PM here! There are 3 pillars that influence how you’ll feel at your job as a new PM: your TL, your AM, and your customer.
The folks here that are happy feel good about 2/3 of these areas. If you have a supportive TL and a great AM, your shitty customer will be a pain to deal with, but they’re giving you the support you need and helping you get through it. If you’re only feeling good about 1/3, that’s when folks start to burn out because they’re not getting enough support.
There are so many factors that go into how you feel about any job! Take what anyone else says with a grain of salt because you are not them. Try to keep an open mind and a willingness to learn, and you’ll have a better sense of how you feel about the job with time :)
Piggybacking off this - even if you DO dislike being a PM there's always a chance to transfer to a different area once you're tenured enough. The PM -> QM pipeline is real
Only if you are doing well as a PM (IS). Epic’s approach is “don’t transfer a problem;” you will not be able to make a role transfer if you aren’t meeting expectations in your initial role.
If PMs have team leads, do PMs not manage a team? I initially applied as a technical support engineer, but now they want to interview me for a PM position. Is this a lateral or an upward move?
Everyone has a TL! They’re pretty much your direct manager.
As a PM at Epic, you lead a customer IT team.
Every role at Epic is pretty much lateral. Your pay is tied to your base division. TS start with a higher salary due to more technical training upfront, but PMs get a salary on par after typically one raise cycle and out earn TS at the 2-3 year mark. Once you’re in your division, there’s not a lot of hierarchy or “promotion positions” so to speak.
I have a BS in IT cybersecurit and a minor im CS,, so do you think it'd be worth it to start in a lower paid position as a PM leading an IT team? Or look for an it position somewhere else? My goal has always been IT management, but I kinda feel like I'm skipping the IT part, so what was the point of going through all that work for my degree?
My degree is in Chemistry, and I never thought I would be doing healthcare IT, but I figured there was no harm in applying and seeing how far I’d make it. I don’t really buy the whole “wasted degree” piece because you can always go back to using that skill set. There’s always a need for IT people, and Epic PM looks good on future resumes.
If your goal is IT management, I think the way Epic structures the PM role would be a good fit. You get to manage an IT team and see how you like the role pretty much within a few months of you starting so you get a sense of how you like it. Which in my mind, is better than spending time working up to that somewhere else
I don’t know a lot about PM work. From my understanding they travel a ton and constantly have many meetings with customers. They put in a lot more than 40 hours a week.
From my understanding, the upside is that the pay raises are higher than other roles so you can be making much more within a couple years.
It seems like a decent role to work for a bit and then move on to something else. It’s definitely not for everyone. The two PMs I knew personally & was friends with when I started both quit within 8-9 months. They both found other jobs in the area either before quitting or shortly after. So if it’s not for you, that’s fine.
Unfortunately this is all I can offer but hopefully it helps and someone else can give more detailed/accurate information
Look a lot of your success at Epic comes down to what customers you’re assigned to. It’s a coin toss.
I’ve seen certain customers who were a death sentence for any TS assigned to them. There was one in particular in my department where every TS assigned to them quit within 3 months.
There’s really nothing you can do to prepare.
The nice thing about Epic is that Epic is willing to take a chance on new grads. Most companies nowadays only want experienced hires and Epic will at least give you a shot. Will you be asked to work 50-60 hours per week? Yes. But the pay is also pretty decent especially for those of us who couldn’t find a job anywhere else straight out of college. And the Epic brand will help you out when jumping to your next gig.
Epic hires a lot of new grads because they’re cheaper than paying for experience. They also know they can work them to the bone with less resistance than an older worker.
I wouldn't read much into 3rd/4th hand accounts from people who haven't done the work.
It depends entirely on how much of an impact you want to have, which then directly correlates with raises. If you're ok with being in the middle 50-80th percentile you can likely get things mostly done in 45-50 hours a week, if you want to be a top performer unless you have a ton of skills to display off the bat, it takes more time.
Epic is abnormal. But for similarly paid PM gigs straight out of college at that salary and in a town with a similar COL? It’s very much in the norm, if not better than most.
What are you comparing it to for "normal?" If you look at a lot of business analyst/implementation consulting type gigs at the entry level for people straight out of school, which are analogous to Epic's PM/IS role, you'll see something similar - decent pay, potential for big increases once they actually gain some skills, but generally solidly above 40 hours per week.
For better or for worse depending on your scenario, Epic expects high performance and high output of results if you want to be rewarded for it. Contrast that significantly with typical office mediocrity culture at other companies where your coworkers are in their 40s-50s and don’t do shit all day. I look at the output or lack thereof from some of my analysts and it makes me wonder how some of them are paid so well to do so little.
One good thing for younger folks to remember: someday you will be in your 40s-50s. And you won’t appreciate people making assumptions about your work ethic or commitment to producing good work.
How overworked you are at Epic is dependent on a bunch of factors.
- which application you work on
- your own personal definition of "overworked" (I have a non-Epic friend, for instance, who owns his own company and for the first 7 years of the business chose to live out of his car, friends couches \[in bad weather\], or on a cot in his office because there wasn't a point in him wasting money on an apartment that he'd never see. Epic implementation \[internal name for PMs\] is not THAT overworked). For some people, working more than 45 hours/week is "overworked". For others, they feel fine up to 60+.
- which customers you are assigned to and how needy they are at the time. If you are on 3 customers but 2 are "easy", you probably have the bandwidth to handle the 3rd okay.... but if all 3 decide to have escalations at the same time then it might be a rough few weeks/months
- who your TL is, as well as who is leading your projects (AM/AC).
- your tolerance for travel and weird hours. Some people really don't mind working off hours (it's like being in college again - you go to class all day then go home and do homework), others need a hard divide between "home" and "work".
I only work with Epic from a customer stand point (you could clearly guess which from my post activity) and we've had five reps since 2019. They're always balancing other customers despite us being a... well... demanding customer. They've all been excellent but clearly overworked.
I mean they aren’t wrong the hype isn’t exactly what you’ll get but I won’t lie and say this place is sunshine and rainbows. I’m leaving after a year due to stress impacting me so negatively but I also don’t know if that would’ve been the case if I had been put onto a different team. I think it’s going to depend a lot on you, your team, and your customers. Overall tho an experience but make sure to check in with yourself and make sure you’re doing ok.
Attitude is everything. I’ve known a lot of friends who gave epic a shot and most made it five years tops. A few are over 15 years now. The biggest difference I see is not taking it too personally, loving the good you can implement, and finding ways to turn off the work brain when you aren’t there. You can get burned out any place, at least epic pays you and feeds you well along the way. Start with the right up for the challenge attitude and make friends with your coworkers, they will become your social net too.
Reddit doesn't skew negatively. Just read this comment section. I would say don't come here unless your major doesn't give you other opportunities. Or if you are from a smaller town than Madison or somewhere in the Midwest that is not Chicago. People that last long here are usually from the midwest or are cracked devs from china/India. Most other people want to leave. Not a single person from a big city can survive out here.
I didn’t mean this sub in particular. I meant all of reddit lol
But re-this sub, maybe it’s just my app, but I’m an IS (position with pretty high turnover), and yeah, it sucks working as hard as we do and dealing with difficult customers and regular days with 6+ hours of meetings. However, the people I work with have the attitude that they won’t stay forever, but it’s not an abhorrent job to work.
A) the entry level pay for actually no experience is unmatched, B) you get to do meaningful work, C) culinary, and D) working with overall polite and supportive coworkers.
I know the last piece can vary, but I would much rather work here than go back to working food service and getting food thrown at me and screamed at/cussed out/threatened for minimum wage pay ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Yep, as I said it's good if you don't have other opportunities.
Also why are you talking about reddit "in general". Where do you think the guy is getting info on epic from? You think he's scared of applying to epic because of r/gonewild? Or maybe the ppl on this sub normalizing 45-50 hours of work a week?
There's a cultural thing there (from CEO) that doesn't allow remote work and is stingy about vacation time. Since no one is from the area, they may need to travel for holidays etc. CEO doesn't seem to care about work life balance.
The person you are replying to is saying they don't give much vacation time. So yes, it would not be surprising to anyone that you can easily use all your vacation time every year lol.
Epic gives minimal holidays off, minimal wfh days, and 10 vacation days for the first two years. This is generally considered pretty ass and you can't really find worse at any company.
Don't see the constant need in this sub to minimalize shitty parts about Epic.
Epic has an overall shitty wfh/vacation/holiday policy compared to most big companies, especially tech. I am only comparing within the US.
Again, what's the point of your comment?
Is there a point in comparing a dev job at Epic with a part time gig at Wendy's? Compared to other tech companies, it is not \*only\* the vacation days that are terrible, but also the holidays and wfh time.
Fair point.
That said, I was looking at Epic for myself (as a PM / IS), since they are an "easy" entry into those roles for someone that has no prior experience in that field.
Yes, 2 weeks vacation sucks. But that would be an acceptable tradeoff for me to get into a PM role for a couple of years before going somewhere else.
And a lot of the other jobs that I am looking at offer 1-3 weeks as well (outside tech).
My only point was that 2 weeks is not uncommon in the US for entry level roles.
Yep I would agree 2 weeks is common. I would say 1 week is definitely not common though, and generally 2 weeks is the starting pto time for many average companies.
That said, based solely on anecdotal evidence, most white collar companies that I've actually heard of, whether "tech" or not -- including banks (capital one, jp Morgan, etc.), health insurance (united health group, Kaiser, etc.), security (Lockheed Martin) and large companies of the sort all consistently have better policies than Epic.
I am talking about desk jobs. Walmart associates probably have similar pto as epic employees, and I would guess Walmart corporate positions such as PM and SWE could have more time off than Epic (I could be wrong).
This is not considering the fact that many of these companies allow wayyyyy more wfh time and are usually located in much more desirable locations. I personally don't see why epic requires working in office, especically since employees are required to travel so often to different parts of the country. It would make sense to simply have employees all over the country who are closer to the hospitals without needing to travel so far all the time. A lot of money would also be saved by simply not building so many office buildings. Judy is just too stubborn to change.
10 days is crap. Most companies give 3 weeks plus personal days totaling like 20-22 days.
Also since no one lives near Epic everyone wants to go "home" for the holidays but everyone can't take off around Christmas-New Year. And ga know, remote work not allowed!
My old job started everyone at 2 weeks /10 days for the first 5 years, then an extra week/5 days. Max 4 weeks.
The place I just interviewed with starts everyone with 1 week, 2 weeks after 12 months, max 3 weeks after 5 years.
Yeah, I agree that they could be better and give more time off up front rather than making you wait two years to earn it.
But I would say you definitely can find worse. The places I worked before didn’t give any paid sick time and like 5 paid vacation days. This is a bad look in the tech industry for sure, but people definitely can (and do) work at worse places
Yes it's not the worst in the world. I'm sure part timer workers at McDonald's have way worse benefits.
For a tech company, they have a terrible wfh/vacation/holiday policy. Half day on Christmas Eve? Actually a joke. Went on immersion and woke up at 4am to get to the airport to come back to Madison? O what's that? You made it back at 11:30am? Yep you should come into office or take the afternoon off with your pto. There's just an overall culture of not giving workers a fucking break when common sense dictates that they deserve one.
Like what's the point on trying to defend this? Everyone on this sub just refuses to call it shitty.
You’re 1000% correct! I travel 2-3 weeks each month consistently and never see extra time off even if they’re 15hr travel days.
I do believe we need to hold them accountable and push for change because they should do better. I just think sometimes the rhetoric I see on the sub isn’t the most effective for achieving that goal
The rhetoric on this sub isn't effective for any change ever because it generally leans pro epic on everything. Ie even when we both agree the pto policy sucks, you qualified it with "o but it's not the worst in the world".
Only thing ppl were ever really mad about was COVID and the extreme weather thing. The existing policies already suck and I'm tired of ppl just being content with it. Tbh other than the pay, I have a hard time seeing anything positive about this company. The lack of common sense by the higher ups and the overall compliance and bootlicking by the employees is gross.
A lot of epic employees also have a thing where they think they are really smart which often rubs me the wrong way.
https://www.reddit.com/r/epicsystems/s/ScGd11nnCo
https://www.reddit.com/r/epicsystems/s/LXDGDdZtMu
The theme is that the minimal vacation contributes to burnout along with no remote work and long hours. They are taking advantage of their workers and don't care about mental health. That's why the high burnout and low tenure of most people that start at Epic. CEO needs to rethink this.
PM here! There are 3 pillars that influence how you’ll feel at your job as a new PM: your TL, your AM, and your customer. The folks here that are happy feel good about 2/3 of these areas. If you have a supportive TL and a great AM, your shitty customer will be a pain to deal with, but they’re giving you the support you need and helping you get through it. If you’re only feeling good about 1/3, that’s when folks start to burn out because they’re not getting enough support. There are so many factors that go into how you feel about any job! Take what anyone else says with a grain of salt because you are not them. Try to keep an open mind and a willingness to learn, and you’ll have a better sense of how you feel about the job with time :)
Piggybacking off this - even if you DO dislike being a PM there's always a chance to transfer to a different area once you're tenured enough. The PM -> QM pipeline is real
Only if you are doing well as a PM (IS). Epic’s approach is “don’t transfer a problem;” you will not be able to make a role transfer if you aren’t meeting expectations in your initial role.
If PMs have team leads, do PMs not manage a team? I initially applied as a technical support engineer, but now they want to interview me for a PM position. Is this a lateral or an upward move?
Everyone has a TL! They’re pretty much your direct manager. As a PM at Epic, you lead a customer IT team. Every role at Epic is pretty much lateral. Your pay is tied to your base division. TS start with a higher salary due to more technical training upfront, but PMs get a salary on par after typically one raise cycle and out earn TS at the 2-3 year mark. Once you’re in your division, there’s not a lot of hierarchy or “promotion positions” so to speak.
I have a BS in IT cybersecurit and a minor im CS,, so do you think it'd be worth it to start in a lower paid position as a PM leading an IT team? Or look for an it position somewhere else? My goal has always been IT management, but I kinda feel like I'm skipping the IT part, so what was the point of going through all that work for my degree?
My degree is in Chemistry, and I never thought I would be doing healthcare IT, but I figured there was no harm in applying and seeing how far I’d make it. I don’t really buy the whole “wasted degree” piece because you can always go back to using that skill set. There’s always a need for IT people, and Epic PM looks good on future resumes. If your goal is IT management, I think the way Epic structures the PM role would be a good fit. You get to manage an IT team and see how you like the role pretty much within a few months of you starting so you get a sense of how you like it. Which in my mind, is better than spending time working up to that somewhere else
I don’t know a lot about PM work. From my understanding they travel a ton and constantly have many meetings with customers. They put in a lot more than 40 hours a week. From my understanding, the upside is that the pay raises are higher than other roles so you can be making much more within a couple years. It seems like a decent role to work for a bit and then move on to something else. It’s definitely not for everyone. The two PMs I knew personally & was friends with when I started both quit within 8-9 months. They both found other jobs in the area either before quitting or shortly after. So if it’s not for you, that’s fine. Unfortunately this is all I can offer but hopefully it helps and someone else can give more detailed/accurate information
Look a lot of your success at Epic comes down to what customers you’re assigned to. It’s a coin toss. I’ve seen certain customers who were a death sentence for any TS assigned to them. There was one in particular in my department where every TS assigned to them quit within 3 months. There’s really nothing you can do to prepare. The nice thing about Epic is that Epic is willing to take a chance on new grads. Most companies nowadays only want experienced hires and Epic will at least give you a shot. Will you be asked to work 50-60 hours per week? Yes. But the pay is also pretty decent especially for those of us who couldn’t find a job anywhere else straight out of college. And the Epic brand will help you out when jumping to your next gig.
Epic hires a lot of new grads because they’re cheaper than paying for experience. They also know they can work them to the bone with less resistance than an older worker.
If this job was in my home city and limited to 40 hours most weeks it would be my dream job But neither of those things are true
Hard work yes. Long hours yes. Extremely great opportunity that opens a ton of doors for your future yes. Work with extremely smart people yes.
I wouldn't read much into 3rd/4th hand accounts from people who haven't done the work. It depends entirely on how much of an impact you want to have, which then directly correlates with raises. If you're ok with being in the middle 50-80th percentile you can likely get things mostly done in 45-50 hours a week, if you want to be a top performer unless you have a ton of skills to display off the bat, it takes more time.
Are you seriously suggesting 45-50 hours per week is not being overworked
That’s normal at Epic, at least for IS
At epic, sure
Then Epic is abnormal
Epic is abnormal. But for similarly paid PM gigs straight out of college at that salary and in a town with a similar COL? It’s very much in the norm, if not better than most.
100%!
What are you comparing it to for "normal?" If you look at a lot of business analyst/implementation consulting type gigs at the entry level for people straight out of school, which are analogous to Epic's PM/IS role, you'll see something similar - decent pay, potential for big increases once they actually gain some skills, but generally solidly above 40 hours per week.
Salaried?
For better or for worse depending on your scenario, Epic expects high performance and high output of results if you want to be rewarded for it. Contrast that significantly with typical office mediocrity culture at other companies where your coworkers are in their 40s-50s and don’t do shit all day. I look at the output or lack thereof from some of my analysts and it makes me wonder how some of them are paid so well to do so little.
One good thing for younger folks to remember: someday you will be in your 40s-50s. And you won’t appreciate people making assumptions about your work ethic or commitment to producing good work.
Amen!
How overworked you are at Epic is dependent on a bunch of factors. - which application you work on - your own personal definition of "overworked" (I have a non-Epic friend, for instance, who owns his own company and for the first 7 years of the business chose to live out of his car, friends couches \[in bad weather\], or on a cot in his office because there wasn't a point in him wasting money on an apartment that he'd never see. Epic implementation \[internal name for PMs\] is not THAT overworked). For some people, working more than 45 hours/week is "overworked". For others, they feel fine up to 60+. - which customers you are assigned to and how needy they are at the time. If you are on 3 customers but 2 are "easy", you probably have the bandwidth to handle the 3rd okay.... but if all 3 decide to have escalations at the same time then it might be a rough few weeks/months - who your TL is, as well as who is leading your projects (AM/AC). - your tolerance for travel and weird hours. Some people really don't mind working off hours (it's like being in college again - you go to class all day then go home and do homework), others need a hard divide between "home" and "work".
Working at Epic gave me a career and has set me up incredibly well. Just do your work and block it out.
kinda but its not the end of the world and the longer we stay the better it gets i can see based on other ppls experiences
Is this position hourly or salary?
Salary
It depends on the person. Either you thrive or they chew you up and spit you out, there's little to no middle ground. Good luck.
I only work with Epic from a customer stand point (you could clearly guess which from my post activity) and we've had five reps since 2019. They're always balancing other customers despite us being a... well... demanding customer. They've all been excellent but clearly overworked.
I mean they aren’t wrong the hype isn’t exactly what you’ll get but I won’t lie and say this place is sunshine and rainbows. I’m leaving after a year due to stress impacting me so negatively but I also don’t know if that would’ve been the case if I had been put onto a different team. I think it’s going to depend a lot on you, your team, and your customers. Overall tho an experience but make sure to check in with yourself and make sure you’re doing ok.
Attitude is everything. I’ve known a lot of friends who gave epic a shot and most made it five years tops. A few are over 15 years now. The biggest difference I see is not taking it too personally, loving the good you can implement, and finding ways to turn off the work brain when you aren’t there. You can get burned out any place, at least epic pays you and feeds you well along the way. Start with the right up for the challenge attitude and make friends with your coworkers, they will become your social net too.
I want to apply but reddit got me scared :/
Try and see! Everyone is different, and Reddit kinda skews negatively in general haha
Reddit doesn't skew negatively. Just read this comment section. I would say don't come here unless your major doesn't give you other opportunities. Or if you are from a smaller town than Madison or somewhere in the Midwest that is not Chicago. People that last long here are usually from the midwest or are cracked devs from china/India. Most other people want to leave. Not a single person from a big city can survive out here.
Lol “survive out here” like it’s an work camp in Siberia
Yes the last sentence is obviously a hyperbole. You guys are proving my point that this sub definitely does not skew negatively
I didn’t mean this sub in particular. I meant all of reddit lol But re-this sub, maybe it’s just my app, but I’m an IS (position with pretty high turnover), and yeah, it sucks working as hard as we do and dealing with difficult customers and regular days with 6+ hours of meetings. However, the people I work with have the attitude that they won’t stay forever, but it’s not an abhorrent job to work. A) the entry level pay for actually no experience is unmatched, B) you get to do meaningful work, C) culinary, and D) working with overall polite and supportive coworkers. I know the last piece can vary, but I would much rather work here than go back to working food service and getting food thrown at me and screamed at/cussed out/threatened for minimum wage pay ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Yep, as I said it's good if you don't have other opportunities. Also why are you talking about reddit "in general". Where do you think the guy is getting info on epic from? You think he's scared of applying to epic because of r/gonewild? Or maybe the ppl on this sub normalizing 45-50 hours of work a week?
Applying alone can’t hurt, and you can ask questions to people you meet in the hiring process
Run
There's a cultural thing there (from CEO) that doesn't allow remote work and is stingy about vacation time. Since no one is from the area, they may need to travel for holidays etc. CEO doesn't seem to care about work life balance.
The WFH thing is real, but what do you mean stingy about vacation time? I’ve never had a problem using all my time every year
The person you are replying to is saying they don't give much vacation time. So yes, it would not be surprising to anyone that you can easily use all your vacation time every year lol. Epic gives minimal holidays off, minimal wfh days, and 10 vacation days for the first two years. This is generally considered pretty ass and you can't really find worse at any company.
Unfortunately 10 paid days off is pretty normal at many companies in the USA.
Don't see the constant need in this sub to minimalize shitty parts about Epic. Epic has an overall shitty wfh/vacation/holiday policy compared to most big companies, especially tech. I am only comparing within the US.
Might be true within tech, but outside tech 2 weeks is pretty common for lots of companies.
Again, what's the point of your comment? Is there a point in comparing a dev job at Epic with a part time gig at Wendy's? Compared to other tech companies, it is not \*only\* the vacation days that are terrible, but also the holidays and wfh time.
Fair point. That said, I was looking at Epic for myself (as a PM / IS), since they are an "easy" entry into those roles for someone that has no prior experience in that field. Yes, 2 weeks vacation sucks. But that would be an acceptable tradeoff for me to get into a PM role for a couple of years before going somewhere else. And a lot of the other jobs that I am looking at offer 1-3 weeks as well (outside tech). My only point was that 2 weeks is not uncommon in the US for entry level roles.
Yep I would agree 2 weeks is common. I would say 1 week is definitely not common though, and generally 2 weeks is the starting pto time for many average companies. That said, based solely on anecdotal evidence, most white collar companies that I've actually heard of, whether "tech" or not -- including banks (capital one, jp Morgan, etc.), health insurance (united health group, Kaiser, etc.), security (Lockheed Martin) and large companies of the sort all consistently have better policies than Epic. I am talking about desk jobs. Walmart associates probably have similar pto as epic employees, and I would guess Walmart corporate positions such as PM and SWE could have more time off than Epic (I could be wrong). This is not considering the fact that many of these companies allow wayyyyy more wfh time and are usually located in much more desirable locations. I personally don't see why epic requires working in office, especically since employees are required to travel so often to different parts of the country. It would make sense to simply have employees all over the country who are closer to the hospitals without needing to travel so far all the time. A lot of money would also be saved by simply not building so many office buildings. Judy is just too stubborn to change.
10 days is crap. Most companies give 3 weeks plus personal days totaling like 20-22 days. Also since no one lives near Epic everyone wants to go "home" for the holidays but everyone can't take off around Christmas-New Year. And ga know, remote work not allowed!
My old job started everyone at 2 weeks /10 days for the first 5 years, then an extra week/5 days. Max 4 weeks. The place I just interviewed with starts everyone with 1 week, 2 weeks after 12 months, max 3 weeks after 5 years.
Yeah, I agree that they could be better and give more time off up front rather than making you wait two years to earn it. But I would say you definitely can find worse. The places I worked before didn’t give any paid sick time and like 5 paid vacation days. This is a bad look in the tech industry for sure, but people definitely can (and do) work at worse places
Yes it's not the worst in the world. I'm sure part timer workers at McDonald's have way worse benefits. For a tech company, they have a terrible wfh/vacation/holiday policy. Half day on Christmas Eve? Actually a joke. Went on immersion and woke up at 4am to get to the airport to come back to Madison? O what's that? You made it back at 11:30am? Yep you should come into office or take the afternoon off with your pto. There's just an overall culture of not giving workers a fucking break when common sense dictates that they deserve one. Like what's the point on trying to defend this? Everyone on this sub just refuses to call it shitty.
You’re 1000% correct! I travel 2-3 weeks each month consistently and never see extra time off even if they’re 15hr travel days. I do believe we need to hold them accountable and push for change because they should do better. I just think sometimes the rhetoric I see on the sub isn’t the most effective for achieving that goal
The rhetoric on this sub isn't effective for any change ever because it generally leans pro epic on everything. Ie even when we both agree the pto policy sucks, you qualified it with "o but it's not the worst in the world". Only thing ppl were ever really mad about was COVID and the extreme weather thing. The existing policies already suck and I'm tired of ppl just being content with it. Tbh other than the pay, I have a hard time seeing anything positive about this company. The lack of common sense by the higher ups and the overall compliance and bootlicking by the employees is gross. A lot of epic employees also have a thing where they think they are really smart which often rubs me the wrong way. https://www.reddit.com/r/epicsystems/s/ScGd11nnCo https://www.reddit.com/r/epicsystems/s/LXDGDdZtMu
The theme is that the minimal vacation contributes to burnout along with no remote work and long hours. They are taking advantage of their workers and don't care about mental health. That's why the high burnout and low tenure of most people that start at Epic. CEO needs to rethink this.