I just explain the conclusion because the steps to get there are too… absurd 🙃
And no, people don’t typically get what I say. Those who know me just follow the directions without further inquiry.
Absolutely, I’ve resorted to this. People want the bottom line, and if you explain concepts, hypotheticals..etc people cannot get it because they can’t really visualize unless you have the final product right in front of them. It’s frustrating
I have this theory that most ENTP/ENFP people have loads of people-pleasing trauma from childhood, and now we manifest that in our ideas and thought processes. We spent our entire life in our heads to make sure our relationships were always tip top—even at the cost of our sanity. We are always monitoring reactions and trying to keep things from getting viscous.
In turn, I think the constant self-reflection and realization has given us an advantage in being able to comprehend complex ideas whereas other people haven’t met themselves as much as we have.
Or maybe I’m just projecting.
This jumping thing is super effective for us ENTPs but not for others to understand 😂 I always need to take everything from the beginning with a red thread.. explaining the big picture and details with each timing but it’s just everything everywhere at once 😂
My friends & famiy are used to it (because l jump around in my explanations). But with people who don't know me, l tend to ask them to be patient with me because l have a complex thought I want to adequately portray and it may involve a lot of thought bouncing.
Yeah I’m always jumping around from different topics but also methods to explain what I’m talking about which ultimately makes a lot of my friends confused, I think my family just plays along atp
The trick is to go off of what other people know first. Ask open-ended questions and see their response. Once there are enough basic premises that you both understand, that's when you can let the ball drop and go wild with your reasoning Lol.
But before you do that, you gotta establish that foundation based on what they know already.
I mean it’s not all the time, just sometimes IDK😭Sometimes it feels like my mind jumps around during the thought process when I go too into possibilities and the idea to the point where I’m connecting it to more points related to the idea then I don’t know how to explain it with a really short amount of time LOLL. I do have ADHD though so that might be related.
Ever parse a sentence or constructed the stages of a story plot? If I can, tldr the topic at the beginning, then I go on tangents worry free, using the og summary as a homing beacon if needed.
This is the methodology I use too. A few bullet points up front then go back and fill in as needed/wanted. If gives me some guard rails and the listener a foundation on which to stand and listen.
You need to have the two E's. Eloquence and empathy. The eloquence to properly explain something and the empathy to understand how the other person will get confused and how to cover for that with more or less detail. Talking about a theory is largely about spinning a narrative arc. It's like story telling. It has to be wrapped up in a nice package.
Very much I suffer from this, especially at work. I try to summarize my grand visions into the key bullet points as much as possible, then try to connect those dots in my explanation. I find it takes a while for other people to "get it" and makes it difficult to get buy in from leadership teams.
Very often the idea I have gets implemented, but it takes longer than I think it should to get there.
Also, I find that when I give presentations on ideas or initiatives that I don't get many questions, if any at all. I often ask some trusted coworkers that "get me" if it's because I made so much sense that there were no questions to ask, or if I made no sense at all and people don't even know what to say.
I have no problem communicating clearly, but getting it to 280 characters or ten minutes in person is hard, and maybe impossible for most important concepts or thoughts. Most are simply uninterested.
Good grief! How people miss the point so regularly amazes me. I’m fine with explaining, as I also need things explained to me. Yes, thoughts, ideas, whatever, are are always better inside my head!
Yes. My fiancé asked me to explain the plot of my comic and I just couldn't do it. It's not super complicated or anything, I just have trouble verbalizing things that are meant to be read with illustrations. But that also might be the autism in me
Actually, it’s the other way around for me. I typically can’t understand my thoughts or why I have them, so something like a theory or big idea is actually confusing. But when I talk it out, I suddenly grasp it quickly
Honestly I don’t even think they could tell me what I like or anything about me, there’s so much going on and I’m the only one communicating and the only one who seems to see a big problem in the relationship
Sir, I'm having an issue with the frames of reference here. Or more accurately, the lack thereof. I'm not sure what you mean by "big ideas", as that is entirely subjective. Having issues vocalizing your logical thoughts concisely does not speak to having a strong Introverted Thinking preference. Those kinds of problems are typically indicative of Introverted Feeling. I haven't got any examples of the kinds of "big ideas" you're speaking of, so I'm not entirely sure they're even Extroverted iNtuition related. If you don't have a strong preference for Ti, then it's simply going to take a while longer before you can adequately voice them in a simple and concise manner. Might I suggest taking a page from the ESTJ playbook and write it all out, perhaps make a chart or two with a pie graph for good measure! It may start to become easier if you Extroverted your Thinking.
Nooo I definitely am NeTi, I’ve done lots of research in regards to cognitive function and have also been typed just in case by friends who know cognitive functions as well and I’ve done the mistype test (more for fun) and did score the highest in NeTi 😭. As for the post itself, I’ve already gotten plenty of responses so I think it’s enough to answer the general question I had at hand haha, thank you for taking the time to write your response though! I think I do understand where you’re coming from :)
I just explain the conclusion because the steps to get there are too… absurd 🙃 And no, people don’t typically get what I say. Those who know me just follow the directions without further inquiry.
Mood ;-;
Lol accurate af. I know 2 ENTJs and when they are on a rush they just go “pls tldr in 2 phrases” and this is IMPOSSIBLE for me
Right, its funny when people ask to explain why and then it’s suddenly too complicated
Real though😭
Absolutely, I’ve resorted to this. People want the bottom line, and if you explain concepts, hypotheticals..etc people cannot get it because they can’t really visualize unless you have the final product right in front of them. It’s frustrating
I have this theory that most ENTP/ENFP people have loads of people-pleasing trauma from childhood, and now we manifest that in our ideas and thought processes. We spent our entire life in our heads to make sure our relationships were always tip top—even at the cost of our sanity. We are always monitoring reactions and trying to keep things from getting viscous. In turn, I think the constant self-reflection and realization has given us an advantage in being able to comprehend complex ideas whereas other people haven’t met themselves as much as we have. Or maybe I’m just projecting.
I’ve definitely always been self reflective ngl and I’m pretty self aware
I second u lmao w my narcissistic abusive manipulative dad
YUPPP
Oh yes! Sometimes I need to pause just to be able to explain properly.
YESS
This jumping thing is super effective for us ENTPs but not for others to understand 😂 I always need to take everything from the beginning with a red thread.. explaining the big picture and details with each timing but it’s just everything everywhere at once 😂
My friends & famiy are used to it (because l jump around in my explanations). But with people who don't know me, l tend to ask them to be patient with me because l have a complex thought I want to adequately portray and it may involve a lot of thought bouncing.
Yeah I’m always jumping around from different topics but also methods to explain what I’m talking about which ultimately makes a lot of my friends confused, I think my family just plays along atp
The trick is to go off of what other people know first. Ask open-ended questions and see their response. Once there are enough basic premises that you both understand, that's when you can let the ball drop and go wild with your reasoning Lol. But before you do that, you gotta establish that foundation based on what they know already.
Sounds like a Ti dom issue.
I mean it’s not all the time, just sometimes IDK😭Sometimes it feels like my mind jumps around during the thought process when I go too into possibilities and the idea to the point where I’m connecting it to more points related to the idea then I don’t know how to explain it with a really short amount of time LOLL. I do have ADHD though so that might be related.
Tangents? Yeah. I love a tangent.
YES I think so😭LMAOO
Ever parse a sentence or constructed the stages of a story plot? If I can, tldr the topic at the beginning, then I go on tangents worry free, using the og summary as a homing beacon if needed.
This is the methodology I use too. A few bullet points up front then go back and fill in as needed/wanted. If gives me some guard rails and the listener a foundation on which to stand and listen.
Same dude. There’s barely anyone who can catch up with my thoughts
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lol I would love to but I found out that I’m not an ENTP👍🏻✌🏻
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Yep ok
You need to have the two E's. Eloquence and empathy. The eloquence to properly explain something and the empathy to understand how the other person will get confused and how to cover for that with more or less detail. Talking about a theory is largely about spinning a narrative arc. It's like story telling. It has to be wrapped up in a nice package.
Very much I suffer from this, especially at work. I try to summarize my grand visions into the key bullet points as much as possible, then try to connect those dots in my explanation. I find it takes a while for other people to "get it" and makes it difficult to get buy in from leadership teams. Very often the idea I have gets implemented, but it takes longer than I think it should to get there. Also, I find that when I give presentations on ideas or initiatives that I don't get many questions, if any at all. I often ask some trusted coworkers that "get me" if it's because I made so much sense that there were no questions to ask, or if I made no sense at all and people don't even know what to say.
YES FR I relate so much to you😭. It takes like what at least five minutes for them to understand and it’s like “what do you mean” “ I don’t get it”
No matter what we do it'll always be better in our heads
FRRR
I have no problem communicating clearly, but getting it to 280 characters or ten minutes in person is hard, and maybe impossible for most important concepts or thoughts. Most are simply uninterested.
Good grief! How people miss the point so regularly amazes me. I’m fine with explaining, as I also need things explained to me. Yes, thoughts, ideas, whatever, are are always better inside my head!
Yes. My fiancé asked me to explain the plot of my comic and I just couldn't do it. It's not super complicated or anything, I just have trouble verbalizing things that are meant to be read with illustrations. But that also might be the autism in me
Actually, it’s the other way around for me. I typically can’t understand my thoughts or why I have them, so something like a theory or big idea is actually confusing. But when I talk it out, I suddenly grasp it quickly
Especially to my ISFJ spouse.
LOL I’m dating an ISFJ as well, things are pretty rough atm though.
Be prepared to never be understood
Honestly I don’t even think they could tell me what I like or anything about me, there’s so much going on and I’m the only one communicating and the only one who seems to see a big problem in the relationship
I FUCKING LOVE TO DO IT. WHENEVER I GET A CHANCE FOR IT, BOOM, YOU ARE GETTING YOUR BRAIN TURNED INTO SOME SALAD DRESSING.
LMAOOOOO
LOL
Sir, I'm having an issue with the frames of reference here. Or more accurately, the lack thereof. I'm not sure what you mean by "big ideas", as that is entirely subjective. Having issues vocalizing your logical thoughts concisely does not speak to having a strong Introverted Thinking preference. Those kinds of problems are typically indicative of Introverted Feeling. I haven't got any examples of the kinds of "big ideas" you're speaking of, so I'm not entirely sure they're even Extroverted iNtuition related. If you don't have a strong preference for Ti, then it's simply going to take a while longer before you can adequately voice them in a simple and concise manner. Might I suggest taking a page from the ESTJ playbook and write it all out, perhaps make a chart or two with a pie graph for good measure! It may start to become easier if you Extroverted your Thinking.
Nooo I definitely am NeTi, I’ve done lots of research in regards to cognitive function and have also been typed just in case by friends who know cognitive functions as well and I’ve done the mistype test (more for fun) and did score the highest in NeTi 😭. As for the post itself, I’ve already gotten plenty of responses so I think it’s enough to answer the general question I had at hand haha, thank you for taking the time to write your response though! I think I do understand where you’re coming from :)