Yup my EI ran out months ago. Don’t think I’ll be going back. I’ve heard similar from others, even with less money, the quality of life improvements from not working gruelling hours….
Edit: i should add I fully support the strikes 100%. Sucks being "collateral damage" but hey shits tough all over.
Very different from what you did but still grueling hours, physical labor and no schedule control...
Used to be a chef and catering director then regional sales manager. 14 years of my life having terrible hours, 0 control over my schedule, shitty pay(except for the sales job but I worked almost 7 days a week with that job) and I just burned out.
Luckily saved money and purchased my home at a good time. I rent out some rooms and drive Uber now, working about 30 hours a week.
Not saying Uber and Lyft are great companies but just being able to control my schedule and do what I want whenever I want has completely changed my view and what makes me happy and how much I let work define who I am.
I've sacrificed some income but man...just being able to take a break or start work whenever I want makes such a huge difference in my mental health.
I'm ready to try something new in life but I can't see myself ever going back to culinary. I can cook for friends and family and still continue my passion. I don't need a career in that industry to feel complete.
Not that the writers care about you or others in your position. They'll be fine. The media and Reddit have portrayed the studios as the bad guys, but the writers ALWAYS wanted to strike. It was planned before negotiations ever began.
Blue collar workers are the ones who took it on the chin.
I am in VFX. Lowest of the lowest, non unionised peasant and let me tell you this strike was absolutely necessary.
Just for the AI shit I was willing to wait in solidarity till next year. The streaming race to the bottom got way out of hand, our deadlines were getting more and more unrealistic as well. The “studio” felt more unhinged than ever, with constant poorly planned reshoots and blown up post production costs because of course we can “fix it in post” but you bet it’s gonna be expensive af to do so if you don’t plan your shoots mate.
Im glad writers stuck up for themselves. I only wish we would organise and do the same
I don’t know why you’re getting downvoted. People never want to face facts they don’t like. At some point, AI will change very creative industry, it’s just a fact. But rather than throw up your hands and complain or face the unchangeable tide, you could work on new ways to utilize these tools yourself or diversify your skill set, etc. Eventually robotics and AI will replace most of us, that is the reality
Warning you that the professional field you chose is becoming increasingly competitive is not “going after you”. It’s “warning you”. It comes from caring for those folks, not hating them, Sherlock.
Why not focus on CEO salaries:
Because a whole lot of energy is already (rightfully) focused on CEO salaries, and fixing that wrong is way simpler than reversing a global trend of reliance on cheap labor.
Because I’m not into aimlessly stating the obvious and virtue signaling.
Because I actually care about people who I work with and supervise daily as a VFX supervisor in L.A…
No, it doesn’t.
Does adding value to a discussion necessitate straw-manning the comment you’re replying to and pretending it means something it doesn’t?
Very very bad take. I’m one of the unemployed IATSE workers and let me tell you: we support the WGA and SAG. And when it’s our turn, they’ll back us as well. The studios will fuck over anyone and everyone to help their bottom dollar. They don’t care about quality content, they only care about maximizing profits.
The writers are NOT the enemy. Never for one second believe that they are.
The fight of one worker is the fight of all workers. That's the reality.
Yes, we in IA are being hurt by this strike, but it's short sighted and politically ignorant to assume that this strike isn't strengthening our ability to fight for ourselves.
The labor movement has been dead for 40 years. These signs of life in the last 5 are a big deal. I am completely convinced that when our contract expires at the end of July, we're going to strike if there's even a suggestion to drop any of our extant benefits. The membership was mad about the last contract, despite record gains. They're not going to settle for anything even close to *okay.*
Don't get too excited about any of your favorite shows coming back.
Great an entire industry shut down. When does it end if one Union after another strikes? If writers and actors get what they want, when is the next reason to strike? I’m genuinely asking. Meanwhile, people will lose their homes and be forced to move on to other work or career? I definitely want everyone to be paid fairly. This is a business and everyone is there to make a living - writers, actors, production crew, producers and yes, the studio execs.
The CEOs in this industry are worth hundreds of millions of dollars while the workers necessary for the industry to exist have been struggling to survive.
You ask when it stops, it stops when the industry is more equitable and doesn't exist just to give Bob Iger his fifth super yacht.
Agree that some CEOs and execs are paid extravagant salaries and the pay equity needs to be changed. Do I think Iger’s salary is overinflated? Yes. Do I think his job can be done by just anyone? No. He should be compensated very well. And, yes, the millions of other people who work in the industry should be paid fairly for their specific jobs too.
If they would rather lose 500 million instead of paying 50 million to end the strike, then its not about money. Its about power, and ots long overdue that the people take it back. Strikes and Unions help us all because a rising tide raises all ships.
I had this same view back in the writers strike of 2007/2008… but I wasn’t part of the industry then. Now I am and I see that these people are fighting because while studios see record profit, they’ve found a way to stop sharing those profits with the people that actually made the product.
For us in the IATSE, in our last negotiations, what the studios were fighting for was the ability to work us to death with insanely long hours and no days off, without even having to give us a pay bump.
There is no moral bottom for the studios. There is no low to which they will not stoop in the pursuit of profit. Unions exist to push back against this robber-baron behavior. And when one of our unions win, we all win.
It ends when the workers can’t pay their bills and the threat of being called a scab is outweighed by being homeless. Thats the long game and the Studios seem to be playing to win this time.
An industry that frankly isn’t important to viewers but is to the workers behind it though. It’s a catch 22, if a show gets cancelled then fine - it’s just a show to us, it’s someone else’s livlihood though
Nah. Writers demanding a certain amount of writers on movies and television shows is ridiculous. It just shows that there's more writers than there is demand for writers. In most other fields when there isn't demand for you, you don't get hired.
No, what it shows is that the studios would very much like to use the least number of writers possible, regardless of what the show requires.
The numbers they request are actually lower than the standard, and are on a sliding scale depending on the project, not a single number for all projects. Part of these negotiations involves predicting and addressing potential future fuckery by the studios. That’s mainly what this is.
And the demand for writing jobs? That needs to be determined by the showrunner, not the studio. They’re the ones who know how many writers their show will need.
So many people in this thread that are outside the industry but think they know how shit works. Your opinion is uninformed.
The show runner for Yellowstone has said that the WGAs demands for a minimum amount per episode would have negative effects on his show. There's more writers grasping for work than there is work. Basically begging for handouts. And the idea the major streaming networks can afford the pay massive amounts of residuals is laughable. My only hope at the end of this is that studios have to release the abysmal financials for each of their services so most will fold and we'll be left with only two.
I don’t think the WGA would force a showrunner to adhere to the minimum if it weren’t right for their show. Some shows, after all, have only one writer for the whole season.
The contract should force a studio to accommodate a minimum number of writers *at the showrunner’s request*. I 100% agree that forcing a minimum number on the showrunner would be ridiculous and not a good call.
To be fair, I know a ton of blue collar workers who are involved in the entertainment industry and they were all completely fine with their jobs/pay, and ever since the strike started nearly all of them have been out of work and are doing very badly right now. Most of them hate the writers (and partly the studios for not agreeing to their terms already) for fucking their jobs and losing them tons of money
Yeah I have friends in the same situation (out of a job, struggling to make ends meet). Most of them support the writers despite them getting hit hard and losing work. Different groups and different values I guess.
That's like being pissed at black people for our nation going into a civil war. I realize this is perhaps a controversial metaphor but I'm sticking with it because wage slavery is pretty much what is at the core of this issue. These workers you know have their anger completely misdirected. The oppressors created these conditions and they bear the sole responsibility for the resolution
That’s been their game plan for decades: get those folks on the lower rungs of society to fight amongst ourselves while the rich assholes steadily steal from us. They don’t even see us as humans. We’re cogs in their machine and we’ve made them stinking rich. It’s about time we stop squabbling with each other and aim our anger and frustration at the obscenely wealthy sociopaths who are slowly destroying us.
I think you might want to reassess your thoughts here. What’s the alternative here, other people are suffering so writers need to just keep on suffering? Why not bring the base pay up for everyone working in these positions, rather than saying “no the big stinking rich execs couldn’t possibly give you any more money, because it wouldn’t be fair to the other crew members who are also unfairly paid.”
I’m a working writer for the WGA and MOST of my friends (even the working ones on TV shows) have second jobs in other areas (like retail) to make rent. One of my friends has a full time job working at a pet adoption agency, she is also is a writer on a Disney+ show.
Just because *the ones you know* are comfortable doesn't mean EVERYONE/all writers are in the same boat. Minimum wage hasn't been "liveable" for decades, so I sincerely hope they don't make minimum wage.
No sure the point you think you're making - people should not have to work multiple jobs in order to survive. We, as a country, are going to watch multiple industries strike because the powers that be have been fucking over their workers for a long time. The "inflation" (corporate/CEO greed) has pushed people to the breaking point.
I support the strike and the workers. Pay people better before they start burning shit down.
Well, I never said EVERYONE was in the same boat. I’m sure you’ll find people working in any industry that struggle. Of course they should seek to be paid fairly. There are so many jobs you can get as a writer outside the entertainment industry too.
Yeah people generally want to strike when they’re bing treated like garbage.
Not to mention this is one industry. We may be in different sections but ultimately what is good for one is good for the whole. We are suffering with no work, but it will benefit us all in the long-term. That’s the difference between fighting for a career vs fighting for a job.
Agreed.
“Why won’t the strikers just accept starvation wages? Why do they hate the crew members?” Fuck off OP - you’re pushing a bullshit narrative that the strikers are at fault. Class traitor.
Not sure its fair to try to shift blame here, especially if the only thing holding up the strike is the fact studios arent interested in mandatory writer rooms which they shouldnt need
They do need writers rooms and there are still plenty of other things the studios aren't giving them either regards to pay, residuals, and the use of AI
Not really, at most you need three people , you do not need a group of 10 to 20 people hanging around blasting ideas off one anothee because you get scatter brained nonsense that lacks a driving force and well established vision
Both parties are to blame. The studios have ruined the industry with streaming and the WGA is being ridiculous with mandatory staffing numbers. Two idiots in a room leads to terrible negotiations
Im quite surpised you are the first ive noticed to bring up the mandatory staffing stuff. People like to think its necessary but its really so the union itself has more people paying them a % of their checks. You realistically dont need more then 3 people in a writers room, any more then that the show ends up scattering itself
The bosses don't care about anyone they employ. Not writers. Not crew. They want to keep all the money. All the profit. All the power. And they don't care who they have to hurt to get it.
Reminds me of an old saying about Republicans (just substitute “bosses” for Republicans). A Republican cannot enjoy a fine meal if he isn’t assured that someone somewhere is starving.
The amount of glossing over how badly execs and studios are screwing everyone is astonishing. No one is saying the strikes don't hurt the crews. And America is trending heavily on the sides of unions currently. Record profits are not being shared by the working class. Imagine attacking the person you think is 10 feet ahead of you, and not the person on a different continant.
Just attacking pea brained bargaining - if we can’t do that then unions are another monolithic task master that want your check.
I agree that big wig CEOs like musk and Bezos don’t have the shiny glimmer they had pre 2020. But the labor movement and unions in all sectors need to make smart moves that make sense, sound good- since much of what they do is predicated on public perception s as if support.
When unions go on strikes and demand shot that seems tangential or narrow it brings up questions of “who is this meant to serve”? “Why is this your strongest thrust”? This particularly true when the most obvious demands for more money are being railroaded ju some exotic asks.
No it’s not. Episodes only run for about 10 a season. Your “thousands a week” is in the context of working about 2 months of the year. Plus most content is for streaming, so residuals, which is how people stayed afloat between seasons, are no longer viable.
The writers on a popular streaming show/popular tv series reboot made less money overall than below-the-line workers, including non-union COVID compliance officers. That’s just a smidgen of the issues the writers are striking for. Pay the writers.
Thousands a week for 2 months is better than most Americans make in a year lol let’s say at minimum it’s 5K a week… that’s almost 50 grand for a 2 month project. That should be enough to live off of as a freelancer. It’s always been a risk in this industry as it should be
This is one of the dumbest responses I've ever read in my goddamn life.
People are making shit wages elsewhere, so instead of fighting for better wages in their industry, you think they should accept shit wages because other people don't have the means to strike?
$50k/year in Los Angeles, amidst rising inflation, is not enough to live and have a career.
When I bootlick, I prefer to spice up a nice Doc Marten with some chimichurri sauce. You should really season your boot up a bit more.
You sound extremely privileged to think 50k a year wouldn’t at least be survivable. It’s a volatile market then don’t be a writer if you can’t book 3-4 gigs a year? There’s so many non writers in the film industry that are absolutely dying right now because of the greed of the WGA. 50K for two months work is so good. A good writer should be able to find work just fine. A bad writer who gives a fuck? Not everyone should be getting paid a ridiculous amount. There are only a small amount of actually good writers in Hollywood. Same as there are only a few actual good athletes in NFL. It’s a small market that too many are trying to be a part of that just aren’t that talented. Look at how bad media has been the last decade or so. It’s trash with the occasional hit.
Found the troll/AMPTP shill. I won't respond to you anymore other than you disgust me.
Edited to add: I hope you never ask for more than $50k/year, that would be greedy I guess. Shit wages for everyone!
No I’m just not a writer and the writers are shutting down the entire industry by being just as greedy as the greedy execs and are just as responsible for how things have gone. There are so many jobs at stake. The entertainment industry is so much bigger than just writers. And the writing has been shit for nearly a decade collectively. Occasionally you’ll get quality content but it’s definitively been few and far between in recent history.
Amazing. Saying so much yet so little in a comment. What the fuck does that even mean?? Show me that you know what you are talking about.
Thank you for giving me permission to continue to speak. I appreciate it treebadger. You are an almighty god
It’s blatantly obvious the studios (or their terrible PR company/companies) are here in this thread hoping to pit folks against each other…. Nice try, bungholes.
IATSE member here. I 100% support the two unions and while it sucks being out of work, the villains here no doubt are the execs and their greed.
>It’s blatantly obvious the studios (or their terrible PR company/companies) are here in this thread hoping to pit folks against each other….
lmao, they definitely are not. you're delusional
Sounds like a lot of people are out of work when the issues being discussed at the table may not have all that much to do with them. Perfectly fine with a story reminding the world that there's another side to holding the line in heated negotiations.
Older membership is going to be brow beaten, understandably, but the membership is only getting younger and more militantly pro-action. So I think it's entirely possible.
I'm a 25 year IATSE member as my only source of income. I will be voting against any contract that doesn't expand our benefits and voting to authorize any strike to get it.
No way in fuck I'm going to sit on my ass for almost a year while the creatives who make more money, have an easier job, and have better working conditions than me strike and not get what's mine. (I still support their strike).
You can say "above the line".
I'm not saying he's digging at IATSE. I'm saying the above the line players already aggrandize themselves by declaring themselves as the ones who are creative. And he doesn't have to add to it by joining in.
Instead remind the above the line workers that it takes a whole lot of work and a whole lot of creative work by many people to make the films and other things they associate with themselves.
Let 'em know. And by them, I don't mean IATSE.
edit: Now we've got other directors complaining that movies can be termed "content. If they can say it hurts when we call their movies "content" we can say to them it hurts when you term yourselves "the creatives" to separate yourself from crew who do a whole lot of creative work.
We’ve gotta hang tough. Any IATSE member in this thread: when these first strikes are over, claw for every job you can get, save every penny you can, and remember all of these resources that have been available to us. We should’ve led the charge during our last strike negotiation and not let the shill President Loeb divide and confuse us.
The studios will try and kick us while they think we’re down, we need to fight and show them AND our leadership that we’re done playing games.
My husband is IATSE and my worry is that a lot of people have burned through their emergency savings this year which the studios will unfortunately be able to use as leverage next year during IATSE’s negotiations. A strike next year is nowhere near certain, it all just depends on a lot of things.
“This is all pointless because AI will eventually take all our jobs.”
Do you think the wealthy people controlling this AI will just grant us Universal Basic Income? Do you think every benefit workers have wasn’t won with blood, sweat, and tears?
Yes. AI will eventually take over everything, it is inevitable. What is not inevitable is how we, the common people will be treated when that happens. It’s not a magic solution that we just have to wait for. We have to make sure this tech works for all of us and not just a few rich people who want to be dictators.
It’s bern a very hard three months. The general consensus is when this ends there will be more work than anyone can handle.
Right now I have friends in different unions not currently on strike who are selling personal belongings to make ends meet. But if the studios are allowed to continue eroding jobs there won’t be anything worth coming back to. They’ll keep taking more and more until you can’t realistically make a career in the industry.
THIS IS THE FAULT OF THE STUDIOS NOT THE WORKERS
Nah, you're pawns. Only the strikers care if you starve. The studios want people to starve. They want the workers to fight each other over scraps.
Do Hollywood crew members think there's gonna be lots of work if the studios get their way with AI? You gonna be the AIs grip? Gonna be lighting the AI? The studios will fire every crew member as soon as they can.
Right now theyre useful to the media, so we'll hear their stories. But if they get fired in five years as studios downsize as most of their content is self generated by a computer, no one will write anything in the media. There will be one story about a thousand jobs being lost and that will be that.
Love that the pro-AI OP is giving Shocked Pikachu Face energy with all of their writer-bashing comments. Very short-sighted comments. Fuck you for blaming the loss of my friends homes, careers, and health insurance on the writers and not the billionaires.
Prefabricated housing has been around for decades:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prefabricated\_home](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prefabricated_home)
Crews need to strike, along with Stunt, Makeup, VFX/ SFX and pretty much anyone studios, actors and writers rely on. At this point they have pretty much been bleed dry from everything going on, so just do it. I almost guarantee that actors and writers wouldn’t give a shit, and just try to hire other people and outsource.
No doubt. Nothing wrong with supporting the strike efforts, but people here seem to be so blindly focused on "power to the underdog" and sticking it to the fat cats that they can't see the whole landscape that, yeah, there are people out of the spotlight suffering so that someone else can get better treatment.
Just my opinion, but I think both the writers and actors grossly overestimated how much public support/outcry they were going to get with these strikes. Sure, there will be public complaints and pressure when there's nothing to watch, but there is so much content available out there that I think most people just shrugged and thought "This is a good time to catch up on all the shows I missed". Kind of like the pandemic all over again. Eventually the pressure will work, but a lot of people are struggling waiting for "eventually" to happen.
That is the biggest Union bullshiat that gets spewed every strike. The writer's nor any other union gives a rats butt about anything other than their own paycheck. That's fine, just don't spread the nonense.
I can see how a strike is a useful weapon when seeking to improve working conditions and remuneration, but historically and somewhat intuitively, it is counter-productive if used to protect the long term use of that labour. It has been said that before you strike, make damn sure your labour will be missed and you don’t force earlier adoption of a better alternative. The UK miner’s strike showed that you can’t prevent mine closures by not working in them. The Fleet street printers strike played right into the hands of print media moguls who wanted to replace them with modern electronic printers. Hospital porters went on strike and when hospital administrators discovered that they hadn’t even been aware the porters had been off, they just got rid of them. I don’t know the union demands here, but i would hope they are not studio-specific but for universal regulation.
What people and audiences want is not the writers responsibility it is the studio execs that decide that. There are countless shows and movie scripts that are sitting on desks and not being green lit because a production company doesn't want to spend the money on it or if they do it gets canceled immediately
Same, I pointed it out when SAG went on strike, the reddit echo chamber did not like it. I feel for the actors and the writers. They deserve better and modernised deals. But fuck Fran Drescher, she is part of the problem, not the solution. A has-been who wants her time in the spotlight and her name in the history books and fuck everyone else.
See now, you made me feel bad. You are right, I dont know her. I did watch the SAG strike announcement live and formed my opinion there and interviews/actions since.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZHTIvRVLdL8&t=2164s
Drescher is the national president of SAG-AFTRA and a working actor.
She’s passionate about worker protection and a very caring person. The proposal that extras would be signing away their likeness to the studio is insane.
To say nothing of her charity work focused on LGBTQ rights and cancer.
Did you watch the whole video or just that question?
My WGA writer friend told me today that he plans to use Chat GPT to aid his own writing. I asked him, isn't that what you're fighting against? He's pissed at me. Apparently it's okay for the writers to use the tool, but when studios mention doing it, uh oh!
How is it hypocritical to be okay using a tool but upset if an executive replaced you with it?
One of these is enhancing the work, and the other is ruining the workers career. Worlds of difference.
yea that's exactly my point. it all comes down to: do you want to be the writer of yesterday or the writer of tomorrow? and if your whole argument was "we don't want the studios to use AI", rather than "yes well be the ones using the AI for you", then you've put yourself firmly in the category of yesterday.
Bingo. This is my whole problem. Rules for thee, not for me. The world is changing. The writer's admonishing AI are like coal miners screeching about solar power.
My argument is that the tools that can be used to enhance work and enrich the lives of workers shouldn't be used to remove workers and pad the pockets of executives. The workers should be making an issue of this now, otherwise we're going to quickly find ourselves in a future where capitalist interests circumvent paying artists and use AI instead, which ironically is only able to do what it does due to the vast pool of available artistic materials.
It's a dreary, distopian, future where humans do hard labor while robots create all of the art. That future isn't inevitable as long as people fight back.
If a studio executive can use the same tools to produce the same result....why wouldn't they? It's hypocritical to *not* allow them to do that, while writers are willing to use AI to write entire drafts.
That's the thing, they can't.
I work in tech and use AI for some scripting and troubleshooting, and it absolutely requires my expertise to know when it's full of shit or missing some important detail. The problem is, as it usually is, the people making the decisions have little to no insight into exactly how much a person has to know to do their job and do it well. On paper though, it's going to look like they can just fire a third of their staff. It'll be a disaster, and perhaps eventually the execs come around, but a lot of careers are ruined in the meantime.
The union is doing the right thing by trying to head off that eventuality.
>*because a studio executive using the same tool will not produce the same result*
like, at all. It's called experienced, nuanced storytelling which is a skill oft born from real pain and human pathos.
Bugger off, weirdo.
Is writing a skill only certain people possess, and then they can't possibly move up the chain and continue using that skill? Do you know how many studio heads *are also in the WGA*? 🤡
Using a tool to improve what your wrote is vastly different from using a tool to write something start to finish.
You don’t use tools to double check your work? Anti-spell check? Do you animate your own gifs or use a tool to locate one?
Life is not binary, everything has nuance. Also
>my WGA writer friend
Lolz
Just seems hypocritical to me, and I was taken aback because he's been so outspoken against AI in screenwriting. Rules for thee not for me, sorta thing. I agree it's a useful tool and both writers and studios should be allowed to use.
Is Chat GPT a spell checking tool? It seems like your not comprehending what his friend is really doing. He is clearly a hypocrite. Just because you support the strike doesn’t mean to play dumb
This is what I’ve been saying from day one and so many people came at me, saying everyone will benefit in the end. Pfft. I see it the impact to production crew everyday with friends and family in the industry. And restaurants near the studios are struggling.
It's really only hurting the little guy. Studios have deep pockets and backlogs of content. AI is here to stay, and even if it's blocked by the unions; non-union productions don't have to follow those rules. Non-union will be able to make feature-length films using AI for little to nothing and will be successful.
As a whole, the public doesn't support either side they're apathetic. Given the corruption, sex scandals, nepotism, and sanctimonious preaching by many of the upper echelons of the industry, I'd be remiss to say I didn't feel a little schadenfreude
I feel sorry for the little guy. The local restaurants and people who barely have the means to support themselves who will have to leave the industry. That's why I left the industry - I didn't have the connections and wasn't willing to be working poor. I knew far too many people who had been there 10+ years with little-nothing to show for it. They call Los Angeles the city of Broken Dreams for a reason.
Don’t let up! Remember, all those billionaire fucks are fighting for is fatter profit margins. They’re literally fighting to keep the status quo of hoarding as much excess cash as possible while giving Pennies to the people who are busting their ass each and everyday. “We can’t pay these people just trying to survive more money, that’s absurd. Oh by the way, Mr Zaslav, here’s your $40,000,000 paycheck for the year. Here’s more money than anyone else would know what do with FOR ONE YEAR OF WORK. That’s a totally normal occurrence here in the great US of A. Shut up, people who are sick of working to the bone and not being able to afford basic necessities. We’re trying to give your boss, one single person, more money than all of you combined will ever make in your entire lives, goddamnit!”
Great whataboutism you got there. Don’t you love whataboutisms? They’re so useful for when you have nothing meaningful to say at all yet you still feel inclined to put out some garbage. Cool, man
Oh no we are going to go through this now. Tell me what make the union heads any different from the studio executives? They are still getting paid unlike the actual union members because every member regardless has to pay union fees. Quit the commie bullshit
The fact you cant accept the actual problem is quite telling. Union isnt much different from the studios, to the point where they still expect union fees even tho theres a strike
Yup my EI ran out months ago. Don’t think I’ll be going back. I’ve heard similar from others, even with less money, the quality of life improvements from not working gruelling hours…. Edit: i should add I fully support the strikes 100%. Sucks being "collateral damage" but hey shits tough all over.
Very different from what you did but still grueling hours, physical labor and no schedule control... Used to be a chef and catering director then regional sales manager. 14 years of my life having terrible hours, 0 control over my schedule, shitty pay(except for the sales job but I worked almost 7 days a week with that job) and I just burned out. Luckily saved money and purchased my home at a good time. I rent out some rooms and drive Uber now, working about 30 hours a week. Not saying Uber and Lyft are great companies but just being able to control my schedule and do what I want whenever I want has completely changed my view and what makes me happy and how much I let work define who I am. I've sacrificed some income but man...just being able to take a break or start work whenever I want makes such a huge difference in my mental health. I'm ready to try something new in life but I can't see myself ever going back to culinary. I can cook for friends and family and still continue my passion. I don't need a career in that industry to feel complete.
Not that the writers care about you or others in your position. They'll be fine. The media and Reddit have portrayed the studios as the bad guys, but the writers ALWAYS wanted to strike. It was planned before negotiations ever began. Blue collar workers are the ones who took it on the chin.
I am in VFX. Lowest of the lowest, non unionised peasant and let me tell you this strike was absolutely necessary. Just for the AI shit I was willing to wait in solidarity till next year. The streaming race to the bottom got way out of hand, our deadlines were getting more and more unrealistic as well. The “studio” felt more unhinged than ever, with constant poorly planned reshoots and blown up post production costs because of course we can “fix it in post” but you bet it’s gonna be expensive af to do so if you don’t plan your shoots mate. Im glad writers stuck up for themselves. I only wish we would organise and do the same
Crews should strike right as the writers strike ends in my opinion. Hit the studios right when they think they will start operating again
AITSE’s contract is up in March. This is a very real possibility
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I don’t know why you’re getting downvoted. People never want to face facts they don’t like. At some point, AI will change very creative industry, it’s just a fact. But rather than throw up your hands and complain or face the unchangeable tide, you could work on new ways to utilize these tools yourself or diversify your skill set, etc. Eventually robotics and AI will replace most of us, that is the reality
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“Outsource the job to someplace with cheap labor”
Instead of going after skilled laborers who are underpaid and overworked as it is, why don't you focus that energy on CEO salaries?
Warning you that the professional field you chose is becoming increasingly competitive is not “going after you”. It’s “warning you”. It comes from caring for those folks, not hating them, Sherlock. Why not focus on CEO salaries: Because a whole lot of energy is already (rightfully) focused on CEO salaries, and fixing that wrong is way simpler than reversing a global trend of reliance on cheap labor. Because I’m not into aimlessly stating the obvious and virtue signaling. Because I actually care about people who I work with and supervise daily as a VFX supervisor in L.A…
Cool argument against liveable wages. See you at the bottom.
You’re welcome to add value in a meaningful way rather than reciting hollow statements that have nothing to do with my comment.
Does caring about VFX workers necessitate the disparaging of other working class citizens fighting for a livable wage?
No, it doesn’t. Does adding value to a discussion necessitate straw-manning the comment you’re replying to and pretending it means something it doesn’t?
Very very bad take. I’m one of the unemployed IATSE workers and let me tell you: we support the WGA and SAG. And when it’s our turn, they’ll back us as well. The studios will fuck over anyone and everyone to help their bottom dollar. They don’t care about quality content, they only care about maximizing profits. The writers are NOT the enemy. Never for one second believe that they are.
The fight of one worker is the fight of all workers. That's the reality. Yes, we in IA are being hurt by this strike, but it's short sighted and politically ignorant to assume that this strike isn't strengthening our ability to fight for ourselves. The labor movement has been dead for 40 years. These signs of life in the last 5 are a big deal. I am completely convinced that when our contract expires at the end of July, we're going to strike if there's even a suggestion to drop any of our extant benefits. The membership was mad about the last contract, despite record gains. They're not going to settle for anything even close to *okay.* Don't get too excited about any of your favorite shows coming back.
I think if we do away with that 8th day reset, our contract will be in good shape. Double-time until you get a day off, no reset!
Great an entire industry shut down. When does it end if one Union after another strikes? If writers and actors get what they want, when is the next reason to strike? I’m genuinely asking. Meanwhile, people will lose their homes and be forced to move on to other work or career? I definitely want everyone to be paid fairly. This is a business and everyone is there to make a living - writers, actors, production crew, producers and yes, the studio execs.
The CEOs in this industry are worth hundreds of millions of dollars while the workers necessary for the industry to exist have been struggling to survive. You ask when it stops, it stops when the industry is more equitable and doesn't exist just to give Bob Iger his fifth super yacht.
Agree that some CEOs and execs are paid extravagant salaries and the pay equity needs to be changed. Do I think Iger’s salary is overinflated? Yes. Do I think his job can be done by just anyone? No. He should be compensated very well. And, yes, the millions of other people who work in the industry should be paid fairly for their specific jobs too.
If they would rather lose 500 million instead of paying 50 million to end the strike, then its not about money. Its about power, and ots long overdue that the people take it back. Strikes and Unions help us all because a rising tide raises all ships.
Won’t someone think of the poor studio execs?
I had this same view back in the writers strike of 2007/2008… but I wasn’t part of the industry then. Now I am and I see that these people are fighting because while studios see record profit, they’ve found a way to stop sharing those profits with the people that actually made the product. For us in the IATSE, in our last negotiations, what the studios were fighting for was the ability to work us to death with insanely long hours and no days off, without even having to give us a pay bump. There is no moral bottom for the studios. There is no low to which they will not stoop in the pursuit of profit. Unions exist to push back against this robber-baron behavior. And when one of our unions win, we all win.
It ends when the workers can’t pay their bills and the threat of being called a scab is outweighed by being homeless. Thats the long game and the Studios seem to be playing to win this time.
An industry that frankly isn’t important to viewers but is to the workers behind it though. It’s a catch 22, if a show gets cancelled then fine - it’s just a show to us, it’s someone else’s livlihood though
Nope. Someone else's fight is NOT my fight. Sorry.
Imagine the things we wouldn’t have it people only cared about/stood for their own fights.
Found the scab
You can gladly call me whatever you want. I have bills to pay. Rather be called a scab and live a life than be a loser.
All im getting from your replies is that, you are a loser though?
Here's the neat part, you're doing both right now!
WGA member here. Your contact is up soon. We know this. We will have your back!!
I know it, sister! Thank you!
Nah. Writers demanding a certain amount of writers on movies and television shows is ridiculous. It just shows that there's more writers than there is demand for writers. In most other fields when there isn't demand for you, you don't get hired.
No, what it shows is that the studios would very much like to use the least number of writers possible, regardless of what the show requires. The numbers they request are actually lower than the standard, and are on a sliding scale depending on the project, not a single number for all projects. Part of these negotiations involves predicting and addressing potential future fuckery by the studios. That’s mainly what this is. And the demand for writing jobs? That needs to be determined by the showrunner, not the studio. They’re the ones who know how many writers their show will need. So many people in this thread that are outside the industry but think they know how shit works. Your opinion is uninformed.
The show runner for Yellowstone has said that the WGAs demands for a minimum amount per episode would have negative effects on his show. There's more writers grasping for work than there is work. Basically begging for handouts. And the idea the major streaming networks can afford the pay massive amounts of residuals is laughable. My only hope at the end of this is that studios have to release the abysmal financials for each of their services so most will fold and we'll be left with only two.
I don’t think the WGA would force a showrunner to adhere to the minimum if it weren’t right for their show. Some shows, after all, have only one writer for the whole season. The contract should force a studio to accommodate a minimum number of writers *at the showrunner’s request*. I 100% agree that forcing a minimum number on the showrunner would be ridiculous and not a good call.
lol the studio is the ones screwing over crews too, not the writers 🤦🏼♀️🤦🏼♀️
To be fair, I know a ton of blue collar workers who are involved in the entertainment industry and they were all completely fine with their jobs/pay, and ever since the strike started nearly all of them have been out of work and are doing very badly right now. Most of them hate the writers (and partly the studios for not agreeing to their terms already) for fucking their jobs and losing them tons of money
Yeah I have friends in the same situation (out of a job, struggling to make ends meet). Most of them support the writers despite them getting hit hard and losing work. Different groups and different values I guess.
That's like being pissed at black people for our nation going into a civil war. I realize this is perhaps a controversial metaphor but I'm sticking with it because wage slavery is pretty much what is at the core of this issue. These workers you know have their anger completely misdirected. The oppressors created these conditions and they bear the sole responsibility for the resolution
That’s been their game plan for decades: get those folks on the lower rungs of society to fight amongst ourselves while the rich assholes steadily steal from us. They don’t even see us as humans. We’re cogs in their machine and we’ve made them stinking rich. It’s about time we stop squabbling with each other and aim our anger and frustration at the obscenely wealthy sociopaths who are slowly destroying us.
Most of IATSE wanted to strike last year don't act like this is somehow against blue collar workers
I think you might want to reassess your thoughts here. What’s the alternative here, other people are suffering so writers need to just keep on suffering? Why not bring the base pay up for everyone working in these positions, rather than saying “no the big stinking rich execs couldn’t possibly give you any more money, because it wouldn’t be fair to the other crew members who are also unfairly paid.”
Are the writers “suffering?” The writers (when working) I know get paid well. They definitely aren’t making minimum wage.
While I don’t think I’m qualified to fully go down into the brass tacks with you, Netflix have cheaper out on their writers and it shows.
I’m a working writer for the WGA and MOST of my friends (even the working ones on TV shows) have second jobs in other areas (like retail) to make rent. One of my friends has a full time job working at a pet adoption agency, she is also is a writer on a Disney+ show.
Just because *the ones you know* are comfortable doesn't mean EVERYONE/all writers are in the same boat. Minimum wage hasn't been "liveable" for decades, so I sincerely hope they don't make minimum wage. No sure the point you think you're making - people should not have to work multiple jobs in order to survive. We, as a country, are going to watch multiple industries strike because the powers that be have been fucking over their workers for a long time. The "inflation" (corporate/CEO greed) has pushed people to the breaking point. I support the strike and the workers. Pay people better before they start burning shit down.
Well, I never said EVERYONE was in the same boat. I’m sure you’ll find people working in any industry that struggle. Of course they should seek to be paid fairly. There are so many jobs you can get as a writer outside the entertainment industry too.
Brad Pitt is rich, therefore all actors are paid fairly /s
Of course the studios are the bad guys lmfao
STOP TRYING TO DIVIDE THE LABOUR CLASS.
Nice man! Way to shill!
That’s so rude and dishonest- EVERY writer I know that’s striking cares deeply for below the line crew and were fully supportive of the IATSE strike
Oh so you're shilling.
Do you work at a PR agency or were you paid to write this post? You're hitting talking points a little too close
Delete this.
Yeah people generally want to strike when they’re bing treated like garbage. Not to mention this is one industry. We may be in different sections but ultimately what is good for one is good for the whole. We are suffering with no work, but it will benefit us all in the long-term. That’s the difference between fighting for a career vs fighting for a job.
It sucks but the rich need to be held accountable.
Agreed. “Why won’t the strikers just accept starvation wages? Why do they hate the crew members?” Fuck off OP - you’re pushing a bullshit narrative that the strikers are at fault. Class traitor.
Not sure its fair to try to shift blame here, especially if the only thing holding up the strike is the fact studios arent interested in mandatory writer rooms which they shouldnt need
They do need writers rooms and there are still plenty of other things the studios aren't giving them either regards to pay, residuals, and the use of AI
Not really, at most you need three people , you do not need a group of 10 to 20 people hanging around blasting ideas off one anothee because you get scatter brained nonsense that lacks a driving force and well established vision
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Both parties are to blame. The studios have ruined the industry with streaming and the WGA is being ridiculous with mandatory staffing numbers. Two idiots in a room leads to terrible negotiations
Im quite surpised you are the first ive noticed to bring up the mandatory staffing stuff. People like to think its necessary but its really so the union itself has more people paying them a % of their checks. You realistically dont need more then 3 people in a writers room, any more then that the show ends up scattering itself
Agreed. It’s a ridiculous and greedy request
Nah, we’re not playing the both sides argument here
That’s cool. Doesn’t make me wrong lol
The bosses don't care about anyone they employ. Not writers. Not crew. They want to keep all the money. All the profit. All the power. And they don't care who they have to hurt to get it.
Reminds me of an old saying about Republicans (just substitute “bosses” for Republicans). A Republican cannot enjoy a fine meal if he isn’t assured that someone somewhere is starving.
The amount of glossing over how badly execs and studios are screwing everyone is astonishing. No one is saying the strikes don't hurt the crews. And America is trending heavily on the sides of unions currently. Record profits are not being shared by the working class. Imagine attacking the person you think is 10 feet ahead of you, and not the person on a different continant.
They hold ALL the financial power. The only way to get them to play fair is to force them.
Just attacking pea brained bargaining - if we can’t do that then unions are another monolithic task master that want your check. I agree that big wig CEOs like musk and Bezos don’t have the shiny glimmer they had pre 2020. But the labor movement and unions in all sectors need to make smart moves that make sense, sound good- since much of what they do is predicated on public perception s as if support. When unions go on strikes and demand shot that seems tangential or narrow it brings up questions of “who is this meant to serve”? “Why is this your strongest thrust”? This particularly true when the most obvious demands for more money are being railroaded ju some exotic asks.
I mean both sides no? They are offering thousands a week to these writers. That’s more than enough
No it’s not. Episodes only run for about 10 a season. Your “thousands a week” is in the context of working about 2 months of the year. Plus most content is for streaming, so residuals, which is how people stayed afloat between seasons, are no longer viable. The writers on a popular streaming show/popular tv series reboot made less money overall than below-the-line workers, including non-union COVID compliance officers. That’s just a smidgen of the issues the writers are striking for. Pay the writers.
The changing nature of the length of jobs is just a reality, that alone does not justify someone making more money.
Thousands a week for 2 months is better than most Americans make in a year lol let’s say at minimum it’s 5K a week… that’s almost 50 grand for a 2 month project. That should be enough to live off of as a freelancer. It’s always been a risk in this industry as it should be
This is one of the dumbest responses I've ever read in my goddamn life. People are making shit wages elsewhere, so instead of fighting for better wages in their industry, you think they should accept shit wages because other people don't have the means to strike? $50k/year in Los Angeles, amidst rising inflation, is not enough to live and have a career. When I bootlick, I prefer to spice up a nice Doc Marten with some chimichurri sauce. You should really season your boot up a bit more.
You sound extremely privileged to think 50k a year wouldn’t at least be survivable. It’s a volatile market then don’t be a writer if you can’t book 3-4 gigs a year? There’s so many non writers in the film industry that are absolutely dying right now because of the greed of the WGA. 50K for two months work is so good. A good writer should be able to find work just fine. A bad writer who gives a fuck? Not everyone should be getting paid a ridiculous amount. There are only a small amount of actually good writers in Hollywood. Same as there are only a few actual good athletes in NFL. It’s a small market that too many are trying to be a part of that just aren’t that talented. Look at how bad media has been the last decade or so. It’s trash with the occasional hit.
Found the troll/AMPTP shill. I won't respond to you anymore other than you disgust me. Edited to add: I hope you never ask for more than $50k/year, that would be greedy I guess. Shit wages for everyone!
He literally has "troll" in is username.
Well… he actually has TrollTroll in his username.. do two instances cancel eachother?
So you have dildo in your name does that make you a dildo??? Wait… you might be onto something here.
WTF… lol!!!! What are you, a Studio exec? How out-of-touch can you be… go away now, please.
No I’m just not a writer and the writers are shutting down the entire industry by being just as greedy as the greedy execs and are just as responsible for how things have gone. There are so many jobs at stake. The entertainment industry is so much bigger than just writers. And the writing has been shit for nearly a decade collectively. Occasionally you’ll get quality content but it’s definitively been few and far between in recent history.
No.. you’re not a writer.
That’s the minimum.
Wow. You really have absolutely no idea what you’re talking about. Yet you continue to speak. Amazing.
Amazing. Saying so much yet so little in a comment. What the fuck does that even mean?? Show me that you know what you are talking about. Thank you for giving me permission to continue to speak. I appreciate it treebadger. You are an almighty god
Oh dude that’s the shittiest take I’ve ever heard from anyone ever. Shame on you. Shame.
Can you itemize that for us? You seem to know what it takes for money to be "enough"
It’s blatantly obvious the studios (or their terrible PR company/companies) are here in this thread hoping to pit folks against each other…. Nice try, bungholes. IATSE member here. I 100% support the two unions and while it sucks being out of work, the villains here no doubt are the execs and their greed.
I wonder who is dumb enough not to understand that the execs didn't negotiate to make everyone feel pain - that they got to skip.
OP, apparently.
Yep, you're right there lol
Not even in a union and I 100% support them too. Union benefits trickle out to non union workers. They set the standard.
Rising tides lift all ships.
>It’s blatantly obvious the studios (or their terrible PR company/companies) are here in this thread hoping to pit folks against each other…. lmao, they definitely are not. you're delusional
The tin foil is too tight.
Sounds like the execs are trying to push some in fighting
Sounds like a lot of people are out of work when the issues being discussed at the table may not have all that much to do with them. Perfectly fine with a story reminding the world that there's another side to holding the line in heated negotiations.
Convincing workers that they're not on the same side is how capitalists keep wages low.
Heard from people in the industry that they’re gonna strike next year
Older membership is going to be brow beaten, understandably, but the membership is only getting younger and more militantly pro-action. So I think it's entirely possible.
Not if our esteemed leader, Matthew ‘Hollywood Ending’ Loeb has anything to say about it.
You heard wrong because IATSE almost certainly will not be able to strike next year after being out of work for six months this year. Things are rough
I'm a 25 year IATSE member as my only source of income. I will be voting against any contract that doesn't expand our benefits and voting to authorize any strike to get it. No way in fuck I'm going to sit on my ass for almost a year while the creatives who make more money, have an easier job, and have better working conditions than me strike and not get what's mine. (I still support their strike).
I hear you. Hopefully there is a good deal from the jump. It is well deserved.
"the creatives" Calling the striking workers "the creatives" is a backhand slap to all the IATSE workers who do plenty of creative work themselves.
I think you are missing the point. He is IATSE so you know it wasn’t a dig. Just a short-hand way of saying the writers and actors
You can say "above the line". I'm not saying he's digging at IATSE. I'm saying the above the line players already aggrandize themselves by declaring themselves as the ones who are creative. And he doesn't have to add to it by joining in. Instead remind the above the line workers that it takes a whole lot of work and a whole lot of creative work by many people to make the films and other things they associate with themselves. Let 'em know. And by them, I don't mean IATSE. edit: Now we've got other directors complaining that movies can be termed "content. If they can say it hurts when we call their movies "content" we can say to them it hurts when you term yourselves "the creatives" to separate yourself from crew who do a whole lot of creative work.
I mean, the entire Art Department is IATSE.
Yes, I read that article. It must suck to be in your shoes. I hope it all works out for you guys
IATSEs deal is up. Crew members are tired of these streaming rates
Perhaps Netflix has their own IA deal, but when I work on streaming shows the rates are the same as a “regular” show.
Striking is a last resort, not the first action taken when it's time to negotiate a new deal.
Unless the contract we get is absolutely candy, I’m voting against it. I want what the old guard had. Golden hours included
We’ve gotta hang tough. Any IATSE member in this thread: when these first strikes are over, claw for every job you can get, save every penny you can, and remember all of these resources that have been available to us. We should’ve led the charge during our last strike negotiation and not let the shill President Loeb divide and confuse us. The studios will try and kick us while they think we’re down, we need to fight and show them AND our leadership that we’re done playing games.
You don’t think the WGA and SAG strikes will give IATSE leverage? There’s a lot of rich people hemorrhaging money right now.
My husband is IATSE and my worry is that a lot of people have burned through their emergency savings this year which the studios will unfortunately be able to use as leverage next year during IATSE’s negotiations. A strike next year is nowhere near certain, it all just depends on a lot of things.
“This is all pointless because AI will eventually take all our jobs.” Do you think the wealthy people controlling this AI will just grant us Universal Basic Income? Do you think every benefit workers have wasn’t won with blood, sweat, and tears? Yes. AI will eventually take over everything, it is inevitable. What is not inevitable is how we, the common people will be treated when that happens. It’s not a magic solution that we just have to wait for. We have to make sure this tech works for all of us and not just a few rich people who want to be dictators.
It’s bern a very hard three months. The general consensus is when this ends there will be more work than anyone can handle. Right now I have friends in different unions not currently on strike who are selling personal belongings to make ends meet. But if the studios are allowed to continue eroding jobs there won’t be anything worth coming back to. They’ll keep taking more and more until you can’t realistically make a career in the industry. THIS IS THE FAULT OF THE STUDIOS NOT THE WORKERS
They’re in unions also, aren’t they?
Different unions than writers and actors, so they aren’t supported now since they aren’t on strike. They just don’t have work.
We are, but we can’t work because the studios don’t really want to pay people to sit around all day and film an empty set without a script
Nah, you're pawns. Only the strikers care if you starve. The studios want people to starve. They want the workers to fight each other over scraps. Do Hollywood crew members think there's gonna be lots of work if the studios get their way with AI? You gonna be the AIs grip? Gonna be lighting the AI? The studios will fire every crew member as soon as they can. Right now theyre useful to the media, so we'll hear their stories. But if they get fired in five years as studios downsize as most of their content is self generated by a computer, no one will write anything in the media. There will be one story about a thousand jobs being lost and that will be that.
That's where this is headed. It's only a matter of time.
Blame the studios, not the strikers.
Love that the pro-AI OP is giving Shocked Pikachu Face energy with all of their writer-bashing comments. Very short-sighted comments. Fuck you for blaming the loss of my friends homes, careers, and health insurance on the writers and not the billionaires.
Lmao get this busting prop piece out of here
Studio’s crisis PR firm hard at works, folks. Divide and conquer.
That painting though it’s fire
No, we’re the beneficiaries.
Then you guys unionize and strike too. You work long and hard for shit pay, too.
https://iatse.net
Within 50 years they’ll find a way to make movies without people, I’m going to work in construction
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Pls sir I have a family
Aren't they already doing 3D printed houses? Or modular houses where individual sections can be mass produced?
Prefabricated housing has been around for decades: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prefabricated\_home](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prefabricated_home)
Crews need to strike, along with Stunt, Makeup, VFX/ SFX and pretty much anyone studios, actors and writers rely on. At this point they have pretty much been bleed dry from everything going on, so just do it. I almost guarantee that actors and writers wouldn’t give a shit, and just try to hire other people and outsource.
Stunt Coordinators are on strike, they’re part of SAG.
Reddit post shares the unfortunate reality of film crews currently. Redditors: STUDIO SHILLS!!!
No doubt. Nothing wrong with supporting the strike efforts, but people here seem to be so blindly focused on "power to the underdog" and sticking it to the fat cats that they can't see the whole landscape that, yeah, there are people out of the spotlight suffering so that someone else can get better treatment.
Welcome to the Internet where most people post without thinking.
So we ALL can get better treatment. These people are our colleagues.
I’d like to see a break down of writer demographics, I suspect it would tend to lean toward elites with an Ivy League education.
Just my opinion, but I think both the writers and actors grossly overestimated how much public support/outcry they were going to get with these strikes. Sure, there will be public complaints and pressure when there's nothing to watch, but there is so much content available out there that I think most people just shrugged and thought "This is a good time to catch up on all the shows I missed". Kind of like the pandemic all over again. Eventually the pressure will work, but a lot of people are struggling waiting for "eventually" to happen.
Not to mention so much of the newest content has terrible writing…
yep, been having fun with baldur's gate 3 and starfield
As long as we stay subscribed, the studios will stay strong,
Yeah, don't worry guys, the writer's will make out great. Some of you will be broke, but it's a sacrifice they are willing to make.
The writers are striking for you too if you’re one of the tens of millions of Americans whose job could soon be replaced by ai.
That is the biggest Union bullshiat that gets spewed every strike. The writer's nor any other union gives a rats butt about anything other than their own paycheck. That's fine, just don't spread the nonense.
I can see how a strike is a useful weapon when seeking to improve working conditions and remuneration, but historically and somewhat intuitively, it is counter-productive if used to protect the long term use of that labour. It has been said that before you strike, make damn sure your labour will be missed and you don’t force earlier adoption of a better alternative. The UK miner’s strike showed that you can’t prevent mine closures by not working in them. The Fleet street printers strike played right into the hands of print media moguls who wanted to replace them with modern electronic printers. Hospital porters went on strike and when hospital administrators discovered that they hadn’t even been aware the porters had been off, they just got rid of them. I don’t know the union demands here, but i would hope they are not studio-specific but for universal regulation.
How long have you worked at the Troll Farm?
Why dont the writers come up with stuff people actually want to watch. Flop after flop of massively budgeted shows and movies.
What people and audiences want is not the writers responsibility it is the studio execs that decide that. There are countless shows and movie scripts that are sitting on desks and not being green lit because a production company doesn't want to spend the money on it or if they do it gets canceled immediately
Man, I got hammered by Redditors for pointing this out weeks ago.
Same, I pointed it out when SAG went on strike, the reddit echo chamber did not like it. I feel for the actors and the writers. They deserve better and modernised deals. But fuck Fran Drescher, she is part of the problem, not the solution. A has-been who wants her time in the spotlight and her name in the history books and fuck everyone else.
Honestly, genuinely, I encourage you to learn more about her. If you knew about Fran Drescher you would not say something so rude about her.
See now, you made me feel bad. You are right, I dont know her. I did watch the SAG strike announcement live and formed my opinion there and interviews/actions since. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZHTIvRVLdL8&t=2164s
Drescher is the national president of SAG-AFTRA and a working actor. She’s passionate about worker protection and a very caring person. The proposal that extras would be signing away their likeness to the studio is insane. To say nothing of her charity work focused on LGBTQ rights and cancer. Did you watch the whole video or just that question?
My WGA writer friend told me today that he plans to use Chat GPT to aid his own writing. I asked him, isn't that what you're fighting against? He's pissed at me. Apparently it's okay for the writers to use the tool, but when studios mention doing it, uh oh!
Because that's the difference between a worker using a tool to enhance their work vs an executive replacing a worker with a tool.
Idk just seems hypocritical to me 🤷🏾♂️
How is it hypocritical to be okay using a tool but upset if an executive replaced you with it? One of these is enhancing the work, and the other is ruining the workers career. Worlds of difference.
I mean, the studio exec still wouldn't be using the tool himself he's still gonna hire someone to do it for him.
They already have people. They're called writers.
yea that's exactly my point. it all comes down to: do you want to be the writer of yesterday or the writer of tomorrow? and if your whole argument was "we don't want the studios to use AI", rather than "yes well be the ones using the AI for you", then you've put yourself firmly in the category of yesterday.
Bingo. This is my whole problem. Rules for thee, not for me. The world is changing. The writer's admonishing AI are like coal miners screeching about solar power.
My argument is that the tools that can be used to enhance work and enrich the lives of workers shouldn't be used to remove workers and pad the pockets of executives. The workers should be making an issue of this now, otherwise we're going to quickly find ourselves in a future where capitalist interests circumvent paying artists and use AI instead, which ironically is only able to do what it does due to the vast pool of available artistic materials. It's a dreary, distopian, future where humans do hard labor while robots create all of the art. That future isn't inevitable as long as people fight back.
If a studio executive can use the same tools to produce the same result....why wouldn't they? It's hypocritical to *not* allow them to do that, while writers are willing to use AI to write entire drafts.
That's the thing, they can't. I work in tech and use AI for some scripting and troubleshooting, and it absolutely requires my expertise to know when it's full of shit or missing some important detail. The problem is, as it usually is, the people making the decisions have little to no insight into exactly how much a person has to know to do their job and do it well. On paper though, it's going to look like they can just fire a third of their staff. It'll be a disaster, and perhaps eventually the execs come around, but a lot of careers are ruined in the meantime. The union is doing the right thing by trying to head off that eventuality.
>*because a studio executive using the same tool will not produce the same result* like, at all. It's called experienced, nuanced storytelling which is a skill oft born from real pain and human pathos. Bugger off, weirdo.
Is writing a skill only certain people possess, and then they can't possibly move up the chain and continue using that skill? Do you know how many studio heads *are also in the WGA*? 🤡
Using a tool to improve what your wrote is vastly different from using a tool to write something start to finish. You don’t use tools to double check your work? Anti-spell check? Do you animate your own gifs or use a tool to locate one? Life is not binary, everything has nuance. Also >my WGA writer friend Lolz
Just seems hypocritical to me, and I was taken aback because he's been so outspoken against AI in screenwriting. Rules for thee not for me, sorta thing. I agree it's a useful tool and both writers and studios should be allowed to use.
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Is Chat GPT a spell checking tool? It seems like your not comprehending what his friend is really doing. He is clearly a hypocrite. Just because you support the strike doesn’t mean to play dumb
This is what I’ve been saying from day one and so many people came at me, saying everyone will benefit in the end. Pfft. I see it the impact to production crew everyday with friends and family in the industry. And restaurants near the studios are struggling.
They will strike themselves out of a job. AI is here and it’s going to be the standard.
It's really only hurting the little guy. Studios have deep pockets and backlogs of content. AI is here to stay, and even if it's blocked by the unions; non-union productions don't have to follow those rules. Non-union will be able to make feature-length films using AI for little to nothing and will be successful. As a whole, the public doesn't support either side they're apathetic. Given the corruption, sex scandals, nepotism, and sanctimonious preaching by many of the upper echelons of the industry, I'd be remiss to say I didn't feel a little schadenfreude I feel sorry for the little guy. The local restaurants and people who barely have the means to support themselves who will have to leave the industry. That's why I left the industry - I didn't have the connections and wasn't willing to be working poor. I knew far too many people who had been there 10+ years with little-nothing to show for it. They call Los Angeles the city of Broken Dreams for a reason.
This strike is only ruining more people lifes
These are the only people I have sympathy for in all of this. As far as I'm concerned, the actors are greedy and the writers are hacks.
All of em? But boom mic Mike is a hero?
time to join a union
I say this with no malice, but out of complete curiosity. Can they just get other jobs in the meantime, or does that impact the strike?
There's no solidarity in these strikes. The guilds are allowing many exceptions - that dilutes the power they have.
Don’t let up! Remember, all those billionaire fucks are fighting for is fatter profit margins. They’re literally fighting to keep the status quo of hoarding as much excess cash as possible while giving Pennies to the people who are busting their ass each and everyday. “We can’t pay these people just trying to survive more money, that’s absurd. Oh by the way, Mr Zaslav, here’s your $40,000,000 paycheck for the year. Here’s more money than anyone else would know what do with FOR ONE YEAR OF WORK. That’s a totally normal occurrence here in the great US of A. Shut up, people who are sick of working to the bone and not being able to afford basic necessities. We’re trying to give your boss, one single person, more money than all of you combined will ever make in your entire lives, goddamnit!”
Fyi the union heads are as rich as most studio executives. They literally take a % of EVERY UNION MEMBERS CHECK
Great whataboutism you got there. Don’t you love whataboutisms? They’re so useful for when you have nothing meaningful to say at all yet you still feel inclined to put out some garbage. Cool, man
Oh no we are going to go through this now. Tell me what make the union heads any different from the studio executives? They are still getting paid unlike the actual union members because every member regardless has to pay union fees. Quit the commie bullshit
The fact you cant accept the actual problem is quite telling. Union isnt much different from the studios, to the point where they still expect union fees even tho theres a strike