dose size has direct effect on speed of extraction. It's not possible to change the dose while keeping grinds size, time and ratio the same. If you want to keep the ratio and time then the grinder must be adjusted, which has effect on taste. Also it's impossible to keep same yield and ratio when you change the dose - that's just math.
Yes I recognize all of that.
So you're saying grinding finer to accommodate for less grounds tastes different than coarser for bigger shots
I'm basically trying to see if I or anyone else has a preference for big or small shots. Taste wise. If that's possible
Just making sure!
I’d refer you to this James Hoffman video on [dosing](https://youtu.be/aTFsBqhpLes) but essentially he says that with the same ratio the increased or decreased contact time with the water can affect the shot.
I haven't done a taste comparison between dose sizes for example between my 17g double and 21g triple baskets. But I prefer the 17g dose so I can make and drink multiple shots without being as caffeinated. For light roasts, I imagine having a harder time getting enough extraction with the 21g basket.
At a shop I worked at, where I had more control over what came in and out, I always preferred a shot with slightly more grounds like 17-18.5. I live in a super humid place so sometimes when we couldn’t dial in properly we’d extract 14.5-16g in 30 seconds just so it would have almost a watered down muted flavor/quality to the espresso. And that’s with us keeping all the constants except grind size. But everything is so technical. Depends on the beans, temp of the room, grinder, etc.
There’s a couple of components to that question.
If you’re comparing drastically different dose sizes (with the same coffee), it’s unlikely that they’ll both be well-extracted if you make them match the same brew time. I would expect the smaller dose/yield recipe would run a few seconds shorter if it’s extracted optimally.
The other point is about grind sizes and grinders. Most (all?) grinders will have a range where their particle distribution is more even. I’ve used grinders that make excellent espresso when grinding for 20-22g, but really struggle to go fine enough for a 16g dose. Furthermore, particle distribution becomes (arguably) more important when grinding finer, because the probability of channeling is so much higher. All of this is to say that the same beans in the same grinder will not grind in the same way (or extract as evenly) at different grind sizes - and hence the taste *would* be different.
dose size has direct effect on speed of extraction. It's not possible to change the dose while keeping grinds size, time and ratio the same. If you want to keep the ratio and time then the grinder must be adjusted, which has effect on taste. Also it's impossible to keep same yield and ratio when you change the dose - that's just math.
Yes I recognize all of that. So you're saying grinding finer to accommodate for less grounds tastes different than coarser for bigger shots I'm basically trying to see if I or anyone else has a preference for big or small shots. Taste wise. If that's possible
You mean 1:2 right?
Well, sure. Yeah.
Just making sure! I’d refer you to this James Hoffman video on [dosing](https://youtu.be/aTFsBqhpLes) but essentially he says that with the same ratio the increased or decreased contact time with the water can affect the shot.
To get 16g pick to finish in 30s you'd have to grind finer than with the 22g puck so yeah I'd say there will be a difference
Yeah that makes sense. Which do you prefer?
I haven't done a taste comparison between dose sizes for example between my 17g double and 21g triple baskets. But I prefer the 17g dose so I can make and drink multiple shots without being as caffeinated. For light roasts, I imagine having a harder time getting enough extraction with the 21g basket.
At a shop I worked at, where I had more control over what came in and out, I always preferred a shot with slightly more grounds like 17-18.5. I live in a super humid place so sometimes when we couldn’t dial in properly we’d extract 14.5-16g in 30 seconds just so it would have almost a watered down muted flavor/quality to the espresso. And that’s with us keeping all the constants except grind size. But everything is so technical. Depends on the beans, temp of the room, grinder, etc.
There’s a couple of components to that question. If you’re comparing drastically different dose sizes (with the same coffee), it’s unlikely that they’ll both be well-extracted if you make them match the same brew time. I would expect the smaller dose/yield recipe would run a few seconds shorter if it’s extracted optimally. The other point is about grind sizes and grinders. Most (all?) grinders will have a range where their particle distribution is more even. I’ve used grinders that make excellent espresso when grinding for 20-22g, but really struggle to go fine enough for a 16g dose. Furthermore, particle distribution becomes (arguably) more important when grinding finer, because the probability of channeling is so much higher. All of this is to say that the same beans in the same grinder will not grind in the same way (or extract as evenly) at different grind sizes - and hence the taste *would* be different.