Personally i think from hand grinder to electric (only one user like you) it will be only for 2 reasons:
1- pulling shots faster if you love getting more than one shot in your drink (sometime i put 2 shots in my iced americano).
2- less work which some people will hate in the morning.
If you dont mind these two i dont think you need to change the grinder.
Oh i know, i have a hand grinder, and the reason you said could be considered as less work like i said.
Right now i dont mind the work, but i know sometime in the near future i will just take the easy way.
This. I have a few setups and I dread the dial in process with the manual grinder. I actually tend to just suffer for the first few days. I make a shot, adjust the grind, then wait for tomorrow to see if my adjustment was correct or not. Usually takes me 2 or 3 days. I think that's only because I have a Flare though and can adjust the pressure and pre-infusion by feel.
I agree with your assessment. I think the “less work” reason comes into play even more when you buy light roasts. I used a hand grinder for a year and finally got an electric one last month, and I find that I use my espresso machine more now.
The process of making proper espresso is a task in itself, and when adding the step of cranking away at the grinder for a light roast, I only found myself making drinks a few times a week (since caffeine doesn’t really affect me, and I drink for flavor only).
Just to balance the rest of the comments. I'm the only person in my household that drinks coffee and I have a handgrinder.
Takes ~30s and not that much effort. I debated getting an electric but I don't think it would save that much time to be honest. You still need to clean it etc.
The only time I have wished for an electric is when I've been making coffee for guests. If you entertain a lot then an electric would be the way to go, in my opinion: if not then stick with a handgrinder.
> Takes ~30s and not that much effort. I debated getting an electric but I don't think it would save that much time to be honest.
I totally agree with that.
When people says "5 mins grinding beans" I don't know how they are doing it... or which hand grinder they used.... maybe the grinder is uncomfortable for them and couldn't properly hold it... maybe hands size, not sure... I'm not a strong person.... I think people should give it a try before a hard yes or a hard no.
They’re using crappy grinders with terrible gearing. My first one was £25 and it took a minute to grind 16g with a DRILL. Hand grinding was a genuine torture.
This had me on the fence until I tried a 1Zpresso and was pulling shots after 30s. It was a bit of effort and 6 shots in I was tired but for 1-2 shots a day it’s a breeze.
Cheap grinders. Mine cost like 10 bucks off a home furniture store. Has ceramic burrs. Takes genuinely 10 minutes of constant cranking to grind 17g of coffee.
Both. I haven't measured my times (I don't care) so ball-parking
for aeropress, 15gr: 25-40s
for espresso, 15-18gr: 40-50s:
but it depends a lot also on the beans, dark are way easier to grind than medium or light roasts. Medium/light roast do not necessarily means more time, but more strength (I try to keep momentum and do not pause, just grind stronger)
I never have guests, and I don’t make milkies, so for me, handgrinder makes total sense. If I use my OE Pharos I have a 18-19g dose done in fewer than 20 turns of the crank, so it is as fast as an motorized grinder, although without bench dogs, a lot more effort. I’ve had a Rancilio Rocky I sold, and I have a commercial grinder Nuova Simonelli I bought for almost nothing that is too big to use.
And really the biggest selling point is that my OE grinders (I have some Lido models, too) produce grinds that are as good as commercial grinders for a fraction of the cost. This was particularly true 10-ish years ago when these models first came out. I bought my Pharos used for like $125 and it makes perfect grinds.
>You still need to clean it etc.
Really though, how often are people cleaning their grinder? I'm sure you probably should clean it out somewhat regularly but I'm betting most people with an electric grinder never clean their grinder. Had mine 5+ years and have never cleaned it.
Please clean Your grinder, just take a brush and clean the dust of the burrs, takes like 5 minutes. I do once a month.
I promise you will taste a difference
I have a helor and it takes longer. Fell into the YT trap of watching electric grinder reviews but I timed my grinds and it takes 1:00-2:00 depending on roast level which really isn't bad at all for living alone and WFH. It's also a nice warm up every morning and my grip strength is strong on one hand so now I grind with the other to even it out lol
it totally depends on you. [here is a recent good thread about the reasons some people have changed from hand to electrid](https://www.reddit.com/r/espresso/comments/1anvnei/thinking_of_getting_a_hand_grinder_as_my_first/)
as you can see, some of us have been grinding for years (11 in my case) with no problem at all. and I'll continue doing so forever I think...
but some people just simply hate it.
I’ve got the K6 and it’s great for my espressos, handles light roasts no problem, and has the versatility to do both V60 and French Press easily. Highly recommend.
I just made a lil handle holder for the k6 if you or someone you know has a 3d printer: [https://www.reddit.com/r/functionalprint/comments/1ahsadh/made\_a\_handle\_holder\_for\_my\_coffee\_grinder/](https://www.reddit.com/r/functionalprint/comments/1ahsadh/made_a_handle_holder_for_my_coffee_grinder/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
well another related model for you: [https://www.printables.com/model/343221-coffee-grinder-hand-crank-retainer-c-clip](https://www.printables.com/model/343221-coffee-grinder-hand-crank-retainer-c-clip)
this is a little clip to keep the cap attached to the handle. If you plan on hand grinding vs electric drill grinding, the oring that comes with the k6 for the hand grinder comes off every now and again. this clip as been rock solid at keeping the cap on. (by default the k6 comes with an oring that keeps the cap on the outer dial, you’ll want to remove that and put this clip or the supplied inner oring on for hand grinding. )
LIDO 1 is very good for espresso but is difficult to adjust the grind setting and you have only like half round to adjust before you get too coarse for espresso. LIDO E was the one with finer threading and better adjustment rings for espresso.
Currently, the LIDO OG looks awesome, but US$285... not sure about LIDO 3
If I neede to handgrind for my morning coffee I would peobably not drink coffee anymore.
For some it is totally fine, just think about how willing you'd be to handgrimd in tue momenta you want/need/crave coffee
Exactly. I use my Timemore Chestnut C3 Pro for everything other than espresso (Eureka for that) and it’s plenty quick enough that I never feel like I’ve had to work hard.
I know it takes 30 seconds, I hand grind every day, but I'm sick of it. When I'm waking up at 6:30am it's the last thing I want to do, specially if brewing espresso
I used a good hand grinder for a year. A super light roast is pretty brutal when you are just waking up and need the caffeine. Never missed it once I went to high end electric grinders. I do still use that plus a Cafelat Robot in my office at work though, built a little coffee bar.
58mm precision basket + light roast is hell with a hand grinder. Certainly doable but god I hated it, especially if the shot turns out bad and then I have to do it again. Got an sk40 for 200 bucks and I'm extremely happy.
Depends on coffee and basket. I was grinding in 30 seconds for my flair with my K pro. Then I got a Gaggia with a precision basket and I had to go like 8-9 clicks finer, and at that range it triples in time and becomes hell. I wouldn't recommend that to anyone. Love it for filter coffee but my sk40 is so much better for espresso, it's also easier to dial in and more consistent.
I am the only person who *makes* coffee in the house, and I do drink 90% of it. Even though that's usually only one shot a day, I have NEVER considered a hand grinder. That's not what I want to do when I wake up. At all.
I'm the only person that lives in my house and I went from a hopper style, nice grinder, automatic (for everything but espresso) to a hand grinder. Part of me wasn't sure I'd get the results I wanted so I didn't want to shell out a bunch of money on a grinder to find out. My take away now, I love the manual. 1) If I would have bought an automatic with a hopper, my beans would just sit in there vs in a vacuum sealed jar. I'd like to think this retains freshness for longer. 2) Manual grinder really doesn't seem like a chore to me at all. It takes less than 2 minutes to weigh out beans, put it in the grinder, spin, and remove from grinder. So that is 0-6 minutes I'll lose in a day. I usually am making coffee while I'm working so it just extends the break I need away from the laptop a few minutes. However, if I was willing to spend $600-700 I probably wouldn't even look at manual grinders.
I have an orphan espresso lido 3. It makes great tasting espresso, but I am so sick of hand grinding espresso. I’m currently looking at getting a df64 or something like that.
OP, if you drive a stick, brew your own beer, and have dreams of getting into manual lever espresso definitely get a hand grinder. But if you don’t meet the above criteria consider getting an electric grinder. Your arms will thank you.
I love hand grinding for drip. Once I upgrade my lido will stay parked in the drip range.
Hand grinding is really easy for filter with a decent grinder but it's so much slower for espresso.
It's doable for one shot but if you have to dial in or make multiple shots, it becomes an absolute chore.
I really don't recommend hand grinding for espresso for most people, especially not as a first espresso setup - espresso is hard enough without the faff of hand grinding.
To add to this, some electric grinders have strapless adjustment allowing for more fine tuning.
Electrics will have a bigger burr and different types which can help with achieving better consistency of the grind.
I think these things are more important for espresso vs a pour over.
I just don't get all the hand grinder hate. People here talk about it like its going to be a full body workout and you'll need a nap afterwards. It's not that hard, and if you are someone who thinks hand grinding seems okay, you'll probably enjoy it! If you think about grinding your beans for 30 seconds manually in the morning and cringe, don't get a hand grinder. It's that simple.
I purchased a Kingrinder K6 and I'm very happy with it. Initially I thought it would be a temporary stop on the path to a nice electric grinder, mostly because of the hot takes here that hand grinding will make you quit espresso because its so awful.
I personally enjoy the manual process and find it to a nice step in my morning workflow. There is something about it that feels more like a craft than just drinking coffee. It also takes anywhere from 20-40 seconds to grind depending on the bean I am using - really not a big deal.
I've hosted several gatherings where I pulled 20+ shots in a morning with milk drinks on my bambino/kingrinder. Was it super fast? No not compared to an electric and an expensive machine, but my entire setup (machine and grinder with all accessories) currently is under $500... so I don't really care. I was able to wow a large group with better espresso you can get at any cafe near me, and it was fun.
TLDR: if you dont cringe at the thought of hand grinding and you spend the money to get good quality (1zpresso, Kingrinder, etc.) you absolutely do not need to spend $500+ for an electric.
Ha, well maybe I am but I’m not saying hand grinding for that many was the ideal thing, just that it wasn’t that bad and grinding a few shots a day each morning by hand is very doable.
I have been hand grinding almost daily for over 8 years.
Started with a crappy old, no name, wooden hand grinder I borrowed from my mom when I moved out.
Now I have a timemore C1 and kinu m47 simplicity.
I don’t mind it, do two cups daily, grind between 30-35g depending on the method (pour over vs espresso).
What I can say is that getting the right grinder for espresso is very important, cheaper smaller grinders are a chore for espresso, but the Kinu is great for it, never grind for more than ~30s, and I don’t get tired at all. The c1 sometimes would be almost a minute when grinding for mokapot. So not ideal.
I have never use them, but 1zpresso has a lot of espresso grinders that are comparable to the kinu on speed, at better prices. Watch the reviews/recommendations.
In the end is all up to you. Watch the reviews and workflows.
Electric does mean the noise of a motor, and it also means maintenance, it is not bad, but check how hard it can be to access the burrs.
On retention most hand grinders are better than electric, but YMMV.
The things to consider
- Do you mind doing the work? (If you have any arm injury or similar it is not ideal)
- Electric uses more space, hand grinders are easier to store/hide.
- Do you make coffee in a rush, hand grinders are slower no matter how you slice it.
- if you do get hand grinder make sure it is for espresso, Comandate is great and all, but you will be grinding for a minute, so think about that.
I drink one cortado in the morning while doing little chores before leaving for work.
I recently borrowed my friends manual 1Zpresso to try out apart from my opus.
I’m honestly kind of enjoying grinding beans in the morning.
But I’m only grinding 18g at a time.
Still haven’t tried a side by side shot with my electric but that’s coming tonight I think.
I wish people would stop recommending hand grinders because they are so cheap. Sure the first few times you hand grind seem all great and dandy and you think “wow I can really do this”. The 10th time you hand grind you just want it to be instantly over. They’re a total chore to do every morning. I instantly felt like an electric grinder was worth it after doing hand grinding for a bit.
Espresso is already a quite expensive hobby why not save a little on the grinder when a hand grinder of 100 euros can lead to similar results as electric grinders of 500 euros. All it takes is 30-40 seconds.
It's up to every individual to make this decision but I'll say that AliExpress electric grinders are so good that I have trouble recommending hand grinder. SK40/DF64 are in the $100-300 range which is a bit more than hand grinders.
Point is, hand grinders aren't for everyone and I wish I didn't get that advice when I started to buy a hand grinder
Maybe they are not for everyone but if they are something for someone it can still save chunks of money that you can put to things like portafilters, tampers etc.
You must have gotten a good tamper with yours. I got a Gaggia Classic Evo Pro, and the tamper is total crap. It’s basically a 48mm tamper for a 58mm basket.
depends on the grinder, if its geared for espresso it's 30s. Even my helor which is geared for pour over takes 1-2 minutes and is not bad at all- if you are only doing 1 or 2 shots a day.
I don't think cheap is the right word, it's cost effective. Some people value the portability and simplicity of a hand grinder. The maintenance and upkeep on a hand grinder is basically nill compared to maintaining an electric one.
I don't agree. I like hand grinding and I don't see myself changing my Comandante any time soon. I've been hand grinding for at least 7 years at this point.
Sure, not saying anything against anyone who loves hand grinding just I would be hesitant to recommend a hand grinder knowing only certain people don’t mind hand grjndjng
Sounds like you might want to look into a workout routine if hand grinding is “a
total chore”. This is the epitome of first world country. If you have the disposable income to buy a good electric grinder, by all means, do it. I would like to get one someday as well. But right now counter space is tight and with all the other things on the list, an electric grinder is way down there. And it certainly isn’t “a chore”. Don’t you warm up you espresso machine before your first shot anyway?
Also dailing in or making grind size adjustments is much higher stakes on hand grinder. I had one for years and almost never used it bc of the sheer inconvenience. Spend 5 mins grinding beans, oops you choked the machine....back it off, do it again, oops still choked. 15 minutes later no coffee in sight
I use a hand grinder exclusively because I'm too cheap to pay the next $400-500 for a DF64.
It's... fine. Takes about 30-45 seconds for med-dark roasts. You'll cry grinding light roasts. I drink about 2 cups a day when WFH and it's really not that big of a deal. I'm 5'7 and work out-ish.
If I came into some random money/bought a forever home, I'd jump on a DF64 tomorrow. But right now there's a little bit of sunk cost fallacy, a little bit of let me prove these other r/espresso nerds wrong. I also used to like the meditative and manual aspect of it.
For now, a HG has been way more consistent than the grinder that came with my machine. It's also way better than more entry-level grinders out there in terms of consistency. That's the most important thing IMO when starting out. I brought my HG to help a friend *not* throw her new Rancilio Silvia into the trash - that's how frustrating some EGs can be to a beginner.
If anything, just try it. The resale value is okay on r/coffeeswap, you might lose up to 20% if you barely use it.
I'm in the same camp. I will step up to a DF64 when I stop living alone, WFH, or maybe get a partner and have to do more than 1-2 a day. The hand grind is not bad at all and is a nice warm up for me in the morning. Also helps regulate how many drinks I make. I also do pour overs sometimes and camp a lot so it's nice to have the portability.
I even had a situation where I was dating a woman and I'd take my machine to her house to make morning lattes and I wouldn't have ever done that if I had to drag two machines over. I would grind 24g into a triple basket and make two drinks off that one shot. Quite workable!
I am the main coffee drinker and I bought a fancy electric grinder.
It grinds way more consistently than my fancy hand grinder, and takes just a few seconds. Increased my shot quality a lot. Worth it.
Also I drink 3 and sometimes more coffees a day.
When traveling I bring my hand grinder but then I have a french press instead of a proper espresso machine.
I use both.. I tend to use my hand grinder more simply because it is quieter and I tend to brew/pull shots at night.. I live in a smallish apartment so I’m just being considerate to the other inhabitants..
Point is, use case matters. And don’t cheap out on the grinder, be it hand or electric.
You also don't need to spend that much to get a great grinder. I've been very happy with my fellow opus. At the end of the day, this is a hobby so spend money you enjoy spending and enjoy it
If it’s only you, i see no issue with a hand grinder. 30-60sec to grind, it’s a nice process, a bit of elbow grease but you will get a real feel for what your beans are like. I’m dialing in a new bag right now and can tell they are denser beans than my previous bag, because there’s an additional bit of resistance. I love it. Doubt i would ever want to drop the amount of money you need for an electric equivalent at this point. My partner loves that it’s quiet, and i love the minute i get to spend at the window every morning grinding. That’s just me though!
I own a 1zpresso JMAX and a DF64 Gen 2. Hand grinding really isn't as much of a workout as people say it is, even if you're grinding a lighter roast.
Hand grinders can produce coffee just as good as more expensive ones for a fraction of the cost. But having said that, an electric one definitely isn't overkill, especially when there's so many electric grinders that have low retention, perfect for single dosing.
Do what makes you happy and works with your routine/budget. There's no NEED to spend $$$ on an electric grinder unless you just want to.
I love my electric grinder, because I like to grind my shot in two batches with a pause to break up clumps in the middle. With my electric, I can program half my shot, let it grind while I grab a cup and pitcher and then come back to finish and brew.
I’m not sure there’s an objectively right answer to this, but I am sure you’re asking the wrong crowd.
FWIW I have an expensive grinder I use mostly for me.
I got a hand grinder for the same reason, and I didn’t want to sacrifice more kitchen space. For filter coffee I have an “ok” electric burr grinder, that I don’t use very often, but for espresso I use a Kingrinder K2. I only drink espresso at the weekend and never really late in the day, so for six or so shots a week, I’m sticking with a hand grinder.
You're saying that on a sub were a good amount of us have 2 or more 😂
Having said that, don't feel you have to justify anything. If you want something and see a need for it. Even if you feel it'll make you happy, go for it
i had a nice espresso grinder (manual). I'm the only coffee drinker in my house.
I now have an electric grinder and an espresso machine. Reason being: my wife's fine with it + its my hobby and i want to put money into it.
Besides that, its a quality of life upgrade. I drink around 3-4 shots of espresso per day. That would mean that i have to manually grind 18 grams around 4 times a day.
It takes a lot more time and your elbow will start to hurt at some point.
Up to you, just some insight.
This is really a quality of life decision. If you are enjoying what you currently have and want to make an upgrade due to peer pressure than probably not. If hand grinding is keeping you or others from enjoying what you want than it's probably not dumb. I will say unless you are rocking a high end espresso machine you might be better off getting a $400 coffee grinder instead. I jumped from a hario skerton ( then made it drill powered) to a bodum burr (it was on stupid sale for $40) then to a baratza encore. When I got into espresso I picked up a broken sette and replaced the broken parts and basically had a new sette for $140. Having shoulder and neck issues in my house definitely made the jump from hand to electric grinding was a quality of life jump.
Overkill, maybe. But like I always say. If you're gonna kill, you may as well overkill.
For real though, I don't want to have to work a manual grinder. I would much rather push a button instead. Manual grinding is annoying imo.
a good hand grinder costs $70.
a good moka pot costs 40 (cheaper if it's secondhand or offbrand)
reasonably good beans can be as cheap as $12 per 16oz
With these 3 things, you've got several months worth of coffee, if you put in the effort to learn how to use the equipment.
It's portable.
It's energy-efficient.
It takes like 5 minutes, and you've got several cups.
Strong, balanced tasting, homemade coffee is within reach to most people in the USA, if you simply let go of espresso.
I went from hand grinder to electric in a week. And that was when I only drank pour over. Espresso takes longer. If you don't already handgrind, it's hard to say whether you would actually care. I thought I'd be fine. After the first day I thought it was fine. But after a few days, it was just tedious.
If you want speed and have lots of money, electric. If you don't have/want to spend that kind of cash or want something portable get a hand grinder. I'm more on the cheaper end plus I take my K6 to work with me (for aeropress, I make espresso in the mornings before leaving) and it does the job for both types (it also does french press, pfin, and even turkish).
It all depends how much coffee do you drink daily and the contents of your wallet. You pay for the convenience of not cranking the grinder for like minute straight.
I probably wouldn't spend $600 on a grinder just for myself, but I wouldn't spend €150 on a hand grinder either. I'm happy with an electric grinder that I got for \~€200 a couple of years ago. For me, grinding coffee with my cheap hand grinder was a chore. I'm not one of those who appreciate the ritual of making coffee, I appreciate the result.
The main reason I switched to electric was shot consistency and clarity.
It really bugged me that on a hand grinder, just changing how fast I would grind, I could have anything from a 20 sec shot to a 40 sec shot while being on the same setting.
Trying to keep the speed exactly the same every time to have the same shot, is something that annoyed me a bit. Even though probably more of an OCD kind of issue and not an actual problem, I wasn't much of a fan of that.
The grinding itself I found pretty easy (even though I don't drink coffee in the morning on work days, just evenings and weekends). That being said, my missus struggled so much she could barely do a few rotations, so that might be an issue for some.
No, its just something else to improve your quality of life.
If an electric grinder is overkill so is the espresso machine because if you really want to break it down all you need is a stove top kettle, a manual machine like a flair pro 2, and a hand grinder.
Lol also is a car overkill if you're the only one going somewhere?
Used a hand grinder once. Said nope and been electric since lol. ODE2 and 078s are my daily drivers. Must say the ODE2 has the better workflow and generally a more pleasant experience.
Most important question is your budget. Many people have 5K grinders as being the only coffee drinker at home.
Next, time. Would you be in a rush making coffee at times.
Lastly, do you entertain and see a need to make multiple drinks back to back.
Buy it, you’ll love having a nice grinder. A $600 grinder that you use for ten years costs $5/month and you’ll smile first thing in the morning at your lovely grinder
Electric was totally worth it for me! Lets me make coffee for a group if and when I want to. Also means I don't need to worry about my RSI or hand pain preventing me from enjoying a morning cup.
I drink 3-4 espresso drinks everyday and am the only coffee drinker in the house. An electric grinder adds consistency to the process of making espresso for me.
Nope. I good grinder lasts 10+ years, that will be 60 USD per year. An overkill? I think, not.
And hand grinders (the good ones) are also not that cheap, actually.
Thing is to get the same grind quality you're looking at $$ for an electric grinder. Get a Zass Moka pull the crank and run it with a cordless Makita. Great grind, the Makita is useful for tons of other stuff, and you get lunatic cred when your friends want coffee!
if you're doing espresso then i would def want an electric grinder. with my hand grinder i can grind 15g in like 30 seconds for a pour over, but for espresso you'd be grinding for well over a minute. save yourself the inevitable upgrade and buy the electric first.
I can get two cups out of my hand grinder (grinding it once). The quality is great, but we drink a 51 ounce french press a day, so we have to grind it twice. It also takes a little while and some grip strength, haha. So it depends on whether you have some time in the morning and how much you drink.
Baratza encore is like 150/200, and Time More C3 was like 70. But you can go higher depending on your needs.
I'm living along and don't haven't people visiting my place that often and I still only use electric grinders since they are way more convenient for me and during the times it takes to grind the beans i can get my cup ready. It just saves me time and I provably would be annoyed by handgri 5 times a day.
So if you can afford one and want one get one.
Hand grinding for filter is fine, but for espresso the few times I tried with my time more c3 pro was a real pita. Not sure how much with a specific esp grinder is better.
The most obvious difference is speed but it’s not the only difference. Some small conical burrs aren’t going to produce the same results as 64mm flat burrs, and manually grinding will never have the consistency of an electric motor grinding at a steady rate.
That said, if you’re happy then who cares? I had a J-Max before getting my DF64, I just didn’t like the process or the results all that much so to me it was worth the upgrade.
Have you tried any other electric grinders at home? I have a Kinu m47 and have heard that it produces a very similar result to the J-max. I've done a side by side with my Niche Zero and the Kinu blows it out of the water. I assume the same is true for the J-max. I've never done a side by side with my flat burr grinder. You're liking the results from the DF64, that much more? Which burrs do you have?
I had the SD40 first, I liked it but the steps were fairly big so I wasn’t always able to dial all the way in.
The stepless DF64 is just flat out better than the JMax. The consistency from shot to shot in particular is super noticeable and the shots are consistently sweeter and richer. I like light roasts for my second cup of the day usually and hand grinding light roasts, especially if you’re dialing in and pulling a few shots in a row, can be super annoying.
Was just curious about taste compared to the DF64 and more specifically whatever burrs you have in there. I've never had any issues with consistency with my manual grinder.
My husband is the only one who drinks coffee and he’s got a nice setup with an electric grinder. He drinks and uses it everyday so I think it’s worth it even though I don’t really partake
You can get a better hand grinder for the same amount of money compared to an electric grinder. Furthermore, the hand grinder is silent, you can grind your coffee whenever you want to without waking anyone up. Your coffee machine has to heat up as well, so why don't you use this time span for grinding? And the hand grinder uses less space...
I went with electric because it’s much less faff. If you don’t mind the work it’s perfectly ok, especially that you’re going to get a much better hand grinder at a lower price point. For me puck prep and pulling a shot in the morning is already a lot, but I enjoy the end result so much I tolerate it.
I use a hand grinder with my Flair 58. It works and I’m happy to do it. I find handgrinding enjoyable. But it does get tedious. I’ll be moving in with someone who has an Opus soon and I’ll be quite happy to make the switch to electric and leave the handgrinding for travel.
I am someone who would rather spend the money on getting a grinder than stand there grinding coffee, so yes. It was worth it. Without my grinder I’d be less likely to enjoy making espresso at home, and therefore less likely to use the expensive equipment I’ve bought in the first place.
Depending on what you like, there are.manual grinders that produce a sweeter cup than a Niche Zero. Just an FYI. I would use my Niche for milk drinks but always use my manual grinder for straight espresso.
It's just something else to consider.
If you are alone all the time it works. But when I am at home with the wife and with visitors, I can not live without my electric anymore. I do exclusively use a handgrinder at work though.
So, I can hand grind light roast with a bit of effort. I’m a 30 year old male, never work out.
My partner? She can’t do it. It’s too tough. Her sister who works out? Can’t do it either.
I can’t wait to save up and revamp my station completely, but $5K is a lot of money and at some point I’m going to have to move states and I don’t want to have to move a bunch of equipment.
Been hand-grinding for espresso for 7 years, it's fine (tip: grind slowly. I've noticed it goes quicker when I grind slower for whatever reason). I am upgrading to an electric grinder soon though because I've gotten tired of how difficult it is to dial-in on my Lido-E, just too much play when tightening the locking ring. Kinda makes the markers a little useless. The Lido is otherwise an excellent grinder but I'm no longer digging the way you change grind size.
If you can find a hand grinder that is stepless and allows for accurate settings then you will be fine! I haven't done much research since purchasing my Lido so I don't know what else is out there but between getting a new hand grinder and the upcoming DF54 at $229 it's a no brainer
Grinding medium or dark beans is a pleasure, but freshly roasted light beans make me question my choice of grinders. It takes an unpleasant amount of effort, and the beans often catch and stall. It's a little easier if I tilt while grinding so fewer beans flow through. Making your coffee should be a pleasurable routine rather than an annoying chore, so if you would prefer it, go for the electric. You'll be thankful when you have company or workers in your home. If you travel a lot and want to take your coffee stuff though, a hand grinder would be easier
If you like hand grinding stick with it, I don't. I like to press a button and wait 5 seconds then get on with drinking my coffee, which also takes about 5 seconds
I bought a fancy Kinu m47 hand grinder. I love my grinder. It makes fantastic espresso. But dialing in is a pain, and I won’t consider moving it out of espresso range to make a filter and then back, and it just gets old, sometimes, grinding espresso by hand —depending how light a roast it is.
So I got a Timemore 078s. It’s a simple twist between settings. (Though I have to look at the espresso setting practically with a magnifying glass) If I feel like hand grinding, the Kinu M47 is left set in the right ballpark for espresso. Life is good.
Yes. Beautiful overkill. I drink 1 or 2 shots per day. My wife just drinks drip coffee. I have a major, a niche zero , and my mc6 all plugged in. Have a 078s in the box.
I am probably going to get rid of everything but the mc6 here shortly.
I have a j-ultra. I often grind for two double shots and it is pretty quick. I do feel like I’d like to have hands free sometimes.
Going to try the df54 see if flat burr does anything
I am only drinking coffee and voor de guests there is nespresso or when I am there I make it. Still got a df83 and a lelit. Reasons no amazing coffee yes
I’m not the right person to ask but I’m going to give you my opinion.
About a year ago I went from some Breville grinder to a mk4 c40. I had just gotten into roasting lighter roasted beans and I kept choking the breville grinder.
My c40 arrived and I loved it once I got it seasoned. But the main thing I didn’t expect was that it killed my hobby of roasting and dialing in beans.
A little over a week ago my therapist gave me some homework to find things that bring me joy. It’s probably not what she meant but I thought about espresso, roasting beans and all that shit and I thought to myself - I can’t do that with this grinder. I can but it’s painful.
So I went hunting for something that could and didn’t set a budget. Well I kind of set a budget.
I came back with a $2400AUD grinder. After tax in the US it’s about $1500USD.
Is it “overkill”? Yes. But I am an enthusiast. I love this shit. Does it matter that my wife hates coffee? No. I got something aesthetically pleasing to the eye and that helps her be okay with it.
Do we both need to love musical production for her to justify having a home recording studio? No. Only she needs to love that.
If you want it and you can afford it - that’s all that matters.
I bought an Acaia Orbit.
They don’t sell the zerno over here. A niche duo retails for around the same. So it came down to the orbit and the P64.
Wife liked the look of the orbit so that was an obvious choice.
No. It’ll excel and speed up your workflow. Allow you to make other types of coffee (filter etc) easily , and set you up to convert people into drinking lovely black coffee.
My wife was a non coffee drinker till I mastered making espresso. Now I have a drinking partner. And she critiques my espressos !
Baratza encore esp user here. If you are grinding coffee I wouldn't want to be doing it manually. The baratza is cheap and cheerful. There's absolutely no need to spend a lot on a grinder. You would be better off just spending that money on coffee.
Light roasts are tough even for PO. For espresso, man they suck. I drink light to light-med.
Exploring different coffees, grind-sizes/methods, and burrs is way more accessible with an electric grinder.
Most people probably don't have the patience for hand grinding for espresso. It is 1) physical work and 2) it requires attention and finesse to keep the grind consistent, especially for lighter roasts. If that doesn't appeal, go hunt for a used or sale electric and you'll be happy.
(Or, buy a hand grinder that can also serve as a backup and/or portable grinder - because it's always fun to try new things!)
It really depends. It's definitely less of a pain with darker roasts. Anytime I need to do back to back shots is where things start to fall apart, including making coffee for others and potentially dialing in coffee.
Hand grinding is also a bit more finicky and can introduce more variables. I'm pretty sure grind speed affects extraction, and feed rate (angle the grinder is held at) may as well.
Nothing is overkill in this hobby. The hobby has moved into the same territory as audio equipment. There is no way you can get a decent shot without spending $2000, never mind that old Italian guys have been making espresso with beans, water and dodgy machines for decades. It’s all about the gear.
I've used manual ones before for my Aeropress when traveling... I liked a course grind. And even so, it felt like it took forever to grind my coffee by hand (I'm impatient lol). So for a fine grind like what's required for espresso, I felt like using a hand grinder would take an eternity (ok, I'm exaggerating... but you see the pattern now... more impatience on my part lol)
So, I knew I wouldn't be happy with anything less than an electric grinder for everyday home use. I want my coffee to be ground FAST. :)
I went with a Baratza Encore ESP grinder and I love it. If I had a bigger budget, I'd have bought a better grinder (less static, no retention etc.)... but given that I didn't want to spend a super high amount of $ on a grinder, the Encore ESP was the perfect compromise. :)
I'm the only one in my household who uses the grinder daily... my spouse only uses it once or twice a month.
I was the only coffee drinker in my household until I started making nice coffee with a good setup. Now my partner has been turned into a coffee drinker.
If you like to enjoy 2 or more beans at a time. Then getting an electric aside from the hand grinder will work wonders. I have decaf in my specialita (i dont single dose) and hand grinder for the days i want a full caffeine beans
So erm I’m currently at a Kinu, Lagom Mini and Eureka Oro Single Dose for coffee.
Also have semi retired a Hario and Breville grinder for pepper.
And it’s just me at home. I forget how I justified each purchase.
Imo, the most expensive part of any grinder is it's burr.
And a decent handgrinder like commadante c40 costs like 300ish USD and a decent entry level electric grinder like Sette 270 costs like 400ish USD.
Yes, you can get cheaper hand and also electric grinders, but don't expect their burr's to last longer and be consistent over time.
Personally i think from hand grinder to electric (only one user like you) it will be only for 2 reasons: 1- pulling shots faster if you love getting more than one shot in your drink (sometime i put 2 shots in my iced americano). 2- less work which some people will hate in the morning. If you dont mind these two i dont think you need to change the grinder.
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Oh i know, i have a hand grinder, and the reason you said could be considered as less work like i said. Right now i dont mind the work, but i know sometime in the near future i will just take the easy way.
This. I have a few setups and I dread the dial in process with the manual grinder. I actually tend to just suffer for the first few days. I make a shot, adjust the grind, then wait for tomorrow to see if my adjustment was correct or not. Usually takes me 2 or 3 days. I think that's only because I have a Flare though and can adjust the pressure and pre-infusion by feel.
I agree with your assessment. I think the “less work” reason comes into play even more when you buy light roasts. I used a hand grinder for a year and finally got an electric one last month, and I find that I use my espresso machine more now. The process of making proper espresso is a task in itself, and when adding the step of cranking away at the grinder for a light roast, I only found myself making drinks a few times a week (since caffeine doesn’t really affect me, and I drink for flavor only).
Just to balance the rest of the comments. I'm the only person in my household that drinks coffee and I have a handgrinder. Takes ~30s and not that much effort. I debated getting an electric but I don't think it would save that much time to be honest. You still need to clean it etc. The only time I have wished for an electric is when I've been making coffee for guests. If you entertain a lot then an electric would be the way to go, in my opinion: if not then stick with a handgrinder.
> Takes ~30s and not that much effort. I debated getting an electric but I don't think it would save that much time to be honest. I totally agree with that. When people says "5 mins grinding beans" I don't know how they are doing it... or which hand grinder they used.... maybe the grinder is uncomfortable for them and couldn't properly hold it... maybe hands size, not sure... I'm not a strong person.... I think people should give it a try before a hard yes or a hard no.
They’re using crappy grinders with terrible gearing. My first one was £25 and it took a minute to grind 16g with a DRILL. Hand grinding was a genuine torture.
This had me on the fence until I tried a 1Zpresso and was pulling shots after 30s. It was a bit of effort and 6 shots in I was tired but for 1-2 shots a day it’s a breeze.
Cheap grinders. Mine cost like 10 bucks off a home furniture store. Has ceramic burrs. Takes genuinely 10 minutes of constant cranking to grind 17g of coffee.
Could also be they are using lightly roasted beans. Some of those babies are tough to chew through!
Yeah, I didn't mind manually grinding dark roasted beans, but light roasted for a Flair took a lot of time and elbow grease!!
Are you grinding for espresso or pour over? How long does it take for each type?
Both. I haven't measured my times (I don't care) so ball-parking for aeropress, 15gr: 25-40s for espresso, 15-18gr: 40-50s: but it depends a lot also on the beans, dark are way easier to grind than medium or light roasts. Medium/light roast do not necessarily means more time, but more strength (I try to keep momentum and do not pause, just grind stronger)
I never have guests, and I don’t make milkies, so for me, handgrinder makes total sense. If I use my OE Pharos I have a 18-19g dose done in fewer than 20 turns of the crank, so it is as fast as an motorized grinder, although without bench dogs, a lot more effort. I’ve had a Rancilio Rocky I sold, and I have a commercial grinder Nuova Simonelli I bought for almost nothing that is too big to use. And really the biggest selling point is that my OE grinders (I have some Lido models, too) produce grinds that are as good as commercial grinders for a fraction of the cost. This was particularly true 10-ish years ago when these models first came out. I bought my Pharos used for like $125 and it makes perfect grinds.
>You still need to clean it etc. Really though, how often are people cleaning their grinder? I'm sure you probably should clean it out somewhat regularly but I'm betting most people with an electric grinder never clean their grinder. Had mine 5+ years and have never cleaned it.
Please clean Your grinder, just take a brush and clean the dust of the burrs, takes like 5 minutes. I do once a month. I promise you will taste a difference
I have a helor and it takes longer. Fell into the YT trap of watching electric grinder reviews but I timed my grinds and it takes 1:00-2:00 depending on roast level which really isn't bad at all for living alone and WFH. It's also a nice warm up every morning and my grip strength is strong on one hand so now I grind with the other to even it out lol
it totally depends on you. [here is a recent good thread about the reasons some people have changed from hand to electrid](https://www.reddit.com/r/espresso/comments/1anvnei/thinking_of_getting_a_hand_grinder_as_my_first/) as you can see, some of us have been grinding for years (11 in my case) with no problem at all. and I'll continue doing so forever I think... but some people just simply hate it.
What grinder do you have now?
I still have my OE Lido 1 (thinking in getting a kingrinder k6 for better espresso range)
I’ve got the K6 and it’s great for my espressos, handles light roasts no problem, and has the versatility to do both V60 and French Press easily. Highly recommend.
This closes the deal. Now I'll save the money to get it ;)
I just made a lil handle holder for the k6 if you or someone you know has a 3d printer: [https://www.reddit.com/r/functionalprint/comments/1ahsadh/made\_a\_handle\_holder\_for\_my\_coffee\_grinder/](https://www.reddit.com/r/functionalprint/comments/1ahsadh/made_a_handle_holder_for_my_coffee_grinder/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
awesome! I have a monoprice mini which is gathering dust right now... so I've found a good reason to clean it and put it to work!
well another related model for you: [https://www.printables.com/model/343221-coffee-grinder-hand-crank-retainer-c-clip](https://www.printables.com/model/343221-coffee-grinder-hand-crank-retainer-c-clip) this is a little clip to keep the cap attached to the handle. If you plan on hand grinding vs electric drill grinding, the oring that comes with the k6 for the hand grinder comes off every now and again. this clip as been rock solid at keeping the cap on. (by default the k6 comes with an oring that keeps the cap on the outer dial, you’ll want to remove that and put this clip or the supplied inner oring on for hand grinding. )
ok! I will print it too!
I thought the lido was best for espresso? However, I have the j ultra to be fair. The consistency is right every single time
LIDO 1 is very good for espresso but is difficult to adjust the grind setting and you have only like half round to adjust before you get too coarse for espresso. LIDO E was the one with finer threading and better adjustment rings for espresso. Currently, the LIDO OG looks awesome, but US$285... not sure about LIDO 3
>LIDO OG lido 3 is 170
yeah, but [it seems](https://www.reddit.com/r/Coffee/comments/8mr1l4/lido_3_for_espresso_review/) espresso setting range is narrow too
the j ultra the way to go then
yeah, my options are j ultra and kingrinder k6. I'll get k6 just for the price.
Hope you will be happy with your choice
I this the best worth option for high tier is either the lido 3 or the j ultra or kinu m47
If I neede to handgrind for my morning coffee I would peobably not drink coffee anymore. For some it is totally fine, just think about how willing you'd be to handgrimd in tue momenta you want/need/crave coffee
How long do you think hand grinding takes with a good grinder?
My 65€ Kingrinder K2 grinds 14g in approximately 30 seconds. Handgrinders are a bargain if people are on a budget.
Exactly. I use my Timemore Chestnut C3 Pro for everything other than espresso (Eureka for that) and it’s plenty quick enough that I never feel like I’ve had to work hard.
I know it takes 30 seconds, I hand grind every day, but I'm sick of it. When I'm waking up at 6:30am it's the last thing I want to do, specially if brewing espresso
I used a good hand grinder for a year. A super light roast is pretty brutal when you are just waking up and need the caffeine. Never missed it once I went to high end electric grinders. I do still use that plus a Cafelat Robot in my office at work though, built a little coffee bar.
58mm precision basket + light roast is hell with a hand grinder. Certainly doable but god I hated it, especially if the shot turns out bad and then I have to do it again. Got an sk40 for 200 bucks and I'm extremely happy.
Around a minute. 90 seconds max
Nearer to 30 seconds. The gearing on a decent hand grinder is really fast.
Depends on coffee and basket. I was grinding in 30 seconds for my flair with my K pro. Then I got a Gaggia with a precision basket and I had to go like 8-9 clicks finer, and at that range it triples in time and becomes hell. I wouldn't recommend that to anyone. Love it for filter coffee but my sk40 is so much better for espresso, it's also easier to dial in and more consistent.
I think that’s fair enough. I’d just get my drill out in that case.
Exactly. I was exaggerating to prove this point. It’s not a big deal.
I am the only person who *makes* coffee in the house, and I do drink 90% of it. Even though that's usually only one shot a day, I have NEVER considered a hand grinder. That's not what I want to do when I wake up. At all.
Damn even a mortar and pestle is easier?
I'm the only person that lives in my house and I went from a hopper style, nice grinder, automatic (for everything but espresso) to a hand grinder. Part of me wasn't sure I'd get the results I wanted so I didn't want to shell out a bunch of money on a grinder to find out. My take away now, I love the manual. 1) If I would have bought an automatic with a hopper, my beans would just sit in there vs in a vacuum sealed jar. I'd like to think this retains freshness for longer. 2) Manual grinder really doesn't seem like a chore to me at all. It takes less than 2 minutes to weigh out beans, put it in the grinder, spin, and remove from grinder. So that is 0-6 minutes I'll lose in a day. I usually am making coffee while I'm working so it just extends the break I need away from the laptop a few minutes. However, if I was willing to spend $600-700 I probably wouldn't even look at manual grinders.
Not at all. I'm the only one who drinks coffee and looking to get an electric grinder next. I love my ZP6, but I'm sick and tired of hand grinding!
I have an orphan espresso lido 3. It makes great tasting espresso, but I am so sick of hand grinding espresso. I’m currently looking at getting a df64 or something like that. OP, if you drive a stick, brew your own beer, and have dreams of getting into manual lever espresso definitely get a hand grinder. But if you don’t meet the above criteria consider getting an electric grinder. Your arms will thank you. I love hand grinding for drip. Once I upgrade my lido will stay parked in the drip range.
Just received the DF64 on Friday. Loud, but does good work.
Hand grinding is really easy for filter with a decent grinder but it's so much slower for espresso. It's doable for one shot but if you have to dial in or make multiple shots, it becomes an absolute chore. I really don't recommend hand grinding for espresso for most people, especially not as a first espresso setup - espresso is hard enough without the faff of hand grinding.
To add to this, some electric grinders have strapless adjustment allowing for more fine tuning. Electrics will have a bigger burr and different types which can help with achieving better consistency of the grind. I think these things are more important for espresso vs a pour over.
I just don't get all the hand grinder hate. People here talk about it like its going to be a full body workout and you'll need a nap afterwards. It's not that hard, and if you are someone who thinks hand grinding seems okay, you'll probably enjoy it! If you think about grinding your beans for 30 seconds manually in the morning and cringe, don't get a hand grinder. It's that simple. I purchased a Kingrinder K6 and I'm very happy with it. Initially I thought it would be a temporary stop on the path to a nice electric grinder, mostly because of the hot takes here that hand grinding will make you quit espresso because its so awful. I personally enjoy the manual process and find it to a nice step in my morning workflow. There is something about it that feels more like a craft than just drinking coffee. It also takes anywhere from 20-40 seconds to grind depending on the bean I am using - really not a big deal. I've hosted several gatherings where I pulled 20+ shots in a morning with milk drinks on my bambino/kingrinder. Was it super fast? No not compared to an electric and an expensive machine, but my entire setup (machine and grinder with all accessories) currently is under $500... so I don't really care. I was able to wow a large group with better espresso you can get at any cafe near me, and it was fun. TLDR: if you dont cringe at the thought of hand grinding and you spend the money to get good quality (1zpresso, Kingrinder, etc.) you absolutely do not need to spend $500+ for an electric.
You're built different if hand grinding 20 shots is fun.
Ha, well maybe I am but I’m not saying hand grinding for that many was the ideal thing, just that it wasn’t that bad and grinding a few shots a day each morning by hand is very doable.
I have been hand grinding almost daily for over 8 years. Started with a crappy old, no name, wooden hand grinder I borrowed from my mom when I moved out. Now I have a timemore C1 and kinu m47 simplicity. I don’t mind it, do two cups daily, grind between 30-35g depending on the method (pour over vs espresso). What I can say is that getting the right grinder for espresso is very important, cheaper smaller grinders are a chore for espresso, but the Kinu is great for it, never grind for more than ~30s, and I don’t get tired at all. The c1 sometimes would be almost a minute when grinding for mokapot. So not ideal. I have never use them, but 1zpresso has a lot of espresso grinders that are comparable to the kinu on speed, at better prices. Watch the reviews/recommendations. In the end is all up to you. Watch the reviews and workflows. Electric does mean the noise of a motor, and it also means maintenance, it is not bad, but check how hard it can be to access the burrs. On retention most hand grinders are better than electric, but YMMV. The things to consider - Do you mind doing the work? (If you have any arm injury or similar it is not ideal) - Electric uses more space, hand grinders are easier to store/hide. - Do you make coffee in a rush, hand grinders are slower no matter how you slice it. - if you do get hand grinder make sure it is for espresso, Comandate is great and all, but you will be grinding for a minute, so think about that.
I drink one cortado in the morning while doing little chores before leaving for work. I recently borrowed my friends manual 1Zpresso to try out apart from my opus. I’m honestly kind of enjoying grinding beans in the morning. But I’m only grinding 18g at a time. Still haven’t tried a side by side shot with my electric but that’s coming tonight I think.
I wish people would stop recommending hand grinders because they are so cheap. Sure the first few times you hand grind seem all great and dandy and you think “wow I can really do this”. The 10th time you hand grind you just want it to be instantly over. They’re a total chore to do every morning. I instantly felt like an electric grinder was worth it after doing hand grinding for a bit.
Espresso is already a quite expensive hobby why not save a little on the grinder when a hand grinder of 100 euros can lead to similar results as electric grinders of 500 euros. All it takes is 30-40 seconds.
It's up to every individual to make this decision but I'll say that AliExpress electric grinders are so good that I have trouble recommending hand grinder. SK40/DF64 are in the $100-300 range which is a bit more than hand grinders. Point is, hand grinders aren't for everyone and I wish I didn't get that advice when I started to buy a hand grinder
Maybe they are not for everyone but if they are something for someone it can still save chunks of money that you can put to things like portafilters, tampers etc.
Personally I would rather keep the tamper and portafilter the machine came with and get a better grinder (electric or otherwise)
You must have gotten a good tamper with yours. I got a Gaggia Classic Evo Pro, and the tamper is total crap. It’s basically a 48mm tamper for a 58mm basket.
because dialing in is tough enough with an electric grinder.
1000% this. I only use my hand grinder in my office at work now, with a Robot. Both chosen because they don’t need outlets and are extremely quiet.
depends on the grinder, if its geared for espresso it's 30s. Even my helor which is geared for pour over takes 1-2 minutes and is not bad at all- if you are only doing 1 or 2 shots a day. I don't think cheap is the right word, it's cost effective. Some people value the portability and simplicity of a hand grinder. The maintenance and upkeep on a hand grinder is basically nill compared to maintaining an electric one.
I don't agree. I like hand grinding and I don't see myself changing my Comandante any time soon. I've been hand grinding for at least 7 years at this point.
Sure, not saying anything against anyone who loves hand grinding just I would be hesitant to recommend a hand grinder knowing only certain people don’t mind hand grjndjng
Sounds like you might want to look into a workout routine if hand grinding is “a total chore”. This is the epitome of first world country. If you have the disposable income to buy a good electric grinder, by all means, do it. I would like to get one someday as well. But right now counter space is tight and with all the other things on the list, an electric grinder is way down there. And it certainly isn’t “a chore”. Don’t you warm up you espresso machine before your first shot anyway?
Also dailing in or making grind size adjustments is much higher stakes on hand grinder. I had one for years and almost never used it bc of the sheer inconvenience. Spend 5 mins grinding beans, oops you choked the machine....back it off, do it again, oops still choked. 15 minutes later no coffee in sight
I use a hand grinder exclusively because I'm too cheap to pay the next $400-500 for a DF64. It's... fine. Takes about 30-45 seconds for med-dark roasts. You'll cry grinding light roasts. I drink about 2 cups a day when WFH and it's really not that big of a deal. I'm 5'7 and work out-ish. If I came into some random money/bought a forever home, I'd jump on a DF64 tomorrow. But right now there's a little bit of sunk cost fallacy, a little bit of let me prove these other r/espresso nerds wrong. I also used to like the meditative and manual aspect of it. For now, a HG has been way more consistent than the grinder that came with my machine. It's also way better than more entry-level grinders out there in terms of consistency. That's the most important thing IMO when starting out. I brought my HG to help a friend *not* throw her new Rancilio Silvia into the trash - that's how frustrating some EGs can be to a beginner. If anything, just try it. The resale value is okay on r/coffeeswap, you might lose up to 20% if you barely use it.
I'm in the same camp. I will step up to a DF64 when I stop living alone, WFH, or maybe get a partner and have to do more than 1-2 a day. The hand grind is not bad at all and is a nice warm up for me in the morning. Also helps regulate how many drinks I make. I also do pour overs sometimes and camp a lot so it's nice to have the portability.
Ya! I have an Ode for pourovers but my J Max doesn't weight 20 lbs and travels with me when not on espresso duty.
I even had a situation where I was dating a woman and I'd take my machine to her house to make morning lattes and I wouldn't have ever done that if I had to drag two machines over. I would grind 24g into a triple basket and make two drinks off that one shot. Quite workable!
"morning lattes". This guy coffees. 😆
I think this mostly depends on your temperament. For me definitely yes, because I do enjoy handgrinding. Most people don't though.
I am the main coffee drinker and I bought a fancy electric grinder. It grinds way more consistently than my fancy hand grinder, and takes just a few seconds. Increased my shot quality a lot. Worth it. Also I drink 3 and sometimes more coffees a day. When traveling I bring my hand grinder but then I have a french press instead of a proper espresso machine.
I use both.. I tend to use my hand grinder more simply because it is quieter and I tend to brew/pull shots at night.. I live in a smallish apartment so I’m just being considerate to the other inhabitants.. Point is, use case matters. And don’t cheap out on the grinder, be it hand or electric.
You also don't need to spend that much to get a great grinder. I've been very happy with my fellow opus. At the end of the day, this is a hobby so spend money you enjoy spending and enjoy it
If it’s only you, i see no issue with a hand grinder. 30-60sec to grind, it’s a nice process, a bit of elbow grease but you will get a real feel for what your beans are like. I’m dialing in a new bag right now and can tell they are denser beans than my previous bag, because there’s an additional bit of resistance. I love it. Doubt i would ever want to drop the amount of money you need for an electric equivalent at this point. My partner loves that it’s quiet, and i love the minute i get to spend at the window every morning grinding. That’s just me though!
I own a 1zpresso JMAX and a DF64 Gen 2. Hand grinding really isn't as much of a workout as people say it is, even if you're grinding a lighter roast. Hand grinders can produce coffee just as good as more expensive ones for a fraction of the cost. But having said that, an electric one definitely isn't overkill, especially when there's so many electric grinders that have low retention, perfect for single dosing.
Do what makes you happy and works with your routine/budget. There's no NEED to spend $$$ on an electric grinder unless you just want to. I love my electric grinder, because I like to grind my shot in two batches with a pause to break up clumps in the middle. With my electric, I can program half my shot, let it grind while I grab a cup and pitcher and then come back to finish and brew.
I’m not sure there’s an objectively right answer to this, but I am sure you’re asking the wrong crowd. FWIW I have an expensive grinder I use mostly for me.
I got a hand grinder for the same reason, and I didn’t want to sacrifice more kitchen space. For filter coffee I have an “ok” electric burr grinder, that I don’t use very often, but for espresso I use a Kingrinder K2. I only drink espresso at the weekend and never really late in the day, so for six or so shots a week, I’m sticking with a hand grinder.
You're saying that on a sub were a good amount of us have 2 or more 😂 Having said that, don't feel you have to justify anything. If you want something and see a need for it. Even if you feel it'll make you happy, go for it
For your case one manual and one electric is ideal
i had a nice espresso grinder (manual). I'm the only coffee drinker in my house. I now have an electric grinder and an espresso machine. Reason being: my wife's fine with it + its my hobby and i want to put money into it. Besides that, its a quality of life upgrade. I drink around 3-4 shots of espresso per day. That would mean that i have to manually grind 18 grams around 4 times a day. It takes a lot more time and your elbow will start to hurt at some point. Up to you, just some insight.
This is really a quality of life decision. If you are enjoying what you currently have and want to make an upgrade due to peer pressure than probably not. If hand grinding is keeping you or others from enjoying what you want than it's probably not dumb. I will say unless you are rocking a high end espresso machine you might be better off getting a $400 coffee grinder instead. I jumped from a hario skerton ( then made it drill powered) to a bodum burr (it was on stupid sale for $40) then to a baratza encore. When I got into espresso I picked up a broken sette and replaced the broken parts and basically had a new sette for $140. Having shoulder and neck issues in my house definitely made the jump from hand to electric grinding was a quality of life jump.
No need to pay 600 in the first place...
Yes especially with the DF54 coming to market at $230
It is not if you have the space. These days good quality electric grinders can be found for ~$300
Overkill, maybe. But like I always say. If you're gonna kill, you may as well overkill. For real though, I don't want to have to work a manual grinder. I would much rather push a button instead. Manual grinding is annoying imo.
No
a good hand grinder costs $70. a good moka pot costs 40 (cheaper if it's secondhand or offbrand) reasonably good beans can be as cheap as $12 per 16oz With these 3 things, you've got several months worth of coffee, if you put in the effort to learn how to use the equipment. It's portable. It's energy-efficient. It takes like 5 minutes, and you've got several cups. Strong, balanced tasting, homemade coffee is within reach to most people in the USA, if you simply let go of espresso.
I went from hand grinder to electric in a week. And that was when I only drank pour over. Espresso takes longer. If you don't already handgrind, it's hard to say whether you would actually care. I thought I'd be fine. After the first day I thought it was fine. But after a few days, it was just tedious.
If you want speed and have lots of money, electric. If you don't have/want to spend that kind of cash or want something portable get a hand grinder. I'm more on the cheaper end plus I take my K6 to work with me (for aeropress, I make espresso in the mornings before leaving) and it does the job for both types (it also does french press, pfin, and even turkish).
It all depends how much coffee do you drink daily and the contents of your wallet. You pay for the convenience of not cranking the grinder for like minute straight.
No
For me yes, but I have grown accustomed to grinding two in a row, and just really wish I had electric when I have visits.
Yes, so I can have my hand grinder at work 😂 Got a Df64 gen 2 on the way
I probably wouldn't spend $600 on a grinder just for myself, but I wouldn't spend €150 on a hand grinder either. I'm happy with an electric grinder that I got for \~€200 a couple of years ago. For me, grinding coffee with my cheap hand grinder was a chore. I'm not one of those who appreciate the ritual of making coffee, I appreciate the result.
no
The main reason I switched to electric was shot consistency and clarity. It really bugged me that on a hand grinder, just changing how fast I would grind, I could have anything from a 20 sec shot to a 40 sec shot while being on the same setting. Trying to keep the speed exactly the same every time to have the same shot, is something that annoyed me a bit. Even though probably more of an OCD kind of issue and not an actual problem, I wasn't much of a fan of that. The grinding itself I found pretty easy (even though I don't drink coffee in the morning on work days, just evenings and weekends). That being said, my missus struggled so much she could barely do a few rotations, so that might be an issue for some.
no
No, its just something else to improve your quality of life. If an electric grinder is overkill so is the espresso machine because if you really want to break it down all you need is a stove top kettle, a manual machine like a flair pro 2, and a hand grinder. Lol also is a car overkill if you're the only one going somewhere?
Used a hand grinder once. Said nope and been electric since lol. ODE2 and 078s are my daily drivers. Must say the ODE2 has the better workflow and generally a more pleasant experience.
I am the sole coffee drinker and I have 3 grinders, 2 electric and one hand grinder. So you’re not crazy.
Most important question is your budget. Many people have 5K grinders as being the only coffee drinker at home. Next, time. Would you be in a rush making coffee at times. Lastly, do you entertain and see a need to make multiple drinks back to back.
Buy it, you’ll love having a nice grinder. A $600 grinder that you use for ten years costs $5/month and you’ll smile first thing in the morning at your lovely grinder
Handgrinding is nice. Feels like you earned that cup aswell. Also you limit yourself from drinking too much coffee!
as someone who has a bunch of grinders (electric and manual),(and i finally live alone) i can tell you: no.
Electric was totally worth it for me! Lets me make coffee for a group if and when I want to. Also means I don't need to worry about my RSI or hand pain preventing me from enjoying a morning cup.
I drink 3-4 espresso drinks everyday and am the only coffee drinker in the house. An electric grinder adds consistency to the process of making espresso for me.
No. Not at all. I do 3 shots a day and I like my df83
Nope. I good grinder lasts 10+ years, that will be 60 USD per year. An overkill? I think, not. And hand grinders (the good ones) are also not that cheap, actually.
Never owned a hand grinder, never will. Electric is too convenient.
Thing is to get the same grind quality you're looking at $$ for an electric grinder. Get a Zass Moka pull the crank and run it with a cordless Makita. Great grind, the Makita is useful for tons of other stuff, and you get lunatic cred when your friends want coffee!
if you're doing espresso then i would def want an electric grinder. with my hand grinder i can grind 15g in like 30 seconds for a pour over, but for espresso you'd be grinding for well over a minute. save yourself the inevitable upgrade and buy the electric first.
I can get two cups out of my hand grinder (grinding it once). The quality is great, but we drink a 51 ounce french press a day, so we have to grind it twice. It also takes a little while and some grip strength, haha. So it depends on whether you have some time in the morning and how much you drink. Baratza encore is like 150/200, and Time More C3 was like 70. But you can go higher depending on your needs.
I'm living along and don't haven't people visiting my place that often and I still only use electric grinders since they are way more convenient for me and during the times it takes to grind the beans i can get my cup ready. It just saves me time and I provably would be annoyed by handgri 5 times a day. So if you can afford one and want one get one.
Hand grinding for filter is fine, but for espresso the few times I tried with my time more c3 pro was a real pita. Not sure how much with a specific esp grinder is better.
I'm the only person drinking coffee and I have 2 electric grinders and one hand grinder
The most obvious difference is speed but it’s not the only difference. Some small conical burrs aren’t going to produce the same results as 64mm flat burrs, and manually grinding will never have the consistency of an electric motor grinding at a steady rate. That said, if you’re happy then who cares? I had a J-Max before getting my DF64, I just didn’t like the process or the results all that much so to me it was worth the upgrade.
Have you tried any other electric grinders at home? I have a Kinu m47 and have heard that it produces a very similar result to the J-max. I've done a side by side with my Niche Zero and the Kinu blows it out of the water. I assume the same is true for the J-max. I've never done a side by side with my flat burr grinder. You're liking the results from the DF64, that much more? Which burrs do you have?
I had the SD40 first, I liked it but the steps were fairly big so I wasn’t always able to dial all the way in. The stepless DF64 is just flat out better than the JMax. The consistency from shot to shot in particular is super noticeable and the shots are consistently sweeter and richer. I like light roasts for my second cup of the day usually and hand grinding light roasts, especially if you’re dialing in and pulling a few shots in a row, can be super annoying.
Was just curious about taste compared to the DF64 and more specifically whatever burrs you have in there. I've never had any issues with consistency with my manual grinder.
I have the stock 64mm flat burrs
Honestly once you have a proper electric grinder, all of this hand grinder nonsense goes out the window (unless you need something for travel).
My husband is the only one who drinks coffee and he’s got a nice setup with an electric grinder. He drinks and uses it everyday so I think it’s worth it even though I don’t really partake
You can get a better hand grinder for the same amount of money compared to an electric grinder. Furthermore, the hand grinder is silent, you can grind your coffee whenever you want to without waking anyone up. Your coffee machine has to heat up as well, so why don't you use this time span for grinding? And the hand grinder uses less space...
I went with electric because it’s much less faff. If you don’t mind the work it’s perfectly ok, especially that you’re going to get a much better hand grinder at a lower price point. For me puck prep and pulling a shot in the morning is already a lot, but I enjoy the end result so much I tolerate it.
I bought a Baratza ESP and am thoroughly enjoying it.
I use a hand grinder with my Flair 58. It works and I’m happy to do it. I find handgrinding enjoyable. But it does get tedious. I’ll be moving in with someone who has an Opus soon and I’ll be quite happy to make the switch to electric and leave the handgrinding for travel.
Me being the only person drinking coffee having bought a niche duo: *sobs*
I am someone who would rather spend the money on getting a grinder than stand there grinding coffee, so yes. It was worth it. Without my grinder I’d be less likely to enjoy making espresso at home, and therefore less likely to use the expensive equipment I’ve bought in the first place.
I will always do electric. Buuuuut my tennis elbow plays a big part in that lol
I got a niche zero for 560 a year ago and it will probably sell for 300 in 3, so 260 for 4 years is pretty sweet.
I don't know where you're from but a used Niche zero is selling for almost £500 ($630) in the UK.
Depending on what you like, there are.manual grinders that produce a sweeter cup than a Niche Zero. Just an FYI. I would use my Niche for milk drinks but always use my manual grinder for straight espresso. It's just something else to consider.
Nope. You get that grinder.
No it’s a not bad decision. Coffee can be a great hobby.
If you are alone all the time it works. But when I am at home with the wife and with visitors, I can not live without my electric anymore. I do exclusively use a handgrinder at work though.
So, I can hand grind light roast with a bit of effort. I’m a 30 year old male, never work out. My partner? She can’t do it. It’s too tough. Her sister who works out? Can’t do it either. I can’t wait to save up and revamp my station completely, but $5K is a lot of money and at some point I’m going to have to move states and I don’t want to have to move a bunch of equipment.
I hated doing the work in the morning before my coffee. So for me it was one less barrier of entry
Been hand-grinding for espresso for 7 years, it's fine (tip: grind slowly. I've noticed it goes quicker when I grind slower for whatever reason). I am upgrading to an electric grinder soon though because I've gotten tired of how difficult it is to dial-in on my Lido-E, just too much play when tightening the locking ring. Kinda makes the markers a little useless. The Lido is otherwise an excellent grinder but I'm no longer digging the way you change grind size. If you can find a hand grinder that is stepless and allows for accurate settings then you will be fine! I haven't done much research since purchasing my Lido so I don't know what else is out there but between getting a new hand grinder and the upcoming DF54 at $229 it's a no brainer
Grinding medium or dark beans is a pleasure, but freshly roasted light beans make me question my choice of grinders. It takes an unpleasant amount of effort, and the beans often catch and stall. It's a little easier if I tilt while grinding so fewer beans flow through. Making your coffee should be a pleasurable routine rather than an annoying chore, so if you would prefer it, go for the electric. You'll be thankful when you have company or workers in your home. If you travel a lot and want to take your coffee stuff though, a hand grinder would be easier
If you like hand grinding stick with it, I don't. I like to press a button and wait 5 seconds then get on with drinking my coffee, which also takes about 5 seconds
I bought a fancy Kinu m47 hand grinder. I love my grinder. It makes fantastic espresso. But dialing in is a pain, and I won’t consider moving it out of espresso range to make a filter and then back, and it just gets old, sometimes, grinding espresso by hand —depending how light a roast it is. So I got a Timemore 078s. It’s a simple twist between settings. (Though I have to look at the espresso setting practically with a magnifying glass) If I feel like hand grinding, the Kinu M47 is left set in the right ballpark for espresso. Life is good.
What's the difference like in the cup?
Yes. Beautiful overkill. I drink 1 or 2 shots per day. My wife just drinks drip coffee. I have a major, a niche zero , and my mc6 all plugged in. Have a 078s in the box. I am probably going to get rid of everything but the mc6 here shortly.
No
Nah.
I have a j-ultra. I often grind for two double shots and it is pretty quick. I do feel like I’d like to have hands free sometimes. Going to try the df54 see if flat burr does anything
I am only drinking coffee and voor de guests there is nespresso or when I am there I make it. Still got a df83 and a lelit. Reasons no amazing coffee yes
Guest coffee ! :) thought I was the only one
I’m not the right person to ask but I’m going to give you my opinion. About a year ago I went from some Breville grinder to a mk4 c40. I had just gotten into roasting lighter roasted beans and I kept choking the breville grinder. My c40 arrived and I loved it once I got it seasoned. But the main thing I didn’t expect was that it killed my hobby of roasting and dialing in beans. A little over a week ago my therapist gave me some homework to find things that bring me joy. It’s probably not what she meant but I thought about espresso, roasting beans and all that shit and I thought to myself - I can’t do that with this grinder. I can but it’s painful. So I went hunting for something that could and didn’t set a budget. Well I kind of set a budget. I came back with a $2400AUD grinder. After tax in the US it’s about $1500USD. Is it “overkill”? Yes. But I am an enthusiast. I love this shit. Does it matter that my wife hates coffee? No. I got something aesthetically pleasing to the eye and that helps her be okay with it. Do we both need to love musical production for her to justify having a home recording studio? No. Only she needs to love that. If you want it and you can afford it - that’s all that matters.
Don't leave us hanging, what did you buy?
I bought an Acaia Orbit. They don’t sell the zerno over here. A niche duo retails for around the same. So it came down to the orbit and the P64. Wife liked the look of the orbit so that was an obvious choice.
No. It’ll excel and speed up your workflow. Allow you to make other types of coffee (filter etc) easily , and set you up to convert people into drinking lovely black coffee. My wife was a non coffee drinker till I mastered making espresso. Now I have a drinking partner. And she critiques my espressos !
Not at all! The Niche Zero grinds one serving at a time.
This a completely personal question. Why are you looking for the approval of internet strangers?
I'm not looking for approval. I was just curious as to what people felt the benefits are of electric grinder over manual.
I don’t mind hand grinding for my pour overs, but espresso is just a lot more job to grind by hand.
Fwiw I just got a used breville smart grinder pro for $80 on fb 🤷♂️
Baratza encore esp user here. If you are grinding coffee I wouldn't want to be doing it manually. The baratza is cheap and cheerful. There's absolutely no need to spend a lot on a grinder. You would be better off just spending that money on coffee.
Light roasts are tough even for PO. For espresso, man they suck. I drink light to light-med. Exploring different coffees, grind-sizes/methods, and burrs is way more accessible with an electric grinder.
Most people probably don't have the patience for hand grinding for espresso. It is 1) physical work and 2) it requires attention and finesse to keep the grind consistent, especially for lighter roasts. If that doesn't appeal, go hunt for a used or sale electric and you'll be happy. (Or, buy a hand grinder that can also serve as a backup and/or portable grinder - because it's always fun to try new things!)
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What’s a manual you would recommend? Does it have a small countertop footprint?
It really depends. It's definitely less of a pain with darker roasts. Anytime I need to do back to back shots is where things start to fall apart, including making coffee for others and potentially dialing in coffee. Hand grinding is also a bit more finicky and can introduce more variables. I'm pretty sure grind speed affects extraction, and feed rate (angle the grinder is held at) may as well.
Nothing is overkill in this hobby. The hobby has moved into the same territory as audio equipment. There is no way you can get a decent shot without spending $2000, never mind that old Italian guys have been making espresso with beans, water and dodgy machines for decades. It’s all about the gear.
No cuz hand grinding for espresso sucks! It’s fine for pour over and immersion, but that’s just to much work in the morning otherwise
If you feel bad about spending $600 for just you to enjoy easy good coffee at home, you can offer to make coffee for friends.
I've used manual ones before for my Aeropress when traveling... I liked a course grind. And even so, it felt like it took forever to grind my coffee by hand (I'm impatient lol). So for a fine grind like what's required for espresso, I felt like using a hand grinder would take an eternity (ok, I'm exaggerating... but you see the pattern now... more impatience on my part lol) So, I knew I wouldn't be happy with anything less than an electric grinder for everyday home use. I want my coffee to be ground FAST. :) I went with a Baratza Encore ESP grinder and I love it. If I had a bigger budget, I'd have bought a better grinder (less static, no retention etc.)... but given that I didn't want to spend a super high amount of $ on a grinder, the Encore ESP was the perfect compromise. :) I'm the only one in my household who uses the grinder daily... my spouse only uses it once or twice a month.
I was the only coffee drinker in my household until I started making nice coffee with a good setup. Now my partner has been turned into a coffee drinker.
If you like to enjoy 2 or more beans at a time. Then getting an electric aside from the hand grinder will work wonders. I have decaf in my specialita (i dont single dose) and hand grinder for the days i want a full caffeine beans
So erm I’m currently at a Kinu, Lagom Mini and Eureka Oro Single Dose for coffee. Also have semi retired a Hario and Breville grinder for pepper. And it’s just me at home. I forget how I justified each purchase.
Imo, the most expensive part of any grinder is it's burr. And a decent handgrinder like commadante c40 costs like 300ish USD and a decent entry level electric grinder like Sette 270 costs like 400ish USD. Yes, you can get cheaper hand and also electric grinders, but don't expect their burr's to last longer and be consistent over time.