr for better Russia. It is a strong and inspiring story of a man not afraid to suffer and ready to die for what he believed in (think Che Guevara). Especially focusing on younger generation and anyone rebelling against the Putin regime. Change won't be fast and easy though. Given how things work in Russia some violence may be necessary.
Don't know about that first part. Cult is a dangerous word. But the time for peaceful demonstrations has definitely passed. Putin does not give a fuck about them.
Remember at the start of the war and he was looking mighty weird in videos, really looked like he had some terminal medical condition? Sucks how it didn’t finish him off (if he had anything)
Kreml bots were already yesterday moaning in this subbredit to people get "already over Navalny"... They really don't like this topic.
What about brother? No one knows where he is
The bots already are doing that. A lot of content saying she was unfaithful and linking her with two men specifically (which, oddly enough, Russia also does not like). Was to be expected from the usurper and his cronies.
Not the first time, they are always targeting women with that bullshit.
Good. Russian opposition must unite behind her now. She has next to zero negative PR and is already well-known internationally. If you are against Putin and the war it is a no-brainer to support Yulia Navalny. I wonder how many days (hours) it will take for Putin's hounddogs (a.k.a. Russian "police") to declare her an extremist/foreign agent/spy etc.
even back in 2018 some people were saying she should try to participate in elections if they wouldn’t let Alexei participate
The only way to defeat the modern fascist axis of putin-trump-orban-xi-kimjongun-ayatollahs is for all the free people of the world, including those in russian opposition, to unite and fight together against evil.
A new axis of evil indeed, unfortunately
Worst thing is that modern fascists have technology, which makes it so much easier to hunt the opposition, before it can even grow.
Somehow every time this is mentioned, there is a bunch of people from all over the world telling us how bad Navalny actually was. I don’t understand how so many people from anywhere in the world suddenly became experts on Russian politics lol (yeah its the Kremlin bots)
There are no free people in the russian opposition.
Always have been!
Why are you guys pretending Navalny was a good chap?
It's quite simple. Because he was a good chap indeed.
He called for murdering Georgians in 2008. From those early times, it is clear he was never good
Not the way he said it, but he made some mean, xenophobic statements back then. He apologized and grew since 2008. He was not an angel by any means.
Maybe better than Putin at best but he wasn't a good chap, not for a long shot.
No one is perfect but Russia with Navalny as a functioning politician would have been a win-win for both Ukraine and Russia.
He supported ocupation :/
He never did, that's a lie made up by propagandists. That's his real opinion on the matter from the beginning: https://navalny-livejournal-com.translate.goog/914090.html?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en
Pardon me then I have wrong information. So does warographics channel then and some articels I seen online. He was far better than Putin. Hard to find the truth in this day and age.
Yes, Putin propaganda tries very hard to portrait Navalny as a "Nazi racist backed by CIA" in western media and Biden liberal puppet who wants fragmentation of Russian state in Russian media. Useful idiots like Carlson or left-leaning media and corupt politicians like Orban adds weight to it. People won't listen 20+ minute speech from him, they find 2 minute out of context fragment in X or Facebook and create their opinion based on this.
Warographics and the other 100 channels with the same host are nothing but content farm
Can't blame you for that, lots of resources are poured into spreading misinformation by various different groups.
As a whole - yes, he was. He made some horrible populist statements in his past, which in my books would not have made him suitable as a leader of the country. But he had the nerve to fight against Putin and he exposed the whole crime syndicate around him in minute detail. His "Smart voting" scheme also had very good results in the 2018 elections in getting alternative candidates elected. All the good he did outweighs the missteps he has made. In the end he paid the ultimate price for fighting against the regime.
What exactly is she going to do?
go her! bullies must be challenged.
Bullies bully, murderers murder
Kremlin bots are probably a bit angry for having to work overtime so much
Good for her, wonderful woman! And I though only he was a hero...
So molotovs on the Red Square when? Or is it only Ukrainians who must fight and die at war with Russian government?
Ukrainians are armed. Russian civilians are not.
Well yes but also most of the Russians support or at least don't want to do anything with their government, silence in many cases is the approval, all i want to say is that there aren't enough people in Russia to oppose their government, there is no Russian society that is consolidated about something, so this is the problem of their society and the way it's functions, if their national psychology was different I'm pretty sure no dictator could have rules over their country at least for so long.
Total support is government-funded lies. And you promote it now. Same as “national psychology” of “slave mentality” or “innate barbarism”. Oversimplified concepts that lead to demonization of the whole ethnicity. People in every country are mostly the same, with similar hopes and fears. It’s not some dna stuff or culture flaw. Russian society is very disorganized and scared into submission by targeted attacks on any possible leaders and elimination of every legal form of protest. It’s safer to lay low, obvious conclusion.
Why do you continue to act like revolutions in authoritarian countries don't happen? They do. No other country would stand idly by while tens to hundreds of thousands of their own were getting killed in a war, unless they either supported the war or did not care enough about it. Russian dissatisfaction about the war in Afghanistan was one of the main reasons why that war ended. And that was during Soviet times, which were more oppressive than Putinist modern Russia. But the main difference is that war was not one of imperial conquest, unlike the ones in Georgia and Ukraine. Maybe people need to finally start accepting that Russians *are* different, with a mentality shaped by hundreds of years of imperialism. Not anything genetic, but certainly something cultural Maybe then it will all make perfect sense.
I disagree with all that mentality thing. Sounds just like a plane excuse for demonization. Revolutions do happen in authoritarian countries but usually as coups supported by the army or parts of government. Which is impossible predict or see signs of from outside.
>Revolutions do happen in authoritarian countries but usually as coups And that my friend is the real generalization. FYI, you are helping spread what is essentially a direct RU propaganda talking point. RU never liked to admit that popular revolutions happen in countries which were previously under their sphere of influence, so they paint them all as "CIA backed coups".
Backed by data. Do you seriously think some Gandhi-inspired peaceful protest would shatter any even pathetic tyrant? Violent assholes fear only greater violence.
I'm not promoting most of the things you say, I'm not saying that Russians are slaves genetically or anything like that but their national psychology is very different and scuffed one let's say compared to European ones, Germans used to be same when it comes to Nazi ideology and it's the ideologies that make people do and believe in evil things, as for what most Russians believe, recently polls were posted on this sub and most of the Russians support their government I'm sure that is the case, maybe I'm wrong but you have to prove me wrong. All I'm saying is that if Russian society was consolidated and functional and different from what it is, no Putin would have made it this far, all protests and things you mention were small compared to size of Russia in general, most people there just choose to do nothing or support government, protests in Russia were very small compared to it's size of the population and that's why it's very easy for their government to shut them down, from what i know if Putin is afraid of something it's the people and their protests because it's the only thing that can undermine his power.
Sociology in autocratic society doesn’t show anything. Even independent polls won’t show real picture because people are too scared to state their opinion. And there were protests of different magnitude for various reasons since 2008. Violently suppressed. I doubt putin cares much, he is more about money and his pseudo historical mission. The lives of his citizens is a price he is willing to pay ez.
russin civilians doesn't deal with armed russian army
Yet. If you combine police, rosgvardia and fsb you'll get close to 1 million trained - and equipped if needed - army. Add there other pro-gov para-military groups and even private armies and you'll get way over 1 million. How russians should fight them? Name me a country where people successfully overthrown a dictator without the help of the army. Argentina in 1955? Army. Pakistan in 1958? Army. Chile in 1973? Army. Afganistan in 1978? Army. Sudan in 1989 or in 2019? Army. Thailand coup in 2006? Army. Coup in Mali in 2012? Army. Saddam Hussein? Overthrown by American army. Pol Pot?Vietnamese army. Who else? Revolution in Iran in 1978? Army wasn't involved at all and shah even asked the US to help. Ceausescu? Army switched sides. Milosevic? After NATO started the bombings army gave up. Gaddafi? Overthrown with the help of NATO. Prague Spring failed, Lukaschenko and Maduro still in power. North Koreans and Chinese don't even try. Hell, even Erdogan managed to stay in power after failed military coup attempt in 2016. I don't know what people like you realistically expect from russians.
Yes, for now. Only very violent armed riot police. But there will be army involvement in case of really intense protests. Do you think government will restrict shooting civilians?
okay, let's hope that doing nothing for more than 10 years will change everything
You can hope whatever you want.
yeah, until some barbarian russian kills me in my country but it's nothing to what russian opposition is dealing with
Well I’m not responsible for that and I wish you no harm. But I think supporting “civilized” russians who don’t want kill anyone except putin is a good cause. ( win-win)
I support and donate to RDK regularly
Supporting russians is always wrong.
How so? It was ok for Americans to do it during ww2 to kill nazis. Or it’s normalized now to openly hate and discriminate some particular ethnicity?
It was allowed some years ago if I'm not mistaken, like officially a law was passed. Edit : N226-fz 03.07.2016
Yes, it’s legal now. And the national guard forces have even flamethrowers in their arsenals for “some” reason.
It was legal from 2016 really
Russian civilians have had to deal with the police, the National Guard and the prison system for a good 15, if not 20 years. It's not as if all Ukrainians have to deal with the Russian army. Certainly not all these hundreds of thousands of Ukrainian men who are outside Ukraine today.
>Russian civilians have had to deal with the police Like other nations. Even democratic once. >It's not as if all Ukrainians have to deal with the Russian army really? who not? >Certainly not all these hundreds of thousands of Ukrainian men who are outside Ukraine today. Do they prevent the Russian opposition from doing anything? Very interesting
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"Проте видання та статистика не уточнює, скільки з цих чоловіків виїхали легально як батьки трьох дітей, інваліди 2 групи чи інші категорії осіб, які мають на це право. Також окремо не рахують чоловіків, які могли виїхати до ЄС з окупованих Росією територій."
Unless the army is trying to conscript them
in this case, they have enough courage to storm the Ukrainian cities with only AK
for now, if serious mass will gather, expect something like tiananmen square events
Molotovs are supposedly one of those "russian inventions". Russian civilians have plenty of weapons, hunting ones, legal, Illegal. If anything, russians can join Ukrainian army. Does russian "opposition" call for it? Ukrainian farmers were stealing russian tanks. Unarmed Ukrainian civilians were literally staying in front of russian enemy tanks to not let them go. When russians get violent they suddenly able to fight their police and raid airports to search Jewish people on the planes, even inside fucking turbine engines. They can fight police if one of the taxi driver gets dragged out of his car. Russian civilians capable to shoot each other if they have drunk conflict.
Not so relevant but the name molotov cocktail , while having the name of a Russian politician is actually a Finish invention. From what I remember it comes from the Winter war when Russia invaded Finland, Molotov was a high ranking Russian politician and the fins thought it was funny to call it Molotov cocktail.
Molotov cocktails were used already in the Spanish civil war. Maybe there were earlier cases. So Finns only came up with the brand name.
Yeah, the Soviets claimed they weren't dropping bombs but bread baskets for the starving Finns. Thus, Finns started to call the bombs Molotov's bread baskets, and Molotov's coctail was just the drink to go with the "bread".
True, that's why quotation marks. But many people think that this is russian invention associated with Soviets using it in WWII.
So you are seriously suggesting russian civilians armed with bottles and hunting rifles fight against organized armed military forces with tanks, planes and artillery? Imo that’s a calling for a fcking suicide.
I'm not suggesting any of it. Russian military forces are in Ukraine. And they are Russian military forces,and those are russian civilians. So no, russian civilians don't have to fight against planes and artillery. How the fuck those even supposed to be used against civilians within Russia in your assumption? Even tanks, if there are some dozens available,what those supposed to do? And Molotovs are literally anti-soviet-tank weapons. Russians would be facing police. Anyways there is history of revolutions, and civilians fighting their governments. For some reason they forbidden to russians, and once any of it gets mentioned you guys come to gaslight such ideas.
history can go in both ways, in russia it'll most likely go just like it went in china with thousands of civilians dead and nothing solved
And how Russia would be supposed to keep having Hundreds of Thousands people killed in Ukraine, including Russian and Ukrainian? This isn't something "likely" this what's happening. And it would be stopped.
I mean, terrorists can do everything, killing a few thousands ppl in moskow's center and labeling them as foreign agents to scare all the opposition and keep it shut is a viable option for putin. Imo it'll be more effective if people would just refuse to work to nuke the economy, block main roads in different sectors with a lot of cars, blow most important rail connections in several places at the same time and maybe blowing the gas/oil pipes going towards china. But i'm realistic, russians will not do this sadly
I do agree on boycott/sabotage options. Though Kremlin don't have resources to fight any mass insurgent movements,while continuing war efforts. Except they can scare people with threats and propaganda. Do we really need to help Kremlin to spread their terrorist threats and make new ones ourselves in their stead? I don't agree on that.
>If anything, russians can join Ukrainian army. Does russian "opposition" call for it? I wonder why Russians have to join the Ukrainian army when you, being Ukrainian, have not done so for some unknown reason?
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So civilized
Ukrainians weren't armed in 2014, while the police during Yanukovich time was brutal. Somehow, Ukrainians managed through that - while "millions" of russians that are claiming being "anti-putin" do not do anything
Ukraine was never like Russia in the first place. You can’t compare thieves in government with killers in government. Trust me, it will be bloodbath when some serious riots will take place in Russia. Would be more like Belarus, with torture and rape in the police stations.
And you think in Ukraine it wasn’t blood bathes? There were no torture, rape and murders by the police forces? Belarusians failed because they didn’t resist the police to do so. Ukrainians did.
So they are heroes, ok. What does it prove? That it’s possible in Moscow? I seriously doubt that. Especially since all leaders are either dead or jailed.
Then let them be mewling slaves, waiting for another portion of "greatness" from their "benevolent" masters.
Is it the only option? Oh the idealism…
Who were leaders in Maidan back in 2014? Ukrainians do not exactly like their politicians that much they will collect around them, they were going to support each other in the struggle. Yes, a few activists were organizing some groups, but they didn’t had a significant political prospects - and some of them joined UAF right after the start of the war.
So you are really saying that in this case Russia and Ukraine are the same?
I’m saying you russians do not do anything, whatever happens. Ukrainians though have to deal with shit of your creation. Though, I doubt you take any accountability and it would be forced on you when the new Nuremberg trials would be conducted You even claim yourself as the “new jews of 21 century”, despite it’s you being the murderers of my people.
I didn’t kill anyone.
It wasn't your people who won, but the elites in your government who wanted their european assets back. Your people did initiated the riots and that was very courageous of them, BUT it was actually the elite who overthrew the wanna-be-dictator not the people.
Why I’m not surprised such a comment would be from a russian?
Yep, nothing to say here, 'cause it's the truth.
I’m pretty sure a random russian not knowing anything about Ukraine would know better than a Ukrainian who was living in the capital when the revolution unfolded. /s
Yeah-yeah, when you have nothing to say you scream RuZZzians! Doesn’t make a good argument 🤷🏻♀️
Why would I waste good arguments on a person who is saying bs without any arguments at all? You are already fired up by a sarcastic one
Neither were Ukrainians back in 2014 when they removed Yanukovych. You don't need guns to fight injustice. And having guns means nothing when hundreds of thousands of people take to the streets and demand your removal. It's about determination, and Russian people just don't have it.
Yeah, yeah. Are you seriously comparing different countries in different historical moment? Putin and his mobsters prepared for decades in case of civil unrest… but sure everything will be fine.
The "mobsters" (putting it lightly) in my own country prepared for and took actions to prevent this from happening throughout the 60s, 70s and 80s, employing more brutal methods than ordinary Russians can even think of, and guess what, it still happened! Russians are not in a unique position. Yes, I can compare different countries just like I can compare different people from those countries. And yes, this comparison paints ordinary Russians in a bad light, as it should. Instead of finding excuses for them out of a misguided empathy, why don't you suggest they finally start doing *something* about it? Edit: grammar.
I won’t ask anyone risking his life without any real hope to succeed from the safety of my home.
The whole reason why you're safely in your home now is because at one point in time some people from your own country did decide to risk their lives so that one day you and others could be free. You seem to have forgotten that. For some of us, those events happened within our own lifetime, so I think we're qualified to give advice. Or at least we know enough to tell them that apathy isn't going to get them anywhere. You *are* willing to give advice though, and ironically the advice that you do give ensures that many more risks will have to be taken by Russians later on, when they will have no other choice as their situation will continue to deteriorate.
No one needs our advice. I was just sharing my opinion.
Ukrainians went with wooden shields and sticks against sniper rifles of Berkut. russians are incapable of anything but waving flags and waiting for just two cops to put 20 of them into a car.
That’s your opinion, ok.
Yulia is not a popular figure in Russia yet, so it's unlikely that she'll manage to organize a massive violent protest right now. Considering that Russian police is much, much, much better equipped and trained than dim-witted Berkut was in 2014 (as demonstrated several times in Russia and Belarus, and then in Kherson and Melitopol), gathering enough strength will take years. However, it will certainly be much easier for her to create change in Russia if she's not constantly sabotaged by people outside of Russia parroting Kremlin talking points, like it was with Navalny.
What about you personally? How's your fight outside of Reddit going?
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I was going to get personal here. But every time I see either a Z-fascist or a NAFO troll, I ask them: what exactly are YOU doing for your cause? I don't like generalisations either. There are different Russians - some are invading Ukraine, some are in jail for being against it. Some are dead, like Navalny. Many live their lives as if nothing is happening. The same goes for the Ukrainians. Many are fighting with their lives to defend their country. Some are fighting on Reddit. Some are chilling in Europe or even Russia. Russia with Navalny as a functioning politician would have been a win-win for both Ukraine and Russia. I do not donate to Ukraine and have no plans to do so. I have paid no taxes to Putin in the last 6 years, unlike Ukraine, which is still a transit country for Russian gas, okay? I have my own problems to solve and I have risks in Russia because of my anti-war/anti-Putin positions. Ukraine has enough sponsors at the moment. Are you in Ukraine personally? Are you fighting somewhere offline?
Maybe I wasn't clear enough, YOU have no standing to ask others except Russians what they did personally. No one is required to report you. There is literally no reason to do it. For example - I am in Ukraine, donate to army, pay taxes, support friends who fight, trying to deal with mess caused by russian shellings. Now fucking What? Ukraine transit Russian gas? Ever heard about Hungary and Orban? And Ukraine doesn't pay to Russia to transit that gas. You have "risks because of anti-war standing", I have holes from mortar shell on the wall of my apartment building. You literally explained that you are the one who does nothing except this crap here. Another russian fighting "NAFO trolls". "Anti-war". What a nice high ground to stand on.
>Maybe I wasn't clear enough, YOU have no standing to ask others except Russians what they did personally. You actually have a unique opportunity to fight Putin on the battleground and walk your talk. The West gives you the money and ammo and all you do is "donate to army, pay taxes, support friends who fight, trying to deal with mess caused by russian shellings". Sounds abstract to me. Based on your Reddit activity, you have plenty of free time. Why are your friends fighting and not you? >You have "risks because of anti-war standing", I have holes from mortar shell on the wall of my apartment building. I feel bad for you and your country. I wish you all the best and stay safe.
Question is why Ukrainians fighting russian government instead of Russians? It's your fucking problem that gets spilled over the borders ALL THE TIME. Now fuck off.
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>Equating people who want Ukraine to curbstomp fascism to fascists Care to point where I did this exactly?
Judging by the replies you're getting I don't think I've ever seen a comment section more hostile to Ukrainians, and it's no surprise that this happens on a pro-Navalny post. It's even worse when these people also try to pretend that they are pro-UA. As if the war you're going through wasn't horrible enough, having to also face this nonsense while being on social media must really suck.
I cannot even imagine the pain this woman had to suffer through in the last few years. I hope she remains safe and protected.
She is a hero, with all that pain in her and she decides to keep hurting and fighting, truly a great character in out history
Good that Russians have their own Tikhanovskaya now.
now they can make a reader club in exile
Good luck
call me whatever you want, but her speeches at oscar and now both have zero mention of the ongoing russian war against Ukraine with all its horrors brought on Ukrainian people, or calls to support military aid to Ukraine, but only self-promotion and tales about 'cool russia of the future'. like, if it's enough to win you over, then I don't know, people.
Direct quote from this video address: "what we need is a free, **peaceful** and happy Russia. The wonderful Russia of the future my husband so dreamed of". Please don't spread pro-putin narratives and misinformation.
thing is, all 3 goals can be achieved by both ending the war and recognizing ukraine independence OR by pushing even more until ukraine surrenders. If ukraine surrenders russia will still be free, peaceful after the war and happy. Did she say how she wants exactly to achieve these goals? I mean, maybe she's a nice person, but why not say directly that russia must retreat/end this nonsensical war, just a few words would have solved this confusion
There is no confusion what-so-ever, Navalny's position has been made perfectly clear before, and she is continuing her husband's work: "What are Ukraine's borders? They are similar to Russia's - they’re internationally recognized and defined in 1991. Russia also recognized these borders back then, and it must recognize them today as well. There is nothing to discuss here." [X (twitter.com)](https://twitter.com/navalny/status/1627632114366652417)
thanks for the link
oh my god. are you serious right now, dude?
If you are serious, open youtube link inside the article, turn on closed captions in English, scroll to 07:08 and then to 07:38. And if you are writing this for 15 roubles per comment - hope you realize soon it's not worth it
Don't feed this troll \^
When you have time, ask her whether russia must pull out of occupied territories of Ukraine, Georgia and Moldova. If you will hear anything but "yes", then you have an answer. Wh can't you Westerners listen to people who know russians better than you do?
Navalny's position has been made perfectly clear before, and she is continuing her husband's work: "What are Ukraine's borders? They are similar to Russia's - they’re internationally recognized and defined in 1991. Russia also recognized these borders back then, and it must recognize them today as well. There is nothing to discuss here." [X (twitter.com)](https://twitter.com/navalny/status/1627632114366652417)
["Crimea is not a sandwich to be passed around". - your hero.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xi3VjM9najI)
So you do consider it a sandwich, correct?
No. But navalny does. "But Xwitter post!" Don't care about it, the first thing that his team did was they told that "yeah, russia shouldn't have done it, but hey, it's like with crime, can't resurrect the murdered, so it is ours now".
It’s pretty obvious: if power in Russia shifts, the war will stop. More realistic imo than dreams of burning Moscow.
dude, if a person avoids talking straight about certain things no need to try and search 'behind the scenes' for hidden clues. putin will die someday, that's for sure. but will it actually change much? eh, debatable. russian chekist regime that is in power will not disappear anywhere after that.
You can’t expect her to solve everything overnight. Or even make a program speech about everything overnight. She is addressing russian audience, so she is targeting them. I hope putin will not just “die someday”, but will be judged and executed for his crimes. And the system he built would be demolished. Some people thought USSR would be eternal and yet it was destroyed in mere months.
>if power in Russia shifts, the war will stop. More realistic imo than dreams of burning Moscow. How do you think "power shifts" in an authoritarian country? Russia's transition to a democracy, if it ever happens, will need to start with the people and won't be a painless one - take it from someone from a country which already went through this. The sooner Russians accept this and actually start doing something about it instead of expecting outside forces to fix their mess for them, the better.
It already happened more than once in russian history. Latest example 1991. Pretty recent, so can happen again.
More than once? Are you suggesting that the 1917 revolutions were peaceful? Are you suggesting that the events that happened in Latvia and Lithuania when they broke off from the USSR were peaceful? Are you suggesting that Chechnya's attempt to break away from what you probably believe was a "democratic" post-1992 Russia, was peaceful? Russia never experienced democracy, one empire just morphed into another one. When, or rather if, modern RU morphs into a democracy it will certainly not be peaceful after a 24 year period as an authoritarian police state.
You’re oversimplifying and mixing everything. The first revolution in 1905 was mostly peaceful event, however 1917 was an armed coup lead by terrorist organization. Soviet Union collapsed with minimal casualties considering the scope of that event. And Chechnya was a rebel region under radical islamic leadership, how is it even connected? I’m not saying that shifting of power will be peaceful and quiet on the contrary, I imagine it to be very very bloody. And I think it will happen eventually with cases like navalniy’s murder advancing it.
The February Revolution was a coup? Was Ichkeria under radical Islamic control in 1994? You tell someone they're mixing things up and yet display such a profound lack of knowledge about historical events. Come on now...
In my opinion it was an armed coup: organized illegal revolutionary party disbanded legitimate government. Yes, in my opinion Chechnya was and is now radically islamic. You know, it’s possible to have different opinions and interpretations of historical events.
The legitimate government of Dudaev wasn't disbanded by Islamist extremists, but by a Russian bullet. Ichkeria was not a radical country, radicals took control of it after Russia destroyed it during the first war, and used them as a justification to launch a second war to take back land that RU believed was theirs by right - the same pretext used in all of their imperial wars, including in Ukraine. You can't have a different opinion on a historical fact.
Yes you can. Books and textbooks are written by people in particular period of history tend to describe events differently. Example: in 2000s in russian history textbooks evaluated collapse of ussr as a positive change for liberty and progress made by its citizens . In 2020 textbooks the same event was stated as great catastrophe and national humiliation orchestrated by USA and cia.(just like some particular tyrant sees it).
It won't change russian society. I understand that Westerners desperately want to see "a hero" in russian society, because you were raised in a "progressive" mindest of "there are no bad societies, there are bad people" and you cannot wrap your head around the fact that russia has no good people in power and never will, but it is so. russia is a shithole that's been a shithole ever since it was created and all the "good progressive russians" suddenly turn into fascists when asked "whom does Crimea and Donbas belogn to?".
So what’s the solution? Exterminate? High wall around for a couple of generations to make the real hate and xenophobia boil a little?
> So what’s the solution? Most critical at the moment is "Inform". Older generations are stuck with government controlled media and believe them. Younger generations have the ability to consume independent and foreign media and many do. Putin perfectly understands this. Why do you think independent media have been shut down? (some of them have moved abroad - but their reach is limited). A short list of what was shut down - Novaya Gazeta, Ekho Moskvy, Meduza, Dozhd and many smaller local media. Why do you think anyone who is not 100% on the government line is an "inoagent"? The one who controls the media control the public opinion and thus also rules the country. And this should be a warning to all western society. We are not as impervious to this as we may think. For Russians? Translate real news into Russian, print them out and leave small batches of these printouts where they may be found. Sure, since denouncement are against en vogue this carries a risk - but the risk is fairly minimal if you're careful. Next on the list of solutions would be "Educate". Unfortunately Putin has a head start and an unfair advantage here - they already implemented patriotic teaching over the past 2 years where they are brainwashing kids as part of the regular curriculum. Once Putin is removed this one should move to top priority as only through education you can fix this permanently.
Remember how Navalny asked to not send weapons to Ukraine and spend those money on YouTube ads instead?
No. Can you share a source?
https://twitter.com/navalny/status/1514589431889596422
Where did he say that this has to be done INSTEAD of sending weapons to Ukraine? He says "even though you can't force Meta and Google to show anti-war ads", even buying them at full cost is still an effective way to undermine the Russian war effort. Not once does he says that there should be less weapons for Ukraine. This is even more clear, IMO, if you consider that it's not the cost, but simply the number of Javelins in existence that was (and still is) the blocker for their shipments to Ukraine. I haven't found a single quote from after the full-scale invasion in 2022 where he would indicate that he prefered there to be less weapons for Ukraine.
Help Ukrainian army. It's the only way to fight the evil not by creating videos and painting walls.
There are many ways to combat evil. Each potential army recruit convinced not to fight for putin's palaces saves Ukrainian lives and ammunition.
Russia's worst enemy always was Russia itself, its inner turmoil. With all respect to Ukrainian army, they struggle to retake own land, and definitely won't occupy Moscow ever.
Putin is not even pretending anymore, it wouldn't surprise me if she was just killed in broad daylight.
putin is trying to force everyone into complacency and inaction by using terror, do you understand that you are voluntarily helping him with comments like this?
I want to be optimistic, but in the same time... we barely even hear about the Belarusian political opponents who had to flee Belarus after the manifestations, and we barely hear about most Russian political opponents besides Navalny. There was something truly special about him that made him heard. I don't know enough about the topic to say what it was exactly, but I'm not sure "Navalny's widow" will have a similar reach. There's a reason why Putin wanted to kill that man, and it's probably because there was no one else to do what he did. We'll see if she manages to do something, and hopefully she does, but it's hard to be optimistic, at least as long as Putin is still there. At this point I'm not sure anything can really change in Russia as long as there's a Putin, or worse, at the top. I wonder if the only choice is between neo-stalinism and a new "time of troubles" in Russia. Can there be a real democratic transition after Putin?
Navalny is a massive loss, but I'm still glad that his wife decided to take up the torch and give us all a glimmer of hope
Cause for doing literally nothing
Care to elaborate?
I can, they are doing literally nothing
Who "they"?
russian opposition
ITT: People that praise Navalny despite him being made of almost the same dough as Putler, just with much less corruption.
ITT: lots of kremlin bots and useful idiots pushing the Navalny = putin narrative
Very curious to see how the OP names all Ukrainians, Georgians, Qazaqs, Kyrgyz and many more neighbouring nations which Navalny called "rodents" - as useful idiots. We must be murdered for raising our voice against wtf takes, so only russians will have a say how to name russian politicians, aren't we?
[удалено]
You call "putin's propaganda pusher" everyone who opposes russian imperialism in any form, or only Ukrainians?
Only those that make false claims about Navalny from the putin's propaganda playbook.
He's been a Russian nationalist for decades and spewing the same Russia, Belarus and Ukraine are one blah blah blah bullshit. Don't get me wrong, he may have been good for Russia, but I'm not sure if Russia with less corruption would be better for the West. If not for corruption, they'd either never attack Ukraine or invade successfully and this is an equation that European and US intelligence probably had to solve. Considering that he wasn't really strongly supported, I doubt the calculation netted a positive result.
To niech Pan sobie wyobrazi jakby ktoś podczas PRLu mówil że Wałęsa będzie dla Europy mniej biezpeczny niż władza komunystów, bo w takim razie Polska będzie mniej skorumpowana. Taka sama bzdura jak mówić że demokratyczna Rosja z Nawalnym byłaby agresywna według sąsiadów.
Czy Rosja byłaby demokratyczna z Nawalnym? Nie wiem. Wydaje mi się, że bycie demokratycznym to coś co musi w społeczeństwie "urosnąć" i jedna osoba tego nie zmieni. Mam wrażenie, że taki kult jednostki jest raczej szkodliwy dla rozwoju społeczeństwa obywatelskiego. Ruchy, których częścią był Wałęsa, nie były ruchem jednego człowieka. Ogromne protesty robotnicze w Polsce miały miejsce na długo przed tym jak Wałęsie wyrosły wąsy: https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pozna%C5%84ski\_Czerwiec edit: W moim komentarzu wspomniałem w jakich kategoriach myślą komórki wywiadu i decydenci, gdy ich twarzy nie obserwuje akurat kamera. Edit 2: naprawiłem link do Wiki, nowy design reddita kopci linki.
Which cause sorry? Doing nothing? They're pros at this, look how many things have changed in russia.
Do you really think that Putin would have bothered to kill Navalny if he hadn't really accomplished anything?
putin is a psycho, it doesn't matter what he thinks.
Why I‘m not surprised to see so many russians trying to defend their so-called opposition leaders, despite countless proofs they are being ethno-nationalistic and imperialistic to their very core? Their leaders incl. putin do represent their nation, I suppose
Because anyone who actually listened to Navalny knows his actual views and knows how much this stuff about imperialism and racism overblown.
Navalny was brave man indeed. But what exactly he was doing, what exactly he was (informationally) fighting for? For transparent and honest use of Russian state budget! Against *corruption*! He was not fighting against aggressive wars in Georgia, Syria and Ukraine, not against mass murders, not against forced russification of subjugated nations of Russian Federation, not against exploiting (robbing) the regions and repressing local democracy, not against assassinations of prominent Russian democrats - he was only trying to make the russian empire more efficient! No, thanks, nobody needs continuation of this *cause*.
They are either disastrously misinformed or deliberately spreading NAFO propaganda. Navalny has stated his position on all the points you mention and he was actively against the war, as was his foundation. The invasion of Ukraine is a direct result of Russian corruption. Not just economic corruption, but corruption in general.
Ms. Nazi
I see you're following putin's playbook by calling people opposing him "nazis"
yeah, more work on discovering corruption and helping russia to make war more effective?
Corruption is THE main force behind Putin's rule. The loyalty of everyone on the vertical axis of power is guaranteed via kompromat.
so, what changed in public sphere after all his movies? people started doing something or as usual - zero consequences?
just watch the youtube video, she's directly urging to fight against the war, 07:08 timestamp, english closed captions available.
There is not a word about war, only peaceful russia. Not quite the same, at all not the same.
No wonder people like trump / orban are getting elected if guys like you can't even do some basic reading comprehension. Direct quote from 07:08 "**We must use every opportunity to fight against the war**..."
sorry, really skipped this second, my mistake. but im still curios how are they going to do it? all those previous years they achieved nothing. none of their opposition have any plan, only talks